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Azears Caldari Perkone	Posted - 2009.08.03 22:56:00 - [1] Why CCP decides 2 make cruise missiles and torpedos EXTREMELY crapy? I wanna c the reasoning behind it. feeling sad about being a Caldari player
Lance Fighter Amarr	Posted - 2009.08.03 23:01:00 - [2] Minor question. Have you ever had a bs vs bs 1v1, with either side being a torp-raven? Originally by: Akita T Seriously ? ...wow... I'm such a forum ho' !
Slave 2739FKZ	Posted - 2009.08.03 23:06:00 - [3] Your skills suck, as well as your support (webs, TP, etc.). Missiles with a little of support are the best weapons if we are talking about non-fleet warfare: heavy hitting and good range. Missiles are fine (except soem stuff like rockets etc.).
Aranis Nax	Posted - 2009.08.03 23:09:00 - [4] frigate missiles are a joke, especially rockets. Cruise missiles are decent(maybe a little low on dps) but don't you dare complain about torps. Torps are VERY PAINFULL against intended targets (aka battleships)
4THELULZ	Posted - 2009.08.03 23:58:00 - [5] Edited by: 4THELULZ on 03/08/2009 23:58:31 Torps are great, cruises just have trouble with flight time on long distances. So yeah either your skills, knowledge or both are poor Edit: Oh yeah and rockets are epic fail.
arbiter reformed Minmatar Annihilate. Avarice.	Posted - 2009.08.03 23:59:00 - [6] lol Signature graphics that may only contain your character name, corporation logo, corporation or personal slogan or other text that is directly related to your in-game persona, or content directly related to Eve Online. All content must be in good taste.Applebabe
Kismo	Posted - 2009.08.04 00:14:00 - [7] Know what's funny? Minmatar pilots fit missiles on their battleships because they're better than projectiles....
Soporo Caldari	Posted - 2009.08.04 00:22:00 - [8] Cruise missiles and Rockets are a bad and useless pvp joke no matter what your support skills are.
Kismo	Posted - 2009.08.04 00:47:00 - [9] Originally by: Soporo Cruise missiles and Rockets are a bad and useless pvp joke no matter what your support skills are. Not to disagree, but I think cruise missiles are situational: - Expecting to fight small ****. Consider the post here a couple weeks back by the guy that went out with rigor + cruise and solo WTFpwnt OMS for a couple hours - When you're in a RR Phoon - A cruise phoon outdamages an AC Pest at 20km.
FT Diomedes Gallente Factio Paucorum	Posted - 2009.08.04 01:24:00 - [10] Originally by: Kismo Know what's funny? Minmatar pilots fit missiles on their battleships because they're better than projectiles.... This. ...this doesn't even seem to be a regular case of rats fleeing the sinking ship. Seems more like the rats are on fire, the ship is on fire, and the sea is full of drunk Russians. - Jacob Etienne
Markesian	Posted - 2009.08.04 01:29:00 - [11] Originally by: Azears Why CCP decides 2 make cruise missiles and torpedos EXTREMELY crapy? I wanna c the reasoning behind it. feeling sad about being a Caldari player Because the Gallente and Minmatars were making really really fast ships ofc. I mean come on, thats SO obvious, you'd have to be blind not to see that lolol ...anyone seen my walking stick?
ISK Launderer	Posted - 2009.08.04 01:34:00 - [12] Originally by: Azears Why CCP decides 2 make cruise missiles and torpedos EXTREMELY crapy? I wanna c the reasoning behind it. feeling sad about being a Caldari player BECAUSE MISSLES ARE FAIL FOR PVP. CALDARI IS NOT TO BE USED FOR PVP ONLY FOR RUNNING MISSIONS AND DOING CAREBEAR DANCE. THERE IS NO GOOD MISSLE SHIP FOR PVP.
Arkeladin	Posted - 2009.08.04 01:38:00 - [13] Originally by: ISK Launderer Originally by: Azears Why CCP decides 2 make cruise missiles and torpedos EXTREMELY crapy? I wanna c the reasoning behind it. feeling sad about being a Caldari player BECAUSE MISSLES ARE FAIL FOR PVP. CALDARI IS NOT TO BE USED FOR PVP ONLY FOR RUNNING MISSIONS AND DOING CAREBEAR DANCE. THERE IS NO GOOD MISSLE SHIP FOR PVP. tell that to good HAMDrake pilots and good torpRavens as well. Tool.
Aranis Nax	Posted - 2009.08.04 01:40:00 - [14] Not to mention Cerberus, Nighthawk, Caracal, Sacrilege...
Terianna Eri Amarr Scrutari	Posted - 2009.08.04 02:15:00 - [15] Originally by: Arkeladin Originally by: ISK Launderer Originally by: Azears Why CCP decides 2 make cruise missiles and torpedos EXTREMELY crapy? I wanna c the reasoning behind it. feeling sad about being a Caldari player BECAUSE MISSLES ARE FAIL FOR PVP. CALDARI IS NOT TO BE USED FOR PVP ONLY FOR RUNNING MISSIONS AND DOING CAREBEAR DANCE. THERE IS NO GOOD MISSLE SHIP FOR PVP. tell that to good HAMDrake pilots and good torpRavens as well. Tool. I think maybe you got sarcasm trolled but I'm not sure...? __________________________________ Originally by: CCP Whisper Boo hoo. Cry some more.
Kismo	Posted - 2009.08.04 02:19:00 - [16] Originally by: Terianna Eri I think maybe you got sarcasm trolled but I'm not sure...? Nooo, sarcasm on my Eve-O?!
TZeer BURN EDEN	Posted - 2009.08.04 05:43:00 - [17] Cruisemissiles are a joke. I did extensive testing on the testserver before CCP put it on TQ. And most of the changes to missiles was done not because of game balance, but because of very high pitched whining from the nano people. Did testing together with a skilled mega pilot with rails and we both where shooting a cruiser. My max skilled + 3 missile implants was unable to break the cruisers tank. While the mega was breaking the tank with ease, he didnt even have to use all his guns. The only place where he started to have troubles was when the cruiser was so close that you could easily disrupt it`s flight path and put a web on it or simply neut it. Even before the missile changes I was on the testserver to see if the whining from people was justified. We all remember the prediction about the drake becoming the weapon of mass destruction. Well, I fitted an alt up in an inty and got a high skilled drake to try kill me. Yes he also used rigs. And guess what? He couldnt kill me no matter how much he tried. And I just kept him scrambled. But yeah, missiles where overpowered... Cruise missiles don't even do full damage on a moving battleship.
Sidus Isaacs Gallente	Posted - 2009.08.04 07:06:00 - [18] Cruise missiles are not that good. Only real use now a days are PvE. Trops smash BSs like no tomorrow. HM/HAM are good enough. Lights, meh works on crow, or on an AML cara Rockets = fail. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- http://desusig.crumplecorn.com/sigs.html
Lilith Velkor Minmatar Beyond Divinity Inc	Posted - 2009.08.04 07:36:00 - [19] Edited by: Lilith Velkor on 04/08/2009 07:40:56 Confirming missiles are crap, look at the torp-phoon for examp... oh wait. Well, at least the Tempest with its double-bonused turrets has a slight bit more dps from guns than unbonused missiles. Can we get some extra missile slots on the Maelstrom please?
lucifers widow	Posted - 2009.08.04 08:32:00 - [20] Originally by: TZeer Cruise missiles don't even do full damage on a moving battleship. Neither do turrets, what's you're point ?
Jaskey Amarr 0beron Construct Shadow Empire.	Posted - 2009.08.04 08:39:00 - [21] Originally by: Arkeladin tell that to good HAMDrake pilots and good torpRavens as well. Tool. Think it should be stressed the GOOD part, BS pilots using turrets need millions of sp in gunnery, over 5 mil imo to be decent where in the past a missle spammer could easily get away less than 1 mil and be effective. Seems most of the problems could be solved or mitigated by proper skilling
TZeer BURN EDEN	Posted - 2009.08.04 08:40:00 - [22] Originally by: lucifers widow Originally by: TZeer Cruise missiles don't even do full damage on a moving battleship. Neither do turrets, what's you're point ? That depends on range and tracking.
lucifers widow	Posted - 2009.08.04 09:10:00 - [23] A turret would not do max damage unless both ships were stationary and right in the optimal which never happens, hell against structures we not always get perfect strikes even then. Originally by: TZeer We all remember the prediction about the drake becoming the weapon of mass destruction. Well, I fitted an alt up in an inty and got a high skilled drake to try kill me. Yes he also used rigs. And guess what? He couldnt kill me no matter how much he tried. And I just kept him scrambled. You should of neuted scrammed and webbed him then set warriors on his ass, been a dead inty then. Fact is inty is not supposed to get hit by the larger weapons systems unless he really screws up so can't see the imbalance. Did you do the same against a heavy pulse harb or a similar turret bc ? I doubt the results would of been much diferent in fact they weren't when we tried it.
fuxinos Caldari Guys 0f Sarcasm	Posted - 2009.08.04 10:02:00 - [24] Originally by: lucifers widow A turret would not do max damage unless both ships were stationary and right in the optimal which never happens, hell against structures we not always get perfect strikes even then. Originally by: TZeer We all remember the prediction about the drake becoming the weapon of mass destruction. Well, I fitted an alt up in an inty and got a high skilled drake to try kill me. Yes he also used rigs. And guess what? He couldnt kill me no matter how much he tried. And I just kept him scrambled. You should of neuted scrammed and webbed him then set warriors on his ass, been a dead inty then. Fact is inty is not supposed to get hit by the larger weapons systems unless he really screws up so can't see the imbalance. Did you do the same against a heavy pulse harb or a similar turret bc ? I doubt the results would of been much diferent in fact they weren't when we tried it. But turrets could kill the inty if he screws up, missiles cant.
Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2009.08.04 10:38:00 - [25] Originally by: TZeer We all remember the prediction about the drake becoming the weapon of mass destruction. Well, I fitted an alt up in an inty and got a high skilled drake to try kill me. Yes he also used rigs. And guess what? He couldnt kill me no matter how much he tried. And I just kept him scrambled. Cruise missiles don't even do full damage on a moving battleship. Both of these statements are wrong.
Ladett	Posted - 2009.08.04 10:45:00 - [26] Originally by: 4THELULZ Edited by: 4THELULZ on 03/08/2009 23:58:31 Torps are great, cruises just have trouble with flight time on long distances. So yeah either your skills, knowledge or both are poor Edit: Oh yeah and rockets are epic fail. Hmmm.... 257km with cruise missiles in my raven thank you very much,
Bibbleibble	Posted - 2009.08.04 10:57:00 - [27] Originally by: Ladett Originally by: 4THELULZ Edited by: 4THELULZ on 03/08/2009 23:58:31 Torps are great, cruises just have trouble with flight time on long distances. So yeah either your skills, knowledge or both are poor Edit: Oh yeah and rockets are epic fail. Hmmm.... 257km with cruise missiles in my raven thank you very much, The range itself isn't bad. It's the 20+ second wait before the missiles hit that makes them bad. ________________________________________________ For changes to Minmatar Battleships click here (Now with added summary!)
Omar Khayyam Minmatar	Posted - 2009.08.04 11:15:00 - [28] * 'tries' to shoot himself with his artillery cannon.. * ------------------------------------------------ cruisers used to be a great power when i started this game :)
Benco97 Gallente	Posted - 2009.08.04 11:16:00 - [29] You guys think cruise missiles are bad? Cruise missiles are fine. You want to hear a joke? Large Artillery. Originally by: P'uck You're a DUMBASS - bold italic underline at the VERY LEAST.
Dr Fighter	Posted - 2009.08.04 11:37:00 - [30] Originally by: Benco97 You guys think cruise missiles are bad? Cruise missiles are fine. You want to hear a joke? Large Artillery. I get it, but its not funny
Foxyer	Posted - 2009.08.04 11:55:00 - [31] Hey guys. We all forgot something! FOF missiles. Oh wait... Their failure goes without saying...
TZeer BURN EDEN	Posted - 2009.08.04 13:31:00 - [32] Originally by: lucifers widow A turret would not do max damage unless both ships were stationary and right in the optimal which never happens, hell against structures we not always get perfect strikes even then. Originally by: TZeer We all remember the prediction about the drake becoming the weapon of mass destruction. Well, I fitted an alt up in an inty and got a high skilled drake to try kill me. Yes he also used rigs. And guess what? He couldnt kill me no matter how much he tried. And I just kept him scrambled. You should of neuted scrammed and webbed him then set warriors on his ass, been a dead inty then. Fact is inty is not supposed to get hit by the larger weapons systems unless he really screws up so can't see the imbalance. Did you do the same against a heavy pulse harb or a similar turret bc ? I doubt the results would of been much diferent in fact they weren't when we tried it. Sorry, I should have been more specific. Warp DISRUPTED him. Not scrammed. Out of both neut and web range.
Kismo	Posted - 2009.08.04 14:08:00 - [33] Originally by: TZeer My max skilled + 3 missile implants was unable to break the cruisers tank. While the mega was breaking the tank with ease, he didnt even have to use all his guns. Dude, I don't know what you're on about, but it's eminently possible to WTFPWN any cruiser you care to name in a cruise Raven - even in their "nerfed" status. Quote: Even before the missile changes I was on the testserver to see if the whining from people was justified. And they were. Ravens were WTF powerful, destroying frigs, AFs, Inties, HACs, Cruisers, anything really. My 10M SP missile pilot felt like cheating it was so powerful at the time. Not that I would expect Burn Eden to have a realistic recollection of the nerf of their favorite ship. HM Drakes were ridiculous too - and so were HAM drakes. So he couldn't break your passive tanked $ship? The Drake's never been known for WTF damage - just a great combination of damage and tank. Really Tzeer, why didn't you try something even marginally realistic. What, are you gonna be arguing that the Tempest is fine because of all your sisi experience with it next? Quote: Cruise missiles don't even do full damage on a moving battleship. Um, yes... yes they do.
Seishi Maru The Black Dawn Gang	Posted - 2009.08.04 15:20:00 - [34] BEfore the missile nerf and after the nano nerf. Missiles were WAY ovepowered WAY WAY over. A raven could insta pop any frigate hull with MWD or AB. And 3-4 volley cruisers. You always took 100% of the damage.Speed tank had ZERO value. The changed helped bring them in line. SOme categories need more adjustments but in general they are not bad. Simple proof is what peopel said. Take a look at typhoons. 8/10 will have 4 torps and rest utilities... 1/10 will ahve 4 torps 4 AC... 1/10 will have AC and no torps.... Simple statement of how torpedoes are far superior to projectiles.
Christina Bamar Agony Unleashed Agony Empire	Posted - 2009.08.04 17:38:00 - [35] Originally by: TZeer Originally by: lucifers widow A turret would not do max damage unless both ships were stationary and right in the optimal which never happens, hell against structures we not always get perfect strikes even then. Originally by: TZeer We all remember the prediction about the drake becoming the weapon of mass destruction. Well, I fitted an alt up in an inty and got a high skilled drake to try kill me. Yes he also used rigs. And guess what? He couldnt kill me no matter how much he tried. And I just kept him scrambled. You should of neuted scrammed and webbed him then set warriors on his ass, been a dead inty then. Fact is inty is not supposed to get hit by the larger weapons systems unless he really screws up so can't see the imbalance. Did you do the same against a heavy pulse harb or a similar turret bc ? I doubt the results would of been much diferent in fact they weren't when we tried it. Sorry, I should have been more specific. Warp DISRUPTED him. Not scrammed. Out of both neut and web range. So what you're saying is that interceptors make good tacklers? What does this have to do with missiles exactly? CEO, Agony Unleashed
AstroPhobic Divine Retribution	Posted - 2009.08.04 17:45:00 - [36] Edited by: AstroPhobic on 04/08/2009 17:45:29 Originally by: Seishi Maru Simple proof is what peopel said. Take a look at typhoons. 8/10 will have 4 torps and rest utilities... 1/10 will have 4 torps 4 AC... 1/10 will have ~~AC and no torps~~ cruise missiles and RR.... Simple statement of how torpedoes are far superior to projectiles. Typhoon without missiles is like a domi without drones.
Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2009.08.04 17:47:00 - [37] He's spouting nonsense anyway. A typical interceptor will only be able to tackle a bog-standard HM Drake for about two minutes before it runs out of HP. That's before counting drones.
Capt Oconell	Posted - 2009.08.04 18:10:00 - [38] Originally by: ISK Launderer Originally by: Azears Why CCP decides 2 make cruise missiles and torpedos EXTREMELY crapy? I wanna c the reasoning behind it. feeling sad about being a Caldari player BECAUSE MISSLES ARE FAIL FOR PVP. CALDARI IS NOT TO BE USED FOR PVP ONLY FOR RUNNING MISSIONS AND DOING CAREBEAR DANCE. THERE IS NO GOOD MISSLE SHIP FOR PVP. THANK YOU, couldnt state it better. To add on to that - YES, Minamatar projectile suck a juicy one but at least they have spare high slots which they can use to fit missiles, or even better neuts. So essentialy minmatar killing power comes in two forms, doing the damge and at the same time sucking blood out of your opponent. Missiles on the other hand...well...the torps and heavy assault missiles are decent but when it comes to tracking things that run circles around you, they fail miserably. Where a gallenta BS will be able to track something with its gun, the caldari counterpart wont be able to track the same thing as efficiently with its missiles wether they are torps or cruise.
Merbusent	Posted - 2009.08.04 18:14:00 - [39] Missles are a whole point of afterburners
Bugszor Caldari PodPal	Posted - 2009.08.04 18:19:00 - [40] Edited by: Bugszor on 04/08/2009 18:23:30 Originally by: Foxyer Hey guys. We all forgot something! FOF missiles. Oh wait... Their failure goes without saying... FoF missiles are cool to use when you jump into highsec as a pirate. plate up or put shield extenders. or both on yer raven. (tbh any ship that can use missiles) and fit FoFs. see the concord go pop. its funny as hell >_< ----------------------------------- Originally by: Nex Angelus Perhaps it was a Bugszor
Kismo	Posted - 2009.08.04 18:23:00 - [41] Originally by: Bugszor see the concord go pop. its funny as hell >_< Faction navy, and yes, I've done this to myself more than once.
Bugszor Caldari PodPal	Posted - 2009.08.04 18:24:00 - [42] Aye faction navy. my bad. its still funny! ----------------------------------- Originally by: Nex Angelus Perhaps it was a Bugszor
Kismo	Posted - 2009.08.04 18:34:00 - [43] Originally by: Bugszor Aye faction navy. my bad. its still funny! What's more funny is when people shoot you only to get a face full of FOF. ;-)
Pater Peccavi Minmatar Tribal Liberation Force	Posted - 2009.08.04 18:45:00 - [44] Originally by: Capt Oconell Originally by: ISK Launderer Originally by: Azears Why CCP decides 2 make cruise missiles and torpedos EXTREMELY crapy? I wanna c the reasoning behind it. feeling sad about being a Caldari player BECAUSE MISSLES ARE FAIL FOR PVP. CALDARI IS NOT TO BE USED FOR PVP ONLY FOR RUNNING MISSIONS AND DOING CAREBEAR DANCE. THERE IS NO GOOD MISSLE SHIP FOR PVP. THANK YOU, couldnt state it better. To add on to that - YES, Minamatar projectile suck a juicy one but at least they have spare high slots which they can use to fit missiles, or even better neuts. So essentialy minmatar killing power comes in two forms, doing the damge and at the same time sucking blood out of your opponent. Missiles on the other hand...well...the torps and heavy assault missiles are decent but when it comes to tracking things that run circles around you, they fail miserably. Where a gallenta BS will be able to track something with its gun, the caldari counterpart wont be able to track the same thing as efficiently with its missiles wether they are torps or cruise. I'm pretty sure Launderer was being sarcastic. Also, the raven has just as many utility highs as the Tempest, so you have no argument for Minmatar being better due to "spare high slots." ______ Why has the number of players online dropped from 50k to 25k? BECAUSE OF SWINE FLU
Christina Bamar Agony Unleashed Agony Empire	Posted - 2009.08.04 19:03:00 - [45] Originally by: Gypsio III He's spouting nonsense anyway. A typical interceptor will only be able to tackle a bog-standard HM Drake for about two minutes before it runs out of HP. That's before counting drones. Get better ceptor pilots then A drake poses little to no threat to a properly fitted/flown interceptor, just like any other BC. CEO, Agony Unleashed
Haradgrim Tyrell Corp Fuzzy Nut Attack Squirrels	Posted - 2009.08.04 19:41:00 - [46] Cruise missiles suck, if there were any better, they would be OP for PVE. As it stands they are the suck for anything pvp but taking out Onyxes approaching fleet with extenders fit..... Rockets are a sad joke, standard missiles are awesome (especially in assault launchers), HM/HAMs are well balanced but HMs could use a little boost (but have the same issue as cruise) -- Originally by: CCP Oveur Just donæt forget the reach-around.
Furb Killer Gallente	Posted - 2009.08.04 20:07:00 - [47] Originally by: Christina Bamar Originally by: Gypsio III He's spouting nonsense anyway. A typical interceptor will only be able to tackle a bog-standard HM Drake for about two minutes before it runs out of HP. That's before counting drones. Get better ceptor pilots then A drake poses little to no threat to a properly fitted/flown interceptor, just like any other BC. No threat as in it will never kill the ceptor since the ceptor can just run, true. However (maybe except some active tanked setups) in the end they will have to run from missile + drone damage.
Fuazzole	Posted - 2009.08.04 20:11:00 - [48] A drake takes how long to kill a ceptor? is this with or without Presision Heavy Missle and were are the 5x light drones? also,..100seconds to kill a ceptor is a hell'a lot better then a web/scram/drone less gunship could do it in, which is not at all. But then, missles ships are alound to fit max-slot tanks , no painter, web and/or scram and whine. Other then rockets, missles are fine, what's wrong is the ships, that favour +range bonus rather then +damage leaving the small/medium missle class's lacking on DPS but having out of thier class range which isn't held very highly.
Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2009.08.04 20:30:00 - [49] I made an assumption that the HMs would be able to hit the inty (5625 m/s missiles and 84 km range vs. ~5100 m/s MWD speed on an Ares), which matches my experience. Okay, overheating the MWD gets you ~7300 m/s and HM immunity for about a minute, but after that you're vulnerable again. Defenders will help, especially against grouped missiles, but some will still get through.
Artemis Rose Sileo In Pacis The Space P0lice	Posted - 2009.08.04 20:40:00 - [50] Originally by: Christina Bamar Get better ceptor pilots then A drake poses little to no threat to a properly fitted/flown interceptor, just like any other BC. I've managed to chase off any interceptor on me within 30 seconds, just by using Warrior IIs, and have done even better when I get to score random hits with projectiles. Dealing a constant HML DPS + Drones means that ceptor will not be around long, "properly" fit or not. *** Currently Playing: Trolls from Outer Space Current Equipment: VISAcard chain mail, +2 Amulet of Epic Whine, Self Banstick +2 WTB: +666 E-peen killboard stats
Hairygoagain	Posted - 2009.08.05 01:28:00 - [51] Originally by: Gypsio III I made an assumption that the HMs would be able to hit the inty (5625 m/s missiles and 84 km range vs. ~5100 m/s MWD speed on an Ares), which matches my experience. Okay, overheating the MWD gets you ~7300 m/s and HM immunity for about a minute, but after that you're vulnerable again. Defenders will help, especially against grouped missiles, but some will still get through. Ignoring the overheat, the missiles closing velocity is 525 m/s. Multiply this by the flight time and any inty that starts this far away is immune to the missiles. BIG CLUE, it isn't 84 Km, the 'range' quoted, it's about 15 Km. <= This is why missiles suck. A precision light missiles can't even reach most inties due to the nerfed flight time. Missiles suck far more if you try to use them and know how they work.
Seishi Maru The Black Dawn Gang	Posted - 2009.08.05 02:14:00 - [52] Originally by: Hairygoagain Originally by: Gypsio III I made an assumption that the HMs would be able to hit the inty (5625 m/s missiles and 84 km range vs. ~5100 m/s MWD speed on an Ares), which matches my experience. Okay, overheating the MWD gets you ~7300 m/s and HM immunity for about a minute, but after that you're vulnerable again. Defenders will help, especially against grouped missiles, but some will still get through. Ignoring the overheat, the missiles closing velocity is 525 m/s. Multiply this by the flight time and any inty that starts this far away is immune to the missiles. BIG CLUE, it isn't 84 Km, the 'range' quoted, it's about 15 Km. <= This is why missiles suck. A precision light missiles can't even reach most inties due to the nerfed flight time. Missiles suck far more if you try to use them and know how they work. T2 missiles need some love that is truth. But you cannot say that HAIL for example is a terrific ammo as well:P Not everythgin on turret world is Scorch quality :P
TZeer BURN EDEN	Posted - 2009.08.05 04:10:00 - [53] I will explain even more: 1: This was after nano nerf, but before missile nerf on the testserver. 2: People where screaming that the drake/ missile ships in general would WTFPWN any ships out there. 3: People where especially screaming about drakes with lightmissiles and rigs... And thats what I tested. Drones had nothing to do with it, as that was not what we tested. Purely the effect of light missiles vs inty. Me in a claw. Opponent in a drake with light missiles and rigs. The speed of the inty was about 5000m/s. With normal missiles the damage was close to nothing. Usually they where trailing behind the inty trying to catch up. If you added rigs and missile actually hit, you did somewhere between 10 and 20 in damage. When you changed rigs to speed or flight time the damage from the missile was down to 4 or something again. And if you tried precision lights the missile never made it to the inty. AGAIN: This was before missile nerf and after nano nerf on SISI. NOT with current missile mechanics. But this examples was one of the main arguments that people used as an example to why the missile needed nerfing. If someone finds that the missiles are great, well, good for them. And even large artilleries will outdamage cruise missiles on most cruisers when you get past the 20km mark. Not counting in mwd or ab now. And this is with no tracking mods.
Omara Otawan	Posted - 2009.08.05 07:32:00 - [54] Edited by: Omara Otawan on 05/08/2009 07:32:07 Originally by: AstroPhobic Typhoon without missiles is like a domi without drones. Or is expecting the hostiles to be more than 20km away Typhoon without drones on the other hand...
Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2009.08.05 07:58:00 - [55] Originally by: Hairygoagain Originally by: Gypsio III I made an assumption that the HMs would be able to hit the inty (5625 m/s missiles and 84 km range vs. ~5100 m/s MWD speed on an Ares), which matches my experience. Okay, overheating the MWD gets you ~7300 m/s and HM immunity for about a minute, but after that you're vulnerable again. Defenders will help, especially against grouped missiles, but some will still get through. Ignoring the overheat, the missiles closing velocity is 525 m/s. Multiply this by the flight time and any inty that starts this far away is immune to the missiles. BIG CLUE, it isn't 84 Km, the 'range' quoted, it's about 15 Km. <= This is why missiles suck. A precision light missiles can't even reach most inties due to the nerfed flight time. Missiles suck far more if you try to use them and know how they work. I do use them and I do know how they work. That's why I don't use Precisions. In the missile feedback thread I told CCP straight away that they were worthless for their intended task (and even if they did hit then their damage would only be ~3% more than, that of CN) but they clearly had that as "intended behaviour". Rage/Fury, however, is more useful, doing ~11% more raw damage than CN. It's generally only worth using against ships a size bigger than your missile, but 11% extra DPS is notable.
Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2009.08.05 08:06:00 - [56] Originally by: TZeer I will explain even more: 1: This was after nano nerf, but before missile nerf on the testserver. 2: People where screaming that the drake/ missile ships in general would WTFPWN any ships out there. 3: People where especially screaming about drakes with lightmissiles and rigs... And thats what I tested. Drones had nothing to do with it, as that was not what we tested. Purely the effect of light missiles vs inty. Me in a claw. Opponent in a drake with light missiles and rigs. The speed of the inty was about 5000m/s. With normal missiles the damage was close to nothing. Usually they where trailing behind the inty trying to catch up. If you added rigs and missile actually hit, you did somewhere between 10 and 20 in damage. When you changed rigs to speed or flight time the damage from the missile was down to 4 or something again. And if you tried precision lights the missile never made it to the inty. AGAIN: This was before missile nerf and after nano nerf on SISI. NOT with current missile mechanics. On Sisi after the speed nerf but before the new missile mechanics, it was still possible to completely negate all (except Precision Light) missile damage by going faster than the ~4 km/s missile cliff. So yeah, your 5 km/s Claw would have been immune to normal missiles, and was probably able to just outrun the Precisions - no missile speed bonus on a Drake. Fortunately, that new formula changed that, and now even HMs can inflict meaningful damage to an inty.
Miss Xoco Minmatar VR Corp Sovereign Technologies	Posted - 2009.08.06 07:51:00 - [57] Edited by: Miss Xoco on 06/08/2009 07:54:38 A Drakes missile can still hurt a lot. I was fighting a drake on my BS and i had 75% kinetic resist. The missiles did kinetic damage and a drake got kinetic boost. I was taking very high damage and had to repair a lot. I wasnt even able to break his tank because the hybrid-turrets can only use kinetic-thermal. The drakes resist was about 85% against both damage types. I wasnt able to break that drakes tank, its just a extremely awesome tank with even a lot of damage potential. Maybe when i got better skills it may work. The BS was a blaster ship with 7 large hybrid turrets in optimal range, so i have to pay respect for a drakes tank.

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