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Should EVE go Free To Play?

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xxxTRUSTxxx Galactic Rangers EVEolution. 315	Posted - 2015.08.22 12:21:27 - [31] - Quote short answer No! long answer Noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!
Geanos V I R I I Ineluctable. 30	Posted - 2015.08.22 12:58:04 - [32] - Quote Looking at no. of players I understand the concern about the health of the game. It could work, but for standard accounts (free) everything that generates ISK should be at least halved, taxes at least 100% increased and only a fraction or no SP training at all. These things should be tweaked to make the game playable but hard and encourage players to go premium (paid).
Salvos Rhoska 1266	Posted - 2015.08.22 13:07:16 - [33] - Quote Im confused. I thought EVE already is F2P in a very real sense (with a few caveats)? Im quite serious. "Playing" EVE generally earns isk, to one extent or another, doing just about anything (minus expenses). That isk can then be put towards buying PLEX ingame. The more you play (if profitable), the freer it gets. Playing makes it free to play (F2P). The influx of PLEX into the game, does yes ofc require RLM, but people dont purchase PLEX with RLM for purposes OF playing, but to sell PLEX ingame rather for purposes of funding HOW they play. Im not completely clear on the best ways in which a new trial player can potentially most cost effectively, in RLM and ingame playing/earning, fund their start, but the buddy program is a strong incentive that returns a substantial amount of the rewarded PLEX value to the old buddy, back to the new buddy, upon their subscription, especially in the competetive market of CCP certified "buddies". Its genius, and imo by far the best alternate sub system Ive ever seen in an MMO. Also remarkable how stable the system has been, even without CCP intervention, for so long. (Though the large PLEX price increase from last fall of about 750mil, to 1 bil in a single year, is a bit concerning). ------------
Naraish Adarn Alexylva Paradox Low-Class 146	Posted - 2015.08.22 13:17:43 - [34] - Quote dear OP stop thinking before you diminish collective intelligence of EVE even further
Cannibal Zuza Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire 1	Posted - 2015.08.22 13:39:43 - [35] - Quote Asinar wrote: Just something I thought about (for 2 seconds). Are there any downsides, besides what little CCP looses from subs (who pays for it anyway?) Plex has plenty of other reasons to exist. One possible problem I see. Empire of Alts. Just need a new e-mail account and you can have an alt. Could have 10, a 100 alts. Nothing stopping you. But then the question is how useful that is. Well, unless you just train them for years and then try to sell them. But that possibility is there for everyone. So selling chars would not be as easy as now. I would probably create 2 extra accounts and just train whatever. In case I need something I never use. Do you think F2P will happen? Considering the wretched job CCP been doing as of late in trying to rebalance ships and reconstruct null sov, I think it's not a bad idea. It would also invite swarms of subscribers back into the game which is what CCP wants. People wouldn't no longer have to worry about risking expensive ships grinding for Plex in WH/Null sec and pvp would be a 24/7 activity for everyone which would be quite fun. This thread deserves +1
Nalelmir Ahashion Omegon 42nd Core 658	Posted - 2015.08.22 14:39:40 - [36] - Quote I need some backup here to properly convey NO in the right way, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CGDIZoXXdg8 "To know the true path, but yet, to never follow it. That is possibly the gravest sin" - The Scriptures, Book of Missions 13:21
Divine Entervention Onalot 593	Posted - 2015.08.22 16:02:35 - [37] - Quote No NO NO No no NO NO no NO Please no Knowing that Children exist is already bad enough. We all put something at risk, we all invest something, be it time to aquire PLEX or time to pay for the subs. Kids are dumb. Remove them all from the game and preferably the internet, maybe life if we can convince enough people to agree.
Kiryen O'Bannon Silver Guardians Fidelas Constans 229	Posted - 2015.08.22 16:04:44 - [38] - Quote Posting in stealth "I want to play EVE without having to either grind ISK or pay a subscription" thread. It's amazing how rife MMOs in general are with people that are hotly opposed to companies actually making money on their products. Eternal Father, King of birth, /Who didst create the heaven and earth, /And bid the planets and the sun/ Their own appointed orbits run; /O hear us when we seek thy grace /For those who soar through outer space.
5n4keyes Sacred Templars DARKNESS. 110	Posted - 2015.08.22 16:13:37 - [39] - Quote Eve could never go free to play, quite simply, because CCP then wouldn't make money. CCP would be entirely reliant on the store and char trades to make money. By going free to play, normally a game will offer new areas by expansion, or for a small cost, that here doesn't really work, you couldn't make say an area of 0.0 only work via a paywall. You also couldn't really offer in game items in return for money, as this would break the Eve economy, fairly quickly. I guess CCP could offer EXP boosts, but that's a bit... limited. What you would also have to consider would be servers, I can probably think of a good 10 people I know that would come play Eve if it was free, or certainly at least give it a go for a month. Throw in advertising and probably a lot of press, reddit, and news sites, and you are probably looking, certainly in the first week, of a boost of 10x the online players. With 90% of these new players in and around empire/newbie systems... Servers simply wont handle it.
Sobaan Tali Caldari Quick Reaction Force 559	Posted - 2015.08.22 16:15:34 - [40] - Quote Azda Ja wrote: Is it me, or are there a lot more of these "Should EVE (insert dumb idea here)!?" threads lately? Sadly, no; It is not just you. Dumb-*** ideas and aneurysm inducing brain farts are the staple of these parts of the internet neighborhood. Welcome, and mind the noise. "Tomahawks?" "----in' A, right?" "Trouble is, those things cost like a million and a half each." "----, you pay me half that and I'll hump in some c4 and blow the ---- out of it my own damn self."
Markus Reese Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State 406	Posted - 2015.08.22 16:20:26 - [41] - Quote Kiryen O'Bannon wrote: Posting in stealth "I want to play EVE without having to either grind ISK or pay a subscription" thread. It's amazing how rife MMOs in general are with people that are hotly opposed to companies actually making money on their products. I know, and in the very obvious things, Eve is CHEAP CHEAP CHEAP value for entertainment. Play more than two hours a month? Well is cheaper than a theatre ticket (before snacks) One month of eve is less money than it costs to fill the gas tank in my motorcycle. Vintage bikes I have, is a shocker on the money spent in upkeep. I spend less on a year in eve than one month of insurance... on one of my bikes. Did you eat fast food? Buy a coffee, how about pop and a bag of chips? Well that is eve subscription. If we reverse look at FTP model. I will go with the one I had the most fun, before it was free to play. STO. Is now a free to play MMO. How does it stay afloat? Well they rely on those who are more into the game. My bro is one. Him and his buddies want said ship, or item or whatever. Instead of paying to play the game, they pay for those bits that make their play fun. Essentially FTP is similar model to a DLC scheme for offline, non MMO games. A very tricky balance. The people who don't put any money into STO is only there because the free entitled group makes the game on whole more lively and as such, money to the people who put dollars into there system. If those guys have fun, even the self entitled will put bucks in. Relating it to eve, we have a similar. The subs model still works and since changing to monthly updates, is more effective. People like me are paying because (I think) they are getting essentially new DLC, features and as such, game is keeping more fresh. You know what? If I am having fun, I will even spend a few more bucks on the DLC to enhance that. I have bought AUR and ship skins. Not much dollars. I mean a frig skin is less than the cup of coffee I am drinking from a dollars perspective. As others have said, a true FTP model just wouldn't work for eve mechanics. There is too much advantage to having heavy access accounts. There are people who might be of limited funds, so making use of the plex system (indirect FTP) is quite advantageous. They are playing for free, and somebody else is able to use dollars to get above, like a FTP model. Both however are the same universe. Person A is not reliant on spending limited funds to get access to a T2 ship. It is more in game work for them. So in the end, Plex has made Eve function the same as a FTP model. Difference is just that if playing free, you progress less as apposed to being forced to pay money to get more.
flakeys Arkham Innovations 3218	Posted - 2015.08.22 18:33:21 - [42] - Quote solrac lara wrote: GOD No NONO JUST NO microtransactions are killing the videogame industry and i assure you there is nothing more toxic that the F2P comunity the game will be full abaut crying 14 old kids asking for nerfs and titans before you can blink. Yeah we are much better with the current ''mature'' players whining about changes and crying about ''but my sandbox should be like this'' ... . We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid.
Pryce Caesar Cloak and Daggers Fidelas Constans 6	Posted - 2015.08.22 18:43:57 - [43] - Quote What about a system like Guild Wars 2? You pay for the actual game, and then you do not have to pay subscriptions to keep on playing. It would eliminate the entire Pilot License system (part of what makes PLEX so valuable), but it would make the game more easily accessible to those who want to play, and those who do not want to be weighted down by needing to pay additional money to renew subscriptions.
Tippia Sunshine and Lollipops 25732	Posted - 2015.08.22 19:31:33 - [44] - Quote Pryce Caesar wrote: What about a system like Guild Wars 2? You pay for the actual game, and then you do not have to pay subscriptions to keep on playing. It would eliminate the entire Pilot License system (part of what makes PLEX so valuable), but it would make the game more easily accessible to those who want to play, and those who do not want to be weighted down by needing to pay additional money to renew subscriptions. It would also eliminate all income to CCP, which would mean they'd have to shut both the company and the game down. Unless you expect them to somehow acquire a couple of hundred thousand new accounts] each month, they'd go broke pretty much instantly. They also can't sell GÇ£expansionsGÇ¥ to make up for the difference due to how the game design is fundamentally incompatible with that kind of game world (to say nothing of customer base) fracturing. Salvos Rhoska wrote: Im confused. I thought EVE already is F2P in a very real sense (with a few caveats)? It is not F2P in any sense since to play the game, you have to have a paid-for account. That inherently and instantly disqualifies it from being F2P since the whole point of F2P is that you don't need a paid-for account. F2P relies on having something to sell to customers in large quantities to either make them stick around, or to spend more money than they otherwise would before they leave. Neither of those are really good options for EVE (arguably, they're not good options for any game), and no matter what, that kind of monetisation really needs to be integrated at the core of the game or it will be a tacked-on horror. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥ Get a good start: Newbie skillplan 2.2.
Divine Entervention Onalot 594	Posted - 2015.08.22 19:41:08 - [45] - Quote Pryce Caesar wrote: What about a system like Guild Wars 2? You pay for the actual game, and then you do not have to pay subscriptions to keep on playing. It would eliminate the entire Pilot License system (part of what makes PLEX so valuable), but it would make the game more easily accessible to those who want to play, and those who do not want to be weighted down by needing to pay additional money to renew subscriptions. Well I think people would buy the game, see that they need to train an account for X amount of days, then just log out until that X passed. Then feeling that they can't perform Y until X arrives, when X gets here they wont be able to do J S because they don't know how to play since they'd been logged out the whole time. Kind of like how it is now, new players being REQUIRED to play eve offline for at least 6 months until they're finally able to do anything worthwhile. #fact
Tippia Sunshine and Lollipops 25732	Posted - 2015.08.22 19:52:13 - [46] - Quote Divine Entervention wrote: Kind of like how it is now, new players being REQUIRED to play eve offline for at least 6 months until they're finally able to do anything worthwhile. #fact You spelled GÇ£fictionGÇ¥ wrong. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥ Get a good start: Newbie skillplan 2.2.
Jonas Kanjus Side Busters 19	Posted - 2015.08.22 19:54:11 - [47] - Quote No. Plain and simple. I have hated the F2P system since I first heard of it. These MMO companies are providing a service to us; and thus, to compensate for such service, we pay a monthly fee. It is no different than paying a monthly fee to access internet, TV, or cellphone. Yeah, sure, you can get those services at reduced costs, but you lose out on the full experience. That's what I believe with F2P games. Those that prefer to play for free lose out on the full experience of the game versus those who actually pay for the game. There are a lot worse things to throw your money at versus paying a monthly sub for a game. If an Eve player has one account and paid monthly for 10 years, that's $1180 at $15 a month. That's chump change compared to paying your monthly electric, cable/DSL, cellphone, whatever bill. IMO, certain people want everything handed to them on a silver platter w/o having to work for it. Do you think after the 10 years I've put into this game, I'd be happy to see it converted to F2P? Hell no! My inauguration date to EVE Online: 6/25/2005 8:24:57 AM UTC
Webvan All Kill No Skill 12877	Posted - 2015.08.22 19:56:01 - [48] - Quote Pryce Caesar wrote: What about a system like Guild Wars 2? You pay for the actual game, and then you do not have to pay subscriptions to keep on playing. It would eliminate the entire Pilot License system (part of what makes PLEX so valuable), but it would make the game more easily accessible to those who want to play, and those who do not want to be weighted down by needing to pay additional money to renew subscriptions. You mean GW2 which is pretty much dead? Seriously dead... Like so dead, even with merging every server which they have essentially done, they still can hardly fill a popular zone with 200 players, dead. Oh unless it's Teq, where everyone logs in for 20m to get their daily farm then logs out. I'm in it for the money Ctrl+Alt+Shift+F12
Divine Entervention Onalot 594	Posted - 2015.08.22 19:59:44 - [49] - Quote Tippia wrote: Divine Entervention wrote: Kind of like how it is now, new players being REQUIRED to play eve offline for at least 6 months until they're finally able to do anything worthwhile. #fact You spelled GÇ£fictionGÇ¥ wrong. l2read
Jonas Kanjus Side Busters 19	Posted - 2015.08.22 20:01:05 - [50] - Quote Divine Entervention wrote: Kind of like how it is now, new players being REQUIRED to play eve offline for at least 6 months until they're finally able to do anything worthwhile. #fact That's bull crap and you know it. New players are not REQUIRED to play offline for the first six months. What you fail to realize is they can still do some of the same things vets can do, but at a severe handicap. How are new players going to learn the game if they are REQUIRED to offline for six months? HELLO! New players give us vets a sense of purpose in the game. EVE Online wouldn't be much if us vets didn't have anyone to train. Nor would the game stay alive. Make sure to lick between your toes while you're sucking on your foot. My inauguration date to EVE Online: 6/25/2005 8:24:57 AM UTC
Tippia Sunshine and Lollipops 25732	Posted - 2015.08.22 20:01:08 - [51] - Quote Divine Entervention wrote: l2read I'll let you pick: did you spell GÇ£fictionGÇ¥ incorrectly, or did you forget the quotation marks around the word GÇ£requiredGÇ¥? GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥ Get a good start: Newbie skillplan 2.2.
Malcanis Vanishing Point. The Initiative. 16948	Posted - 2015.08.22 20:11:16 - [52] - Quote Divine Entervention wrote: Pryce Caesar wrote: What about a system like Guild Wars 2? You pay for the actual game, and then you do not have to pay subscriptions to keep on playing. It would eliminate the entire Pilot License system (part of what makes PLEX so valuable), but it would make the game more easily accessible to those who want to play, and those who do not want to be weighted down by needing to pay additional money to renew subscriptions. Well I think people would buy the game, see that they need to train an account for X amount of days, then just log out until that X passed. Then feeling that they can't perform Y until X arrives, when X gets here they wont be able to do J S because they don't know how to play since they'd been logged out the whole time. Kind of like how it is now, new players being REQUIRED to play eve offline for at least 6 months until they're finally able to do anything worthwhile. #fact 6 months? I thought it was a year? No, wait, 18 months? No wait 3 years! No wait 5 years! Oh wait the Aoen I bought so that I'd finally be ready to go to 0.0 got ganked "It is difficult to get a man to understand something, when his ISK/hr depends upon his not understanding it!"
Pryce Caesar Cloak and Daggers Fidelas Constans 6	Posted - 2015.08.22 20:31:09 - [53] - Quote Webvan wrote: Pryce Caesar wrote: What about a system like Guild Wars 2? You pay for the actual game, and then you do not have to pay subscriptions to keep on playing. It would eliminate the entire Pilot License system (part of what makes PLEX so valuable), but it would make the game more easily accessible to those who want to play, and those who do not want to be weighted down by needing to pay additional money to renew subscriptions. You mean GW2 which is pretty much dead? Seriously dead... Like so dead, even with merging every server which they have essentially done, they still can hardly fill a popular zone with 200 players, dead. Oh unless it's Teq, where everyone logs in for 20m to get their daily farm then logs out. But for the few that play, Anet makes big money. I've talked to a number of big fat whales that have spent $1000's in the item shop tens of thousands. Sure, it launched as a b2p, with tails of expansions to keep funding, but wound up making it really a b2p/f2p hybrid scam. They suck the blood out of people that have a hard time resisting the gambling. They make big money off of BL chest keys that can dump very rare items. Your bandwidth is being payed for by people with huge gambling addictions. The game was made for them, not you. Really, because GW2 was suggested to me because you don't pay subscriptions for it. Is it really that sparse in the actual game world?
Divine Entervention Onalot 595	Posted - 2015.08.22 20:35:40 - [54] - Quote Tippia wrote: Divine Entervention wrote: l2read I'll let you pick: did you spell GÇ£fictionGÇ¥ incorrectly, or did you forget the quotation marks around the word GÇ£requiredGÇ¥? You being one who believes what you want, believe whatever you want. I'll allow it.
Jenshae Chiroptera 2244	Posted - 2015.08.22 20:55:00 - [55] - Quote Here is a question: What if free accounts could access the test servers only? CCP - Building ant hills and magnifying glasses for fat kids There are other ways to fix Null Sec stagnation and Fozzie SOV is the wrong approach.
Jonas Kanjus Side Busters 19	Posted - 2015.08.22 20:59:20 - [56] - Quote Jenshae Chiroptera wrote: Here is a question: What if free accounts could access the test servers only? That would be a huge PITA every time CCP mirrored TQ to SiSi. They would have to find a way to separate the free accounts from the paid accounts so the free accounts don't get wiped during the mirror. My guess would be a huge no from CCP. My inauguration date to EVE Online: 6/25/2005 8:24:57 AM UTC
Webvan All Kill No Skill 12878	Posted - 2015.08.22 21:04:14 - [57] - Quote Pryce Caesar wrote: Really, because GW2 was suggested to me because you don't pay subscriptions for it. Is it really that sparse in the actual game world? It was a good idea, I played it regular for about a year from launch day (mostly for WvW), and since I played GW1 early on too, but yeah they screwed it up. After about six months people were leaving in droves after Anet went back on all their pre-launch promises, their visions of the game. It really doesn't function as b2p, and only until the game was dead did they start working on an expansion after two years into the game. As for the servers, your server is mostly just a flag on your account profile. All the servers were technically merged into one server, and when a zone fills up they make another instanced copy of the zone. Still leaves most zones empty, apart from the few heavily farmed zones though often still on a single instance of it. There are some daily farming events that will fill zones on a daily timer, such as that dragon Teq, because easy loot and chance of rare stuff. The game has become so easy my cat can play. Yeah I don't know why they did that, at least by the design of the game it could have worked as a b2p with paid expansions. I guess the money shop just got too tempting for their investors, looking for the small amount of players that will spend big money gambling as such, like how most f2p's function with their item shops. Wouldn't work for EVE, it's too late. The design/layout of the game is all wrong for a b2p, and most players would leave if it were redesigned in a way for it to work that way. Essentially EVE would need to become a whole different game, way unlike the EVE of today. And it'd need to be a rapid change, which games usually don't survive. I'm in it for the money Ctrl+Alt+Shift+F12
Jenshae Chiroptera 2244	Posted - 2015.08.22 21:12:58 - [58] - Quote Jonas Kanjus wrote: Jenshae Chiroptera wrote: Here is a question: What if free accounts could access the test servers only? That would be a huge PITA every time CCP mirrored TQ to SiSi. They would have to find a way to separate the free accounts from the paid accounts so the free accounts don't get wiped during the mirror. My guess would be a huge no from CCP. It would only matter at the log in server. "Is this a free account? Yes? Prevent it from logging onto TQ" CCP - Building ant hills and magnifying glasses for fat kids There are other ways to fix Null Sec stagnation and Fozzie SOV is the wrong approach.
Trevor Dalech We pooped on your lawn Resonance. 143	Posted - 2015.08.22 21:13:05 - [59] - Quote Asinar wrote: (who pays for it anyway?) I'm pretty sure that everyone who is selling those PLEX you use to sub your game is paying for their own subscriptions as well.
Tesal 445	Posted - 2015.08.22 21:15:56 - [60] - Quote Wasn't Dust free to play. How is that going?

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