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Shadow Mancer Interstellar eXodus R0ADKILL	Posted - 2006.12.31 12:40:00 - [811] Originally by: Butter Dog Originally by: Dianabolic Amusingly whilst BD is wailing at the decision not to engage the aaa capital fleet and siege a pos, apparently motivated by MC not wanting to lose because it's bad for the image. So like, what if they had sieged, and won? And killed a load of aAa battleships? How would that look on the resumT? Hell, how would the ATTEMPT look on the resumT? It would take brass balls of steel and only add to the reputation, I reckon. Yet they still didn't make the call. Go figure, maybe the odds were really THAT BAD. This is it! Even if it wasnt on that particular day, we SHOULD have engaged AAA. Yes, they are good. Yes, they are fearsome. But my God, what a fantastic scrap it would have been. Not that we'll ever know because everyone lacks the nads to take them on. U wanted fame? u wanted to be remembered as someone who FC-ed ISS fleet against fearsome AAA? I'll give u an advice, evemail Scooter1 of Roadkill and ask him how he did lead our small Alliance to stand up against mighty D2 and how we got to keep our station. He will teach u how to do it man, and one thing i'm sure after his real FC lessons u'll stop crying on public forums too. See ya Always smacking in local near you
LoxyRider Body Count Inc. Mercenary Coalition	Posted - 2006.12.31 13:10:00 - [812] Edited by: LoxyRider on 31/12/2006 13:13:19 The allegations against MC are nothing new; we fake contracts, we are scared, we blob, etc... welcome to the forums itÆs nothing new. You go around shouting "facts" everywhere when in reality itÆs just your opinion. The pm from Count was from the early morning after AAA arrived and if I were in his position when my high negotiation position, war momentum and wallet were all about to take a hit I would be tired and annoyed now. I'd bet every isk in my wallet Count is kicking himself for a mail he didn't really mean. But then it still doesn't matter (to the MC at least, not going to touch iss/count's reputation here). We got paid for f4r, that's a contract, while we would have liked to go on to the other systems for more money that night it was a no no. AAA didn't disappear over night and this was a couple days before Christmas, the MC have been on break for the past week and a bit enjoying Christmas with our goal of taking F4R complete. So like I said your nothing but the usual idiot trying to discredit an alliance/corp with his opinions which he demands everyone recognise as world changing facts. Now for fun lets look at Butter Dogs performance in this war. Start of the war, Butter is not in ISS but has been in the past and so sticks up for them on the forums proclaiming the coming death of IAC all while comfortable on the sidelines. He gets some stick on the forums for this, why if heÆs such a supporter and so comfortable in the thought of ISS winning does he not join them and do his bit. So the on the 13th at 22:01 he joins ISS, let me just explain why that date is a bit funny. On the 10th war was declared, and for two days IAC roam ISS space, no sign of butter dog. On the evening of the 12th MC are hired and jump in and put down our pos for all to see and everything changes in the war. And lo and behold the next night on the 13th Butter Dog joins us. He must have thought ISS still needed help perhaps? So the week goes well, we are joined by LV and yes it went all to plan, some long nights full of dread ops and we take control of the F4R, Butter Dog was obviously doing his bit for his friends in ISS! But then the 21st, F4R is done, while we were hoping to carry on into JBY AAA show up and throw a spanner in the works. That nights op is called off which I don't think anyone disagrees with that, even Butter. So then we have a stalemate, the next few days Christmas comes, MC relaxes, the war losses all momentum. Thank god Butter Dog is still around to do... well I'm not sure you'll have to ask him, I didn't notice him rally the troops to take down the so called invincible AAA anyhow. Cut to the 28th, MC are done and we begin to pull out. Oh dear looks like the war may be a little harder then expected. What will Butter Dog do! Without MC and friends about it looks like he may actually have to fight and face loosing! But he only joined when all the odds were against IAC and he wanted to back up his forum antics! Ohnoes! But lucky for him a mail was on his way. An ex ISSN LEADER, and in his words "Old friend and colleague" mailed him about his latest forum posts daring to suggest they were not helpful and said the dreaded "stfu". Obviously rather then this being from an old friend it was from the whole MC! He had his reason to leave! Yay! So to the forums, the 29th, he goes claiming "The MC wont stop ordering him about". Spouting all sorts of drivel which makes up most of this forum anyway. And his brave honourable self declares that he refuses to work with the MC anymore and will therefore leave. How convenient again that the day after the MC starts to leave (and therefore Butter Dog wouldn't be working with us in anycase) and that the war suddenly looks like a challenge for ISS that poor Butter Dog is forced to leave under moral grounds.
LoxyRider Body Count Inc. Mercenary Coalition	Posted - 2006.12.31 13:10:00 - [813] To sum it up a timeline for you. 10th IAC declare war Butter Dog supports ISS on the forums and is encouraged to actually do something about it. 12th MC are contracted and jump into F4R in the evening. 13th 22:01 at night Butter Dog joins ISS after seeing MC and friends arrive and being sure of a smooth ride, +10 points to his forum status. 21st Things take a bump with AAA, the op that night is cancelled, things are put on hold over Christmas. 28th MC are back from Christmas, nothing has happened during the week and we have our money for F4R so we begin to pull out. 29th Butter Dog now realising heÆs being left behind to actually fight uses a mail from an old friend as an excuse to blame the MC for everything. Decides that he cant stay in the ISS because he just has to bring these things to public. So in conclusion, we have someone who smacked about the war on the forums, was in a position when he would really have to get stuck in himself to not loose face but waits for three days until its clear ISS have brought in help and that it should go smoothly until he joins. And then when he is faced with the prospect of being stuck in ISS and a long war makes an excuse to leave ISS and claim to be a moral hero. Well done sir! Not only have you proven YOURSELF to be a complete coward, you have caused severe damage to the alliance you apparently cared about, severe damage to the leader of that alliance that you called a friend because you put him in a situation where he had no choice and severe damage between ISS and MC which puts ISS in a bit of trouble if the next time they need our help we decide its not worth the hassle.
Seleene Body Count Inc. Mercenary Coalition	Posted - 2006.12.31 13:29:00 - [814] I have a question about our first contract on IAC - Butter said he got that information from Count. Ummm... why would Count T know who the client was? I didn't tell him. The number of people who know this information, including the client, can be counted on one hand. Count and I did speak more than once about the possible fate of the IAC stations at the time, due to their close proximity, but that's it. - Vid - 'Images of War'
MaidMarion FarCry Inc Imperium Alliance	Posted - 2006.12.31 13:36:00 - [815] Originally by: Butter Dog Edited by: Butter Dog on 31/12/2006 11:17:41 I'll leave you with a quick thread recap to flame about while I'm out partying for a few days, bascially my main claims and what the result is; * MC refused to engage AAA in offensive operations, full stop Result: Fact. They refused to engage in that one fight, thats true. They also called off all offensive operations with AAA in the picture, even when most of AAA logged in and left the next day. This led directly to.... * MC did not complete the full contract with ISS Result: Fact. With AAA in the picture, taking the other outposts, even with overwhelming numbers in our favour and the choice of two different systems to siege (AAA can only log out in one of them), they walked away. * ISS was dissapointed with MC's performance in relation to the overall contract Result: Fact, as proven by the PM from count expressing his dissapointment in them. No matter how MC spin it, they failed to complete all objectives (for whatever reason), and their employer was left high and dry with only one outpost out of three, and a resurgent IAC to deal with. * MC refuse difficult contracts, or walk away from tough fights Result: Fact. The best source of this was not just the AAA example, or the total cakewalk in F4 in which MC deployed 20% of the numbers but claimed 100% of the credit, but their own ex-leader stating they DID used to accept easy contracts, and shy away from real challenges. * There was no employer for the first Prohibition contract Result: Stalemate. I have given my source, and provided my evidence. The onus is now on MC to provide proof, which they refuse to do. However, an ex-MC leader has stated that he would not put this past them. And that sums it up pretty well I think. And don't forget, I only revealed my source for a couple of those points because he decided to come on this thread and lie about me. That blew up in his face pretty good. Oh... but according to MC, I'm the one who is discredited HAPPY NEW YEAR! First, these are my opinions, not those of Imperium BD :MC refused to engage AAA in offensive operations, full stop So what, MC is a merc corp who work on very detailed plan. If something big enough comes into the picture to change the outcome of that plan - its time for a new plan. They dont make money by suiciding cap fleets. BD : * MC did not complete the full contract with ISS So you say - maybe there was contract for one with option for others ? hence only the payment of the first system. BD: * ISS was dissapointed with MC's performance in relation to the overall contract No - that was one mans opinion as to why MC didnt suicide a fleet - someone who probably knows little of pvp. Think ill take Seleene as an FC over you or count. BD : * MC refuse difficult contracts, or walk away from tough fights However you percieve it - MC is a business entity, they are there to make money, and they are the best at what they do. Part of their business plan is (tada) PROMOTION !!! Yes ! a business CAN have an image !! Thank you for pointing out the obvious. (and making it sound like some back room conspiracy)
Hans Roaming Body Count Inc. Mercenary Coalition	Posted - 2006.12.31 13:38:00 - [816] Originally by: Seleene I have a question about our first contract on IAC - Butter said he got that information from Count. Ummm... why would Count T know who the client was? I didn't tell him. The number of people who know this information, including the client, can be counted on one hand. Count and I did speak more than once about the possible fate of the IAC stations at the time, due to their close proximity, but that's it. Seleene didn't tell the MC so why would he tell Count who it was or if it was fake. If the contract was fake then why would we not just say we're going on a road trip, what would be the motivation to attack IAC in the first place even, ships maybe for fun but not cap ops. Finally if that contract was fake why would KIA get paid? That would be going to the extreme wouldn't it when we could have just said we're off on a road trip, I mean nothing against the 'rules' doing that is it. Saying mercs do fake contracts is an easy thing as mercs either have to break their clients confidentiality or say nothing. One might as well claim that no mercs take contracts when a client doesn't say they were hired.
Der Pfaffe KIA Corp	Posted - 2006.12.31 13:40:00 - [817] I'll join in again and try to sum up. Butter you began your tirade against MC by stating that you knew unpleasant facts about them backed up by hard evidence. The only "hard evidence" you produced was the now famous PM which only proves that Count was unhappy with the fact that MC refused to suicide their dread fleet. That referred to one night not the whole contract. On the unpaid contracts subject (I'll remind you again, you originally said there were several but have since reduced it to one) you also produced some hearsay based on Count telling you something that someone had told him. As I said in an earlier post hearsay is considered inadmissible in most courts of law, so it's not a stalemate it simply does not exist. You saying "I named my source...." doesn't mean he actually said it. I also mentioned earlier that KIA was involved in that first IAC contract and was paid, most likely by the same client, which would tend to support MC's claim. Your promised hard evidence has turned out to be speculation based on your own very biased opinion. It's quite pathetic really. Your reputation has gone along with any credibility you might have had. Nobody that has carefully read this thread will ever trust you with any information that could be considered remotely sensitive. What's even sadder is that it all happened because you threw a tantrum. Good luck in finding a new home and happy new year.
Istvaan Shogaatsu Guiding Hand Social Club	Posted - 2006.12.31 13:47:00 - [818] I think a little civility is in order. The Mercenary Coalition performed splendidly. That their employer saw fit to turn on them in the middle of the campaign is unfortunate, but as far as my (very very accurate) opinion is concerned, the MC did everything that was expected of them.
Phoenus Caldari Body Count Inc. Mercenary Coalition	Posted - 2006.12.31 13:48:00 - [819] Originally by: Istvaan Shogaatsu I think a little civility is in order. The Mercenary Coalition performed splendidly. That their employer saw fit to turn on them in the middle of the campaign is unfortunate, but as far as my (very very accurate) opinion is concerned, the MC did everything that was expected of them. Istvaan, every time you post here, there's the sound of a million tinfoil hats being rustled in the breeze. It's great, I love it [ 2006.08.16 20:49:06 ] (combat) Your Electron Blaster Cannon II barely scratches Dominix [NTEMS]<HELLH>(Dominix), causing 1908.4 damage.
Xander Magnus Caldari Wolf Enterprises	Posted - 2006.12.31 13:58:00 - [820] Yes ladies and gentleman, the truth is out... BD cannot be trusted and backstabbed his alliance, and Count is a human being! Come on guys, we all vent our irritations sometimes to the people nearest to us. So what if Count had to vent some steam after a meeting about the war. He didn't do it publicly and after he had some time to cool down and realize he isn't a military mastermind he decided it wasn't that bad after all. I bet Seleene isn't happy with Count all of the time as well, so what if she PM's a friend in MC about it? They're businesspartners, not friends. It doesn't make Count untrustworthy, it simply makes him a human being. His post was a political view of the situation and in his function as chairman, the PM was the person that eats his dinner while talking to his family. It does however show that you cannot share your personal views with Butter Dog, because when the time comes and things heat up he'll use it if he thinks he is justified. Well, there is no justification for telling the world something that was told to you in trust, not even when you part ways. And Count's post certainly didn't justify breaking that trust, no matter how someone would like it to be so he can tell the world his little secret. And like always people are grabbing this incident to tell ISS will not survive this, I find that kind of hard to believe. They've survived much worse slander on the eve-o forums, and like I said, it's just business for them. It's still one of the few alliances you can trust making a deal with, this thread hasn't proven otherwise.
James Lyrus Lyrus Associates Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2006.12.31 14:01:00 - [821] Edited by: James Lyrus on 31/12/2006 14:06:14 Look. Page 30. Wheee, I feel special. Is this better than the ASCN/BoB threads got in the pagecount?
mudders Office linebackers Center for Disease Creation	Posted - 2006.12.31 14:06:00 - [822] I hear there are plans to make a movie about the thread regarding the current conflict. Prohibition 2: The Wrath of Butters /Arnie accent - 'This time its personal' o7 iac/sod ______________ [DLINE] Mudders And on the 7th day the lord spoke'th "...and let there be man-love..."
Azzaa Caldari Umbra Congregatio Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2006.12.31 14:07:00 - [823] its ok mc we still love ya My little message to butter dog
Verone Veto.	Posted - 2006.12.31 14:07:00 - [824] This is getting out of hand guys, you all need to cool off tbh. I don't really care for the outcome of this whole peen swinging contest but lets lay down some hard line facts from one of the guys who was sat watching, and took part in the organisation that took F4R for ISS. As simple as possible. I was contacted by Count of ISS for our corp to act as a raiding party in Catch during the siege of F4R and to assist support of ISS and MC capital ships where needed. The deal was that the forces allied for this contract would push into F4R and combined capital forces from ISS and MC would start dropping towers and replacing them with ISS towers, removal of further outposts from IAC was dependant on the first operation's success, and further payment to MC for the risk to their capital fleet. I know this because we were intended to be there as support. I can also confirm that while Veto was being paid weekly for our service, MC was being paid per system that lit up on the map for ISS. We jumped the gun, ISS were informed and it was decided to drop an MC tower at an available moon in the system (5-1) to act as a staging point. For the first 36 hours of the contract, without having been paid yet, Veto flew alongside MC as a support group, with ISS still neutral. Bizzarely enough ISS were still shooting at us, regardless of the fact that we were contracted by them and assisting them. I personally spent THIRTY SIX HOURS in ZXIC attempting to get docking rights from ISS after repeated attacks by their members left me with 4% structure on my Taranis ( ) several ISS pilots lost ships and pods to our members and MC fighers in our control, as self defense, with one of our pilots also losing a ship and pod. From then on the system was attacked and the first few towers reinforced, by the hands of ISS and MC while we assisted smaller MC forces and ISSN in locking down the stargates in the system and generally patrolling the area. IAC responded by taking a shot at breaking our gatecamps up, some awesome fights were had, and I can say IAC have huge nuts. After a while, LV showed up with their big fluffy toy, as well as FIX, unpaid and here basically to assist in the fun. AAA also made an appearence, rallying in support of IAC and forming up in JBY to protect IAC assets there. Fair move, nicely played. After a problem with TQ recognising ISS sovreignty in F4R, we shot up the station and ISS claimed it. At this point, this is where the stories start to differ. MC and ourselves had sucessfully assisted ISS in taking F4R, as contracted by ISS. LV and FIX arrival was voluntary, but a welcome sight in my eyes. Christmas arrived and the action wound down, Veto's second week's payment was made 4 days late, on Christmas Eve after repeated attempts to contact ISS management. Despite this we continued to fight. We waited to see what was going to happen, no orders were given, so our client was contacted and we were asked to patrol with an NBSI policy to keep traffic regulated in the area, as capital ships ops were on hold. ISS put a hold on capital ship operations to speak to IAC with regards to a diplomatic solution. Talks appeared to fail after several days (we were not informed of the outcome by ISS), and after no new issue of orders, coupled with the fact our third week payment was late by 36 hours, I pulled the plug on Veto's part in the war as per out contracting charter and walked away to regroup the corp in Sendaya for the trip home. (29th Dec) Shortly after that, I spoke to MC who were also in the process of pulling out due to reasons of their own, catalysed by the fact that ISS were given six hours to form up a fleet in assistance of removal of the MC tower from moon 5-1 in F4R. They failed to do so, and IAC gained a foothold in F4R once more due to poor organisation. That's about it really, Everyone hired did what they were paid to. Not once did I hear anyone say all 3 outposts were our objective. Cold. Hard. Fact. VETO FOR HIRE
Lowa Gallente North Star Networks Cruel Intentions	Posted - 2006.12.31 14:07:00 - [825] Edited by: Lowa on 31/12/2006 14:12:13 Originally by: Istvaan Shogaatsu I think a little civility is in order. The Mercenary Coalition performed splendidly. That their employer saw fit to turn on them in the middle of the campaign is unfortunate, but as far as my (very very accurate) opinion is concerned, the MC did everything that was expected of them. I always get this tingely-icy-feel when you post. Strange thing that is. Its like the cold breath of impending doom blowing through the thread... shivers Edit: Verone, thank you. Regards, Lowa ps. Well, tbh, I just want this thread to pass into 30p! What if the truth was something else?
Static Ga'lraith Sharks With Frickin' Laser Beams Mercenary Coalition	Posted - 2006.12.31 14:13:00 - [826] Originally by: Verone Not once did I hear anyone say all 3 outposts were our objective. Cold. Hard. Fact. Verowned. ----------------
Istvaan Shogaatsu Guiding Hand Social Club	Posted - 2006.12.31 14:13:00 - [827] Yeah, I know that cold breath of impending doom is a problem. I should stop eating Altoids. Maybe switch to cinnamon flavor.
Some Character Has an opinion that he would like to tell EVERYONE	Posted - 2006.12.31 14:27:00 - [828] Originally by: mudders I hear there are plans to make a movie about the thread regarding the current conflict. Prohibition 2: The Wrath of Butters /Arnie accent - 'This time its personal' o7 iac/sod You're late
Sergio Ling Standard Operations Building Services Maelstrom Alliance	Posted - 2006.12.31 14:49:00 - [829] Originally by: Seleene I have a question about our first contract on IAC - Butter said he got that information from Count. Ummm... why would Count T know who the client was? I didn't tell him. The number of people who know this information, including the client, can be counted on one hand. Count and I did speak more than once about the possible fate of the IAC stations at the time, due to their close proximity, but that's it. This sounds true enough. I know at the time there was talk of buying an IAC outpost from the MC (we were red at the time), so ISS would naturally have been contacted over it as well _ Welcome to Rancho Zoidberg
Grimpak Gallente Twisted Attitude	Posted - 2006.12.31 14:54:00 - [830] ok I must say that this thread has gone beyond legendary. honestly it has! oh and of course I must put here the obligatory "posting in a legendary thread", altho the title of "super-legendary thread" is more appealing. ------- Originally by: Tiuwaz for caldari perception weapons that hit up to 100km are short range weapons
Gutsani The Priory Shroud Of Darkness	Posted - 2006.12.31 15:06:00 - [831] Edited by: Gutsani on 31/12/2006 15:10:03 Edited by: Gutsani on 31/12/2006 15:08:34 Statistics Since the creation of this thread, an average of 13 post per hour were made. A total of 58496 people readed this thread. Yes YOU are one of them! This equals to one post each ~5 minutes! pph: 13 vph: 860 Next calculation is words per post, anyone wanna help? Then times derailed. Then posts by forum warriors. Chribba can prolly make a nice script for this all? pph = posts per hour. vph = views per hour. ------------------------ Stop reading my siggy!
nickky01 The Priory Shroud Of Darkness	Posted - 2006.12.31 15:10:00 - [832] Originally by: Gutsani Edited by: Gutsani on 31/12/2006 15:08:34 Statistics Since the creation of this thread, an average of 13 post per hour were made. A total of 58496 people readed this thread. Yes YOU are one of them! This equals to one post each ~5 minutes! pph: 13 vph: 860 Next calculation is words per post, anyone wanna help? Then times derailed. Then posts by forum warriors. pph = posts per hour. vph = views per hour. i'm pretty sure my last 4-5 posts have been defending my title "winner of the thread"
Straith GALAXIAN Rule of Three	Posted - 2006.12.31 15:15:00 - [833] Originally by: nickky01 i'm pretty sure my last 4-5 posts have been defending my title "winner of the thread"
Adril Alatar Minmatar No Quarter.	Posted - 2006.12.31 15:16:00 - [834] Originally by: nickky01 i'm pretty sure my last 4-5 posts have been defending my title "winner of the thread" you can't be the winner.... the winner is elchief for starting this thread
nickky01 The Priory Shroud Of Darkness	Posted - 2006.12.31 15:21:00 - [835] Originally by: Straith Originally by: nickky01 i'm pretty sure my last 4-5 posts have been defending my title "winner of the thread" LOL yay i won \o/
DHB FooFighter FIRMA Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2006.12.31 15:48:00 - [836] cheif, for the love of god ask the mods to lock this thread Then we can continue smacking around ISS without having to alt-tab while camping their stations to see if anyone has posted replies. --------------------------------------------
Duke Grail Darkblade Technologies Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2006.12.31 16:12:00 - [837] i support no lock!!!! let the count reply first "If there were more people like us... there'ed be more people like us"
Belid Hagen The Graduates Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2006.12.31 16:34:00 - [838] For the love of.... well... EVE Let this thread die
HeadWar Minmatar North Star Networks Cruel Intentions	Posted - 2006.12.31 17:07:00 - [839] Woah. Someone's been a bit heavyhanded with the moderation I think. Last I looked, there was 30 pages here, and one rather amusing post with statistics of posts per hour and views per hour. Where did they go?
Sergio Ling Standard Operations Building Services Maelstrom Alliance	Posted - 2006.12.31 17:09:00 - [840] yeah, has this forum been trimmed? _ Welcome to Rancho Zoidberg

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