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Emperor Cheney Celebrity Sex Tape	Posted - 2010.12.23 00:34:00 - [91] Originally by: youknow who Your trying to treat a symtom rather than the cause. As others and yourself have said, people dont like to lose ships. Why? Ask yourself, why do you hate losing ships? Is it because your a bad loser? Is it because you dont have the time between work to get a replacement's? Is it getting the ships out where you need them that grinds your gears? Are you really that lazy? Nope thought not, so why do most of us go into PVP wanting to solo and yet end up baiting, blobbing, hotdropping, kiting etc? Most will hate the answer. Its killmail's and killboards. Every decent pvp corp ive been in or applied to checks me out on battleclinic to see if my kill death ratio is any good. Every corp insists i submit every killmail whilst i'm a member, even solo kills which have nothing to do with them. So many times i've seen good players in corps make a couple of daft mistakes, lose ships, and then get booted for spoiling the corp/alliances killboard ratio. Everyone seems obsessed with them. And if that wasn't enough people see fit to try and publically humiliate others by posting "comedy/failfit" loss's on forums/local chat. Sometime's its smack sometimes its not. And what do killboards really do anyhow? we all know they never tell the story of each fight, thus anyone can look an asshat or a hero at times. Remote repair anyone? Imagine if WOW, SWG or any other mmorpg had a killmail system. Who wants a mail for every wizard you slapped senseless? Who gives a dam what he was wearing and how much damage i did, he died i didn't. You really think all those Warriors would be so keen to charge into clumps of other players if they were judged on how many times they died or what their "fit" is? Can you imagine how sad you would look posting and lol'ing at some of the hundreds of dwarf kills you have? Its pleasing and rather soothing to know that in about 2 months time every Pvp'er in the game will be beaten by a can flipper according to battleclinic, proving once and for all that killmails/killboards and all of the effort that goes into them is pointless and, i'd argue prohibitive to many pvp engagements. So many times i've listened to FC's on vent who are able to work out the outcome of a 20v20 engagement before it happens and if its not in our favour, bottle it because it'll make the killboard look bad. Honestly, how many times have you seen that happen for the reason discussed? Completely agreed. But, what causes people to focus on killmails? I believe it's the lack of any other meaningful metric. Eve is supposed to be a game about harsh, cold isk-grubbing hypercapitalist dystopia. But ISK, for players, is almost free, and that's playing legitimately. RMT, evil as it is, is in fact the only motivator for anyone to play this game past their own ISK needs. So without needing to take territory or income lines, or without trying to avoid combat, it becomes EVEBOWL: Arena, and how do you measure Arena games? Kills versus losses. Killmails are messed up, but the ease of making isk is, I believe, the root of the problem. Effectively free PVP ships means effectively meaningless PVP actions, unless one becomes a killmail *****. And that's the situation we have today.
Drakarin Gallente Absentia Libertas Solus	Posted - 2010.12.23 00:43:00 - [92] Finding the root of the problem was the easy part. How the hell do you correct such a huge issue when there are individuals out there with hundreds of billions and even trillions of isk? So rich that losing a titan to them would feel as bad as me losing a decently fit battleship. Something seriously just wrong with that picture. Too many people have too many damn ships. The only way I can see fixing it is increasing the time it takes to make ships. That and increase the resources necessary too. The biggest factor in rising the prices is time though. This would simply mean that the demand would be equal or greater than the supply, which would rise prices very fast, meaning even ultra rich would feel the sting a bit after a loss or two. As well, REMOVE INSURANCE! I know it's not the biggest factor here, but it does contribute to a lot more isk being in the game, and does not fit in with the "cruel and harsh" atmosphere that EvE is always advertised on. No sane insurance company would keep someone who has lost 1,000 interstellar hyperbattleships insured FOR THE SAME PRICE as when they got their first one.
Ephemeron Solitairian Society	Posted - 2010.12.23 00:45:00 - [93] I must admit that the last alliance I was in kicked me out and banned me from joining all northern alliances because I lost a faction fit Nightmare while flying solo, a ship I bought using my own isk. There is indeed some unhealthy focus on killboard stats.
Mr Epeen	Posted - 2010.12.23 01:17:00 - [94] Baiting is hardly the cancer. I spend a lot of time baiting and have been for some years now. After all the practice and sweat I have honed it to a fine art. You might say that I am now a... Master baiter. Mr Epeen
Bluespot85	Posted - 2010.12.23 01:17:00 - [95] Originally by: youknow who Your trying to treat a symtom rather than the cause. As others and yourself have said, people dont like to lose ships. Why? Ask yourself, why do you hate losing ships? Is it because your a bad loser? Is it because you dont have the time between work to get a replacement's? Is it getting the ships out where you need them that grinds your gears? Are you really that lazy? Nope thought not, so why do most of us go into PVP wanting to solo and yet end up baiting, blobbing, hotdropping, kiting etc? Most will hate the answer. Its killmail's and killboards. Every decent pvp corp ive been in or applied to checks me out on battleclinic to see if my kill death ratio is any good. Every corp insists i submit every killmail whilst i'm a member, even solo kills which have nothing to do with them. So many times i've seen good players in corps make a couple of daft mistakes, lose ships, and then get booted for spoiling the corp/alliances killboard ratio. Everyone seems obsessed with them. And if that wasn't enough people see fit to try and publically humiliate others by posting "comedy/failfit" loss's on forums/local chat. Sometime's its smack sometimes its not. And what do killboards really do anyhow? we all know they never tell the story of each fight, thus anyone can look an asshat or a hero at times. Remote repair anyone? Imagine if WOW, SWG or any other mmorpg had a killmail system. Who wants a mail for every wizard you slapped senseless? Who gives a dam what he was wearing and how much damage i did, he died i didn't. You really think all those Warriors would be so keen to charge into clumps of other players if they were judged on how many times they died or what their "fit" is? Can you imagine how sad you would look posting and lol'ing at some of the hundreds of dwarf kills you have? Its pleasing and rather soothing to know that in about 2 months time every Pvp'er in the game will be beaten by a can flipper according to battleclinic, proving once and for all that killmails/killboards and all of the effort that goes into them is pointless and, i'd argue prohibitive to many pvp engagements. So many times i've listened to FC's on vent who are able to work out the outcome of a 20v20 engagement before it happens and if its not in our favour, bottle it because it'll make the killboard look bad. Honestly, how many times have you seen that happen for the reason discussed? +1 Think we got a winner here Jonny
Artemis Rose Clandestine Vector	Posted - 2010.12.23 09:59:00 - [96] Confirming all people who bait shouldn't do that, but they should all travel in one solid formation everywhere they go. That would improve solo PvP immensely.... *** Currently Playing: Trolls from Outer Space Current Equipment: VISAcard chain mail, +2 Amulet of Epic Whine, Self Banstick +2 WTB: +666 E-peen killboard stats
Geanos Phoenix Tribe	Posted - 2010.12.23 12:30:00 - [97] Edited by: Geanos on 23/12/2010 12:31:08 Originally by: youknow who Its killmail's and killboards. Some time ago I said that this problem would be solved by removing victim's name/corporation/alliance from the killmail and transferring the focus from loss to win. This should make people concentrate on getting more fights/fun rather than avoiding fights (and nasty comments) until they are 100% they can win (blob). This is why in EVE, you usually need to spend a lot of time to get some PVP making it a unpopular among people not willing to spend hours just to get a few fights. Making the killboard look like a person's CV where you put in the strong/positive aspects (kills) and no negative aspects (losses) would encourage people to take more risks and PVP more. edit: spelling
Mathhew Kane Minmatar Gradient Electus Matari	Posted - 2010.12.23 13:08:00 - [98] I just realized something. Each and every person here who claims that getting kills while in a fleet is a lazy (insert insult here) carebear, got their asses handed to them BY a fleet. Truestory bro. The only people who "solo pvp" anymore are the pirates who don't fail, the noobs and the soon to be ganked. In any fight, if you aren't going to do anything it takes to win, then stfu when you die in a splatter of emo tears because the other person wasn't "honorable" enough to honor a one v one. -------------------------------------------------- Loyalty is simply slavery of ones own choosing. If ever you have the choice, Choose your master well." My Step Father, Isikile Kane.
Portmanteau Fumar Puede Matar	Posted - 2010.12.23 13:15:00 - [99] Originally by: FACLON ALT Originally by: Kahega Amielden Quote: Its killmail's and killboards. Came in here to post this, pleasantly surprised to see that it's already been posted. People are KM *****s. I wouldn't be sad to see the entire KM system go. +1 +2
Portmanteau Fumar Puede Matar	Posted - 2010.12.23 13:21:00 - [100] Originally by: Geanos Edited by: Geanos on 23/12/2010 12:31:08 Originally by: youknow who Its killmail's and killboards. Some time ago I said that this problem would be solved by removing victim's name/corporation/alliance from the killmail and transferring the focus from loss to win. This should make people concentrate on getting more fights/fun rather than avoiding fights (and nasty comments) until they are 100% they can win (blob). This is why in EVE, you usually need to spend a lot of time to get some PVP making it a unpopular among people not willing to spend hours just to get a few fights. Making the killboard look like a person's CV where you put in the strong/positive aspects (kills) and no negative aspects (losses) would encourage people to take more risks and PVP more. edit: spelling that's only half the job. while removing the embarrassment factor may encourage more fights, this will not DISCOURAGE blobbing to hoover up KMs and minimize losses, complete removal of KMs would. Ofc CCP could revamp the KM system and internalize it adding ur "nameless" mails and SEVERELY penalizing blob mails on scoring while rewarding 1v1 etc. Altho this has a downside in that it penalizes scoring on "even" fleet engagements, so I prefer just removing them altogether
Diesel47	Posted - 2010.12.23 14:16:00 - [101] Edited by: Diesel47 on 23/12/2010 14:20:58 Originally by: MatrixSkye Mk2 Originally by: Diesel47 Edited by: Diesel47 on 22/12/2010 14:04:26 Originally by: MatrixSkye Mk2 Originally by: Diesel47 The problem is cowards have ventured into the game who only fight in blobs. Most likely carebears who try to pvp. And I'll just add that "PVPers" that kill industrial and PVE-fit ships aren't cowards at all. They're just smart. Carebears that only fight on their terms, on the other hand, as you say, are cowards. No double standard here at all. Wardeccing industrial and PVE corps is cowardly also, what are you talking about? What I am talking about is if you're going to throw carebears under the bus for fighting on their own terms then be prepared to throw the OP, and pretty much every pirate and PVPer out there under the bus for doing the exact same thing. The OP is falling into traps by taking bait, which are probably seemingly lone defenseless ships he feels he can take on easily. Where is your criticism for his cowardice? . When a carebear minimizes his risk he's a coward. When a PVPer minimizes risk, well, that is just sound common sense. Why would you want to Minimize risk when pvping? The entire fun of solo pvp is the risk, notice how test server pvp is rather lame? It is lame because you have an infinite supply of ships in the station, you don't lose anything of value, no risk. Sure you should fit your ship accordingly and don't engage in unfair fights (2v1, 300mil faction ship vs t1 cruiser, etc) but getting in a fleet of 20 gank battlecruisers so you can get the chance to shoot maybe once at a baited target is cowardly, nor is it even fun. When I look for a fight I look for fights that seem fair and are of the same ship class. (Show info, see age and try to determine whether SP matches mine..) The reason is because when you have an even fight then it is when you have real fun, only reason I play EvE honestly. Why would I even waste my precious sec status over killing a rifter in a BC? Originally by: Trader Gandry Give me one good reason as why I would risk losing a fight if I have the means to make sure I win it. Honor? Glory? Both meaningless terms when it comes to achieving certain objectives for a group of people. I don't do 1 vs 1 for the simple reason that a fight should cost my opponent and not me. It all boils down to costeffectiveness and that's where it starts. This is exactly the coward mindset ^^ Keep in mind you are playing a game, not running a business. Cost effectiveness? This is a game. Why would you risk losing a fight if you can blob? The point of solo PvP, or GAMES in general is to test/challenge yourself. You test your skill choices, you test your ship fittings, and you test your pilot skill. If you do not play a game for these reasons then you are doing it wrong. When you play a 1v1 soccer game or something... do you bring 20 friends to make sure you always win? No. FYI EvE is a game.
Joe Skellington Minmatar JOKAS Industries Apocalypse Now.	Posted - 2010.12.23 15:42:00 - [102] I'm all for a one on one fight, too bad most people that pvp in EVE are pussies in that regard.
Skex Relbore Gallente Red Federation	Posted - 2010.12.23 16:34:00 - [103] What a bunch crybaby bs. Baiting is not a problem. Killmails are not a problem. Everything is working as intended. PVP in EVE is a team sport. The art of PVP is getting an enemy to engage you thinking that the terms of battle are favorable to them while in reality those terms are favorable to you. Bait is just one way of crafting the terms of the engagement in your favor. As far as killmails go. Those are your resume. They in general show how good you are at PVP. Syre they don't show everything, for instance a good support pilot won't automatically have great stats but competent leaders understand that. But for your general grunt they can give you a quick read on how a pilot might perform. It can also tell you what kind of engagements they've favored it can tell you how they fit and give you some idea on how to educate them. I find people like the OP really annoying. They can't figure out how to succeed in their chosen playstyle so instead of adapting or simply admitting that they suck they come here and whine to get CCP to change the game to accommodate them. Learn to craft the field of battle to your favor. learn how to break up the blob, The good soloers do this they spring the trap then use their opponents over eagerness to separate the undisciplined from their blob and kill them while their support is still en-route. Get them to chase you different ships align and warp at different rates not all gangs are made up of pilots of equal skills, A little luck and that single frig will land far enough ahead of his fleet that you can kill him before his buddies catch up. You can double back and get the stragglers. The problem people like the OP has is that they think PVP is about ship to ship combat when it's really about out thinking your opponent. The objective isn't just to destroy the enemy ship it's to beat the enemies mind. Not simply out gun them but to out think them.
Joe Skellington Minmatar JOKAS Industries Apocalypse Now.	Posted - 2010.12.23 16:51:00 - [104] I take it you've done this before :) Great points you have here, the real challenge is being able to do things like this. A properly fit ship, willpower and a little know how should make things fun eh? Originally by: Skex Relbore What a bunch crybaby bs. Baiting is not a problem. Killmails are not a problem. Everything is working as intended. PVP in EVE is a team sport. The art of PVP is getting an enemy to engage you thinking that the terms of battle are favorable to them while in reality those terms are favorable to you. Bait is just one way of crafting the terms of the engagement in your favor. As far as killmails go. Those are your resume. They in general show how good you are at PVP. Syre they don't show everything, for instance a good support pilot won't automatically have great stats but competent leaders understand that. But for your general grunt they can give you a quick read on how a pilot might perform. It can also tell you what kind of engagements they've favored it can tell you how they fit and give you some idea on how to educate them. I find people like the OP really annoying. They can't figure out how to succeed in their chosen playstyle so instead of adapting or simply admitting that they suck they come here and whine to get CCP to change the game to accommodate them. Learn to craft the field of battle to your favor. learn how to break up the blob, The good soloers do this they spring the trap then use their opponents over eagerness to separate the undisciplined from their blob and kill them while their support is still en-route. Get them to chase you different ships align and warp at different rates not all gangs are made up of pilots of equal skills, A little luck and that single frig will land far enough ahead of his fleet that you can kill him before his buddies catch up. You can double back and get the stragglers. The problem people like the OP has is that they think PVP is about ship to ship combat when it's really about out thinking your opponent. The objective isn't just to destroy the enemy ship it's to beat the enemies mind. Not simply out gun them but to out think them.
Exordium8 Minmatar Universal Independence Test Alliance Please Ignore	Posted - 2010.12.23 17:08:00 - [105] Originally by: Portmanteau Originally by: FACLON ALT Originally by: Kahega Amielden Quote: Its killmail's and killboards. Came in here to post this, pleasantly surprised to see that it's already been posted. People are KM *****s. I wouldn't be sad to see the entire KM system go. +1 +2 +3 --------------------------------- Pillage, then burn. Everything is air-droppable at least once. There is no 'overkill.' There is only 'open fire' and 'time to reload.
Diesel47	Posted - 2010.12.23 17:11:00 - [106] Originally by: Skex Relbore What a bunch crybaby bs. Baiting is not a problem. Killmails are not a problem. Everything is working as intended. PVP in EVE is a team sport. The art of PVP is getting an enemy to engage you thinking that the terms of battle are favorable to them while in reality those terms are favorable to you. Bait is just one way of crafting the terms of the engagement in your favor. As far as killmails go. Those are your resume. They in general show how good you are at PVP. Syre they don't show everything, for instance a good support pilot won't automatically have great stats but competent leaders understand that. But for your general grunt they can give you a quick read on how a pilot might perform. It can also tell you what kind of engagements they've favored it can tell you how they fit and give you some idea on how to educate them. I find people like the OP really annoying. They can't figure out how to succeed in their chosen playstyle so instead of adapting or simply admitting that they suck they come here and whine to get CCP to change the game to accommodate them. Learn to craft the field of battle to your favor. learn how to break up the blob, The good soloers do this they spring the trap then use their opponents over eagerness to separate the undisciplined from their blob and kill them while their support is still en-route. Get them to chase you different ships align and warp at different rates not all gangs are made up of pilots of equal skills, A little luck and that single frig will land far enough ahead of his fleet that you can kill him before his buddies catch up. You can double back and get the stragglers. The problem people like the OP has is that they think PVP is about ship to ship combat when it's really about out thinking your opponent. The objective isn't just to destroy the enemy ship it's to beat the enemies mind. Not simply out gun them but to out think them. We are talking about lowsec solo pvp, not none of that silly red vs blue garbage.
Skex Relbore Gallente Red Federation	Posted - 2010.12.23 17:56:00 - [107] Originally by: Diesel47 We are talking about lowsec solo pvp, not none of that silly red vs blue garbage. RVB tends to have the fairly even fights of the type the OP claims to want. But that isn't all we do. Keep thinking that crap though, people who underestimate RVB make for a nice source of juicy killmails. Tell me other than your misunderstanding of what RVB is, what exactly do you think is wrong with what I said? I think that you are merely trying to blame your own failings on the system. There are plenty of Pilots who are quite successful using exactly the tactics I outlined. Hell I never even claimed that I'm a particularly good solo pilot (I'm not I tend to prefer fleet work). But I have used these very tactics before successfully, I've also screwed up and lost ships trying it. You don't see me coming in here and crying that the game is broken when I screw up. The point is use some imagination craft the terms of the battle in a way that is favorable to you.
stoicfaux Gallente	Posted - 2010.12.23 17:56:00 - [108] Originally by: Diesel47 This is exactly the coward mindset ^^ People who use the word "cowardly" to describe tactics tend to be on the losing side. It's obvious you want "duels." Other people play Eve like it is a war. In war you do not duel, you destroy your opponent with whatever means and tactics that are available. In war you do not duel, because a duel implies a fair fight, and the more fair fights that you're in, the greater your chance of dying. Quote: The point of solo PvP, or GAMES in general is to test/challenge yourself. Eve doesn't guarantee solo PvP. Your idea of PvP doesn't match how PvP is implemented in Eve. Your choices are to implement some kind of player 1v1 PvP, ask CCP to create a dueling system, or you need to play a different game. ----- "Are you a sociopathic paranoid schizophrenic with accounting skills? We have the game for you! -- Eve, the game of Alts, Economics, Machiavelli, and PvP"
Trader Gandry	Posted - 2010.12.23 17:57:00 - [109] Originally by: Trader Gandry -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Give me one good reason as why I would risk losing a fight if I have the means to make sure I win it. Honor? Glory? Both meaningless terms when it comes to achieving certain objectives for a group of people. I don't do 1 vs 1 for the simple reason that a fight should cost my opponent and not me. It all boils down to costeffectiveness and that's where it starts. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Originally by: Diesel47 This is exactly the coward mindset ^^ Keep in mind you are playing a game, not running a business. Cost effectiveness? This is a game. "Why would you risk losing a fight if you can blob?" The point of solo PvP, or GAMES in general is to test/challenge yourself. You test your skill choices, you test your ship fittings, and you test your pilot skill. If you do not play a game for these reasons then you are doing it wrong. What you are saying is; "I blob because I can't bear losing." That is cowardly, that is not fun, That is pathetic. When you play a 1v1 soccer game or something... do you bring 20 friends to make sure you always win? No. So I am a coward because I play a MMO with a bunch of people and you are a hero for taking it as a single shooter but then horribly fail at it. I sure remember it's a game but I also remember it's a multiplayer. Seems you forget that. Whereas you get your e-peen satisfaction in going out and find a solo victim I enjoy flying with friends and do other stuff. Basicly you're just another reject who blames the world that it doesn't revolve around him. I don't blob because I fear losing, I blob because I care about winning. Trying to force your gamestyle and what makes you jump around all cheerfullmakes you the loser at any game. If you can't stand the heat don't get too close to the fire. And the comparrison with a 1 vs 1 soccer game is absolute crap and you know it just aswel as anyone else with an IQ over 48.
Sean Faust Gallente Point of No Return Waterboard	Posted - 2010.12.23 18:31:00 - [110] Edited by: Sean Faust on 23/12/2010 18:32:20 Originally by: Skex Relbore What a bunch crybaby bs. Baiting is not a problem. Killmails are not a problem. Everything is working as intended. PVP in EVE is a team sport. The art of PVP is getting an enemy to engage you thinking that the terms of battle are favorable to them while in reality those terms are favorable to you. Your argument would hold water if it weren't for the fact that there's an entire race of ships in the game designed almost exclusively around solo PVP. Think about Gallente ships with their high utility mids and active armor tanking bonuses. If you really want to push this belief that all PVP in EVE should be group PVP, then you should also propose changes to the entire Gallente ship lineup to make them more focused/pointed toward roles that benefit gangs and not so much around obvious solo PVP focus. That being said, nothing in the game is more boring to me than making a plan and watching it unfold exactly as intended. Taking intel and planning to a point where it totally eliminates the risk associated with combat to me means taking away combat. If the outcome of a fight is already a foregone conclusion for either side, then I'd just rather not be involved. There's no thrill or excitement. The only thing that makes combat in EVE fun at all to me is having to make on-the-fly decisions mid-fight when things you didn't account for happen.
Snowmann	Posted - 2010.12.23 18:59:00 - [111] Originally by: Exordium8 +3 I've always felt the killboard system hurts this game more than it helps. It actually prevents PvP for the reasons listed above. Too much focus on them. But, who here thinks CCP will ever remove the killmail system from this game if enough players asked? Even if it would promote more PvP. I'm doubting it.
Skex Relbore Gallente Red Federation	Posted - 2010.12.23 19:13:00 - [112] Originally by: Sean Faust <snipped for brevity> Where do you get this silly idea that Gal ships are built primarily for solo combat? They work much better in small gang settings. Mater are far better suited for solo play which is why most successful solo pilots fly Mater (or Angel stuff which are just juiced up Mater ships) Not to say that Gal ships couldn't use some help (particularly hybrids) they could but that's a different discussion entirely. And where in anything I said do you see making split second decisions removed? A good pilot always has to be making split second decisions. And just because one has done a lot of prep work coming up with a good plan doesn't mean that such decision making is removed. The old saw that no plan survives contact with an enemy still applies. Your best preparations can be undone by unpredicted changes in the battle. You scout misses something you get bogus intel your guys screw up. That kind of crap happens all the time. In my opinion though the most appealing aspect of PVP in EVE is that it's much more cerebral. That prior preparation does impact the outcome of a battle. That victory/defeat hinges on factors other than twitch and connection speed. It is a far more dare I say "realistic" model of combat. Rather than a simple FPS where twitch rules, logistics matter, planning matters, social skills matter, leadership matters. The Marines never send out a single grunt to hunt and kill the enemy. The closest they come is a sniper and they work in two man teams with radio's and air/arty support on call. The combat system in EVE rewards those who play smart. Who build relationships with other players who think ahead and plan. It is also singularly unforgiving towards those who don't. I mean I get what you are saying, those fights I tend to enjoy the most are the ones that come down to the wire and end with both sides heavily bloodied. and that's a large part of why I'm in RVB we get a higher proportion of those types of fights than most. But I recognize that this is an artificial circumstance that we've created, and that the rest of EVE isn't like that. It works for us because we've gathered a group of like minded people and built and organization that creates the type of fights we enjoy. But EVE is a sandbox meaning that different people play for different reasons. And I'm not trying to enforce my play style on anyone else. People like the OP want to change the game to suit their play style rather than adapting to the game. It's like the guys who join RvB and don't want to do arranged fights then turn around and whine when they get over-shipped. They tend to just be mad that others aren't willing to be their victims. I mean lets look at baiting the reason it works is because the baited thinks they are getting an easy kill. They think they can win or they'd never engage in the first place. To then turn around and cry because someone else turned the tables on them is just hypocritical. I see it all the time. Never fails that the guy crying about getting ganked was the same one camping a station popping newbs in frigates with their Ruptures and Canes. Face it players like the OP are just mad because they can't find easy victims.
Ava Starfire Minmatar Nordanverdr Modr	Posted - 2010.12.23 19:30:00 - [113] Seems to be 2 topics now...bait and killmails. Ive lived in losec for months. I am a solo career pirate. And tbh, I havent seen bait being a huge problem. I will sometimes take what I know is bait, simply to try and kill the bait and gtfo. Sometimes I succeed. Sometimes I dont. People are really risk averse in eve, understandably. Losses can hurt, financially. But, people also dont need to fly vagas, cynabals, and T3s constantly. Got the isk to afford it? Then why be risk averse? If you cant afford it, stop flying it? I fly rifters 99% of the time, they cost me about 7m fully fit. I literally have attacked things I knew i couldnt beat, simply to see what happens. T1 cruisers and BCs are in this categorry for most of us. Insurable, cheap. Solo roaming isnt about finding 1v1s. Its about 1v2, 1v3, 1vwhatever, maybe killing 1 or 2 and getting away, maybe not. IT is still fun if you let it be. Basically, Im not sure what you classify as "solo pvp" but what I classify as "solo pvp" certainly exists and is relatively easy to find. And killmails? They suck, period. They are an incentive to smartbomb gatecamps, hisec RR ***gotry, and all the other crap that 95% of the payer base claims to hate, yet a whole lot seem to do anyway.
Otto Toten Minmatar The Real OC Intergalactic Exports Group	Posted - 2010.12.23 19:31:00 - [114] Edited by: Otto Toten on 23/12/2010 19:31:48 Originally by: Karn Velora I'm not surprised actually that it's hard to get 1-on-1 pvp, mostly because I don't see much point for it. I guess there's people out there who enjoy a 1-on-1, but lets be honest: a fair fight is not profitable. You stand to lose a lot, and gain very little. Not many want a part of it. Quote: I disagree, I enjoy solo pvp 1 on 1, I don't mind a fair fight. If you win, it is rewarding if you lose hopefully you learned something. I don't care about the isk lost or gained, I make my isk other ways to support pvp fun.
Joe Skellington Minmatar JOKAS Industries Apocalypse Now.	Posted - 2010.12.23 19:37:00 - [115] Originally by: Skex Relbore Originally by: Sean Faust Mater are far better suited for solo play which is why most successful solo pilots fly Mater (or Angel stuff which are just juiced up Mater ships) Mater? Is this a new faction? Sorry if that seems rude.
Willl Adama Judicio Sine Misericordia	Posted - 2010.12.23 19:38:00 - [116] I agree that KMs are alot of the reason that most people blob/Bait/whatever, thereby being a pain in the ass for many solo and small gang players. However, removing them completely would be the same as taking a way alot of the reward for those exact solo pilots, especially the competent ones. I certainly enjoy my epic solo killmails of killing HACS with t1 fris and so on. On the other hand, I don't give a **** about most my lossmails simply because they have BLOB all over them. The issue here is that it may be hard to distinguish between playstyles simply by looking at KMs, since a dedicated solo pilot obviously will have worse stats than that of a blobber. A K/D ratio for a solo player on 5:1 and isk eff. of 80% is pretty good, while the same stats for a fleet/blob pilot would mean that the pilot is extremely incompetent. Yet most people will judge only from these stats. The bottomline is that I would like to see solo work rewarded somehow more visibly through Kms, as currently the only thing you get out of it Km-wise is more points pr KM. while this is fine, this only really does anything when you have thousands of kills on a KB as battleclininc, and on eve-kill it's pretty useless since the point/involved parties ratio is screwed. Oh btw, why is it that all fleet players always asume that we solo players are only looking for 1on1s? I generaly find the most joy in fights if I am fighting outnumbered with terrible odds. Nothing is more satisfying that emerging from such encounters victorious. But I guess that is something you guys just never will experience. To hell with winning. It's a god damn game. What does winning matter if it aint fun?
Skex Relbore Gallente Red Federation	Posted - 2010.12.23 19:40:00 - [117] Originally by: Joe Skellington Originally by: Skex Relbore Originally by: Sean Faust Mater are far better suited for solo play which is why most successful solo pilots fly Mater (or Angel stuff which are just juiced up Mater ships) Mater? Is this a new faction? Sorry if that seems rude. General short hand for Minmatar. Which tend to have the best solo ships because their speed maintains their GTFO capabilities if they bite off more than they can chew.
Joe Skellington Minmatar JOKAS Industries Apocalypse Now.	Posted - 2010.12.23 19:42:00 - [118] Edited by: Joe Skellington on 23/12/2010 19:42:58 Yeah, it dawned on me after I posted. I usually see it as matar, i.e. Ammatar or something. Originally by: Skex Relbore Originally by: Joe Skellington Originally by: Skex Relbore Originally by: Sean Faust Mater are far better suited for solo play which is why most successful solo pilots fly Mater (or Angel stuff which are just juiced up Mater ships) Mater? Is this a new faction? Sorry if that seems rude. General short hand for Minmatar. Which tend to have the best solo ships because their speed maintains their GTFO capabilities if they bite off more than they can chew.
ILikeMarkets	Posted - 2010.12.23 19:54:00 - [119] Solo is dead. It's been dead. Sorry you found out so late. Now go find an ECM blob and enjoy what PvP has become.
Cipher Jones Minmatar	Posted - 2010.12.23 20:15:00 - [120] Solo PvP is 100% based on bullying. Read Sun Tzu. No-one is looking for a "fair fight". Originally by: Stats pulled out of asses are the best kind as populations continue to fall. Populations will have to start to fall before they can continue to fall.

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