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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 6 post(s) |
Coelomate
Gilliomate Corp
51
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Posted - 2016.03.31 16:22:01 -
[31] - Quote
Apologies if I botched my math/analysis, but it looks like this change will significantly widen the Aeon/Wyvern vs. Nyx/Hel EHP gap at the same time it reduces the damage gap, which seems a bit odd.
Here's my quick write up:
https://www.reddit.com/r/Eve/comments/4cqqdc/supercarrier_rebalance_platesextenders_extra/
Love,
~Coelomate
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Hendrink Collie
Blood Oath Foundation Adaptation.
105
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Posted - 2016.03.31 16:24:13 -
[32] - Quote
Bisu Deckryder wrote:Hendrink Collie wrote:AwoxingBravespymaster McBlueshoter wrote:Typical CCP, makes focus groups and promises to listen, giving players hope that they won't **** up this round of massive changes, then they ignore the focus groups and the play testing and make the bad changes anyways. Did Space Aids and Fozzie Sov teach you nothing? Hi boat. Forgot I was logged in on my alt, but this is a massive insult hendrick. Rifters 1v1 at the Obe sun is the only answer to this slur. May Bob smile upon the just
You got it fam, I should be on around 2:00 EVE time. |
Orontes Ovasi
BURN EDEN Northern Coalition.
22
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Posted - 2016.03.31 16:30:52 -
[33] - Quote
Doubling the EHP advantage of Aeons and Wyverns and closing the damage gap by more than half makes sense how? |
Bertral
Les chevaliers de l'ordre Goonswarm Federation
10
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Posted - 2016.03.31 17:25:29 -
[34] - Quote
Do all drone damage bonuses apply to the fighters' special abilities ? Do RoF bonuses reduce the cooldown on special abilities ? |
Sporego
Noir. Academy Mercenary Coalition
0
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Posted - 2016.03.31 17:30:04 -
[35] - Quote
Rip Gallente/Minmatar carriers... |
Zank Lennelluc
The Pack Fidelas Constans
0
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Posted - 2016.03.31 17:33:43 -
[36] - Quote
Amarr and caldari carriers and supers remain the only option for pvp. |
RahSun
Discrete Solutions Ltd.
1
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Posted - 2016.03.31 17:46:39 -
[37] - Quote
Sporego wrote:Rip Gallente/Minmatar carriers...
Don't worry, the gallante/minnie bonuses are just an early April Fools Day joke...right?
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Destiny Dain2
Your Destiny Corporation
46
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Posted - 2016.03.31 18:06:38 -
[38] - Quote
Made a video on the new skills at https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=g5C1wIIXyiM and my question is... with the new "Doomsday Rapid Firing" skill,
will it be applied to the Citadel doomsday weapons as well? |
Circumstantial Evidence
269
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Posted - 2016.03.31 18:12:42 -
[39] - Quote
CCP Larrikin wrote:Cl4ire Grube wrote:so we have to train "light fighters" and "support fighters" to keep using the **** we already were able to use before?? gg ccp Well support fighters don't exist now...so yes. As for the light fighters, yes you do. Sorry about that. We seeded it as soon as we could to try and give you guys lots of time to train it. It has to do with restrictions on how we can apply skill bonuses for fighters (and drones). I commented about this in the carriers thread here, but see more explanation in this reply here. OK, makes more sense that there's a technical reason for a new skill. But why not move the existing Fighters skill bonus into ship role bonuses, or just buff the fighters?
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Molly Shears
Call of the Wild The Minions.
3
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Posted - 2016.03.31 18:48:20 -
[40] - Quote
CCP Larrikin wrote: [...]
+5 bonus to ship warp core strength [...]
1 stiletto can tackle it with 2 domination Scrambler ?
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Ravcharas
Infinite Point Violence of Action.
449
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Posted - 2016.03.31 18:52:46 -
[41] - Quote
Molly Shears wrote:CCP Larrikin wrote: [...]
+5 bonus to ship warp core strength [...]
1 stiletto can tackle it with 2 domination Scrambler ? It's +5 per level. |
Edriahn
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
21
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Posted - 2016.03.31 19:18:17 -
[42] - Quote
So basically, only a ****** would train for a nyx and a Hel right now. After all the feedback we gave you, you got nothing. Anyway, I was wondering whether to keep my gallente carrier V skills, now it's obviously I don't need it.
Can you at least fix the horrible Aeon model, now that there are only 2 supercarriers in game?
[20:46:05] Komahal > pl is cancer
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SWJesus
Paradox Collective Project.Mayhem.
3
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Posted - 2016.03.31 19:22:18 -
[43] - Quote
u would think that after running this game for while ccp would learn to listen to "testers", but ofc not..
Nyx/hell boni are bad joke. AOE target paint ...lfmau? why not webs, so those supers can pewpew kity fleets..?!?! The EHP > Dmg gap .. seriously?
Balancing is a myth.. |
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CCP Larrikin
C C P C C P Alliance
425
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Posted - 2016.03.31 19:42:00 -
[44] - Quote
Hey Mates,
We've tweaked the bonuses & stats a little. We've upped the damage bonus of the Nyx and Hel up to 10% per level, and brought the amount of shield/armor a little closer together between the Aeon/Nyx & Wyvern/Hel.
Let us know what you think :)
Game Designer | Team Five-0 | https://twitter.com/CCP_Larrikin
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FT Diomedes
The Graduates
2370
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Posted - 2016.03.31 19:42:42 -
[45] - Quote
Really glad I got an Aeon instead of a Nyx.
CCP should add more NPC 0.0 space to open it up and liven things up: the Stepping Stones project.
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Soleil Fournier
Ultimatum. The Bastion
77
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Posted - 2016.03.31 19:49:04 -
[46] - Quote
Ok Bros, my biggest concern right now is the Nyx being inferior to the other 3 supers and losing it's King of Damage title.
This is due to Drone Damage Amps and extra lowslots to use them + current hull bonuses.
Here's the rundown:
2 plates, 3 Actives, 2 EANM.
15 million skillpoints for Nyx, 17 Million for Aeon. But when Aeon adds in a DDA in the 8th lowslot, it now does 7.5% more damage on top of the 2 million additional EHP.
Or the Aeon puts a damage control in that 8th slot and now has 21 million EHP for only 12.5% less damage than the Nyx. Aeon is still the better choice.
If the Nyx takes off an EANM to put on a DDA, it goes down to 12 million EHP, which isn't viable when compared to the other options such as the 14 million EHP Hel + Hel's extra damage due to ability to fit extra DDAs.
If you were to revert back to 10% damage/level for the Nyx? Using the first mentioned build Aeon would have 2 EHP more than the Nyx for only 5% less damage. Still didn't fix the problem.
So we're in a pickle and I really hope you guys are aware of it.
Only two viable solutions that fix this problem are:
Drone Modules don't affect fighters. Any fighter bonuses would come from Fighter Support units where all supers are equal since it's highslots. This is the cleanest option.
Or add additional heavy fighter slots to the Nyx.
Thoughts? |
Soleil Fournier
Ultimatum. The Bastion
77
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Posted - 2016.03.31 19:58:00 -
[47] - Quote
CCP Larrikin wrote:Hey Mates,
We've tweaked the bonuses & stats a little. We've upped the damage bonus of the Nyx and Hel up to 10% per level, and brought the amount of shield/armor a little closer together between the Aeon/Nyx & Wyvern/Hel.
Let us know what you think :)
Doesn't fix the Nyx problem, but it does help.
One: Hell can afford more DDAs, so it now out-damages the Nyx while having only a slightly lower tank. Nyx is supposed to be the most damaging super.
Nyx vs Aeon now looks like: 17 million EHP Aeon, 15 million EHP Nyx, but with the Nyx only doing 5% more damage than the Aeon. using the build in my post above, 2 plates, 3 actives, 2 eanm plus DDA for Aeon. |
Circumstantial Evidence
270
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Posted - 2016.03.31 20:30:17 -
[48] - Quote
Soleil Fournier wrote:CCP Larrikin wrote:Hey Mates,
We've tweaked the bonuses & stats a little. We've upped the damage bonus of the Nyx and Hel up to 10% per level, and brought the amount of shield/armor a little closer together between the Aeon/Nyx & Wyvern/Hel.
Let us know what you think :) Doesn't fix the Nyx problem, but it does help. One: Hel can afford more DDAs, so it now out-damages the Nyx while having only a slightly lower tank. If nyx drops one tank mod to add 1 DDA, it willl have less tank than the hel, and the hel probably still out damages it because it will have at least 2 DDAs. Nyx simply can't match it. . This becomes a debate about balance philosophy: Should all capitals offer equal damage and tank, and just differ on role specializations, like ewar? |
Soleil Fournier
Ultimatum. The Bastion
77
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Posted - 2016.03.31 20:32:54 -
[49] - Quote
My point isn't about equal everything.
My point is why would you chose to fly a ship that has BOTH less damage and less tank? Or has significantly less tank for only 5% damage bonus?
It's about viability not equality. And right now the Nyx is not viable when compared to the other options available. |
Archeras Umangiar
CRY.NET Nihilists Social Club
25
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Posted - 2016.03.31 21:06:56 -
[50] - Quote
i believe the inertia is wrong on the revenant |
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Tashiell Gao
Thunderwaffe Goonswarm Federation
0
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Posted - 2016.03.31 21:20:27 -
[51] - Quote
Give Hel an agility bonus instead of Nyx level damage bonus, but retain the fighter velocity bonus. |
Circumstantial Evidence
270
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Posted - 2016.03.31 21:21:41 -
[52] - Quote
Soleil Fournier wrote:My point isn't about equal everything.
My point is why would you chose to fly a ship that has BOTH less damage and less tank? Or has significantly less tank for only 5% damage bonus?
It's about viability not equality. And right now even with the 10% damage per level the Nyx is not viable when compared to the other options available You may be right, in a 1v1. But what about Nyx other benefits?
-toughest fighters -largest fighter hanger
The new design offers a greater possibility of anti-fighter warfare... the higher damage possibility offered by other ships could be degraded in combat.
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Archeras Umangiar
CRY.NET Nihilists Social Club
25
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Posted - 2016.03.31 21:22:53 -
[53] - Quote
Circumstantial Evidence wrote:Soleil Fournier wrote:My point isn't about equal everything.
My point is why would you chose to fly a ship that has BOTH less damage and less tank? Or has significantly less tank for only 5% damage bonus?
It's about viability not equality. And right now even with the 10% damage per level the Nyx is not viable when compared to the other options available You may be right, in a 1v1. But what about Nyx other benefits? -toughest fighters -largest fighter hanger The new design offers a greater possibility of anti-fighter warfare... the higher damage possibility offered by other ships could be degraded in combat.
have you ever seen an actuall super 1v1 dude? lol |
Soleil Fournier
Ultimatum. The Bastion
77
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Posted - 2016.03.31 21:29:01 -
[54] - Quote
Also, now would be the best time to increase jump ranges. They're horrid and leading to people not dealing with caps or moving them especially if ur Corp moves across a long distance.
2.5ly (5 LY max skills) is way too burdonsome. I prefer 8 LY max skills but 7LY is a good compromise. Fatigue still makes projection implausible, but this eases the burden on cap pilots. |
Soleil Fournier
Ultimatum. The Bastion
77
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Posted - 2016.03.31 21:34:22 -
[55] - Quote
Circumstantial Evidence wrote:Soleil Fournier wrote:My point isn't about equal everything.
My point is why would you chose to fly a ship that has BOTH less damage and less tank? Or has significantly less tank for only 5% damage bonus?
It's about viability not equality. And right now even with the 10% damage per level the Nyx is not viable when compared to the other options available You may be right, in a 1v1. But what about Nyx other benefits? -toughest fighters -largest fighter hanger The new design offers a greater possibility of anti-fighter warfare... the higher damage possibility offered by other ships could be degraded in combat.
Those bonuses do not superceded tank/damage. They are ancillary at best.
This is a fleet issue. Supers rarely if ever 1v1 anything. |
Syrias Bizniz
Zebra Corp Goonswarm Federation
434
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Posted - 2016.03.31 21:43:57 -
[56] - Quote
Quick idea for the Nyx:
Move 1 Highslot to 1 Lowslot. Result: Same "effective lowslots" as Aeon. Nyx is the DPS option if max gank, Aeon the tank option if max tank. Roughly equal in mixed tank/dps fits. Nyx has one less utility high compared to Aeon, but one more utility mid. Nyx can go for a light shield tank and turbo dps / mobility, making it versatile and an interesting ship with many setups, each at a tradeoff, whereas the Aeon would still be what it is: The thing with the max tank, that can also go DPS. |
Circumstantial Evidence
270
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Posted - 2016.03.31 21:54:04 -
[57] - Quote
Soleil Fournier wrote:This is a fleet issue. Supers rarely if ever 1v1 anything.
And when alliances are choosing their fleet setups, a bigger hanger Bay or slightly tougher fighters do not factor into the equation. It's all about tank and damage and capability on the field. Bigger hanger Bay is ancillary at best.
The nyx (and hel) will be secondary choices by default due to damage caps on citadels and the need to tank them for 30 minutes. But they should still bring value on the battlefield in fleet fights. But if u want damage, you would choose the hel. Where does that leave nyx's? Logged off and unused. In a fleet engagement, someone could be running anti-fighters, chopping up DPS. I don't really know how this will play out in advance... I'm just thinking about the saying regarding what happens to plans in war ;) |
Soleil Fournier
Ultimatum. The Bastion
80
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Posted - 2016.03.31 21:55:25 -
[58] - Quote
You wouldn't do that in an expensive super. You would do that in carriers who can deploy the same amount of light fighters. Or just smart bomb blob. |
Atomeon
The Scope Gallente Federation
68
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Posted - 2016.03.31 23:13:19 -
[59] - Quote
Just make ONE Carrier with same bonus for all and 4 different skins to make everyone happy.
Is that so hard? |
Rowells
ANZAC ALLIANCE Fidelas Constans
3006
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Posted - 2016.03.31 23:30:30 -
[60] - Quote
How about a warp speed bonus for the hel? :D |
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