Supers use shield boosters? rly?

+1 to this idea, I've been saying it for years.


Not all capitals are supers, Brobax.

I'd love a crystal boosting Nag or Chim for w-space.

Why would it be a bad idea for shield caps to be useful instead of just armor?

Armor for large engagements (buffer).
Shield for small gang (active).

EVEN IF active chimeras became popular for triage, NEUTS always win.

Explain again why this is a bad idea?

Hence i said

"Unless you talking about creating a new set of implants that add slave effects on shields and crystal effects on armor."

Ancillary Capital Reppers could be a thing of the future. Or Capital Shield extenders to buff up shield HP.

There are implants for superpilots that are NOT highgrade slave sets?

Nope Shield caps don't need them. shield caps all ready tank way more than armor and for the most part have more EHP so why do we need to change that?

all shield capitals? are you sure about that?

*cringes in horror at a Crystaled Swaglfar*

Don't break when something is not broken.

The Caldari ones tank more than the Amarr ones (tank bonus's) and the Minmatar ones have more ehp than the Gallente ones (support/DPS bonus's) so yes seems fine to me.

Shield caps are harder to fit, armor fits can be done on the cheap were as shield needs isk to make them worth it.. but when you don't fit your capital ship like a scrub like its a T1 cruiser hull they are very good.

Phoenix is the highest tanking dread and also the best at blaping right now. The nag is used alot in WH space with both armor and shield fits, Chimera Has the largest Active tank in the game and can have cap stable tanks above 30k dps if fitted right and 60k+ Burst tanks. Wyvern has the 2nd largest EHP's after the Leviathan both of which are more than any thing else in the game.
Levi has coolest DD in the game now and is also 2nd fastest after the rag, the rag haveing the best DD for killing armor supers is the fastest and also has more EHP than one of the other Armor titans. Nidhoggur is the best at RR'ing (quickly saving something like a pos) and has pretty much same tank as a nice fit archon if you spend some isk on it. and the Hel's are the only thing that can get close to a gang of wyverns in terms of active tanking each other while also been the fastest caps in the game.


So erm yer We don't need your help CCP plez don't mess with us.....

That being said, once you go beyond that into links and and inplants, the difference drastically shifts. It goes from small to moderate differences to vastly different situations. The potential max tank on an archon is vastly superior to the chimera, even after heat.

Add crystal effects, and diminish repaired hp of active shield boosters, or boost armor active reppers.
Can be balanced I think.

Plz Stop typing as you seem to not know anything about cap ships or even been able to use EFT. and looking at your kill-board history i can see why.




It already is balanced no need to change anything.

Im sure shield capitals are far superior to armor, thats why your alliance use armor to keep it interesting :P

Quick look at KB show PL lost 4 armor dreads this month (including a phoenix) and 1 shield fit phoenix. Clear favor for armor over shield for capital use.

PL Picked Armor supers and caps because in 2010/2011 our two most used fleet ships were both armor so it was decided at that point to have an armor super fleet so there was an escalation path from subs to caps to supers that all use the same command ships and stuff. then we invented slowcats and as our supers were mostly armor we used armor carriers... we do have a shield slowcat fleet just like we have a shield super and titan fleet but it takes time to build. but as of now we are about 70% armor and 30% shield so we can now escalate both armor and to some extent shield at this point.

PL Picked Armor supers and caps because in 2010/2011 our two most used fleet ships were both armor so it was decided at that point to have an armor super fleet so there was an escalation path from subs to caps to supers that all use the same command ships and stuff. then we invented slowcats and as our supers were mostly armor we used armor carriers... we do have a shield slowcat fleet just like we have a shield super and titan fleet but it takes time to build. but as of now we are about 70% armor and 30% shield so we can now escalate both armor and to some extent shield at this point.

You say that but shield Moros are a thing.... What is a shield cap and not a shield cap?

Crystal set does say it improves shield boosters, and Capital Shield Booster is a shield booster. I don't see why the crystal set shouldn't boost capital shield boosters.

Have seen claims from PL members for years that shield is better, but only ever seen "proof of consept" battles. If shields were the way to go you would already be using shield capital fleets as your main doctrine

Because Why.... Shield Active tanked ships already tank way more than Armor, So if they change crystals they will nerf shield boosters to compensate to a point were you WILL NEED a full crystal set to have what we have now...

Its like totally pointless change.

Yes they do,but they depend way more on capacitor than armor ones,i mean their capacitor going down faster than armor ones

Yes they do,but they depend way more on capacitor than armor ones,i mean their capacitor going down faster than armor ones

I'm inclined to believe PL when it comes to cap/super theorycraft tbh.

Yes they do,but they depend way more on capacitor than armor ones,i mean their capacitor going down faster than armor ones

They say shield work better but keep increasing their armor capital numbers. If shields were realy as good as they say there is no way they would stick to armor for so many years.

So if we trust the theorycrafters in PL, armor capital is the way to go!

How can we swap now? like really how... do you know some one who would like to swap 2000 armor caps 400 armor supers and 150 armor titans for shield ones......if you can find some one who is willing to swap convo me. you have no idea wtf you are on about so plz stfu.

Shield supers might be better but when you have one of the largest super fleets in the game anyway it makes no sence to swap over for the limited gains you would get and the way it is the best way round to have it (as we will all ways have armor supers anyway because people like the nyx and the iron man aeon's ) is the have more of the weaker ones (i.e armor) and less of the stronger shield ones. But this is all totally off topic anyway because Supers don't active tank nor need crystal sets..

Shield caps are balanced fine were they are now all we need is a resign for people to use caps for sov and we all gravy

I might be more willing to believe that, if it weren't the exact same scenario for pretty much every other super fleet in the game. I imagine someone out there runs a shield-heavy doctrine, but I haven't seen it before.

How can we swap now? like really how... do you know some one who would like to swap 2000 armor caps 400 armor supers and 150 armor titans for shield ones.....

we do have a shield slowcat fleet just like we have a shield super and titan fleet but it takes time to build. but as of now we are about 70% armor and 30% shield so we can now escalate both armor and to some extent shield at this point.

170+ shield supers and 60+ shield titans (going by numbers provided by PL people in this thread).
Thats 3.4 FULL fleets of capital ships + almost a full fleet of titan/SC, yet armor is what is used...

I don't think you maths very well.
Maybe you would be deemed more credible if you posted with something other than a forum alt as some of your other posts in some other topics are not as bad...

Shield caps have more EHP than armor caps even WITH full Slaves plugged in. Absolutely not.

No, they don't. Go ahead and show the capital that doesn't outclass its counterpart/contender when it gets a ~50% bonus to its tank.

E: Recorrection, jumped the gun. Still a dank tank this phoenix though.

So you have around 850+ shield caps, 170+ shield supers and 60+ shield titans (going by numbers provided by PL people in this thread).
Thats 3.4 FULL fleets of capital ships + almost a full fleet of titan/SC, yet armor is what is used...

The numbers were just ball park random numbers. Its not a 70/30 split its a bit random, we have more shield titans than shield supers we have more shield dreads than shield carriers think we have more Aeons than we have Titans and all other supers put together shield and armor. we have more archons than any other cap prob 4 to 1 in reality. We have lots of things more than most and we prob have more shield supers in PL than any other single alliance and we don't even have an official shield super fleet.
Regardless of numbers we cannot practicably swap everything over and its not realty worth it for us at this point when we have the numbers we have anyway. they can be better but its not that much better at the numbers PL fields and no one cares about the "what if" B-R mk2 happens... Shield makes sense in the small number game as you can have 20 wyvern's vs 30 isk nyx's and win with maybe 1-2 losses max but when your dropping 50-100-200 supers on stuff and if some one can counter you TANKS are a bit irreverent when dread bombs can alpha all supers when in the max sized fleet of caps range of fighting....

But this is all off topic of shield active tanked caps

my purpose was from the first post,that i`d like too see dreads/carrier shield ,supers dont need this because they need maximum resistts and then cap chain/reps,as much resists ,but dreads and carrier in triage,you cant rep them,thats why they need their boost to be improved.

Im sure you understand that i can only use the numbers provided by PL members, if those are not the correct numbers the math i do with it will ofc not be spot on :P
Can i ask why you dont have an official shield super fleet if they are better and you have the numbers for it?
About you having more shield supers than any other lliance, you proberly have more shield supers that most other alliances have supers but still "only" use armor.

I am just going to stop this off topic discussion here as you keep asking questions that have nothing to do with the OP and you seem to have no clue how the game works. If you would like to continue convo Tappits in game.

An A-type EANM increases armor EHP by 54.77%. An overloaded A-type invulnerability field (yes, overloading is relevant, because you can OL an A-type for about 20 minutes) increases shield EHP by 128.57%. The shield tanker has more EHP than the slaved-up armor tanker upon fitting the first resist module, let alone any additional modules.

I'm not seeing what you're getting at here. I'm not using an EANM on this fit and itsoutpacing the chimera still. Same for their super cousins. Haven't played with the Titans yet though.

But, like tippits said, this is about the active tanking aspect. Which I am very willing to admit, shouldn't simply be an allowance of the bonus to work on capital modules without other tweaks or changes. For me, it's mostly about expanding the use of the implants so that it is not simply excluded from an entire class. And I honestly think the best solution would be to modify both armor and shield active tanks so that, like the buffer tanks, there is less broad of a distinction before adding variables and allow it to expand better as it goes. And with the capital rebalance coming (soon(?)), this is a great opportunity to smooth out the inconsistencies and whacky patterns as much as possible.

So because you cannot work out how to make Shield tanks better than armor tanks you would like CCP to make implants work to help?
Is that what you are saying? because i have no clue what any of you are going on about other than you don't seem to be able to use EFT or have no clue how to fit capital ships or both. i mean i don't get it the only thing i can think of is non of you used capitals very offten or something so you don't know how they work or something because its pretty simple stuff.
on everything from Frigs to Dreads... All active tanked armor ships use less cap then there Shield counterparts but shield use more cap but can tank more... and because shield active tanking implants don't work on caps they have ALLREADY been balanced to still be better.... Yes on some setups Armor with slaves will have more EHP than shield but the shield active tanks are still better which ever way you look at it.... (and in some cases shield EHP is also more (or very very close) to armor on a few ships

You have somehow missed all the points I made in that post, and managed to infuse something that I never said, nor do I think I implied. Congratulations.

I'm not seeing what you're getting at here. I'm not using an EANM on this fit and itsoutpacing the chimera still. Same for their super cousins. Haven't played with the Titans yet though.

But, like tippits said, this is about the active tanking aspect. Which I am very willing to admit, shouldn't simply be an allowance of the bonus to work on capital modules without other tweaks or changes. For me, it's mostly about expanding the use of the implants so that it is not simply excluded from an entire class. And I honestly think the best solution would be to modify both armor and shield active tanks so that, like the buffer tanks, there is less broad of a distinction before adding variables and allow it to expand better as it goes. And with the capital rebalance coming (soon(?)), this is a great opportunity to smooth out the inconsistencies and whacky patterns as much as possible.

Shield caps need a nerf, not a buff via Crystals. They are already strictly superior to armor caps in basically every way, the only reason armor caps are still used is because you can't mix doctrines and if you already have 500 Aeons you're kind of stuck.

Yer they will if you look just at EFT numbers because shield is good at max burst tanking so in eft they look like they cap out super quick but if you manage your cap...(just like you would on an active tanked PVP BS or something) that's were they start to shine.

The problem is that capacitor logi is too strong. Fix capacitor logi, suddenly it comes into balance. Armor tanks are better for EHP and capacitor efficiency, shield tanks are better for quick reps and max rep rate.

So armor get to be the default for any large fight because shield logi cap out anyway?

As if a Phoenix can't tank enough DPS...not supporting the idea.
Nevertheless, the fact that there are no good implant sets for shield capitals (even though some people will mention nomads and ascendancies, I consider those to be niche implants that are useless in most capital fleet fights) remains to be a problem. We need shield version of the slave set, which should be added to few Caldari LP stores. Similarly, we need implant sets for every empire faction. I suggest the following bonuses:

• Amarr: Capacitor amount
• Minmatar: Scan resolution
• Gallente: Targeting range or something Drone-related, like hitpoints or control range

Naturally, they should be weaker than the pirate implant sets and come without a high-grade version. 20-25% bonus from shield slave set should be enough.

Oh, right. Because the devs never broke anything else when they do their "rebalancing" changes.

If you don't think a 20-25% bonus to cap amount implant could make loads of things OP or the other guys idea of 50% cycle time on reps is not OP i don't know what to say.