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[RMR] Scorpion for PvP

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smallgreenblur	Posted - 2006.02.08 18:30:00 - [31] Interesting idea about tanking the scorp. I've tried this in fleet battles and i find that you are considerably more useful with ecm in mids and plates and a large rep in lows. If you accept that you do f all damage anyway and just use cruiser guns or smaller lanchers you have enough powergrid. I was able to lock down, using racials, between 2 and 5 ships at once. In a fleet battle at range with say 8-10 bs on each side, this means you can actually hang on in there for a fair while with plates on and rep going. You may want to fit the optional big brass balls tho cos i've come out in structure a few times when not aligned quite right :P sgb
Cira	Posted - 2006.02.08 20:34:00 - [32] Originally by: General DogsBody You're American, aren't you? Figures. No class. un-****in-believable if ignorance is bliss you must be orgasmic about your life.
Nova Strikes	Posted - 2006.02.08 21:35:00 - [33] stfu with the flaming god, and post me lotsa Scorp setups.
Bjoern Bitter	Posted - 2006.02.09 07:38:00 - [34] Looking for 3 basic setups: PvE ECM vs. Sanshas spawns (what ecm to use against these?) PvE 24 / 7 shield tanking (possible?) PvP Multispec-setup (again - 24 / 7 possible?) Basically I need to learn how to use a Scorp effectively in both PvE and PvP environments. My caldari alt can armor tank like an amarrian on 'roids... Can't figure out 24 / 7 shield tank (there must be a way). The problem with armor tanking (can armor tank a triple bs spawn 24/7 in my scorpion) is that I need all 4 slots for the tank -> no place for a BCU or any damage mods. Since the Scorpion has 8 medium slots it should be an amazing shield tank and/or ecm ship. I've been playing around with setups and can't quite come up with anything I'm happy with. Regards BB
James Lyrus	Posted - 2006.02.09 11:05:00 - [35] Originally by: Bjoern Bitter Looking for 3 basic setups: PvE ECM vs. Sanshas spawns (what ecm to use against these?) PvE 24 / 7 shield tanking (possible?) PvP Multispec-setup (again - 24 / 7 possible?) Basically I need to learn how to use a Scorp effectively in both PvE and PvP environments. My caldari alt can armor tank like an amarrian on 'roids... Can't figure out 24 / 7 shield tank (there must be a way). The problem with armor tanking (can armor tank a triple bs spawn 24/7 in my scorpion) is that I need all 4 slots for the tank -> no place for a BCU or any damage mods. Since the Scorpion has 8 medium slots it should be an amazing shield tank and/or ecm ship. I've been playing around with setups and can't quite come up with anything I'm happy with. Regards BB Sanshas use Amarrian sensors. You need White Noise jammers against them. They're also good to use an armour tank on, because of their 'natural' damage types being EM/thermal. (They're strongest resists on your armour, and weakest on your shields). But whilst I enjoy PvE in a scorp, I also find a Raven to be _far_ more efficient - Scorps really don't put out much damage. I'm assuming by 24/7 you mean a continuous tank? Shield tanking by it's nature works 'better' in a burst defense. Fit a large shield booster on your scorp, and it'll probably be sustainable, but you're also probably better off twitching an XL booster a little less often. Passive tanking is also an option, with shield extenders and shield rechargers, and shield power relays, it's quite possible to get a 'solid' tank that'll last indefinitely. Is that more efficient than managing your cap? No. Burst 'boosting' for an XL booster II is 600/5 seconds. If balanced with your 'peak' shield recharge at about 30%, you will get a maximised tanking amount. PVE shield tank try: 2/2 hardeners, 2x cap rechargers 1x XL booster, 1x shield boost amplifier, and 4x cap power relays in the lows. Depending on your skills that should come within a hair of being sustainable, especially if you have energy vampires. PvP sustainable tanking is almost entirely irrelevant - fight duration is low, so you just need to last long enough. For that, shield boosting (and accepting you're cap will run out, or using cap booster charges) is very effective. If you want something genuinely long term sustainable, again, the passive tank works very nicely. (But it really does suffer from limitations compared to active tanking) -- We are recruiting We sell carriers.
Nyxus	Posted - 2006.02.09 23:15:00 - [36] The scorp will not give you any problems with fittings in the grid or cpu area unless you do something really crazy like....megapulse II or something. As Dahin and Cummila have stated so well, in a larger fleet op you WILL be called primary. No amount of hardening or extenders will allow you to survive. In this case you are better off with 2 sensor booster II's and jammers in the mids with a large or xlarge shieldbooster. Down low I would slap on a plate, 2 T2 Energized Nano adaptives, and a medium armor rep II. Why? It's simple really. You know that you will be called primary. You goal is to jam as many as you can before you have to warp out. When more than 5 enemies in a fleet start flashing yellow you should already have right clicked in space to have the menu up so when the rest of the fleet locks you and start to go red you can instawarp out. You will prolly lose all your shields and some armor if you like to play it risky and stay to the last second. The repper and shield booster is there to minimize the time you are out of the fight, not actually tank damage. Warp out, realign, warp back in, realign, continue jamming. Boost your shield and rep armor on the warps. Rinse and repeat. The concept here is NOT to tank, but rather use your shield and armor hp as a rudimentry timer telling you how long before you die. If your shield starts disapearing and there are a lot of little yellow boxes blinking at you, your life expectancy is counted in seconds or less. Small fleet and small group is MUCH different. Here you have to balance tanking with jamming as it is less likely you will be warping in and out nearly as much. Here, placement is key. The scorp is better off about 50km or so out of the immediate battlezone. Cruise missiles + Nos + T2 med drones can keep tacklers at bay. 4 cruise with damage types chosen carefully can 1 volley T1 frigs and force ceptors to keep thier distance. Remember to launch missiles deliberately and not just mash F1-F4 like a turret boat. Thats my tips for ya. Like Cummila, small group setups have more variety than fleets and worth thier weight in gold so I doubt you will get too many specific tips there. Nyxus Macgyver can build an airplane out of gum and paper clips, but Chuck Norris can kill him and take it.
Bjoern Bitter	Posted - 2006.02.09 23:42:00 - [37] thanks for the tips everyone time to start experimenting BB
Arakasai	Posted - 2006.02.10 00:12:00 - [38] Originally by: KilROCK Oh aren't we a little bit Racist on the side? No i'm not. But truth hurt when it gets hit in the face of unproperly fitted scorpion pilots uh? People seriously need to understand that Americans are not a race and thus racism is not what this is.
Cummilla	Posted - 2006.02.10 00:16:00 - [39] Originally by: KilROCK Don't you love people gloating about their setup and posting with a 1 year old alt in a npc corp. Cummilla setup is made to do damage in most situation and jam effectivly no matter which ships she encounters. Doesn't have to be great to be effective. Yeah it does. Nothing is more pathetic than a poorly setup scorp that can't dps it's way out of a wet paper bag. Believe it or not, being able to actually take down a target quickly matters quite a bit.....especially when there is more than one target
Cummilla	Posted - 2006.02.10 00:39:00 - [40] Originally by: Triscuit Edited by: Triscuit on 08/02/2006 03:27:05 Originally by: Cummilla Like I said, not gonna visit what kind of weapons I use because that's classified. Alot of setups for scorp I see that are supposedly out of the box are just poorly conceived and not really founded in any knowledge of which weapons system types can do the most damage in the most common situations scorps find themselves in. HINT: it's not cruise missiles in highs, not silly things like projectiles or autocannons. Or, god forbid, cap eating lasers. Okay wild guess based on what you've been saying: Highs: 4x large hybrid of some kind, 2x nos Mids: You said multispecs yourself Lows: I'm guessing your advocating signal amps here to save mid slots. Doesn't seem too great to me. Signal amps aren't elevating the most important relevant stats. Sensor boosters while increasing your range, more importantly allow you to lock faster and jam first. The assumption behind all that is that you WILL be jammed. I don't think that's necessarily the case. The EW system is chance based and as such certain values can be raised to considerably lower the probability of being jammed. What if, for example, your gravimetric str value was 36 versus 24?? Then a domi with a racial will only have a 1/4 to 1/5 chance in jamming you with a racial. Tons less with multis. Consider that and the other typical options for lows. Plates? please, refer to former remark about dying in 10 seconds versus 5. WCS...yes, but a full rack is a waste. PDUs? see remarks about plates and if you're worried about cap, then is your focus using that cap to tank? Or just to have cap for some other purpose. PDUs are worthless. Some will say, "yeah, but by using backup arrays in lows(not all, just one or two), you CAN still be jammed." True. But at some point you have to just do the math and play the probabilities and have faith that over time you'll see the results come in line with the expected values. On the issue of smartbombs. Kilrock wants you to laff them off. Yet increasingly you see setup after setup for tacklers gravitate towards the close range model. AC's and even rocket setups on missile inties draw the battle in close. OF course it is true that the smart tackler isn't going to orbit at < 5.5k out of concern for smartbombs. But, there are things that will draw the battle in for smaller ships. Damps still work like they always did when sensor boosters are not present on the target ship. And really, how many inties really fit sensor boosters? Not many in my estimation. As a matter of practice, your average tackler does breach that 5.5k barrier. Alot. More than he should. The number of people that I "surprise" with my smartbomb\nos mix are greater than the number who "expected it." Draw the battle close with damps. Fit a webber. And have some fun with smartbombs.
Marano	Posted - 2006.02.10 20:34:00 - [41] I've been using a scorp for a while and I also took the time to train up Caldari BS to lvl5 so I take advantage of all the jamming abilities here is my setup that I find to be the best. Highs: 4 Siege II launchers, 2 named NOS Mids: (Solo) 1 20k Scram, 1 Web, 1 named Cap, 5 multispec II's (Fleet) 7 multispec II's, 1 named cap Lows: 1 PD II, 1 MED rep II, 1 Kinetic hardner, 1 Thermal hardner Drones of course as well. I use the Javelin Torps since they are just uber and are very well balanced for smaller ships long distances or Bs's. You shouldn't really worry about tanking too much just enough to handle when drones get on you because your best defense is obviously jamming/cycle jamming your opponents.
Meat Wadd	Posted - 2006.02.10 22:05:00 - [42] First I would like to say I am America! Native American! So the rest of you people in MY land are just foreign invaders to me . And I still would not chastise a whole people for the actions of a few. Very poor form. And yes this is an alt. Why would I give more information to a potential enemy than I have too? All war is deseption... I would say more but that would be telling Second, Thanks Cummilla! I hope you donÆt get in to much trouble for giving that up. As it is I am always surprised when players give up there load outs. Eve is a chess match and knowing what your enemies move is going to be really gives you an advantage. You all have given me a lot to think about with your set ups. So know its back to the lab to tinker some more. Thanks again for the help!! Aqua Teen Hunger Force. Number 1 in the Hood, G
Lord Spidey	Posted - 2006.02.14 20:55:00 - [43] Originally by: Cira Originally by: General DogsBody You're American, aren't you? Figures. No class. un-****in-believable if ignorance is bliss you must be orgasmic about your life. exactly what cira said
Exelon Bei	Posted - 2006.02.14 22:02:00 - [44] Edited by: Exelon Bei on 14/02/2006 22:06:49 What i would use for solo pvp: High: 4 Siege launchers 2 large nos Med: 1 100 NM AB 5 Multi jammer 1 Warp disruptor 1 Webber Low: 2 Power diagnostic 2 BCS 24/7 is possible withouth the AB and aslong as you get full effect from the nos' ------------------------------------------------- 2006.01.24 20:00:59<t>notify<t>You have initiated the self-destruct of your Capsule. It wi
Matrices Reborn	Posted - 2006.02.15 02:41:00 - [45] You people seem to thin lightly about tanking or you think that just because you have 5 jammers you willjam every time which is not the case but it will give you about an 80% chance. Well this is a very unorthodox setup which you may freely reject because you don't think your doing enough damage or it's not possible. To me the key to winning is not always gank but degank your opponent which is obvious for the scorp but you cant rely on this method completely. High:4 cruise or siege launchers with 2 nos Med:4 Multi-spec Hynosis,Cap injector,Scrambler,mwd or ab,Cap recharger( whatever is good for the tank) Low: 2 large repairers T2 if possible,Adaptive nano,explosive hardener I dont go with another jammer in the mids because it will eat up cap too fast to support the tank evn with the nos. Im hoping that you wont need to fit Rcu and I dont think you will need to if you use cruise launchers.I dont really see a disadvantage to this setup because 1 jammer doesn't affect much when you have 4 already. Sur you wont be able to fit your precious bcu's but in this case tank is better than gank.
Matrices Reborn	Posted - 2006.02.15 02:42:00 - [46] Please forgive minor grammar mistakes
Erica Lance	Posted - 2006.02.15 12:03:00 - [47] Doens anyone have a setup with turrets? rails and blasters and with shield tank and jamming?
Matrices Reborn	Posted - 2006.02.15 20:04:00 - [48] Well that having a good offense with rails or blasters seems kind of hard because of the low powergrid. Secondly it seems dumb because if also want jammers you arent going to want guns that eat up cap. Plus if you have missiles if someone else in a scorp jams you fof will come to save the day. Moving on I do have a very good all purpose mid slot setup if that is what you are looking for. Fit 3 multi-specs and you still get descent jamming chance for Bs's(about 60% chance. An XL shield booster and 2 invulnerability field will give good resists or a thermal and em hardener for less cap usage. A warp disruptor and mwd for tackling in the last 2 slots
Isky Iskerson	Posted - 2006.02.15 21:15:00 - [49] Originally by: General DogsBody You're American, aren't you? Figures. No class. lol. You are being ironic right? Very funny. You see everyone, our friend here was making a funny. To make scornfull overgeneralizations based on national orgin is as weak-minded as it is...wait for it... totally without class. Thus he is accusing others of the very social crime he is commiting. Unless of course he too is Amercian in which case it holds an element of self-loathing as well. Bravo. -Isky
Godlike324	Posted - 2006.02.16 11:38:00 - [50] My suggestion for a Scorpion. Good for Fleet or smaller gang engagements. Highs: 4x Cruise Launchers which lands good on most size targets. 2x Heavy NOS, for draining tanks and slowing down Intercepters Medium: 1x Sensor Booster II 1x , Boosting your Gravimetric strength considerably making you VERY hard to target jam 6x Racial / Multispectral Jammers II, Go for whichever you feel like Lows: 2x Gravimetric Backup Array 1x Energized Adaptive Nano 1x Large Armor Repairer
WIngman4508	Posted - 2006.02.16 15:03:00 - [51] ill throw out a tanking scorp i suppose, now this set up has room for improvment, ie. bumping up to T2 on the hardeners and such, but your mids are 2 hards, 2 invulni fields, (this is where i still need to go T2) 2 boost amps,cap booster, and T2 Xl booster, then in the lows take 4 power diag II's in you highs its really what ever you feel like, i prefer 4 cruise and 2 heavy nos. Now this is not a solo set up, your going to need a buddy to actually put out the damage, and its meant for sentry tanking/or mission tanking but depending on how many cap charges you can fit in your hold this set up can tank 2 sentry guns for around 15 minutes and thats not really much of a stretch. but your damage out put is about nil.
Jaddor	Posted - 2006.02.16 15:38:00 - [52] Originally by: General DogsBody You're American, aren't you? Figures. No class. Ironic.
eC Cade	Posted - 2006.02.16 17:29:00 - [53] Could I get your guys opinion on this setup: 4xtorps 2x800mm autos 1x20k scambler 1xAB 5xracial jammers 1xmutli spec 4x anything 400x120@24000 bytes Maximum. -Capsicum
Exelon Bei	Posted - 2006.02.16 18:46:00 - [54] Experimental: High: 4 Large Neutrons 2 Heavy nos mid: 1 100NM MWD 1 XL Booster t2 3 hardeners(thermal, kinetic and EM) 1 sensorbooster 1 warp disruptor 1 webber low: 3 RCU 1 PDS Would it stand a chance against any other BS? maybe changing some neutrons for ions so i could change one of the lows for a MFS..would maybe get me more firepower? ------------------------------------------------- 2006.01.24 20:00:59<t>notify<t>You have initiated the self-destruct of your Capsule. It wi
Marano	Posted - 2006.02.16 21:59:00 - [55] Originally by: Matrices Reborn You people seem to thin lightly about tanking or you think that just because you have 5 jammers you willjam every time which is not the case but it will give you about an 80% chance. Well this is a very unorthodox setup which you may freely reject because you don't think your doing enough damage or it's not possible. To me the key to winning is not always gank but degank your opponent which is obvious for the scorp but you cant rely on this method completely. High:4 cruise or siege launchers with 2 nos Med:4 Multi-spec Hynosis,Cap injector,Scrambler,mwd or ab,Cap recharger( whatever is good for the tank) Low: 2 large repairers T2 if possible,Adaptive nano,explosive hardener I dont go with another jammer in the mids because it will eat up cap too fast to support the tank evn with the nos. Im hoping that you wont need to fit Rcu and I dont think you will need to if you use cruise launchers.I dont really see a disadvantage to this setup because 1 jammer doesn't affect much when you have 4 already. Sur you wont be able to fit your precious bcu's but in this case tank is better than gank. Where are you getting the power grid for this setup?? I have very good skills and there is no way I can setup 4 siege on highs and 2 hvy nos and have 1 x large II armor repair nvm 2.... without using a reactor control. If you are using cruise launchers yes but not with siege and maybe if you are using med nos but not hvy's considering they use 2000 pw grid each yet in your setup you said you have 2 hardners on the low's and not even a RCU or PDU.
Matrices Reborn	Posted - 2006.02.18 01:09:00 - [56] Yea you are right. It was just a theoretical setup any ways but it is very possible to have just one T2 repairer. I dont want to give anymore of my setup away but you can easily think of what else I would put in. My tank that I used on quickfit is doable with lots of jamming, 55% average armor resists, 4 cruise and 2 nos plus something else that will aid my cap usage. On a different subject I want to know if someone who actually has flown a scorp is able to kill another popularly used pvp BS because if a scorp can't kill another ships tank on its own I would find no point to buying it because I dont know if im going to be doing fleet or gang pvp.
Matrices Reborn	Posted - 2006.02.18 13:31:00 - [57] bump
jorrel1	Posted - 2006.02.20 00:52:00 - [58] hi every 1 im quite knew 2 a scorpion and ive neva used 1 b4 so if any 1 could eve male me or give me any good pvp set ups for 1
Matrices Reborn	Posted - 2006.02.20 01:57:00 - [59] If you want good pvp setups just read the previous posts. There is some interesting material there so when you get a better idea about scorp setups you can ask more specificc questions. Still waiting for reply about armor tanking setup I listed before. bump.
Crellion	Posted - 2006.02.20 06:57:00 - [60] Why fighting like cats? Good set ups depend on what you want to do and how sure you are that this is the engagement you ll end up in... - Fleet.. you cant actively tank 50 mofos with 425IIs and 1400IIs and tachyon IIs ffs... at best put a plate or 2 in to give you time to run away... perhaps 1 or 2 wcs if they dont have good tacklers or if your fleet has l33t antifrig support so that few are expected to get by? Extreme ranges are likely so go racial and dont look back... its a fleet after all so you can arrange with the other Scorps who fits what. Up high... well if you are doing racials and have a cpr in lows... perhaps you have grid/cpu/cap left to fit some 425s or even 350s with Spike might get you on the killmail...If no room or if you are using multis and you think ur cap wont take it use cruise launchers... they can hit all the way out to the BSs (shoot at the secondary or tertiary target tbh) and you can also do your duty with incoming AFs or cruisers... (ceptors wont be that impressed unless if you have the skills for precision - these might also help you warp faster hmmm...) - Groups: Think about multis... these are close engagements and you need to know you can get whatever shiptype... you can also fit an armour tank... chances are you wont be able to warp out at a convenient time and the DPS incoming is nothing like fleet (especially if you are doing your job half-right)... perhaps even fit a 20km scram... nasty surprise. Up top NOSs are real gold and a Smartbomb might be good for drones - yes- but can you run a smartbomb long enough and multis and LAR? nahhhhh If you are the only BS in your group (running with frigs and/or cruisers) try to fit siege launchers to help with any BS your group attacks (but then oc that will bit a bit more difficult cause of your armour tank need). If however you really have to comtibute on every target then cruise launchers are the way to go. Large Hybruds forget about: rails wont track and blasters you cant afford (u r too slow and you dont have the cap to run them). - Shield tank: Some use it especially when fighting the same peeps all the time ... They fit EW on the Ravens and tank the Scorps... just dont try it twice with the same peeps... An EW raven goes down depressingly fast and then you are left with a useless scorp... an incursus would offer more to the gang... rly Fianlly take all of the above with a pinch of salt cause i d be hardpressed to rememeber the last time I flew a Scorp in pvp... or ... did I ever actually??? probably not... hmmmm

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