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Frostys Virpio
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
3075
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Posted - 2017.02.03 21:30:55 -
[31] - Quote
Danika Princip wrote:DrysonBennington wrote:
From what I have read about the history of naval warfare is that is all combat ships have their main heavy armament that is supported by smaller more rapid firing armaments.
Battleships are the class of combat ships that have been historically called upon to breach the blockade because of their heavy armor, modest speed and their vast array of armaments.
1906 called and wants to tell you about it's new toy, HMS Dreadnaught. Literally the opposite of what you think a naval battleship is, and what every battleship afterwards was based on. Seriously. Please, spend thirty seconds on google if you're going to make a comparison. Now, please explain why you feel battleships should be immune to everything smaller than they are? If you want real world examples, should we look at what sank the Yamato, Repluse, Prince of Wales, Muashi, Tirpitz, the battleships at Pearl Harbour, Mers-el-K+¬bir and Taranto...need I go on? (Oh god I took the bait again please help me)
While it does not necessarily need to be represented in EVE, it's still worth noting that while pretty much everything designed as "all big guns" battleships after Dreadnaught, those ships still included secondary batteries to counter small craft. The move was not complete removal of anything but main battery large guns. It was a move from combo of 8 inch and 10 inch guns on the same ship just like nobody fit 1400mm and 1200mm at the same time in EVE. They retained stuff like 5 inch guns for example because firing a 12+ inch gun at a torpedo boat is an exercise in futility. How well those capabilities are represented by drones could be asked. I don't think more need to be added on top of current config tho. BS balance would be better done by making adjustment to T3Cs. |

Lugh Crow-Slave
3711
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Posted - 2017.02.04 02:06:47 -
[32] - Quote
Frostys Virpio wrote: While it does not necessarily need to be represented in EVE, it's still worth noting that while pretty much everything designed as "all big guns" battleships after Dreadnaught, those ships still included secondary batteries to counter small craft. The move was not complete removal of anything but main battery large guns. It was a move from combo of 8 inch and 10 inch guns on the same ship just like nobody fit 1400mm and 1200mm at the same time in EVE. They retained stuff like 5 inch guns for example because firing a 12+ inch gun at a torpedo boat is an exercise in futility. How well those capabilities are represented by drones could be asked. I don't think more need to be added on top of current config tho. BS balance would be better done by making adjustment to T3Cs.
just drones probably not great but drones + smart-bombs and you get a good representation.
(TBH if ccp just changed the name and image of smart bombs to be point defense we would probably have fewer people like the op)
BLOPS Hauler
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baltec1
Bat Country Pandemic Legion
18565
|
Posted - 2017.02.04 09:43:19 -
[33] - Quote
Frostys Virpio wrote:
They retained stuff like 5 inch guns for example because firing a 12+ inch gun at a torpedo boat is an exercise in futility.
Speak for yourself, a grapple coupled with Neutron blasters are great fun |

Lugh Crow-Slave
3712
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Posted - 2017.02.04 10:42:19 -
[34] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:Frostys Virpio wrote:
They retained stuff like 5 inch guns for example because firing a 12+ inch gun at a torpedo boat is an exercise in futility.
Speak for yourself, a grapple coupled with Neutron blasters are great fun 
Grappler has to be the best thing added to this game in a long time. Can you belive what would of happened if ppl convinced ccp to let them get effected by links and hull bonuses?
BLOPS Hauler
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Matthias Ancaladron
Wrath of Angels
93
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Posted - 2017.02.04 20:50:14 -
[35] - Quote
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:baltec1 wrote:Frostys Virpio wrote:
They retained stuff like 5 inch guns for example because firing a 12+ inch gun at a torpedo boat is an exercise in futility.
Speak for yourself, a grapple coupled with Neutron blasters are great fun  Grappler has to be the best thing added to this game in a long time. Can you belive what would of happened if ppl convinced ccp to let them get effected by links and hull bonuses?
Or be put on smaller ships, webs are for frigs (wimpy wimpy wimpy) Grapplers on big old bs' s (hefty hefty hefty)
Surely there needs to be a middle ground one for battlecruisers/cruisers. No? |

Lugh Crow-Slave
3721
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Posted - 2017.02.05 01:17:54 -
[36] - Quote
Matthias Ancaladron wrote:Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:baltec1 wrote:Frostys Virpio wrote:
They retained stuff like 5 inch guns for example because firing a 12+ inch gun at a torpedo boat is an exercise in futility.
Speak for yourself, a grapple coupled with Neutron blasters are great fun  Grappler has to be the best thing added to this game in a long time. Can you belive what would of happened if ppl convinced ccp to let them get effected by links and hull bonuses? Or be put on smaller ships, webs are for frigs (wimpy wimpy wimpy) Grapplers on big old bs' s (hefty hefty hefty) Surely there needs to be a middle ground one for battlecruisers/cruisers. No?
no
cruisers are already quit able to hit above and below them. this along with the nice level of utility they are afforded has lead to them dominating eve they don't need more help in this area
BLOPS Hauler
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baltec1
Bat Country Pandemic Legion
18565
|
Posted - 2017.02.05 01:24:37 -
[37] - Quote
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:baltec1 wrote:Frostys Virpio wrote:
They retained stuff like 5 inch guns for example because firing a 12+ inch gun at a torpedo boat is an exercise in futility.
Speak for yourself, a grapple coupled with Neutron blasters are great fun  Grappler has to be the best thing added to this game in a long time. Can you belive what would of happened if ppl convinced ccp to let them get effected by links and hull bonuses?
Bonused grapple on a vindi?
Disgustingly nasty. |

elitatwo
Dicker Quick and Hyde Defense Attorneys O.U.Z.O. Alliance
1589
|
Posted - 2017.02.05 04:12:36 -
[38] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:baltec1 wrote:Frostys Virpio wrote:
They retained stuff like 5 inch guns for example because firing a 12+ inch gun at a torpedo boat is an exercise in futility.
Speak for yourself, a grapple coupled with Neutron blasters are great fun  Grappler has to be the best thing added to this game in a long time. Can you belive what would of happened if ppl convinced ccp to let them get effected by links and hull bonuses? Bonused grapple on a vindi? Disgustingly nasty.
At least with another web, you won't need to switch ammo from void to antimatter.
"Come to momma.."
Eve Minions is recruiting.
This is the law of ship progression!
Aura sound-clips: Aura forever
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Lugh Crow-Slave
3721
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Posted - 2017.02.05 05:32:31 -
[39] - Quote
elitatwo wrote:baltec1 wrote:Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:baltec1 wrote:Frostys Virpio wrote:
They retained stuff like 5 inch guns for example because firing a 12+ inch gun at a torpedo boat is an exercise in futility.
Speak for yourself, a grapple coupled with Neutron blasters are great fun  Grappler has to be the best thing added to this game in a long time. Can you belive what would of happened if ppl convinced ccp to let them get effected by links and hull bonuses? Bonused grapple on a vindi? Disgustingly nasty. At least with another web, you won't need to switch ammo from void to antimatter. "Come to momma.."
Something about how the closer I get the more screwed they get and the closer I get the faster they get more screwed just fills me with glee
BLOPS Hauler
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Kenrailae
Mind Games. Suddenly Spaceships.
724
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Posted - 2017.02.05 08:44:59 -
[40] - Quote
Higher EHP and T3's 'rebalanced.'
That's what battleships could use. They don't need ewar resistance. And as much as I like the idea of attaching the PDS visual effect to a battleship, it would kill the server, so smartbombs typically work fine.
The Law is a point of View
The NPE IS a big deal
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Lugh Crow-Slave
3722
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Posted - 2017.02.05 09:12:16 -
[41] - Quote
Nerf the t3s and no change is needed in battleship ehp
BLOPS Hauler
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baltec1
Bat Country Pandemic Legion
18566
|
Posted - 2017.02.05 11:33:24 -
[42] - Quote
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:Nerf the t3s and no change is needed in battleship ehp
Indeed. |

Keno Skir
1246
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Posted - 2017.02.05 14:48:06 -
[43] - Quote
Cearain wrote:Four fights wow. The first was a smart bombing bs and the attacking frigates went in close range. I love how you show a smart bomb battle ship in response to a post I made saying their guns won't hit frigates. The next was station games. I didn't bother with the third or fourth because they are just anecdotal anyway. Instead of posting a few videos over years of eve where someone may have had a good fight why don't you look at less anecdotal information. In any case, if BSs are really being used allot because they are so awesome then great. I agree that my suggestions are bad. But anyway I am just explaining why I do not use them in low sec. And what I would want to see before I was convinced they would be useful. And for the other players who responded, overheat won't get your ab to boost your speed 600%. Also mwds shut off when you are scrammed and you will be scrammed quickly in low sec. And no one is talking about Black birds so I don't know why someone keeps mentioning "BBs."
Mate literally you just need to git gud faster 
I'll agree BS need a HP buff to make them better than T3 cruisers but the rest of your fail cascade is on you and nobody else. If you want to be able to kill all sizes of ship you need to pick a Battleship that suits the role. In a decent fit Armageddon (full rack of neuts and some drone damage amps) you are very scary indeed to pretty much any size of ship. Of course you aren't hitting frigs with giant slow turrets, that would be silly. Just adapt your plan before coming on the forums yelling how Battleships are bad, you just don't know how to fly them or which one to use and that's just a case of experience.
<Gùï> 250,000 Bonus SP when you start an Alpha Clone HERE <Gùï>
<Gùï> Contact me regarding my trusted Alliance Creation Service <Gùï>
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baltec1
Bat Country Pandemic Legion
18566
|
Posted - 2017.02.05 19:22:40 -
[44] - Quote
Keno Skir wrote: I'll agree BS need a HP buff to make them better than T3 cruisers
No the answer there is to drag T3C down to cruiser level. |

Brok Haslack
Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic
0
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Posted - 2017.02.05 22:32:37 -
[45] - Quote
Traditionally Battleships had teh main guns, and also a secondary set of smaller guns. So that they could deal with smaller boats that could dodge their mains and drop a Torpedo on them.
Pocket Battleships took this to a fine art.
EVE needs boats like these.
And some kind of EWAR hardened chassis would be fun as well.
Tuppence deposited. |

Lugh Crow-Slave
3722
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Posted - 2017.02.05 23:49:41 -
[46] - Quote
Brok Haslack wrote:Traditionally Battleships had teh main guns, and also a secondary set of smaller guns. So that they could deal with smaller boats that could dodge their mains and drop a Torpedo on them.
Pocket Battleships took this to a fine art.
EVE needs boats like these.
And some kind of EWAR hardened chassis would be fun as well.
Tuppence deposited.
smart bombs are those secondary guns you are talking about
as stated on page one E-war resistances and vulnerabilities are built into the base states
BLOPS Hauler
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Danika Princip
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
5245
|
Posted - 2017.02.05 23:54:34 -
[47] - Quote
Brok Haslack wrote:Traditionally Battleships had teh main guns, and also a secondary set of smaller guns. So that they could deal with smaller boats that could dodge their mains and drop a Torpedo on them.
Pocket Battleships took this to a fine art.
EVE needs boats like these.
And some kind of EWAR hardened chassis would be fun as well.
Tuppence deposited.
They also had escorts. Torpedo boat destroyers have been around almost as long as torpedo boats themselves.
EVE does not need battleships that are immune to anything smaller than they are. |

Arthur Aihaken
CODE.d
5304
|
Posted - 2017.02.06 01:37:50 -
[48] - Quote
Pocket Battleships were basically heavy cruisers with battlecruiser armament, and they were designed at the time to get around treaty restrictions.
I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week.
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Lugh Crow-Slave
3723
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Posted - 2017.02.06 04:06:00 -
[49] - Quote
Arthur Aihaken wrote:Pocket Battleships were basically heavy cruisers with battlecruiser armament, and they were designed at the time to get around treaty restrictions.
something that was much more easily done by just lying about how much your ships displaced..... You know like the late war full steal US carriers that were some how lighter than some of the small wood decked Japanese ones
BLOPS Hauler
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Arthur Aihaken
CODE.d
5307
|
Posted - 2017.02.06 05:39:33 -
[50] - Quote
Don't get me wrong - I love the idea of Pocket Battleships. I suspect that the in-game equivalent are Attack Battlecruisers. If CCP ever gets around to releasing a T3 Battleship my quest will be complete.
I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week.
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Lugh Crow-Slave
3723
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Posted - 2017.02.06 09:14:02 -
[51] - Quote
Arthur Aihaken wrote:Don't get me wrong - I love the idea of Pocket Battleships. I suspect that the in-game equivalent are Attack Battlecruisers. If CCP ever gets around to releasing a T3 Battleship my quest will be complete.
CCP should be banned from EVER adding another T3 anything
BLOPS Hauler
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Brok Haslack
Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic
0
|
Posted - 2017.02.06 10:38:23 -
[52] - Quote
Arthur Aihaken wrote:Don't get me wrong - I love the idea of Pocket Battleships. I suspect that the in-game equivalent are Attack Battlecruisers. If CCP ever gets around to releasing a T3 Battleship my quest will be complete.
T3 tactical Battleships, where you can swap out the modules! :D
Med gun module gives 4 slots with Med Gun Bonuses. Seriously hardcore tracking for Frigate Popping.
Main gun module gives 4 slots for the mains, with Large Gun Bonuses.
EWAR Module.
'Warping at a higher speed for Raids' module ( think the difference between the APOC Navy Issue & the Machariel ).
Web Support Modules. Like the Vindi or Bhaalgorn special power.
Oh yes, I can see this being A LOT of fun. |

Cade Windstalker
737
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Posted - 2017.02.06 15:52:02 -
[53] - Quote
Cearain wrote:Again I am simply saying why I do not fly battleships in pvp. Sure there may be lots of people flying PVP BSs out there and I am just not seeing them on dscan. CCP should have some statistics. If they are being used allot then fine there is no need to buff them.
They are, just not in the role you apparently want to see them in.
Also if you're just relating your own experience then you may want to not dismiss others for doing the same just because it runs counter to your own.
Cearain wrote:I am not saying they have to be "amazing" at dealing with smaller ships. But whatever you are not actually addressing my points and I don't feel like bickering. As far as your indication of speed a tech 2 web and grappler will bring the speed down to about a 93% decrease. That means it will be going about half as fast as it was going with a 85% reduction. Dropping the targets ships speed down half is useful when you are trying to track. And yes you should have a point on the ship as well. 
Dropping the targets speed from 85% to 93% of normal is only useful if you can't make up that difference in velocity in other ways without spending a module slot, like by adjusting your own velocity to minimize traverse speed. Overall you'd be better off probably 90% of the time swapping that web out for a Tracking Computer, prop mod, or any of half a dozen other options.
Other than that my response remains the same, you want BSes to be good at something they're simply not particularly suited for, though I absolutely agree with everyone in this thread trying to tell you a BS can deal with a frigate if fitted for it. You just don't seem to be listening.
At that point the main reason BSes aren't used for roaming in Low is because of their low warp and align speeds, which makes finding fights and picking fights much harder, even if you are more likely to win whatever fight you get into in a BS all other things being equal. |

elitatwo
Dicker Quick and Hyde Defense Attorneys O.U.Z.O. Alliance
1593
|
Posted - 2017.02.06 16:19:54 -
[54] - Quote
Keno Skir wrote:...In a decent fit Armageddon (full rack of neuts and some drone damage amps)...
Repeat after me, an Armageddon is not a trollgorn. Write this down a 1000 times.
Eve Minions is recruiting.
This is the law of ship progression!
Aura sound-clips: Aura forever
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Mina Sebiestar
Minmatar Inner Space Conglomerate
1110
|
Posted - 2017.02.06 16:20:05 -
[55] - Quote
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:Arthur Aihaken wrote:Don't get me wrong - I love the idea of Pocket Battleships. I suspect that the in-game equivalent are Attack Battlecruisers. If CCP ever gets around to releasing a T3 Battleship my quest will be complete. CCP should be banned from EVER adding another T3 anything
Never not t3 battleship....CCP when they are coming give cool toys for something that is not cancer will you?
T2 resists moderate to low hp combat subs ewar subs navigation subs fleet subs sniper sub(capital engage) and many many many ....many visual mods and animations ...i want
...i need.
"You choke behind a smile a fake behind the fear"n++
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Lugh Crow-Slave
3731
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Posted - 2017.02.06 16:23:39 -
[56] - Quote
Mina Sebiestar wrote:Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:Arthur Aihaken wrote:Don't get me wrong - I love the idea of Pocket Battleships. I suspect that the in-game equivalent are Attack Battlecruisers. If CCP ever gets around to releasing a T3 Battleship my quest will be complete. CCP should be banned from EVER adding another T3 anything Never not t3 battleship....CCP when they are coming give cool toys for something that is not cancer will you? T2 resists moderate to low hp combat subs ewar subs navigation subs fleet subs and many many many ....many visual mods and animations ...i want ...i need.
yeah no in fact anyone at ccp that so much as bring up another t3 idea should be fired on the spot
BLOPS Hauler
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Mina Sebiestar
Minmatar Inner Space Conglomerate
1110
|
Posted - 2017.02.06 16:25:52 -
[57] - Quote
you just watch mister.
"You choke behind a smile a fake behind the fear"n++
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Arthur Aihaken
CODE.d
5314
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Posted - 2017.02.06 17:38:24 -
[58] - Quote
T3 Battleships for the win. No, seriously. Introduce them and eliminate having to deal with a T3 Strategic Cruiser rebalance. Two birds - one stone.
I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week.
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Serendipity Lost
Repo Industries
2475
|
Posted - 2017.02.06 17:51:01 -
[59] - Quote
PROTIP: Your enemy (the OP) was defeated and left the field of battle many posts ago. This is over. |

Matthias Ancaladron
Wrath of Angels
94
|
Posted - 2017.02.06 18:11:15 -
[60] - Quote
Arthur Aihaken wrote:T3 Battleships for the win. No, seriously. Introduce them and eliminate having to deal with a T3 Strategic Cruiser rebalance. Two birds - one stone. :( why can't we just get rid of the t3s we already have. |
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