Hey everyone,

It seems quite simple. The OP is just trying to show that of the 3 turret based Marauders, all can fit the largest, most power hungry guns except the Vargur.

A Kronos can fit 4 425MM railguns, which alone puts it at 55.44% PG
A Paladin can fit 4 Tach 2's, which alone puts it at 88% PG
The Vargur, with 4 1400 Howitzer 2's, hits 130.33% PG

That is just guns.

Yes the fit examples the OP chose are stupid IMO. But they are just showing that the paladin and kronos can be fully fit with the largest available guns, while the vargur goes way over PG with just the guns and nothing else.

Now I can't tell you what this means in terms of usefulness. In many circles I always hear how the vargur is one of the best of the marauders, despite the fact that it cant easily fit 1400mm arties.

Paladin generally requires a fitting mod to be able to fit a tank.

Cant comment on Kronos as I don't fly it.

Vargur doesn't need arties, with autos it absolutely eats missions.

If OP is suggesting to use a marauder in pvp, then troll successful.

First, let us agree that it works fine as an AC boat in missions. More than fine, really - it's trivially better than a Rail Kronos (due to tracking, damage type, and range) and Tach Paladin (due to damage type). It's arguably better than the Golem (damage application to smaller targets, lack of painter fiddling, and better range). So, when AC fit it's better than all the other Marauders in their optimal configuration.

That means that you have another reason to want more grid on the Vargur - and that reason is either due to ammo consumption (maybe in WH space?) or due to you wanting to fit more things to an AC Vargur. The argument that you should be able to fit artillery just for the sake of fitting artillery is fallacious and total bunk as far as game balance goes.

You do briefly make the claim that Marauders are under performing in PVE, but don't really back that claim up. Do you think this because of the Mach? That seems pretty niche (and potentially wrong) to me.

-Liang

Ed: I'm not trying to be a **** here, but could you use proper sentences and paragraphs in your response? Coherency of thought would also be greatly appreciated because my trollese is getting fairly weak in my old age.

The Vargur does not need to fit arties in any way.

The OPs example with Tachs could incite a thread similar to this one if one were wanting to be a giant douchebag troll (as the OP is in this thread). So I guess it's best to just say that the Kronos is the only one that can really fit the longest range turrets?

-Liang

Blaster Kroni problem is Vindicator it is just better pvp/pve doesnt matter.

Sadly for you there is thing called inc,s and wh rats where dmg type is irrelevant and tracking is used on proper targets and range so it is worked with and both of dose ships(kroni,pali) will outperform AC vargur in alpha and overall dmg.(and if you think that short range Vargur can outperform NM or god forbid Vindicator with uber webs you don't have clue about incursions even mach will outperform it like no one business).

this is my 5th language and i do play game atm so bare with me..will edit shortly for more points.

You assume much and assumption is mother of all frackups so they say i rly don't give a shiet about more pg for AC vargur..i want Artys on my vargur sry to disappoint there.

Pve is not missions anymore and marauders suffer even further because it and varg is locked in AC without Huge investment in PG that's not ok.

Blaster Kroni problem is Vindicator it is just better pvp/pve doesnt matter.

And Vindicator will roflstomp varg ...NPC use traversal and mwd Vindi will end up applaying more dps due to webs that will stop target and then it is let me just apply this 1700 dps in you face against Vargur ~900?

Using a blaster Vindicator in wormhole content (which you bring up) is absolutely ********. The AC Vargur is superior in every possible way.

-Liang

Ed: Actually, maybe a blaster Vindi does alright in high level C5/C6 wormholes with capital escalations. I'm sure all the rats spawn on top of you and you're not webbed to **** and never able to apply any DPS.

Honestly, my advice to you is to ask for what you actually want. If you want to say that the Vargur (and hopefully Marauders in general!) need a boost for PVP then I'm sure you won't see a whole lot of push back for that. But really, just say so. The whole argument that there's this PVE hole that you can't fill with the Vargur because you desperately need 1400 Artillery with no fitting mods seems really weak (at best).

-Liang

And mine is they all can use skilled weapons and varg cant due to pg blocking it and even if it is not the case 1400mm varg couldn't be better than tach due to low dps low tracking and not much of optimal where tach paly choose what to shoot and when.

... all about incursions and no other kind of PVE content ...

Liang there is nothing wrong in asking that t2 ship fit t2 guns i would be here bitching for kroni/pali or golem if that was case.

i fly mach/vindi/bhaal/kronos/vargur

Saying that vargur is best or that i want it to be is well trolling it cant out dps many ships it cant out track many ships it cant out run many ships and making it able to use t2 guns like rest of em wont change that.

prove me wrong.

"Then get to bitching about the Paladin." as soon they nerf it pg il be there shaking fist and mention cancel all my accounts.

There you go with this "I think" business but have no numbers or EFT fits or anything to back it up.

-Liang

I'd like to see a slight grid boost for Vargur so it can comfortably fit 4 ACs, XL booster, and prop. Doesn't need to be anywhere close to fitting 1400s.