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Morgaine Legray	Posted - 2007.04.22 17:30:00 - [121] Its not a valid defense of gallante to say that they have fitting problems with t2 modules. I can gurantee you, every race would run into fitting problems when fitting t2 guns, a mwd, and a t2 rep/booster. What it boils down too is you have to make trade offs. You can fit a deimos for a sick tank and pretty decent damage, or if you have a good arazu pilot in your gang, you can fit it for pure damage and pull 700 dps out of it.
Wrayeth Shiva Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2007.04.22 17:37:00 - [122] Originally by: major lulz As usual, Wrayeth is the only one making sense. BLASPHEMY! I never make sense! -Wrayeth "Look, pa! I just contributed absolutely nothing to this thread!"
Goumindong Amarr Merch Industrial We Are Nice Guys	Posted - 2007.04.22 18:03:00 - [123] Originally by: Arkon Havok Originally by: Goumindong But if the battleships main guns can track a frigate when its webbed then something is wrong, because the DPS they apply will pretty much always be too much for the frigate to handle. And battleships shouldnt trump frigates, just like frigates shouldnt trump battleships. But if BS can't kill frigs even when they are webbed down, then frigs DO trump battleships since they can attack the BS but the BS cant hit them in return. I think you are underestimating the DPS of some of the T2 frigs. If a BS had no chance of fending off frigates then it could die to a couple of gank-fit taranis' or AFs, and if thats all it took to kill a short range fit BS then what is the point of flying one? As it is now frigates can avoid death by staying out of web range and fufill their role by putting a point on their target. Frigs should not be able to close to point blank range and unload high dps short-range weapons into the BS without fear of getting webbed and destroyed. I fly pretty much the most damaging frigate in the game, i put out 250 DPS. That cannot break any reasaonble repairing tank. 2. BSs can kill frigs, they just shouldnt be able to do it with guns. Battleships have drone bays for a reason. ---------------------------------------- Thou Shalt "Pew Pew"
welsh wizard 0utbreak	Posted - 2007.04.22 18:29:00 - [124] Edited by: welsh wizard on 22/04/2007 18:25:30 I personally think the Myrm should have another 25m3 to make room for a set of lights but only if they do something about drone recall/release. The Myrmidon itself is not overpowered its a very nicely balanced ship but if it fits some dampening and recalls/releases its drones the other BC's don't really stand a chance. Cool down on drone recall/release? I dunno....
Darqion Zenix	Posted - 2007.04.22 18:31:00 - [125] so you want it to have more drone space, but only if something is fixed first that would make it even better ? that makes... alot of sence :/
welsh wizard 0utbreak	Posted - 2007.04.22 18:42:00 - [126] Originally by: Darqion Zenix so you want it to have more drone space, but only if something is fixed first that would make it even better ? that makes... alot of sence :/ Huh? How would fixing drone recall/releases make it better?
Darqion Zenix	Posted - 2007.04.22 18:53:00 - [127] oh im a lazy.. person i missread it :p.. nevermind teehee :p altho i still think it doesnt need more drone room, its not a carrier :P you can always choose to take lights with you. at cost of a heavy hehe
Sadist Rage and Terror Against ALL Authorities	Posted - 2007.04.22 19:02:00 - [128] Let's sum up. 1. Worst range on close range guns. Amarr get 50km+10 faloff with scorch, while gallente get 12km+15km. With Null. On neutrons. Despite the MYTH that all fights happen close range or in web range, it is NOT so. go 15km from a gate, and chances are, person jumping through the gate will land 30km away from you. Farther than your optimal+ faloff. Yay for losing 50% damage. 2. Worst tanking capabilities. Gallente HAC's are arguably the worst tanks, on par with minmatar, but at least minnies can speed tank. Battlecruisers and Command ships. Again, worst tank. Compared to Claymore/Sleipnir or even an absolution with 85% res across the board, astarte and eos are a joke. Won't even mention the 2000 dps passive tank on caldari ones. 3. Cap dependant as bad as amarr. Amarr have bonuses on most ships to reduce cap usage of lasers, which actually brings cap usage down to about blaster levels. Except amarr ships have more cap. Oh, and they have the option of fitting AC's on their ships, while devoting 100% cap to tanking. 4. Worst fitting. Name a single gallente ship, besides the megathron that does not have problems with fitting or can only fit about 2/3 of what other races can. Deimos grid, anyone? Ishtar CPU, maybe? How about an absolution that can fit a 1600mm plate and still fit medium guns with ease. Or maybe the sleipnir which can fit an XL booster and largest size guns with just one PG rig ?. Yes. Gallente are most obscenely overpowered, please nerf our damage even more, our tanking into oblivion and make our mass twice that high of what caldari have. òòòòòòòòòòòò VIP member of the [23] Quote: - Numbers alone do not win a battle - No, but I bet they help.
madaluap Gallente Mercenary Forces Exquisite Malevolence	Posted - 2007.04.22 22:16:00 - [129] _________________________________________________ Breetime A killmail!11!1 omgrawr: BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOYAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
MrDisposable Caldari Science and Trade Institute	Posted - 2007.04.22 22:50:00 - [130] Originally by: Sadist Let's sum up. 1. Worst range on close range guns. Amarr get 50km+10 faloff with scorch, while gallente get 12km+15km. With Null. On neutrons. Despite the MYTH that all fights happen close range or in web range, it is NOT so. go 15km from a gate, and chances are, person jumping through the gate will land 30km away from you. Farther than your optimal+ faloff. Yay for losing 50% damage. 2. Worst tanking capabilities. Gallente HAC's are arguably the worst tanks, on par with minmatar, but at least minnies can speed tank. Battlecruisers and Command ships. Again, worst tank. Compared to Claymore/Sleipnir or even an absolution with 85% res across the board, astarte and eos are a joke. Won't even mention the 2000 dps passive tank on caldari ones. 3. Cap dependant as bad as amarr. Amarr have bonuses on most ships to reduce cap usage of lasers, which actually brings cap usage down to about blaster levels. Except amarr ships have more cap. Oh, and they have the option of fitting AC's on their ships, while devoting 100% cap to tanking. 4. Worst fitting. Name a single gallente ship, besides the megathron that does not have problems with fitting or can only fit about 2/3 of what other races can. Deimos grid, anyone? Ishtar CPU, maybe? How about an absolution that can fit a 1600mm plate and still fit medium guns with ease. Or maybe the sleipnir which can fit an XL booster and largest size guns with just one PG rig ?. Yes. Gallente are most obscenely overpowered, please nerf our damage even more, our tanking into oblivion and make our mass twice that high of what caldari have. Lol... Hey can amarr fit a MWD on any of their ships with a full rack of top tier guns and an armor rep? Doesn't the myrm and the domi out tank just about any other armor tanker due to the drones? Does any other race have the super-overpowered droneships which for some unknown reason retain as many slots as non-drone ships giving them unprecedented flexability? Who else has dmg types equally as effective against shield/armor tanks? Do gallente have a capless weapon system? Amarr don't The myrmadon was balanced before CCP messed up and increased the drone bay to 125m3. It should be at most 120m3. OH... can gallente boats fit a full rack of guns, cap injector and MED or well anything else on most ships? If so they have better fitting than amarr. Can gallente still hit a ship orbiting at 6km at a snails pace? Amarr can't ______________ BoB Alts "This isn't about Dev misconduct.... ban the Ctrl+q'rs! They are the real problem behind it ALL!!!!!" "Devs stole BPOs for the good of eve."

Hailstorm GALAXIAN Rule of Three	Posted - 2007.04.22 23:45:00 - [131] Originally by: MrDisposable OH... can gallente boats fit a full rack of guns, cap injector and MED or well anything else on most ships? If so they have better fitting than amarr. They can't. If you want the top-tier guns (neutrons and on some ships, even ions) you need to either give up on the cap injector or severely gimp your tanking ability by wasting low slots on grid modules (or rigs, which are damn expensive and shouldn't equate into how good any race is anyway), both of which are deadly choices in many situations. Mind you, I'm not saying Amarr is better/worse this way or that, I'm just stating a fact about Gallente. Also, another Myth aside from the one Sadist mentioned is that people believe blasters do incredible amounts of dps up close and rip things apart fast. They simply don't, even more so after revelations.
Morgaine Legray	Posted - 2007.04.23 01:08:00 - [132] the thing about gallante is you have to make some trade offs. You can do very decent damage with a very decent tank, or do ridiculus damage with no tank. The latter requires a good gang. You have to make trade offs to fit between these two extremes. All other races must make the same trade offs. If you want a sniper boat on caldari, your mids go to tracking comps and sensor boosters. Gallante fitting isnt really any worse then any other race.
Byzan Zwyth Dark Centuri Inc. Firmus Ixion	Posted - 2007.04.23 02:18:00 - [133] I think the OP needs a reality check, ship balance is pretty good and in most cases the best ship in each catagory is so close it comes down to looks & personal taste. If you think gallente pown each class you have a seriously bad sense of balance. ---------------------- Rank: Tech 1 and a 1/2 cannon fodder Pointless forum slowing bandwidth hogging signature pic inc?
Morgaine Legray	Posted - 2007.04.23 02:56:00 - [134] would you care to elaborate instead of just posting a troll? Show me how gallante is balanced.
VicturusTeSaluto	Posted - 2007.04.23 03:16:00 - [135] Edited by: VicturusTeSaluto on 23/04/2007 03:17:06 Gallente is not overpowered. The other races just are not all point blank heavy damage/uber tanking races. Caldari is the PvE/ECM support/sniper race. You can not expect the uber PvE race to also be the uber PvP race. Minmatar simply requires more skillpoints, but after a good long while they are better than Gallente. Minmatar has a very high payoff in the end. On first look Amarr is somewhat broken, however, they have some of the best ships in the game. Look at the Curse, there is nothing more overpowered. Originally by: welsh wizard Edited by: welsh wizard on 22/04/2007 18:25:30 I personally think the Myrm should have another 25m3 to make room for a set of lights but only if they do something about drone recall/release. The Myrmidon itself is not overpowered its a very nicely balanced ship but if it fits some dampening and recalls/releases its drones the other BC's don't really stand a chance. Cool down on drone recall/release? I dunno.... Not at all true. The Myrmidon is fairly easy to defeat. It is simply a lack of tactics on the most players that fight the myrmidon. In so many games people would rather scream nerf/buff than actually learn to play. So sad.
Morgaine Legray	Posted - 2007.04.23 03:29:00 - [136] lol at the lack of tactics. Why should one race be confined to player vs eve. What if someone doesnt know that they are getting stuck with killing bots all day when they start the game? That argument is simply crap. All races should be pvp viable, all races are certainly pve viable, so all races should be able to pvp as well. And yes it does require tactics to kill a myrmidon. Usually it involves more nos then the myrmidon has or ecm. Either way, it either takes another nos boat, ore multiple players to take down 1 battlecruiser. how is that balanced? I define overpowered as this: To kill it takes more of the same thing, or takes many more people. Myrmidon falls into both of those catagories unfortunatly. Tell me what is balanced about a myrmidon doing similar dps to other races battleships, having smaller sig, faster, oh and a full rack of nos? Im sorry my friend, that has no resemblance to balance.
Morgaine Legray	Posted - 2007.04.23 03:33:00 - [137] oh, and dont forget the myrmidon out tanks all other battlecruisers and out damages. Does it bother anyone else that a myrmidon can passive shield tank more damage then a drake, AND do over twice the damage and be a faster ship? That pretty much takes away any reason to fly a passive drake. God forbid caldari be better at something.
Laboratus Gallente BGG League of Abnormal Gentlemen	Posted - 2007.04.23 06:49:00 - [138] Originally by: MrDisposable Doesn't the myrm and the domi out tank just about any other armor tanker due to the drones? Does any other race have the super-overpowered droneships which for some unknown reason retain as many slots as non-drone ships giving them unprecedented flexability? Who else has dmg types equally as effective against shield/armor tanks? Do gallente have a capless weapon system? Amarr don't The myrmadon was balanced before CCP messed up and increased the drone bay to 125m3. It should be at most 120m3. OH... can gallente boats fit a full rack of guns, cap injector and MED or well anything else on most ships? If so they have better fitting than amarr. Can gallente still hit a ship orbiting at 6km at a snails pace? Amarr can't Drones don't help your tank, since you can't target yourself. The geddon for example has 8 lows, so it can outtank any gallanten ship, since it has more slots to tank with and can as well field a full flight of heavies or sentries. It also does not use ammo, so it can carry more cap injectors, meaning it can run it's guns+tank longer than any gallantean ship can. And outdps most of them. And as for fitting, the amarr can fit projectiles to get the advantage of not using cap for shooting, thus losing dps, but gaining more cap for tanking. If you actually count the slots on the domi, you will notice that it has less slots than any T1 battleship. And for sub BS class the best drone boat goes to Curse, since it has a nossing bonus and is an EW ship in it self, so it kinda rules that field supreme. Yea, thermal. Woopie doo. Anyone fighting a droneship knows that if the drone ship wants to change damage types it loses a significant portion of dps. And drones do sub par damage... So just fit an extra thermal hardener II and those ogre IIs cannot break your tank ever. So much for that domi. Amarr have the grid to fit projectiles, gallante don't,so yes they have a capless weapon system, gallantean being the only ones that can't. Heavy drones on a myrmi is bad, since if the other guy just starts playing with you and fits full rack of SB, it will rip the drones to bits and after that it will rip the myrm to bits, since the myrm can no longer fight with anything after that. Amarr have the best tracking long range guns in game. So if they can't, no-one can. And web+ TP solves this one easy... ___ P.S. Post with your main. Mind control and tin hats
Pinky Denmark The Cursed Navy	Posted - 2007.04.23 08:10:00 - [139] To me Gallente seems a very good and pretty much balanced race to fly, but they are masters of disguise and always seem to divert any focus on their powers. They have good arguments like "Deimos is slow", "We use cap" (I really like this btw), "We can't do damage without drones" (drones with lots of bonus and often within scooping range), "nothing wrong with multiple nosferatu", "We are close range" and many more... And the best: "Nerf Caldari - they got missiles" (they never mention their drones somehow) We don't really need them nerfed however multiple nosferatus is an issue and the Myrmidon IS top of the foodchain... I still believe it should only have 120 m3 drone bay - I'm a nice guy!! and OMG I love Team Tuxford for the speedbalancing...
Aggressive Salesman Caldari	Posted - 2007.04.23 08:16:00 - [140] Originally by: Sadist Let's sum up. 1. Worst range on close range guns. Amarr get 50km+10 faloff with scorch, while gallente get 12km+15km. With Null. On neutrons. Despite the MYTH that all fights happen close range or in web range, it is NOT so. go 15km from a gate, and chances are, person jumping through the gate will land 30km away from you. Farther than your optimal+ faloff. Yay for losing 50% damage. 2. Worst tanking capabilities. Gallente HAC's are arguably the worst tanks, on par with minmatar, but at least minnies can speed tank. Battlecruisers and Command ships. Again, worst tank. Compared to Claymore/Sleipnir or even an absolution with 85% res across the board, astarte and eos are a joke. Won't even mention the 2000 dps passive tank on caldari ones. 3. Cap dependant as bad as amarr. Amarr have bonuses on most ships to reduce cap usage of lasers, which actually brings cap usage down to about blaster levels. Except amarr ships have more cap. Oh, and they have the option of fitting AC's on their ships, while devoting 100% cap to tanking. 4. Worst fitting. Name a single gallente ship, besides the megathron that does not have problems with fitting or can only fit about 2/3 of what other races can. Deimos grid, anyone? Ishtar CPU, maybe? How about an absolution that can fit a 1600mm plate and still fit medium guns with ease. Or maybe the sleipnir which can fit an XL booster and largest size guns with just one PG rig ?. Yes. Gallente are most obscenely overpowered, please nerf our damage even more, our tanking into oblivion and make our mass twice that high of what caldari have. 1. No kidding. You want to be able to tank and gank at the same time, and do this without even having to move around? And while not all battles are fought in close range, the great majority area, and if you're 40-50km away you can close in with a MWD (unless you're fighting an army of Rapiers ). 2. The Vaga speed tanking? Ok. The Muninn speed tanking? Anything tanks better than the Muninn. Besides how can you compare the tanks (most minnie ships could not tank even if their life went into it)? Or even complain about the Gallente Command Ships? If anything the Sleip tanks much worse than any other CS. Sure you can fit an XL booster with PG rigs. But it will suck your cap dry in 30 seconds and you'll be a sitting duck. If you fit a LSB the other CS can tank almost the double and with much better cap efficiency. In these ships resistances are more important. And the minnie ships only get 2 or 3 slots to tank as opposed to 5 or 6 for everyone else. 3. Almost everyone has cap problems. Minnies have the least cap, and they have to use it to MWD around since they can't tank/dps like the rest. 4. Bellicose, Muninn, Claymore, Huginn, Scimitar, Typhoon, etc. So you do the highest dps by far, have the second best damage types (kin/therm is good against shields and armor, and you can choose type with drones), can fit a tank almost on par with Amarrians, and want to go as fast as Minmatars? Yes nothing wrong here . In any case I don't think nerfing would be the best option, but rather ungimping the other races a bit. Downside is that it takes more work because there are more things that have to be balanced. But either way Gallente way too good, and something should be done.

Mpafos	Posted - 2007.04.23 08:47:00 - [141] Originally by: Angus McLean None of you have a clue what your talking about. Amarr- Best all around targets. Minmatar- Good for loot and replacement parts. Caldari- Good for missioning to buy a Gallente ship so you can PvP to kill Minmatar and Amarr ships which you use to replace the cost of the ammo you spent on killing the ships which costs about the same as 1 level 4 mission. You must be joiking Man have you ever ecountered any minmatar ship?
Gabriel Karade Nulli-Secundus	Posted - 2007.04.23 10:46:00 - [142] Originally by: madaluap \Signed! But on a serious note, it would be nice if 'modern gallente doctrine' actually worked beyond 1 vs 1 and very small scale engagements... ---------- Video - 'War-Machine'
Kagura Nikon Minmatar Guardians of the Dawn Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2007.04.23 11:28:00 - [143] Lol gallente only good on 1v1? Please explain that to the outbreak guys that fought us saturday with 22 Sniping Megathrons... Those things hurt! If brute force doesn't solve your problem... you are not using enough
James Lyrus Lyrus Associates Betrayal Under Mayhem	Posted - 2007.04.23 12:19:00 - [144] Originally by: VicturusTeSaluto Edited by: VicturusTeSaluto on 23/04/2007 03:17:06 Gallente is not overpowered. The other races just are not all point blank heavy damage/uber tanking races. Caldari is the PvE/ECM support/sniper race. You can not expect the uber PvE race to also be the uber PvP race. I disagree entirely. ALL races should be viable to PvP and PvE with. They're not at the moment, which is why you see a hell of a lot more Gallente and Minmatar ships in PvP. But ... well lets face it, the best way to lose players is to get told the the game's really flexible, and free, only to find that their lots of months training on caldari stuff is wasted and they have to start again. Quote: The Myrmidon is fairly easy to defeat. It is simply a lack of tactics on the most players that fight the myrmidon. In so many games people would rather scream nerf/buff than actually learn to play. So sad. That sounds familiar. Wait, didn't that argument get used with the nanophoon/nanodomi? And the response is the same. If you 'beat it' by setting up _specifically_ to do so, by doing the same thing harder, or bringing additional numbers, then it's overpowered. In a normal fight, ships of the same class should have a reasonable chance of 'being competitive' given equal numbers. However at the moment, Myrmidon vs... well actually almost any ship, will probably win. Except maybe a nos domi, which ... oh look, same situation. Beating a nos domi 1v1 is extremely difficult, given it's effective range overlaps the effective range of warp disruptors.
Galyrion Prison Break Inc. FOUNDATI0N	Posted - 2007.04.23 14:34:00 - [145] I find gallante fine except for a few ships. Myrmidon,Eos and Dominix. The common problem with these ships is they are too versitile without having to sacrifice allot. Myrmidon is perhaps the biggest issue atm. They can field a massive tank, deal the most dmg of any bc and most commandships(!) in addition of having an array of midslots to fit whatever you want. All this makes the myrmidon able to outdo any dedicated ship out there. Eos is a field commandship and if it was in line with the ones for the other races it would not deal allot of damage. At the moment it has the insane tank of a field commandship wich in my eyes is fine but in addition able to outdamage any commandship out there. If dedicated it can even field a full set of heavy armor rep drones, a full sett of t2 heavy drones and a full sett of t2 medium drones! (requires commandships lvl5 but still). The dominix is not as extreme as the ones above, but is still a problem as its a bigger version of the myrmidon with the same balance problems.
Gerod Theron	Posted - 2007.04.23 14:51:00 - [146] i think that one if the main problems that been in game since it was released and that is the couse of alot of controversey is the fact that ships that use low slots to tank have an advantage couse of thier free mid slots to use for what ever. and its even more pronounced and obvious with the gallente race couse thier big drone bays. i mean thiers not one caldari ship that can have a tank,ewar and highs full of weapons and drones to do more damage.all we get is highs with weapons and a midslot tank or we can sacrifice the tank for some e war or what ever. the drone bays on gallanet ship is what puts them over the top compared to other races i think.
Vincent Almasy Gallente The Underground	Posted - 2007.04.23 15:28:00 - [147] Originally by: Gerod Theron i think that one if the main problems that been in game since it was released and that is the couse of alot of controversey is the fact that ships that use low slots to tank have an advantage couse of thier free mid slots to use for what ever. and its even more pronounced and obvious with the gallente race couse thier big drone bays. i mean thiers not one caldari ship that can have a tank,ewar and highs full of weapons and drones to do more damage.all we get is highs with weapons and a midslot tank or we can sacrifice the tank for some e war or what ever. the drone bays on gallanet ship is what puts them over the top compared to other races i think. Here is the breakdown. Gallente: Best damage < 7km with blasters. Moderate to Large dronebay for most ships. Rails significantly reduce damage output compared to blasters. Drones can be restroyed and not reloaded. very short range Minmatar: Can chose three different tanking styles. Autocannons and Artillery cannons do almost same dps, autocannons being a little better. Small to moderate drone bay. Few Missile points for weaker DPS weapons with 100% accuracy if target is slower then ammo. AC uses mostly fall off so very short to moderate range. Amarr: Alot of raw damage. Perfect agenst shields, weaker agenst armor. Alot of lows but lacks mids. small dronebay(should increase and be a sub drone race soon) Medium range Caldari: Typically Missile users making accuracy 100% if slower then weapon. Oversized missiles do significantly less damage to smaller ships. Alot of mids but lack lows. Lower DPS from use of missiles. Possiblity of continue to fire missiles even if damped and jammed from FoF missiles. More ships focused for their ewar style ECM.(some could use a boost) Very long range.
Aggressive Salesman Caldari	Posted - 2007.04.23 16:45:00 - [148] Originally by: Galyrion I find gallante fine except for a few ships. Myrmidon,Eos and Dominix. The common problem with these ships is they are too versitile without having to sacrifice allot. Myrmidon is perhaps the biggest issue atm. They can field a massive tank, deal the most dmg of any bc and most commandships(!) in addition of having an array of midslots to fit whatever you want. All this makes the myrmidon able to outdo any dedicated ship out there. Eos is a field commandship and if it was in line with the ones for the other races it would not deal allot of damage. At the moment it has the insane tank of a field commandship wich in my eyes is fine but in addition able to outdamage any commandship out there. If dedicated it can even field a full set of heavy armor rep drones, a full sett of t2 heavy drones and a full sett of t2 medium drones! (requires commandships lvl5 but still). The dominix is not as extreme as the ones above, but is still a problem as its a bigger version of the myrmidon with the same balance problems. Mostly agree with this, but I'd throw in the Moros and its drones too. The bay and the bonus are way too big.
Royaldo KVA Noble Inc. Sylph Alliance	Posted - 2007.04.23 16:57:00 - [149] wait about screaming nerf untill amarr has had its boost m'kay? i have 3 char's with each over 45m sp. the only i dont have anymore is caldari(sold a 30m sp missiles spec'd to the teeth) fitting wise its hard to get what you want on alot of the amarr and gallente ships. esp on the t1 amarr bs unless you go for the standard fleet setups. just wait untill amarr gets a "fix" or boost before you scream nerf. and to those in here who scream nerf and is caldari...please..
Tista	Posted - 2007.04.23 17:02:00 - [150] gallente just have the best in all worlds.. -------------------- My sig was stolen from some website.. leet! The true Industrial capital ship!



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