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Time for MANY more systems out of 0.0

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Nanobotter Mk2	Posted - 2006.08.13 18:50:00 - [1] Sorry done alot of research during the last week, so ill informed talking out my arse types can do some of thier own before they yap k? Reseult nearly every jump out to 0.0 is perma camped 23/7 ( specially weekends and prime time). I tried the old well go around the camp! and amazingly enough almsot every single way out has gate camps of some degree. Clearly the time has come with EVE's pop to vastly increase the ways in and out of 0.0. Also i am not saying you cannot get past all these gate camps IF you use a ship designed just for that, but that matters little the problem comes when trying to get a ship that actually has some USE past the gate camps. The other thing that became instantly obvious is that 0.0 gate camps have little to no risk, yet another borken aspect of the whole system, these camps can rack up many kills and almost never if ever die.... not because they are good but because gate camping is rediculously safe. So look if you wanna camp a gate? Fine your choice how you play eve, but like everything else in eve risk/reward must be inplace and right now there is little to no risk in 0.0 gate camps. Flame all you want but i speak the truth, and unless you are gonna go scout some systems out to 0.0 today (sunday afternoon) and find a few uncamped, or try to bust through some of these gate camps in a ship that serves some purpose beyond pure travling you're blowing hot air. Specifically I invite you right now to try to make the trip from dijanen to I00-70 if you seem to beleive passing gate camps is easy and that BM's make travel in 0.0 100% safe PS another problem which i discovered ( doubt it will ever be fixed) is i did all this explorering risk free by using an noob alt who had nothing to loose. SO i am not posting because i am angry from losing a big money ship, I am posting because i have taking feedback given when i posted about this issue before and tried various things and by doing so i discovered one of the most broken aspect of eve being the safety and lameness that is gate camping and just how much it is done, time to man up and learn to play the game rather than EZ mode gate camp imho...... atleast in 0.0 imho.
Selfe Caldari UK Corp Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.08.13 18:53:00 - [2] cba to read it all. But if you want to get into 0.0 join a Corp in a alliance. ----------------------- Join The UK Corperation. Foundin Partners in Lokta Volterra
Nanobotter Mk2	Posted - 2006.08.13 18:55:00 - [3] "But if you want to get into 0.0 join a Corp in a alliance." 100% agree that is the one viable option, but it still doesnt adress the safety and EZ that gate campers currently enjoy does it? And although you can suggest joining corps it really shouldnt be nearly the only reasonable choice imho, but that is debateble i would agree.
Dark Shikari Caldari Imperium Technologies Firmus Ixion	Posted - 2006.08.13 18:58:00 - [4] Edited by: Dark Shikari on 13/08/2006 18:58:27 Originally by: Nanobotter Mk2 random crap 1. Gate camping is not risk free, if you think it is, you're a fool. Its not even like gatecampers in 0.0 snipe: they sit on the gate where they're the most vulnerable, and they die OFTEN to their enemies, who try to bust their camps. 2. I'd guess about 30-50% of chokepoints are camped at any one time. Not 100%. 3. Its hard to get into 0.0 because you seem to ignore the concept of "diplomacy." Yes, if you go and trespass on other peoples' land without contacting them first, you'll run into problems. --[23] Member-- Originally by: DB Preacher The only time BoB's backs are to the wall is when Backdoor Bandit is in local.
Zirator Times of Ancar R i s e	Posted - 2006.08.13 19:02:00 - [5] There are enough entry points for 0.0 space allready. It's allready hard enough for alliances out there to controll their space. And you would even want more? Just take a look around and don't fly to the first entry point your autopilot takes you to. There are also alliances out there who have open sky policies so you might take a look there as well. And please don't get me started on the 0.0 camps have no risk part.
Karunel Nuevos Horizontes	Posted - 2006.08.13 19:05:00 - [6] Quote: Reseult nearly every jump out to 0.0 is perma camped 23/7 Stoped reading there. Do more research.
Aversin Gallente Roving Guns Inc. RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2006.08.13 19:19:00 - [7] Originally by: Karunel Quote: Reseult nearly every jump out to 0.0 is perma camped 23/7 Stoped reading there. Do more research. Yeah just the other day I autopiloted from empire through low sec, into 0.0 through D7-ZAC (the system with TCF and RAZOR + friends fighting) up north without a scratch on my ship (cruiser). Obviously there wern't any camps because when you jump into a bubble you can't warp and autopilot turns off, oh and people usually shoot at you :). Originally by: Razner Cerizo They will never quit. The beatings will continue until morale improves.
Rod Blaine Evolution Band of Brothers	Posted - 2006.08.13 19:23:00 - [8] Strange, I never un into those gatecamps of yours, yet i'm european and play at primetime. For some ungodly reason yet to be uncovered by the tinfoil hattery brigade, I manage to evade them, destroy them, or outsmart them, if I ever run into something one could call a gatecamp at all of course. In short: what the hell are you on about ? Old blog
Dr Smythe Sha Kharn Corp Ascendant Frontier	Posted - 2006.08.13 19:46:00 - [9] Quote: Reseult nearly every jump out to 0.0 is perma camped 23/7 If you have no business being in that particular 0.0 space then stay out. Remember if you are not invited or have a travel pass you are more than likely tresspassing. I know for a fact that all entries to 0.0 are NOT gate camped 23/7 but if they were its because people like yourself are tresspassing and gate camps are there to protect their space. Simple enough and you don't have to be Einstein to figure it out.
Darkrydar Destructive Influence Band of Brothers	Posted - 2006.08.13 19:46:00 - [10] This guy is a first class retard. Buy a mothership and put your stuff in it, and cyno it down where you want it to go. Even a retard such as yourself can get an inty through a gate camp I hope. I cba to add anything more to this idiocy.
Christopher Dalran	Posted - 2006.08.13 19:49:00 - [11] Edited by: Christopher Dalran on 13/08/2006 19:49:43 Gate camps only work if someone relativly new to 0.0 comes along without a Bookmark, Vets do not make this mistake. Also gate camps are easy to tear apart, provided you have a few friends (Join a corp) and someone has a cov ops ship. Kinda sucks when a bunch of cruisers warp up within 15km of you BS and your warp scrambled (Sniper setups are only good at long range, they cant do anything at close range and have bad tanks).
IizzaBatch	Posted - 2006.08.13 19:49:00 - [12] Edited by: IizzaBatch on 13/08/2006 19:49:04 Originally by: Dr Smythe Quote: Reseult nearly every jump out to 0.0 is perma camped 23/7 If you have no business being in that particular 0.0 space then stay out. Remember if you are not invited or have a travel pass you are more than likely tresspassing. I know for a fact that all entries to 0.0 are NOT gate camped 23/7 but if they were its because people like yourself are tresspassing and gate camps are there to protect their space. Simple enough and you don't have to be Einstein to figure it out. oic, the space belongs to THEM, you are trepassing, GEROF MA LAND! who said it belonged them anyway? them? YOU HAVE NO RIGHT TO BE THERE, ITS NOT YOUR SPACE, IT BELONGS TO THEM, GET OUT OR BE BANNED!
stoats	Posted - 2006.08.13 20:47:00 - [13] Originally by: Christopher Dalran [ Also gate camps are easy to tear apart, provided you have a few friends (Join a corp) and someone has a cov ops ship. Kinda sucks when a bunch of cruisers warp up within 15km of you BS and your warp scrambled (Sniper setups are only good at long range, they cant do anything at close range and have bad tanks). Except the gate camps into 0.0 usually have a bubble and at least 7 people. Admittedly, they are usually 7 people who aren't very good at the game since all they can do to rack up kills is gatecamp... but lots of people will still die to them.
stoats	Posted - 2006.08.13 20:50:00 - [14] of course, if getting in 0.0 was risk free, everyone would do it.
Rodge Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers	Posted - 2006.08.13 21:13:00 - [15] As so many people here have pointed out, 0.0 entry points are not permacamped. I actually went round 5 of them this evening (euro primetime), looking for a fight. All 5 were empty! And I'm including some of the big ones like PF-346! It's never been as easy to get into 0.0 as it is now. I assume that you've just set a destination in 0.0 and followed your autopilot? There are one or two chokepoints that are busier than others (like EC-P8R and HED-GP). But there's quieter routes around the main entry points. You just have to do some "research" and find the quiet routes, which are even more quiet than the main ones. In short, it's never been easier to get to 0.0 than it is these days. Addendum - I've just logged in and jumped into PF-346. There's one n00b alt in system at a safespot. Hardly what I call permacamped! Sig inappropriate-not eve related -Abdalion [ 2005.04.17 00:34:30 ] Nagilam > u better leave Rodge, u will not gank any1 else 2nite......
Jim McGregor Caldari	Posted - 2006.08.13 21:21:00 - [16] Edited by: Jim McGregor on 13/08/2006 21:21:39 Basicly get a alt to scout ahead and you cant die. Unless some cloaked falcon pilot decides to be intelligent and wait for your main. :) Then again, they show up on the scanner... --- Eve Wiki \| Eve Tribune \| Eve Pirate
Siege	Posted - 2006.08.13 21:22:00 - [17] Even if it IS camped, a ship with the right fitting can get through quite easily. Especially shuttles, T2 frigates and T2 cruisers. And gate camps are NOT easy pickings, contrary to popular belief. If you've got a war going, or any organized opposing force, they are more often than not a death trap to the campers. They lack mobility and it's usually so boring that the more aggressive and talented pilots go elsewhere.
Serenity Steele Rearden Steele Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2006.08.13 21:40:00 - [18] The existing gates to 0.0 are very porous already, and the risk/reward factor for gate campers is pretty balanced - it can take hours of sitting on gates to keep pathways closed, and not very profitable compared to other activities (bar infrequent exceptions). I think it's been mentioned a few time before, but bears repeating (listed by fastest to get through camp): - If you need to use a ship with 'travel setup', just take some modules to re-fit with on 'the other' side of the camp, everywhere has NPC stations, and many markets. - Try a different route. - Negotiate a fee to go through the camp - Use a scout. While gates are camped for hour at a time, if nothing comes through, it will most likely decamp and move-on. - Choose your day and time to travel And general advice: - Do use Instas - Do use scouts - Do not use the path chosen by default autopilot A->B, set mid-waypoints to avoid traffic. - Expect hostilities in claimed 0.0 space (see the territorial map) - If you can get someone to get kit through for you in a carrier, just get a cyno alt to your proposed destination - Join a corp/alliance with access who can help you get in. (It is also known as alliance space after all) I find 9/10 times I can autopilot through to just about any 0.0 region - it's simply a matter of choosing the day, time and good way-points to avoid frequently used routes. (Note: I suggest you DO NOT use Autopilot!)
Akorin Minmatar	Posted - 2006.08.13 21:53:00 - [19] Originally by: Dark Shikari Edited by: Dark Shikari on 13/08/2006 18:58:27 Originally by: Nanobotter Mk2 random crap 3. Its hard to get into 0.0 because you seem to ignore the concept of "diplomacy." Yes, if you go and trespass on other peoples' land without contacting them first, you'll run into problems. Other 2 points agreed, but I think what the op is getting at is there's a lack of "no mans land" out there.. The game is set up in such a way that it's relatively easy for alliances to control all of 0.0 space. I agree saying gates are camped 100% of the time is wrong but I'd like to see more room for independents in some parts of 0.0 too. That said I realize adding random insults to a reply is an EVE forums tradition but god damn can't we act like adults once in a while? Not just aimed at you Shikari but it's hard to find a thread which doesn't turn into a "let's all have a laugh at whoever said something not 100% accurate" and it seems to be getting worse the more people join the game.. Go ahead and flame this reply too.. I could care less about your e-peen related issues
Hoshi Blackguard Brigade	Posted - 2006.08.13 21:57:00 - [20] Originally by: Jim McGregor Edited by: Jim McGregor on 13/08/2006 21:21:39 Basicly get a alt to scout ahead and you cant die. Unless some cloaked falcon pilot decides to be intelligent and wait for your main. :) Then again, they show up on the scanner... We had some fun camps with a cloaked interdictor several stealth bombers a falcon and a rapier :) --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Nanobotter Mk2	Posted - 2006.08.15 09:59:00 - [21] "The existing gates to 0.0 are very porous already, and the risk/reward factor for gate campers is pretty balanced - it can take hours of sitting on gates to keep pathways closed, and not very profitable compared to other activities (bar infrequent exceptions). I think it's been mentioned a few time before, but bears repeating (listed by fastest to get through camp): - If you need to use a ship with 'travel setup', just take some modules to re-fit with on 'the other' side of the camp, everywhere has NPC stations, and many markets. - Try a different route. - Negotiate a fee to go through the camp - Use a scout. While gates are camped for hour at a time, if nothing comes through, it will most likely decamp and move-on. - Choose your day and time to travel And general advice: - Do use Instas - Do use scouts - Do not use the path chosen by default autopilot A->B, set mid-waypoints to avoid traffic. - Expect hostilities in claimed 0.0 space (see the territorial map) - If you can get someone to get kit through for you in a carrier, just get a cyno alt to your proposed destination - Join a corp/alliance with access who can help you get in. (It is also known as alliance space after all) I find 9/10 times I can autopilot through to just about any 0.0 region - it's simply a matter of choosing the day, time and good way-points to avoid frequently used routes. (Note: I suggest you DO NOT use Autopilot!)" This is about the choke points the entry systems.... ya once past those points your pretty much free and clear. It bears mentioning because i ALREADY mentioned it, -going around isnt an option because there are only a very few gates into any specific 0.0 area and those are camped. -travel set up is worthless becasue you know the reason to go into 0.0 is to accomplish something not just pass a gate. -negotiating a feee is just silly you don;t even know it is camped or by who until you enter, and mostly they just want kills for thier KB anyways. - i do use a scout doesnt help just reinforced what i just said that the gate is camped NEARLY 23/7.. cool I confirmed the gate is always camped! - I thought i was pretty clear but i been checking many gates many times a days for a solid week everyone always camped. I appreciate your input, but frankly it is old school and like most posters you just have lost touch with the REAL game because you prolly stay in a area and use an area controlled by your alliance corp or friends. Insta's do nothing to help you through a gate camp they camp the "otherside", and typically they will have either buttloads of bubbles, atleast 1 if not more inty cloaked waiting to scramble anything that comes through at which time the snipers THEN warp in to kill. the only thing that gets away is a small fast warping ship, and the tackler wont even decloak to try to grab a small ship giving up the fact they are there, so the gate you "think" are not camped really are, fly a slow ass ship through you will see :P i suggest a cheap ass indy This isnt about territy control either it is about bragging rights for who has the biggest campboard... i mean KB, and these choke poitns lead to far more systems than these people should be able to control by locking down 2-3 choke points. 2-3 choke points leading to 70+ systems is total trash. Look there will always be 2 sides to this, the peopel who think there leet pvp'ers who fill up KB's camping the gates ( they will insist it is hard and risky but it totaly isnt I can explain why if you wanna play dumb), and the rest of the people who can;t beleive CCP lets such mindless EZ mode pvp exist in there game while these few people lock out so many from sooo many systems because they are all piled behind such narrow choke points.
Avon Caldari Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers	Posted - 2006.08.15 10:02:00 - [22] Probably more likely to get ganked entering lo-sec than entering 0.0 tbh. The Battleships is not and should not be a solo pwnmobile - Oveur
Laythun Euphoria Released Euphoria Unleashed	Posted - 2006.08.15 10:17:00 - [23] wait did anyone ACTUALLY check the chokepoint hes usning as an example?? BWF. now, whats going on there is ask?? its a bloody warzone, of course its going to be campled 24/7. *See You In Space Cowboy*
Laythun Euphoria Released Euphoria Unleashed	Posted - 2006.08.15 10:29:00 - [24] Originally by: Akorin Originally by: Dark Shikari Edited by: Dark Shikari on 13/08/2006 18:58:27 Originally by: Nanobotter Mk2 random crap stuff I'd like to see more room for independents in some parts of 0.0 too. ...stupid random flame... this logic is TOTALLY flawed. there is no such thing as room for independents in 0.0. Why? because its human nature to group together to overcome difficulties, hardships and the like. People, corps etc naturally group and band together. so space will always be controlled by groups OR by ONE strong corp not random groups of independents. *See You In Space Cowboy*
Ralara Caldari Colossus Technologies	Posted - 2006.08.15 10:31:00 - [25] Originally by: Nanobotter Mk2 Sorry done alot of research during the last week, so ill informed talking out my arse types can do some of thier own before they yap k? Reseult nearly every jump out to 0.0 is perma camped 23/7 ( specially weekends and prime time). I tried the old well go around the camp! and amazingly enough almsot every single way out has gate camps of some degree. Clearly the time has come with EVE's pop to vastly increase the ways in and out of 0.0. Also i am not saying you cannot get past all these gate camps IF you use a ship designed just for that, but that matters little the problem comes when trying to get a ship that actually has some USE past the gate camps. The other thing that became instantly obvious is that 0.0 gate camps have little to no risk, yet another borken aspect of the whole system, these camps can rack up many kills and almost never if ever die.... not because they are good but because gate camping is rediculously safe. So look if you wanna camp a gate? Fine your choice how you play eve, but like everything else in eve risk/reward must be inplace and right now there is little to no risk in 0.0 gate camps. Flame all you want but i speak the truth, and unless you are gonna go scout some systems out to 0.0 today (sunday afternoon) and find a few uncamped, or try to bust through some of these gate camps in a ship that serves some purpose beyond pure travling you're blowing hot air. Specifically I invite you right now to try to make the trip from dijanen to I00-70 if you seem to beleive passing gate camps is easy and that BM's make travel in 0.0 100% safe PS another problem which i discovered ( doubt it will ever be fixed) is i did all this explorering risk free by using an noob alt who had nothing to loose. SO i am not posting because i am angry from losing a big money ship, I am posting because i have taking feedback given when i posted about this issue before and tried various things and by doing so i discovered one of the most broken aspect of eve being the safety and lameness that is gate camping and just how much it is done, time to man up and learn to play the game rather than EZ mode gate camp imho...... atleast in 0.0 imho. TBH I think Eve could do with less 0.0 systems overall, but more access points than it has at the moment. There's entire constellations that can go a week or more with only 1 or 2 pilots flying through them, and I'd venture to say there's probably a few systems out there that have had less visitors since Eve began, than I have fingers. _-=-_-=-_-=-_-=-_-=-_-=-_-=-_-=-_-=-_-=-_ -Colossus Technologies- 0.0 and Empire Mining \| PvP \| Manufacturing \| Ratting \| Trading \| Missions
Megan Ryder VentureCorp CORE.	Posted - 2006.08.15 10:41:00 - [26] Originally by: IizzaBatch oic, the space belongs to THEM, you are trepassing, GEROF MA LAND! who said it belonged them anyway? them? YOU HAVE NO RIGHT TO BE THERE, ITS NOT YOUR SPACE, IT BELONGS TO THEM, GET OUT OR BE BANNED! I think the point here being, possesion is 9/10ths of the law. If they can field the players to keep you out and you can't get through...
Alliaanna Dalaii Gallente Does Not Compute	Posted - 2006.08.15 10:48:00 - [27] If you try to enter through a chokepoint close to a HUB then yeah.... logic says it will be camped. There is however back ways into a lot of 0.0 systems. Syndicate (going in from Aridia, Up the shircosin(sp?) pipe) Ive never once seen a gatecamp going through this way. Most i've ever seen is a few Legion guys on the gate back when they used to operate in my area. From Synd you can goto Cloud Ring / Fountain / Delve or anywhere up north you want. Going through this way generally you will see no one apart from the odd fleet flying through. Delve is probably the easiest to get into, Your more likely to be stopped by VC / FA in Fountain than you are by BoB in Delve... they have better things to do than stop NPC'ers I guesse. Iether way getting into 0.0 is easy, You just have to be prepared to put some thought and effort into it Alliaanna DNC Treasure Hunt !!
Chang Pong	Posted - 2006.08.15 10:49:00 - [28] Camps break, they don't last forever. Take it from me who used to live right under the nose of a good sized alliance. It just takes paitence and cloaking devices. Have your scout fly to the system ahead and see whats up. You are waiting in the previous system claked and lined up for warp. The scout clears you, you warp, jump in, cloak, move away from the gate while lingin up, and wait for the scout to clear you for the next system. The hardest part is waiting. Sometimes it takes a few hours until you get that 5 min opening to pass through.
Ishquar Teh'Sainte Euphoria Released	Posted - 2006.08.15 10:54:00 - [29] Originally by: Nanobotter Mk2 Sorry done alot of research during the last week, so ill informed talking out my arse types can do some of thier own before they yap k? Reseult nearly every jump out to 0.0 is perma camped 23/7 ( specially weekends and prime time). I tried the old well go around the camp! and amazingly enough almsot every single way out has gate camps of some degree. Clearly the time has come with EVE's pop to vastly increase the ways in and out of 0.0. Also i am not saying you cannot get past all these gate camps IF you use a ship designed just for that, but that matters little the problem comes when trying to get a ship that actually has some USE past the gate camps. The other thing that became instantly obvious is that 0.0 gate camps have little to no risk, yet another borken aspect of the whole system, these camps can rack up many kills and almost never if ever die.... not because they are good but because gate camping is rediculously safe. So look if you wanna camp a gate? Fine your choice how you play eve, but like everything else in eve risk/reward must be inplace and right now there is little to no risk in 0.0 gate camps. Flame all you want but i speak the truth, and unless you are gonna go scout some systems out to 0.0 today (sunday afternoon) and find a few uncamped, or try to bust through some of these gate camps in a ship that serves some purpose beyond pure travling you're blowing hot air. Specifically I invite you right now to try to make the trip from dijanen to I00-70 if you seem to beleive passing gate camps is easy and that BM's make travel in 0.0 100% safe PS another problem which i discovered ( doubt it will ever be fixed) is i did all this explorering risk free by using an noob alt who had nothing to loose. SO i am not posting because i am angry from losing a big money ship, I am posting because i have taking feedback given when i posted about this issue before and tried various things and by doing so i discovered one of the most broken aspect of eve being the safety and lameness that is gate camping and just how much it is done, time to man up and learn to play the game rather than EZ mode gate camp imho...... atleast in 0.0 imho. LMAO .. this post made my day ... 1. gatecamping is only riskfree because of the lack of people to bust a gatecamp. don't blame the campers ... blame the whiners, who don't want to participate in the removal of a gatecamp. 2. alot of research? then it shouldn't surprise you that the IPS constellation is a warzone. look in the forums, ask the locals etc. and do you expect that a warzone is a fluffy-carebear-zone? 3. as allready said - try some diplomacy - before you jump into the system ... sometimes it works ___________________ -Skellibjalla- Life is a garden of perceptions. Pick your fruit.
Uther Doull Shinra Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.08.15 11:02:00 - [30] i don't think a few extra chokepoints would be bad for eve, but seriously, getting in and out of 0.0 is pretty easy (and i mean when it is camped by none-friendlies)

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