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Isonkon Serikain	Posted - 2005.05.23 18:42:00 - [1] I just found out Instas will go away... Whats the scoop? This is going to be bad
Admiral Pieg	Posted - 2005.05.23 18:46:00 - [2] yay! ______________________ Pod from above.
JoeSomebody	Posted - 2005.05.23 18:48:00 - [3] Edited by: JoeSomebody on 23/05/2005 18:49:51 Originally by: Admiral Pieg yay! ... for pirates and gatecamps Added: yay, for mission runners in slow-ass battleships going into nearby systems, yay for haulers. yay, yay, yay... ____ When flying by Concord Customs Commander's Dominix I distinctly heard him saying "... world domination..."
Sobeseki Pawi	Posted - 2005.05.23 18:53:00 - [4] Yay for introducing strategy! ~Sobe Captain Cutie, Razor's Kiss What is your Radical Dream?
Maxine Stirner	Posted - 2005.05.23 18:58:00 - [5] Train predictive thinking to lvl 2 ya? Actually, dev blog says it ain't happening. But if it did, exactly how long do you think it would be before long range setups got the gatling nerfnerfnerfnerfnerfnerfnerfnerf..? 1)Frigates now THE most incident-responsive platform in the game. Everyone starts picking on BS for being tech1 ships who's destruction makes miners titter. 2)Content emerges for shorter range trader hauls after cacophonous wailing.
JoeSomebody	Posted - 2005.05.23 19:12:00 - [6] Edited by: JoeSomebody on 23/05/2005 19:13:58 Originally by: Maxine Stirner Train predictive thinking to lvl 2 ya? and it gives you exactly what? Don't you all get it yet? It REMOVES strategy from the game, not adds it! So if you remove insta BM's, then choices when entering 0.4 reduce to simply: 1) goin there 2) not goin there Wheres thinkin in that? All your strategy reduces to the dumb luck and prays that system isnt camped. Added: oh almost forgot, yay for the new flavour of the day: noobship spyes! ____ When flying by Concord Customs Commander's Dominix I distinctly heard him saying "... world domination..."
Sobeseki Pawi	Posted - 2005.05.23 19:15:00 - [7] Originally by: JoeSomebody Edited by: JoeSomebody on 23/05/2005 19:13:58 Originally by: Maxine Stirner Train predictive thinking to lvl 2 ya? and it gives you exactly what? Don't you all get it yet? It REMOVES strategy from the game, not adds it! So if you remove insta BM's, then choices when entering 0.4 reduce to simply: 1) goin there 2) not goin there Wheres thinkin in that? All your strategy reduces to the dumb luck and prays that system isnt camped. Added: oh almost forgot, yay for the new flavour of the day: noobship spyes! Well your best strategy would be to give up and stay in the CONCORD Inn. ~Sobe Captain Cutie, Razor's Kiss What is your Radical Dream?
JoeSomebody	Posted - 2005.05.23 19:16:00 - [8] Originally by: Sobeseki Pawi Originally by: JoeSomebody Edited by: JoeSomebody on 23/05/2005 19:13:58 Originally by: Maxine Stirner Train predictive thinking to lvl 2 ya? and it gives you exactly what? Don't you all get it yet? It REMOVES strategy from the game, not adds it! So if you remove insta BM's, then choices when entering 0.4 reduce to simply: 1) goin there 2) not goin there Wheres thinkin in that? All your strategy reduces to the dumb luck and prays that system isnt camped. Added: oh almost forgot, yay for the new flavour of the day: noobship spyes! Well your best strategy would be to give up and stay in the CONCORD Inn. i would gladly use another one if you can make it up for me. no? i didnt think so... ____ When flying by Concord Customs Commander's Dominix I distinctly heard him saying "... world domination..."
Sobeseki Pawi	Posted - 2005.05.23 19:27:00 - [9] Originally by: JoeSomebody Originally by: Sobeseki Pawi Originally by: JoeSomebody Edited by: JoeSomebody on 23/05/2005 19:13:58 Originally by: Maxine Stirner Train predictive thinking to lvl 2 ya? and it gives you exactly what? Don't you all get it yet? It REMOVES strategy from the game, not adds it! So if you remove insta BM's, then choices when entering 0.4 reduce to simply: 1) goin there 2) not goin there Wheres thinkin in that? All your strategy reduces to the dumb luck and prays that system isnt camped. Added: oh almost forgot, yay for the new flavour of the day: noobship spyes! Well your best strategy would be to give up and stay in the CONCORD Inn. i would gladly use another one if you can make it up for me. no? i didnt think so... You know, normally I would just laugh and let you get frustrated at your...efforts?...and just let your ships burn. How about you use the tools available to you? Scout systems with a frigate, know your area, have contingency plans in place, move with friends, inhabit a low sec system for some time, or just friggin do it. Get out of that flying target and get a real ship...or dont. Stay out of my space if all you plan to do is ***** when you get there. ~Sobe Captain Cutie, Razor's Kiss What is your Radical Dream?
Cummilla	Posted - 2005.05.23 19:37:00 - [10] The question is WHY? Why should instas go away? I haven't heard a compelling reason from a balancing standpoint. Instas themselves do not allow people to avoid combat, they simply dictate where the combat must occur for the attacker to have the advantage. Anyone with functioning brain can surmise which side of the gate to sit on and which side to gather intel from. It's not that hard folks. So then if the excuse isn't about increasing combat(on some theory that instas made it easy to avoid combat), then what the problem with them? ....still waiting on a compelling answer.

Sobeseki Pawi	Posted - 2005.05.23 19:39:00 - [11] Why have ships that go different speeds if they can all insta their way across the map? ~Sobe Captain Cutie, Razor's Kiss What is your Radical Dream?
Evad jr	Posted - 2005.05.23 19:41:00 - [12] If you could eliminate gate camping I would love to see instas go away. But the two sorta balance each other out, don't you think?
Cummilla	Posted - 2005.05.23 19:43:00 - [13] Originally by: Sobeseki Pawi Why have ships that go different speeds if they can all insta their way across the map? So? and this has what to do with combat?
JoeSomebody	Posted - 2005.05.23 19:44:00 - [14] Originally by: Sobeseki Pawi Originally by: JoeSomebody Originally by: Sobeseki Pawi Originally by: JoeSomebody Edited by: JoeSomebody on 23/05/2005 19:13:58 Originally by: Maxine Stirner Train predictive thinking to lvl 2 ya? and it gives you exactly what? Don't you all get it yet? It REMOVES strategy from the game, not adds it! So if you remove insta BM's, then choices when entering 0.4 reduce to simply: 1) goin there 2) not goin there Wheres thinkin in that? All your strategy reduces to the dumb luck and prays that system isnt camped. Added: oh almost forgot, yay for the new flavour of the day: noobship spyes! Well your best strategy would be to give up and stay in the CONCORD Inn. i would gladly use another one if you can make it up for me. no? i didnt think so... You know, normally I would just laugh and let you get frustrated at your...efforts?...and just let your ships burn. How about you use the tools available to you? Scout systems with a frigate, know your area, have contingency plans in place, move with friends, inhabit a low sec system for some time, or just friggin do it. Get out of that flying target and get a real ship...or dont. Stay out of my space if all you plan to do is *** when you get there. yay, like not enough ppl were leaving game because getting bored of necessity to use simply dumb and * tricks, lets introduce even more of those! Goin into _your_ space? Thats just lol. If I go into your space _your_ ship will burn, simply because you will not be sitting there waiting for me in snipest by the gate 24/7. This is game, dude, not a real life. People login to play, not to wait things to happen. You know how many times I had to sit on station and wait till a few****s in geddons/inties leave, knowing I can do ABSOLUTELY nothing about it? And even if I manage to get enough corpmates to gank them, pirats will probably leave by then anyway. And even if they dont - they will simply warp into safespot and log... yay pirats won again! It is not pvp, it is pirating that is made waaaay to easy already. Whoever attacks autowins. Defence and retaliation are simply not effective in the game where you can just logoff or switch to alt. Gate-camping is already waaaay to easy. Using cheap tricks, which only ppl with way too much free time on their hands can afford to do, is encouraged. I dont want this to continue to happen. ____ When flying by Concord Customs Commander's Dominix I distinctly heard him saying "... world domination..."
Sobeseki Pawi	Posted - 2005.05.23 19:49:00 - [15] Originally by: Evad jr If you could eliminate gate camping I would love to see instas go away. But the two sorta balance each other out, don't you think? I would love to replace this infernal gate system with something...more likely. ~Sobe Captain Cutie, Razor's Kiss What is your Radical Dream?
Sobeseki Pawi	Posted - 2005.05.23 19:50:00 - [16] Originally by: Cummilla Originally by: Sobeseki Pawi Why have ships that go different speeds if they can all insta their way across the map? So? and this has what to do with combat? If you dont know...then you have never fought before in Eve. ~Sobe Captain Cutie, Razor's Kiss What is your Radical Dream?
Joshua Foiritain	Posted - 2005.05.23 19:51:00 - [17] Originally by: JoeSomebody Edited by: JoeSomebody on 23/05/2005 19:13:58 Originally by: Maxine Stirner Train predictive thinking to lvl 2 ya? and it gives you exactly what? Don't you all get it yet? It REMOVES strategy from the game, not adds it! So if you remove insta BM's, then choices when entering 0.4 reduce to simply: 1) goin there 2) not goin there Wheres thinkin in that? All your strategy reduces to the dumb luck and prays that system isnt camped. Added: oh almost forgot, yay for the new flavour of the day: noobship spyes! The question is, what kind of strategy can be found in Gate camping with snipers? --------------------------- [Coreli Corporation Mainframe]
Sobeseki Pawi	Posted - 2005.05.23 19:59:00 - [18] Edited by: Sobeseki Pawi on 23/05/2005 20:00:46 Originally by: JoeSomebody yay, like not enough ppl were leaving game because getting bored of necessity to use simply dumb and * tricks, lets introduce even more of those! I dont see how its a trick to lose an engagement...and if it was...wouldnt it be your fault for being tricked? Quote: Goin into _your_ space? Thats just lol. If I go into your space _your_ ship will burn, simply because you will not be sitting there waiting for me in snipest by the gate 24/7. First of all I dont gate camp, second of all you will never step foot in my space, so why threaten to? And third...how is my ship going to burn if Im the one who is thinking strategically and tactically? Quote: This is game, dude, not a real life. People login to play, not to wait things to happen. Welcome to my whole argument, do it yourself, stop trying to get others to do it for you. Quote: You know how many times I had to sit on station and wait till a fews in geddons/inties leave, knowing I can do ABSOLUTELY nothing about it? More than me? Quote: And even if I manage to get enough corpmates to gank them, pirats will probably leave by then anyway. That means you win chief. Quote: And even if they dont - they will simply warp into safespot and log... yay pirats won again! If you only see victory in a can...I pity you. Quote: It is not pvp, it is pirating that is made waaaay to easy already. You have to have a BS to gate camp...I dont like being in a BS. Quote: Whoever attacks autowins. Defence and retaliation are simply not effective in the game where you can just logoff or switch to alt. Forcing a retreat isnt effective? Quote: Gate-camping is already waaaay to easy. I agree. Frankly having gates at all is silly. Quote: Using cheap tricks, which only ppl with way too much free time on their hands can afford to do, is encouraged. I wouldnt call using your brain cheap, but it certainly is usually one sided...because the pirates are prepared. Quote:** I dont want this to continue to happen. It will unless you do something about it. Get smart, get guts, or get out. Tbh, you sound like me...oh, about 11 monthes ago. Then I realized low sec is not to be feared. EDIT: Spellin ~Sobe Captain Cutie, Razor's Kiss What is your Radical Dream?
Sobeseki Pawi	Posted - 2005.05.23 20:00:00 - [19] Originally by: Joshua Foiritain Originally by: JoeSomebody Edited by: JoeSomebody on 23/05/2005 19:13:58 Originally by: Maxine Stirner Train predictive thinking to lvl 2 ya? and it gives you exactly what? Don't you all get it yet? It REMOVES strategy from the game, not adds it! So if you remove insta BM's, then choices when entering 0.4 reduce to simply: 1) goin there 2) not goin there Wheres thinkin in that? All your strategy reduces to the dumb luck and prays that system isnt camped. Added: oh almost forgot, yay for the new flavour of the day: noobship spyes! The question is, what kind of strategy can be found in Gate camping with snipers? That would be Tactics actually, the Strategy is involved with the bigger picture. ~Sobe Captain Cutie, Razor's Kiss What is your Radical Dream?
JoeSomebody	Posted - 2005.05.23 20:07:00 - [20] Originally by: Sobeseki Pawi whaaaa... whaaaa... whaaaaa... plz make me always win im sorry but i do not respond to a sensless offences from 13yrs old kid, which you clearly are judgin by your ingame bio. Just two points: 1) This isnt your game, and never will be. 2) Not everyone (even if he has to struggle thru rl) plays this game just to **** off other people. ____ When flying by Concord Customs Commander's Dominix I distinctly heard him saying "... world domination..."

Sobeseki Pawi	Posted - 2005.05.23 20:09:00 - [21] Originally by: JoeSomebody Originally by: Sobeseki Pawi whaaaa... whaaaa... whaaaaa... plz make me always win im sorry but i do not respond to a sensless offences from 13yrs old kid, which you clearly are judgin by your ingame bio. Just two points: 1) This isnt your game, and never will be. 2) Not everyone (even if he has to struggle thru rl) plays this game just to **** off other people. If what I said was offensive, you really wont ever be seen in my space. And I made prefectly reasonable points...I just think you are lazy..which is your entire arguement anyway. ~Sobe Captain Cutie, Razor's Kiss What is your Radical Dream?
JoeSomebody	Posted - 2005.05.23 20:33:00 - [22] Originally by: Sobeseki Pawi Originally by: JoeSomebody Originally by: Sobeseki Pawi whaaaa... whaaaa... whaaaaa... plz make me always win im sorry but i do not respond to a sensless offences from 13yrs old kid, which you clearly are judgin by your ingame bio. Just two points: 1) This isnt your game, and never will be. 2) Not everyone (even if he has to struggle thru rl) plays this game just to **** off other people. If what I said was offensive, you really wont ever be seen in my space. And I made prefectly reasonable points...I just think you are lazy..which is your entire arguement anyway. yes, im lazy in a way. I dint quit this game after 14 days for a reason and i would like this reason to remain in this game. Part of this reason is that i dont have to drag alt in noobship around just to check every system before i jump in, and I specificly would like this to remain the way it is. Because it is: 1) yet another timesink 2) unrealistic game feature like afk-mining, which i think is called griefing Anyhow, you already agreed on main point about gate-camping, and yet keep agruing. I assume this is just to prove that im dumb newb and you uber pvper. I find it offensive as well as remarks about my IQ. Im sorry, but that is not going to prove anything about removing instas from game. ____ When flying by Concord Customs Commander's Dominix I distinctly heard him saying "... world domination..."
Sobeseki Pawi	Posted - 2005.05.23 20:36:00 - [23] No the argument is about instas and access to 0.4. Focus. Why do you need an alt? That's just as cheap as all those tactics you lament. ~Sobe Captain Cutie, Razor's Kiss What is your Radical Dream?
JoeSomebody	Posted - 2005.05.23 20:39:00 - [24] Edited by: JoeSomebody on 23/05/2005 20:39:35 Originally by: Sobeseki Pawi No the argument is about instas and access to 0.4. Focus. Why do you need an alt? That's just as cheap as all those tactics you lament. your response makes no sense to me, plz explain your point about instas or stop botherin me. ____ When flying by Concord Customs Commander's Dominix I distinctly heard him saying "... world domination..."
Scimatar Wolff	Posted - 2005.05.23 20:42:00 - [25] I know allot off you guys want the instas removed but i think that they do have good use too. Not that using instas to every gate to avoid beeing killed might be that good, but because instas are bms and bms are used for allot of good things too i think it isnt a good idea to remove them. I usualy mark good belts or complexes from missions with bms. Eaven bms att gates are nice to have when i jump back and fourth from one system to another many times a day in secure space with my indy. =A= Live Long and Prosper =A=
Sobeseki Pawi	Posted - 2005.05.23 20:44:00 - [26] Originally by: JoeSomebody Edited by: JoeSomebody on 23/05/2005 20:39:35 Originally by: Sobeseki Pawi No the argument is about instas and access to 0.4. Focus. Why do you need an alt? That's just as cheap as all those tactics you lament. your response makes no sense to me, plz explain your point about instas or stop botherin me. While using your alt to scout shows...some thought, it doesnt show courage. Why cant you main scout in a ceptor? ~Sobe Captain Cutie, Razor's Kiss What is your Radical Dream?
JoeSomebody	Posted - 2005.05.23 20:46:00 - [27] Originally by: Sobeseki Pawi Originally by: JoeSomebody Edited by: JoeSomebody on 23/05/2005 20:39:35 Originally by: Sobeseki Pawi No the argument is about instas and access to 0.4. Focus. Why do you need an alt? That's just as cheap as all those tactics you lament. your response makes no sense to me, plz explain your point about instas or stop botherin me. While using your alt to scout shows...some thought, it doesnt show courage. Why cant you main scout in a ceptor? so u expect me to do lvl4's in ceptor? ummmmm, how about no? ____ When flying by Concord Customs Commander's Dominix I distinctly heard him saying "... world domination..."
Imhotep Khem	Posted - 2005.05.23 20:52:00 - [28] Not in a million years would this happen. Vastly too popular and would cr...Well we been here before. This whole thread is a troll. Only ones that ever want this is lazy deadbeat pirates too cheap to buy a mobile warp disruptor. Or too scared they may catch a shark in their net ____ If your not dyin' your not tryin'.
Maxine Stirner	Posted - 2005.05.23 20:55:00 - [29] Edited by: Maxine Stirner on 23/05/2005 20:56:55 As a person who thinks instas are cheating, I want to not always find myself within someone's optimal range, or have some maneuverability as a frig pilot versus large turrets. I don't mind always being within warp disruptor range even at 100km, especially if frigs and cruisers get a considerable speed boost. Locking times over 150km should take a lot longer than 35km locking times, even in a geddon. Enough time for the nimble frig to warp to the tiny sniper camp and nail them in place while backup arrives. Instas by themselves aren't an isolated problem. The problems will remain because they are complicated by other problems such as the instalocking, uber range/tracking, excessive damage, inability to chase people into warp, excessive ability to ss-log, problems of local chat, etcetera. You won't solve anything by picking on just one problem at a time, though it is reasonable to assume changes in one area will lead to a cascade of changes down the line. Also, ze Devs are doing jack all about it, so it is moot. Don't get so emotional.
Sobeseki Pawi	Posted - 2005.05.23 21:07:00 - [30] Originally by: JoeSomebody Originally by: Sobeseki Pawi Originally by: JoeSomebody Edited by: JoeSomebody on 23/05/2005 20:39:35 Originally by: Sobeseki Pawi No the argument is about instas and access to 0.4. Focus. Why do you need an alt? That's just as cheap as all those tactics you lament. your response makes no sense to me, plz explain your point about instas or stop botherin me. While using your alt to scout shows...some thought, it doesnt show courage. Why cant you main scout in a ceptor? so u expect me to do lvl4's in ceptor? ummmmm, how about no? Are you deliberately playing dumb or is this a natural side effect? ~Sobe Captain Cutie, Razor's Kiss What is your Radical Dream?



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