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Runawaypally The Stampede. 1	Posted - 2011.12.08 12:58:00 - [1] - Quote Years of promising to talk/comment on FW with nothing produced. Other topics are on here for 2 hours and have a Dev responce. WTF?
DarkAegix Acetech Systems 491	Posted - 2011.12.08 13:01:00 - [2] - Quote Runawaypally wrote: Waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhh!!!!!!!!
Solstice Project Cult of Personality 267	Posted - 2011.12.08 13:47:00 - [3] - Quote The topic won't help you at all. Inappropriate signature removed. Spitfire
Beaches 3	Posted - 2011.12.08 13:52:00 - [4] - Quote You got a bunch of military uniforms in the NEX shop. Didn't notice?
Rodj Blake PIE Inc. 443	Posted - 2011.12.08 13:56:00 - [5] - Quote At least we got a roundtable dedicated to FW at the last Fanfest! Oh wait... Dulce et decorum est pro imperium mori.
Whyumadtho Ministry of War Amarr Empire 37	Posted - 2011.12.08 14:14:00 - [6] - Quote Working as intended!
Denidil The Graduates Morsus Mihi 230	Posted - 2011.12.08 14:59:00 - [7] - Quote 0/10 Bored in 0.0?-á reset all standings.
Ujagar Sommdax JotunHeim Hird Moon Warriors 1	Posted - 2011.12.08 15:09:00 - [8] - Quote I love u interweb
Muad 'dib The Imperial Fedaykin 16	Posted - 2011.12.08 15:35:00 - [9] - Quote whne ccp says they will do somthing, what they mean is they will do somting in direction relation to how many players are using it. FW = a few 1000 players, which is barly a few % overall, so dont expect a patch as awesome as this latest one on just fw, expect somthing only a few % as good :)

CCP Solomon C C P C C P Alliance 96	Posted - 2011.12.08 15:40:00 - [10] - Quote The more people who care about a problem, the longer it takes to build consensus on a solution. Only the other day I was involved in a brainstorming session about the future of Factional Warfare and believe me when I say there are a lot of people here who care. Keep talking, keep raising your concerns and be a part of the solution. Associate Technical Producer - Carbon

Tanya Powers Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 442	Posted - 2011.12.08 15:55:00 - [11] - Quote CCP Solomon wrote: The more people who care about a problem, the longer it takes to build consensus on a solution. Only the other day I was involved in a brainstorming session about the future of Factional Warfare and believe me when I say there are a lot of people here who care. Keep talking, keep raising your concerns and be a part of the solution. Yeah it's like hybrids rebalance, after so much discussion and players feedback it appeard that they are ment to not exist on current pvp environement other than gank miners in belts just like before, the best way to improve hybrids is to give minmatar ammo some love. Thank you so much
Goose99 Republic Military School Minmatar Republic 301	Posted - 2011.12.08 16:00:00 - [12] - Quote Tanya Powers wrote: CCP Solomon wrote: The more people who care about a problem, the longer it takes to build consensus on a solution. Only the other day I was involved in a brainstorming session about the future of Factional Warfare and believe me when I say there are a lot of people here who care. Keep talking, keep raising your concerns and be a part of the solution. Yeah it's like hybrids rebalance, after so much discussion and players feedback it appeard that they are ment to not exist on current pvp environement other than gank miners in belts just like before, the best way to improve hybrids is to give minmatar ammo some love. Thank you so much The longer you stall, the more resistance there will be for balance, as ppl crosstrained to Winmatar already. Same applies to FW. People who "disagree" are merely those that don't want to see it viable. Eve has a culture of "it's fine if it doesn't directly help me, screwing someone else is more important."
The Snowman Aliastra Gallente Federation 6	Posted - 2011.12.08 16:41:00 - [13] - Quote CCP Solomon wrote: The more people who care about a problem, the longer it takes to build consensus on a solution. . Normally when any new mechanic is introduced in a game there is a 'vision' of what the 'desired outcome' would be. Study the outcome after the fact and compare it to the vision, if the vision isnt realised, adjust... test.. repeat. There must have been an official CCP objective or vision with FW when it was introduced, I remember when it was released CCP stating many times that the system implemented then was "just the beggining".. but was abandoned. The OP, appears to me to be complaining that over the years you've never even stated what the 'ultimate vision' of FW ever was! now it seems your asking the players what they want. There is obviously a difference between what players are wanting and expecting compared to what CCP are wanting and expecting, and thats why its taking to damn long. How about starting with what CCP's original objective and vision of FW was? and starting a proper discussion. You just stated that you were involved in a brain storming session... why not make a dev blog discussing all the points of views, intentions on original visions of FW, how its changed... instead of all these splinterd threads. Hell, why not even make a completly different forum section dedicated to it?
oldbutfeelingyoung VIRTUAL EMPIRE VANGUARD Vanguard Ascendants 7	Posted - 2011.12.08 16:52:00 - [14] - Quote Runawaypally wrote: Years of promising to talk/comment on FW with nothing produced. Other topics are on here for 2 hours and have a Dev responce. WTF? years of promising = working as intended Other topics are on here for 2 hours and have a Dev responce. WTF?= be happy and you will get an response in minutes
flakeys The Great cornholio's Paper Tiger Coalition 43	Posted - 2011.12.08 16:57:00 - [15] - Quote CCP Solomon wrote: The more people who care about a problem, the longer it takes to build consensus on a solution. Only the other day I was involved in a brainstorming session about the future of Factional Warfare and believe me when I say there are a lot of people here who care. Keep talking, keep raising your concerns and be a part of the solution. I am not an FW player but this is kinda ironic solomon. They have been raising their concerns for years now without any changes ... THEY have been a part of the solution.
Runawaypally The Stampede. 1	Posted - 2011.12.08 16:58:00 - [16] - Quote The Snowman wrote: CCP Solomon wrote: The more people who care about a problem, the longer it takes to build consensus on a solution. . Normally when any new mechanic is introduced in a game there is a 'vision' of what the 'desired outcome' would be. Study the outcome after the fact and compare it to the vision, if the vision isnt realised, adjust... test.. repeat. There must have been an official CCP objective or vision with FW when it was introduced, I remember when it was released CCP stating many times that the system implemented then was "just the beggining".. but was abandoned. The OP, appears to me to be complaining that over the years you've never even stated what the 'ultimate vision' of FW ever was! now it seems your asking the players what they want. There is obviously a difference between what players are wanting and expecting compared to what CCP are wanting and expecting, and thats why its taking to damn long. How about starting with what CCP's original objective and vision of FW was? and starting a proper discussion. You just stated that you were involved in a brain storming session... why not make a dev blog discussing all the points of views, intentions on original visions of FW, how its changed... instead of all these splinterd threads. Hell, why not even make a completly different forum section dedicated to it? This is what I was trying to say, but lack of time and coherant train of thought so early in the morning derailed my brain. What did you plan on it being and what have you observed that has kept it from there? Why havent you at least put out that blog that was promised after the gaffe with the round table? Hell you put it in the expansion notes and yet the only change was the plexing mechanics that still does no discernable thing beyond changin a single word on your screen. Oh and the color on the map if you turn that option on. I understand why you dont want to lock ppl out from their stuff if they loose occupancy while away, but thems the dice. You gambled by placing your stuff in a hanger vulnerable to enemy control, you should loose access until you get the system back, thus providing incentive to worry/bother with plexing. And yes please create a faction warfare specific section, the warfare topic doesnt cover it enough.
Hans Jagerblitzen Autocannons Anonymous 613	Posted - 2011.12.08 17:00:00 - [17] - Quote Muad 'dib wrote: whne ccp says they will do somthing, what they mean is they will do somting in direction relation to how many players are using it. FW = a few 1000 players, which is barly a few % overall, so dont expect a patch as awesome as this latest one on just fw, expect somthing only a few % as good :) I disagree completely. POS's are used universally throughout EvE, and we've only seen minor changes over a period of years time. Nullsec soveriegnty is pretty borked, and has been since Dominion was released without further polish, and those changes have left many more thousands of players frustrated and / or bored, and that hasn't been enough to enact change. Speaking as one of the principle promoters of Faction Warfare here on the forums, I'll simply say my interest in improving the feature goes beyond making things more enjoyable for the few of us that stil participate. Faction Warfare could fundamentally revive lowsec as a whole, inviting more players to the region and giving all the various pirate alliances (which likely outnumber the militias in number) much more activity to feed off of. With increased FW activity, and a spike in corresponding activity, there will once again be a huge sector of EvE space where subcap warfare and small gang PvP thrives once again. Players everywhere are thirsty for more of this, especially in the wake of Supercapitals, and people growing old of laggy 500-man battleship fleets where you don't make a difference, battles are won by attrition, and once primaried there's nothing you can do to prevent your ship from being lost as quick as a frigate. Small changes have (dare I say) a "butterfly effect" on the rest of the game. Look at the release of POCO's - a small tweak in planetary interaction (a feature panned by many players are boring as hell) has single-handedly sparked a huge increase in PvP activity surrounding lucrative planets. We can't just look at a feature in isolation and decide whether it has intrinsic merit outside of its context in the EvE universe. Developers and the players involved in feedback (CSM included) should view everything in the light of the surrounding game play areas it intersects, and see the full impact that something like a Faction Warfare revamp could have.
Runawaypally The Stampede. 1	Posted - 2011.12.08 17:06:00 - [18] - Quote CCP Solomon wrote: The more people who care about a problem, the longer it takes to build consensus on a solution. Only the other day I was involved in a brainstorming session about the future of Factional Warfare and believe me when I say there are a lot of people here who care. Keep talking, keep raising your concerns and be a part of the solution. Thank you for responding, I do appreciate it.
Shad0wsFury Habitual Euthanasia Pandemic Legion 41	Posted - 2011.12.08 17:06:00 - [19] - Quote I've participated in FW a few times, most notably right after it came out, and again last time they even addressed anything to do with FW and put in the FW LP store and such. Honestly, it's a joke the way it is. What do FW participants fight over? Nothing except "claiming" systems for your faction, which functionally does nothing. Who can join FW? Literally anyone, and that's the problem. There are far too many spies in FW to be able to run fleets. I've been on both ends. It's un-fun when you know what your enemy is doing exactly and can counter them instantly, and it's un-fun when you're getting 0wned in the face because you're being instantly countered by an enemy FC who has a spy in his opponents fleet. It's pretty sad really, because FW COULD be one of the major draws towards lowsec that is currently lacking. If only there were tangible rewards for FW PvPers, and CCP did away with NPC militia corporations, FW could be a great thing. It might actually become a place for newer players to learn meaningful PvP skills, and a place where veteran players could still find some decent PvP without all the risks of nullsec PvP. Or CCP could just go on pretending FW doesn't exist. I don't care how many backroom conversations you have about it in Iceland. If it doesn't make it onto Tranquility, it's just a lot of hot air being blown up our collective playerbase asses.
Mr Kidd Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation 233	Posted - 2011.12.08 17:06:00 - [20] - Quote CCP Solomon wrote: The more people who care about a problem, the longer it takes to build consensus on a solution. Only the other day I was involved in a brainstorming session about the future of Factional Warfare and believe me when I say there are a lot of people here who care. Keep talking, keep raising your concerns and be a part of the solution. Allow me to translate these 'sage' words: "Soon(tm)" This comment, if brought to it's ultimate logical conclusion, means that the more people that care the longer it will take. Ultimately as Y number of people increases the smaller the chance of a consensus and a tangible solution ( X ). However, conversely as Y approaches 0 or, in other words, the less people that care, the solution ( X ) also approaches infinity. So, in the end, my friends, FW will be fixed in approximately never. We want breast augmentations and sluttier clothing in the NeX!
Derus Grobb Iron Oxide Institute 5	Posted - 2011.12.08 17:07:00 - [21] - Quote There are hundreds of pages of player feedback on FW. CCP just need to sort through and actually implement some of it.
Captain Alcatraz Douchingtons Shadow Cartel 46	Posted - 2011.12.08 17:11:00 - [22] - Quote CCP Solomon wrote: The more people who care about a problem, the longer it takes to build consensus on a solution. CCP Solomon wrote: Keep talking, keep raising your concerns and be a part of the solution. eternal trap
Written Word Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 163	Posted - 2011.12.08 17:16:00 - [23] - Quote Unless Dust is going to fix FW, don't hold your breath for seeing anything for FW in 2012.
Rodj Blake PIE Inc. 443	Posted - 2011.12.08 17:18:00 - [24] - Quote Captain Alcatraz wrote: CCP Solomon wrote: The more people who care about a problem, the longer it takes to build consensus on a solution. CCP Solomon wrote: Keep talking, keep raising your concerns and be a part of the solution. eternal trap It's the fabled wisdom of Solomon at work. Dulce et decorum est pro imperium mori.
Hans Jagerblitzen Autocannons Anonymous 615	Posted - 2011.12.08 17:27:00 - [25] - Quote Derus Grobb wrote: There are hundreds of pages of player feedback on FW. CCP just need to sort through and actually implement some of it. Which is exactly what's been going on. I understand everyone's frustration with FW improvement delays, no one wants to see this fixed more than I. The fact remains that CCP has admitted to not working on spaceship features as much as they needed to, spending over a year to develop a dead-end feature with Incarna. Now that the company as been restructured and resouces reallocated, we are only seeing the tip of the iceberg in terms of what the future holds for EvE proper. Unclogging the Incarna hairball has released a glut of new features, updates, and improvements, and there simply is a massive backlog of features to plow through. At least its all underway and at record speed. I can tell you for certain that the CSM is fully aware of the full range of FW issues (I've personally spoken with many of them to oversee that) , and is discussing them with CCP. CCP also is fully aware of what needs fixing, since most of the main FW issues have been on record in the official backlog ratified years ago. I truly believe, from everyone I've spoken to - CSM and CCP alike - that it is not a matter of if Faction Warfare will be improved and updated, but when. All I can do is share my experience, whether anyone is encouraged by that or not. As for what CCP's own vision is for Faction Warfare - that is a fantastic question, and one I'd love to hear an answer for. Unfortunately, its up to the CSM to share what they've heard during the high-level discussions they're having with CCP at the summit that is underway as we speak. And if they're unable to answer this question to our satisfaction, the only way we'll learn that vision will be for all those interested in Faction Warfare to unite behind a candidate in the upcoming elections that will ask those questions.
Murashu Phoibe Enterprises Black Watch. 5	Posted - 2011.12.08 18:27:00 - [26] - Quote CCP Diagoras wrote: I had forgotten about the militias/FW....
Solstice Project Cult of Personality 268	Posted - 2011.12.08 18:38:00 - [27] - Quote Okay, i'll bite to the dev post. I never was a roleplayer before EvE and i actually have never ever played a MMORPG before EvE, simply because EvE is the only real MMORPG out there. The first time i heard about factional warfare, it got me quite exited. FW is all about role play and i thought: "Hey ... why not ... sounds great!" And then i realized ... "wtf? Why should i do this?" The ranks are worthless, have no meaning and can be too easily obtained. Winning a system does not have any impact whatsoever. Given that it's EvE, this is a major flaw. FW seems to only be about small scale PvP, which for itself is okay, but on the other hand simply is not enough given the topic of having FACTIONS COMPETE AGAINST EACH OTHER. Of course, many will consider FW the holy grail of small scale PvP and i accept (and i'm glad) that they have fun with that, but FW could/SHOULD be so much more. If there's no way to be a "hero", then it lacks intention to play it. One could have more kills than others, but that's only something to brag about. It does not have any impact. There's no "bigger scheme" that rewards this. If there's no way that my own faction can stand out compared to the others, then it lacks intention to play it. Of course, there's plenty of gray between all that black and white, but that's simply how i see it. Statistically speaking, there's plenty of others who see it the same way as i do in one form or the other. Inappropriate signature removed. Spitfire
Hans Jagerblitzen Autocannons Anonymous 615	Posted - 2011.12.08 18:42:00 - [28] - Quote Murashu wrote: CCP Diagoras wrote: I had forgotten about the militias/FW.... Can you reference the source of this comment? I'm very curious.
Hans Jagerblitzen Autocannons Anonymous 615	Posted - 2011.12.08 19:10:00 - [29] - Quote Also - Solstice, you hit the nail on the head. I don't think anyone could have summarized the Faction Warfare situation better than you did. This is why I urge players and developers alike to not use current participation metrics to evaluate whether Faction Warfare is worth iterating on. So many like yourself have come in and said "whats the point?" and left, with arguably good cause. All those that have walked away from feature stand to benefit from its revision, not just those of us that left for whom the killmail race and abundant small gang pew pew are entertainment enough to keep fighting amongst each other. Essentially FW is alive not through any form of central driving mechanic, but rather the sheer force of will amongst a dedicated community who believe too strongly in the potential of CCP's original concept to give up advocating on its behalf. The fact that most players would rather participate in other activities with greater large-scale impact should be just as much impetus to improve the Faction Warfare system so that it, too, lives up to the EvE standard of dynamic and meaningful gameplay.
The Snowman Aliastra Gallente Federation 8	Posted - 2011.12.08 21:37:00 - [30] - Quote or rather just consolidate all the feedback in one place, and not just one thread.... a seperate forum is definatly whats needed. Even after any major revamp, like a CAOD but just for fw. I just dont beleive that the problem takes longer because more people care... usually when you run any test then more results means better averages that are more acurate and MORE common ground can be established. Start with the common ground... and the common ground that everyone agree's on is more reward, more 'reason' to do it, and not just farm LP to spend on crappy LP store. Rewards that matter like acheivments, bragging rights.. not every reward is just about cash. start with that, the rest can be hammerd out from there when people actually start playing FW
Runawaypally The Stampede. 1	Posted - 2011.12.09 01:17:00 - [31] - Quote Guess ill use EvE-Search and try to pull up all of the FW threads and list the ideas in a consolidated list. Obviously troll post ideas wont make it in the list, but it may take some time before I complete the list due to the dozens of threads and several threadnaughts.... oh boy Corrected spelling, stupid phone...
Derus Grobb Iron Oxide Institute 5	Posted - 2011.12.09 01:29:00 - [32] - Quote Hans Jagerblitzen wrote: Murashu wrote: CCP Diagoras wrote: I had forgotten about the militias/FW.... Can you reference the source of this comment? I'm very curious. https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=454440#post454440 Context is important, to pick fault with Diagoras for that is stupid imo. Also, Hans it looks like good things will happen in the summer. If so, the militias should all buy you beer or something.
Simyaldee Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse 10	Posted - 2011.12.09 03:01:00 - [33] - Quote I honestly was slightly gladdened when I found out that the plexing spawn Mechanic was fixed, but the overall Occupancy system was not. Coming up with a good system will take time and at least this shows that CCP is at least thinking about it. Honestly there can many many ways to fix Faction Warfare but as many have said it all depends on what the vision of FW is today. For me(and I think most of you agree with me on this), FW should be focused on the encouragement of small-scale PvP i.e 1-50 man gangs. There have been many many ways discussed on the forums how to do this so I'm not going to state my own. The One thing I do not want is for Faction Warfare to turn into a smaller-scale null sec. I fight Gallente(and occasionally Minmatar) all the time without the motivation of money. We just want fights, for some reason Null Sec PvP'rs who are for the most part are only part-time PvP'rs(their are rare exceptions) can't understand this. In a nutshell most Null sec people imo think PvP to Earn isk, while most of us in Faction Warfare think Earn ISK to PvP. I don't want to be encouraged to fight Gallente over a plex so I can earn money, I want to be encourage to fight Gallente because if they win it will change the way I have to play (i.e station rights etc) and there will be a very noticeable difference in the appearence of my gameplay(i.e. Station Models, a better UI for the Occupancy System etc.). Also while were on this topic I want to put forward a variation of Faction Warfare for Dust 514, if clone Capsuleers can fight for the State/Republic/Federation/Empire, why not clone Mercenaries?
Leisen Interrobang Inc. 2	Posted - 2011.12.09 03:14:00 - [34] - Quote CCP Solomon wrote: The more people who care about a problem, the longer it takes to build consensus on a solution. Only the other day I was involved in a brainstorming session about the future of Factional Warfare and believe me when I say there are a lot of people here who care. Keep talking, keep raising your concerns and be a part of the solution. This sounds reasonable at first, even refreshing to hear that it hasn't been forgotten about. But to expect your customers to be giving you the same requests, the same feedback on a part of the game, for YEARS, is...ridiculous at best. It's an absolute failure on your end. If CCP would have TRIED to fix FW years ago, and failed, it would be fixed by now. You have to jump in and try something sometime, because guess what, you aren't going to get it right the first time. You never have.
Tanya Powers Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 449	Posted - 2011.12.09 03:26:00 - [35] - Quote Mr Kidd wrote: CCP Solomon wrote: The more people who care about a problem, the longer it takes to build consensus on a solution. Only the other day I was involved in a brainstorming session about the future of Factional Warfare and believe me when I say there are a lot of people here who care. Keep talking, keep raising your concerns and be a part of the solution. Allow me to translate these 'sage' words: "Soon(tm)" This comment, if brought to it's ultimate logical conclusion, means that the more people that care the longer it will take. Ultimately as Y number of people increases the smaller the chance of a consensus and a tangible solution ( X ). However, conversely as Y approaches 0 or, in other words, the less people that care, the solution ( X ) also approaches infinity. So, in the end, my friends, FW will be fixed in approximately never. Just like hybrids. That's why I cross trained Minmatar and hell I'm happy I've done it and strongly advice every noob to do so.
Kuronaga Controlled Substance 17	Posted - 2011.12.09 04:24:00 - [36] - Quote CCP Solomon wrote: The more people who care about a problem, the longer it takes to build consensus on a solution. Keep talking, keep raising your concerns and be a part of the solution. So you're telling me I should be a part of the solution so that it takes longer? I'm confused by this flawed play on words you have used.
Zendoren Aktaeon Industries The Black Armada 53	Posted - 2011.12.09 05:01:00 - [37] - Quote CCP Solomon wrote: The more people who care about a problem, the longer it takes to build consensus on a solution. Only the other day I was involved in a brainstorming session about the future of Factional Warfare and believe me when I say there are a lot of people here who care. Keep talking, keep raising your concerns and be a part of the solution. If this is a topic that CCP would like more info on from the community, Might I suggest that we sticky this topic to the top as to encourage more participation and thus producing a consensus among the community faster. (<- ROFL!?) G¥Æ Single G¥Æ Taken G£ö Playing EVE Online CCP Guard > Where's the shoot button on this thing? CCP Space Cadet > What's this "offline guns" button do? http://tinyurl.com/dxwseds
Hans Jagerblitzen Autocannons Anonymous 620	Posted - 2011.12.09 05:06:00 - [38] - Quote Runawaypally wrote: Guess ill use EvE-Search and try to pull up all of the FW threads and list the ideas in a consolidated list. Obviously troll post ideas wont make it in the list, but it may take some time before I complete the list due to the dozens of threads and several threadnaughts.... oh boy Corrected spelling, stupid phone... If any one would like to help with the orginizing/spelling corrections/removing double/tripple/umpteenmillionth copies of same idea, it would speed things up considerably. As well as not make your eyes bleed reading it like its making mine trying to orgnize it. Have you had a chance to check out the main Faction Warfare discussion thread? I have already compiled a list of all the relevant threads containing Faction Warfare feedback, as well as consolidated the most popular fix requests into a "top 10" list, both are stickied at the top of the thread. I've been updating it continuously as new threads emerge, though CCP and the CSM have both urged us as a community to keep our discussion and feedback into a single thread so they can access it efficiently. I would love to hear more ongoing ideas and debate, but lets please keep it to the central location so that we don't frustrate them any further. Also, The Mittani liked the Top Ten list enough that he personally saw that it was posted up on the internal CCP / CSM forums for discussion, and the CSM has also just concluded a long session talking about FW and wormholes as part of the summit currently underway. Trebor tweeted that there were some fun ideas in store for FW.... I used to be a lot more cynical about Faction Warfare's chances to see improvement, but we've definitely got the discussion going at the topmost levels once again. I'm very hopeful we'll see some meaningful changes if we continue to keep letting CCP and the CSM know how much FW means to us and how much it can improve the game in general.
Hans Jagerblitzen Autocannons Anonymous 622	Posted - 2011.12.09 08:27:00 - [39] - Quote Derus Grobb wrote: Also, Hans it looks like good things will happen in the summer. If so, the militias should all buy you beer or something. Quafe Zero works fine, and is much easier to send :)
Ltd SpacePig Exclusion Cartel The Kadeshi 4	Posted - 2011.12.09 09:23:00 - [40] - Quote I listen to Mintchips interview with Soundwave last night and FW will get some love. Problem is that FW is so broken that it doesn't just need some smaller changes it needs to be rethinked and that takes time. It's about 4 - 5 month ago that CCP turned their ship around and started to listen so there was no time for FW in this patch. I would expect some changes to the summer patch. As the dev said in this thread.. be a part of the solution and come with ideas on what you want. I know there is already tons of threads about it but give them more. FW like nullsec sov warfare was some cool stuff they put into the game but they didn't really plan on how to support and evolve the feature. This is stuff they need to do now. They should of course done it before they put it into the game but better late then ever hey :)
Draco Rosso Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse 2	Posted - 2011.12.09 16:47:00 - [41] - Quote I better hear some good news and soon, since I been waiting since 2008 for improvements to FW. I'm tired talking about solutions about FW. I'm running on empty with patience with CCP habitual stalling on FW. Frankly is time for CCP to put or shut up. I want to know about upcoming changes and a timeline of implementation. Ideally I want to see a 2012 winter patch.
Hans Jagerblitzen Autocannons Anonymous 622	Posted - 2011.12.09 17:28:00 - [42] - Quote Draco Rosso wrote: I better hear some good news and soon, since I been waiting since 2008 for improvements to FW. I'm tired talking about solutions about FW. I'm running on empty with patience with CCP habitual stalling on FW. Frankly is time for CCP to put or shut up. I want to know about upcoming changes and a timeline of implementation. Ideally I want to see a 2012 winter patch. You're absolutely right, there isn't all that much more to discuss / debate regarding FW. To be honest, if you read the material from 3 years ago, it pretty much exactly mirrors the list of concerns people are still bringing up today. I share your frustration, that's why I'm trying to push as hard as I can to make sure that both the developers and the CSM have everything they need and know how much this means to all of us. I think we have to understand though that this isn't really stalling just on FW, it was stalling on a whole bunch of stuff delayed by the Incarna detour, and now that CCP has restructured and refocused their development teams, they actually have both the resources and the mandate from top leadership to go forth and catch up on the back log. Most of the items the community wants to see happen are already in the official queue of stuff to develop, so CCP has never really said "we're not doing this" (being in the queue means when, not if) only that they lacked resources allocated to it. If you listen in Soundwave's interview, FW was the first and primary thing he brought up in terms of core gameplay features that are well past due for development, and will be focused on for summer expansion. So lets all take a deep breath, relax a little and let them do their thing and respond with feedback as we hear more details. Any new ideas are great too at this point since the actual programming for summer hasn't begun yet. The summit that is underway is where the planning is being done for summer, its in the concept stage currently, once the overall agenda is decided upon the feasiblity of implementation will be assessed, so its just too soon for anyone to make promises on what exactly is coming. I hope its good news at least that we are NOT being ignored, put off, or fleeced any longer. We just need to be patient the next couple of months and give CCP some time to lock down exactly what will or won't be included. But I would bet my entire wallet and assets that we will see Faction Warfare development this summer, that's how confident I am based on what I'm hearing.
Xtover Macabre Votum Against ALL Authorities 24	Posted - 2011.12.09 17:32:00 - [43] - Quote Tanya Powers wrote: Yeah it's like hybrids rebalance, after so much discussion and players feedback it appeard that they are ment to not exist on current pvp environement other than gank miners in belts just like before, the best way to improve hybrids is to give minmatar ammo some love. Keep thinking that, please
Brooks Puuntai Nomadic Asylum KUGUTSUMEN. 301	Posted - 2011.12.09 17:37:00 - [44] - Quote How many times has this been that CCP said they are "looking into fixing FW"? Just remove it already since its obvious no one at CCP cares enough about it to create a vision for it. Almost all features has a dev or team that at least has some idea on where they want it to go, this doesn't seem the case for FW. Relying on input from massive amount of different opinions from the player base won't solve the issue or make things easier. Someone from CCP really needs to take charge of FW and choose a direction for it or just remove it.
Draco Rosso Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse 2	Posted - 2011.12.09 18:09:00 - [45] - Quote Hans Jagerblitzen wrote: Words of Wisdom To be honest of the reasons I come back into the game was because I reading some of your earlier post about potential development of FW for this patch. I was part of the quiet majority watching the development of this particular patch. When I come back into FW I was stunned just how Grimm the scene is. I honestly believe that FW is on its last legs, and I donGÇÖt think it will survive in its current state until next summer. The Caldari is literally down to one major corp. two competent FCs and few satellite corps. There isnGÇÖt enough momentum in Caldari FW to attract another major corp. or new members. I hate to be doom and gloom but, I been in FW for long time and this really is bottom of the barrel. Personally IGÇÖm raising the white flag on plexing. I donGÇÖt have the energy or the stomach for an extended plexing campaign under the current mechanics. I might just go back into skill training comma or take another break from the game, unless I get some good news by the end of the month. ItGÇÖs not like IGÇÖm lacking for other entertainment options.
Hans Jagerblitzen Autocannons Anonymous 622	Posted - 2011.12.09 18:11:00 - [46] - Quote Brooks Puuntai wrote: How many times has this been that CCP said they are "looking into fixing FW"? Just remove it already since its obvious no one at CCP cares enough about it to create a vision for it. Almost all features has a dev or team that at least has some idea on where they want it to go, this doesn't seem the case for FW. Relying on input from massive amount of different opinions from the player base won't solve the issue or make things easier. Someone from CCP really needs to take charge of FW and choose a direction for it or just remove it. Removing FW is a ridiculous idea. They would instantly lose over a thousand subscriptions at least, and too many players still participate (and continue to participate) irregardless of further development. Many more hold out hope for changes, that if confirmed would never come, might end their subscriptions as well. CCP won't take a revenue hit just to wash their hands and make it "go away" so individuals like yourself don't have to listen to "FW whiners" any more. Should they remove POS's from the game because its obvious they dont have any concrete plans for a sweeping overhaul? Lets be reasonable here. The issue regarding FW developed has always been a resource one - same as lot of other backlogged, half-assed features. The resource issue has been radically addressed. We have to temper some of the doomsday "nevergonnahappen" mentality while we give them time to actually use the new resources they have available. There have been many player suggestions for improvements that developers, including Soundwave himself, have agreed "this is where we'd like it to go". Many of the developers DO have plans in mind, and not just for Faction Warfare, they were just under orders to work on space clothes instead, that's not their fault. Also, the player pretty much DO agree on what needs to be changed. There are some minor mechanics debates going on, and a few big ones like Alliance participation, but the core issues facing and breaking FW are pretty consistently agreed upon.
Hans Jagerblitzen Autocannons Anonymous 622	Posted - 2011.12.09 18:47:00 - [47] - Quote Draco Rosso wrote: Hans Jagerblitzen wrote: Words of Wisdom To be honest of the reasons I come back into the game was because I reading some of your earlier post about potential development of FW for this patch. I was part of the quiet majority watching the development of this particular patch. When I come back into FW I was stunned just how Grimm the scene is. I honestly believe that FW is on its last legs, and I donGÇÖt think it will survive in its current state until next summer. The Caldari is literally down to one major corp. two competent FCs and few satellite corps. There isnGÇÖt enough momentum in Caldari FW to attract another major corp. or new members. I hate to be doom and gloom but, I been in FW for long time and this really is bottom of the barrel. Personally IGÇÖm raising the white flag on plexing. I donGÇÖt have the energy or the stomach for an extended plexing campaign under the current mechanics. I might just go back into skill training comma or take another break from the game, unless I get some good news by the end of the month. ItGÇÖs not like IGÇÖm lacking for other entertainment options. Admittedly, this is one of my areas of weakness - knowledge of the inner workings of the Caldari / Gallente warfront. I tend to have tunnel vision with the Amarr / Minmatar conflict, and assume the other two militias operate similarly. This is awful to hear though, I'm sorry you're having a tough time. It is a bit surprising to me only because things in our warzone have heated up quite a bit. There are (oddly enough) veteran corps that are back out in the plexes again (I'm trying to gain some specific feedback on whether its just boredom or a direct result of the plex changes) and the POCO deployment especially has given us a lot of new engagements. There are CTA's to defend and attack the POCO's owned by both sides of the militias, who are now in competition to control the resources of the local lowsec planets. Also, everyone seems to be enjoying the new BC's as well. Activity is definitely at a peak on this end, most its been in 6 months at least. I know this is no way "fixes" the problems on the Gallente / Caldari end, I'd love to learn more about the history of that conflict and nature of activity in that region, but in the mean time if things are in crisis mode I might honestly suggest rolling over the restless Caldari / Gallente corps into their Amarr / Minmatar counterparts. Concentrating fights in one zone would mean more fun for everyone, but I know this may break RP / immersion and cause logistical issues for those living and operating in those areas. It would, however, entertain all of us for a while and maybe send a strong message that the core issues need to be addressed ASAP - and keep everyone from moving elsewhere or quitting the game entirely in the mean time. Its sad things have grown so stale over there, all I can do is offer an invitation to come join the fray in our space if you'd like, and most importantly I appreciate the heads up, since I now realize my own personal bias when it comes to assessing the health of the scene as a whole.

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