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Phasics
   |
Posted - 2004.09.05 02:50:00 -
[1]
Had a little idea on this which is a hybrid of thigns which have been suggested before.
Now its been sadi before that BPO's should be removed and that all blueprints should be BPC, however this makes the RnD side of things obsolete as u cant research BPC's.
On the other hand if there are no BPO's then BPC for all items can be released on the market giving smaller corps the chance to get in a small portion of the market.
Compromise
1) Remove BPO's from the game and replace them with high run BPC's, e.g. 100-10000 (more or less depending on item type), with the rareer blueprint still beign released through agents, but more often and to move people.
2) Now with any BPC u can do research to increase mineral effiency etc
3) BPC cant be copied but they can be split. so a 1000 run BPC can be broken down into 10 x 100 run copies using a lab slot.
Result
1)What would this do ? well basically it would result into a greater numebr of corps having BPC's and while the alrger corp will proabably get more copies there will still be amrket competition from the little guy to keep exhorbornet prices a tad lower.
2) and 3) This would not take away the effectiveness of anyone who has trained as a researcher as they can still aquire BPC's and research BPC with a high copy number and then split them into several BPC with smaller number of runs and sell these on escrow for a tidy profit.
e.g. Someone could buy a 10run BPC of a Megathron off the market for 20million research the mineral effecency, split the copies into singles and sell for 2.3million give or take depding on amout of ME.
In additon the market could offer a range of BPC runs for the meag like 10,100 and 1000. Thus if your bought a 1000run copy the research time goes on all the runs so you end up with a greater number of high ME BPC runs compared to somone who buys a 10BPC run.
e.g.
1BPC copy person does 1 week of research
10BPC copy person does 1 week of research
100BPC copy person does 1 week of research
after week id finished copies are split into singles
1 x 1 run (1 week of research)
10 x 1 run (10 weeks worth of research)
100 x 1 run (100 weeks worth of research)
Thus big corps can capitise on having a large wallet to buy high BPC runs while the small time corp can still get in on the market by buying lower copy runs , which is less effective but still works and can turn a profit.
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Phasics
|
Posted - 2004.09.05 02:50:00 -
[2]
Had a little idea on this which is a hybrid of thigns which have been suggested before.
Now its been sadi before that BPO's should be removed and that all blueprints should be BPC, however this makes the RnD side of things obsolete as u cant research BPC's.
On the other hand if there are no BPO's then BPC for all items can be released on the market giving smaller corps the chance to get in a small portion of the market.
Compromise
1) Remove BPO's from the game and replace them with high run BPC's, e.g. 100-10000 (more or less depending on item type), with the rareer blueprint still beign released through agents, but more often and to move people.
2) Now with any BPC u can do research to increase mineral effiency etc
3) BPC cant be copied but they can be split. so a 1000 run BPC can be broken down into 10 x 100 run copies using a lab slot.
Result
1)What would this do ? well basically it would result into a greater numebr of corps having BPC's and while the alrger corp will proabably get more copies there will still be amrket competition from the little guy to keep exhorbornet prices a tad lower.
2) and 3) This would not take away the effectiveness of anyone who has trained as a researcher as they can still aquire BPC's and research BPC with a high copy number and then split them into several BPC with smaller number of runs and sell these on escrow for a tidy profit.
e.g. Someone could buy a 10run BPC of a Megathron off the market for 20million research the mineral effecency, split the copies into singles and sell for 2.3million give or take depding on amout of ME.
In additon the market could offer a range of BPC runs for the meag like 10,100 and 1000. Thus if your bought a 1000run copy the research time goes on all the runs so you end up with a greater number of high ME BPC runs compared to somone who buys a 10BPC run.
e.g.
1BPC copy person does 1 week of research
10BPC copy person does 1 week of research
100BPC copy person does 1 week of research
after week id finished copies are split into singles
1 x 1 run (1 week of research)
10 x 1 run (10 weeks worth of research)
100 x 1 run (100 weeks worth of research)
Thus big corps can capitise on having a large wallet to buy high BPC runs while the small time corp can still get in on the market by buying lower copy runs , which is less effective but still works and can turn a profit.
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Leno
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Posted - 2004.09.05 02:58:00 -
[3]
umm, no... too much of a kick in the croch to all the people who have spent so much time playing the game
---------------
RIP - Smoske, My Friend
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Leno
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Posted - 2004.09.05 02:58:00 -
[4]
umm, no... too much of a kick in the croch to all the people who have spent so much time playing the game
---------------
RIP - Smoske, My Friend
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Phasics
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Posted - 2004.09.05 03:11:00 -
[5]
well what if BPO owner were compensated for the change ?
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Phasics
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Posted - 2004.09.05 03:11:00 -
[6]
well what if BPO owner were compensated for the change ?
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Pudface
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Posted - 2004.09.05 03:16:00 -
[7]
Player/Corp buys XXXXXX T2 BPO for LOTS CCP decides they like your idea Reimburses said Player/Corp not LOTS as the player cant realy prove he paid al of that for the said BPO as it may have been done long enough ago for CCP to have lost those logs with the transaction in.
thats just one side of the coin my head hurts so someone else can handle the otherside
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Pudface
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Posted - 2004.09.05 03:16:00 -
[8]
Player/Corp buys XXXXXX T2 BPO for LOTS CCP decides they like your idea Reimburses said Player/Corp not LOTS as the player cant realy prove he paid al of that for the said BPO as it may have been done long enough ago for CCP to have lost those logs with the transaction in.
thats just one side of the coin my head hurts so someone else can handle the otherside
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Lagar
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Posted - 2004.09.05 07:17:00 -
[9]
.... BPO's are not suposed to be removed... only the infinate runs BPC's
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Lagar
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Posted - 2004.09.05 07:17:00 -
[10]
.... BPO's are not suposed to be removed... only the infinate runs BPC's
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Vegeta
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Posted - 2004.09.05 07:55:00 -
[11]
lol, stupid newbie, screw you. People who cant make money whine about it and want things changed. Well guess what, money attracts money so shut your mouth and go back into your hole.
2005.04.25 16:40:42 combat Your 1400mm Howitzer Artillery II perfectly strikes LawrenceNewton [WARAG], wrecking for 2706.9 damage.
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Vegeta
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Posted - 2004.09.05 07:55:00 -
[12]
lol, stupid newbie, screw you. People who cant make money whine about it and want things changed. Well guess what, money attracts money so shut your mouth and go back into your hole.
2005.04.25 16:40:42 combat Your 1400mm Howitzer Artillery II perfectly strikes LawrenceNewton [WARAG], wrecking for 2706.9 damage.
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Ris Dnalor
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Posted - 2004.09.05 08:42:00 -
[13]
I'd rather see BPC's go away & BPO's be the only thing out there.
--
Jump Drive Operation / Rank 5 / SP: 1280000 of 1280000
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Ris Dnalor
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Posted - 2004.09.05 08:42:00 -
[14]
I'd rather see BPC's go away & BPO's be the only thing out there.
--
Jump Drive Operation / Rank 5 / SP: 1280000 of 1280000
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loladoll
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Posted - 2004.09.05 08:46:00 -
[15]
and why would you do that? It's a quit drastic change.
I oppose your proposal quit strongly
Or do you want to start a flame fest? I'll get my flamethrower if you want
______________________________________
live is tough and then you get a clone |
loladoll
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Posted - 2004.09.05 08:46:00 -
[16]
and why would you do that? It's a quit drastic change.
I oppose your proposal quit strongly
Or do you want to start a flame fest? I'll get my flamethrower if you want
______________________________________
live is tough and then you get a clone |
Bohr
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Posted - 2004.09.05 09:14:00 -
[17]
 Originally by: Phasics
well what if BPO owner were compensated for the change ?
Not possible to compensate for something unlimited :), so no.
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Bohr
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Posted - 2004.09.05 09:14:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Phasics
well what if BPO owner were compensated for the change ?
Not possible to compensate for something unlimited :), so no.
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Bohr
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Posted - 2004.09.05 09:16:00 -
[19]
Edited by: Bohr on 05/09/2004 09:17:44
said it twice :P
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Bohr
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Posted - 2004.09.05 09:16:00 -
[20]
Edited by: Bohr on 05/09/2004 09:17:44
said it twice :P
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Asmodia
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Posted - 2004.09.05 09:30:00 -
[21]
Edited by: Asmodia on 05/09/2004 09:31:58
phasic, you are dead meat 
One imporant reason for me to play Eve is my 151 BPO collection. Who try to tough this is dead. I paid a ****load of isk for them and i invested tons of time to reseach them.
I can understand if you would talk about the tech2 BPOs, because the ppl never paid a single isk for them. Changing the tech2 BPOs to max runs and give out more BPCs via agent wouldnt be bad.
------------------------------------------------
CEO of Spectre Syndicate - Curse Alliance
------------------------------------------------ |
Asmodia
|
Posted - 2004.09.05 09:30:00 -
[22]
Edited by: Asmodia on 05/09/2004 09:31:58
phasic, you are dead meat
One imporant reason for me to play Eve is my 151 BPO collection. Who try to tough this is dead. I paid a ****load of isk for them and i invested tons of time to reseach them.
I can understand if you would talk about the tech2 BPOs, because the ppl never paid a single isk for them. Changing the tech2 BPOs to max runs and give out more BPCs via agent wouldnt be bad.
------------------------------------------------
CEO of Spectre Syndicate - Curse Alliance
------------------------------------------------ |
Lagar
|
Posted - 2004.09.05 09:52:00 -
[23]
if you are talking to me Vegata know that i am not a silly n00b. i am just some one who is bussy with alot of things atm so i cant scan everything all the time 24/7
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Lagar
|
Posted - 2004.09.05 09:52:00 -
[24]
if you are talking to me Vegata know that i am not a silly n00b. i am just some one who is bussy with alot of things atm so i cant scan everything all the time 24/7
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Dalmont Delantee
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Posted - 2004.09.05 10:29:00 -
[25]
From what I can tell owning Tech II BPO's the price is actually on all the component parts not what you would actually want to sell them for.
Do you really think we would want to sell them for 2-3 million when they are only slightly better than the original? You can only sell 2-3 a day when you can sell 20-30 if the prices were cheaper and make more money?
Take comfort in knowing that its probably some pimply faced twit, or 40 year old virgin, who gleens everytime mommy offfers to take them to needle point lessons |
Dalmont Delantee
|
Posted - 2004.09.05 10:29:00 -
[26]
From what I can tell owning Tech II BPO's the price is actually on all the component parts not what you would actually want to sell them for.
Do you really think we would want to sell them for 2-3 million when they are only slightly better than the original? You can only sell 2-3 a day when you can sell 20-30 if the prices were cheaper and make more money?
Take comfort in knowing that its probably some pimply faced twit, or 40 year old virgin, who gleens everytime mommy offfers to take them to needle point lessons |
Vegeta
|
Posted - 2004.09.05 10:31:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Lagar
if you are talking to me Vegata know that i am not a silly n00b. i am just some one who is bussy with alot of things atm so i cant scan everything all the time 24/7
I was responding to the original poster
2005.04.25 16:40:42 combat Your 1400mm Howitzer Artillery II perfectly strikes LawrenceNewton [WARAG], wrecking for 2706.9 damage.
|
Vegeta
|
Posted - 2004.09.05 10:31:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Lagar
if you are talking to me Vegata know that i am not a silly n00b. i am just some one who is bussy with alot of things atm so i cant scan everything all the time 24/7
I was responding to the original poster
2005.04.25 16:40:42 combat Your 1400mm Howitzer Artillery II perfectly strikes LawrenceNewton [WARAG], wrecking for 2706.9 damage.
|
Darkwolf
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Posted - 2004.09.05 10:50:00 -
[29]
Originally by: Vegeta
lol, stupid newbie, screw you. People who cant make money whine about it and want things changed. Well guess what, money attracts money so shut your mouth and go back into your hole.
I never, ever thought I'd say this, but....
Right on, Vegeta!
Seriously, this has to be one of the stupidest ideas I've heard in a long time. Way to go stabbing everyone who's invested a year or so of their life in this game, straight in the heart. Brilliant!
Or not.
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Darkwolf
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Posted - 2004.09.05 10:50:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Vegeta
lol, stupid newbie, screw you. People who cant make money whine about it and want things changed. Well guess what, money attracts money so shut your mouth and go back into your hole.
I never, ever thought I'd say this, but....
Right on, Vegeta!
Seriously, this has to be one of the stupidest ideas I've heard in a long time. Way to go stabbing everyone who's invested a year or so of their life in this game, straight in the heart. Brilliant!
Or not.
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Phasics
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Posted - 2004.09.05 10:56:00 -
[31]
mmmmm sensing a lotta hostility
ah well , cant say I'm surprised
People are always focused on how a change will effect them and not if its good or bad for the game
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Phasics
|
Posted - 2004.09.05 10:56:00 -
[32]
mmmmm sensing a lotta hostility
ah well , cant say I'm surprised
People are always focused on how a change will effect them and not if its good or bad for the game
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Zinke
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Posted - 2004.09.05 11:01:00 -
[33]
I think that perfect solution would be to limit number of copies that can be made from original BP, like it used to be after release of the game (only 3 copies allowed).
Of course CCP would have to increase amount of BPO for T2 items and monitor number of BP on market as players stop playing or taking extended leaves would not take most of BP with them.
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Zinke
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Posted - 2004.09.05 11:01:00 -
[34]
I think that perfect solution would be to limit number of copies that can be made from original BP, like it used to be after release of the game (only 3 copies allowed).
Of course CCP would have to increase amount of BPO for T2 items and monitor number of BP on market as players stop playing or taking extended leaves would not take most of BP with them.
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Phasics
|
Posted - 2004.09.05 11:05:00 -
[35]
Originally by: Vegeta
lol, stupid newbie, screw you. People who cant make money whine about it and want things changed. Well guess what, money attracts money so shut your mouth and go back into your hole.
oh and one more thing you might want to watch the personal attacks.
wouldn't want to see you get banned
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Phasics
|
Posted - 2004.09.05 11:05:00 -
[36]
Originally by: Vegeta
lol, stupid newbie, screw you. People who cant make money whine about it and want things changed. Well guess what, money attracts money so shut your mouth and go back into your hole.
oh and one more thing you might want to watch the personal attacks.
wouldn't want to see you get banned
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Vegeta
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Posted - 2004.09.05 11:06:00 -
[37]
Originally by: Zinke
I think that perfect solution would be to limit number of copies that can be made from original BP, like it used to be after release of the game (only 3 copies allowed).
Of course CCP would have to increase amount of BPO for T2 items and monitor number of BP on market as players stop playing or taking extended leaves would not take most of BP with them.
To be honest I think BPC's are the stupidest thing in this game at the moment.
2005.04.25 16:40:42 combat Your 1400mm Howitzer Artillery II perfectly strikes LawrenceNewton [WARAG], wrecking for 2706.9 damage.
|
Vegeta
|
Posted - 2004.09.05 11:06:00 -
[38]
Originally by: Zinke
I think that perfect solution would be to limit number of copies that can be made from original BP, like it used to be after release of the game (only 3 copies allowed).
Of course CCP would have to increase amount of BPO for T2 items and monitor number of BP on market as players stop playing or taking extended leaves would not take most of BP with them.
To be honest I think BPC's are the stupidest thing in this game at the moment.
2005.04.25 16:40:42 combat Your 1400mm Howitzer Artillery II perfectly strikes LawrenceNewton [WARAG], wrecking for 2706.9 damage.
|
Phasics
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Posted - 2004.09.05 11:11:00 -
[39]
Originally by: Vegeta
To be honest I think BPC's are the stupidest thing in this game at the moment.
Then do enlighten us on your great plans for EVE you obivously think u know what best so why dont you post your big plans ?
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Phasics
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Posted - 2004.09.05 11:11:00 -
[40]
Originally by: Vegeta
To be honest I think BPC's are the stupidest thing in this game at the moment.
Then do enlighten us on your great plans for EVE you obivously think u know what best so why dont you post your big plans ?
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Fuse
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Posted - 2004.09.05 11:15:00 -
[41]
Originally by: Vegeta
lol, stupid newbie, screw you. People who cant make money whine about it and want things changed. Well guess what, money attracts money so shut your mouth and go back into your hole.
0.o It's not you... no wait it is you. |
Fuse
|
Posted - 2004.09.05 11:15:00 -
[42]
Originally by: Vegeta
lol, stupid newbie, screw you. People who cant make money whine about it and want things changed. Well guess what, money attracts money so shut your mouth and go back into your hole.
0.o It's not you... no wait it is you. |
Rogue 1690
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Posted - 2004.09.05 11:22:00 -
[43]
I think this thread is one of the worst ideas i've ever heard on these boards.
The BPO/BPC structure is perfect the way it is, end of .
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Rogue 1690
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Posted - 2004.09.05 11:22:00 -
[44]
I think this thread is one of the worst ideas i've ever heard on these boards.
The BPO/BPC structure is perfect the way it is, end of .
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Ebedar
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Posted - 2004.09.05 11:27:00 -
[45]
BPOs aren't the problem, BPCs are - and the damage was first done over a year ago.
Quite often the easiest way to make money from a BPO is to research it and make copies to sell. For pure research characters, it's a fairly standard source of income given the gross lack of support for science-based features such as reverse engineering or BP improvement through research.
The moves made to limit the amount of copying going on were ineffective, IMO, because they were not restrictive enough. I would prefer to see max runs limited to something like 5 runs for ships, 10 runs for modules and drones and maybe 100 runs for missiles and ammo (with copy times made longer too).
The associated problem is the one mentioned above - you would be removing a major source of income (both primary and secondary income) for a number of characters. Without another system for them to pursue (e.g. reverse engineering BPs from named items) you would be depriving a percentage of the player base of their living and purpose.
By making the copy time longer for Tech II BPOs the problem has been reduced but not eradicated. I put this down to a lack of affordable components in some instances, but mainly down to the truth that has held true since Tech I BPOs: it's easier to stick a BPO in a research slot to be copied and leave it there than it is to spend time gathering the materials needed and to produce the item itself.
My life in pictures:
      |
Ebedar
|
Posted - 2004.09.05 11:27:00 -
[46]
BPOs aren't the problem, BPCs are - and the damage was first done over a year ago.
Quite often the easiest way to make money from a BPO is to research it and make copies to sell. For pure research characters, it's a fairly standard source of income given the gross lack of support for science-based features such as reverse engineering or BP improvement through research.
The moves made to limit the amount of copying going on were ineffective, IMO, because they were not restrictive enough. I would prefer to see max runs limited to something like 5 runs for ships, 10 runs for modules and drones and maybe 100 runs for missiles and ammo (with copy times made longer too).
The associated problem is the one mentioned above - you would be removing a major source of income (both primary and secondary income) for a number of characters. Without another system for them to pursue (e.g. reverse engineering BPs from named items) you would be depriving a percentage of the player base of their living and purpose.
By making the copy time longer for Tech II BPOs the problem has been reduced but not eradicated. I put this down to a lack of affordable components in some instances, but mainly down to the truth that has held true since Tech I BPOs: it's easier to stick a BPO in a research slot to be copied and leave it there than it is to spend time gathering the materials needed and to produce the item itself.
My life in pictures:
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Phasics
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Posted - 2004.09.05 11:45:00 -
[47]
funny thing is I can so see some of you selling your first born child before you'd give up your BPO's
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Phasics
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Posted - 2004.09.05 11:45:00 -
[48]
funny thing is I can so see some of you selling your first born child before you'd give up your BPO's
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Asmodia
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Posted - 2004.09.05 11:48:00 -
[49]
I agree 100%. Here you have my children, but dont tough my BPOs.
------------------------------------------------
CEO of Spectre Syndicate - Curse Alliance
------------------------------------------------ |
Asmodia
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Posted - 2004.09.05 11:48:00 -
[50]
I agree 100%. Here you have my children, but dont tough my BPOs.
------------------------------------------------
CEO of Spectre Syndicate - Curse Alliance
------------------------------------------------ |
Phasics
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Posted - 2004.09.05 11:57:00 -
[51]
Originally by: Asmodia
I agree 100%. Here you have my children, but dont tough my BPOs.
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Phasics
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Posted - 2004.09.05 11:57:00 -
[52]
Originally by: Asmodia
I agree 100%. Here you have my children, but dont tough my BPOs.
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Selim
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Posted - 2004.09.05 16:48:00 -
[53]
Edited by: Selim on 05/09/2004 16:51:20
I agree with the thoughts that BPC suck, and ruin the market. At least for tech 2. More Originals need to be added, but in return, copies NEED to go. It doesnt make any sense in the realism factor, storyline factor, AND it ruins the market because it makes the items into just another tech 1 thing. Soon everyone will have a smurgleblaster II blueprint copy and the market will be flooded.... again.
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Selim
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Posted - 2004.09.05 16:48:00 -
[54]
Edited by: Selim on 05/09/2004 16:51:20
I agree with the thoughts that BPC suck, and ruin the market. At least for tech 2. More Originals need to be added, but in return, copies NEED to go. It doesnt make any sense in the realism factor, storyline factor, AND it ruins the market because it makes the items into just another tech 1 thing. Soon everyone will have a smurgleblaster II blueprint copy and the market will be flooded.... again.
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Lufio II
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Posted - 2004.09.05 17:01:00 -
[55]
Originally by: Selim
Edited by: Selim on 05/09/2004 16:51:20
... It doesnt make any sense in the realism factor, storyline factor, ...
I have to disagree on this one, especially for T2-Blueprints. It makes perfectly sense, since the one that can research and copy the BP does not necessarily have the skills to build the things, too. So would you give out your BPO to someone else just to have the Item produced? I don't think so, so you make a copy, give that to someone who can build it and have your item built without any worries that you might not get your BPO back after he's done building...
So it fits perfectly into realism factor, and storyline, too. And that BPC ruin the Market... well, I don't currently see it but maybe I'm just blind, when I look at all the items actually needed to make a copy of T2-BPs... .
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Lufio II
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Posted - 2004.09.05 17:01:00 -
[56]
Originally by: Selim
Edited by: Selim on 05/09/2004 16:51:20
... It doesnt make any sense in the realism factor, storyline factor, ...
I have to disagree on this one, especially for T2-Blueprints. It makes perfectly sense, since the one that can research and copy the BP does not necessarily have the skills to build the things, too. So would you give out your BPO to someone else just to have the Item produced? I don't think so, so you make a copy, give that to someone who can build it and have your item built without any worries that you might not get your BPO back after he's done building...
So it fits perfectly into realism factor, and storyline, too. And that BPC ruin the Market... well, I don't currently see it but maybe I'm just blind, when I look at all the items actually needed to make a copy of T2-BPs... .
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Viper Bronco
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Posted - 2004.09.05 19:29:00 -
[57]
our corp has gone from small to smaller. yet we still keep adding orginal bp's to our inventory. we pay to research them. we build some from them . why should we give up 1.5 years of research and cost and over 300 bpo's.
yes to reverse engineering, yes to research advancing the tech of the bp's. no, no, no to removing bpo's.
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Viper Bronco
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Posted - 2004.09.05 19:29:00 -
[58]
our corp has gone from small to smaller. yet we still keep adding orginal bp's to our inventory. we pay to research them. we build some from them . why should we give up 1.5 years of research and cost and over 300 bpo's.
yes to reverse engineering, yes to research advancing the tech of the bp's. no, no, no to removing bpo's.
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Danny V
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Posted - 2004.09.06 00:22:00 -
[59]
Originally by: Vegeta
To be honest I think BPC's are the stupidest thing in this game at the moment.
I agree with ya. All they do is flood the game with the ability to build ships. Imho it shouldn't be as easy as it is to create a shipyard. The result of that lack of difficulty is profits are limited. (Not whining just a fact, takes a while to break even on the purchase of a bpo)
I think the Eve economy would be best served having bpcs deleted. If you don't want to spend the money on a bpo then you go out and buy the ships or modules bulk from a corp. To me that's more realistic and closer to how an economy should run.
I personally don't care for "I'll sell you the ability to build 10 times for yourself". 
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Danny V
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Posted - 2004.09.06 00:22:00 -
[60]
Edited by: Danny V on 06/09/2004 00:24:32
oops twice
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Danny V
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Posted - 2004.09.06 00:22:00 -
[61]
Originally by: Vegeta
To be honest I think BPC's are the stupidest thing in this game at the moment.
I agree with ya. All they do is flood the game with the ability to build ships. Imho it shouldn't be as easy as it is to create a shipyard. The result of that lack of difficulty is profits are limited. (Not whining just a fact, takes a while to break even on the purchase of a bpo)
I think the Eve economy would be best served having bpcs deleted. If you don't want to spend the money on a bpo then you go out and buy the ships or modules bulk from a corp. To me that's more realistic and closer to how an economy should run.
I personally don't care for "I'll sell you the ability to build 10 times for yourself".
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Danny V
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Posted - 2004.09.06 00:22:00 -
[62]
Edited by: Danny V on 06/09/2004 00:24:32
oops twice
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Selim
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Posted - 2004.09.06 00:40:00 -
[63]
Originally by: Lufio II
Originally by: Selim
Edited by: Selim on 05/09/2004 16:51:20
... It doesnt make any sense in the realism factor, storyline factor, ...
I have to disagree on this one, especially for T2-Blueprints. It makes perfectly sense, since the one that can research and copy the BP does not necessarily have the skills to build the things, too. So would you give out your BPO to someone else just to have the Item produced? I don't think so, so you make a copy, give that to someone who can build it and have your item built without any worries that you might not get your BPO back after he's done building...
So it fits perfectly into realism factor, and storyline, too. And that BPC ruin the Market... well, I don't currently see it but maybe I'm just blind, when I look at all the items actually needed to make a copy of T2-BPs... .
Er... I'm saying, how can you 'use up' a blueprint? Its silly and it ruins the economy.
Originally by: Danny V
Originally by: Vegeta
To be honest I think BPC's are the stupidest thing in this game at the moment.
I agree with ya. All they do is flood the game with the ability to build ships. Imho it shouldn't be as easy as it is to create a shipyard. The result of that lack of difficulty is profits are limited. (Not whining just a fact, takes a while to break even on the purchase of a bpo)
I think the Eve economy would be best served having bpcs deleted. If you don't want to spend the money on a bpo then you go out and buy the ships or modules bulk from a corp. To me that's more realistic and closer to how an economy should run.
I personally don't care for "I'll sell you the ability to build 10 times for yourself".
Totally man.
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Selim
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Posted - 2004.09.06 00:40:00 -
[64]
Originally by: Lufio II
Originally by: Selim
Edited by: Selim on 05/09/2004 16:51:20
... It doesnt make any sense in the realism factor, storyline factor, ...
I have to disagree on this one, especially for T2-Blueprints. It makes perfectly sense, since the one that can research and copy the BP does not necessarily have the skills to build the things, too. So would you give out your BPO to someone else just to have the Item produced? I don't think so, so you make a copy, give that to someone who can build it and have your item built without any worries that you might not get your BPO back after he's done building...
So it fits perfectly into realism factor, and storyline, too. And that BPC ruin the Market... well, I don't currently see it but maybe I'm just blind, when I look at all the items actually needed to make a copy of T2-BPs... .
Er... I'm saying, how can you 'use up' a blueprint? Its silly and it ruins the economy.
Originally by: Danny V
Originally by: Vegeta
To be honest I think BPC's are the stupidest thing in this game at the moment.
I agree with ya. All they do is flood the game with the ability to build ships. Imho it shouldn't be as easy as it is to create a shipyard. The result of that lack of difficulty is profits are limited. (Not whining just a fact, takes a while to break even on the purchase of a bpo)
I think the Eve economy would be best served having bpcs deleted. If you don't want to spend the money on a bpo then you go out and buy the ships or modules bulk from a corp. To me that's more realistic and closer to how an economy should run.
I personally don't care for "I'll sell you the ability to build 10 times for yourself".
Totally man.
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Danton Marcellus
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Posted - 2004.09.06 00:46:00 -
[65]
I'd settle for copies only other corporate members can use for the forward bases.
Convert Stations
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Danton Marcellus
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Posted - 2004.09.06 00:46:00 -
[66]
I'd settle for copies only other corporate members can use for the forward bases.
Convert Stations
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c0ntinuity
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Posted - 2004.09.06 06:10:00 -
[67]
Sorry Phasics, I think either your corp is lazy or you aren't very smart. I run an alt corporation on another account that is set up for research and production only. Basically it's just a little side income for me. We have been able to acquire any BPO we've wanted with few exceptions. We now have all the drone BPOs, all torp and heavy BPOs, several cruise, ammo, and module BPOs (including the 800mm steel plate armor now - YAY!). We are currently working on an osprey BPO and should have it in a decent timeframe. I've made all the isk needed to buy these by mining with 2 accounts and NO ONE ELSE's HELP.
If you can't put together the scratch for a few BPOs with even a small corp, the problem is your corp, NOT the system.
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c0ntinuity
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Posted - 2004.09.06 06:10:00 -
[68]
Sorry Phasics, I think either your corp is lazy or you aren't very smart. I run an alt corporation on another account that is set up for research and production only. Basically it's just a little side income for me. We have been able to acquire any BPO we've wanted with few exceptions. We now have all the drone BPOs, all torp and heavy BPOs, several cruise, ammo, and module BPOs (including the 800mm steel plate armor now - YAY!). We are currently working on an osprey BPO and should have it in a decent timeframe. I've made all the isk needed to buy these by mining with 2 accounts and NO ONE ELSE's HELP.
If you can't put together the scratch for a few BPOs with even a small corp, the problem is your corp, NOT the system.
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Phasics
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Posted - 2004.09.06 06:59:00 -
[69]
Originally by: c0ntinuity
Sorry Phasics, I think either your corp is lazy or you aren't very smart. I run an alt corporation on another account that is set up for research and production only. Basically it's just a little side income for me. We have been able to acquire any BPO we've wanted with few exceptions. We now have all the drone BPOs, all torp and heavy BPOs, several cruise, ammo, and module BPOs (including the 800mm steel plate armor now - YAY!). We are currently working on an osprey BPO and should have it in a decent timeframe. I've made all the isk needed to buy these by mining with 2 accounts and NO ONE ELSE's HELP.
If you can't put together the scratch for a few BPOs with even a small corp, the problem is your corp, NOT the system.
You know its funny as hell people who think suggestion on the forums always reflect players in game. I myself have 60 BPO's of varisous sorts (mostly high consumables like ammo missles and ships) , my corp has an entire hanger devoted to holding BPO's proabably 300+ , and our corp activly produces items and ships for sale. which we sell in 0.0 out of player owned station making a sweet markup on many items.
So again I reiterate that people on the forums only post with regaurds to how it will effect them and not if its good or bad for the game.
is it so inconcievabel to you people that somone could come up with an idea that might acutally hurt them in-game more than other people ?
I guess it really just show how self centered most of your people are.
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Phasics
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Posted - 2004.09.06 06:59:00 -
[70]
Originally by: c0ntinuity
Sorry Phasics, I think either your corp is lazy or you aren't very smart. I run an alt corporation on another account that is set up for research and production only. Basically it's just a little side income for me. We have been able to acquire any BPO we've wanted with few exceptions. We now have all the drone BPOs, all torp and heavy BPOs, several cruise, ammo, and module BPOs (including the 800mm steel plate armor now - YAY!). We are currently working on an osprey BPO and should have it in a decent timeframe. I've made all the isk needed to buy these by mining with 2 accounts and NO ONE ELSE's HELP.
If you can't put together the scratch for a few BPOs with even a small corp, the problem is your corp, NOT the system.
You know its funny as hell people who think suggestion on the forums always reflect players in game. I myself have 60 BPO's of varisous sorts (mostly high consumables like ammo missles and ships) , my corp has an entire hanger devoted to holding BPO's proabably 300+ , and our corp activly produces items and ships for sale. which we sell in 0.0 out of player owned station making a sweet markup on many items.
So again I reiterate that people on the forums only post with regaurds to how it will effect them and not if its good or bad for the game.
is it so inconcievabel to you people that somone could come up with an idea that might acutally hurt them in-game more than other people ?
I guess it really just show how self centered most of your people are.
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Nyk0n
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Posted - 2004.09.06 14:38:00 -
[71]
Ive been in eve since about 2 weeks after retail release in the uk, when i first started playing the average price of a moa was about 20-24m, i just read a post that said ccp expected that a maller would cost in the region of 20m and a apoc 220 ish.
With the number of peeps who had bpos bein so low there was less compertion amoungst sellers and prices were closer to ccps "expectation"
Ccp made bpc's so that players with bpos could make copies and run multiple factories at once to produce there items. Then some 1 decided to sell 1, the main problem came when bs bps were introduced, those that could afford the inital 1bil+ outlay rapidly made that back many times over buy selling unlimited copies at 200m+.
There were then many more peeps producing items as although they couldnt afford a bpo they might be able to get the money together 4 a copy, which back then was as good as a bpo as lng as u wanted to make the items themselves, 90% of unlimited bpcs are low mineral res as peeps were to be busy makin copies to reserch them so it made little difference to the producer if they were only intending to produce wheather they had a bpo or a copy. So began the price wars.
With ccp then making bps limited in there copys they made the bpcs even cheaper with even more players being able to build themselves ships, n lets be fair who would pay twice as much just to have some1 else build there item 4 them? Result prices lower again.
So from the above id think the damage comes from bpcs, ccp had to stop the early bpo holders making the insane amounts they did but kinda diluted the market even further while doing it.
Make the same bp readable from multiple factories, n kill the bpcs completly imo, and to those who say well what about the little corps or solo players etc etc, they earn them in time just like the original bpo holders did, eve is a time intensive game if u dont want to put the time or work into it maybe its not 4 u, altering it so it isnt would result in it becomeing shallow very quickly.
Theres LOADS more isk avalible now then there was at the start, allot of nu b's can afford cruisers in there first week, it took me a lot longer to get my first cruiser, and hurt even more when i lost it n got nothing from insurence as it was dam expensive at 1 point, so u should be able to get enough 4 ur first bpo quite fast and once u do ud actully make 1/2 decent isk when u sold a ship not the few hundred k u make now assumin ur bps highly res'd
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Nyk0n
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Posted - 2004.09.06 14:38:00 -
[72]
Ive been in eve since about 2 weeks after retail release in the uk, when i first started playing the average price of a moa was about 20-24m, i just read a post that said ccp expected that a maller would cost in the region of 20m and a apoc 220 ish.
With the number of peeps who had bpos bein so low there was less compertion amoungst sellers and prices were closer to ccps "expectation"
Ccp made bpc's so that players with bpos could make copies and run multiple factories at once to produce there items. Then some 1 decided to sell 1, the main problem came when bs bps were introduced, those that could afford the inital 1bil+ outlay rapidly made that back many times over buy selling unlimited copies at 200m+.
There were then many more peeps producing items as although they couldnt afford a bpo they might be able to get the money together 4 a copy, which back then was as good as a bpo as lng as u wanted to make the items themselves, 90% of unlimited bpcs are low mineral res as peeps were to be busy makin copies to reserch them so it made little difference to the producer if they were only intending to produce wheather they had a bpo or a copy. So began the price wars.
With ccp then making bps limited in there copys they made the bpcs even cheaper with even more players being able to build themselves ships, n lets be fair who would pay twice as much just to have some1 else build there item 4 them? Result prices lower again.
So from the above id think the damage comes from bpcs, ccp had to stop the early bpo holders making the insane amounts they did but kinda diluted the market even further while doing it.
Make the same bp readable from multiple factories, n kill the bpcs completly imo, and to those who say well what about the little corps or solo players etc etc, they earn them in time just like the original bpo holders did, eve is a time intensive game if u dont want to put the time or work into it maybe its not 4 u, altering it so it isnt would result in it becomeing shallow very quickly.
Theres LOADS more isk avalible now then there was at the start, allot of nu b's can afford cruisers in there first week, it took me a lot longer to get my first cruiser, and hurt even more when i lost it n got nothing from insurence as it was dam expensive at 1 point, so u should be able to get enough 4 ur first bpo quite fast and once u do ud actully make 1/2 decent isk when u sold a ship not the few hundred k u make now assumin ur bps highly res'd
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Danny V
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Posted - 2004.09.06 17:34:00 -
[73]
Originally by: Nyk0n
Ive been in eve since about 2 weeks after retail release in the uk, when i first started playing the average price of a moa was about 20-24m, i just read a post that said ccp expected that a maller would cost in the region of 20m and a apoc 220 ish.
With the number of peeps who had bpos bein so low there was less compertion amoungst sellers and prices were closer to ccps "expectation"
Ccp made bpc's so that players with bpos could make copies and run multiple factories at once to produce there items. Then some 1 decided to sell 1, the main problem came when bs bps were introduced, those that could afford the inital 1bil+ outlay rapidly made that back many times over buy selling unlimited copies at 200m+.
There were then many more peeps producing items as although they couldnt afford a bpo they might be able to get the money together 4 a copy, which back then was as good as a bpo as lng as u wanted to make the items themselves, 90% of unlimited bpcs are low mineral res as peeps were to be busy makin copies to reserch them so it made little difference to the producer if they were only intending to produce wheather they had a bpo or a copy. So began the price wars.
With ccp then making bps limited in there copys they made the bpcs even cheaper with even more players being able to build themselves ships, n lets be fair who would pay twice as much just to have some1 else build there item 4 them? Result prices lower again.
So from the above id think the damage comes from bpcs, ccp had to stop the early bpo holders making the insane amounts they did but kinda diluted the market even further while doing it.
Make the same bp readable from multiple factories, n kill the bpcs completly imo, and to those who say well what about the little corps or solo players etc etc, they earn them in time just like the original bpo holders did, eve is a time intensive game if u dont want to put the time or work into it maybe its not 4 u, altering it so it isnt would result in it becomeing shallow very quickly.
Theres LOADS more isk avalible now then there was at the start, allot of nu b's can afford cruisers in there first week, it took me a lot longer to get my first cruiser, and hurt even more when i lost it n got nothing from insurence as it was dam expensive at 1 point, so u should be able to get enough 4 ur first bpo quite fast and once u do ud actully make 1/2 decent isk when u sold a ship not the few hundred k u make now assumin ur bps highly res'd
Exactly my point, and peeps say bpcs aren't a virus pffft  . I was giddy when i got my first cruiser wayyy back in the day. They're chump change now. BPCs need to go.
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Danny V
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Posted - 2004.09.06 17:34:00 -
[74]
Originally by: Nyk0n
Ive been in eve since about 2 weeks after retail release in the uk, when i first started playing the average price of a moa was about 20-24m, i just read a post that said ccp expected that a maller would cost in the region of 20m and a apoc 220 ish.
With the number of peeps who had bpos bein so low there was less compertion amoungst sellers and prices were closer to ccps "expectation"
Ccp made bpc's so that players with bpos could make copies and run multiple factories at once to produce there items. Then some 1 decided to sell 1, the main problem came when bs bps were introduced, those that could afford the inital 1bil+ outlay rapidly made that back many times over buy selling unlimited copies at 200m+.
There were then many more peeps producing items as although they couldnt afford a bpo they might be able to get the money together 4 a copy, which back then was as good as a bpo as lng as u wanted to make the items themselves, 90% of unlimited bpcs are low mineral res as peeps were to be busy makin copies to reserch them so it made little difference to the producer if they were only intending to produce wheather they had a bpo or a copy. So began the price wars.
With ccp then making bps limited in there copys they made the bpcs even cheaper with even more players being able to build themselves ships, n lets be fair who would pay twice as much just to have some1 else build there item 4 them? Result prices lower again.
So from the above id think the damage comes from bpcs, ccp had to stop the early bpo holders making the insane amounts they did but kinda diluted the market even further while doing it.
Make the same bp readable from multiple factories, n kill the bpcs completly imo, and to those who say well what about the little corps or solo players etc etc, they earn them in time just like the original bpo holders did, eve is a time intensive game if u dont want to put the time or work into it maybe its not 4 u, altering it so it isnt would result in it becomeing shallow very quickly.
Theres LOADS more isk avalible now then there was at the start, allot of nu b's can afford cruisers in there first week, it took me a lot longer to get my first cruiser, and hurt even more when i lost it n got nothing from insurence as it was dam expensive at 1 point, so u should be able to get enough 4 ur first bpo quite fast and once u do ud actully make 1/2 decent isk when u sold a ship not the few hundred k u make now assumin ur bps highly res'd
Exactly my point, and peeps say bpcs aren't a virus pffft . I was giddy when i got my first cruiser wayyy back in the day. They're chump change now. BPCs need to go.
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Xavier Arron
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Posted - 2004.09.06 23:44:00 -
[75]
Originally by: Danny V
Exactly my point, and peeps say bpcs aren't a virus pffft . I was giddy when i got my first cruiser wayyy back in the day. They're chump change now. BPCs need to go.
Getting rid of BPC's wont really make a difference for most of the low end Tech 1 market, since BPO prices are so cheap, and most corps own BPO's of ammo / modules / ships they use on a regular basis (not to mention the glut of existing BPCÆs and all the loot rats drop).
You would get some what of a Tech 1 cruiser market and very profitable BS market once again but the rest of the Tech 1 market would still be pretty dead.
The problem is that most corps can just manufacture everything they need, once they have a BPO or BPC. From the start Tech 1 items (like Tech 2) should have required, extensive skills trees for different item types, Investment in tools / equipment for production, and also various facilities. Items Such as ships should of required specialist POS shipyards from the start.
The second problem that needs to be addressed is the time it takes to setup a factory for manufacture e.g. 24hrs would be good as it would penalise short or 1 off production runs. An efficiency bonus could also be given over time as problems in production are sorted out and the corp gains more experience at manufacturing that item. This would encourage further corps to keep factories geared to the manufacture of just one item / type of item.
If Tech 2 BPO's are put on the market, at a significant price (200 mill+ and up for the low end items û unlike most of low end Tech 1) with sufficient SKILL, TOOLS, COMPONENT and FACILITIES requirements, the Tech 2 market will not crash like Tech 1 did, but will be more involving, dynamic and competitive and will still be profitable for ALL.
A more detailed explanation is here:
Other Tech 2 lottery thread
This is a whole section of the game that really could be improved greatly and made so much more fun and rewarding in terms of game play. I really hope this gets some luving post Shiva / come Kali.
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Xavier Arron
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Posted - 2004.09.06 23:44:00 -
[76]
Originally by: Danny V
Exactly my point, and peeps say bpcs aren't a virus pffft . I was giddy when i got my first cruiser wayyy back in the day. They're chump change now. BPCs need to go.
Getting rid of BPC's wont really make a difference for most of the low end Tech 1 market, since BPO prices are so cheap, and most corps own BPO's of ammo / modules / ships they use on a regular basis (not to mention the glut of existing BPCÆs and all the loot rats drop).
You would get some what of a Tech 1 cruiser market and very profitable BS market once again but the rest of the Tech 1 market would still be pretty dead.
The problem is that most corps can just manufacture everything they need, once they have a BPO or BPC. From the start Tech 1 items (like Tech 2) should have required, extensive skills trees for different item types, Investment in tools / equipment for production, and also various facilities. Items Such as ships should of required specialist POS shipyards from the start.
The second problem that needs to be addressed is the time it takes to setup a factory for manufacture e.g. 24hrs would be good as it would penalise short or 1 off production runs. An efficiency bonus could also be given over time as problems in production are sorted out and the corp gains more experience at manufacturing that item. This would encourage further corps to keep factories geared to the manufacture of just one item / type of item.
If Tech 2 BPO's are put on the market, at a significant price (200 mill+ and up for the low end items û unlike most of low end Tech 1) with sufficient SKILL, TOOLS, COMPONENT and FACILITIES requirements, the Tech 2 market will not crash like Tech 1 did, but will be more involving, dynamic and competitive and will still be profitable for ALL.
A more detailed explanation is here:
Other Tech 2 lottery thread
This is a whole section of the game that really could be improved greatly and made so much more fun and rewarding in terms of game play. I really hope this gets some luving post Shiva / come Kali.
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Maya Rkell
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Posted - 2004.09.07 00:21:00 -
[77]
The only change needed is the one CCP said they'd do long ago. KILL UNLIMITED BPC's!
(I'm not willing to go further because of the idiots who'd jump on the idea and, once more, twist it into "kill all BPC's)
"As far as I can tell, It doesn't matter who you are, If you can believe there's something worth fighting for " - Garbage, "Parade" |
Maya Rkell
|
Posted - 2004.09.07 00:21:00 -
[78]
The only change needed is the one CCP said they'd do long ago. KILL UNLIMITED BPC's!
(I'm not willing to go further because of the idiots who'd jump on the idea and, once more, twist it into "kill all BPC's)
"As far as I can tell, It doesn't matter who you are, If you can believe there's something worth fighting for " - Garbage, "Parade" |
Danny V
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Posted - 2004.09.07 05:26:00 -
[79]
Originally by: Xavier Arron
Getting rid of BPC's wont really make a difference for most of the low end Tech 1 market, since BPO prices are so cheap, and most corps own BPO's of ammo / modules / ships they use on a regular basis (not to mention the glut of existing BPCÆs and all the loot rats drop).
You would get some what of a Tech 1 cruiser market and very profitable BS market once again but the rest of the Tech 1 market would still be pretty dead.
Agreed. My whole Focus on nixing bpcs is for the Cruiser and BS market anyway tho. Big boost there.
Originally by: Xavier Arron
If Tech 2 BPO's are put on the market, at a significant price (200 mill+ and up for the low end items û unlike most of low end Tech 1) with sufficient SKILL, TOOLS, COMPONENT and FACILITIES requirements, the Tech 2 market will not crash like Tech 1 did, but will be more involving, dynamic and competitive and will still be profitable for ALL.
If tech2 were put on the market, cardiac units accross the world would be full of peeps who spent months training for their R&D agent. I will admit that i am biased since my corp is not very rich and would not be able to afford to buy tech2 off the market at a price that wouldn't flood the market, but you can't just pull the rug out from under the agent runners. If the bps were released thru lottery for a period of time (a few months), then released to the market that's something that might be acceptable. The new ship bpos should continue to be released thru the agent system. It's fair ground where ANYONE (remember me SmallCorp Inc.) has a chance.
I do think it's obvious that CCP needs to delete bpc. I would settle for Unlimiteds deleted only, but that's just the crust of the problem. Limited runs would still be flooding the market.
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Danny V
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Posted - 2004.09.07 05:26:00 -
[80]
Originally by: Xavier Arron
Getting rid of BPC's wont really make a difference for most of the low end Tech 1 market, since BPO prices are so cheap, and most corps own BPO's of ammo / modules / ships they use on a regular basis (not to mention the glut of existing BPCÆs and all the loot rats drop).
You would get some what of a Tech 1 cruiser market and very profitable BS market once again but the rest of the Tech 1 market would still be pretty dead.
Agreed. My whole Focus on nixing bpcs is for the Cruiser and BS market anyway tho. Big boost there.
Originally by: Xavier Arron
If Tech 2 BPO's are put on the market, at a significant price (200 mill+ and up for the low end items û unlike most of low end Tech 1) with sufficient SKILL, TOOLS, COMPONENT and FACILITIES requirements, the Tech 2 market will not crash like Tech 1 did, but will be more involving, dynamic and competitive and will still be profitable for ALL.
If tech2 were put on the market, cardiac units accross the world would be full of peeps who spent months training for their R&D agent. I will admit that i am biased since my corp is not very rich and would not be able to afford to buy tech2 off the market at a price that wouldn't flood the market, but you can't just pull the rug out from under the agent runners. If the bps were released thru lottery for a period of time (a few months), then released to the market that's something that might be acceptable. The new ship bpos should continue to be released thru the agent system. It's fair ground where ANYONE (remember me SmallCorp Inc.) has a chance.
I do think it's obvious that CCP needs to delete bpc. I would settle for Unlimiteds deleted only, but that's just the crust of the problem. Limited runs would still be flooding the market.
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Mimo
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Posted - 2004.09.07 10:58:00 -
[81]
Totalled
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Mimo
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Posted - 2004.09.07 10:58:00 -
[82]
Totalled
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Malerna
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Posted - 2004.09.07 11:24:00 -
[83]
Researching into a BPO (just the way its done) is wrong imo. The bpo shouldn't be "released" then someone find it. It should be found and then released. Blueprint copies is like selling on a limited patent on an item you have the patent on. So copying tI bp's like bships is wrong, as you clearly aren't the owner of the original thing (the corpoartion/character who first recieved them are).
Face it, you can't go realism or only one person would have a BPO and it would be for others to 'modify' slightly to it and release their own stuff.
Won't happen in a game.
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Malerna
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Posted - 2004.09.07 11:24:00 -
[84]
Researching into a BPO (just the way its done) is wrong imo. The bpo shouldn't be "released" then someone find it. It should be found and then released. Blueprint copies is like selling on a limited patent on an item you have the patent on. So copying tI bp's like bships is wrong, as you clearly aren't the owner of the original thing (the corpoartion/character who first recieved them are).
Face it, you can't go realism or only one person would have a BPO and it would be for others to 'modify' slightly to it and release their own stuff.
Won't happen in a game.
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Xavier Arron
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Posted - 2004.09.08 00:56:00 -
[85]
Edited by: Xavier Arron on 08/09/2004 01:03:36
Originally by: Danny V
If tech2 were put on the market, cardiac units across the world would be full of peeps who spent months training for their R&D agent. I will admit that I am biased since my corp is not very rich and would not be able to afford to buy tech2 off the market at a price that wouldn't flood the market, but you can't just pull the rug out from under the agent runners. If the bps were released thru lottery for a period of time (a few months), then released to the market that's something that might be acceptable. The new ship bpos should continue to be released thru the agent system. It's fair ground where ANYONE (remember me SmallCorp Inc.) has a chance.
I do think it's obvious that CCP needs to delete bpc. I would settle for Unlimited's deleted only, but that's just the crust of the problem. Limited runs would still be flooding the market.
This is a post from another thread but raises a good point;
Originally by: Xavier Arron
Originally by: Sitar
Why Cant they use the R&D agents for Pre-Release by only giving out advanced 1 run copies, Giving more people the chance to receive the BPC, and down the road a bit as they are more frequent release them on the Market in limited release. That way you will see that many more people excited and involved in R&D agents since the chances will be greater to receive a copy. I do not agree with the lottery aspect of BPO release. It sets the winner in a whole new bracket as far as wealth to easily.
Exactly - What happens when Tech 2 BS BPO's are released? Is it fair that a player can become more wealthy and powerful over night than many large corps in EVE whom have been playing for over a year?
Who ever gets that BPO its a license to print money, especially since no new competition can enter the market dynamically with the current CCP controlled system, and as such demand will always far exceed supply keeping prices sky high.
I appreciate that many people in the game like the lottery because it gives the small guy a chance to get a part of the æbig pieÆ. But what I disagree with is the slice of that pie û which in my opinion is just too great.
In the grand scheme of things the time that is spent doing agent missions by 1 person should not equal more wealth and power than almost all large corps in EVE have achieved in months as a group û particularly in the case of Tech 2 BS BPOÆs when they are released.
You say that ANYONE (forced to do agent missions) can have a chance at getting the BPOÆs including the little guy û but why should this be the case? Why should the little guy just get handed a Tech 2 BS BPO which will be unobtainable by most large corps under the current system. IMHO û there should always be things the big corps can do that the little guys cant, but can strive towards, otherwise there is little point in collectively working together to achieve greater aims, like was the case when corps would work towards obtaining Tech 1 Cruiser and BS BPOÆs.
With the current system small groups of people end up controlling a large part of the market, while the rest have to just sit and watch.
IMHO - Tech 2 BPOÆs should be released onto the market aswell but at a considerable price.
Start Tech 2 BPOÆs at 200 mill+ for the low end modules that sell in low volume and set prices for the more complex and expensive modules way up into the 500mill +. Set Ship BPOÆs accordingly with cruiser and BS BPOÆs into the billions.
I donÆt agree with giving individuals billions of dollars in BPOÆs and would rather only see agents give out Pre-release limited run BPCÆs as Sitar suggested. (A 10 run BS BPC would still be worth a significant amount). A compromise could be to allow some BPOÆs to be rarely given out through the agent system along with some more limited 1-10 run BPCÆs post release.
IMO - Why the Tech 1 market crashed , and why the Tech 2 market wouldn't(Scroll down to read my posts):
Linkage
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Xavier Arron
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Posted - 2004.09.08 00:56:00 -
[86]
Edited by: Xavier Arron on 08/09/2004 01:03:36
Originally by: Danny V
If tech2 were put on the market, cardiac units across the world would be full of peeps who spent months training for their R&D agent. I will admit that I am biased since my corp is not very rich and would not be able to afford to buy tech2 off the market at a price that wouldn't flood the market, but you can't just pull the rug out from under the agent runners. If the bps were released thru lottery for a period of time (a few months), then released to the market that's something that might be acceptable. The new ship bpos should continue to be released thru the agent system. It's fair ground where ANYONE (remember me SmallCorp Inc.) has a chance.
I do think it's obvious that CCP needs to delete bpc. I would settle for Unlimited's deleted only, but that's just the crust of the problem. Limited runs would still be flooding the market.
This is a post from another thread but raises a good point;
Originally by: Xavier Arron
Originally by: Sitar
Why Cant they use the R&D agents for Pre-Release by only giving out advanced 1 run copies, Giving more people the chance to receive the BPC, and down the road a bit as they are more frequent release them on the Market in limited release. That way you will see that many more people excited and involved in R&D agents since the chances will be greater to receive a copy. I do not agree with the lottery aspect of BPO release. It sets the winner in a whole new bracket as far as wealth to easily.
Exactly - What happens when Tech 2 BS BPO's are released? Is it fair that a player can become more wealthy and powerful over night than many large corps in EVE whom have been playing for over a year?
Who ever gets that BPO its a license to print money, especially since no new competition can enter the market dynamically with the current CCP controlled system, and as such demand will always far exceed supply keeping prices sky high.
I appreciate that many people in the game like the lottery because it gives the small guy a chance to get a part of the æbig pieÆ. But what I disagree with is the slice of that pie û which in my opinion is just too great.
In the grand scheme of things the time that is spent doing agent missions by 1 person should not equal more wealth and power than almost all large corps in EVE have achieved in months as a group û particularly in the case of Tech 2 BS BPOÆs when they are released.
You say that ANYONE (forced to do agent missions) can have a chance at getting the BPOÆs including the little guy û but why should this be the case? Why should the little guy just get handed a Tech 2 BS BPO which will be unobtainable by most large corps under the current system. IMHO û there should always be things the big corps can do that the little guys cant, but can strive towards, otherwise there is little point in collectively working together to achieve greater aims, like was the case when corps would work towards obtaining Tech 1 Cruiser and BS BPOÆs.
With the current system small groups of people end up controlling a large part of the market, while the rest have to just sit and watch.
IMHO - Tech 2 BPOÆs should be released onto the market aswell but at a considerable price.
Start Tech 2 BPOÆs at 200 mill+ for the low end modules that sell in low volume and set prices for the more complex and expensive modules way up into the 500mill +. Set Ship BPOÆs accordingly with cruiser and BS BPOÆs into the billions.
I donÆt agree with giving individuals billions of dollars in BPOÆs and would rather only see agents give out Pre-release limited run BPCÆs as Sitar suggested. (A 10 run BS BPC would still be worth a significant amount). A compromise could be to allow some BPOÆs to be rarely given out through the agent system along with some more limited 1-10 run BPCÆs post release.
IMO - Why the Tech 1 market crashed , and why the Tech 2 market wouldn't(Scroll down to read my posts):
Linkage
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Tech2 Shoppe
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Posted - 2004.09.08 02:09:00 -
[87]
Originally by: Vegeta
lol, stupid newbie, screw you. People who cant make money whine about it and want things changed. Well guess what, money attracts money so shut your mouth and go back into your hole.
How nice, people like you are a bad mark on Eve, please leave the game ASAP.
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Tech2 Shoppe
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Posted - 2004.09.08 02:09:00 -
[88]
Originally by: Vegeta
lol, stupid newbie, screw you. People who cant make money whine about it and want things changed. Well guess what, money attracts money so shut your mouth and go back into your hole.
How nice, people like you are a bad mark on Eve, please leave the game ASAP.
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Danny V
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Posted - 2004.09.08 04:59:00 -
[89]
Edited by: Danny V on 08/09/2004 05:00:44
Originally by: Xavier Arron
I appreciate that many people in the game like the lottery because it gives the small guy a chance to get a part of the æbig pieÆ. But what I disagree with is the slice of that pie û which in my opinion is just too great.
This is a very good point because you are correct. A relatively new player could end up with a techII bpo worth billions  . Maybe corp size could have an affect.
 How about corps being able to designate a Head Researcher that incorporates corp size or something along those lines to increase these "Head Reaseacher"s chances at getting bpos? Dunno if peeps would go for that.
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Danny V
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Posted - 2004.09.08 04:59:00 -
[90]
Edited by: Danny V on 08/09/2004 05:00:44
Originally by: Xavier Arron
I appreciate that many people in the game like the lottery because it gives the small guy a chance to get a part of the æbig pieÆ. But what I disagree with is the slice of that pie û which in my opinion is just too great.
This is a very good point because you are correct. A relatively new player could end up with a techII bpo worth billions . Maybe corp size could have an affect.
How about corps being able to designate a Head Researcher that incorporates corp size or something along those lines to increase these "Head Reaseacher"s chances at getting bpos? Dunno if peeps would go for that.
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Rea Der
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Posted - 2004.09.08 06:23:00 -
[91]
BPC`s killed the market and some of the fun in the game.
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Rea Der
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Posted - 2004.09.08 06:23:00 -
[92]
BPC`s killed the market and some of the fun in the game.
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