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Please make Tobias Warp Disruptor a T1 BPO

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xlop Gallente	Posted - 2006.10.05 17:05:00 - [31] indeed 40km BS scramblers would be very nice. but at 4k grid almost no ship bar the tempest will be able to fit it idea i like, current stas nop -- Imperial College London FTW --
Complacency's Bane Caldari	Posted - 2006.10.05 17:17:00 - [32] I actually like the idea of midrange, and only midranged scramblers. Someone else in the thread mentioned that - battleship class scramblers which only work from 20-40k. Any closer and theyre just non-functional.
Nyxus GALAXIAN Rule of Three	Posted - 2006.10.05 17:17:00 - [33] Originally by: xlop indeed 40km BS scramblers would be very nice. but at 4k grid almost no ship bar the tempest will be able to fit it idea i like, current stas nop Agree that 4k grid is a bit much. Tobias does have a -2 to scramble strength though. 2k MW for a 40km, -1 scram is more reasonable for all ships. It would be the equivalent to fitting another large armor rep to your ship, which is pretty hard for any racial BS to do. Still limits it to BS as well. And while I personally agree with many that the whole scramble system could use some work, tbh I am not willing to wait that long. Tobias Disruptor is already ingame, has been for a VERY long time and it would be an easy adjustment for CCP to make. Thats why I suggested it. Please keep the thread on track discussing Tobias Dis or the proposed 2000 MW, 40km, -1 scram pros and cons. If you want to completely rework the system you should start another thread and we can hash it out there. Thanks! Nyxus Originally by: Tux The thought of a missile spewing armor tanking cool black looking ship makes me happy in the pants
ARMARINE	Posted - 2006.10.05 18:20:00 - [34] i say no to the sized warp scrammers. i think it would pull away from the required teamwork of taking down large targets. just my 2 cents not trying to start any flaming or make some one mad.
Izo Azlion Veto.	Posted - 2006.10.05 18:25:00 - [35] Originally by: Ithildin Warp jamming range need a general boost across the board. Strength 2 scramblers need to define short range (20km) Strength 1 scramblers need to define mid range (50-ish km) Could boost powergrid need of strength 1 scramblers to around 40 so that frigates can't too easily use them, considering that missile frigates with 30km scramblers are already too effective. I do think that it's time to bring scrambling out to nearly reach snipers at best. So what about retreating blaster boats? If we're not already webbed, its sometimes a struggle to make the 20km needed to warp out, if you've made the call early enough to get out in the first place. Bad idea, maybe a few KM more, but not 20km 2 points and 50km 1 point... Warp into a belt and instantly scramble? Boo. Izo Azlion. ---
Randay 0utbreak	Posted - 2006.10.05 18:42:00 - [36] Randay's modified Parellel Weapons Navagation Array Generation Extron cpu: 1 powergrid: 1 activation cost : 1 duration: 10 years range: 250 km scramble strength: 11,000,000,000 - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Originally by: Reddari Now just be nice before I start to make life for the BOB devs (yes you have some) harder by exposing their player characters.
Dahak2150	Posted - 2006.10.05 20:13:00 - [37] It would really be nice for those ships that mount "mid-range weapons" to be able to actually use that mid-range power, without having to pay out the ass for an uninsurable part of the ship that will cost many times the ship itself. ---------- My sig is boring.
Emperor D'Hoffryn No Quarter. Axiom Empire	Posted - 2006.10.05 20:25:00 - [38] the reason blaster boat is king in many 1vs1 situations is that, especially with large blasters and tech2 ammo, the blaster boat can do almost full damage out to 20km. A mid range BS, like say a geddon, or an AC tempest, cannot compete because they have to come into 20km to hold the mega, and are less likely to have a MWD anyway. Biggest problem with this situation tho is the EVE is NOT balanced with 1vs1s in mind. Still, a BS fitted scram that only works on BS size targets would be an interesting addition to the game. That way a geddon, if it has a MWD fitted and can keep range, can do more than force a Mega to warp out. If no MWD, Mega can still close range and likely win, and in either case, if Mega warps in and lands about 20km or less from geddon, geddon loses more often then not. At least give mid range BSes a tactic that they can use if they are setup properly and take proper precautions (sitting at warp in point ftl) Originally by: Tuxford Yes we don't play on our main accounts simply because you would lose all respect for us
Dixon Caldari	Posted - 2006.10.05 20:46:00 - [39] Originally by: Randay Randay's modified Parellel Weapons Navagation Array Generation Extron cpu: 1 powergrid: 1 activation cost : 1 duration: 10 years range: 250 km scramble strength: 11,000,000,000 I had one of those... trashed it when I couldn't scram Ginger Magician with it. BTW: I agree with the smart people who want to have more scram range - - - - - - I have no strong feelings one way or the other...
Nifel Caldari Reikoku Band of Brothers	Posted - 2006.10.06 03:00:00 - [40] Or maybe it's T2 ammo that's broken? Barrage S doing as much raw damage as EMP S? So broken... etc "When I die I want to die peacefully in my sleep like my grandpa. Not yelling and screaming like the passengers in his car." RKK Ranking: (MIN14)

Shanid	Posted - 2006.10.06 04:06:00 - [41] LOL!!! hmm bs with 50km scram...hey how about this...lets just take intys/frig out of the game and make the bs the ONE ship...
Aeaus Tharsis Security	Posted - 2006.10.06 04:30:00 - [42] You know, Amarr do have the lowest starting intelligence... Join Tharsis! - Get Sexy Sigs
Wild Rho Amarr PIE Inc.	Posted - 2006.10.06 07:34:00 - [43] Edited by: Wild Rho on 06/10/2006 07:36:38 Originally by: Nyxus Originally by: Wild Rho Dislike the idea in general as it promotes the "bigger is better" ideal and severely reduces the role of tacklers in a group. How so? Battleships really lock too slowly to take the place of tacklers in a camping situation, and the short scramrange we have now disallows for any range advantage in short range fights. I guess I don't understand how this promotes "bigger is better"? Nyxus It's far from uncommon for battleships to run multiple sensor boosters during a gate camp giving them near insta locking abilities on anything larger than a frigate. With this ability to warp scramble for 2 points at a longer range the battleship will replace the frigate in it's tackling role except in a few specific circumstances. While the battleship may certainly not be as agile as a frigate it has the benefits of... - More mid slots meaning more points. - More points at double the range. - Much greater durability and room for specialised setups (from having more slots to work with). - The ability to tackle with a large number of points outside of Nos and standard webbing range. - Harder to target jam and with the room to fit ECCM to further reduce target jamming abilities. Overall it has too many advantages and far fewer risks associated with normal tackling work to keep it balanced and while it doesn't remove the frigates niche role it heavily reduces it. Again promoting the "bigger is better" mentality. EDIT: Personally I think the overall scrambling ranges are good. They each have the risks/costs and benefits that force you to make some careful choices and to use your brain. The only real problem is the overly common use of warp core stabs on combat setups these days, but that issue is getting addressed least I heard so it comes down to being patient and seeing what happens. I have the body of a supermodel. I just can't remember where I left it.
JoCool Caldari Infinitus Odium	Posted - 2006.10.06 09:41:00 - [44] I have a Tobias Warp Disruptor. It is quite hard to fit and, unless alone, not worth fitting, especially in Caldari ships it is quite hard to use - you need to sacrifice your Heavy Nosferatus for it. The item looks balanced. So many times I have thought about how much better PVP was if this was a t1 item (even if at -1 scramble strength). A battleship using one of these items faces some serious fitting troubles and a lot of capacitor abuse, which make your ship weaker than pilots not using these disruptors. CCP, you might want to consider to do it. _______________________________________________________________________ Trey Azagthoth > Youre my idol Jocool. I wanna be like Jocool jr. or Jocool the sequel! Oveur > ohnoes jocool
Sandra Tseng THE MISPHIT'S	Posted - 2006.10.06 09:44:00 - [45] Get a friend in a tackler gawd damnet. it is a MULTIPLAYER GAME and no ship should be the SOLOPWNMOBILE'O'DOOM _ Killed my sig AGAIN! :p http://www.ninc.org/krubarax/images/2d/verydisco.jpg
Christopher Multsanti Euphoria Released Euphoria Unleashed	Posted - 2006.10.06 10:08:00 - [46] This is definately a good idea in principle but lots of things need to be taken into consideration if you are going to increase the range of scrams and disruptors. Although the main point that should be considered, is that a lot of people already fit stabs to there ships, if this change were to happen you would see a big increase in stab usage and also maybe a lot more people unwilling to fight in a situation where they feel they cannot warp out. Originally by: Bob Pilot I couldn't careless if BoB pilots log in belts
madaluap Gallente Mercenary Forces	Posted - 2006.10.06 10:09:00 - [47] Originally by: Sandra Tseng Get a friend in a tackler gawd damnet. it is a MULTIPLAYER GAME and no ship should be the SOLOPWNMOBILE'O'DOOM _ This isnt about solopwning, its about giving the bs the option to use falloff and optimal of there guns. Infact as gallente i couldnt care less. But for other races a AC temp with barrage can hit fine around 20-30ish k, but it cant freacking scramble there. So you say well bring a bring to do the scrambling. Well what if that other bs also brings a friend to scramble and rapes your inty tackling friend. Not everyone wants to gank peeps in eve, small gangs vs small gangs or even 1 vs 1 still exists. _________________________________________________
Ithildin Gallente The Corporation	Posted - 2006.10.06 10:13:00 - [48] Originally by: Izo Azlion Originally by: Ithildin Warp jamming range need a general boost across the board. Strength 2 scramblers need to define short range (20km) Strength 1 scramblers need to define mid range (50-ish km) Could boost powergrid need of strength 1 scramblers to around 40 so that frigates can't too easily use them, considering that missile frigates with 30km scramblers are already too effective. I do think that it's time to bring scrambling out to nearly reach snipers at best. So what about retreating blaster boats? If we're not already webbed, its sometimes a struggle to make the 20km needed to warp out, if you've made the call early enough to get out in the first place. Bad idea, maybe a few KM more, but not 20km 2 points and 50km 1 point... Warp into a belt and instantly scramble? Boo. It goes hand-in-hand with the need to have significantly increased combat times. For example, currently it is hard to travel 20km before blowing up. In the future, it should be equally hard to travel 50km before blowing up. Well... as long as you aren't doing something suicidally silly such as trying to attack a fleet on your own. Then you deserve to die in 3 red ones. - Three years old
Ithildin Gallente The Corporation	Posted - 2006.10.06 10:18:00 - [49] Originally by: Sandra Tseng Get a friend in a tackler gawd damnet. it is a MULTIPLAYER GAME and no ship should be the SOLOPWNMOBILE'O'DOOM _ 1. It's hard getting more than one tackler on a ship before it warps. 2. The more people you are, the more likely it is that the target will warp before he see your ships. 3. Solo pwn mobiles only happen because people operate solo without coordination. Or if a game mechanic is broken coughecm to allow a ship to attack several at the same time. So - the targets get pwned by one player because the target was a single player. It's a multiplayer game, get some backup to protect you. - Three years old
Aramendel Amarr Queens of the Stone Age Chimaera Pact	Posted - 2006.10.06 11:10:00 - [50] 40 km might be a bit too much, 30 km for 1000 grid seems nice to me, though. And it doesn't only effects 2 ships - it's a problem for the whole shortrange BS lvl. The advantage of ACs and pulses over blasters is range. 20k disruptors make an artifical border which negates the range advantage of these weapons.

Sandra Tseng THE MISPHIT'S	Posted - 2006.10.06 11:22:00 - [51] If you want to engage at scram range, then fit yours hip according to the range of scrammers. You know they operate at max 20km, so either fit your ship along theese lines (lower tier guns, short range ammo, tracking enchancers/computers) or get a faction scrammer. You think a Sniper Rokh will get a 200km scrammer to match the range of its 425mm Railguns? _ Killed my sig AGAIN! :p http://www.ninc.org/krubarax/images/2d/verydisco.jpg
Testy Mctest	Posted - 2006.10.06 11:24:00 - [52] This could be an idea for T2 scrams - improved range scrams with appropriate frig, cruiser, and BS sized fittings? Scrapheap Challenge Forums - All the cool kids are doing it!
Aramendel Amarr Queens of the Stone Age Chimaera Pact	Posted - 2006.10.06 12:55:00 - [53] Originally by: Sandra Tseng If you want to engage at scram range, then fit yours hip according to the range of scrammers. You know they operate at max 20km, so either fit your ship along theese lines (lower tier guns, short range ammo, tracking enchancers/computers) or get a faction scrammer. You think a Sniper Rokh will get a 200km scrammer to match the range of its 425mm Railguns? _ Sniper range != shortrange guns The point you still miss is that minnie and amarr ships CANNOT fit their ships along this lines. Because up to 20km blasters are the most effective weapon. It is not about tracking, it is about damage - BS sized blasters with null outdamage any pulse or AC setup up to 20ish km. If you want to beat a blasterthron with an AC or pulse setup the only feasible way is to stay in the 20-30 km range. The 20k disruptor is fine for the cruiser lvl, a good rupture pilot can beat a throax by outranging him. On the BS lvl this is not possible because in order to outrange a blastership there you have to fly outside the disruptorrange.
Sandra Tseng THE MISPHIT'S	Posted - 2006.10.06 13:04:00 - [54] A Tracking disruptor halves the Blasterships effective range..... _ Killed my sig AGAIN! :p http://www.ninc.org/krubarax/images/2d/verydisco.jpg
Kojiami	Posted - 2006.10.06 13:11:00 - [55] Remove scrambling whatsoever, scrambling is for morons, and it shouldn't be used, period.
inSpirAcy The Solopwnmobiles	Posted - 2006.10.06 13:22:00 - [56] Originally by: Sandra Tseng A Tracking disruptor halves the Blasterships effective range..... It equally reduces yours, and has a greater effect on ships relying on optimal range than falloff (read: Amarr). I love these arguments about bring a tackler friend. So my Geddon vs Megathron becomes Geddon + tackler versus two Megathrons. Riiiiight... (sure, there's an upscaling argument but it sure doesn't hold in 1v1, 2v2 or probably 3v3 either)
Black Napallm adeptus gattacus Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.10.06 13:24:00 - [57] You want a T1 Bpo for a T3 module?
Sandra Tseng THE MISPHIT'S	Posted - 2006.10.06 13:24:00 - [58] A Tracking Disruptor does NOT affect your own ship in anyway. Just as a remote sensor damper does not damp your own sensors. a webifier does nto web your own ship, a scrammer does not scram your own ship and an ECm does not jam your own ship... Dunno where you got that from? _ Killed my sig AGAIN! :p http://www.ninc.org/krubarax/images/2d/verydisco.jpg
inSpirAcy The Solopwnmobiles	Posted - 2006.10.06 13:29:00 - [59] Originally by: Sandra Tseng A Tracking Disruptor does NOT affect your own ship in anyway. Just as a remote sensor damper does not damp your own sensors. a webifier does nto web your own ship, a scrammer does not scram your own ship and an ECm does not jam your own ship... Perhaps my attempt to keep the comment short and sharp obscured its meaning. If you can fit a tracking disruptor, so can a Megathron. And his will be more effective than yours (it affects only optimal, not falloff) if you're Amarrian, one of the two races that needs to fight outside disrupt range.
Aramendel Amarr Queens of the Stone Age Chimaera Pact	Posted - 2006.10.06 13:30:00 - [60] Originally by: Sandra Tseng A Tracking disruptor halves the Blasterships effective range..... Since it does nothing to falloff it doesn't - effeciently it reduces it by about 20%. And amarr BSs and the typhoon do not have the spare med slots to use one in the first place. A pest can, but would then have to dance between 16-20 km which is with 2 unwebbed MWD BSs somewhat tricky, to say the least. But even if it is a feasible solution, thats still 1 out of 4 ships...



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