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Chee
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Posted - 2006.06.14 14:41:00 -
[91]
I like what Azzerad proposed, 7.5% RoF to projectiles, 5% launcher rof.
Coupled with a slight powergrid nudge it would be great. Havnt run short on CPU on my phoon yet.
That should keep it within tier 1 margins but a viable option, just like the other tier 1 race bs.
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Weirda
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Posted - 2006.06.14 15:19:00 -
[92]
 Originally by: Testy Mctest
Originally by: Ithildin
A thought struck me. It was gone quickly, but I caught the tail of it... "Why does projectiles have to be made that they require two damage bonuses? Minmatar ships could have all these cool miscellaneous bonuses instead". I think the thought meant stuff like agility, scrambler range, etc when it mentioned miscellaneous bonuses. I.e. all those little bonuses that makes you better but that the forum *****s blatantly ignore all the time.
I approve of this idea, if I understand you right.
The simple fact is, at the moment, that projectiles simply don't do enough damage without double bonuses. DPS isn't everything - but it needs to be at at least a *reasonable* level or you're ineffective. There's very few Minmatar ships that don't have a double bonus of some kind that are considered decent in any kind of combat role. Of course, if projectiles were buffed we could have some cool misc bonuses such as speed, agility, warp strength (gorilla warfare ftw!), and such.
But sadly, that's about as likely as me going a day without posting.
matari gun get their 'dps' from matari ship to keep them from going on other ship. much as laser use too much cap on non-amarr ship... that is the real reason it wont change. (yes we know that people have made many viable setup with projectile on non-minmatar ship, but those setup are not using dps as their viability).
but wtf does weirda know - you have completely ignore every post then agree w/those that repeat the same thing... 
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Weirda
Assault Ship need 4th Bonus and More! |
Mila Prestoc
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Posted - 2006.06.14 15:32:00 -
[93]
Originally by: Weirda
matari gun get their 'dps' from matari ship to keep them from going on other ship. much as laser use too much cap on non-amarr ship... that is the real reason it wont change. (yes we know that people have made many viable setup with projectile on non-minmatar ship, but those setup are not using dps as their viability).
but wtf does weirda know - you have completely ignore every post then agree w/those that repeat the same thing...
I AGREE... feel the love.
I think 5% would be ok after running some tables/graphs but 7.5% wouldn't be overpowering but actually make it a GOOD ship. People are so used to it being some low DPS tin can they don't want it being anything but that little minmatar tin can that fits loads of nos and a few missiles or AC's.
The strength people haven't mentioned explicetly so far is that people won't know what to expect. ATM AC's + Missiles are very low DPS compared to most BS's. With the bonus changes people would actually have to consider the damage output of the Typhoon. It could also use the traditional Missiles + NOS while retaining good DPS like the Domi does through its drones (which it has vast ammounts of spares unlike the typhoon) so it would truely be flexable and unpredictable.
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Imhotep Khem
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Posted - 2006.06.14 16:11:00 -
[94]
Why is CCP toying with Minmatar. This ship has sucked for over 2 years now. And the solution is to tinker? Don't we deserve more?
Split weapon system sucks (in many ways). Rather than fix this, they continue along as if somehow the split can be redeemed. Please, go tinker Amarr or Caldari. Minmatar have had enough. I do not have patience for experiments with the Typhoon.
Make the ship 5/4 if you want to split. Those that cant understand then can gladly fit 4 launchers and 4 turrets. The rest of us will fit 5 projectiles. There is simply no other answer than 5 turrets.
____
"If your not dyin' your not tryin'."
"Are you prepared to go all the way, Alexi?" DuGalle |
Wilfan Ret'nub
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Posted - 2006.06.14 16:28:00 -
[95]
Originally by: Imhotep Khem
There is simply no other answer than 5 turrets.
5 launchers?
I hope you can see the advantage of the fastest T1 BS that spams torps.
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Testy Mctest
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Posted - 2006.06.14 17:47:00 -
[96]
Originally by: Weirda
matari gun get their 'dps' from matari ship to keep them from going on other ship. much as laser use too much cap on non-amarr ship...
Fair point.
Anyway, enough projectile vsa other stuff debate. Back to the phoon.
@ the above guy who says there's no answer but 5 turrets: that's highly untrue. It's fine with split weapon systems as long as it gets an appropriate bonus. And as DB Preacher said above, it has other advantages too, that can be played to. I'd much rather a ship be unique and different (as long as the ship is still usable) than just another gunboat.
Testy's Eve Blog, Updated 12/06/06
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Kaylana Syi
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Posted - 2006.06.14 17:57:00 -
[97]
5% to RoF for Proj and L missiles seems a bit fair to me atm. Even if the numbers were slightly off... its wayyyy better than what we have now.
Originally by: "Oveur"
I don't react to threats any better than you do
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Sarmaul
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Posted - 2006.06.14 18:34:00 -
[98]
/op signed (you took your bloody time writing it!!!)
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Mila Prestoc
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Posted - 2006.06.14 19:03:00 -
[99]
Originally by: Sarmaul
/op signed (you took your bloody time writing it!!!)
You took your time to post!
We got the Sarmaul stamp of approval, tux may carry the changes out. hehe
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Tar om
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Posted - 2006.06.14 19:15:00 -
[100]
Originally by: Toaster Oven
Theoretical Typhoon with 7.5% ROF bonus:
4x Heavy Diminishing NOS
4x Siege Launcher II
100MN AB II
Faint Warp Prohibitor
2x PWNAGE painter
LAR II
MAR II
2x EAN II
Internal Force Field Array
BCU II
RCU II
5x Ogre II + 5x Warrior II + 5x Hornet II
869 DPS. 4 Heavy NOS. Awesome armor tank. Fastest battleship. Lowest sig radius (320m). Torps only doing 10% more damage than cruise against an unpainted Phoon! It would absolutely annihiliate anything it comes across. I can understand why Minnie crew would love this. Nothing like having a one stop solution to pwning the feck out of everything!
The truth is that with maxed missile, gun, NOS and drone skills the phoon is already very nearly a superb ship. Its just frustrating because its only "nearly" superb with 38m SP (in my case, all for Min BS apart from a small diversion into Gall).
Another frustration is that with the 10% range bonus its truly unique when fitted with 4x1400s for range, and losing that bonus will be a sad day. (cmon, its not even overpowered, its just funny).
--
We are the Octavian Vanguard www.octavianvanguard.net
"The belief in the possibility of a short decisive war appears to be one of the most ancient and dangerous of human illusions." |
Sarmaul
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Posted - 2006.06.14 19:17:00 -
[101]
it wouldn't have been so bad if it was 10% optimal and 5% damage. but with 4 turrets and no damage bonus, it was a joke :/
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Testy Mctest
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Posted - 2006.06.14 20:35:00 -
[102]
Originally by: Sarmaul
/op signed (you took your bloody time writing it!!!)
Took your time replying too. 4 pages down!
Testy's Eve Blog, Updated 12/06/06
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Mila Prestoc
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Posted - 2006.06.14 20:46:00 -
[103]
Originally by: Testy Mctest
Originally by: Sarmaul
/op signed (you took your bloody time writing it!!!)
Took your time replying too. 4 pages down!
I'm sure he wanted the 100th post or something before it came up to his standard of topic to post in.
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Epsilon 1
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Posted - 2006.06.14 21:04:00 -
[104]
Boost the phoon 
/Signed.
Originally by: Steven Gerrard
Why do those minmatarians throw their ships together from toilet paper and junk?
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F4ze
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Posted - 2006.06.14 21:25:00 -
[105]
I have had the pleasure of testing the new typhoon on SiSi and this is what I came up with:
I used two different setups, both were using:
4 dual 425mm AC II (barrage ammo, also carrying some hail and EM)
4 arbalest cruise (I only have cruise missiles at lvl3) (paradise cruise)
1 fleeting webifier
1 faint scrambler
1 heavy electrochemical injector
1 AB or 1 balmer tracking disruptor
In case of AB:
1 LAR II
4 hardeners (3 specific, 1 EAN II)
1 gyro II
1 BCU II
In case of tracking disruptor:
2 LAR acco
3 hardeners (1 exp, 2 EAN II)
1 gyro II
1 BCU II
Complemented with 5 Ogre II and 5 Hammerhead II.
And the results....I've killed geddons, ravens, megathrons, apocs, phoons and haven't lost a duel yet (more testing to come).
Imho, the typhoon is great with the new changes. It's a killing machine without resorting to nos-tactics or EW, even with sub-par missile skills. Sure it could do with a little bit extra grid so it might be able to fit the above setups with AB + dual acco reppers, or perhaps fit siege launchers or dual 650mm AC's. But overall, it's actually a good ship and a capable killer.
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Sarmaul
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Posted - 2006.06.14 21:30:00 -
[106]
Edited by: Sarmaul on 14/06/2006 21:29:59
Originally by: Mila Prestoc
Originally by: Testy Mctest
Originally by: Sarmaul
/op signed (you took your bloody time writing it!!!)
Took your time replying too. 4 pages down!
I'm sure he wanted the 100th post or something before it came up to his standard of topic to post in.
I didn't even realise it was the 100th post, and I was in London all day yesterday so I couldn't reply to the thread 
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rus6
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Posted - 2006.06.14 21:35:00 -
[107]
/signed
Been flying mim ships since the beginning, about time the phoon got some 'love' and a new description :)
The upcoming fixes will be a step in the right direction, lets hope it is a step and not the last 'love' the phoon will get.
The current phoon is really an expensive lesser domi tbh.
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Mila Prestoc
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Posted - 2006.06.14 21:42:00 -
[108]
Originally by: Sarmaul
Edited by: Sarmaul on 14/06/2006 21:29:59
Originally by: Mila Prestoc
Originally by: Testy Mctest
Originally by: Sarmaul
/op signed (you took your bloody time writing it!!!)
Took your time replying too. 4 pages down!
I'm sure he wanted the 100th post or something before it came up to his standard of topic to post in.
I didn't even realise it was the 100th post, and I was in London all day yesterday so I couldn't reply to the thread
Doh! Well i'm going to London tommorow so you can take over and push these changes ^_- I expect a Dev post by time I come back next week and nothing less!
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Sarmaul
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Posted - 2006.06.14 21:53:00 -
[109]
Originally by: Mila Prestoc
Doh! Well i'm going to London tommorow so you can take over and push these changes ^_- I expect a Dev post by time I come back next week and nothing less!
I would, but I'm currently on a personal crusade to make Khanid useful :)
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Jim McGregor
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Posted - 2006.06.15 10:24:00 -
[110]
Originally by: F4ze
I have had the pleasure of testing the new typhoon on SiSi and this is what I came up with:
I used two different setups, both were using:
4 dual 425mm AC II (barrage ammo, also carrying some hail and EM)
4 arbalest cruise (I only have cruise missiles at lvl3) (paradise cruise)
1 fleeting webifier
1 faint scrambler
1 heavy electrochemical injector
1 AB or 1 balmer tracking disruptor
In case of AB:
1 LAR II
4 hardeners (3 specific, 1 EAN II)
1 gyro II
1 BCU II
In case of tracking disruptor:
2 LAR acco
3 hardeners (1 exp, 2 EAN II)
1 gyro II
1 BCU II
Complemented with 5 Ogre II and 5 Hammerhead II.
And the results....I've killed geddons, ravens, megathrons, apocs, phoons and haven't lost a duel yet (more testing to come).
Imho, the typhoon is great with the new changes. It's a killing machine without resorting to nos-tactics or EW, even with sub-par missile skills. Sure it could do with a little bit extra grid so it might be able to fit the above setups with AB + dual acco reppers, or perhaps fit siege launchers or dual 650mm AC's. But overall, it's actually a good ship and a capable killer.
You have pretty good skills too.... tech 2 guns and drones. Are you sure you fought pilots that used similar, tech 2 setups?
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The Eve Wiki Project |
Aloysius Knight
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Posted - 2006.06.15 10:36:00 -
[111]
rather fun setup
4 650mm scout autos
4 arbi seige lanchers
XL-cl5 booster
amp
2 invura fields
3 bcu2
2 gryo2
cpu2
damog control
5 heavys
gogo gankaphoon =P
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Grimpak
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Posted - 2006.06.15 13:05:00 -
[112]
Edited by: Grimpak on 15/06/2006 13:07:10
I approve Testy's post.
oh and btw, a bit OT here but, to the ones that say that halo implants suck.
fit a set of them and go fly a typhoon. you get a nearly BC sized BS in sig radious terms
edit: wrong, you get a BS SMALLER than a brutix or even a ferox (yes, brutix is the biggest of all BC's btw, and i'm talking about below 280m sig rad. here)
-------
Originally by: Abdalion
Originally by: Jebidus Skari
What, in EVE, is a Tyrant?
Me. Especially when it comes to troll threads.
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Jim McGregor
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Posted - 2006.06.16 08:51:00 -
[113]
This thread keeps dying...
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The Eve Wiki Project |
Meridius
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Posted - 2006.06.16 09:10:00 -
[114]
Hmm dunno about this one. I played on sisi a bit with the phoon and it rocked pretty hard. I still have to do more testing but atm i do think it's fine.
It does a lot of DPS for a ship that's very hard to counter (ECM is the only real way to do that) and uses zero cap for it's offense. It's also quite speedy with a relatively small signature radius.
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_____
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Twilight Moon
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Posted - 2006.06.16 09:54:00 -
[115]
Hmm...how about this for a setup:
Highs: 4x Seige Launcher T2 (Rage Torps), 4x Heavy NOS
Mids: AB/MWD, Web, Scram, Heavy Cap Booster (800's)
Low: Tank of preference.
Drones: Mix of Preference.
Sure, you're natural cap regen will suck like a dead monkey, but you have the 4x Heavy NOS and 800's to keep you going.
Is that feasable? (Currently working on the skills for T2 Torps.
Signature Remove, not Eve related. -ReverendM ([email protected])
"But...it was Monty Python! You Dev's are souless!!" - Twilight Moon
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Aloysius Knight
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Posted - 2006.06.16 11:45:00 -
[116]
typhoon bady neds more grid
all ships below were wiht adv wep upgrades 4
typhoon
4 425mm auto 4 arbi cruse lanchers
2 accom large reps
13,200 grid used out of 15625
geddon
7 425mm autos 1 large smart bomb
2 accom res
13,050 grid used out of 20,625
dommie
6 425mm autos
2 accom large reps
10,900 grid used out of 11,250
scorp
4 425mm autos 2 seige
2 accomo reps
10,900 grid used out of 11,250
typhoon has 2,425 grid left
geddon has 7,575 grid left
dommie has 350 grid left
scop has 350 grid left
i know my post is like the op's but its to give you an idea of the diffences
as you can see the dommie and the scop have **** all grid left, as they use other means of fighting, ecm and drones
typhoon and geddon how ever mostly rely on there own weps, with a large drone bay to back them up
adding 1,000 grid to the phoon would bring it more inline with the geddon making it
geddon
7575
typhoon
3425
what also holds the phoon back is that it needs to use 2 diffenct damg mods, which are just 2 slots if you go for the amour tank
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Jim McGregor
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Posted - 2006.06.16 11:52:00 -
[117]
Yeah, alot of people seems to agree that it needs 1k extra grid. Hopefully Tux considers it.
---
The Eve Wiki Project |
ParMizaN
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Posted - 2006.06.16 11:53:00 -
[118]
The fitting is fine tbh, just try fitting a geddon.. really.
Domis suffer from grid problems to a certain extent as well if you want to try to armour tank, and if you want to shield tank it probably ahs some cpu problems. Geddon has problems when you want to fit a tank at all. Scorp? i forget but it seems to be the exception really.
Is it a bad hing? Nope. Fitting a fll rack of things should not be easy. Somebody calculated the theoretical DPS of a phoon with a full rack of guns/launchers and it came out as either first or second on DPS. I would rather it wasnt easy to fit this as well as a tank tbh 
BDCI Recruitment Officersig edited for lack of pink really
PINK -eris |
Aloysius Knight
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Posted - 2006.06.16 12:03:00 -
[119]
4 640mm 4 seige with 5 heay drones?
3 gryo 2 3 bcu 2?
that leaves you with just about no tank
weres nauti boy to graph stuff when you need him 
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Jim McGregor
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Posted - 2006.06.16 12:06:00 -
[120]
Originally by: Aloysius Knight
weres nauti boy to graph stuff when you need him
I havent seen him for a long time now... 
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The Eve Wiki Project |
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