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Derisor
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Posted - 2005.06.23 13:34:00 -
[1]
There is a lot of talk about level 4 missions being a source of too much money. People can do them to make tens of millions at a time. Now personally i have a hard time with level 3s but then Im not a battleship driver so that is probably why.
Everything else that gains large amounts of money in the game has the large amount of risk of going to 0.0 attached to it. should level 4 missions be the same?
What do you think?
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The words "Exciting" and "Safe" are mutually exclusive; pick one. |
Roshan longshot
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Posted - 2005.06.23 13:37:00 -
[2]
Old issue, already been beat to death, for several weeks, and CCP seems to think they are ok where they are.
Free-form Professions, ensure no limetations on professions. Be a trader, fighter, industialist, researcher, hunter,pirate[/i] or mixture of them all.
[i]As read from the original box and from this site.
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MOOstradamus
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Posted - 2005.06.23 13:39:00 -
[3]
No. Shut up.
MOOrovingian  "Following & supporting EVE (since Jan 2001) is like wiping your arse with sandpaper."
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Tananda Vaakaja
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Posted - 2005.06.23 13:39:00 -
[4]
Unless something is done about "Ganking" my vote is No.. don't force people out to 0.0, you'll end up souring customer relations, and the amount of resultant "whinage" on the forums will be even worse than it already is...
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Kaalise
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Posted - 2005.06.23 13:43:00 -
[5]
I could go with 0.0 - 0.4 with possibly the odd really crappy agent in a system near thos that sends you into low-sec half the time anyway but only 0.0? That's a pretty bad idea. Of course if they could alter missions so that PvP setups and PvE setups were fairly similar, well, that would be different (and also about as likely to happen as a whelk surviving a supernova)now wouldn't it?
.+
(_) Fetch the holy hand grenade |
Deja Thoris
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Posted - 2005.06.23 13:44:00 -
[6]
 Originally by: MOOstradamus
No. Shut up.
^^
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Akilah Ashaki
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Posted - 2005.06.23 13:49:00 -
[7]
Edited by: Akilah Ashaki on 23/06/2005 13:49:27
I wouldn't go that far.
SL<0.5 seems a fair deal to me even if you're right, by any other mean you can make as much money as Lvl4 grinding in .5<SL<.0
Lvl4 agent rewards in Concord space doesn't make sense.
/me jumps in her flameproof suit
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Akaviri
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Posted - 2005.06.23 13:52:00 -
[8]
Well, 0.0 may be too far, 0.4 and lower is sufficient. It just doesn't make sense to me that there are tons of pirate faction battleships and installations in systems with a concord presence. Concord not shooting at small gate rats is one thing, but the hundreds of pirate faction battleships that get destroyed by mission runners every day in 0.9 systems don't make any sense from a roleplay perspective.
Since the Titan incident, the Gallente Navy shouldn't be allowing Serpentis to have entire fleets of battleships in the heart of the Federation, yet systems like Oursulaert are still full of serpentis battleships.
````````````` _ |\_
````````````` \` oo\
````````_____/ =__Y=
`````` /` `````` )
`_``` / ` , ``` \/\_.(\_/)
((____| `` )_--\ \_-`(x.x)
`------'`------` `--` (> <) Kitty pwns Bunny! |
Discorporation
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Posted - 2005.06.23 13:55:00 -
[9]
Originally by: MOOstradamus
No. Shut up.
[Heterocephalus glaber]
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Rexthor Hammerfists
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Posted - 2005.06.23 13:55:00 -
[10]
i think, the plan of ccp, making it impossible to run em alone is enough.
never done em so im not a big fan of em ;)
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jason hill
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Posted - 2005.06.23 14:13:00 -
[11]
unplug keyboard please
"THE HUMAN SHIELD" |
Thyro
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Posted - 2005.06.23 14:15:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Derisor
There is a lot of talk about level 4 missions being a source of too much money. People can do them to make tens of millions at a time. Now personally i have a hard time with level 3s but then Im not a battleship driver so that is probably why.
Everything else that gains large amounts of money in the game has the large amount of risk of going to 0.0 attached to it. should level 4 missions be the same?
What do you think?
Sure put lvl4 missions in 0.0 but bring all ore that gives zyd+mega into 1.0
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Joshua Foiritain
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Posted - 2005.06.23 14:17:00 -
[13]
Originally by: MOOstradamus
No. Shut up.
Word, though if possible id like that lvl 4 security agent from the FIO in Ours moved to low sec space 
[Coreli Corporation Mainframe] |
Derisor
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Posted - 2005.06.23 14:25:00 -
[14]
It boggles the mind how so many people cant state their opinion politely without being a complete jerk.
I guess good manners are out of fashion?
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The words "Exciting" and "Safe" are mutually exclusive; pick one. |
SengH
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Posted - 2005.06.23 14:25:00 -
[15]
Edited by: SengH on 23/06/2005 14:25:00
I'd prefer if 0.0 agents got a huge income boost. We dont get bounties, and the stupid tags dont sell for anything at all. EVERY time i get a blockade mission at the gates in HLW therse a 50% chance it'll end up as a PVP mission, the RISK of getting ganked is just NOT worth the reward. Also every once in a while my stupid survelliance agent gives me a important HAULING MISSION in 0.0 that gives crap and gave me a sec hit with concord. I was hauling antibiotics to treat an outbreak that affected civillians and concord gives me a sec hit? WTF. The risk is just NOT worth the reward of hauling something 20 ish jumps up the curse pipe just for 110k isk.
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Derisor
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Posted - 2005.06.23 14:27:00 -
[16]
Originally by: SengH
Edited by: SengH on 23/06/2005 14:25:00
I'd prefer if 0.0 agents got a huge income boost. We dont get bounties, and the stupid tags dont sell for anything at all. EVERY time i get a blockade mission at the gates in HLW therse a 50% chance it'll end up as a PVP mission, the RISK of getting ganked is just NOT worth the reward. Also every once in a while my stupid survelliance agent gives me a important HAULING MISSION in 0.0 that gives crap and gave me a sec hit with concord. I was hauling antibiotics to treat an outbreak that affected civillians and concord gives me a sec hit? WTF. The risk is just NOT worth the reward of hauling something 20 ish jumps up the curse pipe just for 110k isk.
Hmm I didnt know that. Probably because you were working for serpentis but I should ask if it is worth it living out there? Can you get the equipment you want and need?
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The words "Exciting" and "Safe" are mutually exclusive; pick one. |
Cliff Yablonski
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Posted - 2005.06.23 14:28:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Derisor
It boggles the mind how so many people cant state their opinion politely without being a complete jerk.
Ohh the irony 
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Thousand Fluffles
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Posted - 2005.06.23 14:28:00 -
[18]
Originally by: SengH
I was hauling antibiotics to treat an outbreak that affected civillians and concord gives me a sec hit? WTF.
But they were pirate civilians though, weren't they? You know how it works, giving comfort to the enemy, etc. 
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DrunkenOne
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Posted - 2005.06.23 14:38:00 -
[19]
Originally by: MOOstradamus
No. Shut up.
Take his advice.
They are already getting nerfed and will be apparently hard to solo. With that and the new introduction of zyd and mega in low sec ores, hopefully more people will start moving out of high sec.
[04:02:36] DrunkenOne > nelson 1v1?
[04:02:42] Nelson Vandermark > no atuk cheat
JaegerBomb Part 1
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Verone
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Posted - 2005.06.23 14:45:00 -
[20]
I'd say move all level 4 agents to low sec empire.
As far as the storyline/RP aspect of eve goes, it's a bit of a contradiction to the whole idea of concord having battleship pirate NPC's flying around in high sec empire space.
Of course, the empire huggers will flame this idea, even though if their beloved agents did get moved to low sec empire, they still can't be a target for most pirates who aren't willing to pack a scan probe launcher to find the deadspace areas their missions spawn in. 
Most people need to understand that moving the missions to lowsec or 0.0 will never happen, because so many people, particularly those who are funding alliances/large corps etc have a completely safe way to ISK farm in high sec empire space with no risk whatsoever, and if CCP were to move their agents, there would probably be a protest, and mass burning of pink panties from the empire hugging community.
WWW.SNIGG.CJB.NET |
Blind Fear
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Posted - 2005.06.23 15:24:00 -
[21]
If you have trouble with lvl 3 agent missions, you really arent qualified to say anything at all about lvl 4.
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Avon
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Posted - 2005.06.23 15:31:00 -
[22]
The problem with claiming lvl 4's will be fine because they will be harder, is that they were meant to be impossible to solo anyway.
Players will find ways to do it, simply because NPC's are predictable.
The best rewards should be in the areas with a higher risk.
That doesn't mean putting all lvl4's in low sec or 0.0, it means reducing the rewards of those which are not.
______________________________________________
Pay or pray..er..prey..yeah, pray you aren't prey. Er, just pay. |
Winterblink
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Posted - 2005.06.23 15:39:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Derisor
It boggles the mind how so many people cant state their opinion politely without being a complete jerk.
I guess good manners are out of fashion?
Take a cursory glance through the forums, you'll find the issue's already been discussed at length. We really didn't need another thread on the subject.
Also, keep in mind that online forums (especially gaming ones) aren't known as havens for the socially well-adjusted. You know this, you've been in the Neocron forums. Unless you're a different Derisor...
___winterblink/warp_drive_active/eve_nature_vraie// |
DrunkenOne
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Posted - 2005.06.23 15:46:00 -
[24]
Edited by: DrunkenOne on 23/06/2005 15:46:23
Originally by: Avon
The problem with claiming lvl 4's will be fine because they will be harder, is that they were meant to be impossible to solo anyway.
Players will find ways to do it, simply because NPC's are predictable.
Dunno, patch day I plan on sitting near a gaet in niya in a sigil with nanos picking up all the loot mission runners will lose when they try and kill frigs with torps.
[04:02:36] DrunkenOne > nelson 1v1?
[04:02:42] Nelson Vandermark > no atuk cheat
JaegerBomb Part 1
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Quanteeri
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Posted - 2005.06.23 15:51:00 -
[25]
Cheese on Wheat!!! This ones been done. Been Done Discussed, Been Done Resolved Even.
It was determined that there is no meaningful reason to move the agents around. That's why you get crappy loot for everything but 0.0, compared to prior to the last patch. All the good loot was where everyone was making their "real" money.
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Jane Vladmir
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Posted - 2005.06.23 15:57:00 -
[26]
I like the idea.
lvl 2 agents @ 0.5+
lvl 3 agents @ 0.1-0.4
lvl 4 agents @ 0.0
But hey, that'd force people to have a risk while making money, and we all know people don't like risk/reward.
Carebears
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nahtoh
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Posted - 2005.06.23 16:00:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Derisor
It boggles the mind how so many people cant state their opinion politely without being a complete jerk.
I guess good manners are out of fashion?
As had been mentioned your are reducing the dead hores to greasy stain on the floor...
Lets not forget you seem to be only looking out for yourself...
1. You liked stabs up untill you could not catch people.
2. 0.0 needed changed till you got out there.
3. You wanted powergaming/a lot of newbie help when you were low skilled.
4. I would guess your rat faction standing sucks and don't want to go back to empire space so you want all lvl4s moved to 0.0.
"I am not saying there should be capital punishment for stupidity, but
why can`t we just take the safety labels off everything and let the
problem solve itself" (credits to mcallister TCS)
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Noriath
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Posted - 2005.06.23 16:10:00 -
[28]
They should be moved into a black hole as far as I'm concerned.
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Derisor
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Posted - 2005.06.23 16:13:00 -
[29]
Originally by: Winterblink
Originally by: Derisor
It boggles the mind how so many people cant state their opinion politely without being a complete jerk.
I guess good manners are out of fashion?
Take a cursory glance through the forums, you'll find the issue's already been discussed at length. We really didn't need another thread on the subject.
Also, keep in mind that online forums (especially gaming ones) aren't known as havens for the socially well-adjusted. You know this, you've been in the Neocron forums. Unless you're a different Derisor...
When they implement a search function and dev tracker you can tell me to do this. Until then Im not going to page through thousands of posts every time I wish to post something.
Dont ***** at me, ***** at CCP.
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The words "Exciting" and "Safe" are mutually exclusive; pick one. |
IamBen
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Posted - 2005.06.23 16:16:00 -
[30]
with the new changes to pirate factions, rat hunting in 0.0 may become more profitable than agent mission whoring.
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Derisor
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Posted - 2005.06.23 16:18:00 -
[31]
Originally by: nahtoh
Originally by: Derisor
It boggles the mind how so many people cant state their opinion politely without being a complete jerk.
I guess good manners are out of fashion?
As had been mentioned your are reducing the dead hores to greasy stain on the floor...
Lets not forget you seem to be only looking out for yourself...
1. You liked stabs up untill you could not catch people.
2. 0.0 needed changed till you got out there.
3. You wanted powergaming/a lot of newbie help when you were low skilled.
4. I would guess your rat faction standing sucks and don't want to go back to empire space so you want all lvl4s moved to 0.0.
1) True. Unlike others, I will change my mind given appropriate evidence unstead of getting so entrenched in a position. Others are too obsessed with their pride to admit they are wrong sometimes.
2) ??? How so ? Try not to be so vague. What did I say about 0.0 that I didnt mean. The only example is that I think once I propsed sentries on gates there. Bad idea. But again, unlike you, i dont spend time looking in the mirror obssessed with myself. I can admit when Im wrong. 0.0 does need changes but that is because the game should evolve, not stagnate.
3) I still firmly believe the game is too unfriendly to newer players. That opinion hasnt changed. The fact that I am not any longer one of them is irrelevant.
4) Thats what you get for guessing about something you dont know jack about. Your guesses are so far off the mark it is amazing. The reasons I thought about moving those missions to 0.0 are clearly laid out in the original post. You just have to put away the mirror and stop admiring yourself long enough to read it.
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The words "Exciting" and "Safe" are mutually exclusive; pick one. |
Derisor
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Posted - 2005.06.23 16:19:00 -
[32]
Originally by: Jane Vladmir
I like the idea.
lvl 2 agents @ 0.5+
lvl 3 agents @ 0.1-0.4
lvl 4 agents @ 0.0
But hey, that'd force people to have a risk while making money, and we all know people don't like risk/reward.
Carebears
LOL ... exactly what I was thinking. They dont like it when I attack their sugar-daddy do they?
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The words "Exciting" and "Safe" are mutually exclusive; pick one. |
Winterblink
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Posted - 2005.06.23 16:26:00 -
[33]
Originally by: Derisor
When they implement a search function and dev tracker you can tell me to do this. Until then Im not going to page through thousands of posts every time I wish to post something.
Dont ***** at me, ***** at CCP.
I wasn't *****ing at anybody. Calm down.
___winterblink/warp_drive_active/eve_nature_vraie// |
Mistress D'Malice
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Posted - 2005.06.23 17:01:00 -
[34]
Moving them to 0.0? Never happen nor should it...
Either make lv 4 missions COMPLETELY un-soloable...or move them low sec. But sitting in 1.0 space while raking in 100's of millions is very bad for the economy.
------------------------------------------------
Black Lotus Official Forums - www.blacklotusclan.com
Contact Me - [email protected] |
Gabriel Karade
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Posted - 2005.06.23 17:29:00 -
[35]
I've found I make noticeably more from bounties/loot in a good 0.0 system than bounties/loot/rewards from low security space lvl4 agent (EQ 43).
Oh and they are generally incredibly dull, though more fun as a group.
(\_/)
(O.o)
(> <) "That's no ordinary rabbit!...that's the most foul, cruel and bad-tempered rodent you ever set eyes on" |
Burnhard Brutor
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Posted - 2005.06.23 17:37:00 -
[36]
Two things: firstly if you are solo'ing level 4's it's going to take a while to do the mission (depending on skills and setup) - I'm guessing you could probably mine Kernite for the same amount of time and not make a huge amount less in cash that way.
Secondly, as has been stated many times before, moving stuff into lower and lower sec doesn't encourage players to move into lower and lower sec. This has become something of an urban myth. People aren't pigeons following a trail of breadcrumbs. If you move them, less people will do them.
Putting them into 0.0 is a totally silly idea because most of 0.0 is locked down by one dumbass alliance or another - effectively making level 4 agent missions EXCLUSIVE to those alliances and not open to all (much like the good roids). If you look at the Eve demographic *and I can't emphasise this enough* A LOT OF PEOPLE QUITE LIKE BEING RELATIVELY SAFE BY HANGING ABOUT IN EMPIRE - and those people pay subs like everybody else, so they need content to keep 'em coming.
It's a No Brainer!!!! 
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Aitrus
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Posted - 2005.06.23 17:38:00 -
[37]
The fact that mission runners can drop 500mil on social skill drops, and bid 6 BILLION on faction ships should tell people something.
Heck, I went back to mission running a bit last week. Got the rogue drone mission twice in a row. Made 45mil in about an hour and a half off the minerals.
I mean, yeah, I LIKE making that kind of isk, but it can't be healthy to the game eceonomy.
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Burnhard Brutor
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Posted - 2005.06.23 17:41:00 -
[38]
Originally by: Mistress D'Malice
Moving them to 0.0? Never happen nor should it...
Either make lv 4 missions COMPLETELY un-soloable...or move them low sec. But sitting in 1.0 space while raking in 100's of millions is very bad for the economy.
No it isn't, when people are selling Tech II stuff for hundreds of millions. Are you saying you want the only way to become wealthy in Eve to be mining 0.0 roids or getting the lucky chance of a Tech II BP? Pleeeeeaaaasseee. Level 4's require time and effort to solo + also some risk (you have to concentrate believe it or not), effort should be rewarded.
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Aitrus
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Posted - 2005.06.23 17:45:00 -
[39]
Edited by: Aitrus on 23/06/2005 17:46:41
Originally by: Burnhard Brutor
Originally by: Mistress D'Malice
Moving them to 0.0? Never happen nor should it...
Either make lv 4 missions COMPLETELY un-soloable...or move them low sec. But sitting in 1.0 space while raking in 100's of millions is very bad for the economy.
No it isn't, when people are selling Tech II stuff for hundreds of millions. Are you saying you want the only way to become wealthy in Eve to be mining 0.0 roids or getting the lucky chance of a Tech II BP? Pleeeeeaaaasseee. Level 4's require time and effort to solo + also some risk (you have to concentrate believe it or not), effort should be rewarded.
Judging from your comments you've never lived in 0.0 and have no idea what real work and effort is. Living in empire is a cakewalk. Even 'trying really hard' to solo lvl 4's in your raven is easy. As you said, effort should be rewarded.
BTW, the only way people can sell tech II stuff for millions is because they HAVE the millions to spend. Again, people pay 500mil for skillbooks to increase LP rewards. Seriously, think about that.
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Gungankllr
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Posted - 2005.06.23 17:49:00 -
[40]
Quote:
Edited by: Zrakor on 23/06/2005 10:58:16
We don't have any plans of beefing up the rewards of the Navy ships this patch, but we did beef up the rewards of pirate mission running a bit. A few changes worth mentioning:
1) NPC navy tag offers more widely available.
2) New implant-giving important mission sequences added, more for the pirate agents than Empire.
3) Pirate implant offers implemented, these are of course only available for pirate agents, but for the non-pirate players out there you can still acquire them by killing officers in 0.0.
4) Running pirate missions will no longer directly affect your standing with CONCORD, however killing CONCORD officers in missions will of course still affect this standing (but there is always the decline option for those missions).
5) Running pirate missions will no longer destroy your standing with all Empire factions, instead it mainly just affects the direct rivals of the pirate faction you're working for and their allies.
6) We're lowering the bounties on big pirate complex rats (such as battleships) to limit the ISK cash cow that is high-level agent and complex running. Navy tag bounties remain unaffected with this change however, so that is in a sense a boost to pirate agents.
See part 6. I am starting to feel that the missile changes were a prelude to nerfing L4 missions, and not having the slightest thing to do with PVP.
I dunno. Maybe I'll go mine again.
www.hadean.org
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Astarte Nosferatu
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Posted - 2005.06.23 17:59:00 -
[41]
Yes, they should be moved into low sec space (0.4-0.0).
------------------------------------------
Follower of the Blood Revolution.
Sani Sabik. |
Karol Kei
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Posted - 2005.06.23 18:08:00 -
[42]
No, they shouldn't be yet another thing for alliances to farm.
Instead, they should be balanced to give proper rewards and boosted in difficulty.
Apparently 0.0 is getting some love too, with more officers etc in spawns, which ought to balance things a bit, too.
What is this "large risk" in 0.0 ISK farming (ratting, mining etc), BTW? To be ganked once every two months when AFK on a toilet break?
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Burnhard Brutor
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Posted - 2005.06.23 18:42:00 -
[43]
Originally by: Aitrus
Judging from your comments you've never lived in 0.0 and have no idea what real work and effort is. Living in empire is a cakewalk. Even 'trying really hard' to solo lvl 4's in your raven is easy. As you said, effort should be rewarded.
BTW, the only way people can sell tech II stuff for millions is because they HAVE the millions to spend. Again, people pay 500mil for skillbooks to increase LP rewards. Seriously, think about that.
I have lived as a member of CFS and Xetic in 0.0, so I know what it's all about thanks. What is the problem with people having millions to spend and people selling things for millions? What difference does it make? Add 3 zeros to the equation, remove 3 zeros. It's the same. Who cares?
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Mistress D'Malice
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Posted - 2005.06.23 19:08:00 -
[44]
Originally by: Burnhard Brutor
Originally by: Aitrus
Judging from your comments you've never lived in 0.0 and have no idea what real work and effort is. Living in empire is a cakewalk. Even 'trying really hard' to solo lvl 4's in your raven is easy. As you said, effort should be rewarded.
BTW, the only way people can sell tech II stuff for millions is because they HAVE the millions to spend. Again, people pay 500mil for skillbooks to increase LP rewards. Seriously, think about that.
I have lived as a member of CFS and Xetic in 0.0, so I know what it's all about thanks. What is the problem with people having millions to spend and people selling things for millions? What difference does it make? Add 3 zeros to the equation, remove 3 zeros. It's the same. Who cares?
The problem is that the only people that can effectively gain the billions are agent runners, high end miners before the bottom fell out and the select industrial entreprenuer(sp?).
Perhaps make it so when a ship is being destoyed in PvP, the capsule ejects but you can capture the ship? :P
------------------------------------------------
Black Lotus Official Forums - www.blacklotusclan.com
Contact Me - [email protected] |
nahtoh
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Posted - 2005.06.23 19:37:00 -
[45]
Originally by: Derisor
1) True. Unlike others, I will change my mind given appropriate evidence unstead of getting so entrenched in a position. Others are too obsessed with their pride to admit they are wrong sometimes.
2) ??? How so ? Try not to be so vague. What did I say about 0.0 that I didnt mean. The only example is that I think once I propsed sentries on gates there. Bad idea. But again, unlike you, i dont spend time looking in the mirror obssessed with myself. I can admit when Im wrong. 0.0 does need changes but that is because the game should evolve, not stagnate.
3) I still firmly believe the game is too unfriendly to newer players. That opinion hasnt changed. The fact that I am not any longer one of them is irrelevant.
4) Thats what you get for guessing about something you dont know jack about. Your guesses are so far off the mark it is amazing. The reasons I thought about moving those missions to 0.0 are clearly laid out in the original post. You just have to put away the mirror and stop admiring yourself long enough to read it.
Actually virtually all of your posts about things to be fixed seem to revole around what others can do that you can't...Heres what I consider to be the relevant part...
Everything else that gains large amounts of money in the game has the large amount of risk of going to 0.0 attached to it. should level 4 missions be the same?
What do you think?
You are now in 0.0 as you have posted when you were complaining about warp stabs. etc...
Lets take your point 2 shall we? All of your posts (that I have read) are about what you are doing at the time and what you concider to wrong with it, seems pretty self centered to me.
This thread maybe considered different unless we igonre the fact that you are now in 0.0 and maybe taking more risks than empire mission runners of which I am one but I am in and out of .4 normally 2 or 3 times a day on most days.
The core of your argument seems to be since you are runing risks why should it be possable for some one to make more or the same amount of ISK for the same/less risk. Now what could not be less self centered than that?
Riddle me this does the area you operate in have lvl4 agents? a simple yes or no answer is sufficent. I would have proven your point a lot better.
"I am not saying there should be capital punishment for stupidity, but
why can`t we just take the safety labels off everything and let the
problem solve itself" (credits to mcallister TCS)
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Miri Tirzan
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Posted - 2005.06.23 19:45:00 -
[46]
Why would level 4 agent missions be moved to zero land to be block from most the player base? Right now alliances claim entire regions and KOS anyone not a member of their alliance. So added to the fact that they get to mine all the good (rare) ores, they get the NPCs with the unnerfed drops, now they want all the agent missions to be out there just for them also.
Looks like a pretty big dog in that manger.
svetlana - "whining gets you stuff. that is why humans got to the top of the food chain and all the other animals got nerfed."
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Sha Dar
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Posted - 2005.06.23 20:55:00 -
[47]
I don't even do level 3 missions, so it wouldn't affect me, but I still say no.
As mentioned in a lot of other posts, approx 95% of the player base play in non 0.0 space.
Why should things be altered to favour the minority 5% just because they seem to whine the loudest ?
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Kular
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Posted - 2005.06.23 21:23:00 -
[48]
Move them to lower sec if you people must, but 0.0 never!
Empire people are happy now, 0.0 people have their crap
let us never speak to each other again thanks!
Home of Ubiqua Seraph
Eve's only all Sarum loyal corporation. |
Mistress D'Malice
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Posted - 2005.06.23 21:54:00 -
[49]
I think most people on both sides would be ok if they just made lv4 missions completely NOT soloable. No matter the ship or skills...you need a group of 3-5 people to finish them or something.
As it is now, agent runners in 1.0 space are completely safe and run no risk other thenthe mission itself. For the risk vs. reward ratio...who wouldn't run missions? If it wasnt so damn boring.
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Black Lotus Official Forums - www.blacklotusclan.com
Contact Me - [email protected] |
nahtoh
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Posted - 2005.06.23 22:57:00 -
[50]
Originally by: Mistress D'Malice
I think most people on both sides would be ok if they just made lv4 missions completely NOT soloable. No matter the ship or skills...you need a group of 3-5 people to finish them or something.
say 2 or 3 rather than 3 or 5 and yeah would not bother me. I run missions solo and I run them with corp mbrs and a couple of times random pilots in the system (when I started lvl4s and could not brack some tanks in my scorp).
The worst losses I had on missions was with wingmen (we twice agroed the entire lvl spawn).
solo more profit and groups more fun I find...
"I am not saying there should be capital punishment for stupidity, but
why can`t we just take the safety labels off everything and let the
problem solve itself" (credits to mcallister TCS)
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Derisor
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Posted - 2005.06.24 10:32:00 -
[51]
Originally by: Karol Kei
No, they shouldn't be yet another thing for alliances to farm.
Instead, they should be balanced to give proper rewards and boosted in difficulty.
Apparently 0.0 is getting some love too, with more officers etc in spawns, which ought to balance things a bit, too.
What is this "large risk" in 0.0 ISK farming (ratting, mining etc), BTW? To be ganked once every two months when AFK on a toilet break?
pffft ... spoken like an empire dweller. I have lived in empire and I have lived in 0.0 and I tell you that 0.0 is ooodles harder just to live.
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The words "Exciting" and "Safe" are mutually exclusive; pick one. |
Derisor
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Posted - 2005.06.24 10:33:00 -
[52]
oh and with the new entries into 0.0, the control that aliances have over it will be noticably diminished.
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The words "Exciting" and "Safe" are mutually exclusive; pick one. |
Funia
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Posted - 2005.06.24 11:16:00 -
[53]
No they should not be moved to 0.0!
why? course that would for one part seriously ruin my game! level 4 missions are the onely alternative for good isk making in Empire, compared to vast riches in 0.0 the alliances has the oppitunity to mone, and collect bountyes and get VERY good named stuff in the loot.
AND even though the 0.0 is beeing opend up, that dosent help a person with NO desire for PVP, and neither the skill's or mod's to do themn in.
i think it would be wrong to force PvP to players doing level 4's course thats what would happen....
"look here, a raven returning from a level 4 mission, OH! it onely has 1/4 hull and amor left LETs GET IT!!!!" GANK GANK GANK GANK!"
Thats more or less what would be a frequent occurance.
No animals was injured or felt any harm druing the production of this message
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Derisor
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Posted - 2005.06.24 11:56:00 -
[54]
There are ways to travel safely in 0.0. You just have to open your mind to them rather than sitting petrified in a corner afriad of the world.
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The words "Exciting" and "Safe" are mutually exclusive; pick one. |
Allen Deckard
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Posted - 2005.06.24 12:53:00 -
[55]
If they make npc's act more like real player in that they deliver various damage types and attack strategy's thus closer mimiking (sp) real player and forcing people to setup their ships in a way that also is more like a pvp setup then it wouldn't be nearly as bad.
Things like nos should also work against rats.
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AlexK100
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Posted - 2005.06.24 13:27:00 -
[56]
Originally by: Derisor
There is a lot of talk about level 4 missions being a source of too much money. People can do them to make tens of millions at a time. Now personally i have a hard time with level 3s but then Im not a battleship driver so that is probably why.
Everything else that gains large amounts of money in the game has the large amount of risk of going to 0.0 attached to it. should level 4 missions be the same?
What do you think?
Yeah. I think they all should be moved to GW.
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Miri Tirzan
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Posted - 2005.06.24 13:32:00 -
[57]
Yet another thread of "I want every one to play my way or not play at all!" Why dont you just play your way and leave the rest to play thiers?
The problem of ravens having a easy time with missions is going away so what is the point of this thread.
I have not had much problem doing missions in my Apoc till I got bored.
svetlana - "whining gets you stuff. that is why humans got to the top of the food chain and all the other animals got nerfed."
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Avon
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Posted - 2005.06.24 13:52:00 -
[58]
Originally by: Miri Tirzan
Yet another thread of "I want every one to play my way or not play at all!" Why dont you just play your way and leave the rest to play thiers?
This is the bit you just don't get, isn't it?
Everything you do in this game effects other players to a greater or lesser degree.
Your 'they aren't hurting anyone, leave them alone' viewpoint is blinkered and naive.
______________________________________________
Pay or pray..er..prey..yeah, pray you aren't prey. Er, just pay. |
Danton Marcellus
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Posted - 2005.06.24 14:04:00 -
[59]
Move the best agents to low secure space, keep the crappy ones at center and give out sets of missions requiring a pilot to travel far to complete them all and not go back and forth all the time like a pavlovian pet.
I remember getting an agent mission sending me into Syndicate space a long time ago. More of those but for the love of highly priced goods, put someone on the agent missions and make them make sense and be more diverse and immersive!
Convert Stations
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Winterblink
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Posted - 2005.06.24 14:09:00 -
[60]
Originally by: Derisor
There are ways to travel safely in 0.0. You just have to open your mind to them rather than sitting petrified in a corner afriad of the world.
There are plenty of easy ways into 0.0, yes. People have this mistaken impression that the second they step into 0.0, that system will be a fortress of some kind populated by gate gankers or something. Certainly there IS that chance... but most of the time it's simply not the case.
Originally by: Derisor
oh and with the new entries into 0.0, the control that aliances have over it will be noticably diminished.
I don't think control over huge areas is necessary / will be necessary, to be honest. A lot of systems go unused (for a lot of reasons). But with the new in-roads to 0.0 coming, it's going to be harder to defend territory, and I bet we'll see that territory contract somewhat to make it easier to cover all the bases.
___winterblink/warp_drive_active/eve_nature_vraie// |
Allen Deckard
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Posted - 2005.06.24 14:26:00 -
[61]
Originally by: Avon
Originally by: Miri Tirzan
Yet another thread of "I want every one to play my way or not play at all!" Why dont you just play your way and leave the rest to play thiers?
This is the bit you just don't get, isn't it?
Everything you do in this game effects other players to a greater or lesser degree.
Your 'they aren't hurting anyone, leave them alone' viewpoint is blinkered and naive.
I agree with miri myself. Please explain how it effects your game play in .0 when someone does a mission in empire.
Does it
effect the price of items? Maybe of tech 2 bpo's but not by much
effect the population of .0? Not by much most those doing lvl 4's don't want to pvp or not pvp every time they log in.
If your going to make a blanket statement explain why you think someone is so wrong. I am currious.
Personally I have never actually seen anyone explain how lvl 4's effect "their" gameplay besides complaining that someone else is making more isk than them.
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Avon
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Posted - 2005.06.24 14:37:00 -
[62]
Originally by: Allen Deckard
Please explain how it effects your game play in .0 when someone does a mission in empire
I am not in 0.0 space.
______________________________________________
Pay or pray..er..prey..yeah, pray you aren't prey. Er, just pay. |
Karol Kei
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Posted - 2005.06.24 22:35:00 -
[63]
Originally by: Derisor
pffft ... spoken like an empire dweller. I have lived in empire and I have lived in 0.0 and I tell you that 0.0 is ooodles harder just to live.
Likewise, lived in both. Funny, isn't it?
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Psym0n
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Posted - 2005.06.24 22:40:00 -
[64]
Originally by: Derisor
Now personally i have a hard time with level 3s but then Im not a battleship driver so that is probably why.
I can do lvl3's solo in an assault frigate......only one i have troulble with is "The Score" because of the webbifyer that warp scrambles me..
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Zarquon Beeblebrox
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Posted - 2005.06.24 23:19:00 -
[65]
Im glad tho to read that populating 0.0 is one of the developers bigest aim with the upcoming patch.
In the end after following ccp's changes to the game over quite some time. I can only say that they have proven to put in the best changes at the best time. And i dont see any reasons for them to not beeing able to do so again.
--
Lady Beeblebrox
Teddybears: Forum - movies |
Embattle
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Posted - 2005.06.24 23:40:00 -
[66]
Originally by: Jane Vladmir
I like the idea.
lvl 2 agents @ 0.5+
lvl 3 agents @ 0.1-0.4
lvl 4 agents @ 0.0
But hey, that'd force people to have a risk while making money, and we all know people don't like risk/reward.
Carebears
Shock horror.
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F'nog
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Posted - 2005.06.25 03:47:00 -
[67]
I'm surprised no one has mentioned the most obvious problem with this plan: there are NO stations in 0.0 for agents to work out of. Sure, there are a handful of pirate stations, but those already have agents. So, basically, the devs would have to add dozens, or even hundreds of stations to house all the agents, stations which have no RP reason to exist there. Or did you want all the agents to be from pirate factions and have hundreds of agent runners crammed into the same systems to such an extent that Nonni and co. as they are currently populated would then look deserted in comparison?
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Gamer4liff
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Posted - 2005.06.25 07:20:00 -
[68]
Originally by: Jane Vladmir
I like the idea.
lvl 2 agents @ 0.5+
lvl 3 agents @ 0.1-0.4
lvl 4 agents @ 0.0
But hey, that'd force people to have a risk while making money, and we all know people don't like risk/reward.
Carebears
That is the worst idea ever in the history of bad ideas.
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Deja Thoris
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Posted - 2005.06.25 07:37:00 -
[69]
Originally by: Mistress D'Malice
I think most people on both sides would be ok if they just made lv4 missions completely NOT soloable. No matter the ship or skills...you need a group of 3-5 people to finish them or something.
As it is now, agent runners in 1.0 space are completely safe and run no risk other thenthe mission itself. For the risk vs. reward ratio...who wouldn't run missions? If it wasnt so damn boring.
They can do this when they split agent rewards between the players. Until then - no!
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Poca Hontas
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Posted - 2005.06.25 07:49:00 -
[70]
Edited by: Poca Hontas on 25/06/2005 07:49:58
Originally by: Jane Vladmir
I like the idea.
lvl 2 agents @ 0.5+
lvl 3 agents @ 0.1-0.4
lvl 4 agents @ 0.0
But hey, that'd force people to have a risk while making money, and we all know people don't like risk/reward.
Carebears
brilliant idea...not
lack of stations in 0.0
almost every part of 0.0 is claimed by some group
no sense to put empire agents in pirate stations
but from a kcfos member i expect nothing else than a suggestion that would bring tons of easy targets to gank
ppl like you are the true carebears for whining about it that much and loud
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Gerome Doutrande
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Posted - 2005.06.25 07:50:00 -
[71]
Edited by: Gerome Doutrande on 25/06/2005 07:50:39
Originally by: Joshua Foiritain
Originally by: MOOstradamus
No. Shut up.
Word, though if possible id like that lvl 4 security agent from the FIO in Ours moved to low sec space
there is a very decent kill mission agent in uphallant for you, which fortunately also gives something else than small arms as bonuses. 
edit: and no don't move agents to 0.0 space.
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Engelious Angelion
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Posted - 2005.06.25 11:12:00 -
[72]
i can't see why any one has a problem with level 4 missions, removing Level 4 missions to 0.0 is totally the wort idea, with the worst arguments ive ever heard...
but you know what i'll make you a deal!
if the ore types from 0.0 becomes avalible in empire then FINE! you can have level 4 missions, no prob.. i'll just go mine Zyr!....
but as is, alliances and PvP people are the once in 0.0
IM NOT a pvp player, and i Enjoy the game type in empeire, i mine, Trade and do level 4s... and for me that's great fun.
I have no desire having to worry about who's gonna pod me as im returning with my mission loot in a hauler, or whos gonna pod me in my raven wich is down to hull after having to jump out of a mission!
but sure let's do the trade Empeire gets the rare ores, and 0.0 gets level 4's and well soon see who'll be complaining like CARZY becourse they arnt earning enoughf isk... and then the thread will read MOve the ores to 0.0 *lol*
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Avon
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Posted - 2005.06.25 12:27:00 -
[73]
Originally by: Engelious Angelion
i can't see why any one has a problem with level 4 missions, removing Level 4 missions to 0.0 is totally the wort idea, with the worst arguments ive ever heard...
but you know what i'll make you a deal!
if the ore types from 0.0 becomes avalible in empire then FINE! you can have level 4 missions, no prob.. i'll just go mine Zyr!....
but as is, alliances and PvP people are the once in 0.0
IM NOT a pvp player, and i Enjoy the game type in empeire, i mine, Trade and do level 4s... and for me that's great fun.
I have no desire having to worry about who's gonna pod me as im returning with my mission loot in a hauler, or whos gonna pod me in my raven wich is down to hull after having to jump out of a mission!
but sure let's do the trade Empeire gets the rare ores, and 0.0 gets level 4's and well soon see who'll be complaining like CARZY becourse they arnt earning enoughf isk... and then the thread will read MOve the ores to 0.0 *lol*
Read the info for the next patch - rare ores are comming to Empire space.
You going to stick to your word?
______________________________________________
Pay or pray..er..prey..yeah, pray you aren't prey. Er, just pay. |
nahtoh
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Posted - 2005.06.25 15:46:00 -
[74]
Originally by: Avon
Originally by: Engelious Angelion
i can't see why any one has a problem with level 4 missions, removing Level 4 missions to 0.0 is totally the wort idea, with the worst arguments ive ever heard...
but you know what i'll make you a deal!
if the ore types from 0.0 becomes avalible in empire then FINE! you can have level 4 missions, no prob.. i'll just go mine Zyr!....
but as is, alliances and PvP people are the once in 0.0
IM NOT a pvp player, and i Enjoy the game type in empeire, i mine, Trade and do level 4s... and for me that's great fun.
I have no desire having to worry about who's gonna pod me as im returning with my mission loot in a hauler, or whos gonna pod me in my raven wich is down to hull after having to jump out of a mission!
but sure let's do the trade Empeire gets the rare ores, and 0.0 gets level 4's and well soon see who'll be complaining like CARZY becourse they arnt earning enoughf isk... and then the thread will read MOve the ores to 0.0 *lol*
Read the info for the next patch - rare ores are comming to Empire space.
You going to stick to your word?
Now avon trace amounts are not what he means and you know it...
"I am not saying there should be capital punishment for stupidity, but
why can`t we just take the safety labels off everything and let the
problem solve itself" (credits to mcallister TCS)
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