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why do players stay in npc corps?

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Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13344	Posted - 2015.06.08 18:39:25 - [1471] - Quote March rabbit wrote: Kaarous Aldurald wrote: We are what makes EVE harsh. (takes notes) Hm.... that's interesting... So to change nature of the game to something more popular and interesting CCP only needs to ban some people.... Is this another of your "Flat Earth" theories? "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13344	Posted - 2015.06.08 18:40:56 - [1472] - Quote xxxTRUSTxxx wrote: but to be blown up over and over doesn't directly correlate to their likelihood of unsubscribing from the game? Nope. It's time for you carebears to conjure up a new bullshit narrative. That one's worn out. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Ivant Sumboodi Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 8	Posted - 2015.06.08 18:45:22 - [1473] - Quote The fact is that you're pissing in a smaller and smaller pool, and either you don't realize that or you don't care. That is why you are basically a cockroach.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13344	Posted - 2015.06.08 18:46:57 - [1474] - Quote Ivant Sumboodi wrote: The fact is that you're pissing in a smaller and smaller pool, and either you don't realize that or you don't care. That is why you are basically a cockroach. Tell me how you really feel. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Frostys Virpio KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation 1868	Posted - 2015.06.08 18:57:57 - [1475] - Quote Kaarous Aldurald wrote: Ivant Sumboodi wrote: Honestly dude I dont care what you think, or what definitions you feel are so important to use. Your entity is a scourge to the game bottom line. Except that we're not. In fact, by all indications, we're a distinct and noticeable positive, whether you like it or not. Getting ganked was litterally "the 1%" in the chart. Interaction is what CCP need to direct it's noob toward. Ganking can work but it's not a big driver. You could even be a statistical anomaly with data like that. Please remember that when making sweeping statement about how you are a distinct positive to the bottom line. Your only proven positive positive as of right now is paying your sub one way or another.
xxxTRUSTxxx Galactic Rangers 269	Posted - 2015.06.08 19:05:53 - [1476] - Quote Kaarous Aldurald wrote: xxxTRUSTxxx wrote: but to be blown up over and over doesn't directly correlate to their likelihood of unsubscribing from the game? Nope. It's time for you carebears to conjure up a new bullshit narrative. That one's worn out. LOL the silly CODE role player thinks i'm a carebear hahahahahaha. thanks for the link. i stand corrected.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13347	Posted - 2015.06.08 19:07:31 - [1477] - Quote xxxTRUSTxxx wrote: Kaarous Aldurald wrote: xxxTRUSTxxx wrote: but to be blown up over and over doesn't directly correlate to their likelihood of unsubscribing from the game? Nope. It's time for you carebears to conjure up a new bullshit narrative. That one's worn out. LOL the silly CODE role player thinks i'm a carebear hahahahahaha. thanks for the link. i stand corrected. Carebear is a state of mind, my friend. The point stands regardless. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
xxxTRUSTxxx Galactic Rangers 270	Posted - 2015.06.08 19:13:47 - [1478] - Quote Kaarous Aldurald wrote: xxxTRUSTxxx wrote: Kaarous Aldurald wrote: xxxTRUSTxxx wrote: but to be blown up over and over doesn't directly correlate to their likelihood of unsubscribing from the game? Nope. It's time for you carebears to conjure up a new bullshit narrative. That one's worn out. LOL the silly CODE role player thinks i'm a carebear hahahahahaha. thanks for the link. i stand corrected. Carebear is a state of mind, my friend. The point stands regardless. well you tell me so,, what's a carebear ? and yes the points stands, care to share your feelings on that once more. go on,,, you guys love patting yourselves on the back
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13347	Posted - 2015.06.08 19:15:10 - [1479] - Quote xxxTRUSTxxx wrote: and yes the points stands, care to share your feelings on that once more. Certainly. Counter to the assertions of some, including in this thread, ganking in general does not cost subs. And that's the end of it. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
xxxTRUSTxxx Galactic Rangers 270	Posted - 2015.06.08 19:23:57 - [1480] - Quote Kaarous Aldurald wrote: xxxTRUSTxxx wrote: and yes the points stands, care to share your feelings on that once more. Certainly. Counter to the assertions of some, including in this thread, ganking in general does not cost subs. And that's the end of it. to say it costs none is a lie and you know it. so you're not willing to go into what you think a carebear is? i wonder why

Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13347	Posted - 2015.06.08 19:25:32 - [1481] - Quote xxxTRUSTxxx wrote: to say it costs none is a lie and you know it. Net, obviously. And as before, regarding new players, as per the link I provided. Quote: so you're not willing to go into what you think a carebear is? i wonder why A carebear is someone who opposes the existence of non consensual PvP. Typically, they do so out of selfishness as they would stand to benefit from the removal of such. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Vimsy Vortis Shoulda Checked Local Break-A-Wish Foundation 2481	Posted - 2015.06.08 19:26:10 - [1482] - Quote The existence of ganking also creates subs.
Ivant Sumboodi Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 8	Posted - 2015.06.08 19:35:08 - [1483] - Quote Ruminating on "carebears" ls literally 10 yrs ago tech. look at the population right now and be a real person.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13350	Posted - 2015.06.08 19:36:15 - [1484] - Quote Ivant Sumboodi wrote: Ruminating on "carebears" ls literally 10 yrs ago tech. look at the population right now and be a real person. You mean the population that goes lower and lower, while highsec gets safer and safer? "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Ivant Sumboodi Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 9	Posted - 2015.06.08 19:38:17 - [1485] - Quote The population that is smaller, and safer in nullsec and all have incursion hisec alts.
Frostys Virpio KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation 1870	Posted - 2015.06.08 19:40:46 - [1486] - Quote Kaarous Aldurald wrote: Ivant Sumboodi wrote: Ruminating on "carebears" ls literally 10 yrs ago tech. look at the population right now and be a real person. You mean the population that goes lower and lower, while highsec gets safer and safer? Did CCP map where those player no longer logging in were from/were doing in game before vanishing?
xxxTRUSTxxx Galactic Rangers 270	Posted - 2015.06.08 19:41:02 - [1487] - Quote Kaarous Aldurald wrote: A carebear is someone who opposes the existence of non consensual PvP. Typically, they do so out of selfishness as they would stand to benefit from the removal of such. your idea of a carebear is a strange one. there is no such thing as non consensual PVP in EVE, you undock your open to being shot at regardless of what space you're in. only the very new players don't fully get this. by that logic a carebear is a newb. that's not a carebear try again.
Frostys Virpio KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation 1870	Posted - 2015.06.08 19:43:30 - [1488] - Quote xxxTRUSTxxx wrote: Kaarous Aldurald wrote: A carebear is someone who opposes the existence of non consensual PvP. Typically, they do so out of selfishness as they would stand to benefit from the removal of such. your idea of a carebear is a strange one. there is no such thing as non consensual PVP in EVE, you undock your open to being shot at regardless of what space you're in. only the very new players don't fully get this. by that logic a carebear is a newb. that's not a carebear try again. Actually, a lot of people never get this. It's one of the issue with this game.
Vimsy Vortis Shoulda Checked Local Break-A-Wish Foundation 2483	Posted - 2015.06.08 19:46:01 - [1489] - Quote A carebear then is someone who doesn't acknowledge that by undocking they are consenting to PVP.
Jenn aSide Smokin Aces. 11285	Posted - 2015.06.08 19:46:28 - [1490] - Quote Kaarous Aldurald wrote: Ivant Sumboodi wrote: Ruminating on "carebears" ls literally 10 yrs ago tech. look at the population right now and be a real person. You mean the population that goes lower and lower, while highsec gets safer and safer? But dag nabbit, that should work the other way around. What should happen is that CCPs buffs to safety in EVE should have meant more 'new players' didn't get griefed out of the game but 'bad people', resulting in higher revenue for CCP, resulting further in more 'stuff' for all of us because obviously a company making more money means that company gives customers it already has more stuff...just like how cell phone and cable companies always give existing customers the same deals they do new customers!! I mean, it can't be possible that CCP made the game safer, making it boring for people who don't need to be cuddled and protected while not enticing more 'carebears' to come play. It's almost as if all the safety buffing DEVALUED the experience for the 'good guy' players (previously, surviving in EVE was a point of pride, now safeties and pop ups do all the work for you, yay) while enraging the 'bad guy' players enough to make them adapt and keep on being bad. That simply cannot be, it's almost like things work the opposite of what people expect, with up being down and gankers being player retention agents! CCP must have not done it right. Perhaps the answer is even more safety! Yea, that will do it, if CCP will just keep digging that hole deeper, it will work and thousands of new players will join and sub and we'll get the 'better stuff' we've been waiting for for years. It has to work! hashtag screw your sarcasm meters

xxxTRUSTxxx Galactic Rangers 270	Posted - 2015.06.08 19:48:09 - [1491] - Quote Frostys Virpio wrote: xxxTRUSTxxx wrote: Kaarous Aldurald wrote: A carebear is someone who opposes the existence of non consensual PvP. Typically, they do so out of selfishness as they would stand to benefit from the removal of such. your idea of a carebear is a strange one. there is no such thing as non consensual PVP in EVE, you undock your open to being shot at regardless of what space you're in. only the very new players don't fully get this. by that logic a carebear is a newb. that's not a carebear try again. Actually, a lot of people never get this. It's one of the issue with this game. ah now come on,, not a lot,, i'd say a few who are lucky enough to have not been shot at or just don't notice what's going on in local. i'd think most after 6 months know well they can be shot at no matter where they are. i've met a few over the years that didn't get it. but most know better after a while.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13353	Posted - 2015.06.08 19:49:47 - [1492] - Quote Vimsy Vortis wrote: A carebear then is someone who doesn't acknowledge that by undocking they are consenting to PVP. Someone gets the point. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Teckos Pech The Executives Executive Outcomes 2984	Posted - 2015.06.08 19:50:37 - [1493] - Quote Kaarous Aldurald wrote: Except that, per CCP themselves, doing it just for lulz increases net retention of new players. Those involved in PvP combat are an order of magnitude more likely to resub. Kaarous, I think there might be a bit of an endogeneity problem here. For example if you are using some sort of logistic regression model to look at this you might have a model like this: R = a + b*(PvP) Where R is your probability of re-subbing (and in your data it is either a 0 or a 1) and PvP is also dichotomous (0 for no PvP, 1 for PvP). In this case noting that people who are more likely to resub their account because they PvP are people who like to PvP or to put it differently they came to Eve to PvP. The plentiful opportunities means they have a higher probability to stick around. People who don't like PvP, but try out Eve...yeah, they'll likely leave. So, should the game be changed for those who don't like PvP to try and keep them subscribed? And is there something to discuss about people who want to PvP, but find the NPE insufficient for them to run up Eve's rather steep learning curve? Personally, I don't want to change the game to keep non-PvP oriented players in game. The edge case PvP players...yeah I think one could make an argument there for some changes. Lastly, trying to get those not interested in PvP to PvP to try increase subscriber retention probably wont work. So forget about that case altogether. What do you think? Upgrading Local to Eliminate All AFK Influence So Local Chat vanished, now what?
Teckos Pech The Executives Executive Outcomes 2984	Posted - 2015.06.08 19:50:52 - [1494] - Quote Vimsy Vortis wrote: The existence of ganking also creates subs. Was just thinking this. Yeah, a guy who dislikes PvP gets ganked...sure he might quit. But could that ganking also lead to 1 or more new subs? If so, then a larger view of things needs to be considered. Upgrading Local to Eliminate All AFK Influence So Local Chat vanished, now what?
Ivant Sumboodi Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 9	Posted - 2015.06.08 19:53:00 - [1495] - Quote it's not about making HS safer necessarily, but not making some HS careers so so so much better than all of Industry combined. And having CODE nolifes convinced that they have better things to do. This fixes EVE completely.
Teckos Pech The Executives Executive Outcomes 2984	Posted - 2015.06.08 19:53:22 - [1496] - Quote xxxTRUSTxxx wrote: Kaarous Aldurald wrote: A carebear is someone who opposes the existence of non consensual PvP. Typically, they do so out of selfishness as they would stand to benefit from the removal of such. your idea of a carebear is a strange one. there is no such thing as non consensual PVP in EVE, you undock your open to being shot at regardless of what space you're in. only the very new players don't fully get this. by that logic a carebear is a newb. that's not a carebear try again. I can be both against non-consensual PvP (note, I am not) and still undock my ship. You can argue that undocking means you are giving implicit acceptance to non-consensual PvP, but I can still oppose it. Upgrading Local to Eliminate All AFK Influence So Local Chat vanished, now what?
Ivant Sumboodi Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 9	Posted - 2015.06.08 20:01:40 - [1497] - Quote "Opposing non-consensual pvp" os OP in this thread. You can have anytime-PVP while balancing the risk and rewards. CODE are just cockroaches feeding on a literally dying Industry mechanic. Incursions are an imba hi-sec money faucet. These are both facts at the same time.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13354	Posted - 2015.06.08 20:02:47 - [1498] - Quote Teckos Pech wrote: snip What do you think? "should the game be changed for those who don't like PvP to try and keep them subscribed?" No. PvP is the founding pillar upon which EVE Online is based. They're welcome to their playstyle as much as anyone else, but never it they want to claim that their playstyle is "I shouldn't have to defend myself". Furthermore, as CCP has demonstrated for us with the Burner rats content, any PvE that CCP devises can be math hammered out and made trivial in far, far less time than it took a CCP employee to generate that content. New PvE content that is not fundamentally dynamic therefore, becomes a waste of effort, as it is trivialized entirely too quickly. Heck, these new multiplayer Drifter dungeons they have devised? They had to keep them a secret until launch, or people would have min maxed their way through that one too. As for, as you put them, "The edge case PvP players", I believe that there are more of them in the game than meets the eye. I don't think that everyone who mines or runs missions is a hopeless, iredeemable carebear. I think the NPE wrongly pushes players in that direction and ONLY in that direction, and that player conflict being so handcuffed in highsec is strongly contributing to that. Consequently, I assign that as a large contributing factor as to why people unsub from boredom of chewing rocks. I hear time and again from miners and missioners that they "like" things the way they are, that they find such content "fun". Clearly, not all of them do, or they wouldn't be quitting in such numbers. Perhaps it's the very people who claim that they enjoy banality that are keeping this game from being improved for everyone else? In summary, I believe that a PvE centric approach for the NPE, and highsec, is a proven failure. And I believe that CCP can't ignore that for too much longer, so the sacred cows of Concord, NPC corps and Incursions will find themselves approaching the guillotine. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
xxxTRUSTxxx Galactic Rangers 270	Posted - 2015.06.08 20:03:32 - [1499] - Quote Kaarous Aldurald wrote: Vimsy Vortis wrote: A carebear then is someone who doesn't acknowledge that by undocking they are consenting to PVP. Someone gets the point. so a carebear is someone who doesn't understand the mechanics of PVP in EVE ? or doesn't want too ? 2 totally different player types,,, both equally easy targets.
Scipio Artelius The Vendunari End of Life 37890	Posted - 2015.06.08 20:06:14 - [1500] - Quote xxxTRUSTxxx wrote: i'd think most after 6 months know well they can be shot at no matter where they are. i've met a few over the years that didn't get it. but most know better after a while. Many that know, still oppose the idea. They rage when they get shot at, they come and complain in the forum how pvp in highsec should be made harder (eg. -10s not allowed in highsec, high slot modules shouldn't work in highsec, non-consensual pvp should be removed from highsec because it's meant to be safe, etc) and they post ideas in the F&I forum designed to make themself safer while eliminating other people's play. They constantly call for nerfs to pvp and complain how pvp affect player retention without even attempting to understand whether that is true or not, just because they don't like it. Come Win At Eve - Join The Vendunari



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