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Hathrul
DEEP-SPACE CO-OP LTD
Exhale.
90
   |
Posted - 2012.05.26 00:38:00 -
[31] - Quote
Asayanami Dei wrote:W-space is like fight club. We punch you in the face in hope you will punch back, but when you need help to kick someone else in the balls, we're there for you.
As a diplo i must say, it's not uncommon among wh dwellers to ask for help and recieve it from their 'enemies' they shoot and smack every other day of the week. It's all for good fun and well being of the wh pvp community, which IMO is one of the best in eve.
We dont care much for politics (at least adhocracy doesn't), all we care about is having friends we can shoot when we can/want and be able to team up with them a day after to fight off somebody else.
As long as you play along, fight when there's a fight to be had, keep it civil, you'll do great here.
basically this. if help is asked there is a fair chance you can get it from the others. but permanent blues just make for less people to shoot. alliances form and fall every day, thats how it should be. dont blue, just, if you give your word, keep it |
Ayeson
Hard Knocks Inc.
36
|
Posted - 2012.05.26 05:27:00 -
[32] - Quote
Cybus Max wrote:i didn't say anything about lying about being trapped out :P
It was pretty hilarious and when we found your hole and saw the fleet and you told us to come at you bro...i couldn't help myself
Cybus Max wrote:our 'scout' missed your entire fleet
Location Location Location :)
Ask me about Rengas-dar, HRDKX's Most recent, groundbreaking, game-changing, wormhole-collapsing research endeavour. |
Alyna Stormwind
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2012.05.26 06:28:00 -
[33] - Quote
wormholes are one of the best place to hide if you're a carebear. Nothing more nothing less. |
Bernie Nator
Talocan Hive
Talocan United
281
|
Posted - 2012.05.26 06:41:00 -
[34] - Quote
I love bears. I love the sound their pod makes as it autoejects from the ship upon seeing my tornado. |
Nathan Jameson
Talocan Dominion
Talocan United
398
|
Posted - 2012.05.26 07:28:00 -
[35] - Quote
Having blues in different systems doesn't do much for wormhole dwellers, as you're so disconnected. Believe me, we know this first hand from being in an old wormhole "coalition" that failed. And that's assuming they bother to come out to help at all.
As has been said, making potent friends matters a lot more in the long run, and you do this by interacting with us. With guns. Doesn't even matter if you win or lose; the goal is mutual respect and comraderie.
That way, when you do finally get sieged and need help, we'll remember you as "oh yeah those guys who XYZ" instead of just "those guys who blueball us every time." |
MadbaM
Hard Knocks Inc.
2
|
Posted - 2012.05.26 08:25:00 -
[36] - Quote
Kalel Nimrott wrote:I wanna FAP. Where do I sign?
It's not something you can sign up to, its a special type of hand shake. |
Talonaer
The Kairos Syndicate
Transmission Lost
0
|
Posted - 2012.05.26 09:49:00 -
[37] - Quote
Blues in WH Space is bad mkay? unless its temporary for big ops/people that fly together alot. Otherwise just = less targets = unhappy me.
Most of the big WH alliances have good banter with each other and still blow each other up daily. No butt hurt here.
|
Klokvarg
Adhocracy Incorporated
Adhocracy
3
|
Posted - 2012.05.26 18:18:00 -
[38] - Quote
Talonaer wrote:Most of the big WH alliances have good banter with each other and still blow each other up daily. No butt hurt here.
It's how we express our affection for each-other, just like in grade school when you shoved the cute girl you liked! |
Jack Miton
Bite Me inc
Exhale.
272
|
Posted - 2012.05.26 21:28:00 -
[39] - Quote
Having blues in WHs, apart from temp blues for big ops, is almost universally a bad thing. |
Archdaimon
NorCorp Enterprise
No Holes Barred
57
|
Posted - 2012.05.26 22:13:00 -
[40] - Quote
FAP it is. |
Cybus Max
Bite Me inc
Exhale.
3
|
Posted - 2012.05.26 22:34:00 -
[41] - Quote
having perma blues in w-space tends to end up with someone else in w-space invading you |
Komen
Capital Enrichment Services
The Night Crew Alliance
82
|
Posted - 2012.05.27 01:44:00 -
[42] - Quote
We were blue to one corp. Then we went and allied with them. Our policy is NBSI, but we will never lie to get a kill. No 'yes I'll help you find a way out' only to get them into a trap.
|
Kalel Nimrott
Wishful Desires Inc.
Armada Assail
9
|
Posted - 2012.05.27 05:36:00 -
[43] - Quote
I'm starting to believe that everyome that says that they are NBSI, but will help you out in need if you ask, are only laying a meta trap... |
Nathan Jameson
Talocan Dominion
Talocan United
398
|
Posted - 2012.05.27 05:43:00 -
[44] - Quote
Kalel Nimrott wrote:I'm starting to believe that everyome that says that they are NBSI, but will help you out in need if you ask, are only laying a meta trap...
Does this cunning plan also involve apathy and sloth? If so, it's ******* brilliant. |
Hathrul
DEEP-SPACE CO-OP LTD
Exhale.
90
|
Posted - 2012.05.27 10:51:00 -
[45] - Quote
Kalel Nimrott wrote:I'm starting to believe that everyome that says that they are NBSI, but will help you out in need if you ask, are only laying a meta trap...
i think if one alliance would break its word time and time again they'd pretty soon face half the wh alliances on the base of "wh etiquette" (i hate that word) |
Cybus Max
Bite Me inc
Exhale.
3
|
Posted - 2012.05.27 10:58:00 -
[46] - Quote
Hathrul wrote:Kalel Nimrott wrote:I'm starting to believe that everyome that says that they are NBSI, but will help you out in need if you ask, are only laying a meta trap... i think if one alliance would break its word time and time again they'd pretty soon face half the wh alliances on the base of "wh etiquette" (i hate that word)
This has happened already.... Firebirds broke a ransom deal with aharm, and aharm evicted them..... twice.... |
Ikeo58
Vermis foramen Industrius
Union 0f Revolution
5
|
Posted - 2012.05.28 10:01:00 -
[47] - Quote
I suppose its like the unwritten law. Breaking a ransom as a pirate leads to your demise and tarnishes your name & back stab people in a WH and you will get evicted.
I always honor requests for an escape route but if they are doing sites I make them eject sleeper loot first  |
Nathan Jameson
Talocan Dominion
Talocan United
398
|
Posted - 2012.05.28 14:43:00 -
[48] - Quote
I do not ask for a ransom unless I intend to honor it. If I want the killmail, I'll just shoot them. |
Gibbo3771
AQUILA INC
Verge of Collapse
104
|
Posted - 2012.05.28 16:29:00 -
[49] - Quote
Bane Nucleus wrote:Talking in local is either a noob move from people who don't know better, or it's one of the Aquila guys (coughcoughMesscoughcough) 
You just lost the privilege of "gf" in local bro
Everytime you dont like my comments/posts the terrorists win and your a disgrace to your country. |
Cybus Max
Bite Me inc
Exhale.
3
|
Posted - 2012.05.28 21:25:00 -
[50] - Quote
Bane Nucleus wrote:Talking in local is either a noob move from people who don't know better, or it's one of the Aquila guys (coughcoughMesscoughcough)
For a diplo that wasn't very diplomatic :P |
Bernie Nator
Talocan Hive
Talocan United
281
|
Posted - 2012.05.28 22:17:00 -
[51] - Quote
Cybus Max wrote:Bane Nucleus wrote:Talking in local is either a noob move from people who don't know better, or it's one of the Aquila guys (coughcoughMesscoughcough) For a diplo that wasn't very diplomatic :P
Ooo is that similar to me being diplo? |
Trinkets friend
Sudden Buggery
Dead On Arrival Alliance
345
|
Posted - 2012.05.29 01:54:00 -
[52] - Quote
We have perma-blues. They are the Batphone, usually they are smaller corps we regularly work with, in and out of w-space. Often the batphone goes unanswered. We also have guys on our batphone who aren't blues, because who doesn't want an invite to shoot quality targets?
Sometimes (as per this last weekend) the batphone doesn't always Work As Intended. But stay tuned, we don't work up a lather of POCOs for nothing.
The old Wormhole Coalition, of which Nate speaks, was a Bad Idea. There's a difference between NAPs, FAPs and mutual defence pacts. Mutual defence pacts between different corps and alliances in disparate wormholes is a bad idea when you are, viz. CHAIN, Eve Dragons, etc. People can figure the relationship out and troll you. Hard.
Admitting you are in such a thing...well, let me scribble something in my Little Black Book.
The skilful employer of men will employ the wise man, the brave man, the covetous man, and the stupid man.
Sun Tzu
localectomy.blogspot.com.au
|
Jack Miton
Bite Me inc
Exhale.
277
|
Posted - 2012.05.29 02:31:00 -
[53] - Quote
Trinkets friend wrote:We also have guys on our batphone who aren't blues, because who doesn't want an invite to shoot quality targets?
tbh, i hate the batphone craze that has take over WH pvp.
generally all it does is lead to blobs and people pulling out of fights.
for example, Exhale recently attacked a TLC occupied system.
TLC had a roughly equal sized fleet with a half dozen caps for support but instead they batphoned 4 other large WH groups to bail them out, at least 2 of which are a match for exhale or their own.
in the end it didnt work out for them anyway but that kind of 'omg come save us and get free kills!!!' mentality belongs in nullsec, not WHs.
yeah there are times it is warranted but doing it every time youre on the seemingly losing side of a fight gets lame real fast.
TLC specifically are notorious for threatening to bring in AHARM when they get attacked... |
Nathan Jameson
Talocan Dominion
Talocan United
401
|
Posted - 2012.05.29 04:35:00 -
[54] - Quote
Jack Miton wrote:tbh, i hate the batphone craze that has take over WH pvp.
generally all it does is lead to blobs and people pulling out of fights.
+1
The secret to gaining both good fights and good respect in wormholes is knowing how to call only just enough people to get the job done.
It's a careful balance. Too few people and your guys lose morale getting repeatedly face-stomped, and your enemies start seeing you as an easy target.
Too many and your blues get resentful for getting called out of their home wormholes, having to wait for wormholes to cycle to get their full fleet in, and finally arriving at a fight that didn't ultimately happen. Not only will you lose "street cred" for bringing a blob you didn't need to, but your blues might decide not to show up next time.
So far, my rule of thumb has been "opposing force +1." I.e. estimate what size of fleet the enemy will bring, then match it and add one more friendly entity. If they have two competent corps, you bring three. |
Bernie Nator
Talocan Hive
Talocan United
282
|
Posted - 2012.05.29 04:57:00 -
[55] - Quote
Nathan Jameson wrote:Jack Miton wrote:tbh, i hate the batphone craze that has take over WH pvp.
generally all it does is lead to blobs and people pulling out of fights. +1 The secret to gaining both good fights and good respect in wormholes is knowing how to call only just enough people to get the job done. It's a careful balance. Too few people and your guys lose morale getting repeatedly face-stomped, and your enemies start seeing you as an easy target. Too many and your blues get resentful for getting called out of their home wormholes, having to wait for wormholes to cycle to get their full fleet in, and finally arriving at a fight that didn't ultimately happen. Not only will you lose "street cred" for bringing a blob you didn't need to, but your blues might decide not to show up next time. So far, my rule of thumb has been "opposing force +1." I.e. estimate what size of fleet the enemy will bring, then match it and add one more friendly entity. If they have two competent corps, you bring three.
I'm pretty inclined to agree with this. No need to bring a S&W 500 when a model 686 will do. If you want good fights, see what they've got, and bring what you figure can beat it with some forces in reserve. |
Durzel
The Xenodus Initiative.
13
|
Posted - 2012.05.29 08:01:00 -
[56] - Quote
Jack Miton wrote:tbh, i hate the batphone craze that has take over WH pvp.
generally all it does is lead to blobs and people pulling out of fights.
for example, Exhale recently attacked a TLC occupied system.
TLC had a roughly equal sized fleet with a half dozen caps for support but instead they batphoned 4 other large WH groups to bail them out, at least 2 of which are a match for exhale or their own.
in the end it didnt work out for them anyway but that kind of 'omg come save us and get free kills!!!' mentality belongs in nullsec, not WHs.
yeah there are times it is warranted but doing it every time youre on the seemingly losing side of a fight gets lame real fast.
TLC specifically are notorious for threatening to bring in AHARM when they get attacked...
So how did Starbridge end up getting involved too then? Batphoned by you? Blue? |
Trinkets friend
Sudden Buggery
Dead On Arrival Alliance
346
|
Posted - 2012.05.29 08:49:00 -
[57] - Quote
Jack Miton wrote:Trinkets friend wrote:We also have guys on our batphone who aren't blues, because who doesn't want an invite to shoot quality targets? tbh, i hate the batphone craze that has take over WH pvp. werds.
I totally agree. Let me describe this last weekend's op in bullet points.
- we find C2 with 6 corps in it
- clearly something homo is going on between these corps. To Maldoror it "who are their backers?"
- Cue a craptonne of structure grind and camping to draw out a fight.
- Oh, hey, its Sleeper Social Club / Kill It With Fire / Red Circle / others with 30-40 T3's and assorted sauce, vs DOA's 15 T2's/BS/nubs.
- Touche, gentlemen.
- No goodfites, just a mostly successful withdrawal in the face of overwhelming firepower -/- a poor escapecage with orca.
Le shrug. It happens. Our batphone was busy, other people got octopused into the Great All Inclusive Hisec Gay Pride Parade AKA Wardec, and so we couldn't rock-paper-scissors SSC and friends. It was wasted effort, but you can't win them all.
I would have enjoyed a fight, if they'd brought something we could have had a chance against. Perhaps they'd have got more kills if they weren't as subtle as a fat girl in a miniskirt. No doubt they enjoyed camping our alt-corp siege POS these past few days, but we got 50 toons out safely.
Other times, we haven't. But you can't avoid the social engineering, and sometimes you can't predict who is on the batphone, if anyone. Sometimes your batphone doesn't get picked up. You have to deal with it versus ostrich-neck the whole thing and grumble about how everyone should be purists and stand on their own two feet as a corp/alliance and just roll with being donut-punched all the time.
Not that you have much to worry about, Jack, as long as your hexa-boxing C5 ratting goes smoothly and Exhale. stays near the top, it will remain an annoyance for good fights and something you'd prefer not to use yourself - and often probably can avoid using.
The skilful employer of men will employ the wise man, the brave man, the covetous man, and the stupid man.
Sun Tzu
localectomy.blogspot.com.au
|
Joran Jackson
The Red Circle Inc.
20
|
Posted - 2012.05.29 09:08:00 -
[58] - Quote
I don't know how brilliant you are, but I will spell it out for you, that's the Eve University training w-system. Don't **** with them, they're providing a public service.
You want goodfights with any of those corps, come at us bro, I think I can safely speak for everyone when I say we love people to bring the fight.
But what you tried to do was bully a bunch of kids with lollipops (and if you think structure grinding is gf then I am :( ). |
Laurra Dakan
The Red Circle Inc.
0
|
Posted - 2012.05.29 10:24:00 -
[59] - Quote
30-40 t3s and other stuff, umm not really we had like 30 guys total and not all in t3s, http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=13493239. Could we have brought more sure i dont think even half of each corp showed up. You say you had a 15 man noob fleet but got 50 toons out things dont quite add up. Also whats up with a private public chat.
edit: technically its not a uni WH but open to Uni members |
Jack Miton
Bite Me inc
Exhale.
281
|
Posted - 2012.05.29 11:35:00 -
[60] - Quote
Durzel wrote:So how did Starbridge end up getting involved too then? Batphoned by you? Blue?
edit: Turns out loads of other corps were involved on the enemy side
starbridge lent us the use of their C6 so we could chain collapse for a specific C6 (since we have a C5 static).
they were always part of our fleet and were in no way batphoned. |
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