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[SF] Week One War Diary

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Octavinus Augustus Amarr PIE Inc.	Posted - 2007.04.09 18:22:00 - [31] Originally by: Jasmine Constantine I'd consider it a personal favour if the Amarrians not actually fighting this war could continue their endless nonsensical torturing of logic in one of the numerous threads they have designed for the purpose elsewhere. Keep this thread for commenting on the war diary please. (And yes, I would like the ISD mods to intervene and remove off topic discussion if possible to ensure this thread doesn't get bogged down with irrelevent discussion that has nothing to do with this weeks diary). Well, we couldn't have you feel in any way obliged now could we little Jasmine. I really do think you ought to change your name from Star Fraction to Star Fiction. It somehow appear to be a more suitable name. Motto: Vae Victis - Woe to the vanquished.
Pezzle Amarr Imperial Dreams Curatores Veritatis Alliance	Posted - 2007.04.09 18:22:00 - [32] Edited by: Pezzle on 09/04/2007 18:19:04 wrong topic
Revan Neferis Amarr Bloodveil The Sani Sabik	Posted - 2007.04.09 18:29:00 - [33] Originally by: Tomahawk Bliss to clarify for OSS's involvment Bastables had nothing to do with it, I asked for the war and it was declared. SF's luck was that Naphtalia, CEO of Black Rabbits has a personal friendship with a few members of OSS' leadership (something I didn't know at the time) and was able to cause enough trouble in defence of Sani Sabik and Star Fraction that it wasn't worth the issue. I was looking forward to some fun in Amarr, I made a request and OSS obliged. simple as that, no cloak and dagger games or anything of the like. don't paint it so romantic. "the sad fact of the matter is XXX... we want to kill Revan again" Original by.... "Revan dies, no need for us to fight" original by.... Don't make me say another word. or even the complete set. Even a stupid lie as your post above, have limits. "Power destroys the ones who dont have it"
Octavinus Augustus Amarr PIE Inc.	Posted - 2007.04.09 18:33:00 - [34] Originally by: Ituralde We don't pay off pirates as an organization. We do not pay anyone for standings. Originally by: Ituralde We don't ransom ships, save rarely under extreme circumstances where the defeated party sometimes approaches us in a desperate attempt to save their vessel. And on and on it goes from Ituralde. Originally by: Azure Skyclad Originally by: Octavinus Augustus So, am I to understand that when an SF official speaks on behalf of your alliance you do not feel any obligation to follow his words? Nope. Now viewing these posts together makes it absolutely clear that the "we" referred to in Ituraldes post (as well as in any other post by SF members) is simply an empty phrase. After all, no SF pilot is bound by the words of any other SF pilot be he an official spokesman of the alliance or not. Basically, anything said by any SF pilot is simply an empty meaningless series of words made up to suit the occasion. Motto: Vae Victis - Woe to the vanquished.
Jasmine Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.04.09 18:39:00 - [35] Originally by: Octavinus Augustus Well, we couldn't have you feel in any way obliged now could we little Jasmine. I really do think you ought to change your name from Star Fraction to Star Fiction. It somehow appear to be a more suitable name. What kind of tech1 frigate would you like? Star Fraction is recruiting
Azure Skyclad Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.04.09 18:47:00 - [36] Edited by: Azure Skyclad on 09/04/2007 18:43:40 Originally by: Octavinus Augustus Some selective omissions and out of context quotes......... If you're going to quote me in an argument then be so kind as to quote it all would you? Good boy! http://ultravixen.co.uk/
Tharrn Amarr Epitoth Fleetyards Vigilia Valeria	Posted - 2007.04.09 18:48:00 - [37] Ah, the numbers game... the VV statistics stand at: Inflicted: 2 Assault Frigattes, 2 Battlecruisers, 4 Battleship, 4 Heavy Assault Ships, 3 Interceptors and 1 Recon Cruiser totalling 1.448 billion ISK. Losses: 1 Assault Frigatte, 4 Battleships, 6 Cruisers, 1 Industrial, 2 Interceptors, 1 Interdictor and 1 Shuttle totalling 521 million ISK. The overall efficiency thus stands as 74.05% and we are determined to raise it above 90% like for all of our campaigns past and present. Otherwise a nice work containing a lot of wishfull thinking, worthy to be the basis for one of the Gallente holoreels you seem to fancy so much. If the SF had bothered to define clear cut goals from start we could even measure how successfull this week has been for them. As they did not the statistics are all we have unfortunately. Thank you for engaging a foe that outgunned you in his never undocking legion of T1 cruisers though. Ceterum censeo 'Concordia' esse delendam.
Jasmine Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.04.09 18:54:00 - [38] Edited by: Jasmine Constantine on 09/04/2007 18:54:25 Originally by: Tharrn Ah, the numbers game... the VV statistics stand at: Inflicted: 2 Assault Frigattes, 2 Battlecruisers, 4 Battleship, 4 Heavy Assault Ships, 3 Interceptors and 1 Recon Cruiser totalling 1.448 billion ISK. Losses: 1 Assault Frigatte, 4 Battleships, 6 Cruisers, 1 Industrial, 2 Interceptors, 1 Interdictor and 1 Shuttle totalling 521 million ISK. The overall efficiency thus stands as 74.05% and we are determined to raise it above 90% like for all of our campaigns past and present. Otherwise a nice work containing a lot of wishfull thinking, worthy to be the basis for one of the Gallente holoreels you seem to fancy so much. If the SF had bothered to define clear cut goals from start we could even measure how successfull this week has been for them. As they did not the statistics are all we have unfortunately. Thank you for engaging a foe that outgunned you in his never undocking legion of T1 cruisers though. Obviously its entirely ridiculous to take your kill figures singularly since you act in concert with other Amarrian loyalists always. Otherwise we'd have to deduct the figures you are claiming from AM and PIE figures and make theirs worse. VV have been involved with 4 BS Kills vs SF, PIE have been involved with 6 - you suggest we've lost 10 and should double account for losses for two different organisations acting together? Insane. As anyone sensible can see our general overview of the statistics showing SF vs PIE/AM/VV as a single set of figures is the only meaningful measure of the campaign proceess and your interjection is just a attempt to hide the truth. If you want to present this kind of thing I suggest you do as PIE have done and author your own war diary Amarrian. And for the record the isk figures are ridculous since all tech2 hulls used by SF in this campaign are manufactured by our shipyards and sold internally to pilots at build cost. Have a nice day! Star Fraction is recruiting
Tharrn Amarr Epitoth Fleetyards Vigilia Valeria	Posted - 2007.04.09 19:06:00 - [39] It was just to demonstrate that these figures are meaningless. Thank you for acknowledging that so quickly. Ceterum censeo 'Concordia' esse delendam.
Ituralde Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.04.09 19:17:00 - [40] I could argue that we aren't in combined fleets, but it really isn't necessary. The fact remains that you can't freely travel around your own capitol, and that fact will remain to be the case. By all means though, take what small victories you can and you might even be able to convince yourselves that you are actually winning. _____________________________ Fear is the mind-killer.
Kovid Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.04.09 19:18:00 - [41] VV, you have to make a certain number of appearance to the battlefield to throw numbers. A small sample size always will be suspect, even if we are the ones doing the beating. But the fact their is a small sample size does measure your zeal. The so called praetorians (VV & PIE) do a fine job of keeping the station chairs warm. But as Jasmine said, the splitting of numbers and double counting of things is typical. Should we split up Star Fraction into corporation statistics? That would do the same thing. And the restriction of reporting losses to public record among many if not all of you is indicative of many things. The suppression of the Amarr Domain protectors continues. ---------------------------------- An informal Star Fraction FAQ \| ----------------------------------
Tharrn Amarr Epitoth Fleetyards Vigilia Valeria	Posted - 2007.04.09 19:21:00 - [42] Originally by: Ituralde The fact remains that you can't freely travel around your own capitol, and that fact will remain to be the case. By all means though, take what small victories you can and you might even be able to convince yourselves that you are actually winning. Really? I have been there earlier, conducted my business and left again, despite of four of your pilots being in system. At the same time Lallara, to whom I was chatting, outfitted a battleship with modules she bought from nearby systems and carried to Amarr. Whom are you trying to fool? You cannot and do not control Amarr enough to have any impact on normal operations. But my all means: sit in your little trench all day shouting 'we are winning, PIE is disintegrating!' Ceterum censeo 'Concordia' esse delendam.
Tharrn Amarr Epitoth Fleetyards Vigilia Valeria	Posted - 2007.04.09 19:23:00 - [43] Originally by: Kovid VV, you have to make a certain number of appearance to the battlefield to throw numbers. A small sample size always will be suspect, even if we are the ones doing the beating. But the fact their is a small sample size does measure your zeal. The so called praetorians (VV & PIE) do a fine job of keeping the station chairs warm. But as Jasmine said, the splitting of numbers and double counting of things is typical. Should we split up Star Fraction into corporation statistics? That would do the same thing. And the restriction of reporting losses to public record among many if not all of you is indicative of many things. The suppression of the Amarr Domain protectors continues. I was just under the impression that all sensible parties had agreed that posting statistics on the IGS is a bad idea a long time ago as it just leads to endless discussions about what is the right way to display them and how many kills were omitted by what side. slaps head THERE is the problem. Ceterum censeo 'Concordia' esse delendam.
Jasmine Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.04.09 19:27:00 - [44] Originally by: Tharrn Originally by: Kovid VV, you have to make a certain number of appearance to the battlefield to throw numbers. A small sample size always will be suspect, even if we are the ones doing the beating. But the fact their is a small sample size does measure your zeal. The so called praetorians (VV & PIE) do a fine job of keeping the station chairs warm. But as Jasmine said, the splitting of numbers and double counting of things is typical. Should we split up Star Fraction into corporation statistics? That would do the same thing. And the restriction of reporting losses to public record among many if not all of you is indicative of many things. The suppression of the Amarr Domain protectors continues. I was just under the impression that all sensible parties had agreed that posting statistics on the IGS is a bad idea a long time ago as it just leads to endless discussions about what is the right way to display them and how many kills were omitted by what side. slaps head THERE is the problem. Wrong. Our figures make perfect sense. Accept that or not, its not my concern. But putting up a nonsense interpretation to try and prove ALL statistics are meaningless is simply being ignorant. End of the day we've blown up 182 war target ships and pods, your side has blown up 47 ships and pods of ours. You can't make that kind of number go away with simple propaganda and wish fulfilment. Star Fraction is recruiting
Ituralde Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.04.09 19:31:00 - [45] Originally by: Tharrn Whom are you trying to fool? You cannot and do not control Amarr enough to have any impact on normal operations. As I said, by all means keep convincing yourself of that. Someday, you might actually believe it if you repeat it enough. _____________________________ Fear is the mind-killer.
Tharrn Amarr Epitoth Fleetyards Vigilia Valeria	Posted - 2007.04.09 19:38:00 - [46] Originally by: Jasmine Constantine Wrong. Our figures make perfect sense. Accept that or not, its not my concern. But putting up a nonsense interpretation to try and prove ALL statistics are meaningless is simply being ignorant. End of the day we've blown up 182 war target ships and pods, your side has blown up 47 ships and pods of ours. You can't make that kind of number go away with simple propaganda and wish fulfilment. Do you have an efficiency percentage to go with that or are those meaningless as they don't suit you, too? Every time you'll post your statistic I will post ours - it is of no concern to me if you think it makes sense either. Ceterum censeo 'Concordia' esse delendam.
Jasmine Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.04.09 19:42:00 - [47] Originally by: Tharrn Do you have an efficiency percentage to go with that or are those meaningless as they don't suit you, too? Every time you'll post your statistic I will post ours - it is of no concern to me if you think it makes sense either. Whatever, do as you will. Won't make your performance in space any better. Star Fraction is recruiting
Gaius Sejanus Gallente Federal Navy Academy	Posted - 2007.04.09 19:48:00 - [48] Quote: I think it's been shown quite readily that the only recourse the Amarrian paramilitaries have at the moment is to point fingers and shout "Liar, Liar." What do you mean "At the moment"? It's quite obvious that PIE and its erstwhile allies have been shaking in their boots from the very moment the Star Fraction declaration was made. You can tell the obvious difference in how PIE's GalNet warriors behave when speaking to other war targets, and how they reacted from the very first post from the Fraction. They lost this war even before the 24 hour timer to start hostilities was up.
Ituralde Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.04.09 20:21:00 - [49] Originally by: Tharrn Do you have an efficiency percentage to go with that or are those meaningless as they don't suit you, too? Every time you'll post your statistic I will post ours - it is of no concern to me if you think it makes sense either. Killboard Statstics can be calculated countless ways, most of them are foolish. Raw numbers are far better. We could inflate point values on our killboard as well and come with a different efficiency. But, since you are interested? Our efficiency for this war is just under 70%. _____________________________ Fear is the mind-killer.
Dallenn Minmatar Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.04.09 22:16:00 - [50] Originally by: Tharrn Really? I have been there earlier, conducted my business and left again, despite of four of your pilots being in system. At the same time Lallara, to whom I was chatting, outfitted a battleship with modules she bought from nearby systems and carried to Amarr. Of course, there is quite a bit of anecdotal evidence of bold Amarrian shuttle and frigate pilots flying around the local hub systems, carrying assets to replace those lost on the battlefield, or running whatever errands are considered "normal operations" in the paramilitary circles. Still, one cannot hide one's surprise over how much the operations of Amarrian paramilitaries have changed to fit changing times, for being such conservative organizations. On a different note, I would like to send congratulations to those pilots who have been officially recognized, especially Alyne. Her relentless fighting spirit and good humour have really carried on this interesting campaign. Roleplaying in Eve
Davlos Caldari Omerta Syndicate Exuro Mortis	Posted - 2007.04.09 23:38:00 - [51] One innocent question: In the displayed footage, was there any grand strategy involved during the wastage of capacitor by having one repairer active even though the ship's armor was in optimal condition? ---------------
Tecam Hund The Buggers	Posted - 2007.04.09 23:56:00 - [52] Originally by: Tharrn It was just to demonstrate that these figures are meaningless. Thank you for acknowledging that so quickly. Yes indeed. Numbers always serve to provide the general picture for uninvolved parties. What is relevant though, is that Star Fraction, while facing a numerically larger foe (the representatives of superior race at that), has complete superiority in space on your own turf. Congratulations SF. Hopefully upcoming weeks will bring you more success.
Bacchanalian Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.04.10 00:06:00 - [53] Originally by: Davlos One innocent question: In the displayed footage, was there any grand strategy involved during the wastage of capacitor by having one repairer active even though the ship's armor was in optimal condition? Wouldn't you like to know! Star Fraction is recruiting, join the revolution!
Tecam Hund The Buggers	Posted - 2007.04.10 00:38:00 - [54] Originally by: Davlos One innocent question: In the displayed footage, was there any grand strategy involved during the wastage of capacitor by having one repairer active even though the ship's armor was in optimal condition? No plate. Armour repairers don't repair instantly, and if you are called primary there is a possibility your tank won't hold.
Tareen Kashaar Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.04.10 03:40:00 - [55] Originally by: Davlos One innocent question: In the displayed footage, was there any grand strategy involved during the wastage of capacitor by having one repairer active even though the ship's armor was in optimal condition? As the pilot in question, I might just answer: Because I can. Have a nice day. --- WTS: Forum Signatures, 30mil a piece. Evemail me!
Vaslav Tchitcherine Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.04.10 04:33:00 - [56] Originally by: Tharrn Do you have an efficiency percentage to go with that or are those meaningless as they don't suit you, too? Efficiency is a derived statistic that can be calculated in any number of ways. It is as open to debate and questions of relevance as ISK loss values, kill points or any other derived statistic. This is why we only quote actual ship numbers destroyed, because only these numbers have true meaning. And I note you do not dispute them, because you cannot. If you want more information on how badly you are faring, our killboard is open to all. For your reference, our efficiency calculations are based on kill points, point values are listed on the Help page, and ISK values on kill pages are clearly marked as approximate and for amusement value only. When you are done nitpicking, feel free to muster your fleet. Star Fraction recruitment: come join the Yarrletariat!
Rodj Blake Amarr PIE Inc.	Posted - 2007.04.10 08:38:00 - [57] Edited by: Rodj Blake on 10/04/2007 08:35:02 Originally by: Vaslav Tchitcherine Originally by: Tharrn Do you have an efficiency percentage to go with that or are those meaningless as they don't suit you, too? Efficiency is a derived statistic that can be calculated in any number of ways. It is as open to debate and questions of relevance as ISK loss values, kill points or any other derived statistic. This is why we only quote actual ship numbers destroyed, because only these numbers have true meaning. And I note you do not dispute them, because you cannot. I'm reasonably sure that every time SF has had favourable efficiency ratings they've not hesitated to parade them in their war diaries. How bizarre that whenever the statistics aren't so favourable the statistical methodology suddenly becomes open to debate. Dulce et decorum est pro imperium mori.
Tecam Hund The Buggers	Posted - 2007.04.10 10:34:00 - [58] Over my time in Jericho two sets of war diaries were published, and as far as I can remember, the only statistics mentioned were always numbers of vessels destroyed. In case I am wrong, statistics based on a point system or value of assets destroyed are very much favorable for SF in this conflict.
Sable Schroedinger Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.04.10 11:20:00 - [59] Originally by: Rodj Blake I'm reasonably sure that every time SF has had favourable efficiency ratings they've not hesitated to parade them in their war diaries. How bizarre that whenever the statistics aren't so favourable the statistical methodology suddenly becomes open to debate. an interesting claim, but again proven to be baseless and a desperate attempt at spin on behalf of PIE. Sadly for you, the "efficiency rating" you're clinging to there was only conceived of and implements in the latest version of the war record software. Software that only just went live in time for this war. -------------------------------------------- Join Now
Sakura Nihil Tabula Rasa Systems The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.04.10 11:25:00 - [60] Originally by: Sable Schroedinger Originally by: Rodj Blake I'm reasonably sure that every time SF has had favourable efficiency ratings they've not hesitated to parade them in their war diaries. How bizarre that whenever the statistics aren't so favourable the statistical methodology suddenly becomes open to debate. an interesting claim, but again proven to be baseless and a desperate attempt at spin on behalf of PIE. Sadly for you, the "efficiency rating" you're clinging to there was only conceived of and implements in the latest version of the war record software. Software that only just went live in time for this war. It does have retroactive capabilities however, so we can see what it was during KD and CYI.

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