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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 13 post(s) |
SXYGeeK
Gallente
do you
Mostly Harmless
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Posted - 2009.11.09 20:21:00 -
[1]
I've had a couple interesting issues testing a sov claim.
The system is X5-UME, I'm also testing in O-A6YN.
In X5 I dropped the only FLAG in the system and set it online on the 6th at around 03:30, I paid the maintenance fee at that time.
I logged back in a few hours after it was to have come online and found that I had a notification telling me the claim was acknowledged as of 15:37:00, I also found another maintenance fee waiting for me to pay (hope the double billing isn't intentional)
However the FLAG did not say online, its status was "Anchored" and the Sovereignty label in the top left system info said unclaimed, but if I opened the sov window it did say I had sov, and in the changes it did report my gaining sov at the correct time, however attempting to anchor a hub told me i didn't have sov.
I waited for DT and tried again the next day, the system showed sov correctly then and i was able to online the hub, however the FLAG still showed "Anchored"
Next I tried to elevate the indexes, I'll quote this...
 Originally by: CCP Sisyphus
Getting the military and industrial indices to increase is a lot of work. A lone person will not really make a dent.
You will need a minimum of two hulks stripmining to get anything at all on the industrial. And Be killing a lot of belt rats to get any military.
To get the higher levels (2,3,4) you will need to have already put in the early upgrades, and have a a fair few people spending their time playing there.
The index values decay.
I put one ship in each of the 5 belts in this system and tried chaining or killing everything that spawned, even ran the one anomaly site I had, I did this for hours killing well over 100 rats, and never had a smidgeon of anything show on the index.
by this time I had gotten sov and hub down in my second system (intending to test strategic upgrades such as bridges) and noticed that the FLAG said "online"
I'm wondering if the FLAG in X5 being in a bugged "Anchored" status could be messing with the index.
so I online it again, when I online it gave me a bill to pay, however when it finished online I did not get a second bill nor did I get a notification, but it does say "online now"
Now we are to this morning so I haven't done a push of ratting to see if this has made a difference.
Another thing I noticed claiming my second system is that the sov changes do not seem to be updating any more.
all that said, I would like to test some strategic upgrades, bridges and generators and things, I have everything in place, including the upgrades for "Advanced Logistics" I hauled out in a freighter, I just need the sov index elevated (obviously can't wait the 30 or 60 days or whatever) I'd love a hand with this, I have everything else prepared.
-We So SeXy |
SXYGeeK
Gallente
do you
Mostly Harmless
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Posted - 2009.11.09 20:27:00 -
[2]
Originally by: SXYGeeK
Another thing I noticed claiming my second system is that the sov changes do not seem to be updating any more.
It is updating on another account i have, maybe just the cache on my main isn't updating.
-We So SeXy |
SXYGeeK
Gallente
do you
Mostly Harmless
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Posted - 2009.11.11 00:22:00 -
[3]
I'm still having trouble in X5-UME.
I have run 6 or so anomolies and been killing every belt ran spawn for most of the day.
I have perhaps the redest system on the map for pirate kills, 312 now.
and not any movement at all in the military index.
-We So SeXy |
SXYGeeK
Gallente
do you
Mostly Harmless
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Posted - 2009.11.11 01:45:00 -
[4]
I have had 6 combat ships going at it killing rats since the server came back up.
over 560 npc kills, downed 14 anomolies, and killed everything spawning in the belts.
finaly i see a 7% of level 1.
realy if it where not for this mother load of anomolies that is somehow in my system this would be thuroughly impossible with teh 5 belts here.
perhaps the index is just a little tough for lvl 1?
-We So SeXy |
m0r3
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Posted - 2009.11.11 02:01:00 -
[5]
Edited by: m0r3 on 11/11/2009 02:02:15
I thought L1 was around 7 days of Sov and a fair bit of pushing in areas to gain more.
see: upgrading and upkeep of sovereign solar systems in dominion > http://www.eveonline.com/devblog.asp?a=blog&bid=711
edit:
I've also just noticed in deep reading the Military and Industry are based on activity.
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SXYGeeK
Gallente
do you
Mostly Harmless
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Posted - 2009.11.11 02:05:00 -
[6]
the problem I see though, is with systems with fewer belts it will be very dificult to raise to level 1 to get the first set of anomolies.
Ive done 16 anomolies along with belt ratting now and moved it 7%, if i didnt magicaly have 19 anomolies in this sytem i wouldnt have gotten it to move at all.
this is a solid days work with 6 combat ships.
is it realy going to take this much work to tick lvl 1 military index to get a couple anomolies. which btw are not paying very well at all.
-We So SeXy |
m0r3
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Posted - 2009.11.11 02:07:00 -
[7]
The only main difference I see from Test to Live is your self I gather is running these said 6 ships... where in a live server you'd have a corp/alliance all working together so the maths would be different.
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SXYGeeK
Gallente
do you
Mostly Harmless
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Posted - 2009.11.11 02:42:00 -
[8]
in live , 1 pilot can cover a 5 belt system, and kill every rat that spawn quickly.
6 is imense overkill, they mostly sit idle.
the limiting factor is not the number of people to work the system, but the number of rats the system spawns.
-We So SeXy |
SXYGeeK
Gallente
do you
Mostly Harmless
|
Posted - 2009.11.11 04:35:00 -
[9]
950 rats killed now, and %12 to level 1 military.
I seem to have Pirate Magnate level 4 upgrade in effect in my system right now, X5- in Fade.
if anyone wants to see how the anomolies work, it's kinda cool. I think with the new patch in effect the upgrade will stop working at downtime, so get out there tonight :P
It might be awhile before we get the system back up to this level of upgrades, (like 10,000 rat kills)
-We So SeXy |
SXYGeeK
Gallente
do you
Mostly Harmless
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Posted - 2009.11.11 20:37:00 -
[10]
something is definitely wrong here.
after killing almost 1000 rats yesterday and recieving only 12% on my military index i login today and it's back at 0.
so far today we have killed around 200 rats, belts and anomolies, and no movement in the index, it still shows a red down arrow.
something is just not right here. with these numbers it seems truely imposible to reach even level 1 military index, especialy in a system with only a few belts.
-We So SeXy |
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Professor Dumbledore
Amarr
GoonFleet
GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2009.11.12 01:53:00 -
[11]
i for one am shocked that this isn't working correctly.
:ccp:
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Yon Krum
The Knights Templar
R.A.G.E
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Posted - 2009.11.12 03:39:00 -
[12]
Ugh.
If all you say is "working as intended" regarding the rat kills/system and decay, then it is effectively impossible to bring systems with few belts up to even level 1 under the new system.
In fact, I question the ability for an alliance to maintain higher levels of military index even in systems they can bootstrap up. IF the anomalies respawn immediately, then it could be possible for a large group of players to cycle through them fast and rack up the ship kills, however it is not reasonable to expect to be able to do this all the time:
a) people get bored of this sort of play... many in 0.0 are there because they are bored of killing rats;
b) home defense activities and CTAs require the time of players that would be otherwise ratting to maintain an index; and,
c) few/no alliance has uniform TZ coverage, meaning that the CTA/HD above is more likely to affect the majority of players, if called during the active time.
Let me give some examples from Dotlan of active alliance's ratting performance:
* Delve [very large alliance], total rat kills 40,578 (non NPC space) for 85 systems (477 average), with 15 systems > 1000 kills, of which 2 systems > 1500 kills, of which 1 system > 2500 kills.
* Vale east [medium alliance] (mostly plexing), total rat kills 8,107 for 34 systems (234 average), with one system near 1000 kills (910).
* Vale west [medium-large alliance], total rat kills 15,449 for 53 systems (291 average), with 7 systems over 1000 kills (or just a tad under, in this case).
It is of course entirely possible to call a week-long CTA on the rats in a given system, but I question the effectiveness of doing so simply because of the spawn rates involved. There are not that many base plexes/anomalies in a system, and once run they are gone for good. You could chain whatever rats are present in belts, in order to attempt to get a higher respawn rate, but are still limited to an effective minimum of about 4-5 belts per player.
Assuming a spawn of 5 ships ever 15 minutes, that's 20 ships per hour per belt, or 300 ships for a midsized, 15-belt system per hour, or a maximum of 6,900 per day assuming you have complete coverage. For smaller systems (5 belts), you'd have a maximum of 2,300 ship kills per day.
-----
What I would suggest is that at least the level 1 military ship kills required scale according to the number of initial belts in a system. That is, figure out what a "medium belt #" rate is to get the system to level 1 (for the anom-generator), and adjust it to the systems with smaller or large numbers of belts. This would even be reasonable from the perspective of "securing" the space--it's easier to secure a smaller area (of belts).
After level 1, whether or not the numbers scale is less relevant, assuming that the system is no longer dependent on belt-rat kills to be maintained/increased.
--Krum
--Krum |
Blane Xero
Amarr
The Firestorm Cartel
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Posted - 2009.11.12 03:55:00 -
[13]
I'll say it once more- Every system in 0.0 needs a uniform three-form increase in belts. With a minimum of 12-15 in systems that either have less than that or none, and maybe a maximum of 40-50.
_____________________________________
Haruhiist since December 2008
Originally by: CCP Fallout
:facepalm:
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SXYGeeK
Gallente
do you
Mostly Harmless
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Posted - 2009.11.12 21:32:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Blane Xero
I'll say it once more- Every system in 0.0 needs a uniform three-form increase in belts. With a minimum of 12-15 in systems that either have less than that or none, and maybe a maximum of 40-50.
I have to disagree with more belts...
I think that the way the anomolies are working now on test server will allow for greater income than belt ratting to be had from high level anomolies. (in the sense that you will be able to support more people doing anomolies than belt ratting as the anomolies will respawn when killed off almost imidiately)
It would be nice however to have some upgrades that would boost the belts, to allow for folks that like that style of rattings to continue it.
-We So SeXy |
SXYGeeK
Gallente
do you
Mostly Harmless
|
Posted - 2009.11.12 21:37:00 -
[15]
Another update, I tried ratting in another system to see if it may have been a bug in my first system.
no movement in index after several hundred kills.
-We So SeXy |
MynChu NicAtoch
Eternity INC.
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Posted - 2009.11.12 23:15:00 -
[16]
I think the simplest solution is going to be to pay isk farmers to bring the level up to the point where it is worth doing. From there it should be self supporting.
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HeliosGal
Caldari
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Posted - 2009.11.12 23:52:00 -
[17]
it seems upgrading will be a 2-3 week process which given it takes 100 days to upgrade to level 5 as per the time for system upgrades thats fair enough
Signature - CCP what this game needs is more variance in PVE aspects and a little bit less PVP focus, more content more varied level 1-4 missions more than just 10 per faction high sec low sec and 00 |
SXYGeeK
Gallente
do you
Mostly Harmless
|
Posted - 2009.11.12 23:59:00 -
[18]
Originally by: HeliosGal
it seems upgrading will be a 2-3 week process which given it takes 100 days to upgrade to level 5 as per the time for system upgrades thats fair enough
most people are not going to cover thier belts with raters 23 hours a day.
I spent most of the day to get 12%, and it was gone after a nights sleep.
sure it doesn't need to be achieved in a day, but don't wipe out the index faster than it was earned with decay.
-We So SeXy |
HeliosGal
Caldari
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Posted - 2009.11.13 00:39:00 -
[19]
my guess is ccp will make tweaks i expect antoher major bugfix, post dominions rebalancing patch before xmas and then the comets and planetary ring mining and other pirate faction missions before end of jan
Signature - CCP what this game needs is more variance in PVE aspects and a little bit less PVP focus, more content more varied level 1-4 missions more than just 10 per faction high sec low sec and 00 |
Kanatta Jing
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Posted - 2009.11.13 00:39:00 -
[20]
Edited by: Kanatta Jing on 13/11/2009 00:39:38
Originally by: MynChu NicAtoch
I think the simplest solution is going to be to pay isk farmers to bring the level up to the point where it is worth doing. From there it should be self supporting.
Hiring a ratter alliance to help beef up all of your systems for you?
"Welcome to Hansons Roughratters, Here is your battlecruiser here are the T1 fittings for it, do not leave the constellation, work singly or in pairs, don't talk in local or we'll pod you and enjoy your stay."
Makes sense.
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HeliosGal
Caldari
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Posted - 2009.11.13 02:28:00 -
[21]
well either that or ratting alts. But its all about getting more peeps into 00 more pew pew lots of small roaming gangs etc. ccp wants to populate it so this is the new order
Signature - CCP what this game needs is more variance in PVE aspects and a little bit less PVP focus, more content more varied level 1-4 missions more than just 10 per faction high sec low sec and 00 |
Avatoin
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Posted - 2009.11.13 04:44:00 -
[22]
Well if CCP wanted more people to get into 0.0 than this would sure do it. But based on the evidence that SXYGeek is presenting it appears that the spawn rate of plexes and belt rats in insufficient to justify a major increase in people.
CCP will need to reduce the rate of decay (because losing a days worth of work in a good nights sleep is WAY too fast). And increase the spawn rate (or even the size of rat groups) in belts to compensate.
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Mara Rinn
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Posted - 2009.11.13 07:07:00 -
[23]
Do PvP kills count towards Military activity index?
[Aussie players: join channel ANZAC] |
SXYGeeK
Gallente
do you
Mostly Harmless
|
Posted - 2009.11.13 22:43:00 -
[24]
After the patch today I gave it another shot.
3 ships ratting as fast as spawns would come and doing 2 anomolies. close to 300 kills.
no movement on the military index.
-We So SeXy |
HeliosGal
Caldari
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Posted - 2009.11.13 23:24:00 -
[25]
mmm so even with maxed out activity it hardly budges. Im wondering if constellation activity levels are also counted but yes seems strange that systems with 2 or even no belts arent going to be worth touching ( unless anamoly and deadspace rat kill levels are counted as well) then it might be something and with grav belts in known space the rats respawn every 20 minutes or so
Signature - CCP what this game needs is more variance in PVE aspects and a little bit less PVP focus, more content more varied level 1-4 missions more than just 10 per faction high sec low sec and 00 |
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CCP Sisyphus
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Posted - 2009.11.14 12:30:00 -
[26]
Originally by: SXYGeeK
After the patch today I gave it another shot.
3 ships ratting as fast as spawns would come and doing 2 anomolies. close to 300 kills.
no movement on the military index.
howdy.
Yes, we looked at this, and have given a boost to generated points when you havn't reached lvl1 yet. But you say you didn't get any movement after the patch - can you give me a system name and who were the characters involved - I'd like to check the lgos and see if we can tweak the numbers a little.
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Venkul Mul
Gallente
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Posted - 2009.11.14 14:45:00 -
[27]
Originally by: HeliosGal
mmm so even with maxed out activity it hardly budges. Im wondering if constellation activity levels are also counted but yes seems strange that systems with 2 or even no belts arent going to be worth touching ( unless anamoly and deadspace rat kill levels are counted as well) then it might be something and with grav belts in known space the rats respawn every 20 minutes or so
I really hope anomaly and deadspace rat kill levels are counted, seeing as the belt rats will not upgrade (at least in the current version of the system).
If they are counted upgrading a low belt system can increase its worth tenfold or even more (literally, 2 belts vs 10 ever respawning anomalies).
If they aren't it will be impossible to upgrade a system with a low number of belts.
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CCP Sisyphus
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Posted - 2009.11.14 14:54:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Venkul Mul
I really hope anomaly and deadspace rat kill levels are counted, seeing as the belt rats will not upgrade (at least in the current version of the system).
Any NPC shot in the system, by anyone, will count.
Same with industrial index, any ore will count.
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Cheekything
Gallente
Fallen Angel's
Blade.
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Posted - 2009.11.14 15:08:00 -
[29]
Curious but how are we meant to get these indexes when most systems have very few belts.
More anoms, higher spawn rates?
This is of course without the upgrades from the sov.
Do CCP have plans to increase the belts ingame?
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Gnulpie
Minmatar
Miner Tech
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Posted - 2009.11.14 15:23:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Cheekything
Curious but how are we meant to get these indexes when most systems have very few belts.
More anoms, higher spawn rates?
This is of course without the upgrades from the sov.
Do CCP have plans to increase the belts ingame?
Hopefully not!
Some systems should have inherent much better potential than other systems!
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