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Navy Caracal, are there any in pvp?

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Beithir	Posted - 2007.03.30 19:45:00 - [1] i hate flying BS at all, they are too slow and vulnerable. now i^m plaing with the idea to buy me a Navy Caracal, but i never engaged or saw one in action. are they cool? If there are PVPers around who fly one, please share your experience with me ^^ thanks in advance
Marcus Druallis Quantum Industries Prime Orbital Systems	Posted - 2007.03.30 19:56:00 - [2] lol -- Your signature exceeds the maximum allowed filesize of 24000 bytes - Devil ([email protected])
Belenkas Amarr	Posted - 2007.03.30 19:58:00 - [3] Putting expensive PvE missile boat to PvP? Plain stupid is what I would call it.
Arowe Telak Grave Diggers Soldiers of the Forgotten Abyss	Posted - 2007.03.30 20:00:00 - [4] It's used about as commonly as any other faction ship. Most people would rather downgrade to a regular Caracal or get the skills and money to use a Cerberus. That said the Navy Caracal is actaully one of if not the best platform for HAM's due to its awesome fitting abilities. I've heard of some people using it for that. Sigs are overrated.
Silvio McFredric	Posted - 2007.03.30 20:19:00 - [5] They do an awesome job of smashing T1 cruisers and can usually warp before a BS locks it. Good fun imo
Merin Ryskin FinFleet Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2007.03.30 20:54:00 - [6] Edited by: Merin Ryskin on 30/03/2007 20:51:24 Just remember, unlike most faction ships, you have an insane range advantage to abuse. It's hard to kill a Navy Caracal that's parked 100km away spamming missiles. And that's very good for protecting your investment, your expensive faction toy will be safely in warp long before anything can scramble it. But it's a good ship in general, covering most of the Caracal's weaknesses. It's no Cerberus obviously, but the skills and cost are a lot lower.
Ryysa North Face Force Privateer Alliance	Posted - 2007.03.30 22:15:00 - [7] Originally by: Merin Ryskin Edited by: Merin Ryskin on 30/03/2007 20:51:24 Just remember, unlike most faction ships, you have an insane range advantage to abuse. It's hard to kill a Navy Caracal that's parked 100km away spamming missiles. And that's very good for protecting your investment, your expensive faction toy will be safely in warp long before anything can scramble it. But it's a good ship in general, covering most of the Caracal's weaknesses. It's no Cerberus obviously, but the skills and cost are a lot lower. Uhmmmmm. To tackle a caracal which warps in 100km from my crow it takes me about 6 seconds. To tackle a caracal which warps in 100km from my vagabond it takes me about 10 seconds. Come back when you have learned that 100km is nothing. And yes, people use them, I've killed two so far, they did exactly what you described, and got owned. N.F.F. Recruitment
Belenkas Amarr	Posted - 2007.03.30 22:17:00 - [8] to tackle a target 100km all you need is single covops frig as warp-in point :)
Ryysa North Face Force Privateer Alliance	Posted - 2007.03.30 22:21:00 - [9] Originally by: Belenkas to tackle a target 100km all you need is single covops frig as warp-in point :) Wrong. Setting up the point takes longer. Also when the target warps in (and you can see him coming out of warp) you can immediately mwd to him. That means that you are mwding to him before he gains control of his ship. That means most of the time he has 3 sec to try to warp out again. Covops has 4 seconds recalibration time iirc. Also, if target had chance to align, you won't do **** with covert ops. The trick is scrambling them before they can align to warp out. If you only pvp against morons who don't know what "align" means then yes you can drop something on top of them, against a foe with a TINY bit of a CLUE this will fail 90% of the cases. Nice try, try harder. N.F.F. Recruitment
Fluffernator	Posted - 2007.03.30 22:23:00 - [10] Lol Ryssa, You make is sound so black and white, who says you arent engaged with another target when he warps in? I warp in 140km in sniping setups all the time and its quite funny watching inties try to close on me and me hitting them into armor/hull and watching them warp away.
Ryysa North Face Force Privateer Alliance	Posted - 2007.03.30 22:30:00 - [11] Edited by: Ryysa on 30/03/2007 22:29:17 Originally by: Fluffernator Lol Ryssa, You make is sound so black and white, who says you arent engaged with another target when he warps in? I warp in 140km in sniping setups all the time and its quite funny watching inties try to close on me and me hitting them into armor/hull and watching them warp away. Well, that's because those inties are noob, I'd love to see you hit my 11km/s inty (no gang bonuses). And i perfectly know how transversal works. Also at 140km you will be tackled in 10 seconds, out of which you will be able to control your ship for 7 seconds. And it is as easy as black and white, because i've done it a gazillion times against retarded snipers like you. And yeah, if people don't notice a sniper warp in, then they deserve to die. Face it, most "PvPers" in eve have no idea about PvP. PvP in EvE is very simple once you know and play by the rules. There's not too much randomness involved, and it's all mathematics. If you have a crappy attention span and crappy setup, you will be owned by people with better attention span and better setup - such is the natural flow of things. I can guarantee with 99% that if you warp in a sniper at 140km while I am in an inty you will be tackled, unless i am heavily intoxicated or tired to hell. N.F.F. Recruitment
Fluffernator	Posted - 2007.03.30 22:32:00 - [12] Edited by: Fluffernator on 30/03/2007 22:31:14 LOL, you can't approach me in a timely manner and not get hit. Its that simple. Trust me, if you approach me in your "6 seconds" I will have u locked and 1 volleyed into hull/armor . I've done it a gazzillion tiems as well. The only way an inty is gonna tackle a sniper that has good bookmarks/ warp in points is if the sniper is a retard. You obvously have minimal experience in large battles. Your not going to notice one sniper warp in when your occupied with so much else. What will happen is you will camp a gate and you and your privateer friends will 5 on 1 some noob empire carebare that warps in at that range.
Ryysa North Face Force Privateer Alliance	Posted - 2007.03.30 22:34:00 - [13] Edited by: Ryysa on 30/03/2007 22:32:40 Originally by: Fluffernator LOL, you can't approach me in a timely manner and not get hit. Its that simple. Trust me, if you approach me in your "6 seconds" I will have u locked and 1 volleyed into hull/armor . I've done it a gazzillion tiems as well. The only way an inty is gonna tackle a sniper that has good bookmarks/ warp in points is if the sniper is a retard. I can easily approach you under a slight angle. And you are assuming 11k/s. In gang with gangmod it's more like 17k/s, which is about...3-4 seconds? :D You won't even lock me before i am on top of you, simple :) Snipers are pointless, you only kill the dumb people with 0 risk pvp, and you are proud of it. That's fine, dumb people deserve to die, but don't be proud because you learned how to align, press f1-f8 and ctrl+click on overview. A 5 year old can do that. P.S. Stop derailing thread now please, if you want to test my reflexes, we can do after next mirror on sisi :) N.F.F. Recruitment
Fluffernator	Posted - 2007.03.30 22:36:00 - [14] Edited by: Fluffernator on 30/03/2007 22:33:20 you have to go at a pretty extreme angle ot out track my guns at 140km. What inty do you fly that is doing 14km/s, i'd like to see the fit. And like I said, if you have a fleet, your not going to notice me warp in instantly. PS: go into a fleet battle and tell me snipers are dumb LOL. So far you've reinforced the fact that you know nothing about actual warfare, but are an expert on ganking noobs.
Morreia The Celestial Element	Posted - 2007.03.30 22:36:00 - [15] He then has another few seconds to 1/2 volley you and warp out before your gang mates get there.
Ryysa North Face Force Privateer Alliance	Posted - 2007.03.30 22:39:00 - [16] Edited by: Ryysa on 30/03/2007 22:37:44 Originally by: Fluffernator you have to go at a pretty extreme angle ot out track my guns at 140km. What inty do you fly that is doing 14km/s, i'd like to see the fit. And like I said, if you have a fleet, your not going to notice me warp in instantly. No stupid, i don't have to. I can actually be about 60-70 rom you before you have me locked, after that click orbit and the ship will take it's own angle at which you won't hit it anymore, uber simple. And why would I be fighting a fleet with an expensive inty. I don't do 100v100 blobfights, maybe that's your thing. If i am fighting a 20 man gang at a gate, and you warp in at 140km, I will: 1. See high velocity on the right column of my overview. 2. See distance from you on my overview. And if we are flying a fast ship gang, if I see a sniper bs warp in, it's like GUYS FREE KILL GOGOGOGO. Oh and setup. 1x Interceptor 1x Gistii MWD 1x Overdrive 2x Mass Reduction Rigs 1x Snake set Originally by: Morreia He then has another few seconds to 1/2 volley you and warp out before your gang mates get there. How? Have you ever sniped with a BS? you can't track for ****. And if you are leet inty pilot you fit 28km scram, so you can't get nosed unless BS has faction scram. You are really that gullible that you think sniper BS can hit inty orbitting at 9km/s at 26km? Sniper BS can't hit inty orbiting at 9km/s at 80km, never mind 20km. Maybe 3 years ago N.F.F. Recruitment
Morreia The Celestial Element	Posted - 2007.03.30 22:42:00 - [17] Sorry but where exactly does it say BS. If you could point it out to me then yes I will acept your right. Only thing then though is what if the BS fits faction NOS?
Fluffernator	Posted - 2007.03.30 22:44:00 - [18] Edited by: Fluffernator on 30/03/2007 22:41:53 now the real question is.... when did i ever say I snipe in a battleship.. and your calling me stupid lol. Try medium turrets. I make these snipe fits specifically to kill inties, and it works well. 1.5 second lock time, 140km optimal, goes up to 250 if i want it too, at 140 pretty much 1 volly puts you into hull. And thats without any tracking penalties and 2 tacking comps... lol you can't really outtrack that at any range. now sure, if you do manage to get under my guns im fubared, but trust me its not as easy as u make it out to be. And yes, I like fleet warfare. I like wars where the enemy isnt an empire carebera and a noob. I like, whats it called... a challange? LOL ITs kinda funny how you say im in a gang and i see ONE sniper bs warp in lol. Further reinforcement of privateers gang banging people in empire. If seen you guys run from gangs of similar size over and over and over, its relaly funny.
Merin Ryskin FinFleet Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2007.03.30 22:45:00 - [19] Originally by: Ryysa Originally by: Merin Ryskin Edited by: Merin Ryskin on 30/03/2007 20:51:24 Just remember, unlike most faction ships, you have an insane range advantage to abuse. It's hard to kill a Navy Caracal that's parked 100km away spamming missiles. And that's very good for protecting your investment, your expensive faction toy will be safely in warp long before anything can scramble it. But it's a good ship in general, covering most of the Caracal's weaknesses. It's no Cerberus obviously, but the skills and cost are a lot lower. Uhmmmmm. To tackle a caracal which warps in 100km from my crow it takes me about 6 seconds. To tackle a caracal which warps in 100km from my vagabond it takes me about 10 seconds. Come back when you have learned that 100km is nothing. And yes, people use them, I've killed two so far, they did exactly what you described, and got owned. Try again. It takes you 6-10 seconds to get into range. It takes me less than a second to press the warp button and insta-warp. Not to mention the fact that if I'm engaging a target at 100km with a missile boat, it means that target is already tied up fighting someone else 100km away. So your interceptor might be great at tackling carebear belt ratters who don't know how to stay aligned, but a proper PvP missile boat pilot is a hopeless cause.
Ryysa North Face Force Privateer Alliance	Posted - 2007.03.30 22:45:00 - [20] Originally by: Morreia Sorry but where exactly does it say BS. If you could point it out to me then yes I will acept your right. Only thing then though is what if the BS fits faction NOS? Then you notice your cap is dry, so you doubleclick in space on a spot, let your previous MWD burst carry you some 50km away from it and hit warp. Simple too. If it's a muninn/eagle, then it really depends, however usually in that case, one of our vagabonds goes for it who just shrugs off the pathetic damage (and still goes over 8k/s). Honestly, why do I have to spoonfeed you these things. You have singularity server - go test there, suck up to someone so they give you a gistii mwd, or try to get one on TQ and store it, so you can take it out next mirror. Snake implants are free on test. You won't understand me until you have flown 15k/s ship. N.F.F. Recruitment
Ryysa North Face Force Privateer Alliance	Posted - 2007.03.30 22:47:00 - [21] Edited by: Ryysa on 30/03/2007 22:44:39 Originally by: Merin Ryskin Originally by: Ryysa Originally by: Merin Ryskin Edited by: Merin Ryskin on 30/03/2007 20:51:24 Just remember, unlike most faction ships, you have an insane range advantage to abuse. It's hard to kill a Navy Caracal that's parked 100km away spamming missiles. And that's very good for protecting your investment, your expensive faction toy will be safely in warp long before anything can scramble it. But it's a good ship in general, covering most of the Caracal's weaknesses. It's no Cerberus obviously, but the skills and cost are a lot lower. Uhmmmmm. To tackle a caracal which warps in 100km from my crow it takes me about 6 seconds. To tackle a caracal which warps in 100km from my vagabond it takes me about 10 seconds. Come back when you have learned that 100km is nothing. And yes, people use them, I've killed two so far, they did exactly what you described, and got owned. Try again. It takes you 6-10 seconds to get into range. It takes me less than a second to press the warp button and insta-warp. Not to mention the fact that if I'm engaging a target at 100km with a missile boat, it means that target is already tied up fighting someone else 100km away. So your interceptor might be great at tackling carebear belt ratters who don't know how to stay aligned, but a proper PvP missile boat pilot is a hopeless cause. Err, you warp in, unless you have pre-set warp-through bookmarks at that spot (which is higlhly unlikely) you need to turn around and warp out. So no, you can't instawarp unless there is a celestial object directly in front of you when you warp in. Yawn, why do I bother =/ Unless you're psychic, you can't every time know exactly where fight will be, so you will have to warp into the fight, that's where you get killed. That's what every GOOD ceptor pilot looks for in a fast ship gang, he looks for NEW arrivals that are off the main mass, so everyone can zoom over and gank him, then get back to what they were doing. I guess I need to make fraps of how we do it... N.F.F. Recruitment
Morreia The Celestial Element	Posted - 2007.03.30 22:47:00 - [22] Been there, done that, got the T-shirt on mail order. And if your inty warps off then what is holding my BS and stopping it warping off?
Fluffernator	Posted - 2007.03.30 22:48:00 - [23] Look ryssa, your not spoon feeding, your just being a ****. Im just disagreeing with you here. Its not so easy to tackle someone thats not a total noob as u make it out to be.
Ryysa North Face Force Privateer Alliance	Posted - 2007.03.30 22:50:00 - [24] Edited by: Ryysa on 30/03/2007 22:47:51 Originally by: Morreia Been there, done that, got the T-shirt on mail order. And if your inty warps off then what is holding my BS and stopping it warping off? How often do you fit 30km nos on your SNIPING BS? Originally by: Fluffernator Look ryssa, your not spoon feeding, your just being a **. Im just disagreeing with you here. Its not so easy to tackle someone thats not a total noob as u make it out to be. It is very easy to tackle anyone when you go fast enough, very very easy, however you need to be ready to put 2bil isk clone into a 300m ship which is paper thin, which the majority of the people on TQ will never do. So thus - an average ceptor will never get a sniper with half a clue. Quote:** LOL yeah make fraps of the privateers ganking noobs wiht 20 on 1 odds. that will make you look cool! oo oo I wanna see how to gank some poor soul with 20 on 1 odds, me first! You just lost the argument by bringing my alliance into this. Ask some people around who know me. And check my killboard. but yeah, I see now why you are arguing with me, because of my alliance ticker. FOAD and go to corp discussions if you want to discuss that. Besides, you are not even showing yours newb. N.F.F. Recruitment
Morreia The Celestial Element	Posted - 2007.03.30 22:52:00 - [25] Originally by: Ryysa Originally by: Morreia Been there, done that, got the T-shirt on mail order. And if your inty warps off then what is holding my BS and stopping it warping off? How often do you fit 30km nos on your SNIPING BS? When I have a free high slot and want to defend against tacklers.
Fluffernator	Posted - 2007.03.30 22:54:00 - [26] Edited by: Fluffernator on 30/03/2007 22:50:41 not sure how i've lost an argument, but anyways. I often fly with several wingmen when im sniping. One of them is often a rook. So if you think you can easily hold down a rook, and a sniper and usually a nos boat, be my guest.
Ryysa North Face Force Privateer Alliance	Posted - 2007.03.30 22:55:00 - [27] Originally by: Morreia Originally by: Ryysa Originally by: Morreia Been there, done that, got the T-shirt on mail order. And if your inty warps off then what is holding my BS and stopping it warping off? How often do you fit 30km nos on your SNIPING BS? When I have a free high slot and want to defend against tacklers. Name me a BS which has 2000 grid free after fitting a full rack of large caliber guns? Not sure how the grid on the mega is after 7 guns, all other ships don't seem as likely candidates since most either will require multiple power upgrades/grid rigs or use 8 guns. However, if you do fit a 30km nos, then you deserve to win against a ceptor which fits a 30km scram - It's simple. Somehow I have not once in 2 years of pvp seen a sniper BS with a TS nos though. N.F.F. Recruitment
Fluffernator	Posted - 2007.03.30 22:58:00 - [28] i've got one, ROKH. can easily fit a large nos + its sniping guns, + a tank
Fluffernator	Posted - 2007.03.30 23:03:00 - [29] no, I flamed your alliance because earlier you were saying 10 on 1 odds. Conviently this is the way the privateers fight. They either extremely out gun what they fight or extremely out number. Privateers dont fight capable opponents, I think most can agree with that. 1 sniper comes in and your gang jumps the sniper. Trust me, with similar numbers snipers are very very effective.
Ryysa North Face Force Privateer Alliance	Posted - 2007.03.30 23:04:00 - [30] Originally by: Merin Ryskin Besides, this is just silly. You're comparing a full faction-fitted interceptor with billions in implants AND gang-mates to a single 100 million ISK cruiser. Even if for some reason I warp in unaware, all you've proven is that if you spend enough money and bring enough friends you can win pretty much any fight. Take away your blob of friends and all you'll manage to do is scramble me and watch as I go AFK and passive tank your Crow until downtime (or more likely, just log off and laugh as you can't even kill me in 15 minutes). If I am solo I will probably fly vagabond. And true, comparing multi-billion isk setups is out of line, I just compare to what I am used to flying. And I can say that with the introduction of snake implants 1 year ago, sniping and distances in general have become of a lot less importance in smaller scale combat - which is very nice. As to the OP. Get a drake instead of that caracal, it will do everything better, except aligning. N.F.F. Recruitment

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