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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |

Zyress
Weapons of Divine Temper
134
|
Posted - 2013.04.18 14:37:00 -
[121] - Quote
Usually I find myself on the side of the victim in these forums but this time I have to go with the pirates. Gate guns have perfect tracking you will not speed tank them even in an interceptor which they will chew a hole through in no time. The smallest ship you can camp a gate in is a well tanked cruiser and that will have to warp off in fairly short order or go down in flames. Going into losec is and should be a risky proposition. Thats why they call it losec. Not a place to take a lone industrial. You need to be able to defend yourself (or have friends who can) or be able to run away, very quickly when you jump into a losec system. |

Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
13629
|
Posted - 2013.04.18 14:49:00 -
[122] - Quote
Beast of Revelations wrote:Let me take a wild guess. The griefers who infest these low-sec shitholes are the same posters on this thread telling me sentry guns are fine, and that sentry guns were never meant to do much beyond tickle gate campers. That's the fun thing about wild guesses: they are pretty much always wrong. Just like now. Not only was your guess wrong, but your basic premise is incorrect: no-one is talking about griefing here.
Quote:As to the second point, that's a damn lie because it has already been stated that CCP nerfed sentry guns to some sort of "ramp up" mechanic. GǪwhich never happened, so no, it's not a lie. Again, you only manage to show that you are very poorly informed about the things you're complaining about.
Quote:Quit with the narcissism and hallucinations of grandeur. You don't represent any 'community.' Actually, he does, as this thread shows. Not even the carebears agree with you, and your insistence on using personal abuse, lies, hyperbole, and hypocrisy as your only argument is not going to win anyone over. You are, in short utterly and completely clueless and need to pipe down and start to listen to what people are telling you.
You went to lowsec unprepared, and you died. It is as it should be. Stop winging about the game working as intended. Vote Malcanis for CSM8. |

Velicitia
Nex Exercitus
1390
|
Posted - 2013.04.18 14:52:00 -
[123] - Quote
March rabbit wrote:i could be wrong for sure but if you press "jump" then after your ships comes from warp and stops it will move to gates and jump. And "grid loading timer" will still protect you from anything bad. It would be great to know if i'm wrong here before i get some tasty lossmail 
You're not able to be targeted (grid-load invincibility for a second or 5), but smartbombs will still ruin your day. One of the bitter points of a good bittervet is the realisation that all those SP don't really do much, and that the newbie is having much more fun with what little he has. - Tippia Malcanis for CSM8 |

Jonasan Mikio
Hateful Munitions Totally Consensual
4
|
Posted - 2013.04.18 15:16:00 -
[124] - Quote
Beast of Revelations wrote:There isn't enough risk for stupid griefer pirates camping gates in these low-sec shitholes I have to pass through on occasion. Even small ships can tank the damage - some huge tank isn't required.
Buff the stupid sentry guns. There shouldn't be zero risk and 100% reward for these idiots. It's dumb.
That is all.
Some topics you should research my good man
1.) Scouts 2.) Neut Scouts 3.) Stabs 4.) Tanks (though shields are a bad idea cause they make you easier to blop imho) 5.) Friends 6.) Scouts 7.) Alts
Seems like you just dont have the required Certs to be in low sec, please see your local concord dealer to obtain the necessary testing materials and try again.
Or you could always just join my corp ;) Then you hauler will NEVER be safe. |

Akturous
Immortalis Inc. Shadow Cartel
108
|
Posted - 2013.04.18 15:27:00 -
[125] - Quote
Beast of Revelations wrote:Sentient Blade wrote:If you walk into a large camp and get killed, so be it, but yes, for anything bigger than a cruiser, the gate guns are pretty ineffective. I just checked. It was 3 CRUISERS. No other ships involved. No 'anything bigger than a cruiser.' No 'large gate camp.' 3 cruisers can instagank an industrial and get off scott free in a 0.4sec covered in sentry guns. Good job CCP.
Yes they can, stop flying t1 haulers into low sex, then dying a horrible fire to a couple of volleys from say and arty rupture and crying about it.
Use a blockade runner, deep space transport or a JF, but don't expect you can just waltz through low sec like it's perimeter and not lose your ship. Vote Item Heck One for CSM8 |

DSpite Culhach
Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic
83
|
Posted - 2013.04.18 15:36:00 -
[126] - Quote
The harshness of EVE is a design feature. Pretty much large sections of it's mechanics get often looked at and if it seems that if a new rule would make things too convenient, CCP will just slide it to the dangerous side.
EVE has large amount of mechanics, that, unfortunately, make zero sense from a sensible side of things, but make perfect sense when it's pointed out that they are meant to create conflict between players; the intrinsic ability for gate camps to exist at all is one of those, I mean, think logically for a second:
* CONCORD knows where every ship is in space, what that ship is, what its pilots are, and what sec status they have, etc etc, including their exact location in respect to the next gate they are camping. * They know that they have just killed a bunch of people in the last few minutes, and they don't bother to tell incoming ships directly. * They know that their gate guns are firing on hostiles at that very gate, and they don't tell incoming ships heading to that gate * etc etc.
Thank god in real life if a tanker explodes in the highway I'm heading down on, my GPS system actually gets update reports on traffic ahead and even suggests route changes as options.
So yea, I think it's CCP mechanics working as intended, and CCP does offer Blockade Runners to allow people to get around, so there's a decent balance in place.
Maybe one day we will get new shiny mechanics that will allow much more interesting methods of travel and much more interesting mechanics for hunting people down while they travel in that new way, so gatecamps become on-route ambushes, rather then feel like a bunch of hoons waiting just outside your doorstep ...
... till then I'm afraid, this is the mechanics we all have to deal with, and for the record, I can't actually come up with a better system in a pinch, although i recall Freelancer had an interesting gate travel mechanic. I suddenly woke up thinking I had a nightmare, then remembered I can't even fly Amarr Battleships. I add bits to this when I'm bored https://www.dropbox.com/s/foijsawsqolarom/EVE_Online.html |

Kali Omega
Immortalis Inc. Shadow Cartel
131
|
Posted - 2013.04.18 15:38:00 -
[127] - Quote
Beast of Revelations wrote:Tippia wrote: Ok. Here's how you do that: don't go up against three combat ships with a transport.
Oh, because that's the decision I made, right? To go up against 3 combat ships in a transport? Begone troll.
You jumped a non cloaky hauler through a low sec gate without a scout...and your suprised you died?
|

Beast of Revelations
Hedion University Amarr Empire
15
|
Posted - 2013.04.18 17:03:00 -
[128] - Quote
Tauranon wrote:However EVE allows for people to deny access to things (is a necessary facet of contention within the playerbase), lowsec makes it easier for people to deny you access to things, and camps are a necessary component of denying people access - ie all world pvp games have natural chokes.
LOL. I love it when people ascribe motives or intelligence or strategy to something when in reality it simply doesn't exist.
They aren't trying to 'deny access' to anything. They are sitting at a gate and pushing a button called 'fire' whenever anything jumps through. There's no motive or intelligence or logic to it. They just get off on griefing and seeing stuff go 'boom.'
Now, access may be denied, but that's entirely incidental. My car denied me access to a place earlier today because it failed to start. But it isn't as if the car was purposefully trying to do that as part of some grand strategy.
LMAO. |

Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
13637
|
Posted - 2013.04.18 17:07:00 -
[129] - Quote
Beast of Revelations wrote:They aren't trying to 'deny access' to anything. GǪaside from your access to the system and your ship and your cargo.
Quote:There's no motive or intelligence or logic to it. They just get off on griefing and seeing stuff go 'boom.' So there's motive, intelligence and logic to it (but still no griefing).
You keep using that word. It does not mean what you think it means. Vote Malcanis for CSM8. |

Riot Girl
RADIO RAMPAGE Initiative Mercenaries
676
|
Posted - 2013.04.18 17:08:00 -
[130] - Quote
Ban explosions. Oh god. |
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Jonasan Mikio
Hateful Munitions Totally Consensual
5
|
Posted - 2013.04.18 17:14:00 -
[131] - Quote
Riot Girl wrote:Ban explosions.
no no just nerf them... ;) |

Abrazzar
Vardaugas Family
1327
|
Posted - 2013.04.18 17:16:00 -
[132] - Quote
Replace the use of alt scouts with a right click option on gates: Check Destination.
This option will allow you to pay the gate owners a fee to get a 250km directional scan from the targeted destination stargate. The fee will depend on the faction standing and your security level and may be rejected if either is too low. Does not work on border gates. Only works in empire high and low sec. In 0.0 alliances with sovereignty can set the fee and access to this option, if they have sovereignty in both systems.
Alright, time to cloak. Mining Overhaul Nothing changed since 2008. |

Unit757
D-I-L-L-I-G-A-F Double Tap.
46
|
Posted - 2013.04.18 17:42:00 -
[133] - Quote
And people wonder why everyone hates high sec people? OP is a good indication of why  |

Roime
Shiva Furnace
2565
|
Posted - 2013.04.18 17:53:00 -
[134] - Quote
Abrazzar wrote:Replace the use of alt scouts with a right click option on gates: Check Destination.
This option will allow you to pay the gate owners a fee to get a 250km directional scan from the targeted destination stargate. The fee will depend on the faction standing and your security level and may be rejected if either is too low. Does not work on border gates. Only works in empire high and low sec. In 0.0 alliances with sovereignty can set the fee and access to this option, if they have sovereignty in both systems.
Alright, time to cloak.
This sounds good, with high sec status you could check hisec gates in hisec, and with negative sec status you could check lowsec gates. You will also need positive standings with the local pirate faction to check lowsec gates.
-á- All I really wanted was to build a castle among the stars - |

Roime
Shiva Furnace
2565
|
Posted - 2013.04.18 17:54:00 -
[135] - Quote
Beast of Revelations wrote:Tauranon wrote:However EVE allows for people to deny access to things (is a necessary facet of contention within the playerbase), lowsec makes it easier for people to deny you access to things, and camps are a necessary component of denying people access - ie all world pvp games have natural chokes. LOL. I love it when people ascribe motives or intelligence or strategy to something when in reality it simply doesn't exist. They aren't trying to 'deny access' to anything. They are sitting at a gate and pushing a button called 'fire' whenever anything jumps through. There's no motive or intelligence or logic to it. They just get off on griefing and seeing stuff go 'boom.' Now, access may be denied, but that's entirely incidental. My car denied me access to a place earlier today because it failed to start. But it isn't as if the car was purposefully trying to do that as part of some grand strategy. LMAO.
I'm afraid you are the one lacking intelligence.
Also, you get off from hauling pixels in an internet game.
-á- All I really wanted was to build a castle among the stars - |

Bizzaro Stormy MurphDog
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
86
|
Posted - 2013.04.18 18:17:00 -
[136] - Quote
Beast of Revelations wrote:
LOL. I love it when people ascribe motives or intelligence or strategy to something when in reality it simply doesn't exist.
They aren't trying to 'deny access' to anything. They are sitting at a gate and pushing a button called 'fire' whenever anything jumps through. There's no motive or intelligence or logic to it. They just get off on griefing and seeing stuff go 'boom.'
And you know the worst part of all this? These unmotivated, ignorant and illogical gate campers are successfully preventing 100% of EVE's playerbase from crossing into low sec from high sec. In fact, they are probable the first people that ever made it to lowsec, and have been preventing the use of all lowesec gates every since.
You are the victim here, and deserve restitution: don't let anyone else in this forum tell you otherwise (they're all just alts of the guys who attacked your poor damn bestower). But of course, you do realize that superstrong gate guns wouldn't have saved you anyways, because as you said (when rightfully pointing out that it is completely impossible to scout your own travel route) that they could just warp in real quick and still get you before the guns got them.
There are only two ways to fix it so that lone travelers can safely pass lowsec gates without risking being destroyed. The first is to make every ship that is on grid with a gate be totally invulnerable. This is the best choice.
The other choice would be to make certain gates "in" gates and certain gates "out" gates, and have the gate guns designed to instapop anyone going the "wrong way" on a gate. This is the second best choice.
A third option (that I don't like, but could accept) would be to make industrial ships invulnerable to damage at all times.
All these ideas would make EVE 10 times more enjoyable by ensuring that nobody dies on gates, and protecting people like the OP from being unfairly, unjustly, illogically, unmotivatingly, and other adverbly attacked.
In short, I agree with OP -
|

DeMichael Crimson
Republic University Minmatar Republic
6710
|
Posted - 2013.04.18 18:22:00 -
[137] - Quote
Andski wrote:DeMichael Crimson wrote:I agree, Gate Guns definitely need a serious buff by CCP.
Gate guns are supposed to be deadly. Right now they are nothing more than just a minor annoyance.
DMC No they don't, lowsec is supposed to be lowsec, not highsec. Who said anything about low sec / high sec?
Doesn't matter where the Sentry guns are located, they all belong to Empire Factions and as such should be something that's feared, not easily ignored.
As it is right now, gate guns are just a bad joke. They constantly rotate through targets, have low DPs along with limited range.
Tippia wrote:DeMichael Crimson wrote:Gate guns are supposed to be deadly. Right now they are nothing more than just a minor annoyance. Not really, no. They're meant to be an annoyance GÇö something you don't want against you in a fight, and they do just that. They remove the use of fast tacklers, drones, and unsupported ships, forcing a bit of co-ordination on the part of the aggressor. Nothing more is really needed, and each of these added requirements also means an additional point of weakness that can be exploited by people trying to get past the camp. If none of that works, then hey, it's lowsec GÇö if a gate is camped, just blow it up or bypass it. It's not rocket surgery. Typical, over-sensationalized statement yet still wrong. The only thing gate guns do is present a slight hindrance for gate campers, nothing more. I've seen plenty of small gang camps with drones deployed as well as solo campers.
DMC |

Rath Kelbore
The Six-Pack Syndicate Hashashin Cartel
363
|
Posted - 2013.04.18 18:40:00 -
[138] - Quote
Beast of Revelations wrote:Quote:Scouts and/or support works wonders for keeping industrials alive in lowsec Not everyone has the luxury of support. Not everyone has the luxury of a massive corporation or alliance to help them play the game. No, some people have to do everything on their own, by themselves. More news at 11.
Actually, you DON'T have to do stuff on your own. You are choosing to.
You claim they are camping at "no risk". This is not true. They risk that someone might actually come along and blow them up, and in addition to that they have gate gun fire on them. Just because you and your iteron or whatever isn't a risk to them, doesn't mean they aren't at risk.
You're the one with the mentality error. For some reason you think you should be able to take a defenseless ship into an area that gives you a ******* pop up warning, stating how dangerous it is, at no risk. I'll bet you think you should be able to take whatever goods you were trying to move and profit off of them in some way or another as well? All without any risk of losing it while in transport, even through low security space.
They took the time to assemble three people to keep industrials from moving freely through that system. Why can't you assemble at least three people to ensure safe passage of unarmed industrial ships through that system??? I'm sure you'll whine about them getting more people or something like that, but you could do the same. You won't, but you could. I plan on living forever.......so far, so good. |

Chandaris
Immortalis Inc. Shadow Cartel
314
|
Posted - 2013.04.18 18:47:00 -
[139] - Quote
BAD METER RISING
OVERLOLOLOLOAD DETECTED |

Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
13659
|
Posted - 2013.04.18 18:51:00 -
[140] - Quote
DeMichael Crimson wrote:Who said anything about low sec / high sec? The OP. Sentry guns are already scaled down (or up) depending on the security of the system, and the point of them being there is to dissuade the use of specific tactics. They have always been fairly easy to ignore. It is as it should be.
Quote:Typical, over-sensationalized statement yet still wrong. The only thing gate guns do is present a slight hindrance for gate campers, nothing more. I've seen plenty of small gang camps with drones deployed as well as solo campers. GǪso I'm right then, since you said pretty much the same thing. Drones die horribly to sentries and you can't rely on them to do damage. You still want to use them for decloaking, and if you are willing to pay for exceptionally expensive ammo, then sure GÇö go ahead and waste them. They're still not a camping weapon. What you're saying that the sentries do what they're supposed to do: they present a hindrance. Vote Malcanis for CSM8. |
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Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
7583
|
Posted - 2013.04.18 18:52:00 -
[141] - Quote
DeMichael Crimson wrote:Who said anything about low sec / high sec?
Doesn't matter where the Sentry guns are located, they all belong to Empire Factions and as such should be something that's feared, not easily ignored.
As it is right now, gate guns are just a bad joke. They constantly rotate through targets, have low DPs along with limited range.
There's plenty of hisec systems for you bears, please stop trying to get it expanded into lowsec. mine quotes from my posts at your peril, badposters TheMittani.com: The premier source for news, commentary and discussion of EVE Online and other games of interest. Malcanis for CSM 8 |

Chandaris
Immortalis Inc. Shadow Cartel
314
|
Posted - 2013.04.18 18:55:00 -
[142] - Quote
Tippia wrote: Drones die horribly to sentries and you can't rely on them to do damage. You still want to use them for decloaking, and if you are willing to pay for exceptionally expensive ammo, then sure GÇö go ahead and waste them. They're still not a camping weapon. .
omfg read your patch notes please.
sentry guns do not target drones any more and have not for quite some time now.
|

Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
13660
|
Posted - 2013.04.18 19:18:00 -
[143] - Quote
Chandaris wrote:sentry guns do not target drones any more and have not for quite some time now. GǪand the reason DMC has seen Gǣplenty of small gate camps with drones deployedGǥ is still not that they're any good for camping (quite the opposite) but because they have far better uses. The very recent change in Retribution does not change this.
You see, I don't particularly believe that he's been in lowsec ever any time recently, so it's all ancient history anyway.
Vote Malcanis for CSM8. |

Kali Omega
Immortalis Inc. Shadow Cartel
131
|
Posted - 2013.04.18 19:24:00 -
[144] - Quote
Also...OP...This game is a
SANDBOX
Nuff said |

Chandaris
Immortalis Inc. Shadow Cartel
314
|
Posted - 2013.04.18 19:25:00 -
[145] - Quote
drones are perfectly fine for camping, esp sentry drones.
they suffer dps application issues much like missiles do, that doesn't make them 'bad for camping' it just makes them ****** alpha-strike weapons. if you don't bring webs and bump ships to a gatecamp, you fail at life and should biomass now! |

DeMichael Crimson
Republic University Minmatar Republic
6710
|
Posted - 2013.04.18 19:31:00 -
[146] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Chandaris wrote:sentry guns do not target drones any more and have not for quite some time now. GǪand the reason DMC has seen Gǣplenty of small gate camps with drones deployedGǥ is still not that they're any good for camping (quite the opposite) but because they have far better uses. The very recent change in Retribution does not change this. You see, I don't particularly believe that he's been in lowsec ever any time recently, so it's all ancient history anyway. Thanks for proving you know nothing.
By the way, when was the last time you logged into the game and actually played it, other than to do skill training?
DMC |

Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
13663
|
Posted - 2013.04.18 19:38:00 -
[147] - Quote
Chandaris wrote:drones are perfectly fine for camping, esp sentry drones.
they suffer dps application issues much like missiles do, Eh, you mean Gǣmuch like turrets doGǥ, since that's the mechanic they use. And since you have to leave them behind should something go wrong (or if, say, you want to get away from the sentry fire in a hurry), and since the ships that can properly use sentires are rather horrid for camping, and since decloaking is a better use of the bandwidthGǪ no, I'd still qualify them as Gǣbad for campingGǥ.
Ok, fine, I suppose you could set them to aid the fast-tackler, but then we're back to waste of bandwidth. 
Vote Malcanis for CSM8. |

Chandaris
Immortalis Inc. Shadow Cartel
314
|
Posted - 2013.04.18 19:40:00 -
[148] - Quote
biomass now |

Varesk
Origin. Black Legion.
365
|
Posted - 2013.04.18 19:53:00 -
[149] - Quote
Dear OP.
Get a scout and stop crying. Even if the sentry guns were buffed, you still would have died.
|

Beast of Revelations
Hedion University Amarr Empire
21
|
Posted - 2013.04.18 19:54:00 -
[150] - Quote
I love the endless reams of straw man arguments.
"Oh, so you think you should be 100% safe when you do blah."
"Oh, so you think sentry guns should give you a 100% risk-free pass into low sec."
"Oh, so you think sentry guns should fight all your battles for you."
"Oh, just another high-sec risk averse carebear who blah blah blah..."
"Blah blah blah."
Nobody ever suggested anything of the sort. What somebody suggested was that sentry guns actually, you know, do something. What's their purpose? To chase off light tier 1 frigates? Are light tier 1 noob pilots the people CCP is trying to instill fear into with these sentry guns?
What someone suggested was that there be an adjustment to the risk/reward for mindless easy mode gate camping. Despite all protests to the contrary ("Oh, but these low-sec gutter pirates DO take on a lot of risk!"), I fail to see any merit to the claims. In fact, the claims are laughable. These low-sec gutter urchins can sit at the gate all day long in a couple of cruisers. Something comes through that's a little too tough for them to handle? They can simply do nothing and let it pass. Or warp away - whatever. Yeah, some "risk" haha.
Suggesting a different balance to some aspect of the game isn't all this "OMFG @*%$# pusy carebears want the game changed to suit them so they have 100% no risk play BLAH BLAH!" This forum is full of balance suggestions all over the place. All you have to do is go to the Features and Ideas Discussion to see page after page of upcoming balance changes being implemented. Yet no one accuses any of them of wanting to change the game to suit their carebear selves. Why? Because those discussions are about things like battleship balance, or large energy turrets. In other words, they aren't discussing mechanics that affect the cheap no-risk playstyle of a minority of gutter-snipe griefer low-sec 'pirates.'
Now go right back to more of your straw man arguments, arguing stuff that no one has ever suggested or said. |
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