How do you propose any blanket nerf that doesnt wreck domis but keeps the ishtar balanced? Domis online is a vastly different deal from ishtars online.

I was under the impression structure bashing was most of the reason Ishtars are used so much.

Now, I think 25 km is the magic distance for keeping sentries at all. That's how far it is to a large stick from the edge of a forcefield.

Another inconsistency that bothers me is the sheer range of sentries combined with their DPS. I think sentries can use a change to not only their damage type, but also the profile of their guns.

Starting with Caldari, Wardens could mimic rails, and have exceptional range but very weak damage, around 1/3 the DPS of Gardes. They would be able to reach 75km, 40 DPS, slow tracking...

Gardes which mimic blaster DPS, and have range that is less than Large blasters, base stats. 7 or 8 km. 120 DPS, great tracking, no hope of reaching large towers through forcefields. Or medium towers, for that matter.

Bouncers with a range of 45km, high alpha and lower rate of fire, equal to rails... 40 DPS, OK tracking

Curators with a range of 50km, 60 DPS, slow tracking

So basically, even for the purpose of shooting structures, especially in the case of large towers, sentries become half as effective or worse, and tower owners don't have to worry about tanking omni anymore.

redundant thread, btw.

This thread is about drones not specific ships, they're separate but related issues.

They are hardly separate.

Sentry nerfs which leave ishtars balanced destroy domis, sentry nerfs which leave domis balanced result in overpowered ishtars.

Again the issue is not the drone but the hulls which have APPLICATION bonuses attached to them.

The issue IS the drone, sentrys are a do everything wonder weapon which consistently outperform medium and heavy drones in their own role, and I'm not just talking about ishtars and domis, sentrys are the preferred drones of carriers and supercarriers as well.

The issue IS the drone, sentrys are a do everything wonder weapon which consistently outperform medium and heavy drones in their own role, and I'm not just talking about ishtars and domis, sentrys are the preferred drones of carriers and supercarriers as well.

snip

.....maybe it's because they couldnt hit the floor if they fell on it.

Someone will say hey shut up the only thing is good against ishtar is only an ishtar. Ok then switch your brains on and propise a new weapon new ship or whatever is.

Because not a single entity has been trying to do this. It is pure coincidence they all arrive at the same conclusion:

A) BLOB IT!
or
B) Just give in and use ishtars.


Sometimes people come up with novel ideas to kill ishtar fleets and you know what? They'd probably even work sometimes. Of course what they forget is it requires so many damned people it would be easier and more expedient at that point to kill them with....other ishtars. It's literally a poster child for broken when the counters are as stated above.


@Wulfy Johnson Drones already cap out at 60km before needing mods to get range....except on the go-to hull for fleet ops, the ishtar, which gets a free DLA II. Go figure.

So its not that the counter didn't work, but it involved working with other players.

Where did I see that Eve is a social game where you are suppose to work with other players........

I guess with your logic CCP should disband all the big coalitions and corps because if you wanted to beat them you would have to work with others....many others.

i was posting this idea as a joke but honestly if implemented correctly it could word.

change the sentry drones so the dont act anymore as deployable turrets but more like missile launchers, keep the same dps as current sentries but different sentries have different ranges (via missile speed not flight time) and different application values.
if made properly this would reduce their usefulness as an anti-everything tool.

Ur talking about fighter bombers, right?

So its not that the counter didn't work, but it involved working with other players.

Where did I see that Eve is a social game where you are suppose to work with other players........

I guess with your logic CCP should disband all the big coalitions and corps because if you wanted to beat them you would have to work with others....many others.

This change would literally ruin all drone boats, remember when the domi was 68 mil because it was crap? Sentry drones haven't changed since then you know.

Sentries are BS sized weapons so to speak, so should have large sized weapon tracking and sig res.
The issue currently is that they have medium sized weapon properties with large sized range & damage.
Change that and Ishtars might still be popular but won't be as crazy against all fleets.

We used to blob Armageddons
They got nerfed

We use to blob Raven
They got nerfed

We used to blob Drakes, Canes, Abaddons, Supers, Titans, Noob ships.

They got nerfed.

What didn't get nerfed?
BLOBS

Nerf Sentry, Nerf Ishtar. Welcome to next in line for most effective Blob.

That is not to say we shouldn't assemble large fleets. We should. But there should be 50 targets minimum in a 250 man fleet.

It can be done. It starts at the Corporation level and a need to force us to dedicate to a Corporation identity. You want to be a military Corp? Mark your corp as a military Corp. You want to be a pirate corp? Mark your Corp as a pirate corp. Industrial, Research, Logistics, all will have base starters for standings of others. All will have different barriers in how you interact with the population.

Once this is established, a throttle can be placed on locking people in combat. You can define hostile and logistic, you can then set up a system where more than 5 hostiles locking an enemy produce Sig Rad penalties, create fleet battles where multiple engagements at once and it creates large scale battle systems rather than a whole bunch of recycled blapping.

Once Fleet becomes more than blob, fleet is epic. With the everyone gonk 1-125 it voids all things EVE. Who cares about ship choice, fit, skill points or anything else when 100 people are locking me? I will pop. End of story.

the nerf sledge hammer fails. It has failed for 12 years.

We used to blob Armageddons
They got nerfed

We use to blob Raven
They got nerfed

We used to blob Drakes, Canes, Abaddons, Supers, Titans, Noob ships.

They got nerfed.

What didn't get nerfed?
BLOBS

Nerf Sentry, Nerf Ishtar. Welcome to next in line for most effective Blob.

That is not to say we shouldn't assemble large fleets. We should. But there should be 50 targets minimum in a 250 man fleet.

It can be done. It starts at the Corporation level and a need to force us to dedicate to a Corporation identity. You want to be a military Corp? Mark your corp as a military Corp. You want to be a pirate corp? Mark your Corp as a pirate corp. Industrial, Research, Logistics, all will have base starters for standings of others. All will have different barriers in how you interact with the population.

Once this is established, a throttle can be placed on locking people in combat. You can define hostile and logistic, you can then set up a system where more than 5 hostiles locking an enemy produce Sig Rad penalties, create fleet battles where multiple engagements at once and it creates large scale battle systems rather than a whole bunch of recycled blapping.

Once Fleet becomes more than blob, fleet is epic. With the everyone gonk 1-125 it voids all things EVE. Who cares about ship choice, fit, skill points or anything else when 100 people are locking me? I will pop. End of story.

the nerf sledge hammer fails. It has failed for 12 years.

you know i love how the ishtar is getting exactly the same arguments that everything else has ever had throughout all of time when it's been overpowered. there is a simple counter to it and tha'ts just ignoring them they can't really hurt you unless you let them (anything that fights out side of point range is very easy to counter).

This guy has it right. The problem with EVE is its too dumbed down. Jump in a blob F1 then chest beat on forums that you have "friends". EVE should be like spacefights in the movies with multiple mini battles going on simultaneously within one large scale battle. If CCP perfects this and fixes the blob guarantee you will see players coming to the game in droves to participate in epic large scale fights where they did something other than listen to 1 guy call targets and get instapopped when locked.

Ask most people why they leave the game, I would be willing to guess blobbing is the number one reason. Ask some of the more intelligent players why they find null sec a bore, because their creativity and ingenuity is meaningless in a blob, which null sec always is 95% of the time. All the modules and beautiful different tactics available in this game and it always boils down to some cookie cutter fit that can be put into a blob and dumbed down for the masses.

Who told you that sentries are bs size?!
Where the hell is that written?!

In this case heavies are also bs size and we should stop to use them on cruisers and battlecruisers.

It was 68 mil because it was 65 mil to build.