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Fuyursuki	Posted - 2006.04.16 02:20:00 - [1] Had a frig tournament earlier today with the corp and very good fun indeed Just thinking about upgrading the competition to cruisers, but don't want people to use the top class fighting one (i.e rupture, thorax etc), so just wondered what people consider the 'second class' fighting cruiser. For mm I would suggest the stabber, the gallente have the vexor, amarr the omen and not sure of the caldari one, perhaps the blackbird? Now I know each ship has its niche but they are what I consider the best balance of cost and fighting power below the fighter cruisers. Any opinions would be most welcome. 'Suki
Dark Shikari	Posted - 2006.04.16 02:31:00 - [2] The Caracal is Tier 2, but in my opinion is without a doubt the most powerful cruiser in EVE. [23] Member: Official Forum Warrior What's with the blue robots? Click my sig.
Hait	Posted - 2006.04.16 02:33:00 - [3] How about a mining cruiser fight: Osprey, Scythe, Exequror and ummm, I guess Amarr don't mine so the Augoror will have to do
fmercury	Posted - 2006.04.16 02:45:00 - [4] Edited by: fmercury on 16/04/2006 02:45:27 Vexor is da best. A thorax would toast a caracal and you know it shikari ;)
Blind Man	Posted - 2006.04.16 02:47:00 - [5] Originally by: fmercury Edited by: fmercury on 16/04/2006 02:45:27 Vexor is da best. A thorax would toast a caracal and you know it shikari ;) I would 'lol' at the sight of a thorax MWDing towards a fury heavy missle carcal
JADE DRAG0NESS	Posted - 2006.04.16 02:48:00 - [6] Originally by: Blind Man Originally by: fmercury Edited by: fmercury on 16/04/2006 02:45:27 Vexor is da best. A thorax would toast a caracal and you know it shikari ;) I would 'lol' at the sight of a thorax MWDing towards a fury heavy missle carcal You sure there would be time to type lol.
Dark Shikari	Posted - 2006.04.16 03:07:00 - [7] Edited by: Dark Shikari on 16/04/2006 03:08:06 Originally by: fmercury Vexor is da best. A thorax would toast a caracal and you know it shikari ;) I have dueled both gank and tank/plated caracals, all beginning at point blank. I have yet to lose. And no I don't use EW. There is truth to this deal with the Vexor though. The only cruiser I have lost to in my Caracal is a Vexor. Though that was partially due to my own stupidity [23] Member: Official Forum Warrior What's with the blue robots? Click my sig.
Malthros Zenobia	Posted - 2006.04.16 03:14:00 - [8] Originally by: Dark Shikari The Caracal is Tier 2, but in my opinion is without a doubt the most powerful cruiser in EVE. Only because precision heavies are uber. Once a thorax closes the distance on it, or a Moa gets into AM range, it's not going to hold up all that well. Plus a BB will just jam him and prevent it from ever locking, and just how many FOFs do you normally carry? Originally by: Dark Shikari Istvaan Shogaatsu's ego, when combined with a veldspar asteroid, would create 500 titans. Too bad he's never mined. RAWR!11 Sig Hijack!11 - Imaran
Malthros Zenobia	Posted - 2006.04.16 03:18:00 - [9] Originally by: Dark Shikari Edited by: Dark Shikari on 16/04/2006 03:08:06 Originally by: fmercury Vexor is da best. A thorax would toast a caracal and you know it shikari ;) I have dueled both gank and tank/plated caracals, all beginning at point blank. Assuming you mean tank/gank raxes, but I can't help but wonder how you're starting point blank, and out-tanking them, when a blasterax is going to be doing 2x your damage, something just doesn't seem quite right in there... Originally by: Dark Shikari Istvaan Shogaatsu's ego, when combined with a veldspar asteroid, would create 500 titans. Too bad he's never mined. RAWR!11 Sig Hijack!11 - Imaran
fmercury	Posted - 2006.04.16 06:28:00 - [10] Originally by: Dark Shikari Edited by: Dark Shikari on 16/04/2006 03:08:06 Originally by: fmercury Vexor is da best. A thorax would toast a caracal and you know it shikari ;) I have dueled both gank and tank/plated caracals, all beginning at point blank. Doesn't prove anything. Maybe the pilots were low-sp, or just morons? Thorax is going to be doing twice your DPS and still be able to fit a decent tank. While the caracal can tank pretty nicely it's not going to hold up to the ~500 DPS of a t2 rax :)
Epsilon 1	Posted - 2006.04.16 07:06:00 - [11] Originally by: Dark Shikari The Caracal is Tier 2, but in my opinion is without a doubt the most powerful cruiser in EVE. No such thing as the most powerful (cruiser, battleship, whatever.) Thorax/maller would toast a caracal. It all comes down to pilots and setups. Originally by: Steven Gerrard Why do those minmatarians throw their ships together from toilet paper and junk?
Zysco	Posted - 2006.04.16 07:25:00 - [12] There is currently no cruiser ingame that can kill a max skills vexor without the use of ew. New Petition Inc Vid
Lorth	Posted - 2006.04.16 07:31:00 - [13] Vexor is NOT a second class cruiser. Just not many people know how to fit it.
Rorix Whitecloud	Posted - 2006.04.16 07:54:00 - [14] Originally by: Lorth Vexor is NOT a second class cruiser. Just not many people know how to fit it. I think he meant tier 2 cruiser... ~I don't remember. That's the second thing they teach you.
HippoKing	Posted - 2006.04.16 08:45:00 - [15] tier 2, you want a vexor or a caracal solo. blackbird or caracal in groups heard nice things about the stabber too, but i know very little about it Win a Cerberus!! sigs of the 23/24/25 hijack just as well -eris yarrrr, i shall retake my sig -HippoKing Not a chance, our 1337 sig haXx0r sk1llz are too powerful! - Wrangler Ho-Ho-Hooooooo, Merry Saturday!11 - Immy Yo ho ho and a bottle of BReeEEEEeee.... - Jacques ARRRRRRchambault Stop spamming with "QFT" >:\|. - Teblin Who pwned who? ~kieron RAWR!11 Sig Hijack!11 - Imaran
R31D	Posted - 2006.04.16 10:08:00 - [16] If a Vexor with Blasters lands on top of you, say goodbye Free bumpage for all
Valen L'eganas	Posted - 2006.04.16 11:21:00 - [17] Edited by: Valen L''eganas on 16/04/2006 11:23:15 Originally by: R31D If a Vexor with Blasters lands on top of you, say goodbye What good is all that firepower if you can't even lock your target??? For every measure... there is a countermeasure.... In the end its about balls, and brains but often luck too... I sometimes fly blasterrax, BB, Damp-Celest or Caracal, but mostly its about my mood when I choose my ship. ---------------------- *Homo Sapiens non Urinat in ventum*
Dark Shikari	Posted - 2006.04.16 12:05:00 - [18] Edited by: Dark Shikari on 16/04/2006 12:07:56 Originally by: fmercury Originally by: Dark Shikari Originally by: fmercury Vexor is da best. A thorax would toast a caracal and you know it shikari ;) I have dueled both gank and tank/plated caracals, all beginning at point blank. Doesn't prove anything. Maybe the pilots were low-sp, or just morons? Thorax is going to be doing twice your DPS and still be able to fit a decent tank. While the caracal can tank pretty nicely it's not going to hold up to the ~500 DPS of a t2 rax :) You would be very, very surprised. I don't want to say that the Caracal is overpowered, but I highly doubt that any Thorax can beat a Caracal. The only ship I have lost to is a Vexor (yes, the Vexor is a VERY good ship). I'm not entirely sure if it was due to his setup being better or me making a number of very dumb tactical mistakes. Always remember that a Caracal can kill any untanked cruiser in a maximum of 4 volleys. So a gankrax will die in 24 seconds (8 second refire * 3 volleys, as the first volley is instant). That means a gankrax will do 12000 unhardened damage, or about 6000 hardened. The shield will probably recharge about 1000 of that during that time, so about 5000 actual damage. Since the caracal will probably have the advantage at the start of the battle as it can simply lock and fire before the thorax can get in range (even if they start at 15km), it will probably save itself another 1000 damage. Thus, the Caracal ends up with 2500 shields left (rough calculation). [23] Member: Official Forum Warrior What's with the blue robots? Click my sig.
Kaylana Syi	Posted - 2006.04.16 12:52:00 - [19] Toe to Toe if you beat a Thorax with a Caracal at point blank without ewar I wouldn't even mention it to anyone because it just means you fought a nublet. Plain and simple. Originally by: "Oveur" I don't react to threats any better than you do
Firequill	Posted - 2006.04.16 14:02:00 - [20] Omg... No he didnt mean tier 2 cruisers, he meant the lesser, second-rate cruisers like an auguror, celestis, vexor .. auguror, hmm i hadnt looked at its new bonuses since rmr.. lol 10% armor bonus per lvl? celestis has more ewar so might not be too fun to duel.. blackbird, nah, same as celes.. no fun in being jammed/damped to hell through a duel..
HippoKing	Posted - 2006.04.16 14:07:00 - [21] moa is second class Win a Cerberus!! sigs of the 23/24/25 hijack just as well -eris yarrrr, i shall retake my sig -HippoKing Not a chance, our 1337 sig haXx0r sk1llz are too powerful! - Wrangler Ho-Ho-Hooooooo, Merry Saturday!11 - Immy Yo ho ho and a bottle of BReeEEEEeee.... - Jacques ARRRRRRchambault Stop spamming with "QFT" >:\|. - Teblin Who pwned who? ~kieron RAWR!11 Sig Hijack!11 - Imaran
Montero	Posted - 2006.04.16 14:17:00 - [22] i see no reason why any t1 cruiser in eve should ever beat a vexor wthout ewar. and even then, i've killed blackbirds 1v1 whilst jammed. Keep profanity & moderation discussion out of your sig, please. --Jorauk ISD USE HAX AND SPLOITS
Ithildin	Posted - 2006.04.16 14:39:00 - [23] The tiers. Tier 1 (aka "Logistics tier"): Augoror, Exequrour, Osprey, Scythe. Tier 2 (aka "Electronic Warfare tier"): Arbitrator, Celestis, Blackbird, Bellicose Tier 2.5 (aka "Assault tier"): Omen, Vexor, Caracal, Stabber Tier 3 (aka "State of the art tier"): Maller, Thorax, Moa, Rupture If you want the "strongest" cruisers, I'd say: Maller, Thorax, Caracal, Rupture. If you want the "second strongest" cruisers, I'd say: Arbitrator, Vexor, Blackbird, Stabber. The Vexor is lacking slightly in hit points, those 4 low slots aren't going to make for too many good setups, as well as the lack of backup drones is annoying. The Arbitrator is just nasty. Anything but Blackbirds or Caracal's are going to feel an intense sensation of missery when attacking Arbitrators. Originally by: Firequill auguror, hmm i hadnt looked at its new bonuses since rmr.. lol 10% armor bonus per lvl? Not to nitpick, but the Augoror has had +10% armour hit points since middle of Castor, when all cruisers got their second bonus. Might be wrong, though, in which case it's had that bonus since launch. The new RMR bonus on Augoror is the energy transfer bonus. Latest EVE musing (MC-boards)
Montero	Posted - 2006.04.16 14:40:00 - [24] you slate the vexor then big up the arbi, which is like a poor man's vex. Keep profanity & moderation discussion out of your sig, please. --Jorauk ISD USE HAX AND SPLOITS
Arkanor	Posted - 2006.04.16 14:58:00 - [25] Originally by: Valen L'eganas What good is all that firepower if you can't even lock your target??? Use the drones Luke. ________________________________________________ Originally by: Imperial Baddour I just lost my ship, and dont feel like playing anymore!
Ithildin	Posted - 2006.04.16 15:13:00 - [26] Originally by: Montero you slate the vexor then big up the arbi, which is like a poor man's vex. The biggest difference is that the Vexor fit a few more guns, while the Arbitrator fit a few more EWar modules. Otherwise the HP difference isn't pronounced at all. I'd actually put my money on Arbitrator in a straight slug-fest between the two. Latest EVE musing (MC-boards)
Fuyursuki	Posted - 2006.04.16 15:14:00 - [27] Wow, cheers guys didn't expect this many people to reply, but its all good. Some interesting suggestions here, but I guess I could have been clearer about what I was asking Basically I wanted to use the more underused ships, seeing as any respectable pilot knows how to fit his races primary cruiser (or what most people consider the best one at least). I would think a Caracal would just kill anything on the field in about 20 seconds (the kessies were bad enough in the frigate wars!) so a jamming Blackbird may pose an interesting opponent, as would a Arbitrator. The list posted by Ithildin is useful, seeing as it puts my question in a better way :/ Thanks guys, and keep them coming! æSuki
Firequill	Posted - 2006.04.16 15:17:00 - [28] Originally by: Firequill auguror, hmm i hadnt looked at its new bonuses since rmr.. lol 10% armor bonus per lvl? Originally by: Ithildin Not to nitpick, but the Augoror has had +10% armour hit points since middle of Castor, when all cruisers got their second bonus. Might be wrong, though, in which case it's had that bonus since launch. The new RMR bonus on Augoror is the energy transfer bonus. Oh? o well, then again, ive never flown one, heck the only ammar stuff ive flown is a punisher
Ithildin	Posted - 2006.04.16 15:18:00 - [29] Under-used cruisers would be, if considering intentional PvP use :- Amarr: Auguror, Arbitrator, Omen* Caldari: Osprey Gallente: Exequrour, Celestis* Minmatar: Scythe, Bellicose * These ships are becoming more common Latest EVE musing (MC-boards)
Kaeten	Posted - 2006.04.16 15:27:00 - [30] ♥ vexor, drone interfacing 5 makes it nice Second image removed, please only use one image in your signature - Petwraith :( ingameboard.asp?a=topi

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