At present, EVE online is as visually spectacular as it has ever been. Crucible, was a welcomed surprise as is CCP's new direction. Let us not forget what led us here, and what restored a healthy balance back to this game. YOU, the player... sent a message that was heard loud and clear to the highest levels of CCP.



Although the CSM may claim responsibility (in part or in full) for this change, it is the voice of the players that precipitated CCP's return to a perspective that made this game one of a kind. Only here could protests be followed up by (mostly) unedited forum outrage. Only here could a collective voice of untold subscriptions shake the foundations of a multimillion dollar corporation in another country.





The Backstory

For years the CSM has been a fruitless band of individuals that spoke much and achieved very little. As the years past and the frustration of the players mounted, most of the parts of EVE that were being ignored... went ignored by the rest of us. But when the straw broke the camels back, the players finally reacted. And through the efforts of the players, CCP was forced to listen and in doing so, IMHO preserved the game that they created for many years to come.





A Final Word

I just wanted to through that out there, for the sake of all of those out there who helped make this change. Masked beneath "you hate goons" and "CSM emergency... blah blah" and all the rest of the propaganda that floods these forums, is a unique community that can inspire change that not only effects a digital universe, but the real universe as well. Without YOU none of this would have happened. It was a hard transition, but you may have saved EVE online in such a way that it can now proceed into the next decade. That transcends all in game politics, the CSM and anything else that people might come up with.



* Eternum bows to the player base, thx CCP and then flips the CSM the finger.

At present, EVE online is as visually spectacular as it has ever been. Crucible, was a welcomed surprise as is CCP's new direction. Let us not forget what led us here, and what restored a healthy balance back to this game. YOU, the player... sent a message that was heard loud and clear to the highest levels of CCP.



Although the CSM may claim responsibility (in part or in full) for this change, it is the voice of the players that precipitated CCP's return to a perspective that made this game one of a kind. Only here could protests be followed up by (mostly) unedited forum outrage. Only here could a collective voice of untold subscriptions shake the foundations of a multimillion dollar corporation in another country.





The Backstory

For years the CSM has been a fruitless band of individuals that spoke much and achieved very little. As the years past and the frustration of the players mounted, most of the parts of EVE that were being ignored... went ignored by the rest of us. But when the straw broke the camels back, the players finally reacted. And through the efforts of the players, CCP was forced to listen and in doing so, IMHO preserved the game that they created for many years to come.





A Final Word

I just wanted to through that out there, for the sake of all of those out there who helped make this change. Masked beneath "you hate goons" and "CSM emergency... blah blah" and all the rest of the propaganda that floods these forums, is a unique community that can inspire change that not only effects a digital universe, but the real universe as well. Without YOU none of this would have happened. It was a hard transition, but you may have saved EVE online in such a way that it can now proceed into the next decade. That transcends all in game politics, the CSM and anything else that people might come up with.



* Eternum bows to the player base, thx CCP and then flips the CSM the finger.

Thanks to CSM6 the most effective CSM ever.

Did I do that right? Or do I need to give you a delicious tears as well?

You do every time you post.

Don't worry the mean man will stop thanking CCP and the players soon.

Thanks Eternum. Your tearful posts about Goonswarm are much appreciated.

You should post some more stuff in the CSM forum.

Thanks Eternum. Your tearful posts about Goonswarm are much appreciated.

You should post some more stuff in the CSM forum.

It's the first time I'm urged to use that Like button.

CSM people claiming the credits of so-called refocusing of CCP make me sick.

did he mentioned Goonswarm here ? **** i have to read it again

Check his post history. He's real mad about Goons.

its logic to bring up non relevant issues to this post it really helps you

Yes because if it wasn't for his negative feelings about Goons (especially the two Goons on the CSM) he wouldn't have made this thread.

Look at all those things the CSM didn't do like fix Hybrids and nerf sCaps.

well he didn,t mention the goons in this thread .
and in my opinion ,he makes a good point
So maybe he has some hatred for the Goons,but that's not relevant in this post

Like I said it's relevant because the only reason he made this thread was to discount and belittle the efforts of the current CSM. This is not a difficult concept.

Look at all those things the CSM didn't do like fix Hybrids and nerf sCaps.

Look at all those things the CSM didn't do like fix Hybrids and nerf sCaps.

Like I said it's relevant because the only reason he made this thread was to discount and belittle the efforts of the current CSM's attempts to take credit for what the player base have done collectively. This is not a difficult concept.

As much as I make fun of the CSM (well, Mittens in particular), I do think they were rather useful this time around (if horrible communicators to the player base). So, though I agree the players' actions also had a large impact on what came about, I personally think you're off to be discounting CSM6.

i don,t think the csm could do anything ,if all of the playerbase kept silent.

As someone who has interacted with the CSM on many occasions I am not sure that the sentiments in the OP are just. Every CSM I have worked with have been productive, helpful and have worked to ensure that player concerns are addressed and fixed. Calling them a fruitless band of individuals is more than unfair.

Still, elections will be coming up in the next few weeks for the CSM so perhaps you can shift that focus, run a strong campaign and be a really good CSM member. Naturally, it is always easy to throw stones at a glass house. Try coming into the house instead and actually affect change.

Try getting them to represent themselves the same way when interacting with the general player base. Seriously, it would go a looooong way in terms of restoring the CSM name in the eyes of everyone else. While in the CSM chair, they are representing your company to the rest of the world.

then you also have the power to change that with your votes.

Would you suggest that changing the personna of individuals would be a benefit?

As someone who has interacted with the CSM on many occasions I am not sure that the sentiments in the OP are just. Every CSM I have worked with have been productive, helpful and have worked to ensure that player concerns are addressed and fixed. Calling them a fruitless band of individuals is more than unfair.

Still, elections will be coming up in the next few weeks for the CSM so perhaps you can shift that focus, run a strong campaign and be a really good CSM member. Naturally, it is always easy to throw stones at a glass house. Try coming into the house instead and actually affect change.

1 paying account = 1 vote, or it is meaningless and can be heavily exploited. Not only has it happened, I have seen it admitted too multiple times on these forums over and over again.

If there really is/was a way to exploit the voting process, that would be... bad.

percieved poor interaction with the players

your respect is meaningless, and i only represent my constituents

Bridged...

Crucible appeared really fast after the realized failure of incarna and the lol Himlar fiasco. It's content is not an effort of an elected council, it is instead an effort of a panicking and downsizing RL corporation to make people very happy, very fast. I mean, it is pretty obvious isn't it?


The CSM did not invent "Hybrids need to be balanced", "Supers need nerf", "Dreds lost their role", "POS's need to be looked at", "fix oneiros" ex.) This has nothing to do with them and I can't understand how people can entertain the idea when people say otherwise (like whitetree)


You can only get away with that kind of fabricated stupidity on the internet.

That is not to openly state that it is do to the CSM directly, but on the other hand, there is an uncanny correlation that cannot simply be ignored.

Meh, this CSM wasn't nearly as entertaining as the last one. Mittens is ok for laughs, but Ank was the greatest.


On a serious note, I haven't followed the CSM as much as last year, so I don't know how much work they put in, but I'm sure they did something, either for the players or for CCP.

Anyway being that there are easier and fairer ways to poll player opinion,

Hey remember last year when CCP polled the playerbase about their most pressing issues with the game?

Docking games was the number one item.

Do you think docking games is the biggest problem in Eve right now?

Therefore CCP, do you want to change that and get a better CSM or do you rather keep your 0.0 alliance CSM with long term players you know and like? I imagine working with a more mixed up CSM and more mixed up opinions on this game will make it harder, but also more fruitfull.

Effective in what way, have you any evidence to support this, how would crucible be any difffrent without the CSM?

There is the very real probability that Eve wouldn't have survived to produce the Crucible expansion without the intervention of the current CSM

Gold.

Thankyou for saving eve CSM6. We are forever in your debt.

As someone who has interacted with the CSM on many occasions I am not sure that the sentiments in the OP are just. Every CSM I have worked with have been productive, helpful and have worked to ensure that player concerns are addressed and fixed. Calling them a fruitless band of individuals is more than unfair.

Still, elections will be coming up in the next few weeks for the CSM so perhaps you can shift that focus, run a strong campaign and be a really good CSM member. Naturally, it is always easy to throw stones at a glass house. Try coming into the house instead and actually affect change.

It's the first time I'm urged to use that Like button.

CSM people claiming the credits of so-called refocusing of CCP make me sick.

* Eternum bows to the player base, thx CCP and then flips the middle finger at the CSM.

At present, EVE online is as visually spectacular as it has ever been. Crucible, was a welcomed surprise as is CCP's new direction. Let us not forget what led us here, and what restored a healthy balance back to this game. YOU, the player... sent a message that was heard loud and clear to the highest levels of CCP.



Although the CSM may claim responsibility (in part or in full) for this change, it is the voice of the players that precipitated CCP's return to a perspective that made this game one of a kind. Only here could protests be followed up by (mostly) unedited forum outrage. Only here could a collective voice of untold subscriptions shake the foundations of a multimillion dollar corporation in another country.





The Backstory

For years the CSM has been a fruitless band of individuals that spoke much and achieved very little. As the years past and the frustration of the players mounted, most of the parts of EVE that were being ignored... went ignored by the rest of us. But when the straw broke the camels back, the players finally reacted. And through the efforts of the players, CCP was forced to listen and in doing so, IMHO preserved the game that they created for many years to come.





A Final Word

I just wanted to through that out there, for the sake of all of those out there who helped make this change. Masked beneath "you hate goons" and "CSM emergency... blah blah" and all the rest of the propaganda that floods these forums, is a unique community that can inspire change that not only effects a digital universe, but the real universe as well. Without YOU none of this would have happened. It was a hard transition, but you may have saved EVE online in such a way that it can now proceed into the next decade. That transcends all in game politics, the CSM and anything else that people might come up with.



* Eternum bows to the player base, thx CCP and then flips the CSM the finger.

Actually as soon as a lone-wolf type reached the point of having its own clients to vote for him he no longer would be lone-wolf and would represent a guy wih a lot of clients to please. Preferably clients from nullsec. Preferably close to the uber-alliances. Preferably the kind of CSM we got now, who are asisting your company into flipping the bird to hiseccers, soloers, casuals and very specially those who hoped you (eventually) were true about Incarna and instead got four closets and have been waiting for two bloody months and 2,000 messages that you deign yourselves to say anything on WiS.

As far as we know, WiS was not on the table this december. That's nice. But now grow some balls and tell us you no longer want to think on WiS and so we can carry on and do whatever we see suit to do with whatever gameplay you will give to nullsecers, griefers, gankers and the rest of your First Class customers.

....

I have no issue with the CSM doing what they where supposed do, they did jump on the bandwagon eventually, although it took a little time and prodding from the masses to get them to take that last step.

The community failed .. HARD. It proved that it is every bit an illiterate bunch of lemmings as any other community in the world. Sorry for being the one to break it to you, but take it a look at the sequence of events and show me where/how I am wrong in that assessment.

Well, sometimes we are a bit ahead of the curve. You will recall CSM5 and the infamous public letter (which I'm told got us called "terrorists" by some people at CCP, and was the subject of much criticism during the CSM6 elections).

The problem with being a canary in the coalmines is that you're usually the first to die...

All cool and stuff, but you realize that "flipping the finger to soloers" is not actually true or real outside your imagination?

There is the very real probability that Eve wouldn't have survived to produce the Crucible expansion without the intervention of the current CSM.

I think you actually believe that sadly enough

CCP was happy to basically ignore the entire playerbase until people started canceling their accounts in great numbers and even then they didn't really grasp what the problems were until the emergency CSM meeting they had over the summer.

Oh yes CCP are blind and deaf and needed someone to tell them again what everybody was screaming about. 'The emergenct summit turned things around', Well I ask you ever had the wool pulled over your eyes, it was PR stunt by CCP in a desperate attempt to communicate to the playerbase they are interested in our concerns, no more no less, just a propaganda excercise

But for some more concrete examples you can thank the CSM for jump bridges not being foolishly removed from the game, supercaps finally getting a balance pass, an actual plan to fix some of the glaring problems with the Dominion sov system, CCP backing away from selling gold ships and ammo through RMT and a bunch of smaller "quality of life" issues that they have been championing since their term started.

Or CCP could have polled the playerbase as an entriety and done the same thing, this doesn't justify the CSM or prove it's effectivness

I get that some people don't like Goons and hate to see us succeed but keep in mind that there are only two Goons on the CSM and when I say that CSM6 has been the most effective CSM in history I mean all of them--not just Mittens and Vile Rat.

Get over yourself nothing to do with goons, it's to do with establishing a political structure when one wasn't needed and infact having one is detremental to the impartiality and overall effectiveness of the concept of a small focus group.

I have 2 accounts and so I get 2 votes. Do you know how many people in nullsec have more then just 2? People were activating dead accounts, and buying accounts with plexes just to game the CSM vote. Why do you think that there are Pandemic and Goon CSM's? Coincidence? Nope. Wealthy alliances that are not only large, they also have many multiple account owners (like 4,5,6 accounts and more)

Guess what that means for the ordinary, run of the mill single account holder who only gets 1 vote?



20 people with 2 accounts can submit 40 votes
That means that twice as many single account holders have to vote for it to break even (let alone have their choice win the CSM chair)

While resubbing shenanigans might account for some votes, it is very minor compared to what more effective campaigning might yield.

Thanks to CSM6 the most effective CSM ever.

Because of said Shenanigans, and because of the general low opinion of the CSM universal-wide, the other 86% of people don't feel like voting will matter. So they do not. 14% is not allot, and those 14% generate a small group of elected CSM's that gamed the system to a significant degree. Those people are supposed to represent 100% of people and that is just stupid.

Most effective? Completely and totally false. If CSM6 were the most effective then the Summer of Rage wouldn't have happened. CSM6 was simply the most public, which is still to their credit.

Try getting them to represent themselves the same way when interacting with the general player base. Seriously, it would go a looooong way in terms of restoring the CSM name in the eyes of everyone else. While in the CSM chair, they are representing your company to the rest of the world.

Try getting them to represent themselves the same way when interacting with the general player base. Seriously, it would go a looooong way in terms of restoring the CSM name in the eyes of everyone else. While in the CSM chair, they are representing your company to the rest of the world.


Time to be quiet now. You are pooping some nasty crap out of that mouth.

Thank CCP not yet ,they may be listening to those idiots.
Thinking they represent the whole playerbase