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Nero Scuro
Caldari
Jejaikaro Corporation
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Posted - 2007.01.31 23:36:00 -
[121]
 Originally by: ChironV
But they aren't. You act as if they have no control over it. They do and are doing their best right now to figure out what to do. They may remove GTC>ISK due to rampant scamming or they may put in a way to do GTC>ISK which is protected and regulated. If they can figure out a way to make it easy for users to do but limit it to certain amounts per month then they will have an additional revenue stream without hurting the game.
And if they regulate it or nerf it in some way, good. But I'd still rather see it gone all together.
Remember, I'm saying what I hope and want to happen, not what I think will actually happen.
Originally by: ChironV
Currently 90 day cards are going for about 350 million isk. So lets say to raise a fleet you would need what, 5 bill to get a fleet going of battleships with T2 fittings. Thats about 14 or so GTC at $38.00 a pop for a total of $532.00. Thats a chunk of coin, and fairly improbable. Sure an alliance could swing it if they got some of the more well off players to do it. Then again, the market would be soon glutted with GTC>ISK sales, driving the isk price down. Soon enough there would be no worth to sell the cards to isk because they wouldnt be worth an isk. Your reasoning is one extreme. I prefer to think CCP would step in and regulate it before something that extreme occured.
I would agree that it's extreme, but even now there are people saying that alliance's are saying just this - a tactic whereby if they get smacked down hard they can just quickly buy their way back up to a counter-attack.
Originally by: ChironV
True. But what if you don't have a credit card and your mum or father don't like shelling out for game cards? What if the reseller of Eve game cards in your area runs out? Give up? Quit? In sum you are saying, "If you don't have the cash, log off." I dont think thats 100% fair. If they can sell some isk for time when they need it, I think thats a decent solution for cash strapped (or no creditcard) users.
I have a credit card, but don't use it for eve (it's reserved for important things). I pay using paypoints. I'm not sure about other countries but they're rampant in the UK. Literally everywhere. You print off a payment sheet from the pay-by-cash website and take it to any store with a paypoint symbol outside. Quick and easy. No excuses for those without credit cards, especially since pay-by-cash has about 20 other payment options too if you don't get paypoint in your country.
And as I've already said, EVE is dirt-cheap. Anyone who can afford the internet can afford EVE. Simple as.
Originally by: ChironV
Yup it is a hobby. But again your reasoning boils down to "Don't have the time to play as much as me, then log off, because you can't compete."
You can compete, you just can't expect to do as good a job. That's just obvious, and isn't an excuse to buy your way into the game, especially since GTC>ISK isn't reserved for those with little time to play the game.
EVE is a game about consequence. It's not your standard MMO. Doing almost literally anything in EVE will affect the other players. You can't claim sanctuary just because you find the game a bit hard at times.
Or to use your reasoning, if I have no cash to buy ISK and no time to play, I should get free ISK right? It's only fair on me, not my fault if I'm broke and have no time to play as fanatically as you.
___
The world isn't going to end; we're not that lucky... |
ChironV
Caldari
Deep Core Mining Inc.
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Posted - 2007.01.31 23:40:00 -
[122]
Originally by: Nero Scuro
And buying your way into the game with your wallet is not an innovative concept. I'm not having everything I've worked hard for ingame trashed because my opponent is a stockbroker in real life and likes to fling his money about.
Well thats the admission I was waiting for. Your objections have little to do with CCP getting the revenue's which are bleeding out to 3rd party isk'ers and more to do with YOU.
You are afraid that your tactical advantage will dissapear. Your advantage is time. You have alot of time to sit playing Eve, and you feel that your "game time earnings" should not be compromised.
Funny, but if you look at it right, having tons of time to play eve is a "cheat" as well.  Its an unfair advantage to those who have a RL. 
We could solve this problem simply and for everyone.
Limit the logon time to 2 hours daily.
No transfering of GTC's.
Buy isk, get hit with the Banstick.
No transfering of characters.
Ta-Da!! everyone equal! Only the best and most organized players would succeed.
 .....
How about we just drop the discussion and see what CCP floats down the bowl to us.
________________________________________________
It is by caffeine alone I set my mind in motion,
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Maya Rkell
Forsaken Empire
The Forsaken Empire
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Posted - 2007.01.31 23:43:00 -
[123]
"they're rampant in the UK. Literally everywhere"
Where? Never seen a single one. Pay-by-cash is quite litteraly blocked by my bank, and other UK ones, because of its poor record. And there is no reason to pay 20-25% extra because you don't happen to have the right super sekrit magic card. Mastro STILL isn't supported, ffs.
Your assumption that Eve can be paid for in the same way as internet access is just that. I don't see the first party direct debit options, myself.
"That's just obvious"
Only if you make the base assumption that player skill should count for nothing and time invested everything. And no, people with lots of time and little cash can sell to people with little time and lots of cash. Both get what they want. Gee, sounds like it *gasp* works. Trying to claim unique snowflake status, heh.
He didn't reason that. Only if you're again using your time invested > all assumption can that be true. And some of us think player skill should actually count. I'm..no, I'm not sorry you can't compete. Time invested is not a magic bullet, and that's GOOD.
//Maya |
Nero Scuro
Caldari
Jejaikaro Corporation
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Posted - 2007.01.31 23:50:00 -
[124]
Originally by: ChironV
Originally by: Nero Scuro
And buying your way into the game with your wallet is not an innovative concept. I'm not having everything I've worked hard for ingame trashed because my opponent is a stockbroker in real life and likes to fling his money about.
Well thats the admission I was waiting for. Your objections have little to do with CCP getting the revenue's which are bleeding out to 3rd party isk'ers and more to do with YOU.
You are afraid that your tactical advantage will dissapear. Your advantage is time. You have alot of time to sit playing Eve, and you feel that your "game time earnings" should not be compromised.
Funny, but if you look at it right, having tons of time to play eve is a "cheat" as well. Its an unfair advantage to those who have a RL.
I was talking in general. I don't own anything in EVE worth blowing up. About 100mil in assets, and 70 mil of that is a covert ops cloak. I was just talking for all those players who DO own chains of POS and whatnot. So no, I wasn't thinking about myself.
And I don't play eve that much anyway. 90% of my time online is just chatting in channels, so I wouldn't be losing any supposed 'time advantage'.
___
The world isn't going to end; we're not that lucky... |
hotgirl933
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Posted - 2007.01.31 23:54:00 -
[125]
profits from GTC go into the game and profits as CCP have stated atm are mostly going back into the game via extra hardware devs and even the white wolf merger
unlike the biggest one in the MMO market its ploughed back into the game
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Vicarias T
Caldari
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Posted - 2007.02.01 00:43:00 -
[126]
Wasn't this thread originally about Ebay and selling virtual items?? If you check that site you will see it has happened. Now if we can shoot the macro mining isk farmers, it will be the players game again!
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Maya Rkell
Forsaken Empire
The Forsaken Empire
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Posted - 2007.02.01 00:49:00 -
[127]
So now Yantis has a market advantage for his tactics, it's a win for Eve? Heh.
He's a hundred times the threat Ebay was. One of his standard tactics, for example, is to get corp leaders to sell him the corp wallet. And abuse exploits on a massive scale, and and.
Funny, I'd of thought you'd of disliked that over a few individual sales on Ebay. (Further, there is zero proof from the games which have allways had auctions pulled off ebay that it does ANYTHING to reduce RMT volume - the number of people banned for RMT *stays steady*).
All neo-prohibition serves is to annoy people.
//Maya |
Yggdrassil
Amarrian Missionaires
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Posted - 2007.02.01 01:13:00 -
[128]
The big, difficult thing to do, is somehow to find a way where ppl can sell gtc for isk, but has no way to transform the isk to $.
With ebay stopping the sale of ingame items, we're half way there.
Now, if CCP somehow could make a system where you could put up gtc for sale through the account system... They could directly check that the gtc is good / no fake. Seller states his price in ISK and wait for a buyer.
Then, allow ppl to buy gtc through account system, simply by selecting what kind of gtc, and what price in isk he wants to pay.
Every downtime, you match the buy/sell orders, and transfer isk to/from players, and directly update the billing info.
Might be a bit work to code, but... they would save themselves a lot of petitions in the long run - since scammers can't find any workarounds to that system (at least no way I can see)
Yggdrassil |
Maya Rkell
Forsaken Empire
The Forsaken Empire
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Posted - 2007.02.01 01:18:00 -
[129]
Yggdrassil,
Ebay was one market. There are other auction sites. There are other FAR less savourary sites. For there to be "progress", you'd have to change the fundermental nature of Humans. This is a step back.
//Maya |
Yggdrassil
Amarrian Missionaires
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Posted - 2007.02.01 01:22:00 -
[130]
lol - saw this when I googled for isk selling sites - and just had to share:
Quote:
An earthquake which has struck the Asia Pacific Region has severely disrupted our service levels. We apologize for any delay and inconvenience this has caused. "
Yggdrassil |
Yggdrassil
Amarrian Missionaires
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Posted - 2007.02.01 01:35:00 -
[131]
I still don't get why ppl would want to buy isk from one of these sites.
If you sell a GTC that costs... 39$, you get around 350 million.
That equals around 120$ per billion isk.
Buying from the shady web sites seems to cost you around.... 120$ for 1 billion isk.
Now... wtf would anyone buy them from those sites???
Price is almost identical. Selling gtc yourself is legal - so you don't risk having the isk pulled out of your wallet, while paying the same on one of those sites makes you face the risk of simply loosing your $'s.
I just don't get it....
Yggdrassil |
DJ Static
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Posted - 2007.02.01 10:33:00 -
[132]
Edited by: DJ Static on 01/02/2007 10:30:43
Originally by: pass lake
I suspect that noobs are buying isk on ebay, so removing this source of isk should be deflationary for lower priced ships/equipment that noobs would be buying. Less money chasing the same number of goods should make the items increase in price. Of course there are lots of variables. This assumes noobs buy low priced stuff and manufacturing output stays the same.
Errrr.... not so much.
Assuming there is less money chasing the same ammount of goods.
1. Consumers have less means to buy said items
2. There becomes a surplus of the items
3. Firms producing said items bid the price of the item down in an effort to sell.
4. After the price is bid low enough, there will be enough consumers with the means to buy the item and eliminate the surplus.
5. Equlibrium.
Yes, I DID just get out of Economics 202
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Michael Clark
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Posted - 2007.02.06 18:16:00 -
[133]
Ok,
I do not agree on using ISK to buy GTCs. I do not use a CC or a bank card to pay for my account. I drive down to 7-11 buy a prepaid $25.00 Visa gift card and wow, my accounts paid for for anthor month. No idea if they have this in Europe. So, theres an idea for those who have no CC or Bank card.
MC
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nossler
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Posted - 2007.02.09 06:28:00 -
[134]
I having a feeling that this is gonna end up hurting the game, like it or not those macro miners paid a monthly subscription to ccp. Thats real $'s outta ccp's wallet. I personally don't care, I play the game to have fun. I drive long haul truck across the states and Canada I can't always get online, so my game time is low. I have sold GTC's for isk because of the fact I can't sit for hours at a time mining, I would rather watch paint dry, but thats me. I understand from a pure gamers point that the Ebayers represent an easy way out, as oppossed to ratting/mining/trading or what ever. I just don't have that time, but I like the game and the people I play with. So because I can't play all the time I shouldn't have a way that works with my real life? Who do I hurt? The builders? Don't think so I am purchasing from them. The miners? The builder buys from them. The PvP'rs? They get to fight me or any of the numerous others like me. Maybe it's the traders? Nope they are either selling to one of us and I mean all of us, or an NPC. Now yes I have noticed a few price jumps IE: T2 launchers name one its gone up close to 100% but like in real world economics the price is only what the market can bare. Don't get all "this isn't real life" Think back to all the diccusions about missles and how "unfair" they are, can't have it one way then another. I don't want to play the game like that, I wish I could sit infront of my laptop and mine or rat, but my life just doesn't allow that. Do what you must CCP it is your game and your rules. I would still play just wouldnt have as much fun Just think about what it is you are actually discussing here guys and gals. Who cares if joe sold dave something from this or any other game for real world money. Dave has money to burn, let him. It all ends up back in the game one way or the other. Remember that Vegas saying, "The house always wins!" and ccp is the house!!! Anyways thats my take on it I'm just a guy trying to get his nut in this crazy world we call EVE. Fly Safe and keep the pirates cursing your name. 
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