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Justin Credulent
Perkone Caldari State
50
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Posted - 2011.11.13 04:32:00 -
[31] - Quote
Quote:EVE University does not teach PvP. The real teachers are the pirate corporations who specialize in small-gang tactics.
Yeah, because 3 people ("small gang") in Warp Scrambler Hurricanes sitting at a gate for the helpless Industrial is F*CKING HARDCORE PVP MAN!!!!
Translation: Go f*ck yourself. Null-Sec needs to HTFU and stop crying to CCP. If null-sec wants PvP, they need to stop being carebears and start fighting eachother - after years of bot-mining, they have the ships! |
Revolution Rising
Native Freshfood Minmatar Republic
25
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Posted - 2011.11.13 04:43:00 -
[32] - Quote
Kent Reeves wrote:It might help if you limit the number of systems a corp/alliance can have sovereignty over due to skill points. There are skills for everything in the game except sovereignty.
For lack of better solutions, I'd be down for this.
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Stella Dust
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
11
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Posted - 2011.11.13 04:52:00 -
[33] - Quote
Parsee789 wrote:Until coalitions and NAPfests remain, along with swarms of blues nullsec will remain as it is. If you don't like it then You the players have to change it. Don't get CCP to change nullsec due to problems that alliances have created. If you want action, I will quote: " Stop having so much blues and start shooting." Why should CCP waste time and resources trying to "fix" nullsec when there are much more pressing concerns in the game. Stella Dust wrote:Parsee789 wrote:There's no way you can expect how people will behave and react. You can't blame CCP for what has happened to nullsec and trying get the player to play in a certain way will not work for CCP, they'll just quit. That's where you're wrong, you can account for human behaviour, it's not as individual as individuals at least when it comes down to a conrtolled environment and a game is just that. People should be aware and accept the consequences of their own actions. CCP did not tell you or force you to create absurdly large mega alliances surrounded by blues with hordes of RMT bots. That was of YOUR OWN DOING. Its called RESPONSIBILITY AND LIABILITY. If you can't accept that then HTFU.
You're wrong again, it's human nature. CCP implemented the changes that were going to result in large mega alliances, they should have realised that would be the result. Meaning they did not think it through fully.
It was not of my own doing as I'm not in one of those alliances, I don't even blame the alliances involved because it was going to happen (not talking about RMT as I can't really say anything on that as I've not seen any proof of large alliances in 0.0 RMTing) . It's the kind of thing that happens when you add competition into the game in the manner CCP did.
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Poetic Stanziel
Arrakis Technology
279
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Posted - 2011.11.13 04:54:00 -
[34] - Quote
Large Collidable Object wrote:As opposed to most people in GD, my concern isn't converting highsec bears into nullsec bears, but making game mechanics in low/0.0 fun for those actually interested in pvp. You sound like The Mittani. Hmm.
EVE Online: Incarna - New Coke EVE Online: Winter Expansion - Coke Classic |
Tanya Powers
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
187
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Posted - 2011.11.13 04:57:00 -
[35] - Quote
Paragon Renegade wrote:Really, everyone is so busy demanding they nerf Highsec (Safety-wise) that they forget nerfing is not the answer.
Actually the most comic episodes of Eve are being written right now.
RMT 's asking on forums "CCP stop that"
Gankers enjoying the safety of high sec
Null sec dictating to each and every players from older to new one how they have to play this game, forget CCP on the process, they have nothing to say.
Yeah very fun indeed. Excellent experience.
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Azelor Delaria
Error-404
79
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Posted - 2011.11.13 05:08:00 -
[36] - Quote
Justin Credulent wrote:Quote:EVE University does not teach PvP. The real teachers are the pirate corporations who specialize in small-gang tactics. Yeah, because 3 people ("small gang") in Warp Scrambler Hurricanes sitting at a gate for the helpless Industrial is F*CKING HARDCORE PVP MAN!!!!Translation: Go f*ck yourself.
It's more PvP than sitting at a gate in null sec with a 50-man blob, complete with bubbles.
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Parsee789
Immaterial and Missing Power
19
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Posted - 2011.11.13 05:15:00 -
[37] - Quote
Players created the mega blobs and lagtastic fleet fights. It doesn't matter how much CCP fixes lag, alliances will continue to dump ships into the node UNTIL IT LAGS, THEN THEY WILL COMPLAIN ABOUT THE LAG.
Alliances should stop having their space full of blues so they won't be so bored so much.
Imagine if we applied the Nullsec Alliance systems and Coalitions to the Entire EVE universe. There would simply be not much people to fight, and when targets are found they will be crushed with ridiculous overwhelming force, never to be seen again.
Then they will run out of Targets because no one wants to fight a ridiculously Large Blob.
If you want easy to find and easy to destroy kills, well that's simply too bad, most people will not make the same mistake twice.
Alliances should think about their war philosophy and politics and wonder why nullsec is stagnating.
If they can't do that, well they deserve to fail.
CCP is not responsible are how alliances should be run, that's the Players' job! |
mkint
324
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Posted - 2011.11.13 06:45:00 -
[38] - Quote
Parsee789 wrote:Players created the mega blobs and lagtastic fleet fights. It doesn't matter how much CCP fixes lag, alliances will continue to dump ships into the node UNTIL IT LAGS, THEN THEY WILL COMPLAIN ABOUT THE LAG.
Alliances should stop having their space full of blues so they won't be so bored so much.
Imagine if we applied the Nullsec Alliance systems and Coalitions to the Entire EVE universe. There would simply be not much people to fight, and when targets are found they will be crushed with ridiculous overwhelming force, never to be seen again.
Then they will run out of Targets because no one wants to fight a ridiculously Large Blob.
If you want easy to find and easy to destroy kills, well that's simply too bad, most people will not make the same mistake twice.
Alliances should think about their war philosophy and politics and wonder why nullsec is stagnating.
If they can't do that, well they deserve to fail.
CCP is not responsible are how alliances should be run, that's the Players' job! Um... yeah... so... you basically just rewrote your OP to bump your own thread? Super.
Alliances are making the best decisions that they can for the success of their alliances. Unprofitable wars destroy alliances. The nullsec alliances are making the right decisions for their own success. Game mechanics do not allow any decisions to be made other than those that have been made.
Perhaps you should clarify your argument and come up with some valid, plausible supporting points, because so far it's just been a babbling "I'm sooooo angry!" |
Sri Nova
Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic
22
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Posted - 2011.11.13 07:00:00 -
[39] - Quote
Player Driven . that is the wonderful thing about eve .
For over 7 years we have had a player driven game and it has been awesome.
How ever there has been one problem that ccp has been wanting to solve. how to get more people out of high sec and into null?
Unfortunately the players have failed at making null awesome .
As the game stands now it is entirely dependent on the players to make null in to a place that people want to come to.
Over the years the player base has been exposed to null enough, to know whether they are going to stay or avoid it . The majority have decided to avoid it or worse exploit it.
The exploitation of nullsec is what has made it anemic . The lack of player investment into the game mechanics available to them is another.
Honest attempts have been made by the players to make null attractive but they have all failed. mainly because its easier ,more profitable , and unfortunately more fun to just cannibalize each other than to watch each others backs.
Null as it stands can be interpreted as fine .. but it will take more than just the players to make null into what ccp envisions. |
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
1092
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Posted - 2011.11.13 07:37:00 -
[40] - Quote
Parsee789 wrote:Its not CCP's fault that nullsec is bad, its the players fault.
Have you ever been to a system called Nonni? It's a 0.5 sec in Lonetrek, it has quite a few stations, and it's 6 or 7 jumps from Jita.
Nonni has more production capacity than any 5 regions of sovereign 0.0 space. For free.
Think about that for a moment.
Carry on.
Malcanis' Law: Any proposal justified on the basis that "it will benefit new players" is invariably to the greater advantage of older, richer players.
Things to do in EVE:-áhttp://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/ |
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Kietay Ayari
Monopoly Money Operations
37
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Posted - 2011.11.13 07:53:00 -
[41] - Quote
At one point in history when people were put down and told they couldn't succeed they would have tried harder. Don't hold your breath for that to be the norm again! Posts like this are the future! Ferox #1 |
Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
124
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Posted - 2011.11.13 08:03:00 -
[42] - Quote
One thing that would really jazz it up is the ability to dial in a system to system warp for most ships, whether by module, rig or hull.
The gank pipelines and hence the gankaholics along with the usual use of renter space as killing fields have managed to form a Great Wall of Carebear around high sec. The gates, and the mechanics around them, lead to gate camps and blobs. The gate camp and the warp bubble reign. Remove the dependency on them and the age of the Combat Probe and small patrol begins.
There's a thread for system to system hyperwarp in F&I. |
Dradius Calvantia
Creative Cookie Procuring Rote Kapelle
60
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Posted - 2011.11.13 08:53:00 -
[43] - Quote
Posting in another thread full of people who do not live in null. |
Akrasjel Lanate
Naquatech Conglomerate
169
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Posted - 2011.11.13 09:25:00 -
[44] - Quote
Parsee789 wrote:Its not CCP's fault that nullsec is bad, its the players fault.
Just like Lowsec is, pirates kill people and laugh at them and tell them to go back to highsec.
A month later they complain that people aren't coming lowsec. They then whine and cry like little babies about how highsec and nullsec needs to be nerfed.
The same applies to nullsec, mindless blobs gank people that come in and tell them to go carebear in highsec.
A year later they complain that nullsec is dying and they need CCP to get more people in nullsec.
Please CCP, there is nothing wrong with Nullsec and there are plenty of isk and opportunities to become rich. It is the fault of the alliances and the people there that make it so.
Trying to fix nullsec and lowsec is trying to make someone quit drugs, its pretty much impossible. They won't change so no
matter what Nullsec will remain as it is.
There are plenty of people living in nullsec, nothing needs to be changed.
It's the player fault that they create... coalition that take half of 0.0 and then WHINE that they don't have REDs to shoot...
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Mahakaharashi RedEagle
Hedion University Amarr Empire
1
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Posted - 2011.11.13 09:39:00 -
[45] - Quote
Parsee789 wrote:Its not CCP's fault that nullsec is bad, its the players fault. No, it's never players fault because players will always tend to do the same thing in any given setup. So it's all about the game mechanics - change that, and players will behave differently. |
Ann133566
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
36
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Posted - 2011.11.13 09:42:00 -
[46] - Quote
well... They could limit the number of people in a corp and the number of people in an alliance.... the tears would be awsome |
Solhild
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
61
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Posted - 2011.11.13 09:44:00 -
[47] - Quote
Parsee789 wrote:Its not CCP's fault that nullsec is bad, its the players fault.
Just like Lowsec is, pirates kill people and laugh at them and tell them to go back to highsec.
A month later they complain that people aren't coming lowsec. They then whine and cry like little babies about how highsec and nullsec needs to be nerfed.
The same applies to nullsec, mindless blobs gank people that come in and tell them to go carebear in highsec.
A year later they complain that nullsec is dying and they need CCP to get more people in nullsec.
Please CCP, there is nothing wrong with Nullsec and there are plenty of isk and opportunities to become rich. It is the fault of the alliances and the people there that make it so.
Trying to fix nullsec and lowsec is trying to make someone quit drugs, its pretty much impossible. They won't change so no
matter what Nullsec will remain as it is.
There are plenty of people living in nullsec, nothing needs to be changed.
A compelling argument here. Well done sir. |
Lord Mandelor
Consolidated Holdings War Ensemble.
67
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Posted - 2011.11.13 09:48:00 -
[48] - Quote
Ann133566 wrote:well... They could limit the number of people in a corp and the number of people in an alliance.... the tears would be awsome It won't matter what official restrictions are. People can still work together without official stamps on everything. ConHo Daily: http://conhodaily.blogspot.com Stories ranging from midgets inside your Damage Control to drones becoming self-aware. |
Elrich Kouvo
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2011.11.13 10:03:00 -
[49] - Quote
The problem is not the players so much as it is CCP. CCP allows Null sec to be choked off, with perma running bubble gate camps. If they want high sec carebears to move into null sec, then they need to tear down those walls! |
Ann133566
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
36
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Posted - 2011.11.13 10:10:00 -
[50] - Quote
Elrich Kouvo wrote:The problem is not the players so much as it is CCP. CCP allows Null sec to be choked off, with perma running bubble gate camps. If they want high sec carebears to move into null sec, then they need to tear down those walls!
Carebears know they will be target practice. |
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Nova Fox
Novafox Shipyards
290
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Posted - 2011.11.13 10:15:00 -
[51] - Quote
Whoever said the Op is wrong for accounting for normal human behavior needs to move to a third world country where that is normal.
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Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
1093
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Posted - 2011.11.13 10:20:00 -
[52] - Quote
Elrich Kouvo wrote:The problem is not the players so much as it is CCP. CCP allows Null sec to be choked off, with perma running bubble gate camps. If they want high sec carebears to move into null sec, then they need to tear down those walls!
It's hilariously easy to move through 0.0 if you try some other method than "Get in Raven, set autopilot, activate autopilot".
Would you like to know more? Malcanis' Law: Any proposal justified on the basis that "it will benefit new players" is invariably to the greater advantage of older, richer players.
Things to do in EVE:-áhttp://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/ |
Myz Toyou
Bite me inc. Narwhals Ate My Duck
11
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Posted - 2011.11.13 10:25:00 -
[53] - Quote
Ann133566 wrote:well... They could limit the number of people in a corp and the number of people in an alliance.... the tears would be awsome
yeah, special the tears from all the veteran NPC corpmembers that get pushed in their own 1 man corp to make room for new players
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Elson Tamar
Lion Investments
33
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Posted - 2011.11.13 10:52:00 -
[54] - Quote
Not all low and null players are douches. Im trying to get my PVP on at the mo and the learning curve isnt too steep, strap guns to ship and pew. Once you are over getting ships blown up and getting podded (which happens less than you would think!) that side of it isn't to bad. I have met more people in low sec who are talk than i ever have in high sec. The guys in BREAD have been very cool as has the others who have shot at me, ransomed me and generally given me tips. - During the week at any rate.
Now what i have discovered is that low sec apears to have no one in it, seriously it's a bit boring. There are no small gangs, there is mainly 1 on 1, at least between Amarr and Gallantee space (Domani, Sing Laison etc.).
Partly this is becasue of Low secs rep i think, but also some low sec players are douches. If you educate high sec players in pvp, if you encourage small corps to set up you will get your pew on. The problem is those small corps will get murdered simply becasue there is no one there. A friend of mine, who is a dedicated pirate, has recently come up to high sec becasue low sec has got boring, tells you a lot really dosn't it.
I have only played in Null a little, and that was the training wheels npc null and bubble camps (i cant fly a raven or proteus so bubble camps hurt) ended the fun for me. As a Neutral you are a victim waiting to happen, i will say again however there are some cool people who will give tips and help, but a samll group or one person really dosn't have any impact. If you want samll gangs running around null you need to give 'em an ability to affect the world around them.
Hell if all the high sec greifers though they could go and grief null sec alliance i reckon they would be all over it (unless of course they are high sec griefing because its safe with little risk, see what i did there ;) )
There is a problem with the people, but also there needs to be system changes. Not sure what, but OP is mainly right. |
Elrich Kouvo
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2011.11.13 11:01:00 -
[55] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:Elrich Kouvo wrote:The problem is not the players so much as it is CCP. CCP allows Null sec to be choked off, with perma running bubble gate camps. If they want high sec carebears to move into null sec, then they need to tear down those walls! It's hilariously easy to move through 0.0 if you try some other method than "Get in Raven, set autopilot, activate autopilot". Would you like to know more? nullsec ain't worth it. I don't need to know more. You have been around long enough to know that when CCP introduced warp bubbles it messed up nullsec. The only thin that is "hilariously easy" is gate camping with warp bubbles. |
Aruken Marr
BSC LEGION Tactical Narcotics Team
2
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Posted - 2011.11.13 11:29:00 -
[56] - Quote
If people are that soft skinned they cant take a bit of banter from people in local maybe they should go back to hisec. HTFU for crying out loud. You sound like a band of little kids
Justin Credulent wrote:
Exactly. EVE is player driven. If the carebears in null-sec really wanted some action, they'd wardaec eachother.
wat?
Clearly you don't know what youre talking about |
proxwar
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
11
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Posted - 2011.11.13 11:38:00 -
[57] - Quote
Aruken Marr wrote:Justin Credulent wrote:
Exactly. EVE is player driven. If the carebears in null-sec really wanted some action, they'd wardaec eachother.
wat? Clearly you don't know what youre talking about
Far from being a null vet myself, i have to question this? Elaborate some.
Null is full of big alliances with thousands of players, 99% of which complain that null is boring and CCP owes it to them for some reson to fix what you yourselves broke.
Usually the most obvious solution is the right one, if you null sec bears are bored, it because you blueball everybody within reach to protect your RMT bot operations, ergo, if you want constant unrestricted PVP ( which is the whole point of null ) then red each other and pew pew to your hearts content.
Problem solved.
You lot always call high seccers bears for not coming into low/null, yet there are no bigger hypocrties than yourselves, your all carebears in null by your own choice, you just dont like people knowing it.
You guys made null into the place it is now, so stop whining that it need buffing when your the ones that made it into the boring void its become.
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Grace Chang
Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire
0
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Posted - 2011.11.13 11:41:00 -
[58] - Quote
To OP: you are wrong.
You can't blame people for behaving egocentric and powerhungry in nullsec. That is how they are/play in this game. It is CCP job to design the sandbox around this premise and make it work for many people REGARDLESS. I have to admit that is probably tough, because people come up with new and exciting ways of being assholes all the time :) (not that that is necessarily a bad thing in a game like this).
Telling people just to be "nice" and "moral" is just foolish. That doesn't even work in RL. |
Aruken Marr
BSC LEGION Tactical Narcotics Team
2
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Posted - 2011.11.13 11:47:00 -
[59] - Quote
proxwar wrote:Aruken Marr wrote:Justin Credulent wrote:
Exactly. EVE is player driven. If the carebears in null-sec really wanted some action, they'd wardaec eachother.
wat? Clearly you don't know what youre talking about Far from being a null vet myself, i have to question this? Elaborate some. Null is full of big alliances with thousands of players, 99% of which complain that null is boring and CCP owes it to them for some reson to fix what you yourselves broke. Usually the most obvious solution is the right one, if you null sec bears are bored, it because you blueball everybody within reach to protect your RMT bot operations, ergo, if you want constant unrestricted PVP ( which is the whole point of null ) then red each other and pew pew to your hearts content. Problem solved. You lot always call high seccers bears for not coming into low/null, yet there are no bigger hypocrties than yourselves, your all carebears in null by your own choice, you just dont like people knowing it. You guys made null into the place it is now, so stop whining that it need buffing when your the ones that made it into the boring void its become.
Nice broad generalisation there. 99% of null seem to be pretty dam content with shooting each other right now. Yeah maybe it would be nice to have more targets, yea maybe it would be nice if anomalies payed out as much as they used to so that i can get back on the horse a bit quicker but. But **** man, maybe you should spend less time on the forums and more time playing. Maybe then youd see that 99% of players in null are pretty chill.
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Hauling Hal
The Black Ops
10
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Posted - 2011.11.13 11:56:00 -
[60] - Quote
Aruken Marr wrote: 99% of null seem to be pretty dam content with shooting each other right now.
This line implies only 1% of null have blued each other, which is either a troll or you're too insignificant/stupid/ignorant to know any better. |
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