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Kenzoku goes Super Saiyan, transforms into ~Band of Brothers Reloaded~

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MirrorGod Amarr Heretic Army	Posted - 2009.03.24 23:37:00 - [511] Originally by: Aurvundill goonfggotry.jpg Can't let you do that, KenZoku!* GET OUT GET OUT GET OUT GET OUT GET OUT GET OUT GET OUT [center]
Susung Caldari Alt Anti-defamation League	Posted - 2009.03.24 23:46:00 - [512] i'm not Frank, but pls cancel your account goonies and show the big meenies(CCP) how much you care Holy crap would you dang goonies just shut up. Are you ever gonna stop ****ing and moaning about every little thing. You have clogged CAOD with your moronic tripe for months now you keep beating this dead horse. I don't think this was necessarily right but for christ sake it was a simple name change. You now have one of the best playgrounds in the game are you happy? NO! What happened to the bees? I remember when the goons first came into the game I thought, 'Man those guys are having fun wish i had thought of a velator blob.' I played that video over and over. Are you still having fun? Sure don't sound like it. Do us both a favor find another game guys.
Joakim Saxon Minmatar Merch Industrial GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.03.24 23:58:00 - [513] Goons wouldn't exist if they weren't having fun. The only dead and defeated goon is a bored goon.
Pseudothei Amarr GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.03.25 00:03:00 - [514] The preliminary findings indicate that what happened was simply an unpoliced substandard GM doing his job ingame. He changed the alliance name in order to access their POS, which was bugged. Chill guys, it's not like it's the first time Kenny is privy to this sort of preferential treatment.
Jade Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2009.03.25 00:19:00 - [515] Originally by: Retepp Nedsmul That does suck that you lost your empire and everything, but I have the same reaction to that as this. Neither should happen. They want to stop space mine lagging, they should have banned mines like they eventually did. No gate camp hopping, nothing else. It doesn't really suck, that wasn't my point. I was illustrating that GM's make hard calls in difficult situations that will inevitably upset one side or another. In this case the GM in question probably felt he was doing us all a favour and triggering a spaceship fight away from the jump-in and saving players from the lag of mines. Whatever really. Some of our fleet were upset at the time of course, but with a bit of perspective you just see this is the business of refereeing and its never clean and simple. Hell, you ever been to a football match? The abuse the poor old referees get over free kicks, corners and penalties. Sometimes they do get things wrong but their purpose is to keep the game flowing and make decisions on the best of their ability to do so. Quote: They want to fix the whole one guy essentially deleting an alliance? Then fix it so it doesn't happen again, but leave what happened untouched. They pretty much did. The moment there wasn't a rollback and BOB lost absolutely all sovereignty overnight was ccp indicating that the action would stand. The problem here is that the GM's were staring into the headlights of a goon whine fest of epic proportions with what came next. Identity theft has never previously been allowed to stand. I don't think any of the old and wiser players expected it too this time. But rather than simply renaming the Darius JOHNSON formed alt corp Band of Brothers and letting BOB re-establish its alliance name (with no sovereignty) the GMs delayed the decision. We can guess the reasons for this. With Apocrypha due in the next couple of weeks I guess CCP didn't need the huge whinefest that would have ensued if the GMs had taken the entirely reasonable step of removing the stolen corp name and letting BOB have their name back. So they compromised, they let the goons keep the stolen name through fear of goon whinage if what had happened with the identity theft was rightfully reversed. Quote: While the action of fixing a name is fairly minor, it's the intent behind it and the slippery slope it's on. It's the principle in the end. I actually agree with you but not for the reasons you might think. The principle here at stake is that the GMs appeared to be afraid of goon whining to the degree that they didn't reverse the identity theft in a timely manner. This is whats led to the current messy compromise and from the massive threadnaughting that has afflicted the forums in the last 24 hours its shown that its never a good idea to expect chronic entitlement cases to respect a rational settlement. Quote: It just seems like the devs are taking a dump on their games best feature, and what makes it unique. That really isn't the case. Identity theft has previosly had absolutely no place in the universe of eve online. That stuff has always been rectified quickly in the history of the game and this is probably the first ever incident of a stolen corp name being allowed to stand. Quote: Uh, and forgive my newbness, I just looked you up after noting the replys you seem to get. Are you part of that CSM, player - developer connection thingy? Oh ignore the goon replies in the main. They are still sore I managed to beat their leader in the first CSM elections. I served my first term last year and am taking a break before the next. ISSUE - Bring Space Bushido to CAOD
GenrlBaconbits Caldari Southern Cross Empire	Posted - 2009.03.25 00:33:00 - [516] Originally by: Yonker If they re-named using the established ways of re-naming their alliance they would lose Sov3 in 9 (admittidly crappy) systems and be out of 1bil isk. Since the GMs let them circumvent the rules, it is the equivalent of them being handed Sov3 in 9 systems and free money. It isn't a huge deal, the systems will be taken anyway. But this type of rule bending is one of the reasons why people have no faith in CCP. or mabe it is because most of you goonies troll around on the forum and .BoB. does not troll too much...mabe you goonies should be nicer on here...you might get some nice things from CCP?? think about it... i dislike goonies with a passion...keep up the trolling. woo go new .BoB.
Caius Proximus Caldari GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.03.25 00:42:00 - [517] bob are the **ing O.G. CAOD **poster squad you goof
Soldis Minmatar Privateers Privateer Alliance	Posted - 2009.03.25 00:46:00 - [518] Crossposting a nice post. Quote: The name Kenzoku was hated by most of their members, and it was a mistake Mollee made, and you have to live with the consequences of that terrible alliance name in your corporation's alliance history profile. Mollee made a lot of mistakes. He allowed Haag to disband the alliance by removing the voting safety measure, he lost a Titan and destroyed your morale, he decided to do nothing and stay docked in a NPC station, and finally he renames the alliance a fail name "reloaded", like Darwin Reloaded (mollee's titan that died), this new alliance will die pathetically as well. Having the name Kenzoku demorazlies your members, and was a vicotry for your ennemies, and you can change it using valid game mechanics, but you decided that you didn't want to pay 1,000,000,000 isk, and didn't want to have that stain in your emloyment profile. NO ONE FORCED YOU TO CHOOSE THE NAME KENZOKU, EXCEPT YOUR LEADER MOLLEE. NOW LIVE WITH THE SHAME! Your alliance is a joke, and will die as such, none of your ennemies will pay you any respect. You poor attempts at propaganda and righteousness are so pathetic and fall on deaf ears.
Webb Mordock Caldari GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.03.25 00:47:00 - [519] Edited by: Webb Mordock on 25/03/2009 00:47:19 Jade, most of the time Goons are just trying to waste your time and troll you, so I appreciate the fact that you continue to at least attempt to bring some semblance of discussion to these forums. But, could you please proofread your posts before you make them and perhaps correct all of the grammatical errors? They make your posts very difficult to read. As someone with an English degree it's kind of my pet peeve.
Gail Sohmbadi Caldari GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.03.25 00:47:00 - [520] Originally by: Jade Constantine They pretty much did. The moment there wasn't a rollback and BOB lost absolutely all sovereignty overnight was ccp indicating that the action would stand. The action stood because it was acheived through acceptable (unpredicted) game mechanisms. Goons play rough, but we play by the rules. Originally by: Jade Constantine The principle here at stake is that the GMs appeared to be afraid of goon whining If this were true, CCP would have publicly announced these changes BEFORE making them, not after a day of public outcry. Originally by: Jade Constantine I served my first term last year and am taking a break before the next. More like, enough people saw through your flimsy charade of self-important filibustering to jeapordize your chances of re-election, so you withdrew from the competition rather than suffer a humiliating public defeat. I suppose you can hope that eventually people will forget how useless you were as a CSM, and you will be able to attempt another entry, with a new voting public.

Yarik Mendel Amarr Privateers Privateer Alliance	Posted - 2009.03.25 00:50:00 - [521] Originally by: Gail Sohmbadi More like, enough people saw through your flimsy charade of self-important filibustering to jeapordize your chances of re-election, so you withdrew from the competition rather than suffer a humiliating public defeat. I suppose you can hope that eventually people will forget how useless you were as a CSM, and you will be able to attempt another entry, with a new voting public. Don't worry, we'll be there to quote his terrible ideas and postings on his candidacy thread to fend of any supporters that aren't his corpmates' alts.
Jade Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2009.03.25 00:51:00 - [522] Originally by: Gail Sohmbadi I suppose you can hope that eventually people will forget how useless you were as a CSM, and you will be able to attempt another entry, with a new voting public. Heh, you do realize there is a pretty healthy "anti-goon" vote out there to be harnessed right Anyways, conspiracy theories aside on my reasons for waiting for black ops changes to get into game before running on my record - lets get back to the subject of the thread. ISSUE - Bring Space Bushido to CAOD
Ria Sotori Caldari Poor Old Ornery nOObs	Posted - 2009.03.25 00:52:00 - [523] You know, I like watching the somethingawful crowd get all emo and cry as much as the next person but really this one is stupider than there normal threadnaughts. - CCP Does not now nor will it ever I assume discuss petitions on the forums. All the whining and crying in the world doesn't change that fact. But for the sake of argument let me paint you a probable scenario. - Haarg disbands the bob alliance - Molle upon discovery of the alliance loss petitions for it to be restored or some other bob higher up petitions. - CCP Respond with "will look into it" like they do to everything. - In the interim Bob has to have an alliance to claim sov so they use the old RKK one. - Someone from Bob asks CCP that if they start claiming sov with another alliance name and CCP rules in there favor will that mess things up ? - CCP Rule not to give Bob there name back since its a game mechanics issue however flawed. - Bob petition to have the temp alliance name altered since the ruling has finally been decided and the kenzoku alliance was meant as a stopgap till CPP ruled. - CCP Agree Nothing in the above is cheating or favoritism. This was a first time case and so CCP had no guidelines to go by in this instance imho. Is that what happened ? Who Knows. Point is its as probable or even more so that all the CCP cheats! nonsense your spouting and knowing how well Bob think out a lot of things they do is really more likely if your being honest with yourselves. So do yourselves a favor and get over it, move on and play the game.
Jade Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2009.03.25 00:52:00 - [524] Originally by: Yarik Mendel Don't worry, we'll be there to quote his terrible ideas and postings on his candidacy thread to fend of any supporters that aren't his corpmates' alts. Funny thing is last time I asked you to defend your point of view on the assembly hall you ran away! Heh, will take more than the virtual equivilent of "knock-down-ginger" to win you any debate points old chap ISSUE - Bring Space Bushido to CAOD
GenrlBaconbits Caldari Southern Cross Empire	Posted - 2009.03.25 00:54:00 - [525] Edited by: GenrlBaconbits on 25/03/2009 00:54:12 Originally by: enjoi Anytime you feel sad. Alone, isolated, depressed, misunderstood. Tell people that they don't get you. GoonSwarm, a place for the lonely and misunderstood. They understand. QFT!!!...and GO .BoB. and if you want a little more help ill gladly help ya guys out...(to .BoB.) i dislike goonies with a passion...keep up the trolling. woo go new .BoB.
Palmer Eldritch Gallente Ultrapolite Socialites GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.03.25 00:54:00 - [526] Just to clarify for those who don't know, KenZoku wasn't called KenZoku because of any identity theft. It was created, and named, in August 2008, while the original Band of Brothers was still in existence. When Band of Brothers was disbanded by one of its directors, corporations which had been members of BoB chose to join KenZoku of their own free will, instead of making a new alliance (for example, an alliance named Band of Brothers Reloaded). They did this because getting straight into a pre-existing alliance gave them an advantage - a legal, within the rules advantage - in the ongoing war in 0.0 space. ------------ Coranor you all know i can't stand most of the gbc but while we have them we may as well give them something challenging where they can actually learn a bit Dian fair point
Jade Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2009.03.25 01:00:00 - [527] Edited by: Jade Constantine on 25/03/2009 01:00:30 Originally by: Palmer Eldritch Just to clarify for those who don't know, KenZoku wasn't called KenZoku because of any identity theft. It was created, and named, in August 2008, while the original Band of Brothers was still in existence. When Band of Brothers was disbanded by one of its directors, corporations which had been members of BoB chose to join KenZoku of their own free will, instead of making a new alliance (for example, an alliance named Band of Brothers Reloaded). They did this because getting straight into a pre-existing alliance gave them an advantage - a legal, within the rules advantage - in the ongoing war in 0.0 space. I imagine they did it because the initial petition didn't yield the expected result of having the goon alt corp "band of brothers" renamed to "evecorp 239013909" thereby allowing the BOB leaders to establish another band of brothers alliance immediately. The fact that this was the established protocol in cases of identity theft following alliance disbands previously appears not to have entered into the calculations this time. Now admittedly BOB themselves muddied the waters by moving to the kenzoku identity but since CCP weren't exactly going to freeze the server and hold the ongoing war while the gms were investigating the petition you can understand why they did it. The current compromise solution is something that won't likely please anyone 100%. Band of Brothers corporation in Goonswarm should be renamed. BOB should be offered their original alliance name back. GM's should offer them the straight choice between continuing with the current partial sovereignty holding Band of Brothers reloaded or a clean start with the original Band of Brothers name once its removed from goon blocking. Whether this can possibly happen admist all the shouting tears and threadnaughting is unlikely. ISSUE - Bring Space Bushido to CAOD
Yarik Mendel Amarr Privateers Privateer Alliance	Posted - 2009.03.25 01:07:00 - [528] Edited by: Yarik Mendel on 25/03/2009 01:07:59 Originally by: Jade Constantine I imagine they did it because And this is where you went wrong, shut up, don't talk about things you don't know.
Caius Proximus Caldari GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.03.25 01:10:00 - [529] why are you saying that the band of brothers corporation still should be renamed and the name offered back to kenzoku when ccp has already ruled in contradiction to that if you were right, then why did ccp two days ago rename kenzoku instead of band of brothers? why the necessity for a compromise in the first place? you're full of ** as usual jade you should just get back to roleplaying a space ** sucker
Petar Quaresma Caldari GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.03.25 01:11:00 - [530] Why would the legally acquired corporation "Band of Brothers" be renamed? If you're going to troll, at least try and be creative and less obvious.

Caius Proximus Caldari GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.03.25 01:13:00 - [531] Edited by: Caius Proximus on 25/03/2009 01:14:23 also yea good luck with your running again for csm jade "who cares about the rules just play the game " constantine
Momoha Caldari GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.03.25 01:14:00 - [532] No identify theft was employed in the BoB disbanding scam, you idiots.
Captain Thunk Amarr Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2009.03.25 01:21:00 - [533] It's pretty amazing how partisan these threads always end up. Pro-Bob: I don't see what the problem is, was just a few T2 BPOs, rigged events or other benefit that no other organisation in the game gets. It's CCPs game, if you don't like it you should quit. leans back Not sucking upto Bob: Even after all the scandals Bob still get personal favours? Good God someone teach me Icelandic, CCP just don't seem to understand basic English. It always makes me laugh to watch people justifying something they know is fundamentally wrong simply because it happens to currently suit their personal agenda. Captain Thunk
KeratinBoy Caldari GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.03.25 01:25:00 - [534] Originally by: Jade Constantine before running on my record That would be inventing powers you don't have? That would be stating on the record that the CSM accomplishes nothing and back room deals should be the norm? That would be gagging fellow CSM members and trying to shirk the consequences?
Rafus Amarr GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.03.25 01:55:00 - [535] I have gotten into the habit of just skipping of "I am a man who roleplays as a female sex slave on the internet"'s posts entirely due to their wall of text nature. It is amusing to me that people spend 30 or 40 minutes writing an essay as a post. Anyway to whoever it is that was like THEY NEEDED A ALLIANCE TO CLAIM SOV WITH!!!!!! Nothing was stopping them from creating a new alliance and naming it to something they liked, but instead they chose to use a already created alliance. That is the problem. There is no excuse for its name being changed.
Gallente Ardientemente Gallente DarkStar 1 GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.03.25 01:56:00 - [536] Originally by: Jade Constantine I imagine they did it because the initial petition didn't yield the expected result of having the goon alt corp "band of brothers" renamed to "evecorp 239013909" thereby allowing the BOB leaders to establish another band of brothers alliance immediately. The fact that this was the established protocol in cases of identity theft following alliance disbands previously appears not to have entered into the calculations this time. Now admittedly BOB themselves muddied the waters by moving to the kenzoku identity but since CCP weren't exactly going to freeze the server and hold the ongoing war while the gms were investigating the petition you can understand why they did it. The current compromise solution is something that won't likely please anyone 100%. Band of Brothers corporation in Goonswarm should be renamed. BOB should be offered their original alliance name back. GM's should offer them the straight choice between continuing with the current partial sovereignty holding Band of Brothers reloaded or a clean start with the original Band of Brothers name once its removed from goon blocking. Whether this can possibly happen admist all the shouting tears and threadnaughting is unlikely. Hahahaha you're not relevant.
Dog Solitude Minmatar Omega Fleet Enterprises Executive Outcomes	Posted - 2009.03.25 02:05:00 - [537] Edited by: Dog Solitude on 25/03/2009 02:06:31 Originally by: Captain Thunk It's pretty amazing how partisan these threads always end up. Pro-Bob: I don't see what the problem is, was just a few T2 BPOs, rigged events or other benefit that no other organisation in the game gets. It's CCPs game, if you don't like it you should quit. leans back Not sucking upto Bob: Even after all the scandals Bob still get personal favours? Good God someone teach me Icelandic, CCP just don't seem to understand basic English. It always makes me laugh to watch people justifying something they know is fundamentally wrong simply because it happens to currently suit their personal agenda. Captain Thunk I think its funny to see groups of players, who obviously have no care for other peoples game experience, tout the "good guy" line and pretend they care about things like rules and regulations, when in reality, they only care about pursuing their own personal agendas. But hey Thunk, both you and I are heavily biased. So we are likely no different. /edit. Please bring back guys like Cippa in here so goons can stop getting trolled by Jade.
Retepp Nedsmul Caldari Eve University Ivy League	Posted - 2009.03.25 02:19:00 - [538] Originally by: Jade Constantine Originally by: Retepp Nedsmul N.B. For space reasons, my original post is edited out It doesn't really suck, that wasn't my point. I was illustrating that GM's make hard calls in difficult situations that will inevitably upset one side or another. In this case the GM in question probably felt he was doing us all a favour and triggering a spaceship fight away from the jump-in and saving players from the lag of mines. Whatever really. Some of our fleet were upset at the time of course, but with a bit of perspective you just see this is the business of refereeing and its never clean and simple. Well okay maybe the GM had some bizarre good intentions, but he was wrong. GM may be a thankless tough job, but thatÆs no reason to not expect them to do their job well and make correct decisions. IÆm sorry if they donÆt like the work, but donÆt do it if youÆre going to do a bad job. Originally by: Jade Constantine [Hell, you ever been to a football match? The abuse the poor old referees get over free kicks, corners and penalties. Sometimes they do get things wrong but their purpose is to keep the game flowing and make decisions on the best of their ability to do so. But in a football match itÆs much easier to ignore the rules. In EVE you canÆt just decide to cheat. Crazy hacking aside, you play the rules the Eve client forces on you. Refereeing should be done a little as possible in a game like Eve, the freeform nature is the most unique part of it. Originally by: Jade Constantine They pretty much did. The moment there wasn't a rollback and BOB lost absolutely all sovereignty overnight was ccp indicating that the action would stand. Yes I didnÆt mean to imply that they did not somehow leave things untouched. Simply as an example of how your space mine story should have went, without any interference. Originally by: Jade Constantine The problem here is that the GM's were staring into the headlights of a goon whine fest of epic proportions with what came next. Identity theft has never previously been allowed to stand. I don't think any of the old and wiser players expected it too this time. But rather than simply renaming the Darius JOHNSON formed alt corp Band of Brothers and letting BOB re-establish its alliance name (with no sovereignty) the GMs delayed the decision. We can guess the reasons for this. With Apocrypha due in the next couple of weeks I guess CCP didn't need the huge whinefest that would have ensued if the GMs had taken the entirely reasonable step of removing the stolen corp name and letting BOB have their name back So they compromised, they let the goons keep the stolen name through fear of goon whinage if what had happened with the identity theft was rightfully reversed. . Uh.... I would hardly call what happened ôidentity theftö or ôstolenö in the way I think you mean. The BoB name was acquired completely within the scope of game mechanics. The idea that Goonswarm should have the BoB name ôrightfully reversedö is ridiculous and runs counter to everything that makes Eve great. The rest of your answers sort of hinge on this idea of something has been æstolenÆ so IÆll leave one quick comment. Hargooth or whoever it was, did not get forced into anything. He chose to disband BoB. While one may disagree with the ease in which he did this, itÆs not stealing. Adding safeguards in the future to the game so that this is harder to accomplish is fine. But whatÆs done is done, and done completely within the game. Not stealing, not theft, not cheating. Originally by: Jade Constantine Oh ignore the goon replies in the main. They are still sore I managed to beat their leader in the first CSM elections. I served my first term last year and am taking a break before the next. Sure thing, the reason I asked was I was curious as to your stance on this issue as a CSM representative. I guess that would seem pretty obvious now, so IÆm going assume youÆre in favour of the choice made by CCP in this matter?
Jade Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2009.03.25 02:39:00 - [539] Originally by: Retepp Nedsmul Uh.... I would hardly call what happened ôidentity theftö or ôstolenö in the way I think you mean. The BoB name was acquired completely within the scope of game mechanics. The idea that Goonswarm should have the BoB name ôrightfully reversedö is ridiculous and runs counter to everything that makes Eve great. Previously Eve online GM's have renamed impersonating corporations and individuals and have returned "stolen names" to the original owners. The whole theft of identity theme that came to the fore in this blocking of alliance recreation by sitting on an alt corp is new ground and its never been allowed to stand before. I'd contend that Eve is not "made great" by allowing cheap director emocides to risk the identity of groups of thousands of players with no mechanism to rectify the situation. Eve is about space opera, politics and clash of arms. Cheesy creation of alt-corps to exploit a weakness in the naming mechanic system is hardly adding much to Eve's mystique. Goons claiming to have defeated BOB because they cheated and stole their name is not exactly good copy. Quote: The rest of your answers sort of hinge on this idea of something has been æstolenÆ so IÆll leave one quick comment. Hargooth or whoever it was, did not get forced into anything. He chose to disband BoB. While one may disagree with the ease in which he did this, itÆs not stealing. You and I and 99.9% of the rest of the server will never know precisely what happened there. We can guess. We can make assumptions, but we'll never know. But the "stealing of identity" is the creation of an alt corp to block the recreation of an established alliance name. It was obvious what was being done and it should have been rectified by the GMs. Quote: Adding safeguards in the future to the game so that this is harder to accomplish is fine. But whatÆs done is done, and done completely within the game. Not stealing, not theft, not cheating. I'm afraid I disagree on the naming issue. I consider it an exploit of the naming mechanism in game. Certainly there used to be an explicit eula term that made it against the rules to impersonate other players and organizations. I am also informed that there has been a prior case of identity theft in a similar manner (alliance disbanded due to non payment of fees and recreated by an enemy) that was resolved by renaming the offending parties alliance. Quote: Sure thing, the reason I asked was I was curious as to your stance on this issue as a CSM representative. I guess that would seem pretty obvious now, so IÆm going assume youÆre in favour of the choice made by CCP Well as I've said elsewhere I think CCP have not done the correct thing here (which would have been to rename the band of brothers alt corp and allow BOB to recreate their alliance with the correct name.) This would have put the matter to bed months ago and would have avoided all the complication over a sov holding entity being renamed which we now have. On balance though I think its still a fair compromise (although not one to really satisfy anyone). But what was really needed was an early decisive resolution that saw Band of Brothers name returned and the past precedent against identity theft upheld and restated. ISSUE - Bring Space Bushido to CAOD
Crimsonjade Minmatar Amarr Secret Service	Posted - 2009.03.25 02:43:00 - [540] and to think we just were talking on ts about how Jades post have gotten smaller



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