So you support a trade system like everquest where a trader must be logged in for their sale and buy orders to be active, and such traders would have to be present at the keyboard the whole time?

A character making a titan must be present at the keyboard and never log out while the titan is being constructed? Moon mining would require someone at the pos, logged in at all times?

Basically, since you are advocating people must be present to benefit in game, any passive activity either requires one has no job and plays from the toilet forgoing basic hygiene or in the least having a waterproof laptop or such activity should provide no benefit while away. Hmmm... Let's try it. Just blow up all the titans, moon goo, modules, etc that were produce or sokd while people were afk. Great way to rebalance the whole game and make it worthless.

agreed, remove auto repeat for all modules.

GǪthe exact same amount of minerals as A, since his barge fills up and then the ship just sits there doing nothing. He also did it at the exact same rate as A, and using normal gameplay, so it does in no way, shape, or form violate the rule you're referencing.

GǪwhich only leads to one conclusion: ATK mining produces more income than AFK mining, which belies your entire premise.

What you're describing isn't AFK mining GÇö it's botting, which breaks the EULA long before we even get to the subclause about accelerated acquisition.

I would like to point out that there was an issue not long ago where players in COSMOS sites would grab a Domi, drop sentry drones, target each drone with a remote armor rep and walk away, letting the drones kill whatever they killed for the entire day. CCP decided it was an exploit.

This issue seems fairly similar to that one.

oh really and how much player activity is behind moon mining?

Oh yeah... The HIC pilots will love watching their bubbles drop once the cycle completes, no more siege or triage mods running for multiple cycles. Heck, even server performance would take a hit in large fleet battles becausr every mod would have to be cycled back on meaning commands constantly sent to the server which have to be processed.

Heck, it would bring a whole new meta game to fights in systems with time dilation. Time your shots so they hit when mods shut off, before they can be reactivated due to dilation.

Do people really just troll this bad or not think thoughts through?

then again afk mining only exists for ice

This would fix a ton of latency, lag, overpopulation of certain zones, etc. this is brilliant and CCP should do this right away, log you out after 15-20 minutes

That depends you can feel free to debate what the original intended gameplay of trading, moonmining and other activities in another thread. This one is for debating the gray area around AFK mining.

Rock just takes 10 seconds of attention per account every 10?

I would like to point out that there was an issue not long ago where players in COSMOS sites would grab a Domi, drop sentry drones, target each drone with a remote armor rep and walk away, letting the drones kill whatever they killed for the entire day. CCP decided it was an exploit.

This issue seems fairly similar to that one.

You still have yet to prove there is a gray area around afk mining or that afk mining permits one to gain isk at an accellerated rate. So really, until that is accomplished, we can bring any factor we wish to this debate.

I would like to point out that there was an issue not long ago where players in COSMOS sites would grab a Domi, drop sentry drones, target each drone with a remote armor rep and walk away, letting the drones kill whatever they killed for the entire day. CCP decided it was an exploit.

This issue seems fairly similar to that one.

Are we getting into pedantry here?

Which means the rate is still accelerated compared to regular game play.

Botting would insinuate they are using a program, if the term botting is being expanded to AFK mining then the case is already solved.

You still have yet to prove there is a gray area around afk mining or that afk mining permits one to gain isk at an accellerated rate. So really, until that is accomplished, we can bring any factor we wish to this debate.

I spent much of last summer and fall helping my alliance do some moon mining

By capturing a little region called Tribute

and Vale of the Silent

all the while defending moons in Venal

You are incorrect I have highlighted a gray area in the EULA in the OP and am asking for CCP clarification.

No, accuracy.
If you want to change the scenario so that player B simply plays longer than player A, then of course he's going to end up with more minerals GÇö he played for longer at the same rate. The fact that A turned into drooling wreck by the constant drone of the lasers while B chose to make popcorn and remain sane instead doesn't mean that B is getting anything at an accelerated rate.

GǪexcept that there is nothing accelerated about the rate GÇö he's just playing longer.

GǪand by suggesting that B is able to get more for less interaction, you are saying that he's botting because if he aren't, the scenario you're describing doesn't take place GÇö B simply earns the same as A at the same rate as A, or he plays twice as long as A and thus accumulate twice as much stuff as A (still at the same rate as A), and either way, he's not getting anything at an accelerated rate.

Then I guess by your definition there that means AFK mining = botting.

Player B is literally getting more while investing the same time as player A

The EULA specifically mentions "other patterns of behavior" which does cover AFK mining.

Then I guess by your definition there that means AFK mining = botting. Player B is literally getting more while investing the same time as player A which means player B's rate will be accelerated when compared to player A who is playing via ordinary play. The EULA specifically mentions "other patterns of behavior" which does cover AFK mining.

You are incorrect I have highlighted a gray area in the EULA in the OP and am asking for CCP clarification.

Time investment on a player level is irrelevant. They both perform the same ingame actions at the same rate with player B having their character active longer thus reaping more reward. If you were trying to argue that playing longer was somehow an exploit you could use this argument, but trying to equate AFK'ing to botting doesn't work with this reasoning.

4, or 6 if you're lucky.
what the hell are you going to do in 6 mins? not a lot.

not when you compare it to ice's 20-30 mins.

You're thinking of at the speaker mining, which is perfectly doable while at work or watching TV for near 100% uptime.

Just because the strip stops doesn't mean you have to immediately run to start it again. It's afk mining, remember? It can be as simple as restarting strips every commercial break. I'll still fill a barge with ~5 mil worth of goods in under 45 min. And there's no one to bump or gank me. Hell, most days, the system I choose to mine, there's not another soul in the belt. I also get my pick of the high-yield variety rock. On an alt that lives in that system with minimal training (barge 3, yield doesn't matter because no 100% miner uptime, no ice training), ready to suck rock when I have a few spare minutes to warp out to a belt. I do it while, for example, playing with the kids - occasionally taking 30 seconds to step away and reset lasers.

I also have perfect refine at a station in system, when my main swings by to pick up the spoils. There are sufficient high range buy orders around for trit and pye that I don't even need to haul.

So you support a trade system like everquest where a trader must be logged in for their sale and buy orders to be active, and such traders would have to be present at the keyboard the whole time?

A character making a titan must be present at the keyboard and never log out while the titan is being constructed? Moon mining would require someone at the pos, logged in at all times?

Basically, since you are advocating people must be present to benefit in game, any passive activity either requires one has no job and plays from the toilet forgoing basic hygiene or in the least having a waterproof laptop or such activity should provide no benefit while away. Hmmm... Let's try it. Just blow up all the titans, moon goo, modules, etc that were produce or sokd while people were afk. Great way to rebalance the whole game and make it worthless.

Not that I think he is saying that... but it would definitely lend credit to being hardcore that's for sure. Would also eliminate a lot of the problems many threads are complaining about. Not to mention making risk vs reward a reality. In all elements.

You also "aquired" the belts in Tribute and Vale of the Silent with the same man hours and you defended the belts in Venal. That fact that this is overlooked does not mean it can avoided. It's definately not the miner's fault if the ressource he's gathering is seen as unworthy to fight for like moons are. If they were worth the same, you would not mention the time it takes to conquer/defend moons in null because it would be irrevelent since it would be shared.

Risk vs reward would be exactly the same. Time vs reward would be the one thing changing.