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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Haram Zada
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Posted - 2006.01.09 14:15:00 -
[91]
Buy a sigil and fit 2 tractors.
Now you will earn a small fortune collecting loot cans by helping people at lvl4 missions.
Heck you dont even need the tractos, as a fully nanoed out sigil does close to 900m/s with a t2 ab, or 800m/s with a t1 version
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Andrue
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Posted - 2006.01.09 19:07:00 -
[92]
 Originally by: Sochin
Christ you carebears are whiny.
QFT
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(Battle hardened miner)
[Brackley, UK]
WARNING:This post may contain large doses of reality. |
Adonis 4174
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Posted - 2006.01.09 19:31:00 -
[93]
Originally by: Abram Linco
You mean a high tech piece of equipment like a warp drive? It doesn't even take science to produce a warp bubble and sling a ship through space at FTL. Now that's high tech.
No, that's old tech. There have been centuries spent refining the warp drive's user interface to make it easy for regular users to operate. Tractor Beams are only a recent development and are thus only available to people who can make them work themselves without relying on control software which is still in development.
Quote:
Any module is simply a piece of hardware. I don't see why it takes science to operate any of them actually. That's like saying you have to have a degree in electrical engineering to use your tv or to use the computer you're using right now.
Until recently you did need specialised knowledge. I remember fondly having to open up my personal computer to push down every connector in the hope of getting it to work again. My grandfather used to tell me how he had to align the television aerial perfectly to get reception in his area. He had even made his own larger-than-usual aerial to get a better shot at it.
First you make it work, then you make it easy to use. Televisions got there a few decades ago, computers only made it in the 90s. Tractor beams will get there someday.
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Caldari battle chef
I was a geek before it was cool |
Quanteeri
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Posted - 2006.01.09 20:07:00 -
[94]
Edited by: Quanteeri on 09/01/2006 20:10:51
Originally by: Sochin
Christ you carebears are whiny.
Agreed.
Honestly, these things don't really require that much. Science and Engineering 5 are both like 5 day skills, that any self respecting pod pilot will want/need anyway.
If your a Industrialist/Scientist, Science 5 is a must; for Combatants, Engineering 5 is a must. And both intermingle well in a general high quality skill set.
And as far as the Graviton Physics books go, they'll come down to about 1mil before spring, there's just a rush now like with any new content.
It's like saying, I can't believe I have to camp in line all night to see Star Wars 7 in the only theatre in town. WTF!!! Yeah, it might be a slight inconvenience but it's totally worth it. I love my tractor beams. Best mod CCP has released since strip miners.
CCP has even knows it. They've added the word BIGSHOT to the URL of my avatar. |
Arnt
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Posted - 2006.01.13 17:21:00 -
[95]
Originally by: Oveur
Originally by: Felcas
Edited by: Felcas on 17/12/2005 04:58:17
Edited by: Felcas on 17/12/2005 04:56:32
 To not complain in vain I just would like to know why CCP made the Tractor beam soo dificult to obtain.
Tractor beam was suppose to facilitate life in single player mission, to colect the cargo, it have no combat purpose since it can only beam cans.
Why make it soo dificult? That is ok to make it a high slot (I dont agree much but I cant change that can I?) but why make it 2 mil isks in the market and why need 2 skills level 5 each PLUS one skill that cost more than 12 mil !!!
Sorry but I totally disagree, in the actual situation I think it is simply not worth the money and the time spent with training.
I just would like to know why you made that way...to understand...maybe I am loosing something here. 
Hmm, I'll lessen the prereq's on that and perhaps decrease the 12 mill a bit. Ta ta.
I know there has been a LOT of stuff to do at CCP's those last weeks.
But could we at least know if those requirements are going to stay (and thus train) or if they are indeed going to be lowered?
Or is an ISD just going to lock this thread calling it 'necromancy', so players get to forget this lowering of prerequesite was even talked about by a CCP dev?
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SinBin
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Posted - 2006.01.13 17:32:00 -
[96]
Originally by: Sam Comco
To sum it up...Tractor Beams took Damage Controls place ;P
hehe yea im with this guy, i have that skill sitting in my hanger from agent & science level 5 but no way can i waste a high slot, id rather leave the loot, probly a miner 1 anyways.
I like what the 1 guy said about bigger ships bigger range that makes alot of sence since the larger normaly means slower.
I guess ya can still have a can collecting ship with it fitted but that ship is normal fast & agils, like sigel full of nanos & the treactor would probly slow you down anyways.
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Ill Shutup when CCP remove bookmarks |
Marcus Sovereign
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Posted - 2006.01.13 17:54:00 -
[97]
Originally by: Arnt
Originally by: Oveur
Hmm, I'll lessen the prereq's on that and perhaps decrease the 12 mill a bit. Ta ta.
I know there has been a LOT of stuff to do at CCP's those last weeks.
But could we at least know if those requirements are going to stay (and thus train) or if they are indeed going to be lowered?
Or is an ISD just going to lock this thread calling it 'necromancy', so players get to forget this lowering of prerequesite was even talked about by a CCP dev?
Honestly, I don't think they're going to be able to lower the requirements for tractor beams until they get the BPO pricing fixed. At the moment, it's cheaper for a player to buy the BPO and build a tractor beam himself than it is for him to buy it from another player.
The BPOs were added in and given a price of 81k isk. I have a feeling that they were supposed to be 8.1m isk.
They tried to adjust the price (which may have resulted in a lowering of requirements), but they made the mistake of announcing the change in the patch notes. We all know what happened after that. 
If they lower the requirements for tractor beams, then EVERYBODY will have a tractor beam, and the researchers and producers will be left out in the cold, because players will just build them for themselves and forget about it. As it is right now, tractor beams are hard to come by for the average player (15-30m isk for the books; 3 weeks of training).
As much as it sucks, trying to fix this might suck even more. As far as I can tell, the only way to undo this is to wipe all tractor beams and tractor beam BPOs from the database so they can start all over again with the correct BPO pricing and a slightly reduced (I'd like to see Science 4 and Engineering 4 with the additional required skill available from NPCs at a cost of ~5m isk) set of requirements.
I guess we'll just have to see what happens.
"Never equate education with intelligence; nor intelligence with wisdom." - me
"A smart man learns from his own mistakes; a wise man learns from the mistakes of others." - also me |
Jayad
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Posted - 2006.01.13 18:08:00 -
[98]
a lot of MMO players (from other games) criticise eve for being too slow pace of life. Anything to speed up a given process is surely welcome to the current and prospecting player base to come.
I support the reduction in cost
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David Sinclair
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Posted - 2006.01.13 18:18:00 -
[99]
Originally by: Demarcus
Screw the tractor beam, give us scavenger drones.
Definately! If, for minimal skill, I can get drones that go out and fight or mine for me, why not ones that just fly out, grapple pods, and bring them back to my ship. Add a "safety feature" that doesn't let them tow pods you don't own to prevent any sort of exploitive behavior.
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StinkFinger
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Posted - 2006.01.13 19:49:00 -
[100]
Lets have a few different types of tractor beams, with different ranges, tractor speeds, fitting requirments, etc. Also a few skills that effect these variables would be nice too.
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Rick Dentill
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Posted - 2006.01.13 21:03:00 -
[101]
I was really lucky, a while back I was desperate to see how r&d worked. Guess what the nearest agent researched? Yup Graviton P. So when I moved on to other areas I had a useless skill become unuseless I was so happy. As to the supply of them, yes this ought to be dealt with. which agent gives them as rewards? I am pretty sure I got mine from Silence the Informant mission loot.
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I am not the magic dominix fairy
http://x-universe.kiwi.nu/page.php?id=dd |
Kage Getsu
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Posted - 2006.01.13 21:26:00 -
[102]
I trained every science skill I could get my hands on to level 0 for the hell of it, so I would love more things that require them.
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Quanteeri
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Posted - 2006.01.13 21:35:00 -
[103]
Edited by: Quanteeri on 13/01/2006 21:36:48
I still think these thing rock.
Sigil + 2 beams + 10mn AB + sensor Booster + Auto Targeting Array + 5 Nanos = Rogue drone Cleanup < 10min.(flight time included)
I don't really see how drones could be much faster.
CCP has even knows it. They've added the word BIGSHOT to the URL of my avatar. |
dantes inferno
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Posted - 2006.01.13 22:43:00 -
[104]
i wont ever bother with these though i am the happy owner of 101 bpo's :D but for a tech 1 frig sized mod..the skills do seem a bit extreme
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"When mothers warned their children that the monster would get them, that monster was me. I was the nightmare that kept |
Odessy
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Posted - 2006.01.13 22:54:00 -
[105]
What bothers me is why mining barges don't have a tractor only slot, you would think that an industrial ship messing with cargo all day would be able to equip one without loosing one of it's mining lasers.
I know some one will fire 'Jetcan mining was never ment .....'
If it wasen't Tritanium would be 10isk a unit.
I think the tractor should be both med AND high slot (Of thats possible) because it hasent got any combat use atm.
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Snodipous
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Posted - 2006.01.14 00:54:00 -
[106]
If the skill requirements are left as they are now, what will the requirements for a Tech2 tractor beam be? Advanced Graviton Physics 5? "Sorry, guys, I know flying a Dread would be good for our corp, but I decided to spend the time learning to use a tractor beam instead."
Tractor beams are a module intended, as far as I can tell, to improve the fun:grind ratio in the game. Why do people have a problem with that? IMHO, they should be available for use by 1-week old characters. They do not affect game balance, they do not confer a combat advantage, they do nothing besides allow me to spend more time doing the *fun* parts of the game, and less time doing the boring, in-between parts of the game.
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Danton Marcellus
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Posted - 2006.01.14 00:54:00 -
[107]
My problem is that there is no skill with which you can beef up the beam, as to make it pull from a greater distance, pull faster and even pull several adjacent objects.
One thing that would be great is if a ship can pull the loot, mined ore or whatnot out of the belt at topspeed during normal flight whilst the rest of the gang is engaging a foe coming crashing the gathering.
Remind me about The Maze.
I'm Danton Marcellus and I approve of this message. |
Kerfira
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Posted - 2006.01.14 11:24:00 -
[108]
I think you're all missing a basic fact here.... CCP doesn't hand out freebies! The tractor beam enables you to retrieve loot MUCH faster if used correctly. This'll save a lot of time when missioning, so it of.c. has to cost. Personally I don't think the costs (skill or ISK) are too extreme.
On the subject on how to use it correctly, it should NOT be put on your combat ship! That high slot is more useful for a weapon. No, instead of putting it on your big, slow combat ship, you put in on a small ship with a fair sized cargo bay and fast locking (like a Cormorant) equipped with MWD. You then put on as many tractor beams as you can track targets. When you've then done your mission in your combat ship and looks back on a 100km loot trail, you bookmark the location, go to your base station, change into your loot collector ship and go back after the loot. This goes INCREDIBLY fast compared to before and is why I think that the requirements are not one bit too high!
General advice: Stop whining!
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Citizen X
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Posted - 2006.01.14 11:33:00 -
[109]
Edited by: Citizen X on 14/01/2006 11:33:48
Well I have high intel and mem, unlike some pilot jocks about. You know I wouldnt be without my tractor beam on my Raven for belt hunting... Its wonderful!!! Made a BS out of recycled loot the other day, all thanks to the tractor beam.
Cheers CCP for a great module and get some skills Felcas!
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Dak Hakin
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Posted - 2006.01.14 11:41:00 -
[110]
Well, I always thought that since I can loot cans from 1.5k out, or transfer stuff, then I have some sort of tractor beam anyway.
_______________________________________________
Dont tell Scotty, Scotty doesn't know
Mr. Grumpy-sour-pus |
Smagd
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Posted - 2006.01.14 11:48:00 -
[111]
Originally by: Quanteeri
I still think these thing rock.
Sigil + 2 beams + 10mn AB + sensor Booster + Auto Targeting Array + 5 Nanos = Rogue drone Cleanup < 10min.(flight time included)
Sigma,
I'm doing the same with a Mammoth. It's even half fun figuring a route that sweeps a 20km wide tunnel through the loot.
Smagd
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Stig Caldar
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Posted - 2006.01.14 12:01:00 -
[112]
I personally think that the Graviton Physics skillbook should be seeded by NPC corporations again, it would cut out a lot of the bickering.
To everyone who says the unit itself is high priced - buy a BPO from NPC at a cost of 90,000 isk and make it yourself.
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Maya Rkell
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Posted - 2006.01.14 12:37:00 -
[113]
Originally by: Kage Getsu
I trained every science skill I could get my hands on to level 0 for the hell of it, so I would love more things that require them.
Same :)
(well, I trained em to lvl1...)
I have WAY too many skills...
Warning: above post may contain traces of sarcasm.
"Corpse cannot be fitted onto ship. Only hardware modules can be fitted." |
Wesley Harding
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Posted - 2006.01.14 13:17:00 -
[114]
Edited by: Wesley Harding on 14/01/2006 13:17:58
I'd like to train for one, and don't even particularly mind the Science V bit. My problem is the 15-100 million ISK skillbook. Frankly, I've got Local Hull Expanders, Cap Recharger IIs, and dozens other mods I need to pay for.
The way I see it is, that I could use a tractor beam on my Impel while scooping loot in complexes for mates. Fitting a tank on an Impel ruins it's ability to speed through things, so a tractor beam would help alot.
I really, really, really hate everyone that's marked up the price though for graviton physics. I hope CCP seeds the book just to spite you bastards.
Edit: Hey, I know. Make Transport 1 a prerequiste for using tractor beams!
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Quanteeri
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Posted - 2006.01.14 14:14:00 -
[115]
Edited by: Quanteeri on 14/01/2006 14:15:19
I cant believe some of you people are griping about the lack of upgradability of these mods. Really, it just sad.
For 2 years people have had to go can to can, begging for this mod and falling on deaf ears. Now, CCP finally caves to the pressure, releases a damn fine mod, and get smacked for it.
Incredible.
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konkord
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Posted - 2006.01.14 15:14:00 -
[116]
Originally by: Quanteeri
Edited by: Quanteeri on 14/01/2006 14:15:19
I cant believe some of you people are griping about the lack of upgradability of these mods. Really, it just sad.
For 2 years people have had to go can to can, begging for this mod and falling on deaf ears. Now, CCP finally caves to the pressure, releases a damn fine mod, and get smacked for it.
Incredible.
Quote for truth.
Guys, get a grip.
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Kerfira
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Posted - 2006.01.14 17:16:00 -
[117]
Originally by: Quanteeri
Edited by: Quanteeri on 14/01/2006 14:15:19
I cant believe some of you people are griping about the lack of upgradability of these mods. Really, it just sad.
For 2 years people have had to go can to can, begging for this mod and falling on deaf ears. Now, CCP finally caves to the pressure, releases a damn fine mod, and get smacked for it.
Incredible.
Yeah, the next post from above whiners will probably be something like:
'Wahhhh. I can't fly a Dread on my first day. CCP are stupid. They must lower the price of skills (and the ship) to 1 ISK, and remove the skill requirements or I'll stop playing!'
Heard it ALL before *sigh*
Whiners should have an aggro flag so you could shoot them in Empire ;-)
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Jon Xylur
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Posted - 2006.01.14 17:59:00 -
[118]
I don't mind science lv.5, it doesn't take all that long, btu the fact that CCP in their infinite wisdom made it reguire a skill that's only availeable from agent offers. Now I'll have to pay 50mil to use the tractor beam. Not worth it IMO.
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Kerfira
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Posted - 2006.01.14 19:04:00 -
[119]
Edited by: Kerfira on 14/01/2006 19:04:48
Originally by: Jon Xylur
I don't mind science lv.5, it doesn't take all that long, btu the fact that CCP in their infinite wisdom made it reguire a skill that's only availeable from agent offers. Now I'll have to pay 50mil to use the tractor beam. Not worth it IMO.
That's your decision. A lot of other people think that it IS worth it. For me, it's cut my loot collection time by about 3/4, which is REAL time saved. This is worth more to me than almost any amount of ISK.
Besides, 50 mill is way too much. The skill can be bought for about 10 mill (Lonetrek right now), and the tractors are approx 2 each. For a new corm with 4 tractors, this is about 20 mill. WELL worth it IMHO.....
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Payne Bringer
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Posted - 2006.01.14 19:41:00 -
[120]
I can't see the problem really.
- Its a cool module that people have been asking for for ages
- 10 days of training to use it (2 lvl 5 skills) is nt particularly onerous
- Its not overly pricey, you can buy a BPO for 85k and build one yourself eventually from recycled loot
- Noone is forcing you to buy it and it is a timesaver. Whether you think that time is worthwhile will come down to a personal choice
Personally, I can easily spend 20 minutes collecting cans at the end of a mission.
If it halves that time, which is a conservative estimate:
I get an extra 10 minutes to spend on missions (so, on lvl 4 missions that's worth about a mil in bounty/loot/reward, dividing average mission return by average time)
I'm going to be doing more than 10 missions this week - so that's the 10mil skillbook paid for already then.
A personal choice I know, but please stop whining about a module that is simply a time saving device - if your time is worth it then buy it, if not then move on.
Payne |
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