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Riggs Droput
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
9
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Posted - 2011.09.28 04:47:00 -
[61] - Quote
I would love to see Dust succeed, my worries are the fact that the average life cycle of most console games seems to be about 6 months of a large fan base. Then about 2 years max before the servers are empty.
I also wonder how long dust players will stick around paying RL cash for tanks and gear when us eve players will be able to nuke them from orbit, for ISK.
I can imagine the rage of these players after dropping 10$ on a platoon's worth of gear only to have one of us come along and being able to bombard them, and they lose it all.
Who know's maybe DUST will succeed, but I give it about 4 years max unless they open it to PC players before then due to the lifecycle of the consoles. We are already half way through the current console generation life cycle. They suspect to see a new XBOX by 2013 and possibly a new Playstation by 2014-15.
Riggs I would rather die on my feet, than live on my knees |

Karim alRashid
Aliastra Gallente Federation
7
|
Posted - 2011.09.28 06:32:00 -
[62] - Quote
I wouldn't imagine CCP are idiots and aren't well aware of the FPS dynamics on consoles. Thus I doubt their goal is to position DUST as a direct competitor to CoD or Killzone, but stress the MMO rather than the "shooter" aspect instead.
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Thorn Galen
The Scope Gallente Federation
20
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Posted - 2011.09.28 06:48:00 -
[63] - Quote
Riggs Droput wrote:I would love to see Dust succeed, my worries are the fact that the average life cycle of most console games seems to be about 6 months of a large fan base. Then about 2 years max before the servers are empty.
I also wonder how long dust players will stick around paying RL cash for tanks and gear when us eve players will be able to nuke them from orbit, for ISK.
I can imagine the rage of these players after dropping 10$ on a platoon's worth of gear only to have one of us come along and being able to bombard them, and they lose it all.
Who know's maybe DUST will succeed, but I give it about 4 years max unless they open it to PC players before then due to the lifecycle of the consoles. We are already half way through the current console generation life cycle. They suspect to see a new XBOX by 2013 and possibly a new Playstation by 2014-15.
Riggs
So true. Looking at console gaming from a historical perspective, console MMO's are viable only in the short-term (4 years and less). If DUST is not ported to the PC platform, it too could suffer a very short lifespan. I am still surprised that CCP went the route of a console game. Perhaps they based their decision on the premise that the PC platform is dead and dying - I see no other reason why. CCP may also have based their decision on the idea that players will spend real money to win, which is what PS3 network players tend to do. I think the Nex store is an experiment to test this - but their pricing strategy is all wrong.
The urgency of getting Incarna to be 100% what it was meant to be (as advertised), should not be ignored by CCP - and I'm pretty sure that as a company that has been running as long as they have, they are fully aware of, and very sensitive to this.
Servitudes - The name given to members of very large alliances. |

Sofia Bellard
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
42
|
Posted - 2011.09.28 06:49:00 -
[64] - Quote
DUST 514 will easily be a CoD and BF killer!!! I already have my copy reserved at Amazon.com.
Poor sad little pirates, -áwhy you so mad? |

Riggs Droput
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
10
|
Posted - 2011.09.28 06:53:00 -
[65] - Quote
[quote= So true. Looking at console gaming from a historical perspective, console MMO's are viable only in the short-term (4 years and less). If DUST is not ported to the PC platform, it too could suffer a very short lifespan. I am still surprised that CCP went the route of a console game. Perhaps they based their decision on the premise that the PC platform is dead and dying - I see no other reason why. CCP may also have based their decision on the idea that players will spend real money to win, which is what PS3 network players tend to do. I think the Nex store is an experiment to test this - but their pricing strategy is all wrong.
The urgency of getting Incarna to be 100% what it was meant to be (as advertised), should not be ignored by CCP - and I'm pretty sure that as a company that has been running as long as they have, they are fully aware of, and very sensitive to this. [/quote]
Actually Nvidia posted that PC games are set to overtake console games in sales by 2015 but it reads like Nvidia propaganda.
http://www.techpowerup.com/152626/Sunday-Special-PC-Gaming-On-the-Rise-Set-To-Outsell-Consoles-by-2014-NVIDIA.html
Riggs I would rather die on my feet, than live on my knees |

KarlSteiner
MoonRabbit Collective EVE Federation
0
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Posted - 2011.09.28 06:56:00 -
[66] - Quote
Most of eve user cant play dust because they have no PS3. So dust will be fail. Simple. |

Karim alRashid
Aliastra Gallente Federation
7
|
Posted - 2011.09.28 07:18:00 -
[67] - Quote
A game lifespan is not bounded by the console hardware lifespan.
DUST 514 may well fail because it is just not fun and/or buggy, but not for all the idiotic reasons stated in this thread.
I wonder how console gamers pay RL cash to win, like one poster said above. I admittedly have played only CoD:BlackOps, Killzone, Uncharted and Gran Tourismo in the last half an year or so, but don't remember shelling anything other than initial game purchase, even the network play is free, there isn't anything like XBOX Live subscription. |

Riggs Droput
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
10
|
Posted - 2011.09.28 07:29:00 -
[68] - Quote
Karim alRashid wrote:A game lifespan is not bounded by the console hardware lifespan.
DUST 514 may well fail because it is just not fun and/or buggy, but not for all the idiotic reasons stated in this thread.
I agree with your statement that a game lifespan is not bounded by the console hardware lifespan but a games popularity and community can be limited due to those reasons.
Crimsons Skies Xbox, one of the first games that took advantage of xbox live, an excellent arcade flight combat game. No one plays now because everyone is on a 360.
Look on the opposite side.
Counter Strike release date 1999, still servers running the game even with Counter Strike: Source being release. A stable platform that is 100% backwards compatible will keep a games life span around longer then the hardware lifespan.
The issue with some of the previous consoles is that they are not backwards compatible. That's why PC games end up holding their communities together longer. Because as people upgrade their hardware they are still able to play the game. It does not affect them like upgrading console hardware.
When I bought my 360 I packed up my original xbox. Sold most of the games and the xbox and moved over to my 360. When I got my PS3 I packed up my PS2 and games and gave them all to charity.
The majority of console players will not stick with an older system when something new comes out, and when the older systems become outdated most of the software and community goes with it. I am not saying all will do that but a large portion do.
So unless the PS4 is 100% backwards compatible you will see a drop in players as the console life cycle moves on.
Riggs I would rather die on my feet, than live on my knees |

Karim alRashid
Aliastra Gallente Federation
7
|
Posted - 2011.09.28 07:34:00 -
[69] - Quote
Riggs Droput wrote:Karim alRashid wrote:A game lifespan is not bounded by the console hardware lifespan.
So unless the PS4 is 100% backwards compatible you will see a drop in players as the console life cycle moves on.
I rather think it's CCP's job to port their game to the then current version of the Unreal Engine for PS4.
And if DUST is successful on PS3, they will.
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Othran
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
32
|
Posted - 2011.09.28 07:34:00 -
[70] - Quote
Regardless of anything else, CCP are going to have a hell of a job selling it in the UK.
Largest game retailer in the UK (Game) announced results recently and they're not good - basically they're seeing a 16% fall in sales over the year (on a like for like basis) and are expecting the market to become "substantially weaker" over the next 12 months. European and US sales are looking similar although US sales seem to be holding up a little better (still bloody awful though).
tl;dr people aren't buying games (on console/PC) like they used to and in the UK at least its going to get a LOT worse before it gets better. |
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Jaroslav Unwanted
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
7
|
Posted - 2011.09.28 07:34:00 -
[71] - Quote
human-kind will fail inevitably / true universe will fail inevitably / true Dust will fail inevitably / true
You see what i did there...
Its all matter of time. |

Fouljin
Sanguine Marauders
0
|
Posted - 2011.09.28 07:35:00 -
[72] - Quote
OMG a Gaming company is developing a game. STOP IT!!! 
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Riggs Droput
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
10
|
Posted - 2011.09.28 07:40:00 -
[73] - Quote
Karim alRashid wrote:Riggs Droput wrote:Karim alRashid wrote:A game lifespan is not bounded by the console hardware lifespan.
So unless the PS4 is 100% backwards compatible you will see a drop in players as the console life cycle moves on. I rather think it's CCP's job to port their game to the then current version of the Unreal Engine for PS4. And if DUST is successful on PS3, they will.
Ya CCP should but Sony can make it easier on all developers by developing a strong backwards compatibility in to their hardware. It makes it easier on everyone. Then when you upgrade you don't only start out with launch titles you have a entire previous generation of games that are able to bundle/promote your new console. They might not have all the flash the release titles do but it would keep the player base happier.
Riggs I would rather die on my feet, than live on my knees |

Karim alRashid
Aliastra Gallente Federation
7
|
Posted - 2011.09.28 08:28:00 -
[74] - Quote
Othran wrote: tl;dr people aren't buying games (on console/PC)
Statistics on pirating ?    |

Rico Minali
Sons Of 0din Fatal Ascension
35
|
Posted - 2011.09.28 08:30:00 -
[75] - Quote
CaptainFalcon07 wrote:
Whatever DUST will by, I'm not going to be playing or buying it since I don't have a PS3.
Then stfu and stop trying to cause drama.
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Seraph Cruoris
Aliastra Gallente Federation
5
|
Posted - 2011.09.28 08:36:00 -
[76] - Quote
Quote:Ya CCP should but Sony can make it easier on all developers by developing a strong backwards compatibility in to their hardware. It makes it easier on everyone. Then when you upgrade you don't only start out with launch titles you have a entire previous generation of games that are able to bundle/promote your new console. They might not have all the flash the release titles do but it would keep the player base happier.
backwards compatibility only works on one premise: you're not adding anything more to the game. if they do add anything more to the game which being CCP and EVE-linked, it is bound to happen, what will probably happen is that it will either see a release in disc format with updated graphics or a PSN download for those already subscribed (or for those who want to skip the physical copy).....
secondly if they really want to make this work is to really beg Microsoft to give them an exclusive pass to the XBL system's bubble of certification and have PS3 and 360 player playing on the same server.
as for what someone said about 6-12 months life span...you're thinking CoD. But if you look at Halo/Battlefield those titles last a lot longer...Halo 3 lasted 3 years (and if im not mistaken people still play it now despite Reach's release)....Halo 2 was the one title that kept going on the old XBL servers (big deal was made about this)...so if they can make this game special like Halo/MAG you'll always have an active community...
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Zey Nadar
Aliastra Gallente Federation
7
|
Posted - 2011.09.28 08:42:00 -
[77] - Quote
I would love to hear from CCP exactly what kind of dependencies and connections there is between dust and eve players.. As long as there isn't any information, its easy to round those connections to "none" and declare a generic fps shooter a failure. I wish there would be a devblog about the current situation in the development of dust. It would be a nice change to the contentless devblogs lately.
Riggs Droput wrote: Counter Strike release date 1999, still servers running the game even with Counter Strike: Source being release. A stable platform that is 100% backwards compatible will keep a games life span around longer then the hardware lifespan.
Consoles arent necessarily backwards compatible. I had the first generation ps3 that could run ps2 games, but Sony eventually removed the backwards compatibility from its latest-generation playstation 3s. |

Screenlag
Beyond The Gates Tri Sol Syndicate
0
|
Posted - 2011.09.28 13:56:00 -
[78] - Quote
Dust will live on eve players. I would considering playing it had it not been a PS3 exclusive and given that I could make money for my eve character. I enjoy shooters as much as the next guy, but lets hope CCP manages to integrate it in a good way, so that there's isk to be made for us peasants :) |

Vertisce Soritenshi
SHADOW WARD Tragedy.
45
|
Posted - 2011.09.28 14:27:00 -
[79] - Quote
Ladie Scarlet wrote:Tippia wrote:Ladie Scarlet wrote:That's kind of my point. Console kiddies don't stick with one game for any length of time and developers have to keep cranking out new games to appease them. Do you really see CCP making Dust, Dust 2, and Dust 3 in a year? GǪyou mean kind of like releasing (say) a yearly content patch and game update? game update is not a sequel. Console games don't live on updates and DLC for very long because the audience has been trained to expect a brand new game every few months. CCP expecting Dust to live alongside Eve for years is foolish.
You could say the exact same thing about PC games and gamers. Why you are trying to distinguish PC from Console is foolish. |

Sellendis
The Ares project
12
|
Posted - 2011.09.28 14:54:00 -
[80] - Quote
DUST a fail project? Only time will tell, IMHO its a fail. The idea itself is fine, but considering game market of today....its gonna be hard to get by.
How many EvE players own PS3? How many will buy PS3 just for DUST (and BR player mostly)?
Is CCP counting on big alliances to somehow motivate people to contribute to fights on planets? Is PI still a factor in DUST and EvE, and controlling planets control PI production? Again a good idea, but its gonna be a hassle, why go all the trouble to make and bake a loaf of bread at home and waste few hours, when you can buy one in a second? EvE has bots, bots earn money, who needs PI and your own ground army when you can buy what you want in 4-4.
Console players attention span is low. With new games on shelves almost weekly, CCP needs a goddamn good plan to keep people playing DUST.
Imagining DUST is a console MMO (MMO connected) is stupid, they cant sell that to most of EvE community, let alone console players. What happens when DUST server population drops? Servers shut down, and what about EvE? Does EvE get a emergency boost of patches to remove DUST from equation, or will EvE keep going like DUST never mattered in the first place.
Now this i am sure no one will answer , how much money did CCP spent developing DUST? How much do they expect to gain in first 6-12 months? Now imagine all that money and man hours invested in DUST were instead put into EvE....what would be the situation in EvE today, maybe hybrids would be fixed along with a lot of balancing issues. |
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Jokerface666
Ever Flow Northern Coalition.
18
|
Posted - 2011.09.28 14:55:00 -
[81] - Quote
Zey Nadar wrote:I would love to hear from CCP exactly what kind of dependencies and connections there is between dust and eve players.. As long as there isn't any information, its easy to round those connections to "none" and declare a generic fps shooter a failure. I wish there would be a devblog about the current situation in the development of dust. It would be a nice change to the contentless devblogs lately. Riggs Droput wrote: Counter Strike release date 1999, still servers running the game even with Counter Strike: Source being release. A stable platform that is 100% backwards compatible will keep a games life span around longer then the hardware lifespan.
Consoles arent necessarily backwards compatible. I had the first generation ps3 that could run ps2 games, but Sony eventually removed the backwards compatibility from its latest-generation playstation 3s.
I've got a strong feeling that the connection will be kind of a contract system already in game, you set up a contract to take over planet X or destroy player Xs equipment on planet X for X amount of ISK. which every "corp/clan" in DUST can accept and try to accomplish. ------------------------------w00t w00t rapetrain------------------------------ |

Ana Vyr
65
|
Posted - 2011.09.28 15:01:00 -
[82] - Quote
I'd have bought a copy of Dust just to see the interaction with EvE at work...if they'd released it on X-box that is. I'm not gonna buy another console to play one game. |

Vertisce Soritenshi
SHADOW WARD Tragedy.
45
|
Posted - 2011.09.28 16:14:00 -
[83] - Quote
Ana Vyr wrote:I'd have bought a copy of Dust just to see the interaction with EvE at work...if they'd released it on X-box that is. I'm not gonna buy another console to play one game.
And that is your perogative. Too bad Microsoft wouldn't allow CCP to do what they needed to on XBL huh? Otherwise it would be on XBox. |

Karim alRashid
Aliastra Gallente Federation
7
|
Posted - 2011.09.28 20:19:00 -
[84] - Quote
Heh, I bought my PS3 because of DUST 514 (I was shopping for a TV set and there was this bundle with a PS3 "free").
But have played several very good (some PS3 exclusive) games on it. |

AlleyKat
The Unwanted.
24
|
Posted - 2011.09.28 23:21:00 -
[85] - Quote
Sellendis wrote:DUST a fail project? Only time will tell, IMHO its a fail. The idea itself is fine, but considering game market of today....its gonna be hard to get by.
How many EvE players own PS3? How many will buy PS3 just for DUST (and BR player mostly)?
Is CCP counting on big alliances to somehow motivate people to contribute to fights on planets? Is PI still a factor in DUST and EvE, and controlling planets control PI production? Again a good idea, but its gonna be a hassle, why go all the trouble to make and bake a loaf of bread at home and waste few hours, when you can buy one in a second? EvE has bots, bots earn money, who needs PI and your own ground army when you can buy what you want in 4-4.
Console players attention span is low. With new games on shelves almost weekly, CCP needs a goddamn good plan to keep people playing DUST.
Imagining DUST is a console MMO (MMO connected) is stupid, they cant sell that to most of EvE community, let alone console players. What happens when DUST server population drops? Servers shut down, and what about EvE? Does EvE get a emergency boost of patches to remove DUST from equation, or will EvE keep going like DUST never mattered in the first place.
Now this i am sure no one will answer , how much money did CCP spent developing DUST? How much do they expect to gain in first 6-12 months? Now imagine all that money and man hours invested in DUST were instead put into EvE....what would be the situation in EvE today, maybe hybrids would be fixed along with a lot of balancing issues.
Sums up most of my thoughts.
We understand they are giving the game away for free as well. So the money they have spent on developing the game is going to be recouped by vanity items?
Nice one CCP, great business strategy.
That's basically saying "This game is soooo bad we cannot charge money for it. Please play it please, please, please"
Desperation is such a turn on, isn't it?
Haven't you ever heard of playing hard to get?
Confidence pwns desperation every time.
You've been very lucky with your relationship with us - you might have convinced us (somehow) that a threesome is a good idea, but you've got to introduce us to your new partner, and I sense a rocky beginning to this new level of the relationship.
Leaders of Alliances in this game have several thousand members - what stopping them from blowing the crap out of PS3 players with 1 click of a mouse?
All it takes is 1 mistake from you guys and it's *poof* no more PS3 players, because every-time they start a game, they get nuked from orbit.
You didn't think this through very well, did you?
All you needed to do was put it on PC's and flog it on Steam for $25, with a Drum n Bass infused trailer. Are you really that disconnected with gamers?
I own a PS3, btw, so meh. "Combat in New Eden is either a blob or a work of art...let me paint you a picture" |

Cypermethren
Celtic Cartage And Hauling
5
|
Posted - 2011.09.29 08:13:00 -
[86] - Quote
speaking as someone whom has alot of console gamer friends, who like to mock me for my MMO choices....
They are all hyped up and eager for Dust.
Go figure?
the FPS industry has screwd itself over by being lazy and just making new maps and tweaking existing models/guns slightly and re-releasing it as a new game. This has been the trend since Call of Duty 3 and onwards, which is an incredibly long time.
CCP stepping up and putting Dust on the plate realy does have Battlefield 3 and the new Modern Warfare weary. You can expect the next in the series that they release to have alot of ideas stolen from Dust and other games, then incorporated into it.
If they do not, they will loose the market, its that simple, and they know it.
Dust can and will take the FPS market by storm, you do not "NEED" to buy the in game cash, it will be like eve - **** easy to make if you sit down and play - but moreso a convenience for the average joe that isnt on government benefits and has work/family committments, and has restricted playing time - but wants in early on stuff that would take him alot longer to achieve.
Wether it can keep the market, after the other games pilfer ideas and modify their own games to compete on the same level, is another story. |

Aston Bradley
Through the Looking Glass
0
|
Posted - 2011.09.29 09:05:00 -
[87] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Ladie Scarlet wrote:Anybody who's not a mouthbreathing idiot can see the future when it comes to Dust. A console shooter (a market that is glutted with titles) exclusive to the console with the smallest audience is doomed to fail. Yes. The PS3-exclusive shooters have all been such abysmal failures that they're only into their third or fourth sequel by nowGǪ
True but than again, they were a succes as a Single player shooter. Usually multiplayer elements in console shooter keep players interested for a few months at best untill they move to either a sequel or an other game. Despite how much i love Killzone games, i am not going to keep playing it months later. I will move on to other games.
Dust being an MMOFPS, it will need more than nice graphics, a cool story line, and good gameplay (The basics for a good shooter). You need MMO elements, and a strong community to keep such a game alive over the years.
I have no doubt that as a strict console shooter, Dust will succed. As a MMO-shooter however, i have my doubts.
Making DUST an PS3 game is a mistake, since most console players don't dedicate their time to a single game as new titles it the platform every month. The console market is saturated. If you want players to keep playing the game for years, the PC market is the way to go. |

Vertisce Soritenshi
SHADOW WARD Tragedy.
46
|
Posted - 2011.09.29 11:37:00 -
[88] - Quote
I was talking about DUST among my co-workers yesterday. Most of them had never heard of it yet all of them because of myself and a few others I work with know what EvE is. The ones that knew of DUST admitted that they would be playing it at some point at least to give it a try and see how it goes. The others after reading about it and seeing what DUST offers that is new to console FPS are now on board to try it as well.
Most FPS gamers are going to at least try to play DUST just because of the new elements such as interacting with a persistent PC MMO will bring. This is all CCP needs. People to just try it. After that the ball is back in CCP's court to make the game good enough to keep people playing. Look at MAG. Still alive and kicking. I logged in the other day to see thousands of people on and playing. Wasn't expecting that. Look at HALO. Completely unheard of game on a new console with no advertising. Blockbuster hit and many sequels made to this day.
To say that DUST will fail without giving it a try is foolish at best. Nobody knows right now what the reaction to DUST will be when it hits shelves. To quote one of my co-workers yesterday after I explained DUST to them...
"So you are saying that there will be players in another game flying in space who will pay people in DUST to do ground combat for them? And these actions will impact the PC gamers flying in space? That's ******* awesome!"
That's the kind of reaction that gets new games attention and makes them successful. No matter what it is from...the wow factor. |

Aston Bradley
Through the Looking Glass
0
|
Posted - 2011.09.29 12:27:00 -
[89] - Quote
Vertisce Soritenshi wrote: To say that DUST will fail without giving it a try is foolish at best. Nobody knows right now what the reaction to DUST will be when it hits shelves. To quote one of my co-workers yesterday after I explained DUST to them...
"So you are saying that there will be players in another game flying in space who will pay people in DUST to do ground combat for them? And these actions will impact the PC gamers flying in space? That's ******* awesome!"
That's the kind of reaction that gets new games attention and makes them successful. No matter what it is from...the wow factor.
The fact that you get paid by player from a PC MMO game and that your actions have impact on this MMo is cool but :
- Most of Dust players that don't play or care about eve won't see this change, so it hardly a cool factor for Dust player unless they are also Eve player. Most forums that talk about Dust show that fans are PS3 players, not Eve players. What's the point of the butterfly-effect that you can't see?
- It's not enough to keep players in. Sure MAG is still live, but your gonna need more than what they are currently offering to keep playing DUST.
As said, i believe many PS3 owner will try the game, and it might even be a succes as a shooter. I am still not convinced that players will keep the game alive months after release however, and the fact that eve players can pay bots rather than players shows that CCP is already prepared with the possibility that DUST will not have enough players on the long run to make the hiring mercenaries option in eve a viable option.
Time will tell, and as a PS3 owner i will buy and play the game. But i am not sure it will keep it's promisses.
I mean.... It's CCP. |

J Kunjeh
78
|
Posted - 2011.09.29 13:06:00 -
[90] - Quote
Dust definitely wont fail...
I think for one it will attract a lot of ex-Eve players who quit because they just don't have 20 hours a week to devote to a game world, but they're still hopelessly addicted to to everything Eve. They need some way to make meaningful contributions to New Eden that doesn't require a part time job. "The world as we know it came about through an anomaly (anomou)" (The Gospel of Philip, 1-5)-á |
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