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How much overpowered the vaga is?

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Karl Shade	Posted - 2006.07.13 23:49:00 - [31] Originally by: Waragha Originally by: Leshrac Shepherd Remove stabs from the game, then we'll see if there are any vagabond pilots left. -
Audrea	Posted - 2006.07.14 00:56:00 - [32] Originally by: Horza Otho Edited by: Horza Otho on 13/07/2006 22:33:44 This is a thread made by someone who has died to a Vagabond and wants to scream omgomgoverpowered. Also Audrea, please stop posting about that which you do not know. The Vagabond is far from perfect. Please stop yelling nerf when you die to a Vagabond, especially when the Vaga is one of the few things we have going for us, thankyou. I have never died to a vaga; but vagas ran away countless times, even from proper cate camps. Granted I dont fly it, but doesnt mean I dont know anything about this ship; tbh I think it could use agility nerf, that would make me happy enough ------------------ Tired of fleet combat lag? -Post HERE All posts are my personal opinions.
Balklanac	Posted - 2006.07.14 01:45:00 - [33] Can somebody send me 1b isk so I can finally fly one. --------- I would love to see a bounty pilot get some friend or an alt to pod them to collect the isk if that resulted in a two week delay before their 'personality' was uploaded to a new clone.
Dahin	Posted - 2006.07.14 02:42:00 - [34] Edited by: Dahin on 14/07/2006 02:42:56 I believe people are mistakenly falling to the misconception that the vaga is overpowered because they see vaga's splattering stuff all over the place. It is true, I bet vagabonds are THE most lethal weapon used in small and solo engagements. But this is less because of their "unbalanced" attributes as much as their engageability. You see, the vagabond can easily leg it from 95% of the engagements it's going to face. This is what makes the vagabonds so lethal, not their dps or tank. They will can attack most hostile forces solo or in packs. They will pick off any weak targets or any pilots making severe mistakes (like falling for the "follow me" bait) and when things get grim they will just bail. Every capable vagabond pilot knows he can do crazy things that no other ship would ever dream of doing, and can almost always escape. This is what gives him the courage to engage and ultimately get way with more kills, just because he tried. A deimos would never dare such a thing and would rather commit in more traditional engagements. But, you will never claim "omgwtfbbq" status if you have never engaged in overwhelming odds and have won. Vagabonds do that every day and don't break a sweat. Cartiff's/Lunas's golden rule (a.k.a. "wtf, let's just jump that blob"): balls = engagements = kills. It is not that any of the statistics of the vaga at fault here, it's just that eve combat has become very rigid because of the lack of non-consentual combat. People blob, gang, have eyes everywhere and they are guaranteed survival unless they make a huge mistake or they decide to commit to a "fair" engagement. They know that if something minor shows up they can kill it. Vagabonds break this rigid PvP approach and people are certainly annoyed by this. It's like a grandpa in never-neverland. Ofc, we have to mention the stabs too over here. Let's not forget standard setups include two, "just in case". If other ships have to sacrifice something for a stab, the ac/extender vaga simply has 2 lowslots and doesn't know what to do with them. And if stabs are annoying and need blobbing/bubbles to interrcept, think of the vaga. You can't tackle it with a frigate because it will laugh at you, you can't keep up with it with any other ship to keep a -1 on it, you can't catch it in a bubble because it will shoot out of it in a sec. Ofc one can mention special formations that can hold and kill a vaga but that doesn't really count. The combat field is always random and if I knew exactly what's the layour of every enemy I meet I'd always win. It's the current PvP system that's turning an otherwise "ok" ship into something extremely special and a "solo pwnmobile" compared to other ships. Nerf the current PvP system, not the vaga.
Still Hart	Posted - 2006.07.14 03:29:00 - [35] Originally by: Audrea I have never died to a vaga; but vagas ran away countless times, even from proper cate camps. Granted I dont fly it, but doesnt mean I dont know anything about this ship; tbh I think it could use agility nerf, that would make me happy enough A proper gate camp? Interdictor bubble on the gate, multiple webbers with scram. How is a vaga getting away from that? _____________________
Xendie	Posted - 2006.07.14 04:09:00 - [36] Originally by: Still Hart Originally by: Audrea I have never died to a vaga; but vagas ran away countless times, even from proper cate camps. Granted I dont fly it, but doesnt mean I dont know anything about this ship; tbh I think it could use agility nerf, that would make me happy enough A proper gate camp? Interdictor bubble on the gate, multiple webbers with scram. How is a vaga getting away from that? he slaps his mwd and before anyone get lock he is 40k away. when anything capable of killing him get a lock he is 90k away. thats what happens with a vaga running through any gatecamp if he got snakes also. Originally by: F'nog This would be great, because lag is not at all a problem currently.
Audrea	Posted - 2006.07.14 04:22:00 - [37] Originally by: Xendie Originally by: Still Hart Originally by: Audrea I have never died to a vaga; but vagas ran away countless times, even from proper cate camps. Granted I dont fly it, but doesnt mean I dont know anything about this ship; tbh I think it could use agility nerf, that would make me happy enough A proper gate camp? Interdictor bubble on the gate, multiple webbers with scram. How is a vaga getting away from that? he slaps his mwd and before anyone get lock he is 40k away. when anything capable of killing him get a lock he is 90k away. thats what happens with a vaga running through any gatecamp if he got snakes also. Exactly. Also dont forget that the ceptors are spread around the gate, and the chance for the vaga spawning less tahn 10km from the ceptors is near impossible, so by the time ceptors get in webbing range - the vaga already left teh dictor bubble, and soon enough warps away. ------------------ Tired of fleet combat lag? -Post HERE All posts are my personal opinions.
Paper Airplane	Posted - 2006.07.14 04:32:00 - [38] Edited by: Paper Airplane on 14/07/2006 04:49:32 Originally by: Leshrac Shepherd Remove stabs from the game, then we'll see if there are any vagabond pilots left. I think this would help vagabond pilots more than hurt them. If they get in danger they are so much faster they can always just fly away to 20km and warp out. However if their opponent gets in trouble they will never be able to get out of scramble range...stabs are the only thing that can save them. Stabs do have their place, but I think changing them to use a high slot or some other penalty is needed.
Hllaxiu	Posted - 2006.07.14 04:37:00 - [39] Originally by: Still Hart Originally by: Audrea I have never died to a vaga; but vagas ran away countless times, even from proper cate camps. Granted I dont fly it, but doesnt mean I dont know anything about this ship; tbh I think it could use agility nerf, that would make me happy enough A proper gate camp? Interdictor bubble on the gate, multiple webbers with scram. How is a vaga getting away from that? Count to 30 (40 to be safe) and dive for the gate. --- Our greatest glory is not in never failing, but in rising up every time we fail. - Emerson
Jim McGregor	Posted - 2006.07.14 06:42:00 - [40] Originally by: Hllaxiu Originally by: Still Hart Originally by: Audrea I have never died to a vaga; but vagas ran away countless times, even from proper cate camps. Granted I dont fly it, but doesnt mean I dont know anything about this ship; tbh I think it could use agility nerf, that would make me happy enough A proper gate camp? Interdictor bubble on the gate, multiple webbers with scram. How is a vaga getting away from that? Count to 30 (40 to be safe) and dive for the gate. What do you mean? --- Eve Wiki \| Eve Tribune \| Eve Pirate

Jim McGregor	Posted - 2006.07.14 06:48:00 - [41] Originally by: Dahin Every capable vagabond pilot knows he can do crazy things that no other ship would ever dream of doing, and can almost always escape. This is what gives him the courage to engage and ultimately get way with more kills, just because he tried. A deimos would never dare such a thing and would rather commit in more traditional engagements. But, you will never claim "omgwtfbbq" status if you have never engaged in overwhelming odds and have won. Vagabonds do that every day and don't break a sweat. Very well written. And this is also why its so much fun to fly. You can try to engage alot of targets and get out, which means you get alot of action and excitement from the ship. --- Eve Wiki \| Eve Tribune \| Eve Pirate
Keta Min	Posted - 2006.07.14 08:17:00 - [42] quality whinage.
Great Artista	Posted - 2006.07.14 08:23:00 - [43] Its -------------------------- that much overpowdered, like me, and sometimes its even overpowered. ------------- ½Artista - One name. One legend.+ -Sloganizer.net
dabster	Posted - 2006.07.14 11:23:00 - [44] Originally by: Jim McGregor Originally by: Hllaxiu Originally by: Still Hart Originally by: Audrea I have never died to a vaga; but vagas ran away countless times, even from proper cate camps. Granted I dont fly it, but doesnt mean I dont know anything about this ship; tbh I think it could use agility nerf, that would make me happy enough A proper gate camp? Interdictor bubble on the gate, multiple webbers with scram. How is a vaga getting away from that? Count to 30 (40 to be safe) and dive for the gate. What do you mean? *jump back to where you came from ___________________________ Brutors Rule! My Eve-vids; Click.
Noluck Ned Gallente	Posted - 2006.07.14 11:40:00 - [45] Originally by: Keta Min quality whinage. Keta's was the first Vagabond I ever met, I lasted.....hmm 5 seconds in my new thorax. Nowadays I respect a Vaga very much, but no longer fear it like the plague. They pop the same as all other hacs when they are suddenly hit by some heavy NOS/Nuets.
HolographicEntrypoint Caldari	Posted - 2006.07.14 11:40:00 - [46] Originally by: Audrea Originally by: Shamis Orzoz The vaga is a solo pwnmobile: full set of low grade snakes: 400 mil domination 10mn mwd: 80 mil domination warp disruptor: 120 mil vagbond: 220 mil t2 220's, gyro's, extenders: 10 mil nice nos: 8 mil. Maxed nav skills So for a mere 838 mil + serveral months of training you can get a solo pwnmobile. I find that outrageous. Exactly, and by that logic, Motherships and titans also should be solopwnmobniles, and be able to kill all rats in system once every hour with one press of a button, because they cost more?? Well, should vaga be worse than an inti cause it costs more? Invest more = expect more. --- ^ Making Custom Sigs for ISK My custom EvE Signature Gallery
Jamius	Posted - 2006.07.14 12:30:00 - [47] Na - make more ships like the vaga instead - I've never flown one but it sounds like they are a h3ll of a lot of fun to fly and since this is a game I would imagine getting fun from it is a large part of that. Also it would be nice to fly a ship that you can bail out in easier and not have any wrong decision mean certain death. I know - I fly no stabbed BC's mostly in solo PvP and any time I make a single mistake in evaluating a situation it's generally goodbye which isn't fun. Nothing better than just having a good scrap with someone and both of you coming out alive but talking about how it was such a great fight. Too many people just want to kill kill kill in this game - try having some fun. Jamius thinks training up for a vaga seems like a good idea
Kaeten Hybrid Syndicate	Posted - 2006.07.14 12:39:00 - [48] vagabond needs to be balanced. why? Because of it's speed plus the fact it can fit stabs+dmg mods without any fitting mods... High-Sec Piracy Recruitment
Kaeten Hybrid Syndicate	Posted - 2006.07.14 12:40:00 - [49] Originally by: Logan Fyreite The Ishtar can ECM/Drone/NOS anything! It would take a fleet of inties to kill it! that's not fair. I'm sorry but the vaga pilot I met shot at my drones so I didn't have any left. Care ot comment? High-Sec Piracy Recruitment
dabster Minmatar	Posted - 2006.07.14 15:14:00 - [50] Originally by: Griever Takkow Im, sorry, but i have to know this. A Vagabond with no snakeset will have a base speed of about 370 m/s assuming u have navigation 5. A Cepter with no snakeset will have a base speed of AT LEAST 450, more likely it would be over 500 ( taranis for example, base speed 420, nav 5 gives 525, and taranis aint even the fastest cepter) So just how exactly is a non faction non horrifically expensive implant set Vag faster than a cepter? It isnt. A Vaga without nanos or implants barely breaks 3000m/s. Thats one reason all these kind of Vaga-is-overpowered threads lately are so god damn stupid, cause a lot of the whiners are so awfully clueless. ___________________________ Brutors Rule! My Eve-vids; Click.

dabster Minmatar	Posted - 2006.07.14 15:15:00 - [51] Originally by: Kaeten Originally by: Logan Fyreite The Ishtar can ECM/Drone/NOS anything! It would take a fleet of inties to kill it! that's not fair. I'm sorry but the vaga pilot I met shot at my drones so I didn't have any left. Care ot comment? Jam him and gtfo? ___________________________ Brutors Rule! My Eve-vids; Click.
Prestis	Posted - 2006.07.14 15:28:00 - [52] Originally by: Kaeten Originally by: Logan Fyreite The Ishtar can ECM/Drone/NOS anything! It would take a fleet of inties to kill it! that's not fair. I'm sorry but the vaga pilot I met shot at my drones so I didn't have any left. Care ot comment? Yes, you should of had about 4 more sets ready to go. Ishtars are by far the most overpowered HAC one-on-one. A Battleship sized drone-bay vs Cruiser guns is no fight.
Spydrr	Posted - 2006.07.14 19:55:00 - [53] How about you nub cakes stop saying the Vagabond is overpowered when you have never flown one. Just because you get "pwned" by one doesn't mean you can open that damn hole under your nose and say **** about it. Fly one. Fly one with WCS and fly one without them. Go try it, I dare you to and come back and say your still right punks.
Spaced Skunk Oriundus Cineris	Posted - 2006.07.15 10:41:00 - [54] Firstly I'll add that the Vagabond only comes a problem when Snake implants or faction gear is used. Currently I can only get about 3.2KMs flat out of mine. And unlike an inty, I cannot hold my MWD on sustained for a couple of minutes. I definatly dont have the agility of an inty. And if your annoyed because your amarr ship just got owned by a vagabond, tough, CCP made Minmatar hate Amarr, thats roleplay. You have other issues with the vagabond..such as tracking. Cant track doing 3.2KM a sec on orbit. Whereas intys will probably hit, Crow for example has no tracking. Fly the Vagabond, use the t2 setup, no implants, then says its overpowered. It gets owned by missile boats, it has a low cap capacity, nos will disable the MWD, jam it, drone it.
Caletha	Posted - 2006.07.15 11:53:00 - [55] I just barely reach 2759m/s with my current skills (1.2m in Navigation and Serpentis MWD), no nano's fitted though... A few days ago I almost got completely trashed by a Megathron (wasnt paying attention and he drained my cap and MWD'd to me + double web'd me). It took me a full minute to warp out, even with stabs. I definitly screwed up in that fight, more ways then one and I even panic'd a little. When I saw my shields go down at the speed at which they did. I'm still amazed I made it out. So to be a complete 'solopwnthingie' I need to invest another 350m for a low-grade snake set (or even 3B for a normal one), oh god forbit I kill stuff then. Or get out of stuff with my +800m investment. You can still get Vaga's, sure there are better 'skilled' players out there which are hard (and perhaps even impossible as they know what to engage and what to let go). But you should be able to beat less experienced (and 'skilled') players like myself and probably 90% of the Vaga pilots out there if you use your brains (and not a T1 cruiser or a T1/T2 frigate). And setup your ship to fight interceptors (if your setup works on them, it'll probably work on a vaga).
Jim McGregor Caldari	Posted - 2006.07.15 12:59:00 - [56] Originally by: Kaeten Originally by: Logan Fyreite The Ishtar can ECM/Drone/NOS anything! It would take a fleet of inties to kill it! that's not fair. I'm sorry but the vaga pilot I met shot at my drones so I didn't have any left. Care ot comment? Good job? --- Eve Wiki \| Eve Tribune \| Eve Pirate
Master OlavPancrazio	Posted - 2006.07.18 20:15:00 - [57] Get a few crows with named webbers and the vaga is tackled.
Cohkka	Posted - 2006.07.18 21:25:00 - [58] Originally by: Kaeten Originally by: Logan Fyreite The Ishtar can ECM/Drone/NOS anything! It would take a fleet of inties to kill it! that's not fair. I'm sorry but the vaga pilot I met shot at my drones so I didn't have any left. Care ot comment? Oh, oh look here! I fly an Ishtar so no one can beat me. If someone beats me that ship is overpowered! To teh nerfmobile! Don't speak english, just F5, F5, F5...
Jim McGregor Caldari	Posted - 2006.07.18 21:30:00 - [59] Thanks for bumping this useless thread... --- Eve Wiki \| Eve Tribune \| Eve Pirate
El Alamein Chosen Path Center for Disease Creation	Posted - 2006.07.21 02:38:00 - [60] nerf the 10,277 ms vagabond and i would be happy. -----------------------------------



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