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Jaina Proudmoar
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Posted - 2009.07.23 09:33:00 -
[1]
I believe that EVE is missing a hauler dedicated to the transport of assembled/rigged ships.
I would like one to be introduced.
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Jaina Proudmoar
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Posted - 2009.07.23 09:34:00 -
[2]
I naturally support my own proposal.
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Lee Dalton
Noir.
Noir. Mercenary Group
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Posted - 2009.07.23 09:39:00 -
[3]
Would be useful - currently the only option for moving ships around highsec seems to be the Orca ...
***
You're only as good as your last fight. |
SupaKudoRio
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Posted - 2009.07.23 10:39:00 -
[4]
-SIG-
The true meaning of CCP; Completely Crap Patches.
But I don't care, I haz CHOCOLATE. :D |
Odetta Harpy
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Posted - 2009.07.23 12:56:00 -
[5]
maby a t2 freighter with a ship maintenance bay and no cargo hold. |
W3370Pi4
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Posted - 2009.07.23 13:00:00 -
[6]
im sure there is some other thread somewhere but nvm it's missing ingame
and if it's t2 it should not go over the 2B range
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Inari Valar
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Posted - 2009.07.23 13:29:00 -
[7]
Removing the 120k m3 restriction on courier contracts would allow freighters to fill this role. |
Drake Draconis
Minmatar
Shadow Cadre
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Posted - 2009.07.23 14:35:00 -
[8]
Perhaps a T2 Orca? |
Galen Gallente
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Posted - 2009.07.23 14:45:00 -
[9]
Edited by: Galen Gallente on 23/07/2009 14:46:03
 Originally by: Drake Draconis
Perhaps a T2 Orca?
For the bloody love of god no. The Orca is an Mining Command ship no matter what stupid classification ccp has thought it should fill.
We need small/light freighters that fill the 75K-200K range of cargo. We also need a small and large ship that can move fitted vessels.
It should not need any more skills to fly than the normal Freighters.
Why does there seem to be a need from the player base to add extra requirements for a ship that really should already be in the bloody game.
We need less "oooo shiney" design and actually get a complete system developed that is not missing gaping holes. |
Laxyr
Chamsin Mining Inc.
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Posted - 2009.07.23 15:02:00 -
[10]
Supported ;-) |
Kaylan Jahlar
Minmatar Industrial Limited
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Posted - 2009.07.23 15:32:00 -
[11]
A sort of "Space Tugboat" would be another option too, but I'd like to have a ship dedicated to the transport of large ships.
Supported. |
Gouverneur
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Posted - 2009.07.23 16:46:00 -
[12]
Would be pretty useful. |
jemos
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Posted - 2009.07.23 17:22:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Kaylan Jahlar
A sort of "Space Tugboat" would be another option too, but I'd like to have a ship dedicated to the transport of large ships.
Supported.
I'd kill to se a Mega being tugged though space!
Supported! |
DCThunder
Agent-Orange
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Posted - 2009.07.23 17:55:00 -
[14]
Excellent idea |
Herschel Yamamoto
Agent-Orange
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Posted - 2009.07.23 19:03:00 -
[15]
This should be the province of freighters and Orcas. I expect it'll be easier to make CCP let us haul ships in the right hulls(through one of the many proposals to haul rigged ships) than it will be to get them to bring in a new hull for the purpose. |
Jaina Proudmoar
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Posted - 2009.07.23 19:39:00 -
[16]
Edited by: Jaina Proudmoar on 23/07/2009 19:40:12
Originally by: Drake Draconis
Perhaps a T2 Orca?
As long as it's a T2 Orca which doesn't need mining skills ...
I'm proposing a ship dedicated to hauling rigged ships - it doesn't even need to have a cargo bay and certainly doesn't need mining bonuses. :)
Edit:
What kind of skill requirements would be reasonable?
Industrial V
Spaceship Command V
Advanced Spaceship Command <something>
<New skill>
? |
Galen Gallente
Gallente
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Posted - 2009.07.23 20:55:00 -
[17]
Edited by: Galen Gallente on 23/07/2009 20:56:44
Edited by: Galen Gallente on 23/07/2009 20:55:51
Ok what is the fascination with the Orca?
It is a misguided vessel that has bastard requirements if it meant to be a transport/freight ship.
It is a mining command ship, it is meant to haul ore and act as a central point to mining operations.
Hell, any solution to the hauling of fitted ships should only really require Industrials V.
****************************************************
On a seperate note if we are going to be thorough we need a reworking of the entire transport ship skill system.
There is no reason for there to be racial industrial/transport/freighter skill progressions. All cargo ships should be like the ORE ships, a separate system unto themselves.
Tier 1: Industrial 1-5, Freighters (Large Cargo), Shippers (Move 1 or many fitted ships)
Tier 2 - Transports, Jump Freighters, ?Jump Shippers
Another section that is missing would be the Heavily armored Freighters and Shippers. You know like the Transports that have armor and a few levels of warp stability.
It just seems clunky to have some many racial skills splitting out this tree for no real good reason. It is definitely an area that could use consolidation and refocus. |
Galen Gallente
Gallente
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Posted - 2009.07.23 21:00:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Jaina Proudmoar
Edited by: Jaina Proudmoar on 23/07/2009 19:40:12
Originally by: Drake Draconis
Perhaps a T2 Orca?
As long as it's a T2 Orca which doesn't need mining skills ...
I'm proposing a ship dedicated to hauling rigged ships - it doesn't even need to have a cargo bay and certainly doesn't need mining bonuses. :)
Edit:
What kind of skill requirements would be reasonable?
Industrial V
Spaceship Command V
Advanced Spaceship Command <something>
<New skill>
?
Industrial IV
Spaceship Command III
for the Tier 1 version of the ship that can haul 1 BS.
Industrial V
Spaceship Command V
for the Tier 1 version of the ship that can haul a few BSs.
Industrial V
Spaceship Command V
Advanced Spaceship Command <something>
<New skill>
Only for the Tier 1 version that can move fleets.
There should also be Tier 2 version that are either faster or have thick hides like the Transports are to the normal Industrials. |
darius mclever
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Posted - 2009.07.23 21:32:00 -
[19]
i dont see anything wrong in the skill path for the orca.
a t2 orca should be able to carry 1 or 2 BS.
not supported. |
Jaina Proudmoar
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Posted - 2009.07.23 21:54:00 -
[20]
Ok ...
This thread has little - if anything - to do with the Orca.
This is a proposal for a *dedicated rigged ship transport*.
This has nothing to do with mining or the Orca's training path.
(Use of the Orca's hull because it's pretty and easier than making a new model may be a point though. >.> ) |
Herschel Yamamoto
Agent-Orange
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Posted - 2009.07.23 22:15:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Galen Gallente
On a seperate note if we are going to be thorough we need a reworking of the entire transport ship skill system.
There is no reason for there to be racial industrial/transport/freighter skill progressions. All cargo ships should be like the ORE ships, a separate system unto themselves.
Tier 1: Industrial 1-5, Freighters (Large Cargo), Shippers (Move 1 or many fitted ships)
Tier 2 - Transports, Jump Freighters, ?Jump Shippers
Another section that is missing would be the Heavily armored Freighters and Shippers. You know like the Transports that have armor and a few levels of warp stability.
It just seems clunky to have some many racial skills splitting out this tree for no real good reason. It is definitely an area that could use consolidation and refocus.
Ugh, no. The current system is just fine. |
yani dumyat
Tribal Liberation Force
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Posted - 2009.07.23 22:22:00 -
[22]
Yep would love to see this.
As a side note does anyone else think the orca looks like a memory stick? |
Jaina Proudmoar
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Posted - 2009.07.24 19:22:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Galen Gallente
Originally by: Jaina Proudmoar
Edited by: Jaina Proudmoar on 23/07/2009 19:40:12
Originally by: Drake Draconis
Perhaps a T2 Orca?
As long as it's a T2 Orca which doesn't need mining skills ...
I'm proposing a ship dedicated to hauling rigged ships - it doesn't even need to have a cargo bay and certainly doesn't need mining bonuses. :)
Edit:
What kind of skill requirements would be reasonable?
Industrial V
Spaceship Command V
Advanced Spaceship Command <something>
<New skill>
?
Industrial IV
Spaceship Command III
for the Tier 1 version of the ship that can haul 1 BS.
Industrial V
Spaceship Command V
for the Tier 1 version of the ship that can haul a few BSs.
Industrial V
Spaceship Command V
Advanced Spaceship Command <something>
<New skill>
Only for the Tier 1 version that can move fleets.
There should also be Tier 2 version that are either faster or have thick hides like the Transports are to the normal Industrials.
Looks too low to me tbh.
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N'tek alar
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Posted - 2009.07.24 19:43:00 -
[24]
Sounds good. |
steave435
Caldari
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
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Posted - 2009.07.25 03:38:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Galen Gallente
Originally by: Jaina Proudmoar
Edited by: Jaina Proudmoar on 23/07/2009 19:40:12
Originally by: Drake Draconis
Perhaps a T2 Orca?
As long as it's a T2 Orca which doesn't need mining skills ...
I'm proposing a ship dedicated to hauling rigged ships - it doesn't even need to have a cargo bay and certainly doesn't need mining bonuses. :)
Edit:
What kind of skill requirements would be reasonable?
Industrial V
Spaceship Command V
Advanced Spaceship Command <something>
<New skill>
?
Industrial IV
Spaceship Command III
for the Tier 1 version of the ship that can haul 1 BS.
Industrial V
Spaceship Command V
for the Tier 1 version of the ship that can haul a few BSs.
Industrial V
Spaceship Command V
Advanced Spaceship Command <something>
<New skill>
Only for the Tier 1 version that can move fleets.
There should also be Tier 2 version that are either faster or have thick hides like the Transports are to the normal Industrials.
You should need a freighter class ship to move assembled BS just like you need a freighter class ship to move them packaged. It should be harder to move a rigged ship then it is to move a repackaged one.
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Dr BattleSmith
PAX Interstellar Services
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Posted - 2009.07.25 04:08:00 -
[26]
It'd be best like a freighter.
No fittings, no cargohold, no jetcans, just ships.
So they have zero tank, completely vulnerable, not for solo ship moving.
But can carry as many or more ships then a mothership and go into empire.
Forget the T2 Orca.... this has nothing to do with mining.
As far as using it to transport ships for sale in empire, think the ship would have
too much tank if it's designed to make a suicide gank anything but a sure thing.
When you consider the value of a shipment of BCs the suicide gank should almost
always be much more attractive then most freighter loads.
The tug-boat idea is cool.... Think that's generally what we're talking about,
a ship made outta scaffolding rather then a hardened ship bay.
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Jaina Proudmoar
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Posted - 2009.07.25 10:35:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Dr BattleSmith
It'd be best like a freighter.
No fittings, no cargohold, no jetcans, just ships.
So they have zero tank, completely vulnerable, not for solo ship moving.
0 tank? I was thinking of something with similar stats to a freighter - but with a ship bay instead of a cargohold.
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Mashie Saldana
BFG Tech
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Posted - 2009.07.25 11:44:00 -
[28]
Or we could just get a new kind of freigther containers that are bigger and can contain rigged ships. It should be pretty easy to code it so they have the same restrictions as a carrier corp hangar regarding goods within ships.
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W3370Pi4
Caldari
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Posted - 2009.07.25 20:40:00 -
[29]
Im all for this but not a t2 orca
the freighter & transport skill at level 4 must be a requirement
and the new skill to fly the ship must be a rank 14 skill and cost at least 300M
_______
Join the "Legit Trading"Channel
*Scam Free Trading Channel* |
Jaina Proudmoar
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Posted - 2009.07.26 17:40:00 -
[30]
Originally by: W3370Pi4
Im all for this but not a t2 orca
Who cares what hull it is as long as the training requirements are sane?
Originally by: W3370Pi4
the freighter & transport skill at level 4 must be a requirement
Freighter, yes. Why transport?
Originally by: W3370Pi4
and the new skill to fly the ship must be a rank 14 skill
Because? ...
Originally by: W3370Pi4
and cost at least 300M
To serve what purpose?
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AltBier
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Posted - 2009.07.28 12:09:00 -
[31]
Quote:
The only honor in PVP is that which you bring with you.
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Slave 2739FKZ
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Posted - 2009.07.28 12:33:00 -
[32]
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Tray LiSans
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Posted - 2009.07.28 12:59:00 -
[33]
Honestly, I would rather just see a freighter given some sort of option to reconfigure its cargohold into a hangar. When you use it to transport goods, you cannot access the hangar; when you use it to transport ships you cannot access the regular cargo hold.
This would save the devs from having to design a completely new ship or even code in a new one, and would also prevent from adding to the propagation of more skills that have to be introduced each time a new ship is designed.
Other than that, I'd support the idea.
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Another Forum'Alt
Center for Advanced Studies
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Posted - 2009.07.28 13:07:00 -
[34]
BECAUSE OF FALCON.
Guide to forum posting |
Jaina Proudmoar
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Posted - 2009.07.29 09:38:00 -
[35]
Originally by: Tray LiSans
Honestly, I would rather just see a freighter given some sort of option to reconfigure its cargohold into a hangar. When you use it to transport goods, you cannot access the hangar; when you use it to transport ships you cannot access the regular cargo hold.
This would save the devs from having to design a completely new ship or even code in a new one, and would also prevent from adding to the propagation of more skills that have to be introduced each time a new ship is designed.
Other than that, I'd support the idea.
Just having them reuse the freighter model again would mean that this could be done very easily. I'm not sure about a freighter being able to be both an awesome item carrier as well as awesome ship carrier due to their already low cost and high utility.
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Venkul Mul
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Posted - 2009.07.29 10:34:00 -
[36]
A simple freighter with a ship hangar instead of a cargohold would fit the bill.
No new skill, simply a second ship in the same class.
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Tray LiSans
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Posted - 2009.07.29 11:06:00 -
[37]
Originally by: Jaina Proudmoar
Just having them reuse the freighter model again would mean that this could be done very easily. I'm not sure about a freighter being able to be both an awesome item carrier as well as awesome ship carrier due to their already low cost and high utility.
The most likely course they would take is just like you and Vankul suggest, a new ship of the same model and skills with a ship hangar instead of a cargo hold. Really though, I don't think that allowing a single freighter to configure between one or the other would be too much. It could either haul goods, or it could haul ships, but the two would be mutually exclusive on any given trip. Of course this would still require extra coding for a new game mechanism, so it would be much faster and easier to make a new freighter with a large ship maintenance bay.
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Venkul Mul
Gallente
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Posted - 2009.07.29 12:01:00 -
[38]
Originally by: Tray LiSans
Vankul
Venkul please  .
I prefer a new ship simply because it will add a new item to build and give something extra for the market.
Naturally it would use the same kind of components of a regular freighter but in different numbers.
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Lumy
Minmatar
Sebiestor tribe
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Posted - 2009.07.29 12:18:00 -
[39]
Originally by: CCP Chronotis
One common idea is to allow freighters to use a special configuration rig which will reduce their cargobay capacity but add a reasonable ship maintenance bay which is big enough for battleships and have some checks to ensure the ship is empty before allowing a configuration change. This kind of approach is something we have thought about and will explore further in the future.
Source
I like the rig idea. It could possibly work on both Freighter and Jump freighter. Also it saves art department lot of work on new model/textures.
Joomla! in EVE - IGB compatible CMS. |
Lee Dalton
Noir.
Noir. Mercenary Group
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Posted - 2009.07.30 06:38:00 -
[40]
Originally by: Venkul Mul
A simple freighter with a ship hangar instead of a cargohold would fit the bill.
No new skill, simply a second ship in the same class.
Simple and perfect.
***
You're only as good as your last fight. |
Sans Honore
Wirfadam Productions LTD
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Posted - 2009.07.30 13:54:00 -
[41]
Originally by: Venkul Mul
A simple freighter with a ship hangar instead of a cargohold would fit the bill.
No new skill, simply a second ship in the same class.
Excellent suggestion.
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Jaina Proudmoar
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Posted - 2009.08.06 16:55:00 -
[42]
Bump.
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CommanderData211
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Posted - 2009.08.07 06:45:00 -
[43]
Totally agree with partition existing freighter holds to accommodate a ship hangar. It would be great to be able to select the conversion rate between cargo and hangar space but a fixed amount would be cool too.
Also support a completely separate ship to haul rigged ships with.
Would be nice to be able to transport 5 rigged battleships. 10 would be even better!
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Alexander Knott
Ars ex Discordia
GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2009.08.07 14:37:00 -
[44]
Couldn't we just make a set of containers that provide ship hangar space? Like a freight container that provides 10x the m3 in SMA space that you can't modify in space. While we're doing this, I would also like auditlog station containers with the same thing so that we can organize our corp hangars.
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Syaran
IMPERIAL SENATE
Cool Kids Club
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Posted - 2009.08.07 14:53:00 -
[45]
Regardless of how it is implemented, as long as it's not some orca variation I agree.
Why a hauling career character has to grab mining skills to get into an Orca is beyond me. The only people who say it is fine are the people using the Orca anyhow for mining, who do hauling on the side.
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Jaina Proudmoar
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Posted - 2009.08.10 03:58:00 -
[46]
Bump.
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Jaina Proudmoar
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Posted - 2009.08.13 09:13:00 -
[47]
*
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Caldreis
Caldari
White Star II
Ethereal Advancement Coalition
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Posted - 2009.08.13 19:34:00 -
[48]
Originally by: Syaran
Regardless of how it is implemented, as long as it's not some orca variation I agree.
Why a hauling career character has to grab mining skills to get into an Orca is beyond me. The only people who say it is fine are the people using the Orca anyhow for mining, who do hauling on the side.
Erm Orca is intend to be a mini-freighter to bridge the gap between freighter and industrial. As for mining skill just training mining barge as it is "frigate/cruiser" equal to racial capital ship for the 4 empires.
I already have a simpler idea and it even have less programming overhead as you only adjust one number in the database. I would like at least to avoid all possibility of introducing new bugs or even "features".
Orca's expand to sub-rorqual capability only one battleship can fit.
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Caldreis
Caldari
White Star II
Ethereal Advancement Coalition
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Posted - 2009.08.13 19:37:00 -
[49]
Another reason is from the dev blog "My rifter is equipped with the following rigs". CCP is looking at different methods.
Originally by: Dev blog My rifter is equipped with the following
4. Transport of Rigged Ships
This is something that can be a pain for many of you. There are ways around it such as using courier missions if the ship is small enough with a freighter or an Orca's ship maintenance bay for smaller ships. We will be looking into numerous ways to help alleviate the issue of transporting rigged ships.
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Jaina Proudmoar
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Posted - 2009.08.14 18:10:00 -
[50]
Do not want more Orcas, or variants of orcas.
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Caldreis
Caldari
White Star II
Ethereal Advancement Coalition
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Posted - 2009.08.14 19:57:00 -
[51]
Originally by: Jaina Proudmoar
Do not want more Orcas, or variants of orcas.
Didn't you read? Either rig/module or adjust not a necessary a secondary or even variant version of orca. While I do detest the 3x number of rig bpo, I do see why you would hate to have another orca version. Beside This dev blog is at least July 06, 2009 which is a good 6 week of development time assuming that they begin it way back then.
It is often not very productive to switch development time right in the middle of the process to just trash it all and start something else. Which is why I suggest ADJUSTING only the ship maintenance bay to 600,000 m3 which is a static database entry which has the advantage of less programming overhead.
But given sisi lack of any changes to orca beyond Ore hangar, I would have strong reasons to be wary of the change they plan for this. Why you ask? The more feature/programming something take often beget even more bugs/"features". No offensive meant to CCP programmers.
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Jaina Proudmoar
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Posted - 2009.08.20 04:47:00 -
[52]
o/
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