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X'Alor
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Posted - 2005.06.25 22:55:00 -
[1]
Some are wondering about torp at 5 what it's like.
With torp 5 and current missle skills. Did not train any of the new advanced skills to possibly make them any better.
frigs: 10 to 60 damage. sometimes seen 70's.
cruisers: @100 average. up to 210 on hulls.
Painted targets: only one painter activated
frigs. 30 to 90
cruisers. didn't see much difference really: maybe 20 to 40 more damage to the above.
Stasis didn't try but should also make a difference, probably more than painters but need more time to check it out.
And you guys are really really really REALLY not gonna like torps on some the fast angel or mercenary BS's. The speed factor is way to great. Torps should do full damage on BS sized ships and if they are fast you'll be lucky to get cruiser damage out of torps 5 on fast BS's.
On the same note:
Apoc: T2 large beam skills. Multi xtal. painter. frig at 20km tach 2 averages 300 per shot. the absolute worst tracking large weapon.
Not to fair or balanced if ya ask me.
Looks like it's back to turrets.
Maybe one day caldari will get a turret based BS.
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Elve Sorrow
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Posted - 2005.06.25 22:57:00 -
[2]
10 to 60 is still way too much for torps vs frigs.
Oh well, maybe one day a Raven won't be able to hit frigs atall like the rest of us.
/Elve
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Kyoko Sakoda
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Posted - 2005.06.25 23:00:00 -
[3]
 Originally by: Elve Sorrow
Oh well, maybe one day a Raven won't be able to hit frigs atall like the rest of us.
...I think the point of the thread was that his Apoc was doing ~300 damage to frigs while torps did jack.
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Selim
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Posted - 2005.06.25 23:00:00 -
[4]
Let me guess, the frigate with the apoc had its mwd on, was not moving, and had was painted.
Any frigate that actually gets hit by a tachyon at 20km after the 'moon bug' is fixed deserves to die. This is coming from a primarily frig pilot.
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Elve Sorrow
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Posted - 2005.06.25 23:03:00 -
[5]
Must've been a retarded frigate pilot then.
/Elve
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Ithildin
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Posted - 2005.06.25 23:13:00 -
[6]
Edited by: Ithildin on 25/06/2005 23:13:49
Lasers aren't the worst tracking in game, Projectiles are. Both Railguns and Howitzers track FAR worse than Beams on ANY ship in the comparison.
Originally by: Kyoko Sakoda
Originally by: Elve Sorrow
Oh well, maybe one day a Raven won't be able to hit frigs atall like the rest of us.
...I think the point of the thread was that his Apoc was doing ~300 damage to frigs while torps did jack.
His point is that an Apoc doesn't hit for ~300 damage because it doesn't hit. The Torps always hit, but never hard.
To me this is symetrical balance, but I'll have to play test to see if it truely is balanced...
Oh, and if you fly straight at a turret, expect to be hit. Don't drink and drive... come to think of it, if you drink you might not be able to fly straight...
--
If TC causes you discomfort that you feel is unwarranted or may be outside TC's current contract - contact me, please. |
Elve Sorrow
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Posted - 2005.06.25 23:16:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Ithildin
come to think of it if you drink you might not be able to fly straight...
That would imply drinking and driving is good for a frigate pilot though. 
/Elve
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Nafri
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Posted - 2005.06.25 23:19:00 -
[8]
60 damage is waaaaayyy to high
6x 60, ieek, goodbye ceptors
No sig today |
Meridius
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Posted - 2005.06.25 23:26:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Nafri
60 damage is waaaaayyy to high
6x 60, ieek, goodbye ceptors
Yep.
Torps always hit, a tach isn't going to hit any non-retarded pilot at even 60km (w/out mwd painter bug).
________________________________________________________
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Kyoko Sakoda
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Posted - 2005.06.25 23:30:00 -
[10]
Edited by: Kyoko Sakoda on 25/06/2005 23:32:23
Last time I was fighting a frig on SiSi in a Raven, the mwd'ing interceptor was able to tank me at 11km.
Guess I'll have to see if that's changed.
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Pesht
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Posted - 2005.06.25 23:53:00 -
[11]
I thought torpedos can only go around 2800ms, a good interceptor can easily outrun that
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Altai Saker
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Posted - 2005.06.26 01:02:00 -
[12]
three volleys for a ceptor? hmm guess your guys in bs hae to gank them before they can get off three volleys is all...
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Cannedbeef
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Posted - 2005.06.26 01:15:00 -
[13]
He said 10-60 base for FRIGS
Interceptors have smaller sig radius AND move faster.
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Mac Knife
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Posted - 2005.06.26 02:27:00 -
[14]
Omg my uber torpedo boat can no longer kill a ceptor with 2 torps, OH NOES!! 
A tachyon beam has a hard time hitting my thron at 5kms, how the hell is it going to hit a frigate at 20kms?!?! even webbed target painted it MIGHT get a lucky shot off, other then that it ain't got a chance in hell of hitting it.
Seriously, the raven and other primeraly missile boats were the only ships able to hit a frigate for full dmg if their missiles hit them. Atm a Megathron with 7 425mm's cannot hit a frigate for jack at 20kms, yes it has drones, but so does the raven 
My advice, fit small guns and assault launchers, that will sort your problem.
Why does everyone think this patch is a nerf on missiles when really its making them better? 
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nahtoh
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Posted - 2005.06.26 02:28:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Selim
Let me guess, the frigate with the apoc had its mwd on, was not moving, and had was painted.
Any frigate that actually gets hit by a tachyon at 20km after the 'moon bug' is fixed deserves to die. This is coming from a primarily frig pilot.
well from what has been reported in the painter thread painters were not doing jack or very little on the test server to a MWDing Frig...
"I am not saying there should be capital punishment for stupidity, but
why can`t we just take the safety labels off everything and let the
problem solve itself" (credits to mcallister TCS)
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Maya Rkell
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Posted - 2005.06.26 02:31:00 -
[16]
Yea, but stick a couple on a BS then see how BS guns hits on that BS fare. It's quite nice.
"Corpse cannot be fitted onto ship. Only hardware modules can be fitted." |
Mac Knife
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Posted - 2005.06.26 02:32:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Maya Rkell
Yea, but stick a couple on a BS then see how BS guns hits on that BS fare. It's quite nice.
Agreed, today we had a geddon and thron fitted out with 3 target painters between them, when they painted a bs our dmg increased by a long way. Hitting the target harder with them on.
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keepiru
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Posted - 2005.06.26 02:44:00 -
[18]
Originally by: nahtoh
Originally by: Selim
Let me guess, the frigate with the apoc had its mwd on, was not moving, and had was painted.
Any frigate that actually gets hit by a tachyon at 20km after the 'moon bug' is fixed deserves to die. This is coming from a primarily frig pilot.
well from what has been reported in the painter thread painters were not doing jack or very little on the test server to a MWDing Frig...
effect of painters on MWD'ing ships has been sketchy. at least once during the last few test patches this week, painters would have no effect on an mwding ship (and interceptors were getting no signature bonus either).
wether theyve managed to fix it completely by now.. well i just havnt been bothered to test it, tbh
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The early bird might get the worm, but the second mouse gets the cheese. |
Maxine Stirner
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Posted - 2005.06.26 02:44:00 -
[19]
Try out your cruise missiles on the faster BS, then give us the report.
I fly BS, Cruisers, and Frigs, (everything but HACS) and I know that all are imbalanced because they aren't restricted to their proper roles.
DPS changes aren't enough. Qualitative rather than quantitative differences are needed to promote mixed fleets, and decrease reliance on focused fire tactics (outside of hull class niches).
Locking Times & Evil Asteroids |
Akaviri
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Posted - 2005.06.26 03:00:00 -
[20]
Originally by: X'Alor
Apoc: T2 large beam skills. Multi xtal. painter. frig at 20km tach 2 averages 300 per shot. the absolute worst tracking large weapon.
I think you meant to say "worst tracking large energy weapon." The 425mm Railgun has worse tracking even with a lvl 5 tracking bonus on the Megathron, and the 1200mm and 1400mm are even worse.
````````````` _ |\_
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`_``` / ` , ``` \/\_.(\_/)
((____| `` )_--\ \_-`(x.x)
`------'`------` `--` (> <) Kitty pwns Bunny! |
Leno
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Posted - 2005.06.26 06:36:00 -
[21]
/me pets cruise missles lvl 5....
wait.... i dont even fly missle boats, insta dmg 4tw
---------------
RIP - Smoske, My Friend
Coasterbrian > babies are good, especially raw
Coasterbrian > soft and crunchy at the same time
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Remedial
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Posted - 2005.06.26 08:50:00 -
[22]
In some cases it's better to have a smaller, constant DoT to a frigate that the frigate has no chance of avoiding, rather than sporadic damage that might kill the frigate if it lands, but probably won't land except for 1 out of 30 shots. If anything I think caldari BS will be the new small ship killers after patch since small ships simply cannot avoid missiles going 3-5km/s.
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Jim Steele
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Posted - 2005.06.26 09:16:00 -
[23]
Edited by: Jim Steele on 26/06/2005 09:18:37
Wow, torps hitting for 60 without any skills, my turrets (megapulseII) hit for 0 at close range 100% of the time with all lvl5's in gunnary bar traj analysis.
Only way i can kill intys is to spam them with cruise/torps currently, or web the **** out of them.
Edit: Also are the frigs using AB or a MWD, im sure fitting an AB to a crow now will make it invincible.
Real men, play Rugby |
Li1ith
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Posted - 2005.06.26 09:26:00 -
[24]
still. i want to know how mutch dmg in PvP a Raven all lvl5 can inflict on another BS.
and how fast at range. do u notich the torp hitting or other. do defenders suck now?
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Antic
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Posted - 2005.06.26 09:30:00 -
[25]
for PvE. I think these forums will start to fill up with threads once people try their missile ships in PVE after the 5th of july. Even with new skills maxed.
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Crellion
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Posted - 2005.06.26 22:43:00 -
[26]
Originally by: Antic
for PvE. I think these forums will start to fill up with threads once people try their missile ships in PVE after the 5th of july. Even with new skills maxed.
PvE after 5th of July? In a Raven? Whats that? Why do you think all lvl4 agent bases currently have 4-5 Ravens docking or undocking at any given time. Ravens gather isk now and on the 5th of July (or thereabouts as there will unavoidably be a few crashes the first 2-22 days) the Raven will be PvP (sniping) strictly. 
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X'Alor
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Posted - 2005.06.27 04:42:00 -
[27]
for all you that keep bring up inties...... um
FRIGS
and yes tach 2's hit very regular on FRIGS at 20KM and the BS sitting absolutely still. that is NOT the "hey i hit it once" number. Keeping in mind with my setup which included 2 tracking puter 2's and a painter with apoc sitting still.
That is not a standard gun characteristic of that gun.
it's the only way to get large guns to hit small ships.
They were normal frigs, not MWD frigs, not inties, not MWD inties.
and that was 300 AVERAGE DAMAGE. at 20 km with a painter(NO WEB) will abliterate that frig. I see as high ast 600 to 650 damage to frigs painted at 10km with the BS sitting still and nothing below 200.
And yes I meant to say worst tracking large energy weapon.
Inties will be even worse than those numbers.
What's funnier is all of you say 60 is too much. that was one out of a half load of torps needed to pop it.
most hit between 10 and 20.
the 60 was the wreckers.
and on cruisers that were not MWD'in. only got like 260 max damage on HULL with torp 5. HULL, you guys do reme,ber that hull has no resistances?????
Point being is the large tach can be made to hit frigs for big damage and often. A torp will never ever do full damage again and can't be made to hit like a tach can.
It is a very very imbalanced adjustment.
Back to turret ships for me.
Also worth a note. Had angel extravaganza to test it with. You know those fast BS's. Wait till you guys get a load of the damage you don't do BS to BS using torps just because it's fast. Pretty sad damage.
And that's BS to BS. screw the frig relationship.
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eve warrior
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Posted - 2005.06.27 04:49:00 -
[28]
To be honest a torp should pop a frig. There is a reason a BS cost 120mill and a frig only cost 200k. I dont use missiles much but on a sniper tempest a crusier launcher and a heavy nos are my main defence against ceptors and other fast Frigs. Now with the small amount of dmg its going to take way to long to kill them.
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X'Alor
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Posted - 2005.06.27 04:51:00 -
[29]
oh ya the new anti missle defence isn't defenders
it's an afterburner setup with 6 overdrives.
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Aldanor
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Posted - 2005.06.27 06:49:00 -
[30]
Edited by: Aldanor on 27/06/2005 06:49:36
Originally by: X'Alor
for all you that keep bring up inties...... um
FRIGS
and yes tach 2's hit very regular on FRIGS at 20KM and the BS sitting absolutely still. that is NOT the "hey i hit it once" number. Keeping in mind with my setup which included 2 tracking puter 2's and a painter with apoc sitting still.
That is not a standard gun characteristic of that gun.
urm does the frig even have a decent transverse? even at 60-80km i may get one shot per salvo hit my wolf at 350m/s transverse.... a wolf only gets hit for about 10dmg but still i would imagine by 20km they wouldnt be able to hit at all.... |
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