What about WH caps?!

We lose all that money D:

Its like receiving cash for blowing up my own car.

No insurance company would even consider giving you money for that.

I was thinking something similar Chribba, but not quite the same. Lowsec, Null, and wormholes are suppose to be dark harsh places, empire not as much but still dark and harsh.

So ya can loose your ship in Highsec and get a refund. Lowsec you risked and lost and the insurance company is penalizing the pay out for that extra risk. Nullsec you have a corp and alliance and the insurance company isn't going to risk any money out there in the wilds.

So the actual figures might come out something like this.

1. Highsec hull reimbursement at current insurance prices.
2. Lowsec 50% of hull reimbursement at current insurance prices
3. Nullsec/WH 0% of hull reimbursement at current insurance prices.
4. no insurance on SD irrespective of location in space.

What about WH caps?!

We lose all that money D:

I was thinking something similar Chribba, but not quite the same. Lowsec, Null, and wormholes are suppose to be dark harsh places, empire not as much but still dark and harsh.

So ya can loose your ship in Highsec and get a refund. Lowsec you risked and lost and the insurance company is penalizing the pay out for that extra risk. Nullsec you have a corp and alliance and the insurance company isn't going to risk any money out there in the wilds.

So the actual figures might come out something like this.

1. Highsec hull reimbursement at current insurance prices.
2. Lowsec 50% of hull reimbursement at current insurance prices
3. Nullsec/WH 0% of hull reimbursement at current insurance prices.
4. no insurance on SD irrespective of location in space.

In this case, the black box of the ship would record that SD was activated, so unless you have a friend that loots the black box from the wreck, the insurance company would know you activated SD.

Why not remove insurance completely... make EVE that dark harsh place it is. Also it's not fair that supercaps cannot insure their ships - and ofc even more unfair that the base payout for a titan is like 650m...

/c

EVE insurance is an isk fountain anyway just plain remove it. Eve insurers would have gone bust one billion times over as there premiums would never cover the pay outs. CCP should remove NPC insurance company's and allow insurances company's to become player run. SO no you can't insure your combat ship any more. High sec bears in orca's and freighters would probably still be able to get insured by an other player.

It's a pity that what the insurance pays is tied to the mineral index...oh wait did I just say that?

So it could be exploited like the FW LP?

Why not remove insurance completely... make EVE that dark harsh place it is. Also it's not fair that supercaps cannot insure their ships - and ofc even more unfair that the base payout for a titan is like 650m...

/c

I was thinking something similar Chribba, but not quite the same. Lowsec, Null, and wormholes are suppose to be dark harsh places, empire not as much but still dark and harsh.

So ya can loose your ship in Highsec and get a refund. Lowsec you risked and lost and the insurance company is penalizing the pay out for that extra risk. Nullsec you have a corp and alliance and the insurance company isn't going to risk any money out there in the wilds.

So the actual figures might come out something like this.

1. Highsec hull reimbursement at current insurance prices.
2. Lowsec 50% of hull reimbursement at current insurance prices
3. Nullsec/WH 0% of hull reimbursement at current insurance prices.
4. no insurance on SD irrespective of location in space.

The time limit where it "runs out" is a disincentive to be a competent pilot and not lose your ships.

Being Concorded no longer gives your insurance - a step in the right direction.

If you purposely self-destruct your ship you shouldn't receive insurance. It simply doesn't make sense.

Its like receiving cash for blowing up my own car.

No insurance company would even consider giving you money for that.

In this case, the black box of the ship would record that SD was activated, so unless you have a friend that loots the black box from the wreck, the insurance company would know you activated SD.

Why not remove insurance completely... make EVE that dark harsh place it is. Also it's not fair that supercaps cannot insure their ships - and ofc even more unfair that the base payout for a titan is like 650m...

/c

Why not remove insurance completely... make EVE that dark harsh place it is. Also it's not fair that supercaps cannot insure their ships - and ofc even more unfair that the base payout for a titan is like 650m...
/c

Remove the ability to self-destruct would seem to be the best solution.

If self-destruct actually caused area of effect damage to other ships there might be a valid reason for retaining it but it doesn't so there isn't.

Get rid of self-destruct.

So you get pointed in the middle of no where, say, in your pod. And you have no way of self destructing, and now these bad people can hold you there for hours. See a problem?

It would also suck to get stuck in a wormhole system with no probes and no friends. You should always have the option of putting a gun to your head.
If that option results in a killmail, no insurance, a loot-drop, a nice AOE fireball, or a mark-of-shame on your character, that is one thing. But getting rid of self-destruct entirely is not really an option, for reasons such as those mentioned above.

EVE insurance is an isk fountain anyway just plain remove it. Eve insurers would have gone bust one billion times over as there premiums would never cover the pay outs. CCP should remove NPC insurance company's and allow insurances company's to become player run. SO no you can't insure your combat ship any more. High sec bears in orca's and freighters would probably still be able to get insured by an other player.

I can't recall the last time I insured a ship. So this is ok with me. But I wonder how hard this would hurt the newer players?

It would also suck to get stuck in a wormhole system with no probes and no friends. You should always have the option of putting a gun to your head.
If that option results in a killmail, no insurance, a loot-drop, a nice AOE fireball, or a mark-of-shame on your character, that is one thing. But getting rid of self-destruct entirely is not really an option, for reasons such as those mentioned above.

This was suggested ages ago when people were still self-destructing to MAKE money off of a ship.

It was also pointed out that if SD'ing didn't pay out insurance, people would just blow up their own ship with an alt.

I was thinking something similar Chribba, but not quite the same. Lowsec, Null, and wormholes are suppose to be dark harsh places, empire not as much but still dark and harsh.

So ya can loose your ship in Highsec and get a refund. Lowsec you risked and lost and the insurance company is penalizing the pay out for that extra risk. Nullsec you have a corp and alliance and the insurance company isn't going to risk any money out there in the wilds.

So the actual figures might come out something like this.

1. Highsec hull reimbursement at current insurance prices.
2. Lowsec 50% of hull reimbursement at current insurance prices
3. Nullsec/WH 0% of hull reimbursement at current insurance prices.
4. no insurance on SD irrespective of location in space.

it should give you at least the money you payed for the insurance since it is now invalid. lol

I don't get why this is such a hot topic. Ever hear of scuttling? We destroy ships in our time for tactical reasons or others, and I'm sure as hell that idea would still live on in the future.

that's a poor excuse, removing self destruct from ships isn't the same as removing it from your pod.

I mean I'm willing to hear why ships should be able to self destruct. I think it would be awesome if you could come across empty ships in wormhole space to steal, since the players had to jump out and self destruct his pod.


what do you think?

Just get rid off any insurance altogether - it always has been a flawed mechanic and doesn't fit with eve.

Also, lol about idiots being butthurt about how they didn't get a little picture card to show around.

The other guy lost his ship - and nothing else matters.

i agree, only members of super rich alliances should be able to afford to lose ships

i agree, only members of super rich alliances should be able to afford to lose ships

how about removing all profitable PvE from hisec first

The problem with removing insurance is you completely lose the safety net for newer players. Insurance as it exists prevents someone from losing that first battlecruiser and ragequitting because they just watched a month of PVE go down the drain. Insurance softens the blow and lets them keep going.

Now if you want to void insurance on PVP, fine. But don't gut the new player experience just because experienced players can get by without it.

Self-destructing should not yield insurance. How many noobs do you see self-destructing their ships?

Another +1 for removing Insurance entirely, but especially in the case of Self Destruct.

Further more regarding Self Destruct, make it a means for people to potentially capture ships.

* As soon as you activate SD, your pod is ejected from the ship.
* Hacking Mod can be used to shut off a SD timer and pass ownership to the Hacker.

It would also suck to get stuck in a wormhole system with no probes and no friends. You should always have the option of putting a gun to your head.
If that option results in a killmail, no insurance, a loot-drop, a nice AOE fireball, or a mark-of-shame on your character, that is one thing. But getting rid of self-destruct entirely is not really an option, for reasons such as those mentioned above.

Not the craziest idea I've ever heard. And I hear a lot of crazy ideas. Some of them I even come up with myself.

If that did happen, you would not see any complaints about self destructs

You guys know Navys in real life used to scuttle there vessels if they were doomed to lose them to prevent them from being captured right? Just think of self destructing a valid way or robbing your enemy of a kill mail, ye olde style.

I might have a solution to the problem that I thought of when I was watching the Alliance panel and one of the devs was talking about the upcoming contract changes.


Insurance should be a service that's run the same way insurance is run in real life. The monthly price should be based off location, type of vehicle, and "driver" record, with a deductible. Lower deductible means higher premiums. Pilots who self-destruct can get a payout, but it adds a point to their record for 3 months. 3 points, and they aren't able to get insurance, or their premium is extremely high. Deductible is optional by the way, if you don't pay it then your risk doesn't go up but you don't get the payout.

Think DUI before you're 25 years old insurance prices.

Also, the payout should be tallied every 3 months taking into account your sec status, risk (k/d ratio), points on your record, etc, with the option to add in an extra amount of ISK that would get repaid to you, but also causes your premiums to go up. This could then cover the loss of faction modules and fittings if you so desire.


SECOND PART:

By modifying the current contract system you can give us players the ability to start our own insurance corporations. This would allow player-run corps to insure capitals, and a modified contract system would allow first ask the insured party if they wish to pay the deductible, then it would automatically pay out the previously defined amount. It would also allow the insurance corp to set breach of contract stipulations:

• Self-destruction outside of a wormhole for instance - it can use the killmail's details of the location and add to risk points based on this (wormhole might be ok for self-destruct, but get a 20% reduced payout or something),
• Destruction in an off-limits system (allows the company to set higher premiums for low/null-sec dwellers)
• etc ... Idunno - we'll have to wait and see what they come up with in the new contracts system...

Oh, and here's another thought - for new players that are very risk-averse, we can have the ability to replace your t1 frigate and cruiser class ship, complete with any t1 modules and weapons, at the lowest station price at select hub highsec locations (where an ample supply are stocked).

This would do a couple things - it would allow n00bs the chance to get out and fight and die without as much worry, and it would promote the sale of the covered items in the locations provided. Just a thought

So... CCP sets up a full lossmail board for all pilots -- showing how many losses to NPC's as well as to players?

You'd need to know how many ships are being lost and to what type of attacks for players to provide insurance and "trust" isn't all that hot a gig for most EVE players.

I think the shock-value of seeing all those NPC losses would be funny. Gankers no longer hiding their failures, the mass amount of mission and plex runner losses... Yeah, having that published would be a bit funny and data-mining it would probably show a radically different view of how "safe" PvE is vs PvP.

Do you see them getting money from any insurance agency for doing that?

You guys know Navys in real life used to scuttle there vessels if they were doomed to lose them to prevent them from being captured right? Just think of self destructing a valid way or robbing your enemy of a kill mail, ye olde style.

Scuttling denied loot, not credit for the destruction of the ship.

that's a poor excuse, removing self destruct from ships isn't the same as removing it from your pod.

I mean I'm willing to hear why ships should be able to self destruct. I think it would be awesome if you could come across empty ships in wormhole space to steal, since the players had to jump out and self destruct his pod.


what do you think?

Killed by a Guristas station torp, opps~

It would make hacking even more useful. Interesting idea to say the least.

It would also suck to get stuck in a wormhole system with no probes and no friends. You should always have the option of putting a gun to your head.

That can be seen as "You should always be able to SD your pod". It does not mean you should be able to SD your ship. We could just replace the self-destruct menu item with "Commit suicide".

As funny as that is, lets not put that into the game.

The only way to do this would be with full disclosure of all losses. It also doesn't take into account the "here's a ship, go get it blown up" training missions.

So... CCP sets up a full lossmail board for all pilots -- showing how many losses to NPC's as well as to players?

You'd need to know how many ships are being lost and to what type of attacks for players to provide insurance and "trust" isn't all that hot a gig for most EVE players.

I think the shock-value of seeing all those NPC losses would be funny. Gankers no longer hiding their failures, the mass amount of mission and plex runner losses... Yeah, having that published would be a bit funny and data-mining it would probably show a radically different view of how "safe" PvE is vs PvP.

Self-destruct is fine.

The real problem is that people care far too much about killmails.

"Wow, I'm so impressed how you participated in killing a ship in EVE Online, now I want to sleep with you!" - said no one ever

Killmails are great. They serve as reminders of good fights (or dubious mistakes). They let you measure losses inflicted on your enemy in cold hard ISK. They also demonstrate some interesting choices in ship fitting, or cargo-movement attempts. If you're so inclined, they provide a way to track your kill/death ratio, and measure it against your peers.

For the Inferno 1.2 release, we've modified the self-destruct mechanics a little. These changes are now live on the Singularity test server. You can go and try them for yourself, and leave feedback in this thread.


Loot Drops
Ships that self-destruct will now drop loot in their wreck. This follows the regular chance-based loot-drop mechanics for items fitted to the ship and carried in the cargo hold.


Kill Reports
Ships that self-destruct whilst under aggression will now generate a regular kill-report. In order for this to happen, the ship must have been recently aggressed, and there must be at least one of the aggressors in space in the system at the time of death. The final-blow will be awarded to the eligible attacker who inflicted the most damage.

Self-destructs that do not involve player aggression will not generate a kill-report


By the way, you may have seen reports of the occasional self-destruct kill-report on Tranquility recently. These were caused by an unrelated defect, and were not intentional. Typically the items list of such mails is incomplete. I'm stating this in-advance, as no doubt someone would have asked about it.

From https://t.co/EaNYwX67:

Not a change to insurance, but behold at change to self-destruct mechanics.

Now those who get themselves in deep trouble can not longer coward their way out.

All hail the Masterplan!

As funny as that is, lets not put that into the game.

If you live in a wormhole and worrying about a insurance payment from self-destructing capital, you are doing it wrong.

yeah let's further punish people for living in nullsec

how about removing all profitable PvE from hisec first

Can I get some of these insurence agents in my indy corp? These guys go into nul, wormhiles, wherever just to verify a ship blew up, and yet we never see them. Their skills must be amazing. So must be their cloaky t3 ships. How else could they do their job?

In other words, the assumption that spaceship insurance works in a manner similar to car insurance on earth. Why assume so? Why try to force a real world concept on a game, especially when the concept doesn't match. It would be far closer to marine insurance to begin with. Or maybe a completely different system. Maybe when you purchase a ship, some of the tax is.invested in a special insurance fund at a high return rate? Or it's just a complex scam? Who knows, but it would not be comparable to car insurance.