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Zagum Darkfin	Posted - 2003.12.17 05:54:00 - [31] Edited by: Zagum Darkfin on 17/12/2003 05:56:23 I lost my Raven with Stizum. I am sorry but dying to 10 Thoraxi verses 1 Raven and 2 Apocs, I can understand. Dying to them in a belt 0,0 space where the highest ore is jaspet is a joke. Increase the Spawn time to 30 mins. 10 min respawn with 10-15 ships each spawn 20k away is INSANE!! Atleast make them have to WARP IN SO WE CAN SEE THE BASTARDS. We are getting reports fleets of 10 BS plus are getting trashed. I see the nice warning after I freaking log in. I want game balance also, but this crap is WAAY overly adjusted to the RISK side. The bounties are nice, but god dam, I want to mine without having a fleet of 20plus for a freaking veldspar in 0,0 space. EVE just became EQ. Sow, anyone?? PS. Did I say the Loot sucked balz?? No Tech 2 drops or named stuff. Just crap normal loot like always. WTG CCP
Stoop	Posted - 2003.12.17 05:55:00 - [32] We just lost 1 scorp and 1 raven too. half the gang got stuck on a rock when trying to warp, and then they pwnd a raven in 10 secs or so.
Red Six	Posted - 2003.12.17 05:57:00 - [33] Had killed a large spawn of Sansha's and moved out 70K from the belt sitting with Tachyons w/ Radio Crystals in my Armageddon was sitting there with a Megathron, Apocalypse, and a Tempest. The damn Sansha's warped in 10km from me. I was webified before I could react. I had an escape route plotted. I hit autopilot in an attempt to get and couldn't get out before the 15 of them had me toasted.
Mr nStuff	Posted - 2003.12.17 05:58:00 - [34] There should be a middle ground.. Before in 0.0 space you mostly got 10k / 20k near stations, and you had to go out into deep space to hit the 3x50k , 5x40k type spawns.. Maybe it would be fair to put 3x50k, and 5x40k spawn types near the stations.. And then put these rediculously tuff 20x50k and 4x500k+10x50k spawns back out into deep space. But anyways. I'm pretty sure CCP is just being silly. Haha very funny.. Now nerf the NPCs a bit. 5 R&D Agents, 10months, Zero BPO Offers.. Onboard navigational [Planetary Avoidance] computer. My account will be suspended at the end of the current play period. Expires on 19. September 2004
Zalasar	Posted - 2003.12.17 06:01:00 - [35] lol its sounds like it is way out of controll i think ccp should do something about this (Quick)
Drutort	Posted - 2003.12.17 06:02:00 - [36] guess who is losing the BS's? all the alliances... its all part of the hidden agenda from ccp the problem is... so are all the prices nobody is going to get the bist your mega will be so insanely high and over all ship prices so high.... and all those small to mid size corps would not be able to even touch the low sec to 0.0 areas without having a few dedicated fighters... which is ironic since they are small... every person can agree before the pirates were a jokeà but now? Ok ppl have taken like others s aid a few BSÆs and they come home with losing 4 BSÆs? ok were is the risk reward here? You lose something of such high value over few npcÆs that are a fraction of your ships price? I donÆt know how this is supposed to push ppl out of empire spaceà to me its forcing even me to go and do agent missions, because if nobody wants to take the risk to go hunt or even defend the belts so that ppl can mineà there is nothing to do but just stay there and do what guard vs PC players? OH and the good news of missions not working as they shouldà so either way I go im getting screwed one way or anotherà support Idea: QuickInfo an alternative to ShowInfo my MoBlog
FUZZ79	Posted - 2003.12.17 06:07:00 - [37] How are the Pie's in hophib it's 0,0 sec place
ga'ia	Posted - 2003.12.17 06:08:00 - [38] Quote: Maybe it would be fair to put 3x50k, and 5x40k spawn types near the stations.. And then put these rediculously tuff 20x50k and 4x500k+10x50k spawns back out into deep space. No..that would be the 20x75+k rats o_0 (+those on 1 mill...) __________________________________________________________
Kayosoni	Posted - 2003.12.17 06:08:00 - [39] Don't mine and don't farm and you will be fine. :)
Jash Illian	Posted - 2003.12.17 06:09:00 - [40] Interesting... Any evidence of any type of AI to be exploited? Like they attack whoever's done the most damage? Go after the biggest ship? Are people using the standard bship loadouts from before? Any 'mixed' player bship fleets (snipers + short rangers)? I mean its like you want corporations to oblige each other like its sex or something. Pffft I would rather *** my enemy.- Rohann Be careful out there. That other guy waiting in the queue for the gate MIGHT be a baby-munching frock-burner, YOU JUST DON'T KNOW!*- Lallante
StiZum Hilidii	Posted - 2003.12.17 06:10:00 - [41] oh well was a nice explosion... shame to see such a massive and great ship go down STAN FACTA NON VERBA
Stoop	Posted - 2003.12.17 06:18:00 - [42] Jash, the fleet we had was a normal NPC setup one. We warp to a belt at 50k, then get swarmed, raped, spit on, crapped on etc. They MWD to you, and you have 20-60 missles flying at you. Then they spawn on top of you and kill you more. Bad thing is.. sometiems its a spawn of frigates - 30ks.. manageable. Next spawn is all moas - battleships. (7-15 of them). All this in a place that had frigate pirates only, and now has just crap minerals that you could mine in .4 empire.
Ariell Lucinwind	Posted - 2003.12.17 06:19:00 - [43] Quote: FANTASTIC!! I love this game now, the rats are so tough you really have to use your brain, Brain ? Yes, dont go their you will die Quote: configure your ship accordingly Ignore lasers and small range weapons just equip anything long range range and pass on the frigates / cruisers Quote: and go in big teams to defend yourself. WOW that would be great if people were able to get into a group of 20 to combat the 20 NPCs. Quote: Initially, many people will loose their ships Well thats obviously happening with the most experienced NPC rat hunters Quote: however, soon after we'll start to see more PVP'ing as some people may not choose to venture out into those danger NPC areas!! Done, I am thinking already of becoming a griefor and shooting players. May be easier for me to because I doubt anyone is mining in those areas in a hurry during my peak time. Quote: Tech II items will provide a better advantage for fighting NPC's, remember, you are fighting them with Tech I stuff so you are bound to get a spanking :P Dont we need minerals to get them? From what I have heard the roid fields are so well guarded, making something with little minerals doesnt sound to crash hot. This may sound negative but maybe its that time again for me. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Came back cause I love you guys :P
Jash Illian	Posted - 2003.12.17 06:31:00 - [44] Quote: Jash, the fleet we had was a normal NPC setup one. We warp to a belt at 50k, then get swarmed, raped, spit on, crapped on etc. They MWD to you, and you have 20-60 missles flying at you. Then they spawn on top of you and kill you more. Bad thing is.. sometiems its a spawn of frigates - 30ks.. manageable. Next spawn is all moas - battleships. (7-15 of them). All this in a place that had frigate pirates only, and now has just crap minerals that you could mine in .4 empire. The crap minerals is a separate issue as far as I'm concerned. That's arguing balance with CCP and I've yet to win any of those arguments But something I've seen from past MMOG is what happens when new content gets added: People get pwned until they adjust their tactics to compensate. For example, you said you went with a normal NPC setup. Normal NPC setup prior to today was Tachs/1400mm (mostly Tachs since no ammo). But a 1400mm did feck all of waste ammo for me under 20km. NPC cruiser got that close, I switched to cruise missiles. I'm just saying it may be too early to declare them 'unbeatable'. TomB may be a bit sadistic. But I suspect he enjoys killing people himself more than living vicariously through NPCs. He might be trying to get people to experiement with more balanced loadouts/mixed fleets. Don't ask me about mining parties tho. Not my department. I mean its like you want corporations to oblige each other like its sex or something. Pffft I would rather *** my enemy.- Rohann Be careful out there. That other guy waiting in the queue for the gate MIGHT be a baby-munching frock-burner, YOU JUST DON'T KNOW!*- Lallante
ketamineReality	Posted - 2003.12.17 06:31:00 - [45] Look. Small corps were allowed to set up in 0.0 space without worrying about REDICULOUS numbers of pirates everywhere when mining. It was like this for a long time, and everyone settled in. Now CCP is telling us that we need 20+ people to mine deep space, screwing all of the smaller corps who, despite being small, have a lot of equipment at their station. With traveling slower and jumping more dangerous, being forced to move to a different station, without any storyline to back up the change, or a SERIOUS warning, is utter bulls**t.
VargZ	Posted - 2003.12.17 06:35:00 - [46] Edited by: VargZ on 17/12/2003 06:45:45 CCP has made a tactical error. No way this is justifiable of making the game more enjoyable or playable. I lost a scorp with Death and Trianon, those 25 npc pirates spawned within 14 km of me. Scrambled and webbed before you could say "oh" and the heaven rained missiles. For those ten seconds my heart cried out to you guys at CCP, the rulers and commanders of our world but alas you must have been away from keyboard because all I could hear was this tin can like christmas music echoing in my ears while my ship careened out of control. Well tough luck they must say, just play the game m8. We got these wonderful things prepared for you that you are just gonna love. All part of the grand scheme of things in eve Mr. VargZ, you see. You understand Mr. VargZ, don't you? Well my incentive to play this game just went bonkers. CCP has had all my patience and pride for conceptualizing and developing this wonderful game. My hats off to them. I have been quite happy being a paying guinea pig but at the moment the borders of my cage seem to be a little to tight for my taste. A bug is a bug. They come in all shapes, sizes and color. Some are useful, others are harmful and need to be controlled or killed. How would this situation be categorized and explained for the masses waiting at the gates of every new patch. All talk about leveling the playing field or nerfing things can't make way of such a drastic change of the game mechanics. Well it seems that the game designers didn't think this one through before launching this great patch. It has great potential but as with such a huge update it's bound to be a little bit kinked or contain a few bugs that need to be ironed out. This change has made the npc pirates godlike. How can mere mortal compete in that arena. We fight with those weapons you make available to us but how many of us does it take to metamorphize into a unit that is equivalent to this fleet of npc rats with unlimited resources and the cleverness of the big blue chess computer. Fair is fair, I will admit to that but I can just as easily go bang my head into a brick wall with the small twinkle of hope that I didn't forget to update my clone. Respectfully VargZ A mere fighter in the same loop of mining 2-4 weeks between ships lost. Bahamas you would say. NO, how about a whole lot of snow with blonde women running around laughing in thick overcoats with mittens on and droopy snow caps. Like Teddybears with makeup. nIceland.
dalman	Posted - 2003.12.17 06:37:00 - [47] Only ships lossed this far is all the Sansha ships we've killed. Some battleships. Only 250k and 500k ones though. M.I.A. since 2004-07-30
Slithereen	Posted - 2003.12.17 06:39:00 - [48] I like it I really like it. Time for NPCs to kick some serious butt. Time for their REVENGE!! I think we have all become very soft and had it easy. Success is paved by the same low risk, repetitious activity. I think it's time to put out all the stops, time to declare war on these NPCs. Obviously a challenge is thrown upon us, and we should rise and face up to it. _______________________________________________ "Is it me or the bad guys just getting totally pathetic?"---Clover, Totally Spies, "Hope is wasted on the Hopeless."---Mandy, The Grim Adventures of Billy and Mandy. "Stars are holes in the sky from which the light of the Infinite shine through."---Confucius.
Drethen Nerevitas	Posted - 2003.12.17 06:41:00 - [49] Jash, imho you can't play about with the ranges against NPCs. Their warp in is always centered on the players-20km from player, 15km from player, 40km from player. If it was centered on the middle of the belt, with NPCs spawning for (example) 100km in each direction from the centre of the belt, maybe that would be do-able...but it's not like that (unless I've seriously screwed up figuring out how the new NPC rules work ). _______________________________________________________________________ *IMPORTANT: Devs (and players) please take notice.* 1. 2. 3. 4. 5. 6. 7.
Adliger Krieger	Posted - 2003.12.17 06:42:00 - [50] I have killed 3 1mil rats and 3 55k rats alone. It is hit and run, they approach really fast, Guess their MWD's didnt get nerfed. Anyway, I volley 4 torps, and use 2 mega beam, 3 hardeners and a XLarge Booster. One got within 1500m, and didnt webify or scramble me, go figure. REMEMBER THIS: As SOON as you engage, align your ship to what you will warp to when escaping. I have gotten away every time with no armor damage. Happy hunting!!
Ariell Lucinwind	Posted - 2003.12.17 06:45:00 - [51] Adliger Krieger -- what ship was that your in ? If it was a cruiser -- that makes me feel warm. If your in a Battleship, well pass the buck mate cause thats a lot of us without one who now cant join in the fun. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Came back cause I love you guys :P
Jash Illian	Posted - 2003.12.17 06:45:00 - [52] Quote: Jash, imho you can't play about with the ranges against NPCs. Their warp in is always centered on the players-20km from player, 15km from player, 40km from player. If it was centered on the middle of the belt, with NPCs spawning for (example) 100km in each direction from the centre of the belt, maybe that would be do-able...but it's not like that (unless I've seriously screwed up figuring out how the new NPC rules work ). If they spawned at a static point in space, people would stay 100km from that spot and snipe all day. I mean its like you want corporations to oblige each other like its sex or something. Pffft I would rather *** my enemy.- Rohann Be careful out there. That other guy waiting in the queue for the gate MIGHT be a baby-munching frock-burner, YOU JUST DON'T KNOW!*- Lallante
Veruna Caseti	Posted - 2003.12.17 06:47:00 - [53] Quote: If they spawned at a static point in space, people would stay 100km from that spot and snipe all day. And? The person who is in position first ought to have the advantage. Why should NPCs magically "know" where players are before they enter a belt? Besides, you can't sit and "snipe all day" at a fleet of battleships. They will close a 100km gap before you are done destroying the first few ships. Veruna Caseti Ishukone
Adliger Krieger	Posted - 2003.12.17 06:48:00 - [54] I'm in a Scorpion.
Drethen Nerevitas	Posted - 2003.12.17 07:04:00 - [55] I didn't say spawn at a static point. I said centred on a static point. When we warp to a belt, we warp in 20km from belt centre. If rats warped in at 20km from centre, 50km from centre, etc-instead of 20km from player, 50km from player, etc, that is what I am talking about. Because let's face it, I haven't seen a "Warp to player" option yet, and it's just damn unfair that the NPCs have it first . Oh, yeah and it makes for sucky ranged tactics. _______________________________________________________________________ *IMPORTANT: Devs (and players) please take notice.* 1. 2. 3. 4. 5. 6. 7.
Novo DuPont	Posted - 2003.12.17 07:24:00 - [56] WELL HERE IS THE KICKER: CCP knew about the close spawn problem, because it was on the test server and enough of us told them about it. On the test server it was hard to kill a BS group, which was a BS with 5 to 6 top end cruisers. What is happening now was NOT EVER tried out on the test server. The flip side too many of you are to greedy. I went out in my Megathron, solo, (425 mm setup with MWD and large shield booster, all cap power relays) targeted the 1 million bounty cruiser, killed it and warped out. I made 8 million in 17 minutes that way. Didn't get loot, yes I have armor damage, but at this rate goona have another 40 to 50 million before down time I bet all those 1 million bounty cruisers will go POOF! after down time, you never know "To succeed greatly one must sacrifice greatly"
Jash Illian	Posted - 2003.12.17 07:29:00 - [57] Quote: WELL HERE IS THE KICKER: CCP knew about the close spawn problem, because it was on the test server and enough of us told them about it. On the test server it was hard to kill a BS group, which was a BS with 5 to 6 top end cruisers. What is happening now was NOT EVER tried out on the test server. The flip side too many of you are to greedy. I went out in my Megathron, solo, (425 mm setup with MWD and large shield booster, all cap power relays) targeted the 1 million bounty cruiser, killed it and warped out. I made 8 million in 17 minutes that way. Didn't get loot, yes I have armor damage, but at this rate goona have another 40 to 50 million before down time I bet all those 1 million bounty cruisers will go POOF! after down time, you never know More than likely it's a spawn bug with the number of ships the belt is supposed to be spawning. I mean its like you want corporations to oblige each other like its sex or something. Pffft I would rather *** my enemy.- Rohann Be careful out there. That other guy waiting in the queue for the gate MIGHT be a baby-munching frock-burner, YOU JUST DON'T KNOW!*- Lallante
Lifewire	Posted - 2003.12.17 07:37:00 - [58] Now u guys know how player pirates may have thought when they were engaged by deadly concord fleets. Learn to live with it U should remember: concord BS dont stop hunting u in a 1.0 system. These NPCs stop it when u warp out of the belt.
ElGuapo	Posted - 2003.12.17 07:38:00 - [59] Yeah we lost an Apoc tonight, but had a blast doing it. 2 Megas and 1 Apoc versus a lot. After killing 11 ships, 2 of them BS's, we had to run from the rest. This is a lot of fun. There is risk and it is exciting. Thank you CCCP for making this fun again.
Novo DuPont	Posted - 2003.12.17 07:43:00 - [60] Livewire what is your point??? Last I checked rare ore doesnt spawn in 1.0 systems, unless I was misinformed about that. Also did you ever get loot drops off COncord BS's? "To succeed greatly one must sacrifice greatly"

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