EVE Search - Why on earth is low-sec so empty?!

Check My IP Information

All Channels

EVE General Discussion

Why on earth is low-sec so empty?!

» Click here to find additional results for this topic using Google

Monitor this thread via RSS [?]

Pages: 1 2 3 :: [one page]

Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 0 post(s)
Danthomir	Posted - 2007.01.22 03:32:00 - [1] New player here. o/ I've spent the past week or two doing missions, stealing ore, and pirating in low-sec fairly close to high-population Empire space. Amamake and whatnot... Just now, however, I had to take a looong trip through lowsec's more distant parts. And they're all empty. Allright, not all: some systems are full of people, from good agents I assume. And other systems have one or two folks inside. The rest, however, are completely clear and just SCREAM "Exploit me!" All this time I was under the impression that low-sec was a dangerous place filled with roving bands of pirates, and near major hubs that looks like the case. But it's not! Deeper in, system after system are completely empty! You can go into an empty system and start ratting/mining. Pirate shows up? Safespot or go to another empty system the second they're in Local. Someone unknown shows up in a ship that -could- be a risk? Set your scanner on a few AU, and keep scanning to see if they're warping to your belt. Second they approach, safespot -> new system. Do people not realise how roomy the more distant parts of lowsec are? Do they think all of it is as dangerous as Amamake and surroundings? Is that why they cram in five to an asteroid field into highsec? I have no idea, but I know one thing: I'm packing up my stuff, selling off spare ships, and moving. Elbow room AND higher profits? Oh hell YEAH :D
Dark Shikari Caldari Imperium Technologies Firmus Ixion	Posted - 2007.01.22 03:44:00 - [2] Shhhh! Don't tell anyone! P.S. Low sec ores are now 2-3x as profitable as high sec ores yet not much less profitable than 0.0... and they're often in systems with 50% refineries... -[23] Member- Listen to EVE-Trance Radio! (DSTrance channel ingame)
Mi Lai Sanguine Legion	Posted - 2007.01.22 03:45:00 - [3] Some of the local pirates there have either become inactive or packed up to other places over the last couple of months. I'm pretty confident the action will pick up eventually, Amamake allways does.
Marcus TheMartin Gallente Tuxedo.	Posted - 2007.01.22 04:13:00 - [4] Simply put people don't like getting shot. So they go to empire. People get shot in empire and they make a post about the privateers (high sec pirates so to speak). That then leads to people proposing new shards and such so they can carebear it up without worry. Which leads to pirates making posts. Which leads to the neutrals making unbiased posts that are often called wines as a method of making said argument null and void so thusly any one asking for change is called a whiner. thats whats going on with lowsec and spilling over to the forums Please resize your signature picture to be no more than 400x120 pixels, 24000 bytes. - Devil ([email protected])
ReePeR McAllem The Carebear Stare Privateer Alliance	Posted - 2007.01.22 04:21:00 - [5] Originally by: Dark Shikari Shhhh! Don't tell anyone! P.S. Low sec ores are now 2-3x as profitable as high sec ores yet not much less profitable than 0.0... and they're often in systems with 50% refineries... Talk about digging yerself a hole... coconuts...
ScreamingLord Sutch Hand in Mouth	Posted - 2007.01.22 04:23:00 - [6] Not true! All chokepoints to lowsec are camped by vicious giants who fart citadel torpedos and pew pew laser from thieir eyes! I read this in SWA corp chat so it must be true!
Marcus TheMartin Gallente Tuxedo.	Posted - 2007.01.22 04:29:00 - [7] Originally by: ScreamingLord Sutch Not true! All chokepoints to lowsec are camped by vicious giants who fart citadel torpedos and pew pew laser from thieir eyes! I read this in SWA corp chat so it must be true! Noob corp chat is always hillarious one time some one posted pron and every one was like wow I never want to see you naked again Please resize your signature picture to be no more than 400x120 pixels, 24000 bytes. - Devil ([email protected])
RedLion Caldari evenova	Posted - 2007.01.22 04:32:00 - [8] I made tons of alts and tried traveling into all the big alliance spaces... Noone there to gank me. Ofc I couldn't dock at their stations even when i tried... and the pirate NPC battleships payed no interest in me. 0.0 is dull. I wouldn't mind moving agents out in low sec, too bad the best agents are currently in high sec.
Marcus TheMartin Gallente Tuxedo.	Posted - 2007.01.22 04:37:00 - [9] Originally by: RedLion I made tons of alts and tried traveling into all the big alliance spaces... Noone there to gank me. Ofc I couldn't dock at their stations even when i tried... and the pirate NPC battleships payed no interest in me. 0.0 is dull. I wouldn't mind moving agents out in low sec, too bad the best agents are currently in high sec. The mission runner lobby would have an uproar Please resize your signature picture to be no more than 400x120 pixels, 24000 bytes. - Devil ([email protected])
Maximillian Pele Caldari Jewel Enterprises	Posted - 2007.01.22 04:52:00 - [10] Edited by: Maximillian Pele on 22/01/2007 04:50:33 The problem is that some areas of low sec are so empty that when a pirate comes around guess who they'll be after. As soon as I got my retriever I tried ninja mining in Amarr low sec. Did everything right - set up BMs away from the warp in points, made multiple SS, and had insta dock BMs. The system I was in usually had just me, and I got to know the non-hostile locals. Sat alligned to warp, watched local like a hawk. I had all the Jaspet I could mine. So I should have got rich right? Even though I am on GMT -10 and only 13,000 K were on, I was still found by people who wanted to kill me within a couple of hours at most. I couldn't jet can mine as the pirates camped the can or blew it up. Once they knew where I was they keep returning. Going through a gate was russian roulete. Getting the zydrine out took ages. In the end I spent 50% of my time in a SS or docked. I made little more than I could have made in high sec for far less hassle. And I never lost a ship doing it. Now I mine in 0.0 and commute to high sec. In times of doubt I ask myself "What would BoB do?", and then do the opposite.

6Bagheera9 Shadows of the Dead Aftermath Alliance	Posted - 2007.01.22 05:15:00 - [11] Some areas of low-sec are persistently empty and as long as you keep your wits about you, you should be okay. Its where low-sec borders on 0.0 or high-sec that you need to really watch your ass. These places get alot of traffic, pirates will roam both areas and 0.0 alliances/corps will kill anyone that comes to their front door.
Dagle Minmatar Defense Advanced Research Projects Agency	Posted - 2007.01.22 05:19:00 - [12] Originally by: Maximillian Pele Edited by: Maximillian Pele on 22/01/2007 04:50:33 I couldn't jet can mine as the pirates camped the can or blew it up. Once they knew where I was they keep returning. Going through a gate was russian roulete. Getting the zydrine out took ages. In the end I spent 50% of my time in a SS or docked. I made little more than I could have made in high sec for far less hassle. That's the reason why miners don't go to low sec. It is effectively no more profitable to mine in low sec than it is to mine high sec even though the ores are more profitable per M^3. The time spent avoiding player pirates, difficulty moving the minerals and maybe using less productive ships (for multiple reasons) erodes the higher yield minerals until it is effectively no different from high sec mining.
Alvara	Posted - 2007.01.22 05:27:00 - [13] Originally by: Dagle Originally by: Maximillian Pele Edited by: Maximillian Pele on 22/01/2007 04:50:33 I couldn't jet can mine as the pirates camped the can or blew it up. Once they knew where I was they keep returning. Going through a gate was russian roulete. Getting the zydrine out took ages. In the end I spent 50% of my time in a SS or docked. I made little more than I could have made in high sec for far less hassle. That's the reason why miners don't go to low sec. It is effectively no more profitable to mine in low sec than it is to mine high sec even though the ores are more profitable per M^3. The time spent avoiding player pirates, difficulty moving the minerals and maybe using less productive ships (for multiple reasons) erodes the higher yield minerals until it is effectively no different from high sec mining. Hole in one!
Nikla Uthaan Caldari	Posted - 2007.01.22 06:21:00 - [14] Originally by: Dagle That's the reason why miners don't go to low sec. It is effectively no more profitable to mine in low sec than it is to mine high sec even though the ores are more profitable per M^3. The time spent avoiding player pirates, difficulty moving the minerals and maybe using less productive ships (for multiple reasons) erodes the higher yield minerals until it is effectively no different from high sec mining. But it's damn fun! I remember ninja ratting with my main and ninja mining with my alt in the same system under the noses of 8 pursuing hostiles. Tons of fun and i never lost a ship (unles it was a shuttle) ----------------- One word,, emo,,, The Mishing is an ethnic group in the districts of North Lakhimpur, Sonitput, Dhemaji, Dibrugarh, Sibsagar, Jorhat, Golaghat, Tinsukia of Assam.
Riese Blecja Gallente Merch Industrial	Posted - 2007.01.22 06:46:00 - [15] Originally by: Maximillian Pele Edited by: Maximillian Pele on 22/01/2007 04:50:33 The problem is that some areas of low sec are so empty that when a pirate comes around guess who they'll be after. As soon as I got my retriever I tried ninja mining in Amarr low sec. Did everything right - set up BMs away from the warp in points, made multiple SS, and had insta dock BMs. The system I was in usually had just me, and I got to know the non-hostile locals. Sat alligned to warp, watched local like a hawk. I had all the Jaspet I could mine. So I should have got rich right? Even though I am on GMT -10 and only 13,000 K were on, I was still found by people who wanted to kill me within a couple of hours at most. I couldn't jet can mine as the pirates camped the can or blew it up. Once they knew where I was they keep returning. Going through a gate was russian roulete. Getting the zydrine out took ages. In the end I spent 50% of my time in a SS or docked. I made little more than I could have made in high sec for far less hassle. And I never lost a ship doing it. Now I mine in 0.0 and commute to high sec. This is why you can't solo-mine lowsec. It's entirely possible to make very very good money in lowsec but you need friends and you need to be able to defend your claimed space. MRCHI has practically built their own citadel in lowsec that is probably safer than highsec a lot of the time, especially in a wardec situation. If you're going out to lowsec or 0.0, go out with friends.
Maximillian Pele Caldari Jewel Enterprises	Posted - 2007.01.22 06:58:00 - [16] Quote: This is why you can't solo-mine lowsec. It's entirely possible to make very very good money in lowsec but you need friends and you need to be able to defend your claimed space. MRCHI has practically built their own citadel in lowsec that is probably safer than highsec a lot of the time, especially in a wardec situation. If you're going out to lowsec or 0.0, go out with friends. Have friends now - went to 0.0 instead. In times of doubt I ask myself "What would BoB do?", and then do the opposite.
Monde Thor	Posted - 2007.01.22 07:14:00 - [17] Many Low Sec areas were empty because all the Pirates were shooting me. I went from a very quiet system that saw one Pirate every day or two (at peak time) to a main road in about a week.
Trolsk The Murder Plan	Posted - 2007.01.22 07:15:00 - [18] You answered your own question.... Originally by: Danthomir I've spent the past week or two ... pirating in low-sec People dont like getting randomly ganked by wandering pirates thus they don't go to low sec to become easy prey to the same wandering pirates.....
Cipher7	Posted - 2007.01.22 07:18:00 - [19] Originally by: Maximillian Pele Edited by: Maximillian Pele on 22/01/2007 04:50:33 The problem is that some areas of low sec are so empty that when a pirate comes around guess who they'll be after. As soon as I got my retriever I tried ninja mining in Amarr low sec. Did everything right - set up BMs away from the warp in points, made multiple SS, and had insta dock BMs. The system I was in usually had just me, and I got to know the non-hostile locals. Sat alligned to warp, watched local like a hawk. I had all the Jaspet I could mine. So I should have got rich right? Even though I am on GMT -10 and only 13,000 K were on, I was still found by people who wanted to kill me within a couple of hours at most. I couldn't jet can mine as the pirates camped the can or blew it up. Once they knew where I was they keep returning. Going through a gate was russian roulete. Getting the zydrine out took ages. In the end I spent 50% of my time in a SS or docked. I made little more than I could have made in high sec for far less hassle. And I never lost a ship doing it. Now I mine in 0.0 and commute to high sec. ding ding ding
Audri Fisher Caldari The Keep THE R0CK	Posted - 2007.01.22 07:31:00 - [20] why rat/mine in low sec when it is so much safer and profitable to do so in 0.0?

Andrue Amarr	Posted - 2007.01.22 08:31:00 - [21] Edited by: Andrue on 22/01/2007 08:29:22 Low-sec is stressful and hard to exploit. The stress can ruin game-play experience, the logistics can render the exercise little better than Empire mining. This is especially true for the traditional 'carebear' because they don't actually need great riches. By their nature they don't lose ships. They probably don't need the latest and greatest fittings. That means they can be quite happy pulling down 20mil a week which is easy in hi-sec. This is part of the big problem with Eve from a PvP point of view. It is possible to settle into a comfortable existance and still get value from your subscription. As a PvPer you need to replace hardware and you need the best hardware but an Empire dweller? You can spend an entire year using the same set of ships and equipment (I did) and be quite happy. I'm not a carebear (because I don't whine) but I stay out of lo-sec and 0.0 because there is nothing to be gained by going there. I can currently make 100mil a week in Empire without any hassle but since I'm a multi-billionaire I often don't bother. I'm not saying that all Empire dwellers are multi-billionaires but most of us don't need a huge income to fund our game play. I think that if you want us out of Empire you need to provide something interesting for us to do. Lvl5 agents could be just that. Oh and when it comes to PvP you're going to have give up the idea of getting your rocks off on our pain. By that I mean that we won't tolerate paying a monthly subscription just so that you can destroy our hard work. Blow my ship up, fine but not if it's going to carry the huge penalty that it currently does. Put this another way:Empire dwellers are the 'fops' or 'playboys' of Eve. We have an easy life and we like to loll around doing as little as possible. You're not going to get us to come and visit your sordid little killing fields as they currently stand. -- (Battle hardened industrialist) [Brackley, UK] Linux is only free if your time is worthless
Wild Rho Amarr Black Omega Security	Posted - 2007.01.22 08:55:00 - [22] Low sec has little to offer that's worth the hassle compare to high sec and 0.0. High sec has the concord protection keeping you safe from all but determined suicide attacks and corp wars. Ignoring those factors you can do what you want with minmal interference from other players and is a naturally preferable state of affairs for most people. You can also make a respectable income from mission running and evening mining if you have the patience. 0.0 while having no concord protection is also extremely easy to survive in as long as you maintain even a basic awareness. More recently it has become even safer with the changes to local showing standings giving you plenty of time to get out of trouble if a hostile arrives in the system. Add to that you get the best rewards from rare ores, battleship npc spawns, high end complexes and so on. There's always the risk of your space being invaded but that's more of an event than a day to day occurence. Low sec on the other hand is actually more dangerous than 0.0 but without the same rewards. The danger comes from the fact that you cannot use things like the local channel with the same reliability for intel gathering becuase many people can pass through a low sec system and you can only guess their intentions; either take a chance they have no interest in you or spend alot of time warping to a safespot/station until they leave the system. A someone else said, it's alot of hassle with no real reward. Personally I'd rather see the local channel in 0.0 gone completely as it would definetly make 0.0 alot more dangerous, the fact low sec is more dangerous is a poor joke but that's an old discussion that's been going for a long time now. Low sec really needs somthing unique that can't be found in either high sec or 0.0 to encourage more people out there. Until there is somthing worth taking the time and trouble to secure an area low sec will always be deserted. I have the body of a supermodel. I just can't remember where I left it.
Shadowsword COLSUP Tau Ceti Federation	Posted - 2007.01.22 09:35:00 - [23] Why is it so empty? Pretty simple, really: too many gate campers in the interesting spots, making any solo activity with anything the size of a cruiser or above around those spots just not worth it. Gate sentries haven't been upgraded for years, and it's now far too easy to tank them. ------------------------------------------ Every ship has a base 60-70% resist against the primary damage type of the race that is the least able to vary it's damage types.
gfldex Gallente Dark-Rising Fallen Souls	Posted - 2007.01.22 09:40:00 - [24] Good reason given here but one is missing. With the deployment of sentry guns in low sec the one and only way to protect space was taken away from players. Preemptive strikes that stop ppl from moving into a system are either impossible or depend on a lot luck. In the beginning there was no CONCORD and gate sentries. Players failed to form communities to protect each other and asked the devs to solve the problem (read: whining). Instead of a solution they got a mirror that simply showed their own stupid face. I truely believe the devs are to smart to be handled by carebears properly.
Makree Ubar Asteroid Hugging Collective	Posted - 2007.01.22 09:41:00 - [25] Originally by: Dark Shikari P.S. Low sec ores are now 2-3x as profitable as high sec ores yet not much less profitable than 0.0... and they're often in systems with 50% refineries... Shhhh! Don't tell anyone! But with exploration you can find asteroid belts containing haemoriods and other 'low sec' ores in high sec. Reducing the need to go to low sec even more. To the OP, low sec is empty cause of the warp stab nerf. Now you know that if you get into a fight you cannot bug out, like any sane person would do, if you are going to get an ass whippin.
Riho Red Wrath Exquisite Malevolence	Posted - 2007.01.22 10:45:00 - [26] Originally by: RedLion I made tons of alts and tried traveling into all the big alliance spaces... Noone there to gank me. Ofc I couldn't dock at their stations even when i tried... and the pirate NPC battleships payed no interest in me. 0.0 is dull. I wouldn't mind moving agents out in low sec, too bad the best agents are currently in high sec. not really... the corp i do missions for has the best agents in low sec and i do em there :D
Waut 0utbreak	Posted - 2007.01.22 10:46:00 - [27] They are scary and bad In Soviet EVE, roids pop YOU
Nash Leigth Children of Azathoth Brotherhood Of Steel	Posted - 2007.01.22 10:59:00 - [28] There have been quite a few good threads on the topic in the past few weeks. I'm inclined to agree with some other posters that warp core stab nerf has something to do with it. Before you could put stabs on your ratting ship or your defending ship in case of a mining op. This would give you a chance of escaping encounters with pirates. Right now, if you use warp core stabs you effectively gimp your own ability to fight back, so you can't rat with them or defend mining ops with them. I think a lot of high sec dwellers have caught on to this fact. It is much easier to sit and mine high sec ore or run missions for high sec agents than to try to fend for yourself in low sec. Sure, you're not getting paid as much but whatever is the difference, most people seem to think it is not worth the risk. Also there are a lot of misconceptions younger players have about low sec. They get into a tough situation or gate camp once, and that's it, they proclaim they are not going to low sec ever again. They are not very well aware of some of the techniques that would help them keep safe. For example, a lot of them don't know that pirates can scan for ships and determine exactly what belt a ship is in. Some have this idea that about every low sec gate is camped most of the time. I think if there was some kind of an optional tutorial educating noobs on how to keep themselves safe, they would feel more confident visiting low sec space.
Akkarin Pagan Minmatar Raddick Explorations	Posted - 2007.01.22 11:04:00 - [29] I used to live in low sec about 6 months ago. I found myself a nice little backwater in the minmatar republic (Taff) and *****d out lvl 2s to my hearts content. I never bothered with safe spots or instas, and only got shot at once in about 3 months there by CVA. Luckily for me I was in a Stiletto at the time and my T2 afterburner got me to the gate before they could breach shields. I live in low sec again now (when not in 0.0). I get to use the highest quality agent available to the corp I mission for, again in a backwater. I did get jumped on my way down by an Astarte, and thanks to luck, the ability of the Raven to tank and deal damage like a mofo, and some help from the sentries, the Astarte is now a cloud of radioactive dust, and the mods are furnishing my wallet. Now I'm installed in another backwater, I never see hostiles. A couple of systems away there are a few pilots, but my agent rareley sends me there, and they've never troubled me. I still don't have ss, and if a bunch of pirates come in system, I can dock pdq, and wait them out, and with the scanning changes, I know that a loan pirate will have a devil of a time scanning me out. I do have to pay slightly more for ammo and mods when they are required, but due to the amount of isk I can generate, I can easily swallow those costs. Now with warp to zero (I came down before Revelations) it's even easier to get ships in and out, and there is no reason why others can't come and live in low sec and mission run peacefully. It's all about location :) Akkarin <3 - Immy
Romeda Minmatar The White Star Consortium Distant Star Alliance	Posted - 2007.01.22 11:15:00 - [30] Empty? I lived in Placid for most of my time in EVE and up until about a just under a year ago it was for the most part empty, but now it's full... Of mostly pirates, there is many pirate corps operating in that region, the asteroid belts are very full and rich with low-sec ores mostly giving Jaspet and Omber. The problem is there is too much new players taking up PvP and making mining for large ammouts of minerals like Nox and Iso and others difficult, also belt ratting is somtimes an overly risky bussiness, this makes industry much more expencive in these areas. Think about it why is there no unique low-sec trade hubs? The only unique economic enviroments are some large alliance controled 0.0 regions.

Fester Addams Minmatar	Posted - 2007.01.22 12:19:00 - [31] Its very simple, Highsec is fairly safe so alot of people stay there for their casual play only venturing out into lowsec when they have to for some reason or other or when they go looking for troubble. Back in the day lowsec was fairly well populated but pirates heavy cull of peacefull players have driven thise players ither into empire or out into 0.0. Back in the day it is worth noting that just like now only specific areas were well populated back then it was mainly because of the shortage of players however. Personally I think its a good thing that huge lowsec areas are void of people as this allowes me to go there and have some fun, especially since Im getting into exploration, I would prefer exploring in 0.0 but the logistics of clearing out the sites there would simply be too complex unless you are accepted by the locals, large empty areas of lowsec is perfect for me.
Kagura Nikon Minmatar MASS HOMICIDE FREGE Alliance	Posted - 2007.01.22 13:07:00 - [32] with exception of placid) low sec is mostly empty. So i say.. boost Privateers!!! CCP give them the hability to war dec NPC corps!!! If brute force doesn't solve your problem.. then you are not using enough!!
Gudrun Hart	Posted - 2007.01.22 13:22:00 - [33] low sec is empty because a lot of player dont want to play your game - they want to play theyre own game. If i'm not interested in pvp, because i want to do some missions, then i dont want to deal with gate camps or mission griefers, the same with belt ratting. If i'm setting up a low sec POS then most of the system i get trouble be pirats corps with dreads. The Investment is simply to big for a small corp and the risk is way to high - to loose the POS or just have a inaktive one. Why do you think we all should be targets for pirats? We only loose in that game. We have to transport Fuel, BPO, Moon Mining, Ore.... Sometimes this works and more often i just dont work.
Joshua Mendle Gallente The Bewlay Bros. Inc	Posted - 2007.01.22 14:24:00 - [34] I have recently been venturing into 0.4 for some light belt ratting. I've done it three times already and have lost 3 ships to pirates. This is anoying when you all you want is a little more excitement and harder npcs, with better loot, without too much risk of loosing your ship. On one occasion I was minding my own business in my Incursus, even managing to kill a Dread cruiser, before being set upon by three pirates, all in BCs or above. Hardly worth their time I would have thought, for what they would have collected from me, hardly challenging for them either.
Hauler McTote	Posted - 2007.01.22 14:31:00 - [35] Joshua, you may not have been worth the time ISK wise, but most Pirates (and some other pvp'ers maybe) are notrorious e-peeners and the Killboard comparison is way more important to them.
Kagura Nikon Minmatar MASS HOMICIDE FREGE Alliance	Posted - 2007.01.22 14:32:00 - [36] Originally by: Joshua Mendle I have recently been venturing into 0.4 for some light belt ratting. I've done it three times already and have lost 3 ships to pirates. This is anoying when you all you want is a little more excitement and harder npcs, with better loot, without too much risk of loosing your ship. On one occasion I was minding my own business in my Incursus, even managing to kill a Dread cruiser, before being set upon by three pirates, all in BCs or above. Hardly worth their time I would have thought, for what they would have collected from me, hardly challenging for them either. really just keep local channel open and is almsot impossible to catch you. The only danger you have is dropping at a well made gate camp (as most simple gate camps cant catch a cruiser before it warps). I could stay for like whole day in any low sec without being killed, on any ship you ask to (and that i can fly :P). Just paying attention to local. I also got killed quite some times in low sec. But most were when trying to reach gate into a " hub" low sec system and being caught by a vagabond. That does not happen anymore due to WTZ. All othert times were when I was hunting pirates and trying to find them (and finding harder ones that I could handle). Just get to low sec... ignore the first system (that is usually the msot pirated infested) go 1 or 2 deeper. And you can have long hours of fun with very little risk. If brute force doesn't solve your problem.. then you are not using enough!!
Pesadel0 Vagabundos	Posted - 2007.01.22 14:39:00 - [37] Because they suck.
Joshua Mendle Gallente The Bewlay Bros. Inc	Posted - 2007.01.22 14:58:00 - [38] McTote, so you're saying if the Killboards were suddenly measured by actual mass of the kills instead, they'd all be pretty embarrased. I'm just p@*%ed off that when you try to make the game a bit more enjoyable for yourself, you just get put down.
Darkrogue Standard Operations Building Services	Posted - 2007.01.22 15:22:00 - [39] Danthomir, im happy you have figured this out. Something that I found out within my first few weeks of playing. You realize, while the risk of dying might exist. Extra profits make up for any losses that may occur. Now just to take the next step. 0.0 , its not as bad as everyone talks it up to be!
Nash Leigth Children of Azathoth Brotherhood Of Steel	Posted - 2007.01.22 15:36:00 - [40] Originally by: Hauler McTote Joshua, you may not have been worth the time ISK wise, but most Pirates (and some other pvp'ers maybe) are notrorious e-peeners and the Killboard comparison is way more important to them. An incursus does not look good on the kb at all. Most pirates are after a gank - ANY gank. They are commonly straved for seeing more ships explode on their screens. So even if you come in a Velator, they'll blow that up, and not because a Velator kill will look good on their kb. There are ways of keeping safe in low sec. New players don't know about a lot of these ways. They also don't come here to the forums to read about them. As a result, they get multiple ships blown up and then yes, of course, whatever rewards low sec offers just become not worth it. I think quite a few of these new players try ratting/mining in known pirate nests, being unaware that these systems have large quantities of pirates roaming about, and then they wonder why they get killed so much and complain about the f******ng griefers that blew them up n-th time in a row.

Idami Raptor	Posted - 2007.01.22 16:35:00 - [41] It's fairly simple really. Most people that are into MMO gaming simply aren't interested in uncontrolled PvP. Regardless of how much you like just being able to fight whoever you want, the majority of the potential player market doesn't want to be able to get popped whenever, regardless of how they feel about PvP in general. Sooner or later CCP is going to have to realize that if they want the game to continue to grow, but that's beside the point. Past that, the rewards are much higher in NoSec. Rats are better, minerals are better, everything is better, by a vast amount. NoSec is also securable. You can prevent anyone not in your 'friendlies group' from docking in your space, can kill them on sight, and use coordination and sheer population to hunt down anyone that does have the nerve to poke their nose in. Plus with Warp Bubbles, you can actually trap them and keep them from getting away. In LowSec, anyone can dock at any station. You can't set up warp bubbles so WTZ will always work. You also can't shoot anyone on sight, unless they have a highly negative sec status. Meaning keeping hostiles out is all but impossible if they don't play along. LowSec ends up as an insecurable, unsafe wasteland. Groups can't secure it against pirates, and solo players can't reasonably survive. The rewards for securing and exploiting 0.0 are far better, and the safety of Highsec is far far higher. Thus the only ones who have a real reason to go to lowsec are...pirates. It offers just enough protection that they can operate without getting blasted out of hand, and yet little enough that they can blast people they find without significant consequence, particularly if they get a small group together. They can't go to Highsec because Concord will blast them. They can't go to NoSec because they'll spend most of their time trying to run from the Alliance hunters. and they won't always get away, either. The rewards are higher in NoSec, the safety is higher in Highsec, and securability is much higher in NoSec. Thus most people avoid Lowsec for the exact same reasons the pirates go there. There's only two things that would make people go there. 1.) Higher rewards than NoSec currently offers. 2.) Safety at least close to what Highsec offers. Anything aside from those two options will be ineffective. People who don't care about risk will go to NoSec as long as the rewards are higher there. People that care about safety will always stay in Highsec as long it's the only place they can be safe. People who want to work as a group in dangerous areas to make the rewards worthwhile will probably end up in a 0.0 Alliance(higher rewards AND higher securability than LowSec!)
Wicked Spider	Posted - 2007.01.22 16:51:00 - [42] is there a guide to survival in 0.0 ?
Jas Dor Minmatar	Posted - 2007.01.22 16:57:00 - [43] Originally by: ScreamingLord Sutch Not true! All chokepoints to lowsec are camped by vicious giants who fart citadel torpedos and pew pew laser from thieir eyes! I read this in SWA corp chat so it must be true! In Battleships no less. Travelling frigs ftw. Names, Dates, Times, Engagements, Losses, Op-Tempo or STFU!
Jas Dor Minmatar	Posted - 2007.01.22 17:01:00 - [44] Originally by: Dagle Originally by: Maximillian Pele Edited by: Maximillian Pele on 22/01/2007 04:50:33 I couldn't jet can mine as the pirates camped the can or blew it up. Once they knew where I was they keep returning. Going through a gate was russian roulete. Getting the zydrine out took ages. In the end I spent 50% of my time in a SS or docked. I made little more than I could have made in high sec for far less hassle. That's the reason why miners don't go to low sec. It is effectively no more profitable to mine in low sec than it is to mine high sec even though the ores are more profitable per M^3. The time spent avoiding player pirates, difficulty moving the minerals and maybe using less productive ships (for multiple reasons) erodes the higher yield minerals until it is effectively no different from high sec mining. Agreed. I know one group of miners who lost 1.2 Bil isk in 24-hours when two of their T2 haulers and cargo got popped on the way to empire. All in all I hear that taking a hulk to scordite is by far more profitable than anything you can do in low sec. Names, Dates, Times, Engagements, Losses, Op-Tempo or STFU!
Kanuo Ashkeron Eve Defence Force	Posted - 2007.01.22 18:13:00 - [45] According to the OP¦s question: To be actually effective in low sec you have to form a corp, get together work as a team and protect yourself from the pirates (yes, there are exceptions from the rule). When you achieved that, you probably have no problems in joining a 0.0 alliance. Kanuo
Idami Raptor	Posted - 2007.01.22 18:28:00 - [46] Originally by: Kanuo Ashkeron According to the OP¦s question: To be actually effective in low sec you have to form a corp, get together work as a team and protect yourself from the pirates (yes, there are exceptions from the rule). When you achieved that, you probably have no problems in joining a 0.0 alliance. Kanuo ...which is what most people that can get that organized end up doing. Part of the problem.
Ashina Sito	Posted - 2007.01.22 18:47:00 - [47] Edited by: Ashina Sito on 22/01/2007 18:44:27 Originally by: Wicked Spider is there a guide to survival in 0.0 ? This is a very well written guide. It has everything you need to know as a baseline for your first trip to 0.0. http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=409879
Forum Joe	Posted - 2007.01.22 19:23:00 - [48] Topic title is : "Why on earth is low sec so empty?" Answer is : Because the PvP mechanisms in EvE make ganking the more efficicent way to go.
Danthomir	Posted - 2007.01.23 03:38:00 - [49] Ashina: the link don't work :( Today, after such an exciting foray into lowsec I tried exploring 0.0. Mmkay, that's a totally different story :D Let's just say I lost a battlecruiser to a gatecamp after a gatecamp (outran the first, got locked down by an intie in the next system) then spent a few hours exploring with a shuttle... Sheesh, this place is solo player-unfriendly. You need friends to survive and that's final... Between the chokepoints, pipeline-like routes, and scarse and well-defended stations here the reward for a lone ratter/miner definitely isn't worth the risk o.O I still believe that lowsec is great for solo players though.
Forum Troll	Posted - 2007.01.23 04:35:00 - [50] You are either in High Sec or 0.0. There is no reason to go into Low Sec unless you are a pirate.

hotgirl933	Posted - 2007.01.23 06:16:00 - [51] low sec has its benefits if u pick the right region and are careful exploration is one such upsde
Jessica May	Posted - 2007.01.23 10:49:00 - [52] Low sec's Reward vs Risk doesn't stack up against High sec's Reward vs Risk. The extra isk mining in low sec doesn't cover a new Covetor if a PvP'er decides you're a fair target. Low Sec is full of 'Carebear PvPers', those who like PVP put don't have the spheres to jump to 0.0 High Sec is full of 'CareBear Industrialists', those who like mining but don't have the spheres to jump to 0.0. Low sec is fun for taking a team of TechI frigates and go ratting. You sometimes come across the CareBear PvPers that you can give a good spanking too and then listen to the 'Thats not fair, that was 5 against 1' whining. These are usually the folk who destroy Covetors using a HAC and think thats fair.
Cmdr Sy Repo Industries	Posted - 2007.01.23 12:07:00 - [53] Originally by: Kanuo Ashkeron According to the OP¦s question: To be actually effective in low sec you have to form a corp, get together work as a team and protect yourself from the pirates (yes, there are exceptions from the rule). When you achieved that, you probably have no problems in joining a 0.0 alliance. # Time after time... # Yeah, that's what happens. My old corp A4D has introduced a whole bunch of carebear corps to low sec, and once they can manage their affairs without A4D's input, it's not long before they join an alliance. In one case, it took 2-3 weeks. A couple of pirate attacks along the way, and as soon as they were moving only in groups, using scanner, and covering mining ops with EW, they were off. On the other hand, those that don't like the alliance lifestyle (perhaps due to limited playing hours, or justifiably not wishing to pay their úÇ$ to mine for some arrogant clique), return to high sec once they find that the content is too spread out and in most PVP situations they can't fire pre-emptively. Low sec is like EVE grad school. Not for everyone, can be hard to get into, and no-one hangs around for long because once you're done, there is nothing to keep you there. Low sec needs to offer something unique, attractive and not available in either Empire or 0.0, to become anything but transit systems. Logoffs on Fraps
Roshan longshot Gallente Ordos Humanitas	Posted - 2007.01.23 12:31:00 - [54] Lets use the famous PVP words here....."Risk vs Reward" The risk is far greater the the reward... Now the reward is far greater then the risk in 0.0 Free-form Professions, ensure no limetations on professions. Be a trader, fighter, industialist, researcher, hunter *pirate* or mixture of them all. [i]As read from the original box.
Fester Addams Minmatar	Posted - 2007.01.23 13:22:00 - [55] Originally by: Roshan longshot Lets use the famous PVP words here....."Risk vs Reward" The risk is far greater the the reward... Now the reward is far greater then the risk in 0.0 Actually the PvPers version of Risk vs Reward reads You take the risk so I can have the reward. If there is a risk vs reward that is way out of balance its the one for lowesec campers, with very little preparation and very little risk they have a potential for rewards a non camper could only dream of. Make camping more dangerous and you will see more people try to bust camps wich will leads to camps being less frequent wich will lead to more people braving lowsec wich will lead to non camping forms of piracy becoming more viable... I see no downside to it.
Mr Mozzie Eve University Ivy League	Posted - 2007.01.23 13:25:00 - [56] The lowsec-highsec thing in eve is great. People who don't want to pvp can stay safe in empire and people who want to pvp can leave empire. Originally by: Joshua Mendle On one occasion I was mindiation_disney_magic/western_cruise__fairfieldging to kill a Dread cruiser, before being set upon by three pirates, all in BCs or above. Hardly worth their time I would have thought, for what they would have collected from me, hardly challenging for them either. This reminded me of the animated gif 'PvP in a nutshell'. There is a granny and a guy sitting at a table. Another guy strides up and kicks the granny in the head, so the guy sitting at the table says 'pwnt'. It was so true. If the Privateers recent empire war on eve-uni has taugh me anything, it is pirates tend run when faced with a decent fleet. It will be really interesting to see how lowsec and pirates evolve. Perhaps people will start using group tactics to defeat the pirates and then the pirates will need to develop other tactics. Perhaps one day there will be large convoys of freighters with escorts heading into and out of lowsec to prevent piracy.
Blindscythe	Posted - 2007.01.23 13:33:00 - [57] Edited by: Blindscythe on 23/01/2007 13:29:19 As has already been stated, low-sec is empty because of the overuse of resources, ie. pirates eating too much :) As for 'Eve not being applicable as most MMO players prefer consentual PvP' then how come we see so many WoW defecters here? Plus, wtf? Eve has built a strong base, it hasn't sunk, if anything it has retained a lot of its roots and i'll be damned if in order to make a successful MMO you need to follow the flock. edit: rampant typo
Jessica May	Posted - 2007.01.23 13:50:00 - [58] Edited by: Jessica May on 23/01/2007 13:47:53 I think the term 'pirate' is currently mis-used in terms of EVE. Very few of these PvPers actually hunt/destroy other players for financial benefit. They do it simply because they enjoy it. They use ships which are greatly overpowered for the job, such as HAC's to destroy Barges. What benefit could be had by warping into a belt and destroying a barge without even requesting any ransom? Result you scare them off and you cut off your supply (which is what has happened). Calling these types of players 'pirates' simply gives real pirates a bad name.
Blindscythe	Posted - 2007.01.23 14:12:00 - [59] Originally by: Jessica May Edited by: Jessica May on 23/01/2007 13:47:53 I think the term 'pirate' is currently mis-used in terms of EVE. Very few of these PvPers actually hunt/destroy other players for financial benefit. They do it simply because they enjoy it. They use ships which are greatly overpowered for the job, such as HAC's to destroy Barges. What benefit could be had by warping into a belt and destroying a barge without even requesting any ransom? Result you scare them off and you cut off your supply (which is what has happened). Calling these types of players 'pirates' simply gives real pirates a bad name. In relation to those being 'pirated' the term has no other meaning other than 'losing one's ship to another player' The only way the term 'Pirate' would be in contest, is between the Pirates themselves only :)
Jessica May	Posted - 2007.01.23 14:14:00 - [60] Originally by: Blindscythe In relation to those being 'pirated' the term has no other meaning other than 'losing one's ship to another player' The only way the term 'Pirate' would be in contest, is between the Pirates themselves only :) I'll take that as you're agreeing with me

Selk Cantor Minmatar Dark Nebula Gallente Division Xelas Alliance	Posted - 2007.01.23 14:15:00 - [61] Alot of 0.0 space between empire and deep 0.0 space is empty because it sucks. Much of it just has the same ore as empire and no stations to store the stuff in, run missions from, etc. You can find some ok npc pirating there, but nothing compared to the ore and pirates in much deeper areas. Thus, the only real reason to be there is to gate camp the people coming or going from empire to deep space.
Deez Nuttzy	Posted - 2007.01.23 14:16:00 - [62] i am waiting on 1 system to clear out of pirates but so far no luck and its been that way for 7 months =(
Jaketh Ivanes Amarr Riggers Incorporated	Posted - 2007.01.23 14:51:00 - [63] Its sad how the low-sec pirates keep complaining about empty space and no targets. First off, you pick on the easy targets who don't want to PvP. And they will not return, if they have to PvP. Second, why the don't you (pirates in general) pirate the 0.0 alliances. Plenty of targets there. You should try BOB space . Actually, why don't the alliances complain about not having any "in-between-wars" targets to practice and pass the time with? Before asking us carebears to grow some guts, do it yourself and go where people are.
Jessica May	Posted - 2007.01.23 15:01:00 - [64] Originally by: Jaketh Ivanes Its sad how the low-sec pirates keep complaining about empty space and no targets. First off, you pick on the easy targets who don't want to PvP. And they will not return, if they have to PvP. Second, why the don't you (pirates in general) pirate the 0.0 alliances. Plenty of targets there. It's a good point, sharks swim to the feeding ground, if the feeding ground is empty they find another one. They don't ask all the seals and fishes to come to the feeding ground to be eaten! If the low-sec you're in has dried up then you'll have to find another source, if thats this 'dead ground' 0.0 that has been mentioned and hitting alliance targets comeing up to Empire then so be it. Imagine taking a juicey alliance freighter
Blindscythe	Posted - 2007.01.23 15:11:00 - [65] Originally by: Jessica May Originally by: Blindscythe In relation to those being 'pirated' the term has no other meaning other than 'losing one's ship to another player' The only way the term 'Pirate' would be in contest, is between the Pirates themselves only :) I'll take that as you're agreeing with me Yes I am :) Was just clarifying in case someone decided to open a can of worms :)
Jitagirl	Posted - 2007.01.23 22:55:00 - [66] Originally by: Jaketh Ivanes Its sad how the low-sec pirates keep complaining about empty space and no targets. First off, you pick on the easy targets who don't want to PvP. And they will not return, if they have to PvP. Second, why the don't you (pirates in general) pirate the 0.0 alliances. Plenty of targets there. You should try BOB space . Actually, why don't the alliances complain about not having any "in-between-wars" targets to practice and pass the time with? Before asking us carebears to grow some guts, do it yourself and go where people are. Jaketh wins the thread. Groups like CELES and 0UTBREAK have balls, the lowsec "pirates" are all sad gankbears.
Viktor Fyretracker Caldari Worms Corp	Posted - 2007.01.24 01:01:00 - [67] Low sec is totally pointless until the mission runners and miners can shoot a pirate first without a sec hit. in eve every second counts and as such the first shot can be the most important. whats needed is a system where by in any sec level of space that is lower then .5 anyone who is -2 or below is open game(however the concord sentrys at the gates would still follow their proper rules, this only applies to players). this wouldnt hurt pirates any as they are gunna shoot you anyway, but it helps those who dont want to be fried as they can open fire without fear of also loosing sec just trying to defend their mining or missioning.
Shanur	Posted - 2007.01.24 11:17:00 - [68] To summarize, at present low sec's rules strongly favor people who don't need to worry about their security status (read, pirates) over people who do (carebear corps), hence making it impossible to excercise control over the resources in low sec, hence making it quickly very unprofitable compared to high sec and 0.0 space. And because the skills needed to ward off pirate attacks are similar to those needed to minimize the impact of raiders in 0.0 sec, those who can stand up to pirates go to 0.0, while those who can't stay under the protective wings of CONCORD. What needs to be changed is that the first strike advantage of pirates needs to be removed. If a mining operation could be defended without losing a ship first to get the aggression timer running, or taking a security hit, more people would be willing to set up shop there.


Pages: 1 2 3 :: [one page]

COPYRIGHT NOTICE
EVE Online, the EVE logo, EVE and all associated logos and designs are the intellectual property of CCP hf. All artwork, screenshots, characters, vehicles, storylines, world facts or other recognizable features of the intellectual property relating to these trademarks are likewise the intellectual property of CCP hf. EVE Online and the EVE logo are the registered trademarks of CCP hf. All rights are reserved worldwide. All other trademarks are the property of their respective owners. CCP hf. has granted permission to EVE-Search.com to use EVE Online and all associated logos and designs for promotional and information purposes on its website but does not endorse, and is not in any way affiliated with, EVE-Search.com. CCP is in no way responsible for the content on or functioning of this website, nor can it be liable for any damage arising from the use of this website.