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luzhisheng	Posted - 2006.08.09 07:05:00 - [1] if one pilot have ss and he fit a common cloak device,then,no one can find him , never can even god. i think cloak should be a special equip,just be used by spicial ship,but it can be use by anyship with Prototype Cloaking Device I. eve pvp like a hunter,but hunter have no any effective tool. probe so slow and so limited. and when one ppl dont want fight, he just need ss+cloak device and then he get absoluteness safe in space. this is a balance of ccp want? i very very very wish ccp make a modification in this way. PVP just happen in gate is inconsequence. we want a fight but not camp gate in 80% eve pvp time. this like a WW I.everyone stay in trench. and wait, wait ,wait ,wait, game machine let us do this everyday.
Alliaanna Dalaii Gallente Does Not Compute	Posted - 2006.08.09 07:13:00 - [2] This is perfectly balanced. By fitting that cloak he has just #completely gimped his locking time. #Wasted a highslot. #sitting in a safespot bored as hell. Im afraid I believe strongly if someone is cloaked and SS'd they SHOULD be invincible unless the extremely unlikely event that your sat in someone elses safespot and they land on you (Its happened !! Ive made a ss in space and landed next to someone ) Deep 0.0, I'm not a member of any alliance... Its not my space. I do however like to go for the odd ciggarete, speak to my g/f etc. I think its fairly reasonable to give me a means of safely abandoning my ship in space... dont you ? Or would you rather I just log every time I wish to leave the room.... Alliaanna DNC Treasure Hunt !!
Pabs Sco Caldari Ecosse	Posted - 2006.08.09 07:15:00 - [3] safespotting and cloaking is indeed very lame. And everyone needs a counter measure against it, but then if we did, whats the point in having a cloak? Maybe cloaks should only be used on "special" ships and take up 99%CPU, or have "Special" probes to detect cloaked ships but still need to pin point where the SS is using the usual method. As for gate camping, this also is a lame tactic, its dull boring and quite frankly a horrible way to pvp,as well as 200km snipping, its not all that fun (sit at gate with 10+ people, see hostile in overview, lock, boom! how was that fun??) ------ Eve-O Recruitment thread
Tribunal Darkblade Technologies Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2006.08.09 07:20:00 - [4] Make cloaks burn a fuel source and this problem would vanish real fast. "We can't all be heroes, because somebody has to sit on the curb and applaud when they go by." - Will Rogers
Pabs Sco Caldari Ecosse	Posted - 2006.08.09 07:32:00 - [5] Originally by: Tribunal Make cloaks burn a fuel source and this problem would vanish real fast. OOOoooo nice idea!!! ------ Eve-O Recruitment thread
Alliaanna Dalaii Gallente Does Not Compute	Posted - 2006.08.09 07:37:00 - [6] Originally by: Tribunal Make cloaks burn a fuel source and this problem would vanish real fast. Yeah because a covert ops pilot is going to love that..... "Sorry boys, no fuel... Op is over " As to decloaking covert ops ships etc... JUST NO! Have you seen the price of Covert Ops II's Alliaanna DNC Treasure Hunt !!
mirel yirrin Gallente Phantom Squad	Posted - 2006.08.09 07:41:00 - [7] Originally by: Pabs Sco Originally by: Tribunal Make cloaks burn a fuel source and this problem would vanish real fast. OOOoooo nice idea!!! Its a bloody crap idea. --------------------------------- IMAGINE THE GREATEST SIG OF ALL TIME HERE.
Infinity Ziona Space Elves of Ragnoroth	Posted - 2006.08.09 07:48:00 - [8] Edited by: Infinity Ziona on 09/08/2006 07:50:14 Whats the harm. Unless its a covert ops its going to be able to warp into your belt and then sit there... 1.... 2..... 3.... 4.... 5..... 6..... 7.... 8..... 9..... 10.... .. if you havent jammed it to hell or run away you deserve to die. I think this is a case of people wanting to sit safely and securely in 0.0, probably alone, mining or ratting, without having the fear of someone hostile or neutral in local. 'The alliance should not be a solo contentmobile' - Albert Einstein
Darg Even	Posted - 2006.08.09 07:54:00 - [9] What the point in having a cloak if you can't hide? Might as well remove all ships from this game. That way we would avoid all problems :) Using a cloak on a non covert op ship seriously hampers the ship in question. If I choose to do that then it's my decision. Go hunt for someone else. If your target didn't have a cloak he would have logged off so this doesn't change anything at all for the hunter.
Jenny Spitfire Caldari LoneStar Industries Veritas Immortalis	Posted - 2006.08.09 07:56:00 - [10] Sell prototype cloaks at 200M, improved prototype cloaks at 400M, covert ops cloak at 600M. Problem solved. Everyone fits cloaks these days. Overpowered module == Overpowered price. ---------------- Cruelty is God's way of showing kindness.
Malachon Draco eXceed Inc. Ascendant Frontier	Posted - 2006.08.09 07:57:00 - [11] Originally by: mirel yirrin Originally by: Pabs Sco Originally by: Tribunal Make cloaks burn a fuel source and this problem would vanish real fast. OOOoooo nice idea!!! Its a bloody crap idea. I think its a brilliant idea. It also makes it possible to make a difference between covert ops ships and other ships with a cloak. Covert ops ships could have a reduction in fuel costs. And ideally, different size ships = different fuel costs. One of the most annoying features in this game is how a single ship with a covop cloak can put an entire system out of business for ratting or mining. And the covops guy doesn't even have to be at the keyboard. All you do is get a recon, jump into a system, safespot, cloak and go AFK. Who dares to go mining with a hostile recon in system that is completely invulnerable until he attacks? Fuel should run out in about 30 mins or so for a non-covop ship with an active cloak and maybe 90-120 mins for a covop with a cloak active.
Avon Caldari Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers	Posted - 2006.08.09 08:01:00 - [12] The new scanning system slated for Kali allows you to scan cloaked ships, so this is all a bit of a non-issue. The Battleships is not and should not be a solo pwnmobile - Oveur
Moghydin Beyond Divinity Inc	Posted - 2006.08.09 08:01:00 - [13] The problem is when there's an alt, sitting cloacked in system for days, doing nothing. You never know if the pilot is actually afk or not, if he continues to harmlessly sit there, or is he actually sitting 15km from your NPC'ing bs and 5 enemy tacklers are waiting to warp in on the other side of the gate. The problem is not cloaked ships, but cloak ship abuse by alts, as no one would use his main to sit at 1 spot doing nothing for a week. Alts = abuse.
Sandra Tseng THE MISPHIT'S	Posted - 2006.08.09 08:05:00 - [14] to the OP. What is stopping a guy from warping in between three or four Safe Spots? How are you going to beat that? Remove Safe Spotting? Get real. And if one hostile in local stops an entire system full off people from ratting and mining - maybe you should move back to a high-sec system... Killed my sig AGAIN! :p http://www.ninc.org/krubarax/images/2d/verydisco.jpg
Malachon Draco eXceed Inc. Ascendant Frontier	Posted - 2006.08.09 08:11:00 - [15] Originally by: Sandra Tseng to the OP. What is stopping a guy from warping in between three or four Safe Spots? How are you going to beat that? Remove Safe Spotting? Get real. And if one hostile in local stops an entire system full off people from ratting and mining - maybe you should move back to a high-sec system... Jumping between 4 safespots? No problem, at least he has to be there at the keyboard. In a covops he can be AFK all day long, but you can never be sure. And you try to protect a covetor or an iteron during a mining operation against a recon ship, not gonna happen.
Sandra Tseng THE MISPHIT'S	Posted - 2006.08.09 08:18:00 - [16] well what if he is doing a mission somewhear out far on the map where you can not go - and he decides to stay in that area once he finnishes off the NPCs...? Killed my sig AGAIN! :p http://www.ninc.org/krubarax/images/2d/verydisco.jpg
Malachon Draco eXceed Inc. Ascendant Frontier	Posted - 2006.08.09 08:22:00 - [17] Originally by: Sandra Tseng well what if he is doing a mission somewhear out far on the map where you can not go - and he decides to stay in that area once he finnishes off the NPCs...? There are no missions where I live . And if I'm not mistaken, nobody is immune to Observator probes.
Infinity Ziona Space Elves of Ragnoroth	Posted - 2006.08.09 08:29:00 - [18] Originally by: Avon The new scanning system slated for Kali allows you to scan cloaked ships, so this is all a bit of a non-issue. Yay another change to make EvE safer. 'The alliance should not be a solo contentmobile' - Albert Einstein
luzhisheng	Posted - 2006.08.09 08:30:00 - [19] Originally by: Sandra Tseng well what if he is doing a mission somewhear out far on the map where you can not go - and he decides to stay in that area once he finnishes off the NPCs...? you means you do mission in 0.0? i dont think you can get mission in 0.0 area. and if he decides to stay in that area once he finnishes off the NPCs，i just said"oh, man ,i think you are no do this action in every mission,never no common ppl have so enough time waste than you :P"
luzhisheng	Posted - 2006.08.09 08:32:00 - [20] Originally by: Avon The new scanning system slated for Kali allows you to scan cloaked ships, so this is all a bit of a non-issue. thank your new :) nice !!
Guntaro	Posted - 2006.08.09 08:39:00 - [21] Originally by: Jenny Spitfire Sell prototype cloaks at 200M, improved prototype cloaks at 400M, covert ops cloak at 600M. Problem solved. Everyone fits cloaks these days. Overpowered module == Overpowered price. What problem? There is no problem except the OP whining about how he is a bad hunter.
Viktor VonCarstein	Posted - 2006.08.09 08:41:00 - [22] Whats the point in spending the isk and suffering the penalties of a cloak if it doesn't hide you. Losing a high slot, long lock times etc plus hammering cpu. Using cloaks on ships that aren't designed for it get gimped so I woulnd't worry about them anyways. Those that are designed for it leave them be they are supposed to hide, hecne the terms covert, recon and stealth! TBH local already cripples covert ops pilots and being able to scan them too in Kali. Not exactly covert anymore. Its not like they are gonna uncloak and engage you with a helios.
Jenny Spitfire Caldari LoneStar Industries Veritas Immortalis	Posted - 2006.08.09 08:41:00 - [23] Originally by: Guntaro Originally by: Jenny Spitfire Sell prototype cloaks at 200M, improved prototype cloaks at 400M, covert ops cloak at 600M. Problem solved. Everyone fits cloaks these days. Overpowered module == Overpowered price. What problem? There is no problem except the OP whining about how he is a bad hunter. Well if cloak is balanced then ECM is also balanced. ---------------- Cruelty is God's way of showing kindness.
TerrorWOLF J.H.E.N.R Pure.	Posted - 2006.08.09 08:57:00 - [24] Problem with cloak and stealth in EVE is that we have cloak but there is absolutly no stealth!! And there will be no stealth as long as local shows who is in system. May Your Death Be Slow And Painful
Sirkill	Posted - 2006.08.09 09:16:00 - [25] Originally by: Avon The new scanning system slated for Kali allows you to scan cloaked ships, so this is all a bit of a non-issue. More info please
James Snowscoran Caldari Coreli Corporation	Posted - 2006.08.09 09:28:00 - [26] Originally by: Infinity Ziona Originally by: Avon The new scanning system slated for Kali allows you to scan cloaked ships, so this is all a bit of a non-issue. Yay another change to make EvE safer. Safer? The safe party in situations like this is the one sitting cloaked at a ss. If anything it's about making eve less safe. -----
Mikal Drey Brutor tribe	Posted - 2006.08.09 09:29:00 - [27] hey hey isnt the whole point of a cloak is so you cant get found. problem with cloaks has always been they are either overpowered or totally underpowered. and for every thread that doesnt like cloaked people theres more that want them even more powerfull and usefull.
Brisi Sniggerdly	Posted - 2006.08.09 09:29:00 - [28] You should've been there when there weren't any scan probes, and the only way to find an ss'd ship, was to narrow it down via scanning and warp/fly closer and closer 'till you you found it. I think that a cloaked ship should be impossible to scan for, but that might just be me. I am Brisi, I am as One. Resistance is fertile.
Callistus Coreli Corporation	Posted - 2006.08.09 09:32:00 - [29] Originally by: Sirkill Originally by: Avon The new scanning system slated for Kali allows you to scan cloaked ships, so this is all a bit of a non-issue. More info please Dev Blog -------------- [Coreli Corporation Mainfrane]
Ilmonstre Minmatar Black Nova Corp	Posted - 2006.08.09 09:57:00 - [30] it doestn say you can find ships that have a cloak active at that moment
Avon Caldari Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers	Posted - 2006.08.09 10:19:00 - [31] Originally by: Ilmonstre it doestn say you can find ships that have a cloak active at that moment Originally by: TomB Originally by: R3dSh1ft I would also like to know about the possibility of scanning for a cloaked ship Cloaked ships will be scanable, but they won't get uncloaked if they are found on the scanner. The Battleships is not and should not be a solo pwnmobile - Oveur
Pabs Sco Caldari Ecosse	Posted - 2006.08.09 11:30:00 - [32] Cloaks are overpowered, also youshow up in local which is really pointless of the cloak. The problem with the cloak, that has been stated, is the AFK'ers. Having the cloak use up fuel is a great idea, with special bonuses to cloak ships, there for if your sitting in a SS, you dont need to run your cloak till you see a probe on scanner. I dont see how this would be bad. Make cloaks use fuel, bonuses to proper covert ships to use 50% less fuel. Make cloaks hide you from local. ------ Eve-O Recruitment thread
Ripline	Posted - 2006.08.09 11:49:00 - [33] The issue is probably cloaked campers in station systems and the like, rather than cov ops maneuvering around in normal space. The cloak'n'camp would probably be easiest solved by a POS system scanner module or some such. Only deployable in 0.0, and if a ship doesn't change grid in, say, 60 seconds it'll appear on the overview like a cyno.
Deja Thoris Contraband Inc. Mercenary Coalition	Posted - 2006.08.09 11:53:00 - [34] Originally by: Sandra Tseng to the OP. What is stopping a guy from warping in between three or four Safe Spots? How are you going to beat that? Remove Safe Spotting? Get real. One is an active measure - the other is a passive one that can be done afk. Spot the difference?
Nira Li Destructive Influence Band of Brothers	Posted - 2006.08.09 11:56:00 - [35] wtf is the use of a cloak if you can't stay invisible? You Will Cry My Name Funny Guys
Rofl Waffles	Posted - 2006.08.09 12:02:00 - [36] Maybe to stop or at least slow down the afk'ers should be that once every hour(half hour?) starting when the module is activated, it will turn off, as in stop flashing green. But after it turns off you will remain cloaked for 1-2 minutes in which you can reactivate the cloak. That way people that leave their PC on while asleep or at work lose their cloak but people at their PC activly scouting using cloak arent penalized.
Jessica McDaniel	Posted - 2006.08.09 13:44:00 - [37] Originally by: Malachon Draco Originally by: mirel yirrin Originally by: Pabs Sco Originally by: Tribunal Make cloaks burn a fuel source and this problem would vanish real fast. OOOoooo nice idea!!! Its a bloody crap idea. /signed i completely agree, that is an awsome idea I think its a brilliant idea. It also makes it possible to make a difference between covert ops ships and other ships with a cloak. Covert ops ships could have a reduction in fuel costs. And ideally, different size ships = different fuel costs. One of the most annoying features in this game is how a single ship with a covop cloak can put an entire system out of business for ratting or mining. And the covops guy doesn't even have to be at the keyboard. All you do is get a recon, jump into a system, safespot, cloak and go AFK. Who dares to go mining with a hostile recon in system that is completely invulnerable until he attacks? Fuel should run out in about 30 mins or so for a non-covop ship with an active cloak and maybe 90-120 mins for a covop with a cloak active.
Buxaroo Quantum Industries Prime Orbital Systems	Posted - 2006.08.09 13:48:00 - [38] I see no problem with a cloaked ship in a SS. One, the pilot is already taking a hit in the high slot AND locktime department. I don't see an issue with this. Granted, it's a pain in the butt when you are looking for them but I think it's a legitimate tactic. A good use of a cloaked SS'd ship is the unnerving tactic you can use against hostiles. Staying logged on while cloaked in a SS while you go to work or school is a great tactic to rain on the enemies parade. They never know when you are going to show up and start hitting them. Especially if you have erratic work or school hours
Malicious Wraith The Dark Side of the Moon	Posted - 2006.08.09 14:02:00 - [39] Lol, one time a Nyx was sitting 200km off a gate, with a deimos 15k away from him trying to bait me to go after the deimos, I warped out, back 30km away from the deimos, ontop of the nyx, he uncloaked and I warped out ^.^! Was fun, lol. ----------------------------------------
Darktec Caldari QUANT Corp.	Posted - 2006.08.09 14:20:00 - [40] Originally by: Pabs Sco Cloaks are overpowered, also youshow up in local which is really pointless of the cloak. The problem with the cloak, that has been stated, is the AFK'ers. Having the cloak use up fuel is a great idea, with special bonuses to cloak ships, there for if your sitting in a SS, you dont need to run your cloak till you see a probe on scanner. I dont see how this would be bad. Make cloaks use fuel, bonuses to proper covert ships to use 50% less fuel. Make cloaks hide you from local. ' This translates to, I wanted to kill someone, but hes used a cloak and got away. Want me to call the WAHHHHbulance?
Lord Spidey Hmmzor. Muffins of Mayhem	Posted - 2006.08.09 14:22:00 - [41] People who sit cloaked all day just to **** people off are lame
Buxaroo Quantum Industries Prime Orbital Systems	Posted - 2006.08.09 14:49:00 - [42] Edited by: Buxaroo on 09/08/2006 14:50:31 Originally by: Lord Spidey People who sit cloaked all day just to **** people off are lame Well, when you are talking about pirates and they are ganking your friends whenever they pass thru the system, you are doing the community a favor. After all, pirates use even lamer tactics like jetting cargo cans at a gate to decloak........ Not to mention its psychological warfare.
BoinKlasik Eye of God Axiom Empire	Posted - 2006.08.09 15:01:00 - [43] Originally by: Nira Li wtf is the use of a cloak if you can't stay invisible? invisble != invicible though, which is what people are complaining about... doh, I broke my edited sig :/ cries this signature was lacking pink, I'll provide it for you. There. Looks better doesn't it? -Eris Fixed it for you. Oh, btw, yarr! ~kieron Didn't I tell you? The damsel moved in with me, we're having a great time. - Wrangler The damsel may not be distressed any more, but how many times does the informant have to be silenced before he gets the message? - Cortes
Ozzie Asrail Hybrid Syndicate	Posted - 2006.08.09 15:12:00 - [44] I have 2 big problems with cloaks. Alt scouts. Not even real covops just a 2nd account in a frigate with a prototype cloak sitting in a station system or a chokepoint system watching everything. Totally invulnerable and able to setup login traps or let hostiles know to logoff. Cloaked carriers. Man I hate these, combined with a alt scout iy makes the carrier pretty much immune to being killed without major 23/7 camping of the system. -----
Sara Lea	Posted - 2006.08.09 15:26:00 - [45] This will always be a 'hot topic' so to speak. I personally cant see the problem if an alliance or corporation was to work as a team when the lone cloaked pilot shows up. Yes a cloak is a powerfull asset but it works both for and against a covert pilot. Especially if using one on a Stealth bomber. Yes he can get easy kills but in all honesty he shouldnt be able to close a system down if people were prepared to work together. A bomber pilot is taking a big risk everytime he uncloaks..especially if there are other cloaked ships nearby when he does so. They are paper thin and cant take much damage at all. He will warp in and think he is going to be the one doing the suprising when POW! he sees several others uncloak and lock him...not good and most likely game over for him. By pure design using a covert ship means being stealthy and sneaky. This means taking your time....picking your targets and opportunitys. Rush in gung ho and you will eventually die. Take your time and you will slowly but surely pick away at both moral and assets. If the people who dont like it are willing to work together to counter this sort of gameplay then all the tools are there to do it. Everything needed is in game and its not rocket science. 0.0 space is not easy..it was never meant to be and hopefully never will be. Use the right tactics and as a group then you are laughing...whether its one co ops pilot or a gang of them. Yes you will suffer losses..its part of the overall game. But so will they. Before people start whining that its not possible to get together to counter it then I suggest you rethink why you are in the position you are in?...often more than not a pilot chooses to harrass a certain corp or alliance for a reason. Have you annoyed him in the past?...Or killed him a lot?....many more possibilitys here tbh. If he hasnt a reason then the chances are he will give in if he gets locked out of the battle. If he has a reason...then it may be harder to get rid of him...once again the tools are in game to do this. And hey..talkings good! (not smack of course but n e g o t i a t i o n. ) Adapt...if you want to live in 0.0 then be prepared to work for it. And there is more than one system to fly around in you know..... Yes Im an alt
Missy Mai'la	Posted - 2006.08.09 15:33:00 - [46] Originally by: Callistus Originally by: Sirkill Originally by: Avon The new scanning system slated for Kali allows you to scan cloaked ships, so this is all a bit of a non-issue. More info please Dev Blog Where in that blog does it say you'll be able to scan for cloaked ships? Tbh if they did make it so you could scan out cloaked ships, they may aswell remove cloaking, who the hells going to fit a cloak device if it does not allow you to hide?
Raid Caldari Tyrell Corp Curse Coalition	Posted - 2006.08.09 15:43:00 - [47] Originally by: Missy Mai'la Originally by: Callistus Originally by: Sirkill Originally by: Avon The new scanning system slated for Kali allows you to scan cloaked ships, so this is all a bit of a non-issue. More info please Dev Blog Where in that blog does it say you'll be able to scan for cloaked ships? Tbh if they did make it so you could scan out cloaked ships, they may aswell remove cloaking, who the hells going to fit a cloak device if it does not allow you to hide? You can still hide in plain sight.. They can scan you.. see that theres a cloaked ship somewhere out there.. but you could be at a safespot or right next to them. Whats the difference? TBH I dont care if they know im around or not because I can wait 1 hours or 1 week to make a move.. but im always watching im always there and thats the scary part.
Sumayyah Minmatar Dynamic Endeavors	Posted - 2006.08.09 15:49:00 - [48] Edited by: Sumayyah on 09/08/2006 15:54:10 Using fuel is a bad idea because you run out of fuel Coak deactivates than you are a sitting duck with no cap. You can't warp can't do anything. I think it would be exceptable for it to have a timer though 1 hour max than it deactivates and you have to reactivate. However this will probably just invite a marco :P I also think in Kali if the the scanning system can find cloaked ships I think it should take upwards of a hour and more to find them and uncloak them. This would help the alliances when they have an unfrendly in system uncloaked for hours, but will not give pvp the upper hand when if come to finding people that do not want to fight. I'm an ! I will always be an ! that is all I have to say
Pabs Sco Caldari Ecosse	Posted - 2006.08.09 15:50:00 - [49] Edited by: Pabs Sco on 09/08/2006 15:50:20 Originally by: Darktec Originally by: Pabs Sco Cloaks are overpowered, also youshow up in local which is really pointless of the cloak. The problem with the cloak, that has been stated, is the AFK'ers. Having the cloak use up fuel is a great idea, with special bonuses to cloak ships, there for if your sitting in a SS, you dont need to run your cloak till you see a probe on scanner. I dont see how this would be bad. Make cloaks use fuel, bonuses to proper covert ships to use 50% less fuel. Make cloaks hide you from local. ' This translates to, I wanted to kill someone, but hes used a cloak and got away. Want me to call the WAHHHHbulance? Well actually no, I am a cov-ops pilot but never used these tactics of sitting afk for hours, yes sitting there for about an hour is fun watching everyone warp to station, but I could just as well sit in a SS uncloaked, if someone was probing I could simply recloak to a new SS (or create a new one). In my time in 0.0 when an afk cloaker was about,MO's were canceled, but people went out ratting instead withthe hope to lock and shoot the person. I just think that the cloak is not used as intended, it is should hide you from local too. ------ Eve-O Recruitment thread
Marogian the Organ Grinder and Company Ascendant Frontier	Posted - 2006.08.09 16:06:00 - [50] What about making have a cycle and cap useage thing like most active modules, as well as having an 100% cap recharge penalty when activated. This way they turn off after running out of cap after a certain amount of time The cap useage could be proportional to ships mass or sig radius so that ships with huge caps (BSes etc) can't stay cloaked for several hours
Avon Caldari Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers	Posted - 2006.08.09 16:09:00 - [51] Why is this discussion continuing? The improved system scanning in Kali will make it possible to scan down (but not uncloak) cloaked ships. What more is needed? The Battleships is not and should not be a solo pwnmobile - Oveur
Ogdru Jahad Amarr Ultra Renegades Group	Posted - 2006.08.09 16:18:00 - [52] Edited by: Ogdru Jahad on 09/08/2006 16:22:39 Originally by: luzhisheng if one pilot have ss and he fit a common cloak device,then,no one can find him , never can even god. i think cloak should be a special equip,just be used by spicial ship,but it can be use by anyship with Prototype Cloaking Device I. eve pvp like a hunter,but hunter have no any effective tool. probe so slow and so limited. and when one ppl dont want fight, he just need ss+cloak device and then he get absoluteness safe in space. this is a balance of ccp want? i very very very wish ccp make a modification in this way. PVP just happen in gate is inconsequence. we want a fight but not camp gate in 80% eve pvp time. this like a WW I.everyone stay in trench. and wait, wait ,wait ,wait, game machine let us do this everyday. DOOD! this has saved my ahole time after time. if your stupid enuf to let your prey get away then dont pvp! I had a taranis try and lock down my absolution. he appeared 73km from me. once he started mwding at me i started locking. i got a proper lock at less than 20km. then local filled up with bob! i ripped that lil ranis a new hole as he warped off in str. then i ss'd and cloaked. MWDing ceptor + web and good guners skills = not good for ceptor pilot Great Quotes... INNOMINATE NIGHTMARE > Your mother is an Exotic Dancer and your Sister works in a Quafe Factory.....
Buxaroo Quantum Industries Prime Orbital Systems	Posted - 2006.08.09 16:18:00 - [53] Originally by: Sara Lea This will always be a 'hot topic' so to speak. I personally cant see the problem if an alliance or corporation was to work as a team when the lone cloaked pilot shows up. Yes a cloak is a powerfull asset but it works both for and against a covert pilot. Especially if using one on a Stealth bomber. Yes he can get easy kills but in all honesty he shouldnt be able to close a system down if people were prepared to work together. A bomber pilot is taking a big risk everytime he uncloaks..especially if there are other cloaked ships nearby when he does so. They are paper thin and cant take much damage at all. He will warp in and think he is going to be the one doing the suprising when POW! he sees several others uncloak and lock him...not good and most likely game over for him. By pure design using a covert ship means being stealthy and sneaky. This means taking your time....picking your targets and opportunitys. Rush in gung ho and you will eventually die. Take your time and you will slowly but surely pick away at both moral and assets. If the people who dont like it are willing to work together to counter this sort of gameplay then all the tools are there to do it. Everything needed is in game and its not rocket science. 0.0 space is not easy..it was never meant to be and hopefully never will be. Use the right tactics and as a group then you are laughing...whether its one co ops pilot or a gang of them. Yes you will suffer losses..its part of the overall game. But so will they. Before people start whining that its not possible to get together to counter it then I suggest you rethink why you are in the position you are in?...often more than not a pilot chooses to harrass a certain corp or alliance for a reason. Have you annoyed him in the past?...Or killed him a lot?....many more possibilitys here tbh. If he hasnt a reason then the chances are he will give in if he gets locked out of the battle. If he has a reason...then it may be harder to get rid of him...once again the tools are in game to do this. And hey..talkings good! (not smack of course but n e g o t i a t i o n. ) Adapt...if you want to live in 0.0 then be prepared to work for it. And there is more than one system to fly around in you know..... Yes Im an alt Very well put Mr. Alt. I can really attest to the paper thin attributes of stealth bombers (god knows I lost a couple in Delve lol). It would be different if you could decloak, fire your cruise missiles, then recloak. But you can't. If you cloak after firing your missiles then they won't do damage. And therein lies the problem with stealth bombers. It only takes a fast pilot in a taranis to knock you on your ass. Or a sniping ship. I say leave cloaks as they are. People always have issues with every module/tactic used in the game. Sense cloaked ships are already screwed in a lot of ways I say leave it be. If CCP brought out the nerf bat everytime someone whined about it, this game would just end up like SWG with every mental midget wanting to be a jedi and nothing else thus ruining the game for everyone.
Buxaroo Quantum Industries Prime Orbital Systems	Posted - 2006.08.09 16:31:00 - [54] Edited by: Buxaroo on 09/08/2006 16:31:44 Originally by: Avon Why is this discussion continuing? The improved system scanning in Kali will make it possible to scan down (but not uncloak) cloaked ships. What more is needed? In the dev blog I don't see anything about cloaked ships. Only this part: Quote: Addons New stuff will be added to make players that want to specialize init to become better, faster and more stylish atit: 1x new Launcher (Recon Probe Launcher; fast and deadly - made for ship scanning) ?x new Probes (special ones to find special things) 2-3x new Skills (increased efficiency, faster scanning (Astrometrics changed to give more groups to scan for) and perhaps faster deployment) To me, Recon Probe Launcher means that the scanner can send out probes covertly without them showing up on scanner. Or am I misreading this? And the only entry of recon ships is this: Quote: Lost & Found Just finding objects will be based on the probe type you are using. Its stats will 'battle' against the stats of the objects within its scan radius, if the probe wins it finds the object and gives you the estimated location of the findings. The factors used on the objects for this mini-battle are signature radius (big is bad) and scan strength (high is good), where frigates are commonly harder to find than battleships/ capital ships, while recon based ships are in general the hardest ships to find. I don't see anything about finding cloaked ships, not even decloaking them. Has the dev blog changed any? Is this updated info?
LUGAL MOP'N'GLO	Posted - 2006.08.09 16:35:00 - [55] Originally by: Alliaanna Dalaii I do however like to go for the odd ciggarete, speak to my g/f etc. I think its fairly reasonable to give me a means of safely abandoning my ship in space... dont you ? QFT, cigarrettes kill but I'm addicted to them what can I say. I totally agree, not everyone can be at their computer for every passing second. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Win a Cynabal for 10ml!!!
Ozzie Asrail Hybrid Syndicate	Posted - 2006.08.09 16:36:00 - [56] Originally by: Avon Originally by: Ilmonstre it doestn say you can find ships that have a cloak active at that moment Originally by: TomB Originally by: R3dSh1ft I would also like to know about the possibility of scanning for a cloaked ship Cloaked ships will be scanable, but they won't get uncloaked if they are found on the scanner. from this post -----
Double TaP The Establishment	Posted - 2006.08.09 17:01:00 - [57] Originally by: Avon Why is this discussion continuing? The improved system scanning in Kali will make it possible to scan down (but not uncloak) cloaked ships. What more is needed? Becuase you don't need to be able to scan down cloaked ships.
Avon Caldari Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers	Posted - 2006.08.09 17:20:00 - [58] Originally by: Double TaP Originally by: Avon Why is this discussion continuing? The improved system scanning in Kali will make it possible to scan down (but not uncloak) cloaked ships. What more is needed? Becuase you don't need to be able to scan down cloaked ships. Doesn't matter, it's going to happen. The Battleships is not and should not be a solo pwnmobile - Oveur
The Slayer Caldari Millennium E.R.A	Posted - 2006.08.09 17:22:00 - [59] Originally by: Double TaP Originally by: Avon Why is this discussion continuing? The improved system scanning in Kali will make it possible to scan down (but not uncloak) cloaked ships. What more is needed? Becuase you don't need to be able to scan down cloaked ships. Yes you do. Nobody in eve should ever, ever be invincible. Cloak + Safespot currently means invincibility, so its getting nerfed. Ive also been pointed to some rather nifty Cosmos items (I think) which work like a smartbomb but have large (18 - 22K I think) range and decloak ships. Look neat :) __________________________________ Your Dual 250mm Prototype I Gauss Gun perfectly strikes Estamel Tharchon, wrecking for 187.6 damage.
Missy Mai'la	Posted - 2006.08.09 17:37:00 - [60] Originally by: Avon Originally by: Double TaP Originally by: Avon Why is this discussion continuing? The improved system scanning in Kali will make it possible to scan down (but not uncloak) cloaked ships. What more is needed? Becuase you don't need to be able to scan down cloaked ships. Doesn't matter, it's going to happen. Except for absolutely nowhere has a dev said that they are changing cloaking so you can scan out cloaked ships.
Akkarin Pagan Minmatar Raddick Explorations Myriad Alliance	Posted - 2006.08.09 17:38:00 - [61] There are 2 issues here: 1. Op "Someone didn't get ganked when I wanted to kill them WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 2. Some people are "abusing" what cloaks can do To solve 1. Well dude, you don't always get what you want. If you want free kills, go back to WOW, and get yourself a lvl 60 character and gank noobs outside a starter town. 2. Well the fuel idea sucks balls tbh. How is a Cov ops pilot meant to keep tabs on the composition and location of an enemy fleet if he stands the risk off losing his ship when the fuels out? (60mill for a cloak, and the ship will stand up to a whole milisecond of fire if decloaked). As for Recon cruisers. They aren't some kind of solo pwn mobile (we have issues with a Lachezis pilot and an Astarte pilot where I "live" who always work in tandem) and we lose a few ships, but they have to kill 4 BS for it to be worth their while when we organize and gank them. Anyway. Cloaking is fine mostly. Don't change it Akkarin Linkage Do not press this button
The Slayer Caldari Millennium E.R.A	Posted - 2006.08.09 17:40:00 - [62] Originally by: Missy Mai'la Except for absolutely nowhere has a dev said that they are changing cloaking so you can scan out cloaked ships. READ. THE. THREAD. Originally by: TomB Originally by: R3dSh1ft I would also like to know about the possibility of scanning for a cloaked ship Cloaked ships will be scanable, but they won't get uncloaked if they are found on the scanner. Posted by TOMB. Are you perhaps waiting for confirmation from god before you believe it? __________________________________ Your Dual 250mm Prototype I Gauss Gun perfectly strikes Estamel Tharchon, wrecking for 187.6 damage.
Apertotes Nuevos Horizontes	Posted - 2006.08.09 17:46:00 - [63] Originally by: The Slayer Originally by: Double TaP Originally by: Avon Why is this discussion continuing? The improved system scanning in Kali will make it possible to scan down (but not uncloak) cloaked ships. What more is needed? Becuase you don't need to be able to scan down cloaked ships. Yes you do. Nobody in eve should ever, ever be invincible. Cloak + Safespot currently means invincibility, so its getting nerfed. Ive also been pointed to some rather nifty Cosmos items (I think) which work like a smartbomb but have large (18 - 22K I think) range and decloak ships. Look neat :) you can dock and be invincible. would you like forcing undocking also? or maybe in-station rockets... Apertotes, the Guybrush Threepwood of New Eve
The Slayer Caldari Millennium E.R.A	Posted - 2006.08.09 17:53:00 - [64] Sorry, yes docking should be the only time you are safe. I always hear people saying "You arent safe anywhere" in threads where people are whining about losing 20trillion zydrine in their T1 hauler in Jita. Well cloakers ARE safe, and while it shouldnt be EASY to find them, it should be possible. __________________________________ Your Dual 250mm Prototype I Gauss Gun perfectly strikes Estamel Tharchon, wrecking for 187.6 damage.
Apertotes Nuevos Horizontes	Posted - 2006.08.09 17:58:00 - [65] Originally by: The Slayer Sorry, yes docking should be the only time you are safe. I always hear people saying "You arent safe anywhere" in threads where people are whining about losing 20trillion zydrine in their T1 hauler in Jita. Well cloakers ARE safe, and while it shouldnt be EASY to find them, it should be possible. why? Apertotes, the Guybrush Threepwood of New Eve
The Slayer Caldari Millennium E.R.A	Posted - 2006.08.09 18:00:00 - [66] The fitting of one modules makes a person pretty much invulnerable to anything the enemy can throw at them. If that isnt unbalanced I dont know what is. __________________________________ Your Dual 250mm Prototype I Gauss Gun perfectly strikes Estamel Tharchon, wrecking for 187.6 damage.
Apertotes Nuevos Horizontes	Posted - 2006.08.09 18:02:00 - [67] Originally by: The Slayer The fitting of one modules makes a person pretty much invulnerable to anything the enemy can throw at them. If that isnt unbalanced I dont know what is. so? you dont need any module whatsoever to dock and be invulnerable. people fitting cloak devices are already giving up a lot of things for it. Apertotes, the Guybrush Threepwood of New Eve
quellious COLSUP Tau Ceti Federation	Posted - 2006.08.09 18:03:00 - [68] Cloak in SS is just usefull, and allow many valid offensive tactics. It's not because you are not able to kill 1 guys in a system that the game is broken. Maybe you should play a different way (like baiting him). However, that posts, as for nerfing neutralizer, and remove WCS, is pointless. Regards - > Order Falcon & Pilgrim > Colsup
Buxaroo Quantum Industries Prime Orbital Systems	Posted - 2006.08.09 18:07:00 - [69] OK, someone PLEASE tell me how being cloaked makes you invincible? You can't kill **** while cloaked, and most ships can't WARP without decloaking....how is it invincible? You can still kill cloaked ships, either with warp bubbles or interdictor bubbles and very fast ships. To me invicible means a TITAN. Not a paper thin cloaked frigate or cruiser. Not even a battleship.
Azrael Bierce Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2006.08.09 18:09:00 - [70] Originally by: Apertotes so? you dont need any module whatsoever to dock and be invulnerable. Ya, but you can be found when you are docked. People know where you are. They know you aren't spying on their mining op waiting to spring a login trap. They know you aren't just sitting waiting to jump on someone at a gate. They can keep an eye on you and worry about you when you leave. Cloaking lets you shut down a system because nobody wants to risk a trap, and they can't get back to what they want to do because cloaks are 100% unfindable.
Apertotes Nuevos Horizontes	Posted - 2006.08.09 18:29:00 - [71] Originally by: Azrael Bierce Originally by: Apertotes so? you dont need any module whatsoever to dock and be invulnerable. Ya, but you can be found when you are docked. People know where you are. They know you aren't spying on their mining op waiting to spring a login trap. They know you aren't just sitting waiting to jump on someone at a gate. They can keep an eye on you and worry about you when you leave. Cloaking lets you shut down a system because nobody wants to risk a trap, and they can't get back to what they want to do because cloaks are 100% unfindable. mmm... true... solution: nerf local this way you dont know if there is someone cloaked or not, and you can have your mining op just fine Apertotes, the Guybrush Threepwood of New Eve
Death Kill Caldari direkte	Posted - 2006.08.09 18:33:00 - [72] Edited by: Death Kill on 09/08/2006 18:33:43 Originally by: Alliaanna Dalaii #completely gimped his locking time. #Wasted a highslot. #sitting in a safespot bored as hell. Oh the horror of gimped locking time when you are running from a blob.....in your cloaked battleship. For the state for the state for the state
Avon Caldari Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers	Posted - 2006.08.09 18:42:00 - [73] Originally by: Buxaroo OK, someone PLEASE tell me how being cloaked makes you invincible? Er, not being able to be killed is pretty much the definition of invincible tbh. Examples of how a ship can die when it is not cloaked do not prove your point. The Battleships is not and should not be a solo pwnmobile - Oveur
Katura Amarr Victim Services	Posted - 2006.08.09 18:58:00 - [74] sigh...people have spent alot of time waiting & training for recon ships. The only adjustment I would support/not hate is one that limmits the types of ships cloaks can be placed on. Recons & coverts are ment to stay hidden, that is why people trained for them. It is bad enough that local takes 95% of the stealth away and yet you still complain about the 5% they have left. The reasons people want them nerfed & my response: I cant kill them & I wanty (too bad, get better at eve) They make my 0.0 mining ops scarey (too bad, 0.0 is ment to be scarey & furthermore what in reality is a single covert or recon going to do to a well defended op? Answer - nothing. So again, cloaks on recons & coverts = good Cloaks on any other ship already have massive penalties but I guess it still makes eve is too hard for some of you. My suggestiom, insted of training up you "cry on the forum" skill, spend the time getting better at eve. ___________ Trader, Industrialist & Freedom Fighter.
Guntaro	Posted - 2006.08.12 18:23:00 - [75] Originally by: Avon Er, not being able to be killed is pretty much the definition of invincible tbh. Examples of how a ship can die when it is not cloaked do not prove your point. A cloaked ship is not INVINCIBLE, it is INVISIBLE and there is a big difference. It cannot engage or be enaged by another ship UNTIL it de-cloaks.
Anwyl Gallente	Posted - 2006.08.12 19:51:00 - [76] Edited by: Anwyl on 12/08/2006 19:53:40 Originally by: Guntaro Edited by: Guntaro on 12/08/2006 18:31:33 It cannot engage or be enaged by another ship UNTIL it de-cloaks. In fact if it is in the vicinity of smart bombs it can be destroyed. If I'm right from what I read in the cloak FAQ smartbombs don't hurt when you're cloaked, they decloak you. So you ARE invincible for as long as you're invisible Oh, also I fly a cloaked cargo ship. It's powerful, but not invincible, you have to come out of cloak to warp and come out of warp to cloak, so a quick player can start targetting you before you cloak, and that ALSO disrupts cloak. You have to be VERY careful not to decloak. I once nearly decloaked because a BS randomly ended up within 5km of me on warp in
Ichabod Dirange Iscariot Enterprises	Posted - 2006.08.12 20:01:00 - [77] You crash often enough with the cloaking device, anyways that's my experience so losing them isn't a problem.
Powder Monkey	Posted - 2006.08.12 20:07:00 - [78] OH MY GOD PLEASE NERF Q+CTRL KEKEK ALSO NERF DOCKING ALONG WITH GATE JUMPING WHILE UNDERFIRE KEKEE ITS LIKE TOTALY UNBALANCED. STFU
Zissou	Posted - 2006.08.12 21:41:00 - [79] SS + Cloak = God Only if 'God' = AFK
BlackMoon Thrawn Minmatar the Organ Grinder and Company Ascendant Frontier	Posted - 2006.08.12 22:15:00 - [80] seriosly? 3 pages? you can scan for them when Kali hits. You will not decloak them you will have to work to find them and a cov-ops pilot that is not afk will be able to warp out. That seems pretty balanced to me. If you are using an improved or prototype cloak on a bs or something else lame, guess what you may just get found.
Anwyl Gallente	Posted - 2006.08.12 23:20:00 - [81] Edited by: Anwyl on 12/08/2006 23:21:14 As long as it takes scan probes to do this I'll be fine with it... otherwise you just spam scanner instead of using overview. Scan probes are required aren't they? Originally by: Zissou SS + Cloak = God Only if 'God' = AFK have you seen any miracles lately? God is OBVIOUSLY AFK.
Phoenix vajaa SUBLIME L.L.C. Prime Orbital Systems	Posted - 2006.08.13 00:24:00 - [82] Edited by: Phoenix vajaa on 13/08/2006 00:31:44 Edited by: Phoenix vajaa on 13/08/2006 00:29:10 Are the ss cloaked ships hurting you? Are carriers able to use fighters well ss and cloaked? Are they able to relay tactical info? Are they putting you off going bpc hunting or mining? Do they relaying tactical info a noobship or noob alt can not do? DO they have the ability to stalk up on you and declaok hitting you at 2km? DO they have to delcoak to warp out and escape your fleet that has turned up at their ss in the 6min they have gone for a ciggy, taken a toilet brake and grabbed a pack of crisps? Are you incapable of not baiting a claoked hunter out with a nice ship that lookks like its npc hunting? Are you incapable of using cloaked ships alongside a peice of bait to counter trap the cloaker? Are you unable to kill the carier's fighters if he decloaked for 5min and uses a frig to agro some 1 with them? 1. NO. It's cloaked at a ss so it can't fire on you scan you, jam you or anything else. 2. NO. They can't launch or deligate fighters well cloaked and what more any fighters out when he cloak's are lost control of. 3. YES, if they happene to be in scaner range they can scan items in local and relay whos in local. 4. Yes cus you never know when they may pounce. 5. NO. infact a noob alt can probably do more as no one ever bothers to probe noobs ships. 6. NO. unless they art covert ops in wich case they will warp from their ss remaining cloaked when you warp in. 7. Yes and frankly how is that fair on a ship bigger than a bc? 8. NO every 1 who is in 0.0 should be organised enogth to use basic tactics. 9. NO most corps in 0.0 have recon ship pilots. 10. Most corps in 0.0 should be able to organise a ss to lure fighters to the use hacs to kill them. If that fails you can alwas just insat dock to that nice npc outpost your living in or the pos you settup. IS 0.0 FOR THE WEAK? IS IT RIGHT THAT HAVING A POS IN SYSTEM MEANS NO ONE BUT A 70 MAN BLOB CAN'T HASSEL YOU? why does every 1 talk of cloaks like they are the uber 100% hardener that reduces all nme dammage to 0.1. the fact of the matter is every 1 moaning about them is in a allaince or corp that can't go mine in their faivourit systembecause their is a hostile sat cloaked and ss, MAYBE OR MAYBE NOT active and waiting to descend upon them. problem is 0.0 alliances dont have the patients to camp him in till he gets bored. but he has the patients to wait maybe 5 hours for a target o opertunity. come on its 1 vs 50-60 its pathetic. AND even if the scanner gets changed all it will mean is these people will move hip in as normal. safe it and log it. Move in a noob alt in a shuttle, keep that logged on and use as scout. then log on main when target presents itself. they will probably even start logging them in the system next door and wait.

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