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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
RedSplat
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Posted - 2009.09.17 16:42:00 -
[31]
LOSE THE CHEAPENED TRAINING FOR THERMODYNAMICS.
Seriously, don't penalize players smart enough and willing to put the training time in to train for this skill. 
As for the other lessened training times for modules- lose them as well. 
You are cheapening the efforts and time spent of older players.
Cloaking now requires only electronics 4? BAD idea.
Bomb Deployment needs the req skill to 4 only as well? BAD idea.
I know you want to make the game more accessible to newer players but you are making being able to fly given ships less of an achievement- and making specialized ships mean much less.
Wormhole Dungeons
Please tell me you aren't instancing. You said you would never use instancing. 
 Originally by: CCP Mitnal
I don't sleep.
I am always here.
Watching.
Waiting.
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Mkiaki
Gallente
Center for Advanced Studies
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Posted - 2009.09.17 16:51:00 -
[32]
The tears 
/me buys a boat and sails in the tears. 
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Kyra Felann
Gallente
Noctis Fleet Technologies
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Posted - 2009.09.17 17:23:00 -
[33]
Originally by: Ivena Amethyst
ahhhhrgh!! come the frack on! I just traind the frikkin' energy meangement 5 for thermodynamics
So I guess having maximum base capacitor capacity on every ship you fly from now on isn't useful?
You act like that skill does absolutely nothing for you except let you train thermodynamics.
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Meiyang Lee
Gallente
Azteca Transportation Unlimited
Gunboat Diplomacy
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Posted - 2009.09.17 17:31:00 -
[34]
Originally by: Kyra Felann
Originally by: Ivena Amethyst
ahhhhrgh!! come the frack on! I just traind the frikkin' energy meangement 5 for thermodynamics
So I guess having maximum base capacitor capacity on every ship you fly from now on isn't useful?
You act like that skill does absolutely nothing for you except let you train thermodynamics.
Yup, maxed cap-skills is the reason I have that one at 5 to begin with, I don't think Thermodynamics was even implemented when I got it to 5. 
Personally, I think it's a good idea to slightly reduce some of the requirements for skills, it makes it easier for younger players to get into that sort of thing.
Actually I have most of the skills receiving the treatment, and you don't hear me whine about it, I would have had those skills at 5 anyway, regardless of them being a requirement for the skill or not.
The increase in functionality of the skill, while incremental, is still quite worth it.
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Tor Kallon
Bene Gesserit ChapterHouse
Tread Alliance
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Posted - 2009.09.17 17:39:00 -
[35]
Quote:
It means you can no longer PLACE THE BOOK MARKS INSIDE OF THE STRUCTURES.
So this means you can't put bookmarks into a Corporate Hangar Array at a POS? This is a major change for people who live in w-space. We normally share scan duty and put BMs for all sigs and anoms into the corp hangar array at our POS.
A workaround would be to anchor a GSC and use that for BMs, but I don't get why?
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Veliria
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Posted - 2009.09.17 17:52:00 -
[36]
Quote:
# Hacking will now have the following prerequisites: Science level 3 (from level 5), Electronics Upgrades level 2( from level 5), Electronics level 1 (from level 2) and Engineering level 1 ( from level 2)
# Archaeology will now have the following prerequisites Science lev 3( from level 5), Survey level 3 (from level 5) and Electronics level 1
Not sure I agree with those two.
Before the current Exploration system was added, Radar/Magnetometric/Grav sites were something for only the dedicated explorer.
Granted the system needed a change (just watching the scanner count down was eye straining), but atleast it required some effort.
Apocrypha pretty much annihilated that by making scanning stupidly easy to the point where there is no sense to train for a CovOps and Exploration skills to IV/V as a T1 Heron with lvl 1-3 skills will find even the hardest site in a few minutes now (as it has to with 0.25 AU probes).
Atleast with the skill requirements in place it required some effort for pilots wanting to do Exploration.
Now it's been dumbed again and 1 week old alts will probably be able to probe down sites in no time.
Love the other changes (planets!), but quit dumbing/noobing down Exploration, it won't be fun to find a Radar/Arch site in your T2 rigged Buzzard with all skills for it to IV/V, only to come back with your hacking ship and find twenty one-week old chars hacking the cans already.
Leave the easiest of the easy sites for the newer players and make it so the more they invest in Exploration (skills, experience, ship, rigs, equipment) the better sites they can find and the faster they can find them.
Want to be able to scan down that 'Hard' Gravimetric site? You should need sufficiently boosted probes for it!
It's silly how fast even the most basic 'probing' ship can find sites (and anomaly plexes), it should require effort, we already have AFK mining and missioning, let's not add AFK exploration to that list.
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XXSketchxx
Gallente
Remote Soviet Industries
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Posted - 2009.09.17 18:08:00 -
[37]
Feel free to fix the gallente tower bug.
Otherwise good fixes. Skill requirement reductions are..meh. New players are too scared to go after the good hacking/arch sites anyway (minimum low sec) so not really hurting competition much.
Cloak one is good. More whines from the "omgcloaker" whine crowd.
Only one I don't care for is the thermodynamics change; I feel like overheating is a more advanced option for pvp and thus only someone who has a bit of experience and invested skills should be allowed to do it. But...oh well.
Good job fixing the disparity btwn synth boosters being legal and the prints being illegal. About damn time.
_____________________________________________
-Sketch, Certified Pharmacist
Need a Boost?
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Tobin Shalim
Warped Mining
Strip Mining Club
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Posted - 2009.09.17 18:33:00 -
[38]
Skill changes haven't made it to SiSi yet, just FYI.
Also...are you planning on changing the requirements for the bomb launcher to be in-line with the new skill requirement for the bombs? Seems stupid to have to train missile bombardment for the bomb launcher and only have the bombs themselves require missile bombardment IV.
-----
Originally by: Gierling
Tech III is going to be "Fully modular" until someone crams the "EW Bonus" modules together with the "8 Midslots" modules...
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PStuckey
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Posted - 2009.09.17 19:19:00 -
[39]
Thank you for devaluing everything i get from exploring even more.
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wallenbergaren
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Posted - 2009.09.17 19:20:00 -
[40]
Originally by: Veliria
Apocrypha pretty much annihilated that by making scanning stupidly easy to the point where there is no sense to train for a CovOps and Exploration skills to IV/V as a T1 Heron with lvl 1-3 skills will find even the hardest site in a few minutes now (as it has to with 0.25 AU probes).
Atleast with the skill requirements in place it required some effort for pilots wanting to do Exploration.
Where do you scan for sites?
In lowsec / 0.0 I've come across sites that were very hard to scan in a rigged Helios with above average skills
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Terianna Eri
Amarr
Scrutari
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Posted - 2009.09.17 19:39:00 -
[41]
I don't really understand why people are upset about lowering some of the skill requirements (except maybe cloaking; anything that makes it harder to roll up a cloaking scout alt is a good thing imho).
Thermodynamics, Hacking, Salvaging, etc are pretty basic mechanics, and you think it's a bad thing that new players can get to those things faster?
Hell Thermodynamics is so mind-bogglingly good that you're pretty screwed without it in PVP; making it easier to get means that newer players can get closer to high skilled players (by overloading their stuff and getting +15% to basically everything) more frequently.
And as for the "wasted training time" - The real issue there is that you feel like the prerequisites for the skills in questions weren't worth training except as a prerequisite for someone else, which means that the problem is that some skills are useless, not that the skill reqs are lower.
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Meissa Anunthiel
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Posted - 2009.09.17 20:23:00 -
[42]
# The description of the Minmatar Tech I battleships has had its grammar and spelling fixed.
--> But the patch notes haven't. Should be "the descriptionS of the Minmatar Tech I battleships HAVE had THEIR grammar and spelling fixed." ;-)
# Player owned wrecks can now be marked as "Available for all" which prevents CONCORD or criminal repercussions for taking from or destroying free for all wrecks.
--> By whom? The killer? :p
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ultima necat
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Posted - 2009.09.17 20:27:00 -
[43]
Good bye the olds commitment certificates skills
-electronic upgrade 5 for invention alt
-survey 5 for just about everyone
-missile bombardement 5 for non-missile user who want to fly a SB on the side ...
Those were painfull to train and mostly useless, except for the skill they opened.
Lowering the prerequisite make sense,
but it leave a bad aftertaste, especially to those who just finished training them...
Thermodynamics... Probably a good change however, and at least the old prereq is usefull in its own way.
The others, not a big change.
Going from 4 to 3 is nothing.
Going from 5 to lower on an otherwise usefull skill, it sting a bit but it is for the best.
But survey, elec upgrade for inventors , and missile bombardement for some players, are now purely wasted skillpoints.
Ultima necat
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Horchan
Gallente
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Posted - 2009.09.17 20:28:00 -
[44]
Quote:
* After you have probed down a cosmic signature to 100% Strength, it is now possible to warp to it with less than 3 probes without throwing an exception.
I'm not sure if I understand this one. Are you saying that you don't need four probes to get a warpable hit now (which is just stupid)? Or are you saying that once you get it to 100%, your probes don't have be sitting next to the signature to warp to it (which you can do anyway)?
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DesuSigs |
Mike C
Caldari
Ipuvaepe Industries
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Posted - 2009.09.17 20:38:00 -
[45]
Quote:
Skills
Hacking will now have the following prerequisites: Science level 3 (from level 5), Electronics Upgrades level 2( from level 5), Electronics level 1 (from level 2) and Engineering level 1 ( from level 2)
Archaeology will now have the following prerequisites Science lev 3( from level 5), Survey level 3 (from level 5) and Electronics level 1
Salvaging will now have the following prerequisites Mechanic level 3, Survey at level 3 and Engineering level 1
Cloaking has the following prerequisites Electronics lev 4 ( was 5)
High Speed Maneuvering will now have Navigation at level 3 and Afterburner at level 3 as its prerequisites (instead of all at level 4)
Tactical Shield Manipulation has Engineering at level 3 as its prerequisites(instead of level 4)
Trajectory Analysis has Gunnery at level 4 as a prerequisite (instead of 5)
Bomb Deployment has Missile Bombardment at level 4 as a prerequisite (instead of level 5)
Mining Upgrades now has Mining at level 3 as a prerequisite (instead of 4)
Thermodynamics has Engineering at level 5, Energy Management at level 3(instead of 5) and Science at level 4
Not a single good change here. EVE is WAY too ****ing noob friendly already SP-wise
__________________________________________________
Originally by: Mike C
Trolls - We keep Humanity alive... and kicking...
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Lt Shard
Mentis Fidelis
Circle-Of-Two
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Posted - 2009.09.17 20:41:00 -
[46]
Quote:
* Bomb Deployment has Missile Bombardment at level 4 as a prerequisite (instead of level 5)
I want my 10 days back.
_________________________
Yes, I know the Titan is small in my sig. |
Undertow Latheus
Minmatar
Neo Spartans
Laconian Syndicate
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Posted - 2009.09.17 21:08:00 -
[47]
Originally by: IlluminatedOne
2CCP: can you please tell - what is the idea behind lowering the prerequisite requirements for some skills (Thermodynamics in particular)? It really alienates older players (who spent dozens of days on these) and, in my opinion, "cheapens" the overheating concept - now every noob can use it.
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Komi Toran
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Posted - 2009.09.17 22:27:00 -
[48]
I agree with Veliria on the skill change, but you've screwed over dedicated explorers so much already that I don't think it matters. Hell, just get rid of scanning altogether, make the sites generate a beacon, hand deliver all the goods to a player's cargo hold when they warp in, and be done with it. My cov-ops sit unused, except to find the rare red in 0.0 that didn't fit a cloaking device.
With the planets... sure, they look nice... if you ever get close enough to see them! You need to a) make the planets BIGGER and b) bring the warp-in points and stations closer to them. The horizon should dominate our view, not be something easily missed.
You went through the effort to actually make the graphic display correctly when you get closer to them. It'd be a shame if that was wasted.
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Arec Bardwin
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Posted - 2009.09.17 22:38:00 -
[49]
Originally by: Jonna Red
So, I have Survey 5. Would be nice to get now the speed bonus of that module also for Salvagers, Analyzers and Codebreakers.
THIS
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Tom Hanks
Amarria Auxilia
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Posted - 2009.09.18 00:57:00 -
[50]
CCP Why are you making the Navy Scorp a fail machine?
Please read my thread on how to improve the ship so it isnt just a tankier version of a Navy Raven with crap weapons (so it can just die last)
Caldari Racial Purity
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Jana Tanaka
Caldari
Tanaka Industries Inc.
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Posted - 2009.09.18 00:58:00 -
[51]
a) Nay to the exploration related skill changes.
This is the equivalent of changing the prereq.
for HACs from cruiser 5 to cruiser 4.
If not enough people venture into lowsec / 00 exploration,
its not because of the skill requirements,
yet because of the changes to scan mechanics that made doing so nearly suicidal.
Especially Survey 5 is an nearly useless skill, unless you aim to to a lot of moon surveying.
One can debate Electronic Upgrades 5 since it opens up CovOps, which is nice to have for a dedicated explorer / industrialist.
Still having access to a covops no longer brings the level of advantage it brought before Apocrypha.
Twice Nay to the potential impact of the Hacking changes on Invention
The market does not need more casual inventors.
There are enough people unable to do basic math allready pestering it.
If this change brings only 5% more *casual* inventors into the game,
it will likely have an negative impact on the profit margins.
Therfore Twice Nay.
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Nekmet Awai
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Posted - 2009.09.18 01:26:00 -
[52]
so dissapointing in the patch, all the promise of pve and industrial content and we get pure pvp related content, such bs....
all i got to say about this wasted of time patch of yours...
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Roemy Schneider
Vanishing Point.
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Posted - 2009.09.18 01:29:00 -
[53]
Quote:
You can view the adjacent systems through show in the info of a normal space solar system while you are in wormhole space.
plz elaborate
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putting the gist back into logistics |
Sith LordX
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Posted - 2009.09.18 01:56:00 -
[54]
So ccp heres how you fix the skill requirement barriers you guys lowered and screwed the older players out of so and so days.
Its time to allow the + and - ing of SP from skills we went into wile we where noobs so and so years ago and nolonger use. So we can take unused SP and put it into stuff we will actually use. Say all the mining Sp industry ship sp, I want to put into guns and missiles etc, much like the changes done with attributes.
Let us move around SP once a year. Problem solved issued with requierment nerfs on skills.
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Xing Fey
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Posted - 2009.09.18 01:58:00 -
[55]
I for one am satisfied with my +5% capacitor and CPU, and +10% missile flight time. Those that don't want to train these skills to lvl 5 are losing out anyways, they are very good important skills.
Survey, on the other hand....
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Wutwut934857
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Posted - 2009.09.18 02:47:00 -
[56]
Please fix rockets. :(
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Lili Lu
Purveyors of Uber Research Valuables and Ships
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Posted - 2009.09.18 04:07:00 -
[57]
It makes me sick to think of the ridiculous Gurista ships now on sisi coming onto tranquility. They are more Gallente than Caldari, and more Gallente than Gallente for that matter. So, in keeping with the history of that faction already in the game, and backstory. Not.
And, once again it appears you will let down those that fly Minmatar with two designs that bring up the rear.
There has been plenty of criticism of the new ships in the two threads which you solicited. It would be nice if you could have a dev post in them that you have been reading them. Why should anyone waste their time giving these ships a spin on the test server if you really don't give a **** what players think, and have no intention of altering them?
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something somethingdark
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Posted - 2009.09.18 07:28:00 -
[58]
Preliminary patchnotes , preliminary feedback :
comments like "why doesnt every planet get a new texture" are ominted
Skills - Hacking :
Should retain a lvl5 skill because there should be an entry barrier - perhaps electronics or electronics upgrades
Skills - Archeology :
Should retain a lvl5 skill aswell ( wtf did i train survey 5 for now ? )
Skills - Cloaking
Should keep its lvl5 prequisit ... it shouldnt be too easy to get these highly usefull modules ... perhaps electronics lvl4 only for the prototype cloak ... rest need lvl5 ?
Skills - Thermodynamics
Lowers the entry barrier way too much if energy management lvl5(rank 3 skill) is dropped ... find a way to offset this training time
Skills - Injecting skills
Ummmmmm why ? is there a very very very good reason for that ?
Bookmarks can no longer be placed in starbase structures
Yes i am aware that means you can no longer drop bookmarks INSIDE corp hangars and not bookmarking the actual corp hangar
But, unless you are also planing to finaly add the ability to create and label tabs in the corp hangar ... NO, NO NO NO NO NO
no
just no
dropping a bookmark in a corp hangar is the only way we can presently make others aware that this stuff is mine or this stuff is for pos fuel etc.. if you drop the placing of bookmarks in pos structures feature you will be gimping us severely
The ship warp speed is now displayed in the "Compare" tool
what compare tool ?
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Ancy Denaries
Caldari
The Confederate Navy
Forever Unbound
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Posted - 2009.09.18 09:18:00 -
[59]
Originally by: something somethingdark
The ship warp speed is now displayed in the "Compare" tool
what compare tool ?
Fail. It's under "variations" tab in "show info".
Anyways, response to the patch as a whole, I'm against lowering cloaking requirements, since cloaks are damn near ruining the game by now. Also, I'd like the skill "Survey" to actually do something useful, like, for instance, lower the cycle time on codebreakers, analysers, salvagers and whatnot. Make it USEFUL for us who actually did train it to 5.
Other than that, it looks okay ish. You do need to bring the warp points, stations and whatnot closer to planets/moons, because right now it's a lackluster warping to them.
-----
Why doesn't anyone ever read the forums before posting?
EVE is a game of adaptation and planning. Adapt or die. |
EveFairy0
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Posted - 2009.09.18 09:25:00 -
[60]
How about
Battleship lvl4 for Black Ops/Marauders/Capital ships
Capital ships lvl4 for Titans
Large turret lvl4 for T2 weapons?
I don't have those yet so pretty please? And if I'm trolling, why are you changing the prereq's of the other skills? Please make an exception and explain the changes for a change.
And buff mag sites, they're useless as it is. Also makes analyzer a bit useless. (Moar T2 salvage pls.)
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