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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
K Shara
Caldari
Contraband Inc.
Mercenary Coalition
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Posted - 2006.08.14 10:22:00 -
[1]
ok, a little while ago I posted this thread asking about the use of the goons portrait database program.
for those who arnt aware it replaces the normal portrait with one that shows the alliance / corp of anyone in their database. This means you dont need to manage a buddy list of a few 1000 names erc
Anyway I aked in this thread if it was an exploit or legal
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=375266&page=1
The thread was locked and I was instructed to ask via petition.
I did this.
I got my answer.
Now I cant post actual responses from GM's without being hit with big sticks but I was told to quote the following to anyone who claims that using this program is legal
 Quote:
Section 20, TOS:
You will not attempt to decipher, hack into or interfere with any transmissions to or from the EVE Online servers, nor will you try to create or use any third party add-ons, extras or tools for the game.
So, if you are using it you are breaking the EULA and risk the normal result of breaking the EULA.
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Alliaanna Dalaii
Gallente
Does Not Compute
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Posted - 2006.08.14 11:05:00 -
[2]
It is an exploit.
It is however non-traceable at this point in time, However cheating is lame.
Alliaanna
DNC Treasure Hunt !!
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K Shara
Caldari
Contraband Inc.
Mercenary Coalition
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Posted - 2006.08.14 11:11:00 -
[3]
I know its an exploit, you know its an exploit.
but next time ANYONE claims its not I can officially say it is.
And I do like to win my arguments
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Sir Juri
Caldari
Caldari Provisions
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Posted - 2006.08.14 11:15:00 -
[4]
Edited by: Sir Juri on 14/08/2006 11:15:59
yeah I know ppl that had access to it. Ppl could get it from the forum website that all goons come from. And they all use it to, as ppl from OSS when with goons had the offer to use it. And dont deny it!
edit; So they can see in local who is red who is blue...
damn need to make a new sig... |
Rexthor Hammerfists
Black Nova Corp
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2006.08.14 11:26:00 -
[5]
good job,
now they need a prog tho, to detect those changes..
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Purple Conquered The World, We the Universe.
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FireFoxx80
Caldari
E X O D U S
Imperial Republic Of the North
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Posted - 2006.08.14 11:36:00 -
[6]
It's not an exploit to take CCP byproducts and do with them what you wish. By this I mean the contents of the cache folder. Looking at the code itself or in any other location is a no-no.
Putting content into these folders however, in an attempt to modify how the game references these byproducts, is an exploit. As the goon thing of editing character portraits.
That's how I interpret it.
Obviously IMHO CCP have dug themselves this hole as people have been asking for overview/standing indications in the chat channels for months now.
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Sorja
E X O D U S
Imperial Republic Of the North
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Posted - 2006.08.14 11:50:00 -
[7]
Since local is to be removed in Kali, this is irrelevant 
Now, if they don't remove local, they better give this functionnality to everybody otherwise some will have it, so won't (anyone reminds of UOXtreme back in 1997?).
____________________
Darko1107 > does anything in ascn space have tech II fittings?
Quillan Rage > Iron ships |
James Snowscoran
Caldari
Coreli Corporation
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Posted - 2006.08.14 11:50:00 -
[8]
Originally by: FireFoxx80
It's not an exploit to take CCP byproducts and do with them what you wish. By this I mean the contents of the cache folder. Looking at the code itself or in any other location is a no-no.
Putting content into these folders however, in an attempt to modify how the game references these byproducts, is an exploit. As the goon thing of editing character portraits.
That's how I interpret it.
Obviously IMHO CCP have dug themselves this hole as people have been asking for overview/standing indications in the chat channels for months now.
Ah, but then many many more people have asked for those same channels to be removed altogether because thyey offer unfair amounts of free intel and recon.
And this is the direction CCP has stated they want to go afaik. Which means that standing indications in the chat channels will probably and hopefully remain a dream mister 
-----
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Wild Rho
Amarr
Imperial Shipment
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Posted - 2006.08.14 12:03:00 -
[9]
Edited by: Wild Rho on 14/08/2006 12:03:49
Edited by: Wild Rho on 14/08/2006 12:03:32
Originally by: Sorja
Since local is to be removed in Kali, this is irrelevant
YEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEES! \ /
WE ARE DYSLEXIC OF BORG. Refutance is systile. Your ass will be laminated. - Jennie Marlboro
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Damien Smith
Turbulent
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Posted - 2006.08.14 12:59:00 -
[10]
Seriously?!?!
I'm going to have to join in the YYYYYYYYYYEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
So pirates will have to scan the whole system to know if there's a target or not? People mining/ratting/safespotted will have to scan to know if there's anyone hunting them?
And most importantly: You mean that while we're on an op, we could be ambushed by an antipirate gank fleet without having the all seeing, all knowing local channel of doom saying "zomg local jumped by 25, run away"?
That's awesome.
Got a link to the official statement?
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Join channel 'Turby' or die! (bring pie)
Mission running carebears drop good loot. Probe one out today! |
Malachon Draco
eXceed Inc.
Ascendant Frontier
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Posted - 2006.08.14 13:18:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Damien Smith
Seriously?!?!
I'm going to have to join in the YYYYYYYYYYEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
So pirates will have to scan the whole system to know if there's a target or not? People mining/ratting/safespotted will have to scan to know if there's anyone hunting them?
And most importantly: You mean that while we're on an op, we could be ambushed by an antipirate gank fleet without having the all seeing, all knowing local channel of doom saying "zomg local jumped by 25, run away"?
That's awesome.
Got a link to the official statement?
You mean:
- gankers will have login, scan through 10-15 belts in 2 mins before finding the ratters/miners, gank them, then logout again, while...
- miners and ratters will have to hit a scan button every 3 seconds for 4 hours in a row every time they rat or mine to be remotely safe, even though the reaction time to someone showing up on scanner is probably too short to actually escape.
Yes, great. Can't wait for such a 'balanced' change. Life for stabbabond ganksquads was already so terribly risky, it was just unfair.
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Baldour Ngarr
Artemis Rising
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Posted - 2006.08.14 13:20:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Damien Smith
People mining/ratting/safespotted will have to scan to know if there's anyone hunting them?
What fun, having a member of the mining crew whose sole job is to click "scan" once every three seconds just in case a pirate wandered in.
________________________________________________
"I tried strip mining, but I lost, and it's cold flying around in space naked." |
K Shara
Caldari
Contraband Inc.
Mercenary Coalition
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Posted - 2006.08.14 13:23:00 -
[13]
Originally by: FireFoxx80
It's not an exploit to take CCP byproducts and do with them what you wish. By this I mean the contents of the cache folder. Looking at the code itself or in any other location is a no-no.
Putting content into these folders however, in an attempt to modify how the game references these byproducts, is an exploit. As the goon thing of editing character portraits.
That's how I interpret it.
Obviously IMHO CCP have dug themselves this hole as people have been asking for overview/standing indications in the chat channels for months now.
dude, read my original post.
I sent the GM's a copy of the program and asked if it was legal. They said no, its against the EULA and if anyone claimed it was legal to quote the relevent section.
There are so many ways CCP could detect modified portrait caches.
When you enter a new local it would be easy to check a checksum on your portrait cache
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Zirator
Times of Ancar
R i s e
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Posted - 2006.08.14 13:39:00 -
[14]
Nice work K Shara, now we only need the devs to stealth implement a tool to check the use of this app in the next Kali update. 
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FireFoxx80
Caldari
E X O D U S
Imperial Republic Of the North
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Posted - 2006.08.14 13:41:00 -
[15]
Yeah I agree with you, putting content in to Eve seems to be a no-no.
However, if I wanted to look into the cache, take the portraits, and construct a tasteful collage for my wall, then that's fine.
This program seems to be putting content in to Eve.
Look at the old EveMap, JIDE Object Explorer, market data export (pre-RMR), tri-exporter, and a whole bunch of other things where people have taken content out of eve; all has been deemed within the EULA (albeit some with asking CCP).
Anyway, I am glad that it's against the EULA, it gave an alliance a significant tactical advantage over others. Doing a right-click>show info>standings everytime a new person enters local, makes the baby jesus cry.
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Gariuys
Evil Strangers Inc.
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Posted - 2006.08.14 13:43:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Zirator
Nice work K Shara, now we only need the devs to stealth implement a tool to check the use of this app in the next Kali update.
Bye bye goons... should have a name filter too any name not starting with Remie... should stay... 
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Eleis Machuron
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Posted - 2006.08.14 13:47:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Baldour Ngarr
What fun, having a member of the mining crew whose sole job is to click "scan" once every three seconds just in case a pirate wandered in.
Well, you *could* put alt pickets on the gates, and mine in 2-gate (or 1-gate!) systems. But I'm still not sure I like no local.
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Avon
Caldari
Black Nova Corp
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2006.08.14 13:48:00 -
[18]
Originally by: EULA
CONDUCT
A. Specifically Restricted Conduct
...
You may not use your own or third-party software to modify any content appearing within the Game environment or change how the Game is played.
That was pretty much pointed to as the answer to my question about this.
The Battleships is not and should not be a solo pwnmobile - Oveur
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Scorpyn
Caldari
Infinitus Odium
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Posted - 2006.08.14 14:12:00 -
[19]
Edited by: Scorpyn on 14/08/2006 14:13:58
Originally by: Sorja
Since local is to be removed in Kali, this is irrelevant
I doubt that. I'm pretty sure they will change it - especially in 0.0 - but a complete removal doesn't seem very likely imo.
On topic : I find it rather amazing that anyone would actually believe that this would be allowed. If that is how they fight their wars, then winning won't really mean anything.
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Jaketh Ivanes
Amarr
1st Praetorian Guard
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Posted - 2006.08.14 14:57:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Sorja
Since local is to be removed in Kali, this is irrelevant
Yes, remove local in 0.0, but also remove the feature on the map showing number of peeps in a system. Otherwise you will tell the pirates where the targets are, but not tell the targets where the pirates are.
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Adoro
Caldari
Reunited
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Posted - 2006.08.14 15:03:00 -
[21]
What is it anyway?
--------
"I'll trade you my sleipnir for your sleipnirs." |
Damien Smith
Turbulent
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Posted - 2006.08.14 15:44:00 -
[22]
Edited by: Damien Smith on 14/08/2006 15:50:46
Originally by: Malachon Draco
You mean:
- gankers will have login, scan through 10-15 belts in 2 mins before finding the ratters/miners, gank them, then logout again, while...
- miners and ratters will have to hit a scan button every 3 seconds for 4 hours in a row every time they rat or mine to be remotely safe, even though the reaction time to someone showing up on scanner is probably too short to actually escape.
Yes, great. Can't wait for such a 'balanced' change. Life for stabbabond ganksquads was already so terribly risky, it was just unfair.
Riiiiight...
For a start, that would be boring as hell. Why the hell would anyone play if it was that easy? Second of all, if this is true (which I very much doubt) then pirates would be just as much at risk of being hunted by antipirates as miners are by pirates.
Most importantly though, and the sole reason I'm all for it is: It will unnerf covert ops.
Let me elaborate a little. Combat gangs would have no idea where other combat gangs are, and would need competent covert pilots to locate and assess enemy combat groups. There wouldn't be this "omgz someone's in local, dock in case it's a covert" local hax warning system telling everyone how many people and who they are in local. There would actually be chance of using stealth and diversion as valid tactics in a fight. Ambushes will actually be possible, and the entire fight would be won or lost on the intel each group has on their enemy. A cloaked ship would truly be 'cloaked'.
That to me would be the greatest thing since sliced bread.
You're either a) A whiny carebear who's afraid of losing his favourite 'win button' intel device and is afraid to actually rely on people to patrol and recon your space without knowing the second someone enters local, or b) An equally as whiny blobber/gatecamp bubble maniac who doesn't like the idea that fast mobile strike teams can get in, hit, and get out without you knowing about it. Because to say that all pirates are going to pull lame crap like that is ridiculous. Some of us play for the exciting combat, not to farm noobs for isk.
No one can really say that nerfing local is a bad thing. Even something as simple as make it opt-in only, where you only show if you speak would do wonderful things for pvp as a whole.
-----------
Join channel 'Turby' or die! (bring pie)
Mission running carebears drop good loot. Probe one out today! |
John Munch
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Posted - 2006.08.14 15:53:00 -
[23]
Funny. I heard goons have a GM response that says the exact opposite.
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Wayback
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Posted - 2006.08.14 15:57:00 -
[24]
No one can really say that nerfing local is a bad thing. Even something as simple as make it opt-in only, where you only show if you speak would do wonderful things for me as a whole.
Fixed that up for ya
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K Shara
Caldari
Contraband Inc.
Mercenary Coalition
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Posted - 2006.08.14 15:58:00 -
[25]
The goon tool is a program that conects to an external server and downloads replacement portriats as stored in your portraits folder of your cache,
based upon a central DB. so all Contraband will show as a portrait with MC and conin. All Frick would be MC, frick etc
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EvilNate
Caldari
Beyond Divinity Inc
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Posted - 2006.08.14 16:01:00 -
[26]
Well, it doesn't change the code of client program, not does it export or import data.
--------
www.bydi.org |
Elve Sorrow
Amarr
Shinra
Lotka Volterra
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Posted - 2006.08.14 16:02:00 -
[27]
I'd rather they incorporated this 'mod' in their code tbh. It's damn usefull, and rather ironic they did not come up with it themselves.
Ofcourse, its technically against the EULA so banning its use is a good thing. Incorporate it in the client would be better.
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K Shara
Caldari
Contraband Inc.
Mercenary Coalition
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Posted - 2006.08.14 16:03:00 -
[28]
well the GM's say its a sploit so its a sploit
anyone using it is sploiting and shiuld be banned :)
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Avon
Caldari
Black Nova Corp
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2006.08.14 16:03:00 -
[29]
Originally by: EvilNate
Well, it doesn't change the code of client program, not does it export or import data.
Doesn't matter.
It changes the way the game appears, which is a EULA violation.
The Battleships is not and should not be a solo pwnmobile - Oveur
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Avon
Caldari
Black Nova Corp
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2006.08.14 16:04:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Elve Sorrow
I'd rather they incorporated this 'mod' in their code tbh. It's damn usefull, and rather ironic they did not come up with it themselves.
Ofcourse, its technically against the EULA so banning its use is a good thing. Incorporate it in the client would be better.
Local should not be considered an intel tool.
The intel gathering aspects of local need to be nerfed, not enhanced.
The Battleships is not and should not be a solo pwnmobile - Oveur
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