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S'Daria	Posted - 2004.10.18 12:05:00 - [61] Since it'll be an opt-in program basically the RP reasoning is this: Your flight computer update CONCORD or some other "reporting agency", (make a corporation named Gallop ), receives this information that you allow to be collected. Weekly, say every Monday or whatever the stats are updated for everyone to see under EVE Insider.
S'Daria	Posted - 2004.10.18 12:05:00 - [62] Since it'll be an opt-in program basically the RP reasoning is this: Your flight computer update CONCORD or some other "reporting agency", (make a corporation named Gallop ), receives this information that you allow to be collected. Weekly, say every Monday or whatever the stats are updated for everyone to see under EVE Insider.
Tharrn	Posted - 2004.10.18 12:17:00 - [63] Thumbs down. If you need to stroke your ego by your number of frags go play some Counterstrike or Doom. EVE is about so much more than the number of kills and it would be a pitty to degrade it that way.
Tharrn	Posted - 2004.10.18 12:17:00 - [64] Thumbs down. If you need to stroke your ego by your number of frags go play some Counterstrike or Doom. EVE is about so much more than the number of kills and it would be a pitty to degrade it that way.
Schroni	Posted - 2004.10.18 12:22:00 - [65] Originally by: Toran Mehtar I'm inclined to say no. If such statistics were implemented in this game, then they would very quickly take over as the prime objective for many people. There are plenty of online FPS league tables out there, I thought Eve was better than that. What I would prefer to see is these statistics being monitored covertly by CCP, and used to improve the level of news reporting and storyline interaction. We want to know that over 70 ships (when I last checked) were destroyed in a single system last night. We want to hear a report from Concord who was most involved. Why shouldn't we get reports on who the most 'succesful' pirates have been in the last week ? The statistics should enhance the game, not be the game. i like that approach --- SNIGG Forums my videos
Schroni	Posted - 2004.10.18 12:22:00 - [66] Originally by: Toran Mehtar I'm inclined to say no. If such statistics were implemented in this game, then they would very quickly take over as the prime objective for many people. There are plenty of online FPS league tables out there, I thought Eve was better than that. What I would prefer to see is these statistics being monitored covertly by CCP, and used to improve the level of news reporting and storyline interaction. We want to know that over 70 ships (when I last checked) were destroyed in a single system last night. We want to hear a report from Concord who was most involved. Why shouldn't we get reports on who the most 'succesful' pirates have been in the last week ? The statistics should enhance the game, not be the game. i like that approach --- SNIGG Forums my videos
S'Daria	Posted - 2004.10.18 13:25:00 - [67] By making it an opt-in system those who are not interested in it will never see it or be included in the statistics. For those who want to make this a "goal" can partisipate in this ranking system. Viola'
S'Daria	Posted - 2004.10.18 13:25:00 - [68] By making it an opt-in system those who are not interested in it will never see it or be included in the statistics. For those who want to make this a "goal" can partisipate in this ranking system. Viola'
Tharrn	Posted - 2004.10.18 13:28:00 - [69] Doesn't make a difference unless only kills of people participating count for the ranking. I bet it would cause lag if the system had to find out who the heck has to get points for the ranking in a mixed engagement - like the criminal flagging does :P
Tharrn	Posted - 2004.10.18 13:28:00 - [70] Doesn't make a difference unless only kills of people participating count for the ranking. I bet it would cause lag if the system had to find out who the heck has to get points for the ranking in a mixed engagement - like the criminal flagging does :P
nirana	Posted - 2004.10.18 13:51:00 - [71] shouldnt u change topic to "welcome to Diablo2 ladder" ?
nirana	Posted - 2004.10.18 13:51:00 - [72] shouldnt u change topic to "welcome to Diablo2 ladder" ?
Andrue	Posted - 2004.10.18 14:07:00 - [73] Originally by: Tharrn Doesn't make a difference unless only kills of people participating count for the ranking. I bet it would cause lag if the system had to find out who the heck has to get points for the ranking in a mixed engagement - like the criminal flagging does :P Yes but criminal flagging is supposed to be realtime. If we went for the weekly summary option then all the server needs to do is increment or decrement a couple of counters when the kill mail gets sent out. The harder computational work would get done during Sunday's daily DT. In any case I think restricting the stats to none combat operations addresses these issues. Those players who already engage in PvP don't need any encouragement because (I don't know how, but good for them) they already get a sense of achievement from blowing up other people's ships. Having commercial stats makes sense from an RP perspective and gives the non combat oriented pilots (and there's a lot of us-might even be the majority) a goal to aim for. I agree that having a spotty teenager smack talk about how many ships he's killed is undesirable but I really can't see the same thing happening with amount of Veldspar mined or number or number of items sold. Hmmm. In fact why give the specific details? Just give the relative positions. That leaves very little to brag about since all you know is that you are above someone in the list. It still leaves something to work toward though for those who are in need of a little motivation. -- (Battle hardened miner) [Brackley, UK] WARNING:This post may contain large doses of reality.
Andrue	Posted - 2004.10.18 14:07:00 - [74] Originally by: Tharrn Doesn't make a difference unless only kills of people participating count for the ranking. I bet it would cause lag if the system had to find out who the heck has to get points for the ranking in a mixed engagement - like the criminal flagging does :P Yes but criminal flagging is supposed to be realtime. If we went for the weekly summary option then all the server needs to do is increment or decrement a couple of counters when the kill mail gets sent out. The harder computational work would get done during Sunday's daily DT. In any case I think restricting the stats to none combat operations addresses these issues. Those players who already engage in PvP don't need any encouragement because (I don't know how, but good for them) they already get a sense of achievement from blowing up other people's ships. Having commercial stats makes sense from an RP perspective and gives the non combat oriented pilots (and there's a lot of us-might even be the majority) a goal to aim for. I agree that having a spotty teenager smack talk about how many ships he's killed is undesirable but I really can't see the same thing happening with amount of Veldspar mined or number or number of items sold. Hmmm. In fact why give the specific details? Just give the relative positions. That leaves very little to brag about since all you know is that you are above someone in the list. It still leaves something to work toward though for those who are in need of a little motivation. -- (Battle hardened miner) [Brackley, UK] WARNING:This post may contain large doses of reality.
Toran Mehtar	Posted - 2004.10.18 14:46:00 - [75] m0o didn't become the most feared pilots in the galaxy by being top of a high score list. The Curse Alliance isn't hated because the weekly stats say they're the largest alliance. People don't flee local when the name Tank CEO appears in local because it says No. 1 Ganker next to his picture. You may not agree with what I've said above, but I guarantee 99.9% of the people reading this post recognise the people I've mentioned. So where's the league table that told them ? Eve is such a beautifully intricate game, with a level of player immersion that I have never seen before. In Shiva, players will have the opportunity to form Alliances that will stand side by side with the major npc factions and potentially influence the development of prime fiction within Eve. Do you believe that this was the initial intention of CCP, or do you think that the actions of players in forming these alliances led the developers to move the game in such a direction ? Players are forging their place in Eve folk-lore, crafting the game as it develops. Yet some people want to reduce this to league tables and meaningless statistics. It's sad; very, very sad.
Toran Mehtar	Posted - 2004.10.18 14:46:00 - [76] m0o didn't become the most feared pilots in the galaxy by being top of a high score list. The Curse Alliance isn't hated because the weekly stats say they're the largest alliance. People don't flee local when the name Tank CEO appears in local because it says No. 1 Ganker next to his picture. You may not agree with what I've said above, but I guarantee 99.9% of the people reading this post recognise the people I've mentioned. So where's the league table that told them ? Eve is such a beautifully intricate game, with a level of player immersion that I have never seen before. In Shiva, players will have the opportunity to form Alliances that will stand side by side with the major npc factions and potentially influence the development of prime fiction within Eve. Do you believe that this was the initial intention of CCP, or do you think that the actions of players in forming these alliances led the developers to move the game in such a direction ? Players are forging their place in Eve folk-lore, crafting the game as it develops. Yet some people want to reduce this to league tables and meaningless statistics. It's sad; very, very sad.
Andrue	Posted - 2004.10.18 15:32:00 - [77] Originally by: Toran Mehtar m0o didn't become the most feared pilots in the galaxy by being top of a high score list. The Curse Alliance isn't hated because the weekly stats say they're the largest alliance. People don't flee local when the name Tank CEO appears in local because it says No. 1 Ganker next to his picture. You may not agree with what I've said above, but I guarantee 99.9% of the people reading this post recognise the people I've mentioned. So where's the league table that told them ? You still seem to be fixated on combat. Oh well, first I'll reiterate a solution for combat stats: The stats should be localised around your own character stats. Tank CEO's combat performance would only be known for sure to ten other people. Even they would only that that he was five players above them. Whether this represents five thousand kills or five they will never know. Now for the bit you seem unable to acknowledge or understand: I've suggested that combat stats not be covered. As I said in my last post they probably aren't needed anyway. Something must be keeping you guys at each other's throats and you seem happy about it. A set of stats for commercial operations pretty much destroys your above argument/objection. Or are you going to reply and give a list of famous miners or traders? -- (Battle hardened miner) [Brackley, UK] WARNING:This post may contain large doses of reality.
Andrue	Posted - 2004.10.18 15:32:00 - [78] Originally by: Toran Mehtar m0o didn't become the most feared pilots in the galaxy by being top of a high score list. The Curse Alliance isn't hated because the weekly stats say they're the largest alliance. People don't flee local when the name Tank CEO appears in local because it says No. 1 Ganker next to his picture. You may not agree with what I've said above, but I guarantee 99.9% of the people reading this post recognise the people I've mentioned. So where's the league table that told them ? You still seem to be fixated on combat. Oh well, first I'll reiterate a solution for combat stats: The stats should be localised around your own character stats. Tank CEO's combat performance would only be known for sure to ten other people. Even they would only that that he was five players above them. Whether this represents five thousand kills or five they will never know. Now for the bit you seem unable to acknowledge or understand: I've suggested that combat stats not be covered. As I said in my last post they probably aren't needed anyway. Something must be keeping you guys at each other's throats and you seem happy about it. A set of stats for commercial operations pretty much destroys your above argument/objection. Or are you going to reply and give a list of famous miners or traders? -- (Battle hardened miner) [Brackley, UK] WARNING:This post may contain large doses of reality.
Toran Mehtar	Posted - 2004.10.18 15:45:00 - [79] Originally by: Andrue You still seem to be fixated on combat. Oh well, first I'll reiterate a solution for combat stats: The stats should be localised around your own character stats. Tank CEO's combat performance would only be known for sure to ten other people. Even they would only that that he was five players above them. Whether this represents five thousand kills or five they will never know. So out of 50k accounts I would know the 5 people slightly better than me and the 5 slightly worse ? Odds of me knowing these people well enough to care.... Sounds like a pretty pointless system to me. Originally by: Andrue A set of stats for commercial operations pretty much destroys your above argument/objection. Or are you going to reply and give a list of famous miners or traders? Ever bought/sold at Naga prices ? Ever entered the BIG lottery ? Ever seen people whining about Xanadu aquiring another tech II bpo ? Keep the arguments coming coming. The simple fact is that anything a league table would provide is already being achieved by people in game, and with a lot more depth and intrigue than a bunch of numbers will produce. You want to be famous ? Earn it, and prove it to the community yourself. You want to compete with others, then find people to compete with directly rather than a name on a list that means nothing to you other than they beat you by 0.1 this week.
Toran Mehtar	Posted - 2004.10.18 15:45:00 - [80] Originally by: Andrue You still seem to be fixated on combat. Oh well, first I'll reiterate a solution for combat stats: The stats should be localised around your own character stats. Tank CEO's combat performance would only be known for sure to ten other people. Even they would only that that he was five players above them. Whether this represents five thousand kills or five they will never know. So out of 50k accounts I would know the 5 people slightly better than me and the 5 slightly worse ? Odds of me knowing these people well enough to care.... Sounds like a pretty pointless system to me. Originally by: Andrue A set of stats for commercial operations pretty much destroys your above argument/objection. Or are you going to reply and give a list of famous miners or traders? Ever bought/sold at Naga prices ? Ever entered the BIG lottery ? Ever seen people whining about Xanadu aquiring another tech II bpo ? Keep the arguments coming coming. The simple fact is that anything a league table would provide is already being achieved by people in game, and with a lot more depth and intrigue than a bunch of numbers will produce. You want to be famous ? Earn it, and prove it to the community yourself. You want to compete with others, then find people to compete with directly rather than a name on a list that means nothing to you other than they beat you by 0.1 this week.
Crixon	Posted - 2004.10.18 18:16:00 - [81] This idea has been suggested many times before on Idea Lab (where ideas go to die) but hopefully some CCP peeps will see it here. I'm all for PvP statistics. However, the essentials are ship and pod kills in the last week and alltime. Everything else is optional if it causes tremendous server load. Top 10 lists of other activities are great, but it is probably too much to ask for right now with Shiva content locked down. One other idea I would like to see implemented is a Local broadcast of kills of each players' ship and capsule: Crixon destroyed Oveur's ship! Crixon destroyed Oveur's capsule! Angel Impaler destroyed Crixon's ship! Only the person rendering the final blow would be broadcast this way. Everyone in a fleet battle can get a quick read on who's doing the kills. Also in isolated systems, everyone in local can get an idea of what's going on in the system.
Crixon	Posted - 2004.10.18 18:16:00 - [82] This idea has been suggested many times before on Idea Lab (where ideas go to die) but hopefully some CCP peeps will see it here. I'm all for PvP statistics. However, the essentials are ship and pod kills in the last week and alltime. Everything else is optional if it causes tremendous server load. Top 10 lists of other activities are great, but it is probably too much to ask for right now with Shiva content locked down. One other idea I would like to see implemented is a Local broadcast of kills of each players' ship and capsule: Crixon destroyed Oveur's ship! Crixon destroyed Oveur's capsule! Angel Impaler destroyed Crixon's ship! Only the person rendering the final blow would be broadcast this way. Everyone in a fleet battle can get a quick read on who's doing the kills. Also in isolated systems, everyone in local can get an idea of what's going on in the system.
Andrue	Posted - 2004.10.18 18:25:00 - [83] Edited by: Andrue on 18/10/2004 18:35:21 Originally by: Toran Mehtar You want to be famous ? No, I don't. [Edit:Actually I do but not for PvP or even PvE - I don't play enough. I only want to be famous or known for my character's personality] I just want to watch my character progress and try and match what other similar characters achieve. At present we all play in a vacuum. Nothing we does significantly affects anyone nor changes the Eve universe. Give us some statistics and we can see things changing over time. If they include other character's statistics we can have a little competition. -- (Battle hardened miner) [Brackley, UK] WARNING:This post may contain large doses of reality.
Andrue	Posted - 2004.10.18 18:25:00 - [84] Edited by: Andrue on 18/10/2004 18:35:21 Originally by: Toran Mehtar You want to be famous ? No, I don't. [Edit:Actually I do but not for PvP or even PvE - I don't play enough. I only want to be famous or known for my character's personality] I just want to watch my character progress and try and match what other similar characters achieve. At present we all play in a vacuum. Nothing we does significantly affects anyone nor changes the Eve universe. Give us some statistics and we can see things changing over time. If they include other character's statistics we can have a little competition. -- (Battle hardened miner) [Brackley, UK] WARNING:This post may contain large doses of reality.
Crixon	Posted - 2004.10.18 18:58:00 - [85] Originally by: Andrue Edited by: Andrue on 18/10/2004 18:35:21 Originally by: Toran Mehtar You want to be famous ? No, I don't. Hell yeah I do. I know many players do as well. There's nothing like competition and bragging rights to light a fire in peeps' asses. Participation and fun in PvP would go through the roof with stats. Every pro athlete is obsessed with their stats, and so are game players. I came from DAoC, and people would fight tooth and nail to get up on the top lists every week: http://guilds.camelotherald.com/realms/war.php?server=Percival&t=weekchampions The major downside is that these stats were not viewable in game. Eve stats, pvp and otherwise, must be viewable in game for better impact and recognition. I desperately need these stats to be proud of. I have no life, failed out of school, and am forced to be in a stoned dope-induced haze while autopiloting my courier missions BECAUSE WE DON'T HAVE PVP STATS!
Crixon	Posted - 2004.10.18 18:58:00 - [86] Originally by: Andrue Edited by: Andrue on 18/10/2004 18:35:21 Originally by: Toran Mehtar You want to be famous ? No, I don't. Hell yeah I do. I know many players do as well. There's nothing like competition and bragging rights to light a fire in peeps' asses. Participation and fun in PvP would go through the roof with stats. Every pro athlete is obsessed with their stats, and so are game players. I came from DAoC, and people would fight tooth and nail to get up on the top lists every week: http://guilds.camelotherald.com/realms/war.php?server=Percival&t=weekchampions The major downside is that these stats were not viewable in game. Eve stats, pvp and otherwise, must be viewable in game for better impact and recognition. I desperately need these stats to be proud of. I have no life, failed out of school, and am forced to be in a stoned dope-induced haze while autopiloting my courier missions BECAUSE WE DON'T HAVE PVP STATS!
Stained	Posted - 2004.10.18 19:20:00 - [87] I say no, for 2 simple reasons - 1. it will go to peoples heads. 2. The forums lag enough as is. ___________________________________________________________________ Hair is Over-rated.
Stained	Posted - 2004.10.18 19:20:00 - [88] I say no, for 2 simple reasons - 1. it will go to peoples heads. 2. The forums lag enough as is. ___________________________________________________________________ Hair is Over-rated.
Crixon	Posted - 2004.10.18 20:58:00 - [89] Originally by: Stained I say no, for 2 simple reasons - 1. it will go to peoples heads. 2. The forums lag enough as is. I disagree. 1. I want them to go to my head. 2. They should be kept on a different server than forums.
Crixon	Posted - 2004.10.18 20:58:00 - [90] Originally by: Stained I say no, for 2 simple reasons - 1. it will go to peoples heads. 2. The forums lag enough as is. I disagree. 1. I want them to go to my head. 2. They should be kept on a different server than forums.

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