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Sabriz Adoudel
AWOXalypse
358
   |
Posted - 2013.05.23 03:44:00 -
[1] - Quote
This idea has grown out of something mentioned in another thread that was (probably wrongly) posted in Science and Industry. I thought it had potential and so am fleshing it out here. This is a K-space idea. I don't see how to generalise it to W-space, or even if that would be desireable. If you spend time in W-space and have opinions on this, by all means share them.
The premise is simple. At unpredictable times, an NPC in a capital ship calls for help and the call for help is broadcast throughout the entire region. They have been tackled by a hostile entity and are being whittled down by attackers. If capsuleers do not intervene, the capital ship will lose the fight.
Because these events would be unpredictable and uncommon (but not overly rare), they wouldn't really be farmable like Incursions are. Instead, they'd be a driver for ad-hoc fleet fights.
The distress signal includes information on the system, a warpin point (also visible in-system like a cynosural field), and the two factions involved. Example:
You receive a distress signal from a Federation Customs Moros-class Dreadnought.
'Mayday, Mayday, Mayday. We are under attack in Vylade. Send urgent help. Attackers are Serpentis pirates. Our coordinates are (warp-in point) and Federation Customs will offer significant rewards to anyone that assists us.
followed by
Capsuleers, Serpentis Corporation will handsomely reward anyone that participates in helping us destroy this Federation Customs Moros and its capsuleer escorts. We'll keep CONCORD off your back.
Players can then choose to fight on either the side of the capital ship or its subcap aggressors. In empire, players that help the capital ship can legally shoot players that help the aggressors, and vice versa, creating opportunities for fleet fights.
Neither NPC side will attack capsuleers until they perform an action that declares their loyalty (shooting, remote repair, EWAR, etc).
Crimewatch consequences:
All players that activate a module to support the capital ship (including shooting an attacker) will get a new Crimewatch flag, 'Defender', allowing them to assist any other 'Defender' without Crimewatch repercussions (e.g. you can provide remote reps to a suspect flagged person or war target with Defender, without inheriting the suspect flag).
'Defender' also makes it a Crimewatch red card offense to shoot a Defender or to assist someone with the 'Attacker' flag. In highsec this means CONCORDOOKEN.
Likewise players that assist the attackers will get an 'Attacker' flag which mirrors the 'Defender' one. These flags both persist until the capital ship warps away or is destroyed, at which point rewards are paid to all those on the winning side. (Note that it is possible for the attackers to be entirely destroyed but the capital to be tackled by players loyal to the attackers until it is destroyed, in which case players with the 'Attacker' flag will win.)
On warping out of the site or being podkilled, you lose the ability to legally shoot event participants until you are back on grid.
Rewards:
The more lucrative and unique the rewards, the more likely players are to fight over them. As these events will blow up a lot of player ships and can't really be farmed, they can offer some good stuff, IMO.
Requirements to get rewards:
- To qualify for rewards, you need to remain on-grid, uncloaked, with active modules that do not affect your own ship and an 'Attacker' or 'Defender' flag for at least 5 minutes or 10% of the duration of the fight, whichever is longer. If you lose a ship while it has targetted modules (guns, RR, EWAR, ReSeBo, Remote ECCM etc) active, the 5 min/10% requirement is waived.
- This is intended to stop people AFK cloaking for rewards, and to get them actually participating in the fights.
- As the attackers will win without capsuleer interference anyway, fighting for the attackers does not offer rewards unless at least twenty capsuleers fight for the defenders.
Some ideas:
- Minimal loot/salvage/bounties on the wrecks. Think more like Incursions on this front and less like anomolies - the focus should be on winning the strategic goals of the fight, not ninjalooting everything. Looting capsuleer wrecks will make you a suspect.
- An ISK payout, shared equally between the winning team, equal to 60% of the total losses suffered by capsuleers on the losing team.
- A substantial number of loyalty points with the winning faction, given to each capsuleer that participates, OR a faction-specific reward of fairly low value to each participant (perhaps 2000 units of faction ammo to 50% of players and a random meta 6 faction module to the other 50%). If LP, think 3-4x what you get for a level 5 security mission.
- BPCs for faction ships, given out to a percentage of participants, including at least two brand new ships you cannot get any other way (maybe a faction Hictor for helping attack, and a faction logistics cruiser for helping defend)
- Low/Null only: In lowsec and nullsec, the abiity of players to cyno in reinforcements and capital ships means the NPC ships on both sides of the encounter can and sometimes should be larger. In these larger encounters (which might feature NPC supercapitals) some more lucrative rewards could be considered - faction dreadnought BPCs, meta 10-13 modules and the like.
Impact on in-game economy:
- A slight ISK faucet if considered on its own (assuming 5b losses on each side and a defender win, the defenders would share 3b ISK 'generated from nowhere' plus minor bounties).
- Lots of ships going boom stimulating manufacturing/trade
- Many players that usually run bigger ISK faucets (missions, incursions, anomolies) will likely take a break from those activities, reducing the faucet effect.
AWOXalypse is coming! https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2898431
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An enemy is a friend you stab in the front. |
Sabriz Adoudel
AWOXalypse
358
|
Posted - 2013.05.23 03:44:00 -
[2] - Quote
Reserved
AWOXalypse is coming! https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2898431
Buy shares: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=226618
An enemy is a friend you stab in the front. |
Sabriz Adoudel
AWOXalypse
358
|
Posted - 2013.05.23 03:44:00 -
[3] - Quote
Reserved.
AWOXalypse is coming! https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2898431
Buy shares: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=226618
An enemy is a friend you stab in the front. |
Dreus Vihane
Fweddit
I Whip My Slaves Back and Forth
0
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Posted - 2013.05.23 06:31:00 -
[4] - Quote
This is what incursions should be. |
sabre906
Old Spice Syndicate
Sailors of the Sacred Spice
1110
|
Posted - 2013.05.23 06:36:00 -
[5] - Quote
Dreus Vihane wrote:This is what incursions should be.
Go do null incursions.
Standings Improvement Service
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=19454 |
Matthias Vilmet
Parallax Shift
The Periphery
9
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Posted - 2013.05.23 18:02:00 -
[6] - Quote
I approve of this idea, (as it was mine in the science and industry forum).
I think that the distress signal should be scanned down as another type of anomaly. Like, 50% of all cool shows about space have been exploration shows... so we need more exploration in eve. |
Nikk Narrel
Infinite Improbability Inc
Unclaimed.
1728
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Posted - 2013.05.23 18:09:00 -
[7] - Quote
This could be a lot of fun.
+1
Cloaking being on a ten minute manual cycle timer? (Author: Bree Okanata)
Fine. As long as there is a ten minute timer for being docked in a station. Also, you can't stop moving in the game. Just add in a way so every ten minutes you are randomly warped to the nearest other player. Keeps people from going AFK. |
Sabriz Adoudel
AWOXalypse
364
|
Posted - 2013.05.23 23:17:00 -
[8] - Quote
sabre906 wrote:Dreus Vihane wrote:This is what incursions should be. Go do null incursions.
As far as I am aware, there has only ever been one fleet fight in a mothership incursion site. It was won by Rooks and Kings, who made a great video about it.
Most nullsec incursions happen in areas with secure sovereignty, making it difficult for anyone else but the sov holder to get there in incursion-fit fleets. You can run them in tech 1 hulls with tech 2 fits, but why bother? It's more efficient to run highsec ones in blinged hulls.
Plus, nullsec incursions offer only ISK. Why would you fight a null entity for their incursion when you could fight them for their Tech/Neo moon (or post Odyssey, fight for one of the new top tier moons)?
Matthias Vilmet wrote:I approve of this idea, (as it was mine in the science and industry forum).
I think that the distress signal should be scanned down as another type of anomaly. Like, 50% of all cool shows about space have been exploration shows... so we need more exploration in eve.
Yeah I took your idea as inspiration, but I made it much more about driving player conflict and ad-hoc fleet fights than your original approach.
Your idea would lead to solo players or maybe small gangs scanning down the site and doing it - I'd rather see something driving larger fights.
AWOXalypse is coming! https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2898431
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An enemy is a friend you stab in the front. |
Mole Guy
Xoth Inc
Unclaimed.
100
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Posted - 2013.05.24 10:42:00 -
[9] - Quote
awesome idea.
+1
buying a fit nado to do some lr sniping-120m
paying for a month of eve-550m
shooting my friends and/or corpies for lawlz because they joined the attacker side when i was on the defender side? priceless. |
Zappity
Kurved Space
97
|
Posted - 2013.05.24 10:54:00 -
[10] - Quote
Good idea. This sort of hybrid PvE to PvP is badly needed. Signed.
Hooray, I'm l33t! -á(Kil2: "The higher their ship losses...the better they're going to be.") |
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ExAstra
Echoes of Silence
109
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Posted - 2013.05.24 11:31:00 -
[11] - Quote
I would love this. Absolutely love it. I would totally go roaming to assist the Federation against their enemies in a way that was less of a mission grind like FW.
Save the drones! |
LtauSTinpoWErs
Mafia Redux
Phobia.
9
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Posted - 2013.05.24 17:47:00 -
[12] - Quote
interesting idea...i like it +1 |
Dodger Roger
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
0
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Posted - 2013.05.24 18:48:00 -
[13] - Quote
I really like the idea but fear corporations taking advantage of it. If a well organized corporation picks a side and has a proper fleet comp, the randoms and lone wolfs will have a very hard time trying to take them down.
IE a 50 man fleet picks the side of the attacker and kills anything that lands on grid to defend. They have 10 logi with them and any amount of unorganized fire they do take is easily repped up.
Not really sure how to fix it, or if it should be fix or if it falls into this is eve. |
Zappity
Kurved Space
100
|
Posted - 2013.05.24 23:54:00 -
[14] - Quote
Dodger Roger wrote:I really like the idea but fear corporations taking advantage of it. If a well organized corporation picks a side and has a proper fleet comp, the randoms and lone wolfs will have a very hard time trying to take them down.
IE a 50 man fleet picks the side of the attacker and kills anything that lands on grid to defend. They have 10 logi with them and any amount of unorganized fire they do take is easily repped up.
Not really sure how to fix it, or if it should be fix or if it falls into this is eve.
Still plenty of other sites for lone pilots to go after (and I fly solo). The answer to your large fleet problem is another large fleet.
Hooray, I'm l33t! -á(Kil2: "The higher their ship losses...the better they're going to be.") |
BlakPhoenix
Veni Vidi Vici Reloaded
Darkspawn.
20
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Posted - 2013.05.25 01:21:00 -
[15] - Quote
I like this! |
Sabriz Adoudel
AWOXalypse
375
|
Posted - 2013.05.25 11:36:00 -
[16] - Quote
Dodger Roger wrote:I really like the idea but fear corporations taking advantage of it. If a well organized corporation picks a side and has a proper fleet comp, the randoms and lone wolfs will have a very hard time trying to take them down.
IE a 50 man fleet picks the side of the attacker and kills anything that lands on grid to defend. They have 10 logi with them and any amount of unorganized fire they do take is easily repped up.
Not really sure how to fix it, or if it should be fix or if it falls into this is eve.
If the rewards are done right, that 50 person fleet might just be willing to take a newbie or ten along with them. But to be honest, this is EVE - where numbers are a trump card in any fight that is about achieving a strategic objective.
The random nature of the timing of these events would likely discourage huge fleets, unless the rewards are overtuned. It does after all take time to organise 100 people into a PUG fleet.
AWOXalypse is coming! https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2898431
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An enemy is a friend you stab in the front. |
Sabriz Adoudel
AWOXalypse
376
|
Posted - 2013.05.27 23:40:00 -
[17] - Quote
Couple minor changes to the earlier posts.
AWOXalypse is coming! https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2898431
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An enemy is a friend you stab in the front. |
Cesare Randor
0
|
Posted - 2013.05.28 06:17:00 -
[18] - Quote
Fantastic Idea. I would love to see this.
It's such a no-brainer. This should totally be implemented. |
Dodger Roger
Pinnacle Salvage
1
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Posted - 2013.05.29 19:35:00 -
[19] - Quote
CCP please add this! |
Sabriz Adoudel
AWOXalypse
416
|
Posted - 2013.06.11 11:39:00 -
[20] - Quote
Now that Odyssey is out and this forum is back to being about discussions of new ideas rather than refinement of CCP's existing ideas, I'm going to give this a little bump.
An enemy is just a friend that you stab in the front. |
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Sura Sadiva
Entropic Tactical Crew
430
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Posted - 2013.06.11 11:53:00 -
[21] - Quote
Sabriz Adoudel wrote:On the 'why':
One major failure of Incursions, IMO, is that while they are competitive, at least in highsec where most of them are run, they encourage a form of competition that is not like EVE competitiveness.
Incursions should have been placed in low and null only since day one; and I suspect this was the original incursion design and compliant with the original overpowered rewards they gave. HS incursions was a major mistake.
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Tchulen
Trumpets and Bookmarks
The Volition Cult
412
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Posted - 2013.06.11 11:54:00 -
[22] - Quote
Great idea! This is the first thing I've read for ages which might actually get me to keep a character in high sec. |
Sabriz Adoudel
AWOXalypse
421
|
Posted - 2013.06.12 12:30:00 -
[23] - Quote
Tchulen wrote:Great idea! This is the first thing I've read for ages which might actually get me to keep a character in high sec.
Wasn't really my intention, but shaking up player behaviour works wonders for a competitive game
An enemy is just a friend that you stab in the front. |
TehCloud
Carnivore Company
55
|
Posted - 2013.06.12 12:37:00 -
[24] - Quote
Quite a good idea.
But make it:
- lowsec only.
- not possible to light a cyno inside
- forbidden for rookie ships to enter (no km whoring)
- not a region wide distress, just a few systems and you get a popup telling you the system. Make people search for them.
- have decent enemies. No 200dps BS but let them have some decent firepower.
My Condor costs less than that module! |
Sabriz Adoudel
Federal Defense Union
437
|
Posted - 2013.06.17 00:54:00 -
[25] - Quote
TehCloud wrote:Quite a good idea. But make it:
- lowsec only.
- not possible to light a cyno inside
- forbidden for rookie ships to enter (no km whoring)
- not a region wide distress, just a few systems and you get a popup telling you the system. Make people search for them.
- have decent enemies. No 200dps BS but let them have some decent firepower.
With those changes, I feel this idea would serve a totally different purpose.
My idea was to drive fleet fights in all sorts of space by giving everyone in the area at the time a strategic goal worth fighting for. Your idea sounds much more like a way to incentivise medium sized gangs roaming lowsec space. (Which also is worth doing).
I'd be quite happy to see cynos go up in these in low/null. Even if three-quarters of the time the side that warps in capitals just wins the fight on the spot, every now and again you'll have a big escalation where those on the other side will respond to a 4 carrier and 2 dread drop by dropping three supercarriers and two titans. And then if the carrier/dread pilots have the capacity to escalate, you have the potential for an Asakai sized fight.
An enemy is just a friend that you stab in the front. |
max ericshaun
Ekchuah's Shrine Comporium
Kill It With Fire
4
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Posted - 2013.06.17 02:36:00 -
[26] - Quote
This sounds like a really great idea  +1 |
TehCloud
Carnivore Company
56
|
Posted - 2013.06.17 08:48:00 -
[27] - Quote
Sabriz Adoudel wrote:TehCloud wrote:Quite a good idea. But make it:
- lowsec only.
- not possible to light a cyno inside
- forbidden for rookie ships to enter (no km whoring)
- not a region wide distress, just a few systems and you get a popup telling you the system. Make people search for them.
- have decent enemies. No 200dps BS but let them have some decent firepower.
With those changes, I feel this idea would serve a totally different purpose. My idea was to drive fleet fights in all sorts of space by giving everyone in the area at the time a strategic goal worth fighting for. Your idea sounds much more like a way to incentivise medium sized gangs roaming lowsec space. (Which also is worth doing). I'd be quite happy to see cynos go up in these in low/null. Even if three-quarters of the time the side that warps in capitals just wins the fight on the spot, every now and again you'll have a big escalation where those on the other side will respond to a 4 carrier and 2 dread drop by dropping three supercarriers and two titans. And then if the carrier/dread pilots have the capacity to escalate, you have the potential for an Asakai sized fight.
Light a Cyno outside, and warp the (super)capitals inside manually, makes it a little bit more risky to field those since they are floating around somewhere in space before they actually start to turn the tides of a fight completely.
You don't want those sites to become permanent lagfests in which the side that can field more capitals wins by default. People would be discouraged to go in there if they wouldn't have vast numbers of support caps themselves.
My Condor costs less than that module! |
Sabriz Adoudel
Paragon Blitz
489
|
Posted - 2013.07.02 02:54:00 -
[28] - Quote
TehCloud wrote:Sabriz Adoudel wrote:TehCloud wrote:Quite a good idea. But make it:
- lowsec only.
- not possible to light a cyno inside
- forbidden for rookie ships to enter (no km whoring)
- not a region wide distress, just a few systems and you get a popup telling you the system. Make people search for them.
- have decent enemies. No 200dps BS but let them have some decent firepower.
With those changes, I feel this idea would serve a totally different purpose. My idea was to drive fleet fights in all sorts of space by giving everyone in the area at the time a strategic goal worth fighting for. Your idea sounds much more like a way to incentivise medium sized gangs roaming lowsec space. (Which also is worth doing). I'd be quite happy to see cynos go up in these in low/null. Even if three-quarters of the time the side that warps in capitals just wins the fight on the spot, every now and again you'll have a big escalation where those on the other side will respond to a 4 carrier and 2 dread drop by dropping three supercarriers and two titans. And then if the carrier/dread pilots have the capacity to escalate, you have the potential for an Asakai sized fight. Light a Cyno outside, and warp the (super)capitals inside manually, makes it a little bit more risky to field those since they are floating around somewhere in space before they actually start to turn the tides of a fight completely. You don't want those sites to become permanent lagfests in which the side that can field more capitals wins by default. People would be discouraged to go in there if they wouldn't have vast numbers of support caps themselves.
That would work too, although it may need new tech for localised cyno blocking. Anything that gets more capital ships fighting (and exploding) is a good thing.
An enemy is just a friend that you stab in the front. |
Sabriz Adoudel
Paragon Blitz
575
|
Posted - 2013.07.29 23:17:00 -
[29] - Quote
Still would love to see this.
Nothing quite like watching lots of ships go boom.
An enemy is just a friend that you stab in the front. |
Job Valador
Super Moose Defence Force
139
|
Posted - 2013.07.29 23:35:00 -
[30] - Quote
ill get behind this as well
"The stone exhibited a profound lack of movement." |
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