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Cupdeez Vengeance of the Fallen Imperium Alliance	Posted - 2006.10.19 20:56:00 - [541] You my friend have to much time on your hands.. Type and read all this stuff.. and spie on the ASCN forums... just wow. http://img79.imageshack.us/img79/5624/cupfinalcopyiw0.jpg Signature filesize exceeds max limit of 24000 bytes. Mail us if you have questions -Forum Moderator
Ab Initio Evolution Band of Brothers	Posted - 2006.10.19 23:06:00 - [542] Originally by: Cupdeez You my friend have to much time on your hands.. Type and read all this stuff.. and spie on the ASCN forums... just wow. You aren't even an involved party and yet you take the time to read 18 pages of posts, make your own post, and then tell Rob he has too much time on his hands.
Blacklight Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers	Posted - 2006.10.19 23:15:00 - [543] Originally by: Cupdeez You my friend have to much time on your hands.. Type and read all this stuff.. and spie on the ASCN forums... just wow. Hello blame-monkey, you owe us some proof, where is it?
Lone Bear Band of Brothers	Posted - 2006.10.19 23:57:00 - [544] Originally by: Robet Katrix Most of this war is being fought in BOB space and until it moves into paragon soul i will believe that the pendulum is swinging in tandem. As it has been said, look closer...
IntegralHellsing Gallente Blazing Saddles	Posted - 2006.10.20 08:49:00 - [545] Edited by: IntegralHellsing on 20/10/2006 08:52:38 some bob are fighting in ASCN territory, while a few ASCN are fighting in BoB territory. just a question to ASCN. Where did you put your titans away? The reason i quit ASCN was because CYVOK didn't bother too much with his titan, and i thought it was waste of alliance money not making the most use out of it. ps. oh, couple of ASCN members seem to be 'pirating' in empire, even if the target is neutral. Gangkers corp was engaged even if they are neutral to ASCN (i think it is called 'Gankers'). I was in Raverin system (or whatever it was called.) and this ASCN guy engaged a 'Gankers corp' hauler but was drove off by some other local pilots who saw that he was up to no good. and BEFORE THAT happened, he tried to engage me in Egghelende with his buddy. (was at a planet and he kept on warping in and out. well my corp decided that he was up to no good so we engaged him. thx for the loot.) so ASCN. if you want to win, stop your members doing random piracy in empire, first. ------------------------------
IntegralHellsing Gallente Blazing Saddles	Posted - 2006.10.20 10:53:00 - [546] Edited by: IntegralHellsing on 20/10/2006 10:53:52 False Propaganda: BoB Titan DESTROYED! Link There goes another fake killmail ------------------------------
Depp Knight Evolution Band of Brothers	Posted - 2006.10.20 11:27:00 - [547] Originally by: IntegralHellsing Edited by: IntegralHellsing on 20/10/2006 10:53:52 False Propaganda: BoB Titan DESTROYED! Link There goes another fake killmail and apparently our killboard is false
Splagada Minmatar Tides of Silence	Posted - 2006.10.20 12:10:00 - [548] got killed so hard the corpname changed under impact :D "corp:Evoultion" ------ relaxed corp looking for members
Robet Katrix Beagle Corp R0ADKILL	Posted - 2006.10.20 16:39:00 - [549] Edited by: Robet Katrix on 20/10/2006 16:39:32 Originally by: Rod Blaine post to big to quote but its only like 6 posts up From the top, and I apologize for not responding earlier since EVE-0 was down in my province all day apparently and this is the second time i have had to type this out now since eve ate this post the first time. I run under that assumption that territorial gain was the goal because that is the assumption i was left with after sirmolle's 2 opening posts. It is quite possible that your strategic timeline is much mroe fluid and prolonged than i think, but especially because of the one week timeline Molle gave i was led to that conclusion. I can fully accept that that may be true, im just gonig on the assumptions what i have read so far have led me to believe. I dont think that i actually said BOB morale was going down as you claimed i did, as personally i think it is the opposite and that ascn is doing everything it can to keep propping up themselves. I terms of TCAG/TPAR (funny that the names would be so similar) if your goals are NOT what i assume, which although not 100% convinced on yet, am fully willing to belive they may not be, then all ascn is doing at the moment is further facilitation what i would consider to be an excellent strategy by BOB of wearing down enemy resources, and hurting enemy morale. I will 100% agree with you on several parts of the McCreedy points. I belive the rotation is horrible idea, being as it stands it will only alienate the corps fighting at one time from those fighting at another time. "Why didn't you score as many kills as us when you were on rotation?" I will also agree with ASCN's FC problems. the fact of the matter being that a HC down system doesn't allow for proper player to leader input, and to be honest none of the plans used by ascn so far have been any good or taken and course of action that actually plays to their strengths and BOB's weaknesses. the hostility shown to anyone willing to speak up and contradict those plans is in truth one of the big limiters of creativity. If Ascn is going to continue to fight and fight well at some point certain HC policies or their whole HC system is going to need to be revamped. Although a single figurehead such as cyvok does not seem a problem. Its the people directly under him that do. Edit : and cupz..... get a life. dont criticize people for reading ALL the information before making a post. its 90% of the problem on these forums.
Gothikia Reikoku Band of Brothers	Posted - 2006.10.20 23:51:00 - [550] Originally by: DB Preacher I know, I'm just winding you up ;) And yes, a castle in Scotland is one of the options. I'm going to wear a kilt and sheep will be on tap. dbp if its anywhere near glasgow i wanna come
Yazoul Samaiel Caldari Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers	Posted - 2006.10.21 01:41:00 - [551] Originally by: Robet Katrix I personally think that ASCN are doing well, but at a horrid cost, and they are making many mistakes. TBH i would lik e to know ur personal definition of doing well since what i see from ASCN part is nothing more than faliure at every front , i aint flaming your pov i am curious to know sicne here are some facts . ASCN are losing every single major fleet fight they have with us , their losses are staggering , their supply lines are geting raided every day , their so called invasion to bob space was halted day one and every single POS they erected ( i stopped counting after the 13 large towers we popped ) was destoryed and today they only have one last remaining tower in tcag which means nothing soverignty wise, their leadership is failining in addressing their short comining and just waste space by spreading lies and false hope to its memebers , individual corps claiming weird stats just to look good, i wont start on K/L ratio coz it is blatnely obvious on both kbs and is admited by several ASCN memebers who see things clearly. So with all that how can they be doing well? The only reason ASCN hasnt lost space is that we havent started to claim any yet , we are just having fun atm but once the hammer falls and we decide to steam roll i think the effect will be very obvious but i will leave it to that time. "There is no such thing as innocence , only different degrees of guilt"
Rebellion Caldari Evolution Band of Brothers	Posted - 2006.10.21 01:45:00 - [552] In order to understand the goals of BoB, you simply need to realize what BoB is: BoB is an alliance that spends every minute in EVE either fighting or preparing for combat. Everything else we do, whether it be trading, mission running, researching, resourcing are all for the greater goal of combat. Now, why did BoB decide to attack ASCN? Was it because we wanted to space? Our space alone is already big enough to accomodate everything we need. Was it because we hate ASCN? No, we've had a history of fighting on the same side in the past. Ultimately the reason why BoB attacked ASCN is because we believed that since they are the biggest and richest alliance in the game, they could offer up a good fight. If you remember several months ago Molle made an announcement that we would be resetting all standings with everyone in 0.0. That should have made everyone, former enemies or former friends, consider us as potential hostiles and get ready. Since then ASCN had ample time to build up and prepare for a possible fight with BoB. For the most part, the fight with ASCN is going as expected: they have shown audacity in making big moves that risked a lot of ships. They have lost billions but have not lost the will to fight. These are good things. Why should BoB care where battles take place in, as long as they do? If ASCN did not go to TPAR-G, we would have continued inward until we met resistance. The prime objective here is conflict, not conquest. Or rather, I should say, it was. The point things went sour is when we realized that ASCN leadership were using the strategy of lying to their membership in order to motivate them for war. It's as if they could not get their members to fight without having them hate BoB for some reason. This was severely disapointing and is the main reason why a lot of BoB are so animated in pointing out the lies that ASCN leadership keep telling left and right. Why can't ASCN, being the biggest and richest alliance in the game, fight BoB without demonizing us? What more motivation could be necessary when ASCN has the industrial capacity not to care about battleship losses? Why do things have to turn rancid? There is also our memory of past opponents. In the war with PA, which most people call the Great Northern War, our opponents also used the same strategy of lying to their members in order to motivate them to fight us. This is established fact, not a mere accusation on my part, as admitted here: http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=319120&page=1#1 It's an old thread, speaking of much older things, but the situation then is as it is now, with leadership manipulating their membership with misinformation. Why do we hate such a strategy? Aside from demonizing us unjustly, the lies are bound to be revealed, and they tend to create such animosity within their ranks that our enemies end up hating each other more than they could ever hate us. Such things break alliances for good, without any hope of recovery or redemption. In the beginning stages of this war I had seen signals that ASCN had a tendency to propagandize the information they give to their own members, and there were already hints of demonizing us. We had to check their internal communications to be sure, and sure enough, we found blogs of CYVOK and McGreedy. A lot of us were struck with deja-vu from the GNW. You may not believe me when I say this, but I do not wish ASCN the same fate that befell the PA in the GNW. For a lot of the BoB membership, the internal information massaging that ASCN leadership is doing is strange. This is because BoB has a flat structure completely devoid of internal politics. ASCN, it seems, is internally goverened by a complex web of political relationships. (to be continued)
Rebellion Caldari Evolution Band of Brothers	Posted - 2006.10.21 02:03:00 - [553] (continuing...) You will have to excuse the enthusiastic manner of the BoB members. This is because they want to point out the falacies and stop the lies by ridicule and argumentation because such a mood is unnecessary for alliances as large as BoB and ASCN to fight. The mere industral base alone makes fighting on this scale inexpensive. Why is there a need for heated politicking? Much has always been said of BoB "propaganda". This was a meme started in the very same GNW, when the membership of the PA were being told one thing, and what-was-to-become-BoB was saying another. Since they trusted their leadership, then BoB was therefore lying. Remember my link above that clears up all those accusations and shows them to be false. I mention this because if BoB propaganda is any strong at all, it is because it is not propaganda. Throughout our history in EVE we have been supportive of methods that promote the dissemination of facts. I am willing to wager that we have played a big part in promoting the usage of killboards, as an attempt to refute enemy lies about losses. We were very much in support of the idea of killmails when they first came out. BoB killboard accuracy is a big thing for us, because we use it to evaluate our own performance. It is only opened to the public because of the desire to uphold the open publication of factual information. Internally, in EVOL, there is a policy of "no killmail , no ship replacement" in order to ensure that every member is diligent in keeping our tallies accurate. I may be crossing several points now, and this is getting too long. All I want to communicate to ASCN leadership is that they should be motivating their membership with honest information. Continued massaging of facts in order to protect internal ASCN political power by certain members of their leadership will only serve to make the fall, once truth is realized, harder. It also serves to convince us that ASCN leadership is moving in the same direction as set by our past opponents. This fight is supposed to harden all participants and let them find the areas where they can improve. All conflict in EVE serves the purpose of strenthening the participants. However, this can only happen if the true weaknesses are not hidden by massaged information, so that they may be exposed, and improved. As I said, everything BoB doe is for the glory of combat. If any of you truly want to destroy BoB, then the surest way is to convince us that we have no other hope of conflict other than splitting ourselves in two and fighting each other. That will, however, probably also be the end of many things besides BoB. Conflict feeds us. It is where we get our motivation, it is the reason why we are here. Our movements, our very breaths are all in the service of this god of war we call EVE. Lastly, take heed, as we have not even started truly using our own capitals yet. This conflict has no signs of abating, and things will continue to escalate. If at this point ASCN leadership is already resorting to strategies that involve misleading their membership, then what options will they resort to when BoB expands the field of war?
Robet Katrix Beagle Corp R0ADKILL	Posted - 2006.10.21 02:57:00 - [554] Edited by: Robet Katrix on 21/10/2006 03:04:38 when i made the comment that ascn was doing well it was only in the context of what BOB is not doing. And that is in context of territorial ambition. They have held BOB to BOB space. I AM NOT SAYING that this is 100% their doing, I am merely saying, in terms of "defending the Shire" they are succeeding. Albeit quite possibly only because BOB chooses to not make any move towards it so far. Very nice post Rebellious edit: just reading ascn's forums. Very nice post by James. then mcCreedy comes in and calls him a traitor for giving good advice. I just thought that that was incredibly funny.
McMike Hegemonic Core	Posted - 2006.10.21 09:01:00 - [555] Edited by: McMike on 21/10/2006 09:04:51 Quote: Why can't ASCN, being the biggest and richest alliance in the game, fight BoB without demonizing us? What more motivation could be necessary when ASCN has the industrial capacity not to care about battleship losses? Why do things have to turn rancid? ROFL..BOB playing the victim. ASCN is demonizing BOB. I'm assuming your upset about something in their internal forums because I have read very little of that here. 95% of the posts on this war in EVE-O have been BOB posts. The forum whoring here is VERY one sided. Your guys spit on ASCN at every chance you get. Occasionally, you fish out an ASCN guy who responds but for the large part, its BOB post after BOB post. YET, you are whining about ASCN demonizing bob?! Funny thing is, I don't read about ASCN whining on here about how you 'demonize' ASCN in your private forums. I do read here about how you openly rip out the contents of ASCN's private board and post them up here for all to see or how you resort to TS spying to get out of game advantages in fleet battles. But hey...your the victims here. The shear arrogance and self rightous bull**** that comes from you people is limitless.
Afonso Henriques Minmatar Low Grade Ore The SUdden Death Squad	Posted - 2006.10.21 09:38:00 - [556] Originally by: McMike [ ROFL..BOB playing the victim. ASCN is demonizing BOB. I'm assuming your upset about something in their internal forums because I have read very little of that here. 95% of the posts on this war in EVE-O have been BOB posts. The forum whoring here is VERY one sided. Your guys spit on ASCN at every chance you get. Occasionally, you fish out an ASCN guy who responds but for the large part, its BOB post after BOB post. YET, you are whining about ASCN demonizing bob?! Funny thing is, I don't read about ASCN whining on here about how you 'demonize' ASCN in your private forums. I do read here about how you openly rip out the contents of ASCN's private board and post them up here for all to see or how you resort to TS spying to get out of game advantages in fleet battles. But hey...your the victims here. The shear arrogance and self rightous bull**** that comes from you people is limitless. spin spin sugar
Dianabolic Reikoku Band of Brothers	Posted - 2006.10.21 10:16:00 - [557] Originally by: McMike Your guys spit on ASCN at every chance you get. You will, of course, notice that it isn't ascn we're calling liars - it is their leaders, yes?
Aberash eXceed Inc. Ascendant Frontier	Posted - 2006.10.21 21:02:00 - [558] Hmm what annoys me about topics like this is people who reply who arent even in ASCN/BOB, or arent fighting down in the South and Are saying what they think according to Killboards and forums (which on the most part are exaggerated/ Fake killmails ) By all means post what you think, but dont act like you know everything, its war ** goes wrong goes right.. deal with it. Like the sig? PM me for personalised sig - 10mil each**
Beyond Horizon UA Industry Red Alliance	Posted - 2006.10.21 21:17:00 - [559] an update on the war please for teh 3rd parties?:p - BH
Dragutinovic Caldari Storm Thesis	Posted - 2006.10.21 21:18:00 - [560] Originally by: Dianabolic Originally by: McMike Your guys spit on ASCN at every chance you get. You will, of course, notice that it isn't ascn we're calling liars - it is their leaders, yes? Oh they arent ASCN ? _____________ Im back !
Rod Blaine Evolution Band of Brothers	Posted - 2006.10.21 21:34:00 - [561] Originally by: Aberash (which on the most part are exaggerated/ Fake killmails ) Pics of stfu, or something, whatever, grow up. Old blog
Dianabolic Reikoku Band of Brothers	Posted - 2006.10.21 22:13:00 - [562] Originally by: Dragutinovic Originally by: Dianabolic Originally by: McMike Your guys spit on ASCN at every chance you get. You will, of course, notice that it isn't ascn we're calling liars - it is their leaders, yes? Oh they arent ASCN ? Any alliance is made up of its members. Those in BoB are represented not by me, or by the ceos, but by the "average joe" pilots who fly in our gangs, die on our command, and support our orders day in and day out. They are not the failing of ANY alliance - their leadership is.
Dragutinovic Caldari Storm Thesis	Posted - 2006.10.21 23:16:00 - [563] Originally by: Dianabolic Originally by: Dragutinovic Originally by: Dianabolic Originally by: McMike Your guys spit on ASCN at every chance you get. You will, of course, notice that it isn't ascn we're calling liars - it is their leaders, yes? Oh they arent ASCN ? Any alliance is made up of its members. Those in BoB are represented not by me, or by the ceos, but by the "average joe" pilots who fly in our gangs, die on our command, and support our orders day in and day out. They are not the failing of ANY alliance - their leadership is. A leader is only half as good as its followers .. also a statement made by yer alliance ages ago . I even believe its been made quite recently in diffrent words . Ofc i might express it wrong due the laungauge diffrence . then again look at what ASCN has been doing or has been made and then look yers ... its quite a diffrence .. no ? Chest beating here means zip , nada , nothin . You face someone who is not dedicated in pvp so its a extremely difficult job for them to compete while you all absorbed the most pvpers who liek to join a winning side imo . ¦ Im not flaming at it atll tbh but y cant call it "victorious" . The diffrencec between the two alliances are to big simple . However theres no rule aginst it and that makes the beauty of it but the general behaviour of yer guys destroy the beauty of it .. :/ _____________ Im back !
Louis DelaBlanche Cosmic Odyssey Chorus of Dawn	Posted - 2006.10.21 23:46:00 - [564] ASCN may lie & mslead their members but at least they kep it to their own forums. from day 1 of this conflict BoB or others trying to troll/flamebait have flooded this forum (& even more unfortunately, at times others) with spam that frankly would be locked were there any chance of that controlling it. Ive noticed even BoB posters shake their heads at some of the pointless spam other BoBbits insist on cramming this forum full of. I dont like how ASCN's leadership have aparently tried to personalise, demonise & vilify BoB to the point where you wonder if theyre too committed to the game. But idbe happilly indifferent to it were it not for the BoBbit's who raid ASCN's forums for infomationthey can spin & spam here with. Simularly the sig's, while certainly amusing , focus mainly around accusations of log off tactics & other suggestions, accustions or even insults. Its garnered an equally amusing but again equally suggestive etc retialiatory collection of ASCN sigs. The only differencebeing there arnt reply after reply full of them because ASCN arntso needlessly vocal. Theres alot of usefull infomation for those wantingto follow this war. & i appreciate that to some its important to expose the "underhand" methods of ASCN for what they are as a tactic of war. But its not a real war, its JUST a game, a very good engrossing & time consuming game, but just a game. scrolling through the post asfter post of drival from BoB, ppl wanting to get a reaction out of BoB, & BoBs reaction to it...its almost to the point that this subforum is no longer worth reading, save for the occasional Seleene war story or other alliance announcement. Look at his post. the OP is just some bored person asking (in i admit a rather flamebaitory manner), yet its run on for 18pages. Few of the threads on this subforum's first couple pages are not BoB related directly or been diverted to it. Some seem to be relishing in it. But I for one hate it, as it means the occasional decent & well thought out thread or reply are soon drowned in a sea of flames, trolling & personal post exchanges. & yes, im argueably hijacking this post myself to make my point about BoB's & others flaming, trolling etc on the subject of this war. The irony, if there is any, is not lost on me. But were I to post this as a new thread it would most likely be swamped with the very flames, trolls etc until it gets locked for beng flamebait or derailed. Thats all i have to say thats to my mind constructive. & although im not the first to complain about the obsene levels of spam this war has unleashed, I just hope (against hope) that maybe, just maybe, itl come to an end sooner, rather thenlater. Id rather have a quiet forum then one where its hardly worth reading whats there.
Nez Perces Amarr Black Spot.	Posted - 2006.10.22 00:06:00 - [565] Originally by: Louis DelaBlanche Thats all i have to say thats to my mind constructive. & although im not the first to complain about the obsene levels of spam this war has unleashed, I just hope (against hope) that maybe, just maybe, itl come to an end sooner, rather thenlater. Id rather have a quiet forum then one where its hardly worth reading whats there. ... whats wrong with you people ? If you don't like something don't read it, if the forums are too banal for your tastes, DON'T READ THEM.... Some of us actually enjoy the pointless banter and chestbeating by either side ITS FUN to watch, and personally it makes me chuckle. If your sensiblities are offended by such primitive behaviour then what are you doing in this thread? .. seems to me like you are the one taking things a little too seriously.
Audrea Momentum.	Posted - 2006.10.22 00:12:00 - [566] Originally by: Aberash Hmm what annoys me about topics like this is people who reply who arent even in ASCN/BOB, or arent fighting down in the South and Are saying what they think according to Killboards and forums (which on the most part are exaggerated/ Fake killmails ) By all means post what you think, but dont act like you know everything, its war ** goes wrong ** goes right.. deal with it. You are right, I stopped looking at the ASCN killboard, its not reliable I think its you guys who dont know everything.. perhaps thats why so few ASCN guys post? PS: To the guy from Beagle corp couple posts abot, and others in general: When your post gets 'eaten' by the forum, go back 2 pages in browser (using the arrow, not clicking twice on back button), it should come back to the text box WITH what you written, and this time when you click Post, it will post. Sometimes you have to go back 3 pages, but its 2 almost always. ------------------ yay, the Deimos has been saved!
Audrea Momentum.	Posted - 2006.10.22 00:22:00 - [567] Originally by: Louis DelaBlanche ASCN may lie & mslead their members but at least they kep it to their own forums. from day 1 of this conflict BoB or others trying to troll/flamebait have flooded this forum I dont like how ASCN's leadership have aparently tried to personalise, demonise & vilify BoB to the point where you wonder if theyre too committed to the game. But idbe happilly indifferent to it were it not for the BoBbit's who raid ASCN's forums for infomationthey can spin & spam here with. Simularly the sig's, while certainly amusing , focus mainly around accusations of log off tactics & other suggestions, accustions or even insults. Its garnered an equally amusing but again equally suggestive etc retialiatory collection of ASCN sigs. The only differencebeing there arnt reply after reply full of them because ASCN arntso needlessly vocal. Think of if like that: There is a community of some game of competition (be it chess tournament, whatever), now you are part of clan A, I am clan B. We had few matches, yours lost at every chance, and to excuse it, the leadership of your clan starts to demonize our clan B, call us cheaters, exploiters etc, in your private forum Now, if We in clan B find out about it, and do nothing - it might make few members believe it, and then spread the word that B clan are cheaters etc further, outside clan A. Enough that ONE member belives those lies, and the reputation of clan B is in serious problem. I know I wouldnt stand by and do nothing, and thats exactly why BoB respond here on the public forum, to those accusations thrown at them. ------------------ yay, the Deimos has been saved!
Trooper B99 Caldari Body Count Inc. Mercenary Coalition	Posted - 2006.10.22 00:46:00 - [568] Originally by: Gothikia if its anywhere near glasgow i wanna come Glaswegian bob alts allowed to come? ^^ tb99 Almost a Caldari Alliance Race Winner Current BDCI Ranking: (MINER6) Proficient Deep Core
fuze Gallente Chosen Path Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.10.22 00:56:00 - [569] Originally by: Rebellion Why can't ASCN, being the biggest and richest alliance in the game, fight BoB without demonizing us? What more motivation could be necessary when ASCN has the industrial capacity not to care about battleship losses? Why do things have to turn rancid? This one I gotta tackle. During the beesquatting sessions you held in the Syndicate you pretty much started to demonize the goonies. I even remember telling you guys going too far on it back then. So complaining about it is rather silly. (Come to think of it. I could sift through some old posts and recycle some of the good stuff you wrote about the goonies back then.) Besides that the fact that you state what is happening on the ASCN forums is to be said the truth. I may have missed out some linkies or transcripts but let me use a popular catchphrase 'proof please'.
Fi T'Zeh Evolution Band of Brothers	Posted - 2006.10.22 01:03:00 - [570] Comparing goons to ASCN = fail. .... Real men use blasters

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