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Panseluta
PerRiko Industries
0
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Posted - 2014.01.11 20:05:00 -
[1] - Quote
This guys effective do a genocide between people who do missions, i bet at this rate CCP will must do something to not lose a lot of subscribers. Is very obvious that is way to easy to kill very expensive ships in very cheap ones, and moreover, with new dumb pro-piracy feature of sec status instant boost, using pirate insignias, gankers can get security status back instant, and keep going on suicide gank ships at infinitum as long is very profitable too. They cannot be stopped in that cheap and fast ships, killrights dont have any use because of same reasons... http://eve.battleclinic.com/killboard/combat_record.php?type=player&name=Megamaks+T44 Look on this and notice that something looks very wrong there... So guys take care and brick tank your ships, but that will not help to much as long they use enough destroyers... |
Danika Princip
Freelance Economics Astrological resources Tactical Narcotics Team
2210
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Posted - 2014.01.11 20:10:00 -
[2] - Quote
Suicide ganking? Good old fasioned suicide ganking? No agression mechanic shenanigans, no MTA stuff, literally just suicide ganking?
Stop flying hips worth billions of ISK to complete MISSIONS, and you'll be fine. |
Mojo Joo
Scrap Iron Flotilla
7
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Posted - 2014.01.11 20:30:00 -
[3] - Quote
Danika Princip wrote:Stop flying hips worth billions of ISK to complete MISSIONS, and you'll be fine.
Is not very balanced thing to be able to destroy ships who worth billions using ships who worth less than 500k isk, suicide ganking in hisec... Is so huge profitable that is obvious a broken and unbalanced game mechanic. Just my personal opinion.
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Kenrailae
Mind Games. Suddenly Spaceships.
120
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Posted - 2014.01.11 20:36:00 -
[4] - Quote
Danika Princip wrote:Suicide ganking? Good old fasioned suicide ganking? No agression mechanic shenanigans, no MTA stuff, literally just suicide ganking?
Stop flying hips worth billions of ISK to complete MISSIONS, and you'll be fine.
^Quoted for Truth. The Law is a point of View |
ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors Late Night Alliance
4685
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Posted - 2014.01.11 20:43:00 -
[5] - Quote
This has been in the game for literally YEARS. Even the DEVs support it. Change isn't bad, but it isn't always good. Sometimes, the oldest and most simple of things can be the most elegant and effective. |
Danika Princip
Freelance Economics Astrological resources Tactical Narcotics Team
2210
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Posted - 2014.01.11 20:49:00 -
[6] - Quote
Mojo Joo wrote:Danika Princip wrote:Stop flying hips worth billions of ISK to complete MISSIONS, and you'll be fine. Is not a very balanced thing to be able to destroy ships who worth billions using ships who worth less than 500k isk, suicide ganking in hisec... Is so huge profitable that is obvious a broken and unbalanced game mechanic. Just my personal opinion. And actually is so cheap to suicide gang battleships in hi sec that you can make profit even killing cheap fitted ones, or you can just kill a lot of faction battleships to grief players and get a lot of nice and easy kills on kill board...
Why should a ship be immune to ganking simply because it's expensive? Fit T2, insure, don't be a moron and you're fine. |
Mojo Joo
Scrap Iron Flotilla
7
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Posted - 2014.01.11 21:05:00 -
[7] - Quote
They kill just to many, to expensive ships to fast and to easy. Is game breaking to kill so many expensive ships so easy and is very unbalanced to make tens of billions of isk every day without any risk, as long you can use 500k isk ships to kill ships who worth many billions... Also a big problem is the new broken pro-piracy feature, who provide suicide gankers with a way to instant fix their security status. That make things much worse because they make a lot of money and can afford to buy insignias and fix their security status, then keep going killing at infinitum without becoming flashy. And that was not the game mechanic in the past. People thought twice before going -10... Now, thanks to CCP stupid way of boosting piracy, is not a single backslash to massacre lots of people in hi sec, as long you make a lot of money from that and you can pay to get your security status restored.
Zero risk, hundred of billions destroyed in days, tens of billions profit in days... that is broken game mechanic. |
Mojo Joo
Scrap Iron Flotilla
7
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Posted - 2014.01.11 21:11:00 -
[8] - Quote
Danika Princip wrote:Stop flying hips worth billions of ISK to complete MISSIONS, and you'll be fine. There are so many Faction ships who worth a lot even t2 fitted and can be killed just because is fun to do it. And that because gankers don't risk anything in the process, the kills looks great on killboards, and is funny to kill tens of machariels and other very expensive ships using cheap destroyers... and also being able to keep security status positive all this time. |
Gadicus Sharhrizai
FST Labs
0
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Posted - 2014.01.11 21:21:00 -
[9] - Quote
Mojo Joo wrote:They kill just to many, to expensive ships to fast and to easy. Is game breaking to kill so many expensive ships so easy and is very unbalanced to make tens of billions of isk every day without any risk, as long you can use 500k isk ships to kill ships who worth many billions... Also a big problem is the new broken pro-piracy feature, who provide suicide gankers with a way to instant fix their security status. That make things much worse because they make a lot of money and can afford to buy insignias and fix their security status, then keep going killing at infinitum without becoming flashy. And that was not the game mechanic in the past. People thought twice before going -10... Now, thanks to CCP stupid way of boosting piracy, is not a single backslash to massacre lots of people in hi sec, as long you make a lot of money from that and you can pay to get your security status restored.
Zero risk, hundred of billions destroyed in days, tens of billions profit in days... that is broken game mechanic.
Soo, the bears have moved from crying about ganking miners to ganking mission runners... pathetic
Here are some tips to remember: 1) You are not playing a SINGLE PERSON GAME 2) You are never "SAFE" in eve 3) There is this cool little feature, d-scan, use it and pay attention (hint, when you see 20 dessies coming at you, GTFO) 4) Don't fly expensive ships or glass cannon mission runners 5) Have I mentioned d-scan 6) Get more tank (just like miners have learned why its bad to fly yield fit rets). 7) Don't sit at the warp in at 0 m/s (total fail) 8) Get more tank 9) Have I mentioned D-scan?? 10) Get more tank
Try to comprehend that you are playing a sandbox game with very little rules, as it should be, and you are also not playing by yourself (hence: MMO) . Remove you head from your rectum cavities and pay attention while you are in game.
You are allowed to play in your own little world when you log in, just don't be surprised when someone comes along and pisses on your parade. |
Dolorous Tremmens
The Scope Gallente Federation
47
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Posted - 2014.01.11 21:40:00 -
[10] - Quote
Thank you for a very humorous post, it brightened my day no end.
Blingy ships are not needed to do missions, they can be done with standard t2. You go shot cause you were flying something shiny. You were flying something shiny cause you wanted to make more isk faster. You were risking it just by flying it.
First rule in eve, taught to most on day one: DONT FLY WHAT YOU CANT AFFORD TO LOSE
People slow on the uptake deserve the ridicule, the ones who cry about it deserve the abuse. Get some Eve. Make it yours.
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Mojo Joo
Scrap Iron Flotilla
7
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Posted - 2014.01.11 21:44:00 -
[11] - Quote
Gankers can just kill faction ships who worth a lot even t2 fitted because they don't risk anything in the process, and is cool to have tens of expensive ships kills on killboard just using cheap destroyers... Also main problem is that is no backslash anymore for suicide ganking unlimited number of ships in hisec, because security status is not anymore a limited resource, period. |
Danika Princip
Freelance Economics Astrological resources Tactical Narcotics Team
2210
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Posted - 2014.01.11 21:57:00 -
[12] - Quote
Mojo Joo wrote:Gankers can just kill faction ships who worth a lot even t2 fitted because they don't risk anything in the process, and is cool to have tens of expensive ships kills on killboard just using cheap destroyers... Also main problem is that is no backslash anymore for suicide ganking unlimited number of ships in hisec, because security status is not anymore a limited resource, period.
If you're so worried about faction ships, the answer is simple.
DON'T FLY ONE.
You can easily complete any highsec mission in any t1 battleship with a T2 fit.
Here, read this: http://themittani.com/features/alod-return-investment
Maybe it'll help? (HINT: Don't be a gank magnet and you won't get ganked! Simple. As. That.) |
Mojo Joo
Scrap Iron Flotilla
7
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Posted - 2014.01.11 22:02:00 -
[13] - Quote
Danika Princip wrote:Mojo Joo wrote:Gankers can just kill faction ships who worth a lot even t2 fitted because they don't risk anything in the process, and is cool to have tens of expensive ships kills on killboard just using cheap destroyers... Also main problem is that is no backslash anymore for suicide ganking unlimited number of ships in hisec, because security status is not anymore a limited resource, period. If you're so worried about faction ships, the answer is simple. DON'T FLY ONE. You can easily complete any highsec mission in any t1 battleship with a T2 fit.
That is a silly and partial solution for the problem. Don't forget the huge proportion of the practice of suicide gankink mining barges because gankers can get instant back the security status... you also suggest that all miners to fly from now ventures or maybe noob ships? |
Rek Seven
Probe Patrol Polarized.
1273
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Posted - 2014.01.11 22:10:00 -
[14] - Quote
"That/which" need "to be" changed... +1 |
Danika Princip
Freelance Economics Astrological resources Tactical Narcotics Team
2210
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Posted - 2014.01.11 22:14:00 -
[15] - Quote
Mojo Joo wrote:Danika Princip wrote:Mojo Joo wrote:Gankers can just kill faction ships who worth a lot even t2 fitted because they don't risk anything in the process, and is cool to have tens of expensive ships kills on killboard just using cheap destroyers... Also main problem is that is no backslash anymore for suicide ganking unlimited number of ships in hisec, because security status is not anymore a limited resource, period. If you're so worried about faction ships, the answer is simple. DON'T FLY ONE. You can easily complete any highsec mission in any t1 battleship with a T2 fit. That is a silly and partial solution for the problem. Don't forget the huge proportion of the practice of suicide gankink mining barges because gankers can get instant back the security status... you also suggest that all miners to fly from now ventures or maybe noob ships?
No, I suggest they fit tanks and make themselves unprofitable to gank.
It's all about making yourself unprofitable to gank. Why gank a T2 fit mission battleship or belt miner with a tank fit, when you can go after the loot pi+Ķata faction BS, the deadspace fit mackinaw or the untanked hulk? |
Sarah Stallman
International Unification
103
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Posted - 2014.01.11 22:24:00 -
[16] - Quote
This is a non-issue. There's a massive diminishing return that comes into play as the value of your ship goes up. The more ISK you put in, the less improvement you get for dumping even more in. When you get a ship into the billions, the return is almost nothing.
Further, you start to run into the defender's dilemma. Namely, as the defender you need to be able to defend at least somewhat against all possible threats and attack types, whereas the attacker needs only to find one that works. This means that any ganker who does not feel they could win reliably will not even engage, and those that are confident will do so. This creates a selection bias that makes the gankers seem more effective than they are. The problem is you are only exposed to the ones that can win, not the entire population of them. |
Unsuccessful At Everything
The Troll Bridge
9116
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Posted - 2014.01.11 22:42:00 -
[17] - Quote
How is mission ganking a broken mechanic if it is working as intended?
This is really a non-issue if you realize that the 'Undock' button carries a fine print consenting to pretty much everything. Since the cessation of their usefulness is imminent, may I appropriate your belongings? |
Arthur Aihaken
The.VOID
2759
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Posted - 2014.01.11 22:52:00 -
[18] - Quote
You can have nice things... they just have to stay in your hangar. I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week. |
Mojo Joo
Scrap Iron Flotilla
7
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Posted - 2014.01.11 22:58:00 -
[19] - Quote
Unsuccessful At Everything wrote:How is mission ganking a broken mechanic if it is working as intended? From the moment when gankers was able to get their security status back for isk, suicide ganking not worked anymore as "intended", because now can be done at infinitum without any backslash. The negative consequences of losing security status and access to high sec prevented in the past the suicide gangs to get such high numbers and so many kills without any obstruction. Now nothing can stop them getting lots of members and kills... |
ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors Late Night Alliance
4685
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Posted - 2014.01.11 23:09:00 -
[20] - Quote
Mojo Joo wrote:Unsuccessful At Everything wrote:How is mission ganking a broken mechanic if it is working as intended? From the moment when gankers was able to get their security status back for isk, suicide ganking not worked anymore as "intended", because now can be done at infinitum without any backslash. The negative consequences of losing security status and access to high sec prevented in the past the suicide gangs to get such high numbers and kill without any obstruction. Now nothing can stop them getting lots of members and kills... FYI: "professional gankers" do not care about security status. You can continue to suicide gank even when you are -10 (it is just trickier) and the cost raising your sec status from -10 to 0.0 is about ~200-300 million ISK. Change isn't bad, but it isn't always good. Sometimes, the oldest and most simple of things can be the most elegant and effective. |
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Humang
Sefem Velox Swift Angels Alliance
41
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Posted - 2014.01.11 23:19:00 -
[21] - Quote
The Mittani did a little interesting article that applys to this as part of one of their ALOD's. I can see where you are coming from with the sec status mechanics, but its given a lot more than it's taken in the eve community.
And as people have already said, again and again, a lot of fits can be done with just T2 fittings, at the same efficiently but only a faction of the price. 90% of ganks happen because there is PROFIT in it, with the other 10% just because .
Side note: CCP please fix the forms eating my posts before I can post them Witty Comment Here |
Zane Tekitsu
D.I.C.A.D. Solutions
52
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Posted - 2014.01.11 23:25:00 -
[22] - Quote
Nullsec is always an option you know... The money is better, and the systems are safer than 1.0 systems... |
Danika Princip
Freelance Economics Astrological resources Tactical Narcotics Team
2210
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Posted - 2014.01.11 23:27:00 -
[23] - Quote
Mojo Joo wrote:Unsuccessful At Everything wrote:How is mission ganking a broken mechanic if it is working as intended? From the moment when gankers was able to get their security status back for isk, suicide ganking not worked anymore as "intended", because now can be done at infinitum without any backslash. The negative consequences of losing security status and access to high sec prevented in the past the suicide gangs to get such high numbers and so many kills without any obstruction. Now nothing can stop them getting lots of members and kills...
Whereas before, the gankers would have needed to go to low or nullsec and fly loops around a few systems for an hour or two a week to keep their sec status up, thereby actually EARNING money while improving sec status, rather than spending it... |
Sigras
Conglomo
646
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Posted - 2014.01.11 23:28:00 -
[24] - Quote
Stop flying officer fit battleships!
Suicide ganking actually became much harder recently as CCP removed insurance payouts for kills involving concord. If you fit your ship anywhere in the realm of reasonable, you wont be a gank target.
My rule of thumb is that the fittings for a ship should cost about as much as the ship itself. It isnt a hard fast rule but if youre 2x or 3x that you're probably doing it wrong.
This is coming from someone who has never suicide ganked anyone and doesnt ever plan to. |
Mojo Joo
Scrap Iron Flotilla
7
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Posted - 2014.01.11 23:32:00 -
[25] - Quote
Zane Tekitsu wrote:Nullsec is always an option you know... The money is better, and the systems are safer than 1.0 systems... True, but that is not a realistic solution for all people. Also high security is supposedly called that way because is meant to be home for people who don't want to be shot at any moment without real consequences like in 0.0 ... |
Mojo Joo
Scrap Iron Flotilla
7
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Posted - 2014.01.11 23:44:00 -
[26] - Quote
Danika Princip wrote:Whereas before, the gankers would have needed to go to low or nullsec and fly loops around a few systems for an hour or two a week to keep their sec status up, thereby actually EARNING money while improving sec status, rather than spending it...
Two hours to recover security status lost for tens of ships suicide ganked in high sec? I did ratting for sec status and believe that was a pain in the a.. to just get 1 point back... and a lot of hours of grinding is not a pleasant activity for the ones who hate doing PVE... And believe me, that made all people think twice before thrashing characters security status and become unable to fly in high security systems... Now that is not a problem anymore, you don't need many weeks of ratting to get from -10 to 0 security status like before, you need just some isk. And that is what boost a lot suicide gang activity. |
Gadicus Sharhrizai
FST Labs
0
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Posted - 2014.01.11 23:49:00 -
[27] - Quote
Mojo Joo wrote:Zane Tekitsu wrote:Nullsec is always an option you know... The money is better, and the systems are safer than 1.0 systems... True, but that is not a realistic solution for all people. Also high security is supposedly called that way because is meant to be home for people who don't want to be shot at any moment without real consequences like in 0.0 ...
Two pages before we actually get the crux of your issue, your confused.
High sec, in no way is for "people who don't want to be shot at any moment without real consequences"
In fact, if you look on the eve wiki, here is what you will find with respect to "hi-sec" and concord:
"High security space (also referred to as Highsec and High-Sec) is systems with a security rating of 1.0 down to 0.5. These systems are policed by CONCORD which awards some safety from pirates. While CONCORD does not prevent acts of piracy in high security space, they will quickly respond to such acts and punish the perpetrator. In many cases the response time is fast enough to save the victim from destruction. They will also punish the act by adjusting the security rating according to how high the security in the system is, the higher the system, the higher the penalty."
Policed is the key takeaway for you.. Police investigate crimes and rarely if ever, prevent them.
No where does is say, hi-sec is care-bear safe and for people who want to live and play a single player game or act like they are on a blue server. You are now making up definitions for sec status and using that as the justification for what you are crying about.
EVE is a PVP game, and that conflict can and will manifest itself in many ways. From markets and resources to lasers and missiles, if you are playing this game make no mistake about it, you are playing a PVP game on a PVP server. There maybe places that you can live /be in eve that are "safer" (like in dock) but you are never safe. Understand and accept that, or uninstall eve and go find something that has blue servers.
This "broken" mechanic is working as intended, find a PVP solution to your problem. Stop running missions solo (FFS) and bring along a few corp mates in frigs /etc to help run interference. (ECM Burst and Smart bombs if you are feeling lucky)... there really are a long list of solutions to this problem, all of them don't require you acting like a 4 year old and running to mom and dad to make life easier for you.
Suck it up, dust off your no-no place, find your courage and go out and have fun and don't forget that at the end of the day, it's just a game. |
Dolorous Tremmens
The Scope Gallente Federation
47
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Posted - 2014.01.11 23:53:00 -
[28] - Quote
That's because armed people make for polite discourse. Frontiers typically have more ridged law enforcement than densely populated civil areas. Everyone is polite to their friendly neighbors because you want help when its needed, and you go to their rescue too, tit-for-tat. Less rules, more enforcement.
In civilized areas, insurance will cover you, and "the law" gives you a psychological security blanket. A lot more rules, also more bureaucratic loopholes, and complete apathy from your neighbors.
Eve is such a close model to the real world that it is scary sometimes. Get some Eve. Make it yours.
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Gadicus Sharhrizai
FST Labs
0
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Posted - 2014.01.11 23:55:00 -
[29] - Quote
Dolorous Tremmens wrote:That's because armed people make for polite discourse. Frontiers typically have more ridged law enforcement than densely populated civil areas. Everyone is polite to their friendly neighbors because you want help when its needed, and you go to their rescue too, tit-for-tat. Less rules, more enforcement.
In civilized areas, insurance will cover you, and "the law" gives you a psychological security blanket. A lot more rules, also more bureaucratic loopholes, and complete apathy from your neighbors.
Eve is such a close model to the real world that it is scary sometimes.
+1
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Zane Tekitsu
D.I.C.A.D. Solutions
52
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Posted - 2014.01.12 00:09:00 -
[30] - Quote
Dolorous Tremmens wrote:That's because armed people make for polite discourse. Frontiers typically have more ridged law enforcement than densely populated civil areas. Everyone is polite to their friendly neighbors because you want help when its needed, and you go to their rescue too, tit-for-tat. Less rules, more enforcement.
In civilized areas, insurance will cover you, and "the law" gives you a psychological security blanket. A lot more rules, also more bureaucratic loopholes, and complete apathy from your neighbors.
Eve is such a close model to the real world that it is scary sometimes.
+2
Mojo Joo wrote:Zane Tekitsu wrote:Nullsec is always an option you know... The money is better, and the systems are safer than 1.0 systems... True, but that is not a realistic solution for all people. Also high security is supposedly called that way because is meant to be home for people who don't want to be shot at any moment without real consequences like in 0.0 ...
Local open, and D-scan up pretty much remove any threat.
- Rat in a system that is empty or blue,
- Kill any scramming ships first,
- Keep an eye on intel channels,
- be aligned to a POS or a station.
Null-sec systems generally have a low population density, so whenever you see a neut, or someone you don't trust jump in, warp out. For improved security, use a scout and pings. |
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