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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 8 post(s)
Narwz Zerglingz United 5	Posted - 2013.06.11 14:07:00 - [1] - Quote Exploration & Hacking Fixed an issue with relic and data sites appearing empty or despawning prematurely. Site signatures no longer disappear after the sites have been partially completed. Now all cans that contain loot have to be hacked or exploded for the site to despawn. I'm not even... Best fix CCP, you got to the core of what is the problem here and fixed it in flawless way!
Joshua Foiritain Coreli Corporation Ineluctable. 210	Posted - 2013.06.11 14:12:00 - [2] - Quote Entire regions are going to be littered with unfinished sites nobody wants and no new ones will spawn until someone actually goes and clears out the garbage. I'm glad i can log on right after DT :) Coreli Corporation: Small gang PVP & Drug Production, Apply now!
Diablo Aeglaeca Diabolos AEGLAECA Dark Empire Alliance 3	Posted - 2013.06.11 16:19:00 - [3] - Quote Narwz wrote: Exploration & Hacking Fixed an issue with relic and data sites appearing empty or despawning prematurely. Site signatures no longer disappear after the sites have been partially completed. Now all cans that contain loot have to be hacked or exploded for the site to despawn. I'm not even... Best fix CCP, you got to the core of what is the problem here and fixed it in flawless way! yah, good change. I like. But the consequence of said change will create now "cherry pickers" who will cargo scan the sites, cherry pick the best loot and leave the junk behind for the next hopeful sap. Now if they could just remove the cargo scanner ability to cheat the "random" part of the site and we will be just about right lol
imbaRabbit Suddenly rabbit 8	Posted - 2013.06.11 16:21:00 - [4] - Quote It's not even in their interest to leave the cans open. So they'll blow it up. The easiest way to blow them up is: turn on analyzer and close the game. Do that twice in a row and the can is destroyed.
Zhilia Mann Tide Way Out Productions 1287	Posted - 2013.06.11 16:53:00 - [5] - Quote imbaRabbit wrote: It's not even in their interest to leave the cans open. So they'll blow it up. The easiest way to blow them up is: turn on analyzer and close the game. Do that twice in a row and the can is destroyed. Seriously? That's all it takes? Awesome.
imbaRabbit Suddenly rabbit 8	Posted - 2013.06.11 16:56:00 - [6] - Quote Yes, that's all what it takes. Tried it and it works. But I see the next 'nerf': move containers 50 KM from each other in site, so you have to 'waste' time by moving from one to another. I think 50 KM is maybe optimal especially if you place it in a shape of a sphere. It's either burn to the next container or burn outside in the warp range which takes more time :P.
Elfred Gam'Havoc Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State 0	Posted - 2013.06.11 17:07:00 - [7] - Quote Out in null containers are already spread that far - or farther - around some of the sites. Yes, cycling the hack 2x will cause the can to blow.
Ms Valkyrie State War Academy Caldari State 2	Posted - 2013.06.11 17:27:00 - [8] - Quote This is not a good change. All it means is that you will be scanning down more useless sigs and then feel obligated to blow up the site. I agree that the despawn timer was pretty short, but I would prefer a longer despawn timer over being forced to despawn the sites myself.
Fr00b Snap Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic 3	Posted - 2013.06.11 17:35:00 - [9] - Quote Best part is that cloaking doesn`t despawn site anymore.
Paul Uter School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State 1	Posted - 2013.06.11 17:44:00 - [10] - Quote Thank gods CCP did not adress the real issue.

Nam Dnilb Universal Frog 27	Posted - 2013.06.11 17:56:00 - [11] - Quote So, scanning the good cans then blowing them up? Is this a viable griefing tactic in 0.0? Do 0.0 people care? It seems to go along well with an AFK cloaking character.
Sipphakta en Gravonere 4S Corporation RAZOR Alliance 148	Posted - 2013.06.11 19:36:00 - [12] - Quote I think you are misunderstanding the change. Before today's patch, when you completed one can, the Signature disappeared, i.e. you needed combat probes to find the ship doing the site. They have not changed the Site despawning when at least one can got completed and you warp out and stay off-grid for X minutes. I wish I were a cat. That way, I could kill things and people would applaud - instead of screaming out "OH GOD NO, NOT MY DAUGHTER!"
imbaRabbit Suddenly rabbit 10	Posted - 2013.06.11 19:46:00 - [13] - Quote Sipphakta en Gravonere wrote: I think you are misunderstanding the change. Before today's patch, when you completed one can, the Signature disappeared, i.e. you needed combat probes to find the ship doing the site. They have not changed the Site despawning when at least one can got completed and you warp out and stay off-grid for X minutes. You're misunderstanding the change. If you open one can, the site will not de-spawn. All containers have to be opened or destroyed in order for site to de-spawn.
Narwz Zerglingz United 5	Posted - 2013.06.11 19:50:00 - [14] - Quote Sipphakta en Gravonere wrote: I think you are misunderstanding the change. Before today's patch, when you completed one can, the Signature disappeared, i.e. you needed combat probes to find the ship doing the site. They have not changed the Site despawning when at least one can got completed and you warp out and stay off-grid for X minutes. "Now all cans that contain loot have to be hacked or exploded for the site to despawn."
Zhilia Mann Tide Way Out Productions 1287	Posted - 2013.06.11 19:57:00 - [15] - Quote imbaRabbit wrote: Sipphakta en Gravonere wrote: I think you are misunderstanding the change. Before today's patch, when you completed one can, the Signature disappeared, i.e. you needed combat probes to find the ship doing the site. They have not changed the Site despawning when at least one can got completed and you warp out and stay off-grid for X minutes. You're misunderstanding the change. If you open one can, the site will not de-spawn. All containers have to be opened or destroyed in order for site to de-spawn. Rabbit has it right. They don't go away. You could, if you wanted to troll everyone, hack all but one can and the site would persist until someone bothered with that last one. Even if the site has no one in it.
Robert Caldera Caldera Trading and Investment 578	Posted - 2013.06.11 20:07:00 - [16] - Quote very very sad change.
Cypher Decypher Caldari Deep Space Ventures Tribal Band 17	Posted - 2013.06.12 00:05:00 - [17] - Quote Silly change. Not thought out properly. Explorers especially in highsec will now be leaving low-value/empty cans. They won't explode them. Why should they? There's a lot of competition in eg. Metropolis. The more crud you leave trailing behind you, the more they'll be delayed scanning it down..
Hrian d'Chick Hrian Trading 0	Posted - 2013.06.12 00:28:00 - [18] - Quote After doing some scanning tonight, here is what I noticed.. the number of sites I find dropped drastically, probably due to sites not respawning properly. Where I found 20 sites before DT, I found like 5 afterwards, 2 of which were already half cleared, with all but one can hacked. While the sig vanishing might have been a problem, changing the respawn mechanics pretty much killed exploration for now. At least until people catch up and start clearing sites properly, but that still means no exploration for the next few days, unless you can do it right after DT, which is just BS. Removing the ability to scan cans would not really solve the issue of cherry picking, as after a number of sites you can pretty much tell that some cans are simply worthless.. 9 out of 10 times, and its not worth opening them 9 times just to get that little value out of them for the 10th. So just going by the type of the can to be hacked, one can pretty much tell what difficulty and loot quality he can expect. In my opinion, sites should still despawn after like an hour or two if they have been started (at least one can hacked or hack attempted on them). Also, drone region sites you cannot clear by just blowing up the cans, as if you fail there, you get npcs spawned on you. So you have to hack the cans to actually complete the sites. Not to mention how horribly bugged the loot can drops are in those sites. They spawn all over the place, sometimes 5-6km away from you. I can only hope CCP realizes this and fixes it sooner rather than later.
Ciriaco Waldvogel Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation 0	Posted - 2013.06.12 00:30:00 - [19] - Quote What a bad solution to the cherry picking problem. Just blocking scanning of the cargo and it goes back to random, the way it should be.
Johan Toralen Clockwork X3 97	Posted - 2013.06.12 01:55:00 - [20] - Quote I hope this is not so that sites get cleaned up and fresh sites spawn after downtime. That would be a massive advantage for some players, disadvantage to the rest. Wasn't it like that in the past and it sucked? I'm not against the change per se. Unfinished sites will help ease the market situation a bit. Smart explorers who know where to look will still find fresh sites. But the eventual despawn has to be consistent with when the first container was hacked. Perhaps after 4, 6, 12 hours or whatever would be adequate. Ciriaco Waldvogel wrote: What a bad solution to the cherry picking problem. Just blocking scanning of the cargo and it goes back to random, the way it should be. I've seen a couple voices against the cargo scan. But tell me how a solo explorer would ever get a bpc from a relic site with no cargo scanner? Who would collect data cans and miss out on the t2 loot for this slim chance? Cargo scan isn't the issue. The issue is a spew mechanic designed for group activity that is impossible to balance for serving its purpose while not being unfair to solo explorers. The cherry picking wasn't an issue with the old system. I also find the cargo scan gives at least a bit of depth to running the sites. Otherwise the loot spew would be completely dull. I get excited when i see i valuable bpc on the scan and then pray that nobody disturbs me and the minigame fairy is good to me.

Ms Valkyrie State War Academy Caldari State 2	Posted - 2013.06.12 03:07:00 - [21] - Quote I am confused on the comments regarding downtime. Downtime really doesn't effect anything most of the time. The unfinished sites are still going to presist through downtime and since sites are no longer gaurnteed to be generated after downtime that begs the question as to how does downtime matter at all? The only time downtime is going to come into play is when a site is going to despawn naturually due to age. Really hope the despawn mechanic gets changed rather quickly, as it stands now exploration is pretty much dead for me. Of the sites I found today there were only a few fresh ones. Realistaclly when people realize that they should be finishing the sites, are they really going to do it? I sure ain't. Why would I despawn a site that potentially doesn't even benefit me? It is just a waste of time and ill leave a dead site for someone else to get fruhstrated with.
Maddan69 Sickology 15	Posted - 2013.06.12 03:19:00 - [22] - Quote Cargo scanning of the hackable cans needs to go. I haven't used a cargo scanner to run data/relic sites and I can pull in good isk just by making a snap choice for going with certain cans or not. This is how it should be... not scan the can then instantly know what type to go for when the loot explosion happens. Out of 5 sites I ran today 3 were cherry picked. This change is just making things worse not better.
Robert Caldera Caldera Trading and Investment 578	Posted - 2013.06.12 08:01:00 - [23] - Quote without cargo scanning you could completely remove data sites, because 98% of all cans in find in those sites dont contain anything but worthless stuff. From 10 data sites I cargo scan, there are maybe 1-2 cans worth hacking at all - if I couldnt cargo scan I wouldnt even bother showing up there at all.
Ikonia Royal Amarr Expeditions 65	Posted - 2013.06.12 12:16:00 - [24] - Quote From my experience the sites do despawn, at least in null sec. When u just drifting around for like 10 minutes, everything just explodes. And no matter if you are cloaked or not, if the containers are hacked, scanned or just left as they are. I was drifting ine one when my phone rang, so i had to afk. After bout 10 minutes all containers exploded. So, NO cloaked waiting inside a data or relic site as a pirate. Love that :) Nobody needs them anyway, hehehe.
imbaRabbit Suddenly rabbit 21	Posted - 2013.06.12 12:26:00 - [25] - Quote Well, I've hacked a site. I got all containers which I wanted, and then I've went away in hope that it'll de-spawn. It did not, even after an hour when I was coming back down the pipe. I've found the same signals (I'm writing signals down, so I don't need to re-scan same signals). When I came in system, I've seen the same signal name which was odd to me. Luckily for me, I've saved few of those locations and guess what: they sites did not de-spawn, and it was totally same site. Well, then I've read the patch notes and have proceed to cause a de-spawn by destroying all the cans which I've left before. I have no clue how did that happen or not, and I'm not sure when did you test it out. But after yesterdays patch, the sites don't de-spawn if you don't access\destroy all the cans.
Ylariana School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State 35	Posted - 2013.06.12 13:14:00 - [26] - Quote Robert Caldera wrote: without cargo scanning you could completely remove data sites, because 98% of all cans in find in those sites dont contain anything but worthless stuff. From 10 data sites I cargo scan, there are maybe 1-2 cans worth hacking at all - if I couldnt cargo scan I wouldnt even bother showing up there at all. Which is how it should be. Fix 1: Remove Cargo Scanning of data relic sites Fix 2: Remove Spew Can mechanic and go back to the old looting system. You still get the "work for your bacon" that CCP seems so bloody keen on, while not being able to cherry pick and also preventing Data/Relic sites deliberately being left with bugger all in them to slow down your competition. Exploration, by definition is a Lone Ranger type activity, since 2 people cover more ground and find more stuff when they AREN'T together........ which is, in every world but EVE the actual bloody point of exploring...... to find stuff ..... Whatever idiot OK'd this new system needs a slap in the dish. Its got more holes in it than Rab C Nesbitts string vest ! look him up if youve never heard of him
Mnemosyne Gloob Acerbus Vindictum Stealth Wear Inc. 105	Posted - 2013.06.12 15:41:00 - [27] - Quote Johan Toralen wrote: But tell me how a solo explorer would ever get a bpc from a relic site with no cargo scanner? Who would collect data cans and miss out on the t2 loot for this slim chance? Yes well maybe you just have to miss out on it then. I mean if CCP hadn't made this strange system with the different containers the way they have (who picks up scrap cans anyway), we wouldn't have this 'problem'. I am pretty sure CCP can make it so that the sig doesn't disappear when you open a can, but that the despawn timer is triggered - as it used to be - i haven't checked, but maybe it is like that now. The problem (i guess not for the bears) was that the sig would vanish, even if the site was still there. Now if the site stays after the 'valuable' cans are hacked, i guess that should be investigated. Some of course will like it as a way of trolling, some hate it because sites clutter up their area, and the majority will be ignorant of it. [If anyone has explored angel lowsec some 2 years ago or so - idk if it's fixed - you should have come across a similar situation with the ded 5/10s there] But yeah idk. Either we need to wait a bit until things even out again, or the prof sites should be looked at again. IMO theres something not right when tiny little frigs can farm sites in nullsec - or this is intended and the market will force a new equilibrium.
Johan Toralen Clockwork X3 99	Posted - 2013.06.12 16:40:00 - [28] - Quote Mnemosyne Gloob wrote: Yes well maybe you just have to miss out on it then. That doesn't compute with CCP's promise that the spew would be fair to solo explorers. Also it would lower the demand for the already oversupplied t2 loot. CCP thought the cap rig bpc's would set that problem off. How's that supposed to work when only a tiny fraction of the spawned ones will be found by accident? Anyone really believe that exploration will take off as a widespread group activity? I most certainly don't.
Cthulhu Fthagn Yaxchilan Nocturnal Legion 0	Posted - 2013.06.12 19:10:00 - [29] - Quote Full of half-empy sites now... Takes so much of the excitement away.
Moth Eisig The Trident Brotherhood 10	Posted - 2013.06.12 20:01:00 - [30] - Quote Maybe this is the solution for the low skill point entry levels. Now the main entry barrier will be the player's capacity for tediously sifting through worthless sites instead of the character's skill investment. But if we're using tedium as the solution, aren't we right back to where exploration was pre-Odyssey?



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