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Nina Lowel
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
17
   |
Posted - 2015.04.01 17:13:14 -
[301] - Quote
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Lucas Kell wrote:baltec1 wrote:Yet here you are pushing for a 100% foolproof intel system that would mean pve players could avoid any attempt at pvp on them. People already can avoid any attempt at PvP on them, often unsuccessfully. Even if AFK cloakers didn't exist, that would be no different. Again, what I'm pushing for is actively playing players, that's all. It's not a new concept. You're pushing for actively playing players... by advocating for something that removes the one barrier to completely free afk ratting in nullsec. Lol. You're advocating for naked, selfish self interest, exactly like in the ISBotter thread, be honest for once.
Hundreds and hundreds of people lose ships ratting/mining every day to people just roaming through with a ceptor scout. Stop with the bull, seriously. |
Kenneth Endashi
Atomic Pharmaceuticals
52
|
Posted - 2015.04.01 17:20:30 -
[302] - Quote
I was docked in a station
Where I thought I was safe,
Where oft I felt no hesitation.
What a magnificent place.
Meanwhile, outside, a tempest stirred.
Plus one in local, what could it be?
D-scan, nay, a pilot obscured.
That she was cloaked, I could plainly see.
Before this spectre occurred,
The system was pure.
Before distinctions were blurred,
Of that I was sure!
Now I sit in contempt and full fraught,
Hating that what I may never know.
Perhaps this game is worse than I thought.
Perhaps it is better AFK cloaking be not. |
Dictateur Imperator
Babylon Knights
DARKNESS.
21
|
Posted - 2015.04.01 17:20:32 -
[303] - Quote
Why remove not aft lacking, but clocking immunity from the game.
A) "Afk cloacking" :
-Make moral harassment : just illegal in my country in real life, if i want i can go in justice against CCP if they don't kick a perma clocker who i can proof he make this to make moral harassment (read forum easy to have proof).
-No counter mesure
-Get pvp without tae any risk for pvp player, you can be aft or not attack when you want. You are risk free. ( and active pve player is NEVER risk free for exemple).
B) Normal cloacking:
-More strategical battle if your bomber wing must move and don't just wait 2 H in a point for an enemy fleet coming. More dynamic battle you know ?
C) More content:
- Kill clocker who don't move provide content. Don't play in a system because one people can't be kill and can kill you is just... destroying content.
D)Local issue:
- Local or not : You can't be decloack so people can know you ar here and can't kill you. You are just free risk. Let's do end this remove perma clocking, let people kill you. Risk VS reward : You want good kill mail ? Ok take more risk , for the moment you are risk free.
- AFK cloacking is counter mesure to perfect intel/risk free for pve/other argument like this : In 0.0 the people who attack have all advantage ; you have free intel by a lot of website about mining in system, farming in system so you know where it's active before go in this system. You have free intel about number of target when you enter on the system by local (so local is not only help for people who far, but for rammer to). In fact the true counter of perfect intel of the local is ... you have intel without be in the system you to with farming/mining information.
Conclusion: Nerf cloacking will create more content in the game. Remove perma clocking, and you create more strategical battle, more interesting things,ect... |
Nina Lowel
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
17
|
Posted - 2015.04.01 17:20:47 -
[304] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:Nina Lowel wrote:baltec1 wrote:Lucas Kell wrote:baltec1 wrote:Yet here you are pushing for a 100% foolproof intel system that would mean pve players could avoid any attempt at pvp on them. People already can avoid any attempt at PvP on them, often unsuccessfully. Even if AFK cloakers didn't exist, that would be no different. Again, what I'm pushing for is actively playing players, that's all. It's not a new concept. You get the result you want by removing local. So you want WH space? Then go to WH space. If you want risk free pve go to highsec
You're so adorable! I'm not asking for "risk free pve" I'm asking for a way to hunt those who's only goal is to grief those while cloaked and AFK. If they are ACTIVE then the can avoid being found. That is what is being asked for. You on the other hand have some really weird concept of what people are asking for.
Hundreds and hundreds of ratters/miners die every day in null to things other than those who camp systems in cloakers and are AFK most of the time and come out once in a while. It's not fair to those who are in the wrong time zones for their alliance especially.
You may not be exposed to such issues because you're in a 30k pilot alliance and are blind to it so I forgive you for your complete and utter ignorance. |
baltec1
Bat Country
Goonswarm Federation
15544
|
Posted - 2015.04.01 17:42:49 -
[305] - Quote
Nina Lowel wrote:Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Lucas Kell wrote:baltec1 wrote:Yet here you are pushing for a 100% foolproof intel system that would mean pve players could avoid any attempt at pvp on them. People already can avoid any attempt at PvP on them, often unsuccessfully. Even if AFK cloakers didn't exist, that would be no different. Again, what I'm pushing for is actively playing players, that's all. It's not a new concept. You're pushing for actively playing players... by advocating for something that removes the one barrier to completely free afk ratting in nullsec. Lol. You're advocating for naked, selfish self interest, exactly like in the ISBotter thread, be honest for once. Hundreds and hundreds of people lose ships ratting/mining every day to people just roaming through with a ceptor scout. Stop with the bull, seriously.
Stupidity of afk ratters is not a valid argument.
you will never catch an aleart ratter thanks to the fact that you show up in local the second you enter the system.
Join Bat Country today and defend the Glorious Socialist Dictatorship
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Lan Wang
Coreli Corporation
Mercenary Coalition
282
|
Posted - 2015.04.01 17:50:25 -
[306] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:Nina Lowel wrote:Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Lucas Kell wrote:baltec1 wrote:Yet here you are pushing for a 100% foolproof intel system that would mean pve players could avoid any attempt at pvp on them. People already can avoid any attempt at PvP on them, often unsuccessfully. Even if AFK cloakers didn't exist, that would be no different. Again, what I'm pushing for is actively playing players, that's all. It's not a new concept. You're pushing for actively playing players... by advocating for something that removes the one barrier to completely free afk ratting in nullsec. Lol. You're advocating for naked, selfish self interest, exactly like in the ISBotter thread, be honest for once. Hundreds and hundreds of people lose ships ratting/mining every day to people just roaming through with a ceptor scout. Stop with the bull, seriously. Stupidity of afk ratters is not a valid argument. you will never catch an aleart ratter thanks to the fact that you show up in local the second you enter the system.
Not true active ratters lose ships all the tine to hotdroppers that have been in system for long periods of time, pizza have very good success with it
EVEALON Creative --á****Logo Design | Killboard Banners | -áWeb Design | Website Graphics
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Kaarous Aldurald
Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec
CODE.
12384
|
Posted - 2015.04.01 17:52:27 -
[307] - Quote
"removing a source of risk in nullsec without compensation is fine, because the afk people will still occasionally die to interceptors!"
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs.
|
Nina Lowel
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
17
|
Posted - 2015.04.01 17:52:47 -
[308] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:Nina Lowel wrote:Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Lucas Kell wrote:baltec1 wrote:Yet here you are pushing for a 100% foolproof intel system that would mean pve players could avoid any attempt at pvp on them. People already can avoid any attempt at PvP on them, often unsuccessfully. Even if AFK cloakers didn't exist, that would be no different. Again, what I'm pushing for is actively playing players, that's all. It's not a new concept. You're pushing for actively playing players... by advocating for something that removes the one barrier to completely free afk ratting in nullsec. Lol. You're advocating for naked, selfish self interest, exactly like in the ISBotter thread, be honest for once. Hundreds and hundreds of people lose ships ratting/mining every day to people just roaming through with a ceptor scout. Stop with the bull, seriously. Stupidity of afk ratters is not a valid argument. you will never catch an aleart ratter thanks to the fact that you show up in local the second you enter the system.
Why, because you say it's not? LOL. A ceptor can tackle someone in just a few seconds upon entering a system, not everything can align and warp in those few seconds. It happens EVERY DAY, HUNDREDS and HUNDREDS of times. I feel sorry for you IRL :( |
Nina Lowel
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
17
|
Posted - 2015.04.01 17:55:23 -
[309] - Quote
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:"removing a source of risk in nullsec without compensation is fine, because the afk people will still occasionally die to interceptors!"
Hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of times a day = "occasionally" now.
You're so cute :) |
baltec1
Bat Country
Goonswarm Federation
15544
|
Posted - 2015.04.01 18:00:15 -
[310] - Quote
Lan Wang wrote:
Not true active ratters lose ships all the tine to hotdroppers that have been in system for long periods of time, pizza have very good success with it
Which would end when you remove the tool they use.
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Lan Wang
Coreli Corporation
Mercenary Coalition
282
|
Posted - 2015.04.01 18:02:04 -
[311] - Quote
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:"removing a source of risk in nullsec without compensation is fine, because the afk people will still occasionally die to interceptors!"
Your adding risk not removing it
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baltec1
Bat Country
Goonswarm Federation
15544
|
Posted - 2015.04.01 18:04:38 -
[312] - Quote
Nina Lowel wrote:
Why, because you say it's not? LOL. A ceptor can tackle someone in just a few seconds upon entering a system, not everything can align and warp in those few seconds. It happens EVERY DAY, HUNDREDS and HUNDREDS of times. I feel sorry for you IRL :(
They tacle afk ratters every day. You have more than enough time to get a capital out of the anom before they can finish d-scanning it down.
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Lan Wang
Coreli Corporation
Mercenary Coalition
283
|
Posted - 2015.04.01 18:07:09 -
[313] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:Nina Lowel wrote:
Why, because you say it's not? LOL. A ceptor can tackle someone in just a few seconds upon entering a system, not everything can align and warp in those few seconds. It happens EVERY DAY, HUNDREDS and HUNDREDS of times. I feel sorry for you IRL :(
They tacle afk ratters every day. You have more than enough time to get a capital out of the anom before they can finish d-scanning it down.
Shotgun ceptor fleets will land on grid before a capital manages to warp, and it happens all the time to mining barges
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Nina Lowel
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
18
|
Posted - 2015.04.01 18:11:24 -
[314] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:Nina Lowel wrote:
Why, because you say it's not? LOL. A ceptor can tackle someone in just a few seconds upon entering a system, not everything can align and warp in those few seconds. It happens EVERY DAY, HUNDREDS and HUNDREDS of times. I feel sorry for you IRL :(
They tacle afk ratters every day. You have more than enough time to get a capital out of the anom before they can finish d-scanning it down.
Then why do things other than captials also get tackled hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of times a day? Because they are "stupid"? Should that matter?
Yes, AFK people who are ratting die all the time, why shouldn't AFK cloakers also die all the time? |
Dictateur Imperator
Babylon Knights
DARKNESS.
21
|
Posted - 2015.04.01 18:12:38 -
[315] - Quote
Just for information: Local remove rumor come from fuzzy interview , in the same interview he saids "no new structure, and never nerf cloaking".
So maybe local will stay.
To b continue about nerf of colloquy ship : No counter to cloac actually, after you have a counter. Just a normal change in a game. |
Nina Lowel
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
18
|
Posted - 2015.04.01 18:19:27 -
[316] - Quote
Dictateur Imperator wrote:Just for information: Local remove rumor come from fuzzy interview , in the same interview he saids "no new structure, and never nerf cloaking".
So maybe local will stay.
To be continue about nerf of colloquy ship : No counter to cloac actually, after you have a counter. Just a normal change in a game.
He said cloaking will never be nerfed, not AFK'ing. |
Dictateur Imperator
Babylon Knights
DARKNESS.
21
|
Posted - 2015.04.01 18:21:29 -
[317] - Quote
Nina Lowel wrote:Dictateur Imperator wrote:Just for information: Local remove rumor come from fuzzy interview , in the same interview he saids "no new structure, and never nerf cloaking".
So maybe local will stay.
To be continue about nerf of colloquy ship : No counter to cloac actually, after you have a counter. Just a normal change in a game. He said cloaking will never be nerfed, not AFK'ing.
He said no new structure to. In fact : all this interveiw is Fozie point of view, not CCP point of view. So maybe local never be removed in null (or maybe we have local with observatory).
In all case people can trap ship without aft clocking. They just must use brain. |
baltec1
Bat Country
Goonswarm Federation
15547
|
Posted - 2015.04.01 19:14:05 -
[318] - Quote
Nina Lowel wrote:baltec1 wrote:Nina Lowel wrote:
Why, because you say it's not? LOL. A ceptor can tackle someone in just a few seconds upon entering a system, not everything can align and warp in those few seconds. It happens EVERY DAY, HUNDREDS and HUNDREDS of times. I feel sorry for you IRL :(
They tacle afk ratters every day. You have more than enough time to get a capital out of the anom before they can finish d-scanning it down. Then why do things other than captials also get tackled hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of times a day? Because they are "stupid"? Should that matter? Yes, AFK people who are ratting die all the time, why shouldn't AFK cloakers also die all the time? You really enjoy shooting yourself in the foot don't you?
Im fine with afk cloaking being nerfed, but to get that you have to deal with the imbalance it would cause. If you want afk cloaking gone you have to deal with losing your local intel tool. This is the exact same kind of argument we had with the people who wanted fittings on freighters. They also thought they would get nothing but a buff with their demand.
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Mr Epeen
It's All About Me
8208
|
Posted - 2015.04.01 19:27:52 -
[319] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:
Im fine with afk cloaking being nerfed, but to get that you have to deal with the imbalance it would cause. If you want afk cloaking gone you have to deal with losing your local intel tool.
No, you really don't have to lose local at all (though I'm fine with it, to be honest). That's just your drama queen mantra du jour.
Losing local is just one of many ways it could be balanced.
When all your posts are of the crying wolf variety, people just roll there eyes and ignore you. Except to post just to rile you up. Because lets face it, you're pretty funny when you go off the deep end like this.
Mr Epeen 
There are 86,400 seconds in a day. You just saved one of them by typing 'u' instead of 'you'.-á Congratulations, dumbass!
|
Lan Wang
Coreli Corporation
Mercenary Coalition
284
|
Posted - 2015.04.01 19:46:33 -
[320] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:Nina Lowel wrote:baltec1 wrote:Nina Lowel wrote:
Why, because you say it's not? LOL. A ceptor can tackle someone in just a few seconds upon entering a system, not everything can align and warp in those few seconds. It happens EVERY DAY, HUNDREDS and HUNDREDS of times. I feel sorry for you IRL :(
They tacle afk ratters every day. You have more than enough time to get a capital out of the anom before they can finish d-scanning it down. Then why do things other than captials also get tackled hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of times a day? Because they are "stupid"? Should that matter? Yes, AFK people who are ratting die all the time, why shouldn't AFK cloakers also die all the time? You really enjoy shooting yourself in the foot don't you? Im fine with afk cloaking being nerfed, but to get that you have to deal with the imbalance it would cause. If you want afk cloaking gone you have to deal with losing your local intel tool. This is the exact same kind of argument we had with the people who wanted fittings on freighters. They also thought they would get nothing but a buff with their demand.
Lose local and it causes a balance issue with cynos and recons being able to drop fleets, recons will make people 100% invisible without local and still have the power to drop massive dps fleets without anyone even knowing, you make null a stupid place to live unless you are selfsufficient with highsec alts for carebearing
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Nina Lowel
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
18
|
Posted - 2015.04.01 20:37:40 -
[321] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:Nina Lowel wrote:baltec1 wrote:Nina Lowel wrote:
Why, because you say it's not? LOL. A ceptor can tackle someone in just a few seconds upon entering a system, not everything can align and warp in those few seconds. It happens EVERY DAY, HUNDREDS and HUNDREDS of times. I feel sorry for you IRL :(
They tacle afk ratters every day. You have more than enough time to get a capital out of the anom before they can finish d-scanning it down. Then why do things other than captials also get tackled hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of times a day? Because they are "stupid"? Should that matter? Yes, AFK people who are ratting die all the time, why shouldn't AFK cloakers also die all the time? You really enjoy shooting yourself in the foot don't you? Im fine with afk cloaking being nerfed, but to get that you have to deal with the imbalance it would cause. If you want afk cloaking gone you have to deal with losing your local intel tool. This is the exact same kind of argument we had with the people who wanted fittings on freighters. They also thought they would get nothing but a buff with their demand.
The only thing that MIGHT, MIGHT need to change is appearing in local before breaking your initial gate cloak. I think that MIGHT be acceptable, but 0.0 is balanced around having a local. If you don't want local then go to WH space where CCP designed the entire risk vs reward around having no local. 0.0 was not designed to have no local, they would have to completely rebalance the entire risk vs reward to that of WH levels, but they won't, so move your happy "I want no local" ass to WH space where you can have all the "no local" you can handle. |
baltec1
Bat Country
Goonswarm Federation
15547
|
Posted - 2015.04.01 21:03:41 -
[322] - Quote
Lan Wang wrote:baltec1 wrote:Nina Lowel wrote:baltec1 wrote:Nina Lowel wrote:
Why, because you say it's not? LOL. A ceptor can tackle someone in just a few seconds upon entering a system, not everything can align and warp in those few seconds. It happens EVERY DAY, HUNDREDS and HUNDREDS of times. I feel sorry for you IRL :(
They tacle afk ratters every day. You have more than enough time to get a capital out of the anom before they can finish d-scanning it down. Then why do things other than captials also get tackled hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of times a day? Because they are "stupid"? Should that matter? Yes, AFK people who are ratting die all the time, why shouldn't AFK cloakers also die all the time? You really enjoy shooting yourself in the foot don't you? Im fine with afk cloaking being nerfed, but to get that you have to deal with the imbalance it would cause. If you want afk cloaking gone you have to deal with losing your local intel tool. This is the exact same kind of argument we had with the people who wanted fittings on freighters. They also thought they would get nothing but a buff with their demand. Lose local and it causes a balance issue with cynos and recons being able to drop fleets, recons will make people 100% invisible without local and still have the power to drop massive dps fleets without anyone even knowing, you make null a stupid place to live unless you are selfsufficient with highsec alts for carebearing
All they can drop are blackops and never in numbers that would overwhelm you. The days of local intel look to be over anyway, CCP are activly toying with new tools to replace it.
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Nina Lowel
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
18
|
Posted - 2015.04.01 21:11:22 -
[323] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:All they can drop are blackops and never in numbers that would overwhelm you. The days of local intel look to be over anyway, CCP are activly toying with new tools to replace it.
Hahaha. So delusional. |
baltec1
Bat Country
Goonswarm Federation
15547
|
Posted - 2015.04.01 21:27:00 -
[324] - Quote
Nina Lowel wrote:baltec1 wrote:All they can drop are blackops and never in numbers that would overwhelm you. The days of local intel look to be over anyway, CCP are activly toying with new tools to replace it. Hahaha. So delusional.
Feel free to try anything else when a cyno jammer is up.
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sabre906
Old Spice Syndicate
Intrepid Crossing
1689
|
Posted - 2015.04.01 22:49:23 -
[325] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:Nina Lowel wrote:baltec1 wrote:All they can drop are blackops and never in numbers that would overwhelm you. The days of local intel look to be over anyway, CCP are activly toying with new tools to replace it. Hahaha. So delusional. Feel free to try anything else when a cyno jammer is up.
When was the last time Bomber Bar blapped a goonie carrier in 15 seconds flat? Oh that's right, yesterday.
Wh space is not only hotdrop proof, the isk in it is vastly higher than any max upgraded -1.0 truesec system (unless you count in moon goo), and there's no sov bills or sov wars.
Why would anyone in their right mind live in a wh system that has gates, hotdrops, sov bills, and far lower isk? In order to convince anyone to live in such a place, rewards will have to be set so high it may as well screw up Eve. |
Infinity Ziona
Cloakers
2294
|
Posted - 2015.04.01 23:06:08 -
[326] - Quote
Lucas Kell wrote:baltec1 wrote:You will with an organised defence. We do it day in day out. You'll only kill a cloaker if he chooses to attack. A guy in station would have to leave his ship and clone behind to get out without getting killed. baltec1 wrote:No, what you want is the ability to ensure a perfect safety net via local intel. Wrong, perfect safety doesn't exist even with local in a system with no AFK cloakers. What I want is for people to actually have to play the ******* game if they want to have any effect on a system. I have no problem with active players running around threatening everyone, but the ability to dump alts into systems and chuck up some permanent 100% safety while completely AFK is just a terrible mechanic.
Baltecs argument is ironic.
Give perma-afk cloakies cyno dropper can scout out targets first its pretty rare you will lose anything, moreso given the overkill usually dropped on a target. I've seen fleets with capitals dropped on single BS, worst I saw was a fleet of at least 100+ mainly tengu's dropped on a 6 man gate camp.
Pretty much why they don't want cloakies touched, risk increases from virtually 0 to a couple of % if people know you're actually playing the game.
CCP Fozzie GǣWe can see how much money people are making in nullsec and it is, a gigantic amount, a shit-tonGǪ in null sec anomalies. Gǣ*
Kaalrus pwned..... :)
|
baltec1
Bat Country
Goonswarm Federation
15547
|
Posted - 2015.04.02 08:59:32 -
[327] - Quote
sabre906 wrote:
When was the last time Bomber Bar blapped a goonie carrier in 15 seconds flat? Oh that's right, yesterday.
An AFK carrier not fitted for fighting.
sabre906 wrote:
Wh space is not only hotdrop proof, the isk in it is vastly higher than any max upgraded -1.0 truesec system (unless you count in moon goo), and there's no sov bills or sov wars.
Why would anyone in their right mind live in a wh system that has gates, hotdrops, sov bills, and far lower isk? In order to convince anyone to live in such a place, rewards will have to be set so high it may as well screw up Eve.
You may have missed it but CCP have announced that the rewards in nullsec are indeed getting revamped.
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Eve Solecist
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
123
|
Posted - 2015.04.02 09:14:33 -
[328] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:sabre906 wrote:
When was the last time Bomber Bar blapped a goonie carrier in 15 seconds flat? Oh that's right, yesterday.
An AFK carrier not fitted for fighting. sabre906 wrote:
Wh space is not only hotdrop proof, the isk in it is vastly higher than any max upgraded -1.0 truesec system (unless you count in moon goo), and there's no sov bills or sov wars.
Why would anyone in their right mind live in a wh system that has gates, hotdrops, sov bills, and far lower isk? In order to convince anyone to live in such a place, rewards will have to be set so high it may as well screw up Eve.
You may have missed it but CCP have announced that the rewards in nullsec are indeed getting revamped.
You can have all the highsec miners for the revamped ore.
No one else wants them.
"Please do not file support tickets to ask if your support ticket will be answered soon." - Actual Quote.
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March rabbit
Federal Defense Union
1580
|
Posted - 2015.04.02 09:16:57 -
[329] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:Nina Lowel wrote:baltec1 wrote:All they can drop are blackops and never in numbers that would overwhelm you. The days of local intel look to be over anyway, CCP are activly toying with new tools to replace it. Hahaha. So delusional. Feel free to try anything else when a cyno jammer is up.
I cannot talk about current 0.0 but back in 2011 we in DroneLand were VERY AWARE of group of 9-13 people who were dropping solo ratters with up to 12 blackops.... And if you say that your 12 blackops are nothing.... 
The Mittani: "the inappropriate drunked joke"
|
baltec1
Bat Country
Goonswarm Federation
15547
|
Posted - 2015.04.02 10:56:42 -
[330] - Quote
March rabbit wrote:baltec1 wrote:Nina Lowel wrote:baltec1 wrote:All they can drop are blackops and never in numbers that would overwhelm you. The days of local intel look to be over anyway, CCP are activly toying with new tools to replace it. Hahaha. So delusional. Feel free to try anything else when a cyno jammer is up. I cannot talk about current 0.0 but back in 2011 we in DroneLand were VERY AWARE of group of 9-13 people who were dropping solo ratters with up to 12 blackops.... And if you say that your 12 blackops are nothing....
They arn't when you dump 12-30 carriers on them.
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