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murder one
Gallente Death of Virtue Vigilance Infinitas
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Posted - 2007.06.19 05:27:00 -
[1]
Blasterthrons are an all-or-nothing ship. You either crush your target or get completely destroyed. There is no turning back. There are no options once you engage. You are fully commited. Every time.
Blasterthrons are quickly becoming a rarity in PVP due to the skills required to fly them (both in skillpoints and pilot experience) and the cost to operate one effectively.
The 25% HP increase and the 20% damage reduction to T2 short range ammo, in addition to the huge (-50%) tracking nerf to short range T2 ammo in Rev1 was a massive blow to the effectiveness of the Blasterthron. Once rigs were introduced that increased active tanks by another 35% or more, the margin with which a Blasterthron could overcome a single target's tank has been reduced to almost zero.
Blasterthrons need maxed out skills in order to get that last 10-15% DPS increase in order to compete with the tremendous tanking increases brought about by rigs and the Tier 3 battleships. It's quite easy to build a Rokh or Maelstrom or Dominx, or even a Typhoon with relatively little ISK and less than maximum skills that is competitive with other battleship setups in PVP. With the Blasterthron (and also the Blaster Hype), if you don't have every applicable skill to five, you're probably going to die in a 1v1 fight with another BS if it's properly fit for PVP.
Now that the T2 EANMs have been increased to 36 CPU per module, Blasterthron pilots will have to resort to faction modules and a 5% CPU reduction implant (requireing Cybernetics 5- another skill required to be maxed), just to get a basic fit. Nothing spectacular and overwhelmingly effective, just an entry level setup.
So what do the rest of you think? Is this a good thing? Should flying a Blasterthron be reserved for only the best and most expert pilots in Eve? Or should it be more accessible for use to those with less than perfect skills and a smaller bank roll?
For me, adding an extra 160 million ISK to the cost of my setup, a full 80% increase in cost over my previous setup, just to fly a Blasterthron won't really make that much of a difference. I'll continue to fly it just because I can't stomach flying anything else.
I can fly Minmatar, Caldari and Gallente BS with equal effectiveness (I won't touch Amarr, as they're completely worthless, with the EANM change just making it worse), but I'm sticking with my Blasterthron. It just doesn't feel right defeating my targets with a battleship fit with more nos than guns. Or all nos and torp launchers. There just isn't any skill or style in it.
So I guess in the end, CCP's efforts to remove the Blasterthron from the playing field is a good thing. Those who fly one, and do it well, will be held in high regard, as an esteemed elite, a select few to be held in awe by the common low rank PVP pilots flying second rate nos ships.
Cheers CCP. Keep the nerfs coming. Pretty soon no one will be flying anything that doesn't use nos or capless weapons, and no one will ever undock unless they have at least a four man gang for backup. Looks like a bright future.
Because I said so...
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Death Kill
Caldari direkte
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Posted - 2007.06.19 05:28:00 -
[2]
lol
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Jim McGregor
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Posted - 2007.06.19 05:33:00 -
[3]
Murder one, you really need to stop posting the same things over and over again. I havent ever seen you post about something that is not gallente. Seems to me that you just want to boost your own race here.
---
Originally by: CCP Wrangler You're not supposed to feel like you're logging in to a happy, happy, fluffy, fluffy lala land filled with fun and adventures, thats what hello kitty online is for.
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FarScape III
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Posted - 2007.06.19 05:34:00 -
[4]
So you're saying only the most elete pilots in a Thron can almost beet anything? .....And?
Think about what you're saying.
A Minmater City... Cool! My Skills |

Stellar Vix
State War Academy
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Posted - 2007.06.19 05:37:00 -
[5]
MWDing SniperRokh > MWDing Blaterthorn =========
400x120 13kbs...
SWA Qualified Instructor and Mascot or sorts Ensign Stellar Vix |

William Hamilton
Caldari THE LEGION OF STEEL WARRIORS.... R0ADKILL
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Posted - 2007.06.19 05:37:00 -
[6]
Use blastperions instead?
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Meeli
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Posted - 2007.06.19 05:38:00 -
[7]
and the point of posting was. . .?
the blasterthron has always been a ship made for men with big *******. It's a borderline suicide ship and so far, i dont see any major impact it had in the past few patches. (albeit i've flown blastermegas from way before t2 ammo... uh hell even before t2 guns)
frankly, if you dont like the ship, fly something else.. if you think the rest dont have enough flair then my friend i'm afraid to tell you that your ship has run its course and the door is that way 
if you go with the latter option, CIHYS?
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Kalid Miu
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Posted - 2007.06.19 05:45:00 -
[8]
Edited by: Kalid Miu on 19/06/2007 05:45:13
Originally by: Jim McGregor
Murder one, you really need to stop posting the same things over and over again. I havent ever seen you post about something that is not gallente. Seems to me that you just want to boost your own race here.
I agree with you Jim... ALSO, all his proposed ideas/fixes/'balancing' seem to favour Gallente... EVEN when he keeps saying it's for the benefit of eveyone... LOL... especially when he tried using Amarr misfortunes/issues as an EXCUSE to address some problematic game mechanics...
Edit: BTW, Murder please post your Megatron setup(s)... I would like to examine your ELITE setup...
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murder one
Gallente Death of Virtue Vigilance Infinitas
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Posted - 2007.06.19 05:47:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Jim McGregor
Murder one, you really need to stop posting the same things over and over again. I havent ever seen you post about something that is not gallente. Seems to me that you just want to boost your own race here.
Boost my own race? The Blasterthron hasn't seen anything but nerfs for the past six months. So much so that I cross trained (in an amazingly short time) Caldari and Minmatar so that I could have some ships that excelled in a Nos heavy combat environment.
I'm done arguing for an Amarr buff. I'd fly them too if they were even remotely effective, but they suck, and suck hard. The EANM nerf is just an insult to Amarr everywhere. All the Amarr 'improvements' in Rev2 are hollow jokes.
I don't have my 'own race' in Eve. I fly Hurricanes, Drakes, Rokhs, Maelstroms, Typhoons. Whatever is effective. It just disgusts me when I have to abandon any ship that doesn't conform to the 4x Heavy Nos, 4x whatever else cookie cutter template in order to compete in PVP.
It's a **** poor indication of CCP's lack of competence with respect to game design and insight into combat mechanics within Eve itself. Nos fights and waiting for your target to run out of cap charges is **not fun**. Requiring two, if not three ships in a gang in order to ensure a decisive and quick kill against a single target is **not fun**.
CCP continues to water down combat in general, and solo combat specifically.
I have no 'own 'race' Jim. I fly a Drake, it was nerfed a little, but not enough to make any difference with how I use it or how effective it is. The EANM nerf doesn't touch any of my other ships: Typhoon, Dominix, Rokh, Myrm, Ishtar, Maelstrom, Brutix, Vexor, Rifter, Hurricane, Rupture, etc. etc.
I just can't stand flying some weak ass lamer Caldari nos boat, just like everyone else, when there really is no need to, if CCP will just stop nerfing the Blasterthron.
Because I said so...
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Jail Beatty
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Posted - 2007.06.19 05:48:00 -
[10]
Quote: Those who fly one, and do it well, will be held in high regard, as an esteemed elite, a select few to be held in awe by the common low rank PVP pilots flying second rate nos ships.
ROFL 
I've not seen that much hot air in a single sentence in a long time. Thanks for the entertainment.
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Erichk Knaar
Caldari Maelstrom Crew
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Posted - 2007.06.19 05:49:00 -
[11]
I've killed a few, but I've also had my a$$ wtfhanded to me by them on more than one occasion. It's one of those setups that favors the brave/stupid. Seeing a blasterthron pilot kill 2-3 enemy before he goes down is a thing of beauty. Those that pull it off with regularity, are elite, so, I don't see the point of the post. Adapt...
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Maraude Fury
Minmatar Shadow Of The Light R i s e
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Posted - 2007.06.19 05:51:00 -
[12]
This is the cycle of mmo's.
What's on top one summer is on the bottom the next. This is intentional. I remember Amarr being the best thing in the game. Now look at em? I remember when NOBODY flew Minnie ships. Now I see about 1/3 of all pvp ships are minnie. Used to be you'd only see Caldari Tanking missions. well.. that hasn't changed..
But slowly over the life of an MMO, they look at what's at the bottom of the pile, and slowly keep buffing it while nerfing.. I mean "bringing in line with" someone else so that the bottom is on the top, and the top is in the middle, and the middle is on the bottom and so on. It's a circle.
This is intentional, as it keep players from picking one "race" and sticking with it for years getting bored. Maraude Fury CEO: Shadow Of The Light .SOL.
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Mikal Zackfelt
Gallente Novatec Industries
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Posted - 2007.06.19 05:56:00 -
[13]
I don't remember hearing that a blasterthron is like an all or nothing ship, but then I haven't put mine through its paces yet... I would think, although, that there would be a certain element of planning while having all of it's modules active while in the midst of battle. I certainly have along way to go before I can really take advantage of mine.
My .02 isk
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Kira Metari
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Posted - 2007.06.19 06:00:00 -
[14]
Stuff takes a long time to train, it would be nice if they maintained overall balance. Theres no reason for CCP to keep turning Gallente into the next Amarr.
I personally think it a huge shame when NOS and Damp setups dominate PvP, as opposed to real gunships. Sure, if you want to win, adapt etc.... but this topic isnt about a specific pilot unable to find a way to win. Its about general snores for small gang/solo PvP in general, and CCP doing silly things.
I do agree that in the last year CCP has failed to think things through as clearly as they had in the past. No, its not unplayable, but IMHO its becoming alot less fun. /shrug |

Akkarin Pagan
Minmatar Raddick Explorations Executive Outcomes
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Posted - 2007.06.19 06:01:00 -
[15]
I'll try to be slightly constructive. Have you tried the AC Tempest? It can fit 6 guns and 2 nos, and is far more manouverable than the Blasterthron. Admitedly it can't tank as well or do quite as much damage, but the increased range and mobility more than make up for it imo. I know that you aren't a fan of nos, but hey, if you can't beat them.
Akkarin Hopefully the mods won't play with this one
<3 - Immy
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Malachy Kidd
Minmatar Republic Military School
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Posted - 2007.06.19 06:19:00 -
[16]
Originally by: murder one
Requiring two, if not three ships in a gang in order to ensure a decisive and quick kill against a single target is **not fun**.
I get what you're saying, especially about your original ship-of-choice repeatedly getting hit with the nerf stick, but I just had to point this one sentence out to you.
See, when I read it, the first thing that came to my mind is that you're looking for a wtfpwn-mobile. That's just not allowed, and I don't think that's the impression you intended to make.
One-on-one combat between two equally skilled and competent players should not result in an easy kill by one of them. I'm not even certain where to begin to explain why this is so; it should be self-evident.
I can understand your frustration if you're consistently engaged in protracted 1-on-1 battles with month-old main characters, but if this is the case then I suggest you re-evaluate your ship configuration, skills, and tactics.
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Malachy Kidd
Minmatar Republic Military School
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Posted - 2007.06.19 06:19:00 -
[17]
Originally by: murder one
Requiring two, if not three ships in a gang in order to ensure a decisive and quick kill against a single target is **not fun**.
I get what you're saying, especially about your original ship-of-choice repeatedly getting hit with the nerf stick, but I just had to point this one sentence out to you.
See, when I read it, the first thing that came to my mind is that you're looking for a wtfpwn-mobile. That's just not allowed, and I don't think that's the impression you intended to make.
One-on-one combat between two equally skilled and competent players should not result in an easy kill by one of them. I'm not even certain where to begin to explain why this is so; it should be self-evident.
I can understand your frustration if you're consistently engaged in protracted 1-on-1 battles with month-old main characters, but if this is the case then I suggest you re-evaluate your ship configuration, skills, and tactics.
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murder one
Gallente Death of Virtue Vigilance Infinitas
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Posted - 2007.06.19 06:25:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Akkarin Pagan I'll try to be slightly constructive. Have you tried the AC Tempest? It can fit 6 guns and 2 nos, and is far more manouverable than the Blasterthron. Admitedly it can't tank as well or do quite as much damage, but the increased range and mobility more than make up for it imo. I know that you aren't a fan of nos, but hey, if you can't beat them.
Akkarin
Why fly an AC Temp when an AC Maelstrom is just like it, but more of the same thing? More nos, more tank, more guns. There is no other ship in the game like the Blasterthron. AC Temps/AC Maelstroms/Typhoons, they all rely on endurance to win. They are not a max DPS gank ship. They rely on using cap more efficiently than the target ship, while still doing enough DPS to break it's tank/cap before it dies.
I can fly a T2 torp Tyhphoon, or a T2 torp Rokh w/ 4 nos/4 torps, and a huge tank, and win. Or a 4 Torp/4 T2 AC Phoon, and still probably come out ok, just because I have an insane dual large T2 rep, triple hardener super tank with rigs and a DC2 fit on the Phoon, and simply outlast a Blasterthron. It's relatively nos-proof, as the weapons don't shut off if I run out of cap.
There is no other ship that compares to the Blasterthron, except the Armageddon, and it's such a piece of crap (3 mids?) that it's not even in the running. The Apoc is a joke, and the Abaddon, well, it's great with 4 ACS and 4 Nos. 
Because I said so...
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murder one
Gallente Death of Virtue Vigilance Infinitas
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Posted - 2007.06.19 06:25:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Akkarin Pagan I'll try to be slightly constructive. Have you tried the AC Tempest? It can fit 6 guns and 2 nos, and is far more manouverable than the Blasterthron. Admitedly it can't tank as well or do quite as much damage, but the increased range and mobility more than make up for it imo. I know that you aren't a fan of nos, but hey, if you can't beat them.
Akkarin
Why fly an AC Temp when an AC Maelstrom is just like it, but more of the same thing? More nos, more tank, more guns. There is no other ship in the game like the Blasterthron. AC Temps/AC Maelstroms/Typhoons, they all rely on endurance to win. They are not a max DPS gank ship. They rely on using cap more efficiently than the target ship, while still doing enough DPS to break it's tank/cap before it dies.
I can fly a T2 torp Tyhphoon, or a T2 torp Rokh w/ 4 nos/4 torps, and a huge tank, and win. Or a 4 Torp/4 T2 AC Phoon, and still probably come out ok, just because I have an insane dual large T2 rep, triple hardener super tank with rigs and a DC2 fit on the Phoon, and simply outlast a Blasterthron. It's relatively nos-proof, as the weapons don't shut off if I run out of cap.
There is no other ship that compares to the Blasterthron, except the Armageddon, and it's such a piece of crap (3 mids?) that it's not even in the running. The Apoc is a joke, and the Abaddon, well, it's great with 4 ACS and 4 Nos. 
Because I said so...
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murder one
Gallente Death of Virtue Vigilance Infinitas
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Posted - 2007.06.19 06:28:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Malachy Kidd
Originally by: murder one
Requiring two, if not three ships in a gang in order to ensure a decisive and quick kill against a single target is **not fun**.
I get what you're saying, especially about your original ship-of-choice repeatedly getting hit with the nerf stick, but I just had to point this one sentence out to you.
See, when I read it, the first thing that came to my mind is that you're looking for a wtfpwn-mobile. That's just not allowed, and I don't think that's the impression you intended to make.
One-on-one combat between two equally skilled and competent players should not result in an easy kill by one of them. I'm not even certain where to begin to explain why this is so; it should be self-evident.
I can understand your frustration if you're consistently engaged in protracted 1-on-1 battles with month-old main characters, but if this is the case then I suggest you re-evaluate your ship configuration, skills, and tactics.
I bolded the key part of your post. Max skilled Blasterthron pilots don't stand a chance against pilots with a paltry amount of skillpoints. I can fly a 30m SP Blasterthron pilot against a 5m SP Domi or Rokh pilot, and the Blasterthron will lose every time. Guaranteed. This is my whole point. I'm not looking for a 'solo pwnmobile'. I'm looking for some equity.
Because I said so...
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Tonkin
D00M. Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2007.06.19 06:29:00 -
[21]
am i reading this right someone wants gallente boosted!!!
they have the best drones one of the best snipers, the domi with its ubber nos, best carrier, best mothership, 2 of the best hacs and the best crusier
so come again?
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2007.06.19 06:32:00 -
[22]
Edited by: Akita T on 19/06/2007 06:34:56
Downgrade from Neutrons to Ions. About 6% DPS drop for 7% better tracking, much easier to fit, both PG and CPU-wise. Drop the turret CPU implant you used to need and get a turret damage implant instead. Almost recovered lost DPS. Of course, the 5 Ogre IIs still deal the same damage as before.
Switch from Void L (28K/28T, -25% range, -50% falloff, -50% tracking, +25% capacitor usage) to LP-shop Antimatter L faction ammo (32.2K/23T, -50% range, no falloff penality, no tracking penality, no capacitor usage penality). Almost the same damage (-1.4% DPS overall), easier on the cap, better quality hits (or mor often) which actually means an increase in DPS, and a whooping 20% capacitor savings ! And no, I don't expect that ammo to cost significantly more as T2 ammo.
THERE. Easy to fit. Cheap. More than DOUBLED tracking. Almost doubled range. Almost same base DPS. _ New char creation guide | Module/Rig stacknerfing explained |

MOS DEF
0utbreak
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Posted - 2007.06.19 06:33:00 -
[23]
Time to grow some real balls and jump into the astarte. That one still fits.

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Celador Nane
Turbulent
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Posted - 2007.06.19 06:40:00 -
[24]
I have to agree with Murder One....
I fly a hyperion/thron and it saddens me to loose most duels with corpmates to any ship with 4 nos, simply cuz its impossible to gank a rigged battleship your forced into trying to outlast them, which simply does not happen with the insane cap use of MWD/GUNS/REPS.....:/
Even using a heavy injector II you still run out of cap b4 your cap charges have run out.

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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2007.06.19 06:42:00 -
[25]
Edited by: Akita T on 19/06/2007 06:42:14
So, have you tried SiSi recently ? Have you tried what I just described in the previous post ?
P.S. My "Mega" skills are execrable (very, very pathetic), still I think it handles admirably as described above. _ New char creation guide | Module/Rig stacknerfing explained |

murder one
Gallente Death of Virtue Vigilance Infinitas
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Posted - 2007.06.19 07:09:00 -
[26]
Originally by: MOS DEF Time to grow some real balls and jump into the astarte. That one still fits.

I have an Astarte. It's smaller, does less DPS, and has less cap. It's fun for gangs and killing smaller ships, but it's still not a BS. Any 4m SP Domi pilot will rip it apart.
Because I said so...
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murder one
Gallente Death of Virtue Vigilance Infinitas
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Posted - 2007.06.19 07:18:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Akita T Edited by: Akita T on 19/06/2007 06:39:44
Downgrade from Neutrons to Ions. About 6% DPS drop for 7% better tracking, much easier to fit, both PG and CPU-wise. Drop the turret CPU implant you used to need and get a turret damage implant instead. Almost recovered lost DPS. Of course, the 5 Ogre IIs still deal the same damage as before.
Switch from Void L (28K/28T, -25% range, -50% falloff, -50% tracking, +25% capacitor usage) to LP-shop Antimatter L faction ammo (32.2K/23T, -50% range, no falloff penality, no tracking penality, no capacitor usage penality). Almost the same damage (-1.4% DPS overall), easier on the cap, better quality hits (or mor often) which actually means an increase in DPS, and a whooping 20% capacitor savings ! And no, I don't expect that ammo to cost significantly more as T2 ammo.
THERE.
Easy to fit, doesn't even NEED T2 guns. Cheap. Well, cheapER as what you were apparently used to anyway. Almost same base DPS (3-4% at worst if you insist on using T2 guns). Highly increased survivavility because it DOESN'T cap out as fast as you're used to. More than DOUBLED tracking (yes, more than, I count 107% vs 50% as more than double). Almost doubled effective fighting range (lower falloff on ions, but no 50% penality, slightly lower optimal too).
What the heck do you need more ? It's a freaking Gallente BOOST to boot, and you're WHINING "NERF" ?!?!?
If LP store faction antimatter becomes a viable alternative (both in price and volume) to Void, then I think that your above suggestion might be viable.
And you're getting your range calculations mixed up. Neutrons have a much greater base range than Ions, and Void has a larger optimal range than Antimatter. So with Ions, you're still losing quite a bit of effective range compared to Neutrons, but you're gaining tracking.
The reduced CPU requirement of the Ions and adding the +5% large turret damage implant might be an effective solution, if the overall DPS can be maintained. And the decreased cap usage is a very good improvement, as long as the LP faction ammo is available. (Which is currently not the case)
Regardless, look at what you're saying. I'm having to resort to expensive implants, rare faction ammo, and whatever else, just to maintain the same performance. This is unacceptable.
Because I said so...
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Jin Entres
Sharks With Frickin' Laser Beams Mercenary Coalition
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Posted - 2007.06.19 07:27:00 -
[28]
Well, he has some points. Less damage versus better tanks. It's a problem for all blaster ships. It's increasingly difficult to reach and stay in blaster range with speed setups more common.
The biggest problem, however, in my opinion is cap usage. Not only is cap more under attack by nos, but the increased length of engagements has obviously also increased the amount of time needed to run guns, tackling, propulsion and tank. Blasterships were already weak in this regard, relying on killing their opponents before cap death.
7 Ion II's consume 25.6 cap/s* which equals roughly 2+ heavy nos on you constantly. Megathron with maxed cap skills and MWD fitted has a peak recharge (2.4x modifier) of 14.6 cap/s. That is, it can't even sustain the guns, much less anything else. A T2 heavy injector provides 57 cap/s, so after guns there is 46 cap/s. LAR II is 35.5, scrambler and web are about 5 total, and all other modules such as hardeners and damage control are maybe 3 more, which puts the capacitor status at about +2 cap/s.
That means both A. that there is practically zero margin for being nossed to sustain it and B. that MWD's usage is drained from max cap, which usually means that it's used to get in range, bringing the cap down near the 30-40% peak spot.
And that's with just one repper. Considering battleships that use weapon systems that do not require cap (Typhoon, Tempest, Maelstrom, Dominix (mostly), Raven) can do competitive damage while tanking considerably better and even having better range and better fitting options, even utility slots for nos with guns, I would definitely argue that blasterthrons and hypes are disadvantaged.
I don't want them to be buffed hugely, but I would appreciate it if the cap issue was addressed.
* With: 2 MFS II 3% RoF Hardwiring Gunnery V Rapid Firing V Controlled Bursts IV ---
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Cur
Minmatar Dawn of a new Empire Pure.
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Posted - 2007.06.19 07:40:00 -
[29]
Originally by: murder one I can fly a 30m SP Blasterthron pilot against a 5m SP Domi or Rokh pilot, and the Blasterthron will lose every time. Guaranteed. This is my whole point. I'm not looking for a 'solo pwnmobile'. I'm looking for some equity.
Looks like someone's head is hitting a wall and they refuse to notice the futility of their actions.
Adapt or die. If the low player skill, shove the ship and guns down the throat of your enemy, strategy doesn't work anymore then I suggest you find a new one.
"What is best in life?" "To crush your enemies, to see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentations of their women." |

d026
THE LEGION OF STEEL WARRIORS.... R0ADKILL
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Posted - 2007.06.19 07:40:00 -
[30]
huh?
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2007.06.19 07:50:00 -
[31]
LP shop (with faction ammo details) thread _ New char creation guide | Module/Rig stacknerfing explained |

Solokar
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Posted - 2007.06.19 07:51:00 -
[32]
The OP makes some good points but IMHO the main issue is still NOS. It takes almost no skills to use and its effect is overpowered. 6 NOS + 2 guns > 4 NOS + 4 guns > 8 guns. Hopefully, we will see a balancing change in this area soon.
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Chainsaw Plankton
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Posted - 2007.06.19 08:09:00 -
[33]
Akita T stop trying to help the people, its more fun to watch them squirm and cry nerf!!!
and on sisi the other day i got owned by a blasterthron, in a drake, and a slipnir and a absolution went down too.
blasterthrons seem very good after the patch anyways.
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E Vile
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Posted - 2007.06.19 08:10:00 -
[34]
Edited by: E Vile on 19/06/2007 08:09:52 Sorry, but you are completely full of it.
No Tier 3 BS is "Cheap and easy" to fit. No way. All Tier 3 BS are far more expensive and AT LEAST just as skill intensive to fly correctly.
Amarr are FAR from worthless. The abaddon and geddon can be very effective with PROPER SKILLS, and SMART PLAY.
This game has so many whiners. Reminds me of the people that ruined Star Wars Galaxies. "The key to immortality is to first live a life worth remembering."
Shohadaku New York Metal
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MuffinsRevenger
EmpiresMod
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Posted - 2007.06.19 08:10:00 -
[35]
The OP fails to see that this is a MMO, meening that he might not be suposed to kill most ships out there by himself :) |

kliop
Wisdom Seekers
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Posted - 2007.06.19 08:13:00 -
[36]
i have only one thing to say
Originally by: murder one
Originally by: Vdub2002 so.... im all for the cpu bonus and crap, but me being gallente, only went caldari for manticore, for the 3rd launcher... so um... now that ALL the sb's have 3 launchers, WTF is manticore going to be better at? being a big ugly target?
=_=
Buhu?
cry me a river! u want blasterthrons to allways obliterate their target?...whatever cryboy -------------------------------- hello o/ |

Jane Spondogolo
NoobWaffe
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Posted - 2007.06.19 08:16:00 -
[37]
Originally by: Stellar Vix MWDing SniperRokh > MWDing Blaterthorn
MWD snipers.........
Hmm. I'll be polite and call that 'unique'. ______ Unrepentant Southern Federation Cheerleader.
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Odinegras
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Posted - 2007.06.19 08:17:00 -
[38]
Im confused here? Your saying real men use a blasterthron erm take off the EANM II's and fit mag stabs, fight like a real man. Who needs a tank anyway? talking about all or nothing then fitting a tank :S
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jaezebelle
Gallente ORB enterprises
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Posted - 2007.06.19 08:19:00 -
[39]
I think if you'd have specialized in just Gallente instead of spreading it about with at least another 2 races you'd feel a little bit better about them.
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Lore Isander
Caldari Sybrite Inc.
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Posted - 2007.06.19 08:19:00 -
[40]
Youy suck murder one. ---
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E Vile
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Posted - 2007.06.19 08:24:00 -
[41]
WTF?!?
""Caldari and Minmatar so that I could have some ships that excelled in a Nos heavy combat environment."""
Did I miss something? Did they take Domis out of game?
"The key to immortality is to first live a life worth remembering."
Shohadaku New York Metal
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d026
THE LEGION OF STEEL WARRIORS.... R0ADKILL
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Posted - 2007.06.19 08:29:00 -
[42]
btw. the raven cant wtfbbq anything. please give it 8th missile slot + 5 more lows.
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d026
THE LEGION OF STEEL WARRIORS.... R0ADKILL
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Posted - 2007.06.19 08:31:00 -
[43]
MWDing SniperRokh > MWDing Blaterthorn
well you dont fit a mwd on a sniper rokh but still:
tier 3 bs > tier 2 bs in most cases...
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MOS DEF
0utbreak
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Posted - 2007.06.19 08:40:00 -
[44]
Originally by: murder one
Originally by: MOS DEF Time to grow some real balls and jump into the astarte. That one still fits.

I have an Astarte. It's smaller, does less DPS, and has less cap. It's fun for gangs and killing smaller ships, but it's still not a BS. Any 4m SP Domi pilot will rip it apart.
You are right there. The problem does not ly with blasterboats though. It's one single bloody module called the heavy NOS. How CCP let this bad joke go on for so long is unbelievable. Fix nos. Those modules are simply too good especially because so many battleships have free hi slots to fill up with them. They should use some sort of utility turret or something. If someone puts 2 heavy nos on hs tempest or raven i can live with that.
4 nos 4 launchers/guns rokhs machariels, phoons, abaddons and the like are a sad joke though.
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Horus Dark
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Posted - 2007.06.19 08:42:00 -
[45]
Blasterthrons are quickly becoming a rarity in PVP <---stopped reading right there.
You actualy pvp?
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Ashaz
Mindstar Technology United Confederation of Corporations
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Posted - 2007.06.19 08:51:00 -
[46]
Originally by: Jane Spondogolo
Originally by: Stellar Vix MWDing SniperRokh > MWDing Blaterthorn
MWD snipers.........
Hmm. I'll be polite and call that 'unique'.
Why so? If you fit for fighting at range. Fit to stay at range. *shrug* People will come at you with WMDs, so you'll need one to keep them away. iDrone |

murder one
Gallente Death of Virtue Vigilance Infinitas
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Posted - 2007.06.19 08:58:00 -
[47]
Originally by: Ashaz
Originally by: Jane Spondogolo
Originally by: Stellar Vix MWDing SniperRokh > MWDing Blaterthorn
MWD snipers.........
Hmm. I'll be polite and call that 'unique'.
Why so? If you fit for fighting at range. Fit to stay at range. *shrug* People will come at you with WMDs, so you'll need one to keep them away.
I have flown a speed fit 'sniper blaster Rokh'. It works ok, but once you get more than one opponent on you, you're usually toast, as you can keep one guy away, but it's hard to keep two off of you, given how slow the Rokh is to change direction.
Because I said so...
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d026
THE LEGION OF STEEL WARRIORS.... R0ADKILL
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Posted - 2007.06.19 09:00:00 -
[48]
Edited by: d026 on 19/06/2007 08:59:24
Originally by: Ashaz
Originally by: Jane Spondogolo
Originally by: Stellar Vix MWDing SniperRokh > MWDing Blaterthorn
MWD snipers.........
Hmm. I'll be polite and call that 'unique'.
Why so? If you fit for fighting at range. Fit to stay at range. *shrug* People will come at you with WMDs, so you'll need one to keep them away.
if you snipe you dont have much of a tank! so if you getat attaked you dont usualy mwd away but you warp:9
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murder one
Gallente Death of Virtue Vigilance Infinitas
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Posted - 2007.06.19 09:02:00 -
[49]
Originally by: kliop Edited by: kliop on 19/06/2007 08:18:57 i have only one thing to say
Originally by: murder one
Originally by: Vdub2002 so.... im all for the cpu bonus and crap, but me being gallente, only went caldari for manticore, for the 3rd launcher... so um... now that ALL the sb's have 3 launchers, WTF is manticore going to be better at? being a big ugly target?
=_=
Buhu?
cry me a river! u want blasterthrons to allways obliterate their target?...whatever cryboy i mean here u are teasing someone else when he points out that a ship that will have the same role for each race will be in every aspect worse then the other races...and u cry cause u blasterthron might loose some battles? u are
What does the above have to do with anything in this thread? The Manticore was horribly overpowered compared to the rest of the Stealth Bombers, and now it's the same/slightly (very slightly) worse. If anything, the Manticore was buffed with all the new changes, and the other SBs were simply buffed just a little bit extra.
I'm not wanting a Blasterthron to 'win every time'. I want it to work in it's intended envelope: ultra short range combat. Right now it can't do that, much less anything else.
Because I said so...
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Karanth
Gallente Cirrius Technologies O X I D E
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Posted - 2007.06.19 09:04:00 -
[50]
I find that it hurts to think about blasterthrons, and their place, until one considers that a blasterthron is a CoDzilla in a different form, and then, it makes total sense.
Free beer for those who mod my sig!
There is only one sig hijack that matters, the orginal and only member of the hijack squad. me. -Eris. ps Black russians are better then beer. I'll see your beer, and raise you a goat kebab -Tirg I'll take that pint and raise you two -Timmeh I bet 2 goats, 1 pint and a bag of slugs -Lordharold I grab it all, cook it/eat and drink it all and say thank you. -Pirlouit I'll call your bluff, and go all in on 3 locks of Hutch's hair. -Incognus I'll see that bet, depending on where the hair came from. -Rauth *pushes the other mods out of the way* Mmmm, bree - Karass Bree & goat kebabs!!! I'm in!! - Yips |
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Kay Han
Caldari Friendship 7 Corporation YouWhat
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Posted - 2007.06.19 09:07:00 -
[51]
Originally by: Jin Entres Well, he has some points. Less damage versus better tanks. It's a problem for all blaster ships. It's increasingly difficult to reach and stay in blaster range with speed setups more common.
The biggest problem, however, in my opinion is cap usage. Not only is cap more under attack by nos, but the increased length of engagements has obviously also increased the amount of time needed to run guns, tackling, propulsion and tank. Blasterships were already weak in this regard, relying on killing their opponents before cap death.
7 Ion II's consume 25.6 cap/s* which equals roughly 2+ heavy nos on you constantly. Megathron with maxed cap skills and MWD fitted has a peak recharge (2.4x modifier) of 14.6 cap/s. That is, it can't even sustain the guns, much less anything else. A T2 heavy injector provides 57 cap/s, so after guns there is 46 cap/s. LAR II is 35.5, scrambler and web are about 5 total, and all other modules such as hardeners and damage control are maybe 3 more, which puts the capacitor status at about +2 cap/s.
That means both A. that there is practically zero margin for being nossed to sustain it and B. that MWD's usage is drained from max cap, which usually means that it's used to get in range, bringing the cap down near the 30-40% peak spot.
And that's with just one repper. Considering battleships that use weapon systems that do not require cap (Typhoon, Tempest, Maelstrom, Dominix (mostly), Raven) can do competitive damage while tanking considerably better and even having better range and better fitting options, even utility slots for nos with guns, I would definitely argue that blasterthrons and hypes are disadvantaged.
I don't want them to be buffed hugely, but I would appreciate it if the cap issue was addressed.
* With: 2 MFS II 3% RoF Hardwiring Gunnery V Rapid Firing V Controlled Bursts IV
thats pretty much the point and it aplies to all gallente blasterships.
The mega needs some caplove. Reduced cap needs on blasters or overall more cap.
anyways this is a very nice thread. Some valid points here and a good OP.
P.s. the deimos still needs a Huge potion of love  ___________________________________________ A wise man said once: 'Violence is the escape of the mentaly poor guys.'
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murder one
Gallente Death of Virtue Vigilance Infinitas
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Posted - 2007.06.19 09:12:00 -
[52]
Originally by: E Vile Edited by: E Vile on 19/06/2007 08:09:52 Sorry, but you are completely full of it.
No Tier 3 BS is "Cheap and easy" to fit. No way. All Tier 3 BS are far more expensive and AT LEAST just as skill intensive to fly correctly.
Amarr are FAR from worthless. The abaddon and geddon can be very effective with PROPER SKILLS, and SMART PLAY.
This game has so many whiners. Reminds me of the people that ruined Star Wars Galaxies.
I can fit a Hype or Maelstrom or Rokh using all T2 modules, with no faction mods required. The Maelstrom and Rokh I can fit with modules that are *way* cheaper than what I need to use to fit my Hype or Mega.
That is the definition of cheap and easy. I have never had any fitting problems with the Rokh or Maelstrom. That's the definition of 'easy'.
Ships that don't take that many SP to fly well: Rokh, Domi, Phoon (Phoon takes a little more to fly well than the other two). All are Nos boats, all fits use missiles and and nos or drones and nos. No guns, no gunnery SP required.
This isn't speculation. This is direct first hand experience. Right now I'm finishing out large blaster spec to 5, just for that extra 2% DPS. Maybe it will help.
The faction ammo available from the LP stores might be just the thing needed to revive the Blasterthron. Using Void really hurts it.
Because I said so...
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Voculus
E X O D U S Imperial Republic Of the North
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Posted - 2007.06.19 09:20:00 -
[53]
If you think blaster Megas suck, you should try flying a Tempest! _________________________________________________________
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AlphaM
Doom Guard FREGE Alliance
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Posted - 2007.06.19 09:23:00 -
[54]
i can kinda see your point
My T2 thron (20+mil sp) would kill a complete nub in a raven, when that raven hits 10mil sp it becomes a coin toss,
I havnt used my thron for a while as,
A it didnt seem like a great pay off in performance compared to time and isk invested, B domi out performs it in gang fights C A month training a raven gives me a all purpous pvp/pve ship.
It looks cool tho, and those that can invest the time and isk into it can make kick ass vids :) |

murder one
Gallente Death of Virtue Vigilance Infinitas
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Posted - 2007.06.19 09:33:00 -
[55]
Edited by: murder one on 19/06/2007 09:32:23
Originally by: Voculus If you think blaster Megas suck, you should try flying a Tempest!
Don't I know it. That's why I fly a Phoon with a big fat dual rep armor tank (Omni tank, with plenty of EANM T2s).
Because I said so...
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Horus Dark
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Posted - 2007.06.19 09:34:00 -
[56]
if you think a mega needs cap love try flying a abaddon.
I am sorry...but the mega rocks. It might have some small issues...but they are in no way as big as a ton of otherships out there.
Its so funny to see your spoiled gallentre complain about a perfectly decent ships.
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Vyktor Abyss
The Abyss Corporation
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Posted - 2007.06.19 09:52:00 -
[57]
Rock, Paper, Scissors.
The Blasterthron is Scissors. Though unfortunately these days noone flies paper.
- Ideas are my business...maybe thats why I'm always skint! Please read my ideas |

Siigari Kitawa
Gallente The Aduro Protocol
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Posted - 2007.06.19 09:52:00 -
[58]
Man, I'm going to have to make an anti-eve forum flamers signature or something. Seriously, half the posts I read anymore are flames.
To the OP: YES. I agree. All the blasterthron pilot has been hit with the past year is NERF NERF NERF NERF. There was one boost to it- the Neutron Blasters got a cap usage reduction, then everything after that just made them difficult to use. It makes me sad too. It seems that unfortunately CCP has been trying to hard to balance the game that they have wound up making severe cuts to ships that are highly efficient to try and make those that are less efficient "work." And that's not fair.
Balancing a game is difficult. Real life is not balanced. A game CAN be balanced, but it it's own ways. I still fear (sometimes) Amarr ships for instance. They are straight amazing. In the hands of a pilot that knows what they're doing, they're devastating. But the simple fact remains that if you don't know what you're doing (aka you don't have the skills), don't fly it. I'm tired of seeing CCP pandering to the player that wants to fly everything perfectly with level 4 skills. Did you take the time to train to level 5? No? Then deal with your crap skills.
Sheesh. :(
_________________ Burn. |

Kehmor
Caldari The Movement
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Posted - 2007.06.19 10:00:00 -
[59]
I'll fly the blasterthron no matter what but ye, buff it!
The Movement is recruiting! |

Siigari Kitawa
Gallente The Aduro Protocol
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Posted - 2007.06.19 10:10:00 -
[60]
Originally by: Kehmor I'll fly the blasterthron no matter what but ye, buff it!
And we lub you for it <3
_________________ Burn. |
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Na'Kunni
Amarr Null Horizon
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Posted - 2007.06.19 10:14:00 -
[61]
Originally by: murder one Blasterthrons are an all-or-nothing ship. You either crush your target or get completely destroyed. There is no turning back. There are no options once you engage. You are fully commited. Every time.
Blasterthrons are quickly becoming a rarity in PVP due to the skills required to fly them (both in skillpoints and pilot experience) and the cost to operate one effectively.
The 25% HP increase and the 20% damage reduction to T2 short range ammo, in addition to the huge (-50%) tracking nerf to short range T2 ammo in Rev1 was a massive blow to the effectiveness of the Blasterthron. Once rigs were introduced that increased active tanks by another 35% or more, the margin with which a Blasterthron could overcome a single target's tank has been reduced to almost zero.
Blasterthrons need maxed out skills in order to get that last 10-15% DPS increase in order to compete with the tremendous tanking increases brought about by rigs and the Tier 3 battleships. It's quite easy to build a Rokh or Maelstrom or Dominx, or even a Typhoon with relatively little ISK and less than maximum skills that is competitive with other battleship setups in PVP. With the Blasterthron (and also the Blaster Hype), if you don't have every applicable skill to five, you're probably going to die in a 1v1 fight with another BS if it's properly fit for PVP.
Now that the T2 EANMs have been increased to 36 CPU per module, Blasterthron pilots will have to resort to faction modules and a 5% CPU reduction implant (requireing Cybernetics 5- another skill required to be maxed), just to get a basic fit. Nothing spectacular and overwhelmingly effective, just an entry level setup.
So what do the rest of you think? Is this a good thing? Should flying a Blasterthron be reserved for only the best and most expert pilots in Eve? Or should it be more accessible for use to those with less than perfect skills and a smaller bank roll?
For me, adding an extra 160 million ISK to the cost of my setup, a full 80% increase in cost over my previous setup, just to fly a Blasterthron won't really make that much of a difference. I'll continue to fly it just because I can't stomach flying anything else.
I can fly Minmatar, Caldari and Gallente BS with equal effectiveness (I won't touch Amarr, as they're completely worthless, with the EANM change just making it worse), but I'm sticking with my Blasterthron. It just doesn't feel right defeating my targets with a battleship fit with more nos than guns. Or all nos and torp launchers. There just isn't any skill or style in it.
So I guess in the end, CCP's efforts to remove the Blasterthron from the playing field is a good thing. Those who fly one, and do it well, will be held in high regard, as an esteemed elite, a select few to be held in awe by the common low rank PVP pilots flying second rate nos ships.
Cheers CCP. Keep the nerfs coming. Pretty soon no one will be flying anything that doesn't use nos or capless weapons, and no one will ever undock unless they have at least a four man gang for backup. Looks like a bright future.
I totally disagree with you jsut for the fact, that Gallente are the best race for PvP and NOW you want to boost your race even more? Seriously something wrong there if anything "imo" Gallente should get nerfed, NOS+Drone's usually end up in WIN, an Gallente can do both.
Train your "Blasterthron" skills to max, an maybe you can be "elite" too. And post on the forum at how great it is??
(No intention to flame at you, just saying it how it is)
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d026
THE LEGION OF STEEL WARRIORS.... R0ADKILL
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Posted - 2007.06.19 10:16:00 -
[62]
Edited by: d026 on 19/06/2007 10:15:37
Quote: stuff about mega beeing diffiult to use and underpowered
i rly dont get your whine. the mega is balanced as hell, there is no other t2 bs that performs so well.
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Aakron
Infinitus Odium
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Posted - 2007.06.19 10:44:00 -
[63]
Just bring 2x blasterthrons against the 1 target. Welcome to eve 2k7 ---
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Sir Dancealot
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Posted - 2007.06.19 10:54:00 -
[64]
Originally by: d026 it can tank + gank + tackle + use ew + use 5 heavy drones
wat? ew? Thatd be in the imaginary extra mid-slots we all dream of. Not to mention the extra cpu 
Originally by: Incantare
Thread does not deliver. I was expecting a story, funny, surprising or otherwise interesting. Instead I got to read Kehmor's smacking. Awesome.
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kliop
Wisdom Seekers
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Posted - 2007.06.19 11:00:00 -
[65]
Originally by: murder one
Originally by: kliop Edited by: kliop on 19/06/2007 08:18:57 i have only one thing to say
Originally by: murder one
Originally by: Vdub2002 so.... im all for the cpu bonus and crap, but me being gallente, only went caldari for manticore, for the 3rd launcher... so um... now that ALL the sb's have 3 launchers, WTF is manticore going to be better at? being a big ugly target?
=_=
Buhu?
cry me a river! u want blasterthrons to allways obliterate their target?...whatever cryboy i mean here u are teasing someone else when he points out that a ship that will have the same role for each race will be in every aspect worse then the other races...and u cry cause u blasterthron might loose some battles? u are
What does the above have to do with anything in this thread? The Manticore was horribly overpowered compared to the rest of the Stealth Bombers, and now it's the same/slightly (very slightly) worse. If anything, the Manticore was buffed with all the new changes, and the other SBs were simply buffed just a little bit extra.
I'm not wanting a Blasterthron to 'win every time'. I want it to work in it's intended envelope: ultra short range combat. Right now it can't do that, much less anything else.
it has to do everthing with it... he says that the manticore is worse in every aspect to the other sb now...and u say he is a crybaby...i say ur ship doesnt win every occasion...and u whine...so u are a cry baby...so BUHU!
see it is very easy to be like that i was hoping that if someone does to u that s*** u do u might think twice next tme...anyway not to derail ur thread..
the blasterthron already does the highest dmg afaik ... and like most things i find it balanced as it is...or if not balanced ppl are acustomed to it...as for the 1vs1...if nos was involved...well every ship gets F***** by nos...otherwise i would have thought the mega would win...and if u say about the rigs and how the other ships can tank better with them...y not do the same...it should give ur tank enough time to kill his... -------------------------------- hello o/ |

Patch86
Di-Tron Heavy Industries Atlas Alliance
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Posted - 2007.06.19 11:02:00 -
[66]
I'm not sure the OP really has it right.
But Blaster ships are definitely in need of some love atm. Basically, they need to tank long enough to crawl all the way in to range, they need speed modules, and they need enough gank left so that when they get there, they can finish them off quickly (seeing as the battle has already been raging for nearly a minute by the time they get in to range).
That makes them just about the only ship in existence that requires all 3 major disciplines- its not a gank ship, not a tank ship, not a speed ship- it's ALL of these. And there simply isn't enough fittings to do it well. Combine this with how ridiculously easy it is to counter a Blaster ship (one webber and he's done for) and it just isn't very viable. --------
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Dawson
Caldari FATAL REVELATIONS FATAL Alliance
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Posted - 2007.06.19 11:05:00 -
[67]
what do you expect its a tier 1 BS. nuff said.
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James Duar
Merch Industrial We Are Nice Guys
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Posted - 2007.06.19 11:22:00 -
[68]
Originally by: Dawson what do you expect its a tier 1 BS. nuff said.
It's a tier 2 BS.
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hUssmann
Caldari Veto. Veto Corp
|
Posted - 2007.06.19 11:31:00 -
[69]
Edited by: hUssmann on 19/06/2007 11:30:26
Originally by: Tonkin the domi with its ubber nos
Domi gets a bonus to nos? Funnily enough a heavy nos drains the same amount coming from a domi than from anything but a bhaalgorn.
Originally by: Tonkin 2 of the best hacs
Oh my god. 
Tried fitting an ishtar lately? I'm not a big fan of small guns on my cruiser.
Ginger Magician > You are merely an effective ganker of haulers who runs at the first sign of combat. |

Drykor
Minmatar Celtic Anarchy Anarchy Empire
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Posted - 2007.06.19 11:33:00 -
[70]
Edited by: Drykor on 19/06/2007 11:31:48 Gallente don't really need to be even better in pvp. That having said, NOS is overpowered at the moment. But if you remove it, blasterships will be even better in pvp and they will become the new flavour of the month. Nerf NOS (only fit in utility slots or something) and maybe nerf blasterships slightly afterwards.
Edit: Oh and introduce tracking for NOS.
|
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murder one
Gallente Death of Virtue Vigilance Infinitas
|
Posted - 2007.06.19 11:34:00 -
[71]
Originally by: kliop
Originally by: murder one
Originally by: kliop Edited by: kliop on 19/06/2007 08:18:57 i have only one thing to say
Originally by: murder one
Originally by: Vdub2002 so.... im all for the cpu bonus and crap, but me being gallente, only went caldari for manticore, for the 3rd launcher... so um... now that ALL the sb's have 3 launchers, WTF is manticore going to be better at? being a big ugly target?
=_=
Buhu?
cry me a river! u want blasterthrons to allways obliterate their target?...whatever cryboy i mean here u are teasing someone else when he points out that a ship that will have the same role for each race will be in every aspect worse then the other races...and u cry cause u blasterthron might loose some battles? u are
What does the above have to do with anything in this thread? The Manticore was horribly overpowered compared to the rest of the Stealth Bombers, and now it's the same/slightly (very slightly) worse. If anything, the Manticore was buffed with all the new changes, and the other SBs were simply buffed just a little bit extra.
I'm not wanting a Blasterthron to 'win every time'. I want it to work in it's intended envelope: ultra short range combat. Right now it can't do that, much less anything else.
it has to do everthing with it... he says that the manticore is worse in every aspect to the other sb now...and u say he is a crybaby...i say ur ship doesnt win every occasion...and u whine...so u are a cry baby...so BUHU!
see it is very easy to be like that i was hoping that if someone does to u that s*** u do u might think twice next tme...anyway not to derail ur thread..
the blasterthron already does the highest dmg afaik ... and like most things i find it balanced as it is...or if not balanced ppl are acustomed to it...as for the 1vs1...if nos was involved...well every ship gets F***** by nos...otherwise i would have thought the mega would win...and if u say about the rigs and how the other ships can tank better with them...y not do the same...it should give ur tank enough time to kill his...
Indeed, you have everything exactly wrong. The Manticore was horribly overpowered (I guess I have to keep repeating myself, as you're too stupid to comprehend what I say) and the other bombers were improved to match it. The idiot whines that his bomber is no longer 50% more powerful than all the rest, even though the Manticore still does a great job.
This has nothing to do with what I'm talking about. If it were comparable, it would be like the Manticore's DPS being reduced so much that it could never kill anything before it was killed itself. Now *that* would be a similar comparison.
I don't want the Blasterthron to win every time. I just want it to be good at it's specified role. CCP's changes to ammo, HP, DPS, rigs etc. have made the Blasterthron ineffective. It can no longer kill a target decisively once it gets into range.
And there is no amount of tanking that will solve the problem for blaster ships. Once you're out of cap, you're dead. The only answer is to kill as fast as possible. It's like you guys don't even fly Blasterthrons or something. You appear to not know WTF you're talking about.
Come to think of it, I guess you don't, since you obviously don't fly them. Maybe you shouldn't speak on subjects you know nothing about.
Because I said so...
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Siigari Kitawa
Gallente The Aduro Protocol
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Posted - 2007.06.19 11:34:00 -
[72]
Originally by: James Duar
Originally by: Dawson what do you expect its a tier 1 BS. nuff said.
It's a tier 2 BS.
lmao owned.
_________________ Burn. |

murder one
Gallente Death of Virtue Vigilance Infinitas
|
Posted - 2007.06.19 11:38:00 -
[73]
Originally by: hUssmann Edited by: hUssmann on 19/06/2007 11:30:26
Originally by: Tonkin the domi with its ubber nos
Domi gets a bonus to nos? Funnily enough a heavy nos drains the same amount coming from a domi than from anything but a bhaalgorn.
Originally by: Tonkin 2 of the best hacs
Oh my god. 
Tried fitting an ishtar lately? I'm not a big fan of small guns on my cruiser.
Me either.
What is even more amusing is that the Abaddon/Rokh/Maelstrom can all fit **way** more Nos than the Domi can, because they have the grid/CPU. You can easily fit 4x heavy nos and 4x guns (or launchers in the case of the Rokh), while the Domi is left fitting 2x heavy nos, and 4x medium nos at the most.
I guess me and you hUss are the only two guys on the forum who get it. 
Because I said so...
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murder one
Gallente Death of Virtue Vigilance Infinitas
|
Posted - 2007.06.19 11:38:00 -
[74]
Originally by: Siigari Kitawa
Originally by: James Duar
Originally by: Dawson what do you expect its a tier 1 BS. nuff said.
It's a tier 2 BS.
lmao owned.
X3 
Because I said so...
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hUssmann
Caldari Veto. Veto Corp
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Posted - 2007.06.19 11:41:00 -
[75]
Originally by: murder one
I guess me and you hUss are the only two guys on the forum who get it.
Would you like to snuggle in my hanger?   
Ginger Magician > You are merely an effective ganker of haulers who runs at the first sign of combat. |

murder one
Gallente Death of Virtue Vigilance Infinitas
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Posted - 2007.06.19 11:44:00 -
[76]
Originally by: hUssmann
Originally by: murder one
I guess me and you hUss are the only two guys on the forum who get it.
Would you like to snuggle in my hanger?   
lol! 
I'm training my EM armor comp skill to 5 in protest of the EANM nerf. \o/ 
Because I said so...
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Celestal
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Posted - 2007.06.19 11:57:00 -
[77]
NOS is changed as of today ( well when the patch is completed ) so this thread is pointless and a total waste of time.
So , why not wait for the patch , evaluate combat with the nos changes then have a ship discussion that is actually relevant ?
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hUssmann
Caldari Veto. Veto Corp
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Posted - 2007.06.19 11:59:00 -
[78]
Originally by: murder one
Originally by: hUssmann
Originally by: murder one
I guess me and you hUss are the only two guys on the forum who get it.
Would you like to snuggle in my hanger?   
lol! 
I'm training my EM armor comp skill to 5 in protest of the EANM nerf. \o/ 
I only trained it to 5 to irritate amarr 
Ginger Magician > You are merely an effective ganker of haulers who runs at the first sign of combat. |

Ja'kar
Vendetta Underground
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Posted - 2007.06.19 12:05:00 -
[79]
I think if you'd have specialized in just Gallente instead of spreading it about with at least another 2 races you'd feel a little bit better about them.
cross training so very easy when you have high sp it really don't make a difference to using a ship I can fly the same 3 races and 2 of em at lvl 5 and gal will soon be trained to lvl 5 bs - cos all my other 'base' skills work with other ships and starting with min gave me a good start as I had to train guns/missiles, so with a few extra skill u r just as good in any of the three race ships.
I just got a hyper so cannot comment on it, but I will say cap is a real issue
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Akkarin Pagan
Minmatar Raddick Explorations Executive Outcomes
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Posted - 2007.06.19 12:11:00 -
[80]
I have actually flown a blasterthron, (not very well and my skills are quite average for it) and it was fun. I did have huge problems with fitting though, and although the huge DPS was nice I stil couldn't kill off the super tanked Tempest before his 2 mates in Ravens turned up to finish me off.
It does appear that blaster setups are having the same issues as arty snipers these days. Before the HP boost an alpha strike off an Arty Tempest was something to be feared, but now it's no where near as scary because of the incresaed buffer you have against it and the hideous cycle time of arty means you have time to escape.
Maybe an increase to blaster dps is the answer (an increase to arty dps at teh same time would be nice too )
Akkarin Hopefully the mods won't play with this one
<3 - Immy
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kliop
Wisdom Seekers
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Posted - 2007.06.19 12:16:00 -
[81]
Edited by: kliop on 19/06/2007 12:16:53
Originally by: murder one
Originally by: kliop
Originally by: murder one
Originally by: kliop Edited by: kliop on 19/06/2007 08:18:57 i have only one thing to say
Originally by: murder one
Originally by: Vdub2002 so.... im all for the cpu bonus and crap, but me being gallente, only went caldari for manticore, for the 3rd launcher... so um... now that ALL the sb's have 3 launchers, WTF is manticore going to be better at? being a big ugly target?
=_=
Buhu?
cry me a river! u want blasterthrons to allways obliterate their target?...whatever cryboy i mean here u are teasing someone else when he points out that a ship that will have the same role for each race will be in every aspect worse then the other races...and u cry cause u blasterthron might loose some battles? u are
What does the above have to do with anything in this thread? The Manticore was horribly overpowered compared to the rest of the Stealth Bombers, and now it's the same/slightly (very slightly) worse. If anything, the Manticore was buffed with all the new changes, and the other SBs were simply buffed just a little bit extra.
I'm not wanting a Blasterthron to 'win every time'. I want it to work in it's intended envelope: ultra short range combat. Right now it can't do that, much less anything else.
it has to do everthing with it... he says that the manticore is worse in every aspect to the other sb now...and u say he is a crybaby...i say ur ship doesnt win every occasion...and u whine...so u are a cry baby...so BUHU!
see it is very easy to be like that i was hoping that if someone does to u that s*** u do u might think twice next tme...anyway not to derail ur thread..
the blasterthron already does the highest dmg afaik ... and like most things i find it balanced as it is...or if not balanced ppl are acustomed to it...as for the 1vs1...if nos was involved...well every ship gets F***** by nos...otherwise i would have thought the mega would win...and if u say about the rigs and how the other ships can tank better with them...y not do the same...it should give ur tank enough time to kill his...
Indeed, you have everything exactly wrong. The Manticore was horribly overpowered (I guess I have to keep repeating myself, as you're too stupid to comprehend what I say) and the other bombers were improved to match it. The idiot whines that his bomber is no longer 50% more powerful than all the rest, even though the Manticore still does a great job.
This has nothing to do with what I'm talking about. If it were comparable, it would be like the Manticore's DPS being reduced so much that it could never kill anything before it was killed itself. Now *that* would be a similar comparison.
I don't want the Blasterthron to win every time. I just want it to be good at it's specified role. CCP's changes to ammo, HP, DPS, rigs etc. have made the Blasterthron ineffective. It can no longer kill a target decisively once it gets into range.
And there is no amount of tanking that will solve the problem for blaster ships. Once you're out of cap, you're dead. The only answer is to kill as fast as possible. It's like you guys don't even fly Blasterthrons or something. You appear to not know WTF you're talking about.
Come to think of it, I guess you don't, since you obviously don't fly them. Maybe you shouldn't speak on subjects you know nothing about.
someone would have to be stupid to say that cause something might have been or not overpowered it now has to be worse then the rest...anyway gallente are fine as it is..specially the bs of them... any more dmg and u guys will outdamge the other races bs (no matter the dmg kind) without u wearing any dmg mods and them wearing..which is wrong..u pay with fittings for ur dmg u cant have anything EDIT am done with bumping that useless thread anymore...cause i dont think the blasterthrn need anything more if it isnt the solowtfpwnmobile... -------------------------------- hello o/ |

Patch86
Di-Tron Heavy Industries Atlas Alliance
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Posted - 2007.06.19 12:19:00 -
[82]
Originally by: hUssmann
Originally by: Tonkin 2 of the best hacs
Oh my god. 
Tried fitting an ishtar lately? I'm not a big fan of small guns on my cruiser.
Lol, Ishtar?! Forget the Ishtar- what about the poor Deimos?! IMO a likely contender for the worst HAC in the game!
Oh, and it's a blaster one too, so it fits in with this topic well  --------
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Vasiliyan
The Flying Swan
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Posted - 2007.06.19 12:19:00 -
[83]
Every now and again I dip my toe into blasterships, and every time I die badly, with no cap. Even at 20m SP it doesn't seem worth it.
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Siigari Kitawa
Gallente The Aduro Protocol
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Posted - 2007.06.19 12:26:00 -
[84]
Originally by: Celestal NOS is changed as of today ( well when the patch is completed ) so this thread is pointless and a total waste of time.
So , why not wait for the patch , evaluate combat with the nos changes then have a ship discussion that is actually relevant ?
Yep, NOS is changed a lot. I agree. *nods*
# Small meta and t2 nosferatu's also get a range bonus now, like the medium and heavy ones. # Small Nosferatu II drain amount decreased to 9.6 and range decreased to 5500 meters.
_________________ Burn. |

Janu Hull
Caldari Order of Z Industries
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Posted - 2007.06.19 12:27:00 -
[85]
Originally by: murder one
Originally by: E Vile Edited by: E Vile on 19/06/2007 08:09:52 Sorry, but you are completely full of it.
No Tier 3 BS is "Cheap and easy" to fit. No way. All Tier 3 BS are far more expensive and AT LEAST just as skill intensive to fly correctly.
Amarr are FAR from worthless. The abaddon and geddon can be very effective with PROPER SKILLS, and SMART PLAY.
This game has so many whiners. Reminds me of the people that ruined Star Wars Galaxies.
I can fit a Hype or Maelstrom or Rokh using all T2 modules, with no faction mods required. The Maelstrom and Rokh I can fit with modules that are *way* cheaper than what I need to use to fit my Hype or Mega.
That is the definition of cheap and easy. I have never had any fitting problems with the Rokh or Maelstrom. That's the definition of 'easy'.
Ships that don't take that many SP to fly well: Rokh, Domi, Phoon (Phoon takes a little more to fly well than the other two). All are Nos boats, all fits use missiles and and nos or drones and nos. No guns, no gunnery SP required.
This isn't speculation. This is direct first hand experience. Right now I'm finishing out large blaster spec to 5, just for that extra 2% DPS. Maybe it will help.
The faction ammo available from the LP stores might be just the thing needed to revive the Blasterthron. Using Void really hurts it.
A Rokh may not need many skills to fly in a fleet, but try flying it anywhere BUT a fleet. Those things are hurting in tight battles under 30km, unless you're flying a half-assed Dominix fit with massive NOS and T2 drones.
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Patch86
Di-Tron Heavy Industries Atlas Alliance
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Posted - 2007.06.19 12:29:00 -
[86]
Originally by: Siigari Kitawa
Originally by: Celestal NOS is changed as of today ( well when the patch is completed ) so this thread is pointless and a total waste of time.
So , why not wait for the patch , evaluate combat with the nos changes then have a ship discussion that is actually relevant ?
Yep, NOS is changed a lot. I agree. *nods*
# Small meta and t2 nosferatu's also get a range bonus now, like the medium and heavy ones. # Small Nosferatu II drain amount decreased to 9.6 and range decreased to 5500 meters.
Lol. That deserves a "pwn'd" I think   --------
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LUH 3471
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Posted - 2007.06.19 12:31:00 -
[87]
ccp it is most embarrissing that u still havent fixed nos and that u have nerfed eanms in an attempt to boost amarr. regarding that matter u have completly ignored the major of the community. instead u bring us worthless things like eve voice. how much percent of the players are actually using it ?? it is indeed a slap into the face of your own community and an insult to our intelligence. change focus,ccp , to the community. that is where the cash is. dont be foolish. now replace that complete utter (...), who has been in charge of balancing. k thx bye 
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Dano Katiria
adeptus gattacus Praesidium Libertatis
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Posted - 2007.06.19 12:35:00 -
[88]
i love blaster ships, they are the most fun in the game imo. But they do have serious issues, i u want the gank to kill anything u have to rid yourself of the tank require to even get into range.
In theory a 120mil t2 ship, deimos, should be able to kill a 40mill bc, (drake). But even with 5neutron blasters, 3 damage mods and 2 t2 weapon dps rigs i could not even get a drake past 30% sheild, with my friend tanking, this is with t2 weapons/drones/mods and once he started to attack me i melted.
The same is applicable to the brutix and the mega. Imo the most fun ships in the game, now useless unless u have 50mil sp,
Blasters could do with a little dps improvement, and nos could do with a FAT nerf. I have rather good skills with drones, t2 heavies. And the domi with bs5 is almost unbeatable, just because of Nos. I lol at blasterthron pilots attacking my domi, because they will be out of cap before they get me into armour. NOS NEEDS A NERF Being nice is for ugly people - Falazi |

John Blackthorn
Foundation R0ADKILL
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Posted - 2007.06.19 12:42:00 -
[89]
Most all races can make a simular plea that there ship is gimped compaired to another. Such as Ammar have cap issues and only 3 mids to work with. And Caldari can have a shield tank but in order to match the resits of an armor tanker they have use up all there mids + use more cap. (except passive tankers which have to rely on amount of shields and not nessary resists).
While I have mostly flew caldari in the past I found out they were very good npc'ers but when it came to pvp I was disapointed because I'd ether be able to tank by using up my mids, or I could tank less and throw in a scrambler or a dampner.. etc etc. It's all about balance. A caldari raven pilot should just accept that they can't tank and participate in alot of e/w at the same time (web/scrm/disruptor/dampen).
As a blasterthon perhaps you should look for other ways to solve the issue.. perhaps you should just drop the mwd and go all tank with cap injectors. You have to relay others to put you into postion on a target enemy when landing from warp etc etc.
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NightmareX
Caldari Infinitus Odium
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Posted - 2007.06.19 13:04:00 -
[90]
Originally by: Voculus If you think blaster Megas suck, you should try flying a Tempest!
Ehm, Tempest is still a very nice ship. But ofc, you need a **** load of gunnery skills etc to be able to use it good, but not sure if you have any good skills to use a Tempest any good.
Like me, i just need to skill up 2 more skills from level 4 to level 5, then i have maxed all of my skills to a Tempest / Machariel .
Infinitus Odium - We Are The Bringers Of Hatred |
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Caios
Caldari Unified Refining Federation Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2007.06.19 13:12:00 -
[91]
Originally by: Tonkin am i reading this right someone wants gallente boosted!!!
they have the best drones one of the best snipers, the domi with its ubber nos, best carrier, best mothership, 2 of the best hacs and the best crusier
so come again?
Most players will never touch the capitals, last I checked the rupture was minmatar , and not all of us want to be stuck with drone boats.
Blaster setups that really rely on killing speed have taken a hit with the hit point boost. Hopefully heat will give them the slightest of boosts and get people to actually put guns on their ships.
Droneboats really need to be weened away from nos, yes, but there's nothing fundamentally imbalanced about drones themselves.
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LUH 3471
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Posted - 2007.06.19 14:09:00 -
[92]
wts brain 
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d026
THE LEGION OF STEEL WARRIORS.... R0ADKILL
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Posted - 2007.06.19 14:11:00 -
[93]
Originally by: John Blackthorn Most all races can make a simular plea that there ship is gimped compaired to another. Such as Ammar have cap issues and only 3 mids to work with. And Caldari can have a shield tank but in order to match the resits of an armor tanker they have use up all there mids + use more cap. (except passive tankers which have to rely on amount of shields and not nessary resists).
While I have mostly flew caldari in the past I found out they were very good npc'ers but when it came to pvp I was disapointed because I'd ether be able to tank by using up my mids, or I could tank less and throw in a scrambler or a dampner.. etc etc. It's all about balance. A caldari raven pilot should just accept that they can't tank and participate in alot of e/w at the same time (web/scrm/disruptor/dampen).
As a blasterthon perhaps you should look for other ways to solve the issue.. perhaps you should just drop the mwd and go all tank with cap injectors. You have to relay others to put you into postion on a target enemy when landing from warp etc etc.
signed, you should try to use a different setup, a fully plated or dual lar mega is such a pain in the ass..
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Hellspawn01
Amarr Falcon Advanced Industries
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Posted - 2007.06.19 14:13:00 -
[94]
Mega has its role even when its dying when trying, but it has its role. If you cant properly fit your mega and then whine about it, you suck. If you know how to fit it and smile after a kill, you¦re elite. I dont see your problem.
Ship lovers click here |

Dawson
Caldari FATAL REVELATIONS FATAL Alliance
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Posted - 2007.06.19 15:22:00 -
[95]
Originally by: Siigari Kitawa
Originally by: James Duar
Originally by: Dawson what do you expect its a tier 1 BS. nuff said.
It's a tier 2 BS.
lmao owned.
is it really? I thought Armageddon was tier 1, Apocalypse tier 2, Abaddon tier 3.
intact i'm sure of it, not that I can check in game at the moment.
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Audri Fisher
Caldari VentureCorp Imperial Republic Of the North
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Posted - 2007.06.19 15:24:00 -
[96]
Originally by: Jin Entres Well, he has some points. Less damage versus better tanks. It's a problem for all blaster ships. It's increasingly difficult to reach and stay in blaster range with speed setups more common.
The biggest problem, however, in my opinion is cap usage. Not only is cap more under attack by nos, but the increased length of engagements has obviously also increased the amount of time needed to run guns, tackling, propulsion and tank. Blasterships were already weak in this regard, relying on killing their opponents before cap death.
7 Ion II's consume 25.6 cap/s* which equals roughly 2+ heavy nos on you constantly. Megathron with maxed cap skills and MWD fitted has a peak recharge (2.4x modifier) of 14.6 cap/s. That is, it can't even sustain the guns, much less anything else. A T2 heavy injector provides 57 cap/s, so after guns there is 46 cap/s. LAR II is 35.5, scrambler and web are about 5 total, and all other modules such as hardeners and damage control are maybe 3 more, which puts the capacitor status at about +2 cap/s.
That means both A. that there is practically zero margin for being nossed to sustain it and B. that MWD's usage is drained from max cap, which usually means that it's used to get in range, bringing the cap down near the 30-40% peak spot.
And that's with just one repper. Considering battleships that use weapon systems that do not require cap (Typhoon, Tempest, Maelstrom, Dominix (mostly), Raven) can do competitive damage while tanking considerably better and even having better range and better fitting options, even utility slots for nos with guns, I would definitely argue that blasterthrons and hypes are disadvantaged.
I don't want them to be buffed hugely, but I would appreciate it if the cap issue was addressed.
* With: 2 MFS II 3% RoF Hardwiring Gunnery V Rapid Firing V Controlled Bursts IV
Please tell me you didn't say a torp raven has competitive damage to a blasterthron. I'm caldari specced, and I have enough sense to have controlled burst to 5, what is your excuse?
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Dawson
Caldari FATAL REVELATIONS FATAL Alliance
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Posted - 2007.06.19 15:38:00 -
[97]
Originally by: Dawson
Originally by: Siigari Kitawa
Originally by: James Duar
Originally by: Dawson what do you expect its a tier 1 BS. nuff said.
It's a tier 2 BS.
lmao owned.
is it really? I thought Armageddon was tier 1, Apocalypse tier 2, Abaddon tier 3.
intact i'm sure of it, not that I can check in game at the moment.
Quote:
Armageddon >Primary Skill required >Amarr Battleship I
defo tier 1
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Comanche Banshee
Atlas Incorporated Hydra Alliance
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Posted - 2007.06.19 15:40:00 -
[98]
Edited by: Comanche Banshee on 19/06/2007 15:39:18
Originally by: murder one Blasterthrons are quickly becoming a rarity in PVP due to the skills required to fly them (both in skillpoints and pilot experience) and the cost to operate one effectively.
--
Blasterthrons need maxed out skills in order to get that last 10-15% DPS increase in order to compete with the tremendous tanking increases brought about by rigs and the Tier 3 battleships. It's quite easy to build a Rokh or Maelstrom or Dominx, or even a Typhoon with relatively little ISK and less than maximum skills that is competitive with other battleship setups in PVP. With the Blasterthron (and also the Blaster Hype), if you don't have every applicable skill to five, you're probably going to die in a 1v1 fight with another BS if it's properly fit for PVP.
--
I can fly Minmatar, Caldari and Gallente BS with equal effectiveness (I won't touch Amarr, as they're completely worthless, with the EANM change just making it worse), but I'm sticking with my Blasterthron. It just doesn't feel right defeating my targets with a battleship fit with more nos than guns. Or all nos and torp launchers. There just isn't any skill or style in it.
--
Cheers CCP. Keep the nerfs coming. Pretty soon no one will be flying anything that doesn't use nos or capless weapons, and no one will ever undock unless they have at least a four man gang for backup. Looks like a bright future.
Oh cry me a river, I mean really dude you are complaining about a ship that is still VERY capable in PvP, and seeing that you admit you won't touch the hardest race (Amarr, which is ALL I fly btw) you don't even know what it is to struggle in PvP. Bar none the Gallente still have plenty of advantages over the other races seeing that their blasters are the still some of the hardest hitting weapon up close and their drones are second to NOBODY, you have no room to be complaining.
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Grox
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Posted - 2007.06.19 15:44:00 -
[99]
Originally by: Tonkin am i reading this right someone wants gallente boosted!!!
they have the best drones one of the best snipers, the domi with its ubber nos, best carrier, best mothership, 2 of the best hacs and the best crusier
so come again?
and the best pilots hehehehe sup tonkin,,, hope ur doing good m8 and i wish u surrounded by reds,,,because what is a warriors day with blues all around?
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hUssmann
Caldari Veto. Veto Corp
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Posted - 2007.06.19 15:48:00 -
[100]
Originally by: Dawson
Originally by: Dawson
Originally by: Siigari Kitawa
Originally by: James Duar
Originally by: Dawson what do you expect its a tier 1 BS. nuff said.
It's a tier 2 BS.
lmao owned.
is it really? I thought Armageddon was tier 1, Apocalypse tier 2, Abaddon tier 3.
intact i'm sure of it, not that I can check in game at the moment.
Quote:
Armageddon >Primary Skill required >Amarr Battleship I
defo tier 1
This is a megathron thread.
Twice in one day, not doing so well are we? 
Ginger Magician > You are merely an effective ganker of haulers who runs at the first sign of combat. |
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Xequecal
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Posted - 2007.06.19 15:49:00 -
[101]
Wait, wait. Someone is actually complaining that the MEGATHRON isn't strong enough? The best battleship in the game? Hahahahahahahahahaha.
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Bazman
Caldari Werda Fookarwii
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Posted - 2007.06.19 15:59:00 -
[102]
People flaming Murder One are mongs. For the most part, he's right. Although the problem isn't restricted to Blasterthrons, but to DPS boats in their entirity, Anything from Blasterthrons to Taranis' or Abbadon to Retribution. Pure DPS ships simply do not cut it in PVP anymore.
The problem is that tanking has been consistantly buffed with each patch and firepower has more or less remained the same, all this has promoted is the overuse of NOS. You can't break a good tank with 1k damage per second, so you need to blast the cap of your target to turn that damn tank off first. It is such a horribly boring way to fight.
Also, you'll find that the Gallente ships most people whinge about aren't the Blaster ships, but the drone ships. Arguably the biggest abusers of nos setups there are. Anyone that thinks Blasterships are overpowered needs to go and have a good long look at them again. -----
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SasRipper
DIE WITH HONOUR
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Posted - 2007.06.19 16:33:00 -
[103]
Edited by: SasRipper on 19/06/2007 16:32:47
Originally by: Bazman People flaming Murder One are mongs. For the most part, he's right. Although the problem isn't restricted to Blasterthrons, but to DPS boats in their entirity, Anything from Blasterthrons to Taranis' or Abbadon to Retribution. Pure DPS ships simply do not cut it in PVP anymore.
qft the constant hit point boosts and now with the nano pump rigs it gives tanking such an upper hand. But its always been like this take the 1600mm plate rax over the ions or even in some situtions the electron 800mm plate loses to the wrong sized plate & guns .
The fact that a bs or even bc of late can tank over 1k dps for so long screws over the btrhon espically if nos is stuck on it.
*snip* Sas has spoken this tread shall be locked. |

Vyktor Abyss
The Abyss Corporation
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Posted - 2007.06.19 16:46:00 -
[104]
Originally by: Dawson
Originally by: Dawson
Originally by: Siigari Kitawa
Originally by: James Duar
Originally by: Dawson what do you expect its a tier 1 BS. nuff said.
It's a tier 2 BS.
lmao owned.
is it really? I thought Armageddon was tier 1, Apocalypse tier 2, Abaddon tier 3.
intact i'm sure of it, not that I can check in game at the moment.
Quote:
Armageddon >Primary Skill required >Amarr Battleship I
defo tier 1
What planet are you from?
We're talking about the Megathron.
Dominix t1 Megathron t2 Hyperion t3
Get blushing some more please. 
- Ideas are my business...maybe thats why I'm always skint! Please read my ideas |

Dr Fighter
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Posted - 2007.06.19 16:49:00 -
[105]
try not soloing stuff, hav you every tryed a team of blaster thron (3+), you will realise that you infact dont need to spend a huge amount to make them good enough.
The only thing that changed wit the extra tanking was how many ships you need in an everage fight, and generally speaking the bigger ship, the bigger the support and thats what ccp were going for.. and you know what it worked for the most part.
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Pesadel0
Ordem dos Templarios Te-Ka
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Posted - 2007.06.19 16:53:00 -
[106]
Originally by: Jim McGregor
Murder one, you really need to stop posting the same things over and over again. I havent ever seen you post about something that is not gallente. Seems to me that you just want to boost your own race here.
This.
I was sworn to absolute secrecy BY CCP. |

Laboratus
Gallente BGG League of Abnormal Gentlemen
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Posted - 2007.06.19 17:00:00 -
[107]
Originally by: Bazman People flaming Murder One are mongs. For the most part, he's right. Although the problem isn't restricted to Blasterthrons, but to DPS boats in their entirity, Anything from Blasterthrons to Taranis' or Abbadon to Retribution. Pure DPS ships simply do not cut it in PVP anymore.
The problem is that tanking has been consistantly buffed with each patch and firepower has more or less remained the same, all this has promoted is the overuse of NOS. You can't break a good tank with 1k damage per second, so you need to blast the cap of your target to turn that damn tank off first. It is such a horribly boring way to fight.
Also, you'll find that the Gallente ships most people whinge about aren't the Blaster ships, but the drone ships. Arguably the biggest abusers of nos setups there are. Anyone that thinks Blasterships are overpowered needs to go and have a good long look at them again.
The man speaks the truth. ___ P.S. Post with your main. Mind control and tin hats |

Sharupak
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Posted - 2007.06.19 17:06:00 -
[108]
Hmmm,
I kinda see maybe what the OP is saying. In the begining, before Dreads, Carriers and even tech2. The Megathron was THE ship. You could go on the trade channel and people were paying rediculous sums of money to get one. It was the most feared ship in the game. I feel then it was overpowered but not by much. In contrast, Mimitar stuff with a couple of exceptions was complete junk. However, I think some changes in game mechanics and probably even more so, people experimenting with different setups and tactics made ships like the tempest competitive.
So I would agree with the reduction in dominance, but its not that bad!
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LMAAAOOOO
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Posted - 2007.06.19 17:07:00 -
[109]
I'm getting tired of Murderone's buyist (probably spelt that wrong) posts, i'm going to cease reading your pointless posts. ______________________________________________ *some guy telling a noob that pirates doesnt check their age before attacking* "ooh! an age quip! very clever,I'm probably older than you darling! xx |

Bazman
Caldari Werda Fookarwii
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Posted - 2007.06.19 17:15:00 -
[110]
Originally by: Sharupak Hmmm,
I kinda see maybe what the OP is saying. In the begining, before Dreads, Carriers and even tech2. The Megathron was THE ship. You could go on the trade channel and people were paying rediculous sums of money to get one. It was the most feared ship in the game. I feel then it was overpowered but not by much. In contrast, Mimitar stuff with a couple of exceptions was complete junk. However, I think some changes in game mechanics and probably even more so, people experimenting with different setups and tactics made ships like the tempest competitive.
So I would agree with the reduction in dominance, but its not that bad!
Its not because they were overpowered, it was because it oozed awesomeness on a scale not seen since the Prophet Awesome decended from Mt Awesome with a 6 pack in one hand and a minigun on the other :P
Blasterthrons had character at the time, only seriously mad players took a ship with such short ranged weapons to kill things, now their kinda rubbish :P People also didn't know how to counter them back then, because everyone flew gank setups until they caught onto EWAR and started abusing that. -----
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Skraeling Shortbus
Caldari Gallente Federal Bank
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Posted - 2007.06.19 17:15:00 -
[111]
Give me a drone damage highslot mod and then maybe ill consider replacing the nos in my domis highs... till then its got not enough Pg to make it worthwhile to even bother fitting guns which is why most people dont that and nos being so easy to use.
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Leonie Eisenberg
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Posted - 2007.06.19 17:18:00 -
[112]
Originally by: E Vile Edited by: E Vile on 19/06/2007 08:09:52 Sorry, but you are completely full of it.
No Tier 3 BS is "Cheap and easy" to fit. No way. All Tier 3 BS are far more expensive and AT LEAST just as skill intensive to fly correctly.
Amarr are FAR from worthless. The abaddon and geddon can be very effective with PROPER SKILLS, and SMART PLAY.
This game has so many whiners. Reminds me of the people that ruined Star Wars Galaxies.
Yes. But those 50-on-50 Jedi battles were something... Something stupid, but something none the less.
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Dawson
Caldari FATAL REVELATIONS FATAL Alliance
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Posted - 2007.06.19 17:27:00 -
[113]
Edited by: Dawson on 19/06/2007 17:29:26 Edited by: Dawson on 19/06/2007 17:26:42
Originally by: Vyktor Abyss
Originally by: Dawson
Originally by: Dawson
Originally by: Siigari Kitawa
Originally by: James Duar
Originally by: Dawson what do you expect its a tier 1 BS. nuff said.
It's a tier 2 BS.
lmao owned.
is it really? I thought Armageddon was tier 1, Apocalypse tier 2, Abaddon tier 3.
intact i'm sure of it, not that I can check in game at the moment.
Quote:
Armageddon >Primary Skill required >Amarr Battleship I
defo tier 1
What planet are you from?
We're talking about the Megathron.
Dominix t1 Megathron t2 Hyperion t3
Get blushing some more please. 
lmao that explains it, god knows what made me think it was a geddon thread  been bugging me all day, i was trying to find info on the geddon trying too work out if they changed the tier lmao its not even the right race 
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Leonie Eisenberg
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Posted - 2007.06.19 17:41:00 -
[114]
Originally by: murder one I'm not wanting a Blasterthron to 'win every time'. I want it to work in it's intended envelope: ultra short range combat. Right now it can't do that, much less anything else.
Problem is Murder One, you got it backwards. The Megathron has routinely been forced into blaster boat, but it's really a rail boat, hence the 73KM base targeting range and tracking bonuses to keep those rails on target. The HYPERION is the blaster-boat of the Gallente Navy, hence the 60KM base targeting range, the vastly superior repairing ability AND the freaking description:
Quote: Recognizing the necessity for a blaster platform to round out their high-end arsenal, the Federation Navy brought in top-level talent to work on the Hyperion. The result: one of the most lethal and versatile gunboats ever to take to the dark skies.
Special Ability: 5% large hybrid weapon damage per level 7.5% bonus to armor repair amount of armor repair systems
So, yeah, players do things because they're looking for an advantage. But just because they develop a common thread in the fantasy of what "something is" in their lore, doesn't mean they're necessarily right.
And you're complaining about a ship doesn't do what you want it to do when that's not really it's mission. Even though you, and a great number of people, have developed some "lore" about the Megathron = Blasterthron. Now you have the ship you want, it's called the "Hyperion."
Get one. They're fun. Although, I must admit, they're energy sucking pigs.
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Donathan Slade
Kay Korporation Knights Of the Southerncross
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Posted - 2007.06.19 17:45:00 -
[115]
whine whine whine, ***** ***** *****... Is that people always do? If something doesn't go your way you ***** and complain that CCP is nerfing nerfing... OMG THEY NERFING AGAIN!!!
I don't hear you complaining about the Drake, because it doesn't affect you, but if it did you would probably still be *****ing!!!
So you can't have a blasterthron!!! Get a blaster hyper which is the reason tehy were made, blasters, tank bonus.. get real and use the apropriate ship for the appropriate job. This is what CCP is balancing for. No, I don't like the EANM nef myself, especailly since nobdoy was complaining. But if you relate it to shields, they don't have a eanm equivalent for shield tanking sooo, bonus to armor tankers once again?
Quit playing if you don't like it or fly something else. Or, waste your money and watch your "elite of the elite" in SP get poped by the little tackle sniper gang that you can't shoot with their 40k scrams.
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Bazman
Caldari Werda Fookarwii
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Posted - 2007.06.19 17:49:00 -
[116]
Originally by: Donathan Slade whine whine whine, ***** ***** *****... Is that people always do? If something doesn't go your way you ***** and complain that CCP is nerfing nerfing... OMG THEY NERFING AGAIN!!!
I don't hear you complaining about the Drake, because it doesn't affect you, but if it did you would probably still be *****ing!!!
So you can't have a blasterthron!!! Get a blaster hyper which is the reason tehy were made, blasters, tank bonus.. get real and use the apropriate ship for the appropriate job. This is what CCP is balancing for. No, I don't like the EANM nef myself, especailly since nobdoy was complaining. But if you relate it to shields, they don't have a eanm equivalent for shield tanking sooo, bonus to armor tankers once again?
Quit playing if you don't like it or fly something else. Or, waste your money and watch your "elite of the elite" in SP get poped by the little tackle sniper gang that you can't shoot with their 40k scrams.
MO has complained about the Drake in a previous thread somewhere. Hyperion is a weird ass abortion of a Blastership. Rep bonus :| So it can tank like a ***** while doing mediocre damage. Yay, its another ship that needs to be nossed to beat it.
Also, News flash, Shield tanking and armour tanking are not meant to be the same.
Your last sentence is just pointless. wtf has a sniper gang got to do with anything, we're talking about DPS boats being virtually worthless when it comes to solo work. -----
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Igualmentedos
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Posted - 2007.06.19 17:51:00 -
[117]
Here is a really good idea. suck it up. There, everyone wins.
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Lore Isander
Caldari Sybrite Inc.
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Posted - 2007.06.19 17:53:00 -
[118]
Originally by: Dawson Edited by: Dawson on 19/06/2007 17:29:26 Edited by: Dawson on 19/06/2007 17:26:42
Originally by: Vyktor Abyss
Originally by: Dawson
Originally by: Dawson
Originally by: Siigari Kitawa
Originally by: James Duar
Originally by: Dawson what do you expect its a tier 1 BS. nuff said.
It's a tier 2 BS.
lmao owned.
is it really? I thought Armageddon was tier 1, Apocalypse tier 2, Abaddon tier 3.
intact i'm sure of it, not that I can check in game at the moment.
Quote:
Armageddon >Primary Skill required >Amarr Battleship I
defo tier 1
What planet are you from?
We're talking about the Megathron.
Dominix t1 Megathron t2 Hyperion t3
Get blushing some more please. 
lmao that explains it, god knows what made me think it was a geddon thread  been bugging me all day, i was trying to find info on the geddon trying too work out if they changed the tier lmao its not even the right race 
DO I HEAR QUOTE CHAIN!? ---
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Horza Otho
Minmatar Infortunatus Eventus Cruel Intentions
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Posted - 2007.06.19 18:40:00 -
[119]
Originally by: Akita T Edited by: Akita T on 19/06/2007 06:39:44
Downgrade from Neutrons to Ions. About 6% DPS drop for 7% better tracking, much easier to fit, both PG and CPU-wise. Drop the turret CPU implant you used to need and get a turret damage implant instead. Almost recovered lost DPS. Of course, the 5 Ogre IIs still deal the same damage as before.
Switch from Void L (28K/28T, -25% range, -50% falloff, -50% tracking, +25% capacitor usage) to LP-shop Antimatter L faction ammo (32.2K/23T, -50% range, no falloff penality, no tracking penality, no capacitor usage penality). Almost the same damage (-1.4% DPS overall), easier on the cap, better quality hits (or mor often) which actually means an increase in DPS, and a whooping 20% capacitor savings ! And no, I don't expect that ammo to cost significantly more as T2 ammo.
THERE.
Easy to fit, doesn't even NEED T2 guns. Cheap. Well, cheapER as what you were apparently used to anyway. Almost same base DPS (3-4% at worst if you insist on using T2 guns). Highly increased survivavility because it DOESN'T cap out as fast as you're used to. More than DOUBLED tracking (yes, more than, I count 107% vs 50% as more than double). Almost doubled effective fighting range (lower falloff on ions, but no 50% penality, slightly lower optimal too).
What the heck do you need more ? It's a freaking Gallente BOOST to boot, and you're WHINING "NERF" ?!?!?
Dude, u dont need cpu implants for neutrons... u need them for ions. 
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Lore Isander
Caldari Sybrite Inc.
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Posted - 2007.06.19 18:42:00 -
[120]
Originally by: Horza Otho
Originally by: Akita T Edited by: Akita T on 19/06/2007 06:39:44
Downgrade from Neutrons to Ions. About 6% DPS drop for 7% better tracking, much easier to fit, both PG and CPU-wise. Drop the turret CPU implant you used to need and get a turret damage implant instead. Almost recovered lost DPS. Of course, the 5 Ogre IIs still deal the same damage as before.
Switch from Void L (28K/28T, -25% range, -50% falloff, -50% tracking, +25% capacitor usage) to LP-shop Antimatter L faction ammo (32.2K/23T, -50% range, no falloff penality, no tracking penality, no capacitor usage penality). Almost the same damage (-1.4% DPS overall), easier on the cap, better quality hits (or mor often) which actually means an increase in DPS, and a whooping 20% capacitor savings ! And no, I don't expect that ammo to cost significantly more as T2 ammo.
THERE.
Easy to fit, doesn't even NEED T2 guns. Cheap. Well, cheapER as what you were apparently used to anyway. Almost same base DPS (3-4% at worst if you insist on using T2 guns). Highly increased survivavility because it DOESN'T cap out as fast as you're used to. More than DOUBLED tracking (yes, more than, I count 107% vs 50% as more than double). Almost doubled effective fighting range (lower falloff on ions, but no 50% penality, slightly lower optimal too).
What the heck do you need more ? It's a freaking Gallente BOOST to boot, and you're WHINING "NERF" ?!?!?
Dude, u dont need cpu implants for neutrons... u need them for ions. 
Nub, you need it after REV2... ---
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murder one
Gallente Death of Virtue Vigilance Infinitas
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Posted - 2007.06.19 18:58:00 -
[121]
Originally by: Donathan Slade whine whine whine, ***** ***** *****... Is that people always do? If something doesn't go your way you ***** and complain that CCP is nerfing nerfing... OMG THEY NERFING AGAIN!!!
I don't hear you complaining about the Drake, because it doesn't affect you, but if it did you would probably still be *****ing!!!
So you can't have a blasterthron!!! Get a blaster hyper which is the reason tehy were made, blasters, tank bonus.. get real and use the apropriate ship for the appropriate job. This is what CCP is balancing for. No, I don't like the EANM nef myself, especailly since nobdoy was complaining. But if you relate it to shields, they don't have a eanm equivalent for shield tanking sooo, bonus to armor tankers once again?
Quit playing if you don't like it or fly something else. Or, waste your money and watch your "elite of the elite" in SP get poped by the little tackle sniper gang that you can't shoot with their 40k scrams.
Guess what? I fly a Drake too. Why? It's really friggin good! It was nerfed (slightly) with Rev2. Guess what? I'm not whining about it! Why? Because it's FAIR! The Drake is STILL REALLY GOOD! It can still do it's job. It still has a great passive tank. IMO the nerf wasn't enough. It can still passive tank exceptionally well, and my shields now idle at 74% instead of 85% when being fired on by sentries.
The nerf didn't change a dang thing for my ship.
Because I said so...
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Temp Boi
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Posted - 2007.06.19 19:04:00 -
[122]
Totally agree with the OP, the constant nerfs are just too much. Blasterthrons already have a **** poor tank, not to mention our DPS just isn't enough to make up for it. Tanks are too strong nowadays; there's something wrong when an all out gank fitted, damage rigged, damage implanted mega pilot with tech 2 ogres can be tanked by your run of the mill battleship.
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Sergis
Caldari Life Extermination Coalition of Carebear Killers
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Posted - 2007.06.19 19:20:00 -
[123]
Im sry but if tehy were that elite they would know to fly a rokh. Also unlike you I fit a thing called a MWD, that is a Micro Warp Drive just incase you didnt know. And I use it to get away alot. It tends to do that very well. But your right sitting doing absolutely nothing when a carrier jumps in is much more honorable. --- Evil Thug [RAT.]<.-A-.> hits you, doing 24601.0 damage. |

Sergis
Caldari Life Extermination Coalition of Carebear Killers
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Posted - 2007.06.19 19:20:00 -
[124]
Edited by: Sergis on 19/06/2007 19:20:13
--- Evil Thug [RAT.]<.-A-.> hits you, doing 24601.0 damage. |

murder one
Gallente Death of Virtue Vigilance Infinitas
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Posted - 2007.06.19 19:28:00 -
[125]
Edited by: murder one on 19/06/2007 19:29:04 A halfway decent setup after Rev2:
Megathron-
Highs: 7x Ion2s w/ Void. (Haven't tried it with faction AM yet)
Mids: T2 mwd, fleeting web, faint 20km scram, T2 heavy injector w/ 800s.
Lows: Large Accom Rep, 1600 Tungsten plate, Internal Force Field Array DC, 2x T2 EANM w/ Comp skills @5, 2x Mag field stabs.
Drones: Berserker IIs (5) or Ogre IIs (5) depending on expected targets.
Rigs: 3x Trimark Armor Rigs.
Implants: (this setup **will not** work without these implants) High Grade Slave set (~1.4+ bil ISK), +5% all turret damage implant (~250m+ ISK), +5% Large Hybrid implant (~250m+ ISK).
That's a little over 2bil in implants. The ship absolutely will not work without them. You will cap out or run out of armor every time in a solo fight with almost any other BS with equal skills. I can't remember off hand how much CPU I had left over, but it was around 0.5 or 1 CPU left or something.
It ends up with average resists (explosive is around 54% or so, Kin/therm around 66%) and something like 31.6k armor. It's REALLY SLOW, due to the plate and 3x armor rigs. Around 125m/sec base speed, and around 960m/sec w/ T2 MWD topped out. (and it takes forever to get up to speed) I MWDed 30km, and still didn't hit max speed by the time I got to my target.
Anyway, the above setup works fairly well- that is, it's able to compete (barely) with other battleships that don't use implants themselves, and just stick with a basic T2 fit. As soon as you add faction mods or implants to other BS, you're going to lose.
This also is referring to a straight up 1v1 fight with no EW or other screwy stuff. And if you run into a really nasty nos boat, like a 4 nos Maelstrom or Abaddon or a generic nos Domi ([sarcasm]never seen one of those ever[/sarcasm]) then you still might die anyway, if the pilot knows what he's doing.
I built a Hype using the same basic design, only with a tracking comp in the 5th mid to fix the tracking, one less T2 EANM due to the lost low, and a T2 LAR because of the increased CPU and grid on the Hype. I ended up with 1 CPU free. It does quite well, but is a little more cap hungry than the Mega is, with it's 8th gun and T2 LAR and lower resistances requiring the use of the rep more.
If you don't have perfect skills to fly these setups, I wouldn't even bother. You need maxed Nav skills for every little bit of speed, maxed Mech skills for that last little bit of resistance (and for speed due to Armor rigs), maxed gunnery skills are a given, and you had better have maxed drone skills to squeeze every last DPS out of your drones (all spec skills at 5).
Don't forget maxed engineering skills for that last bit of cap and shield, as you'll need every bit of it while you MWD 30km to your target, all the while being hit by torps with your sig radius the size of a Titan.
I still stand by my original post. Blasterthrons are a ship for the most elite, most experienced and most skilled of the PVP community. No other ship requires as much time and ISK to be used effectively, or even made barely competitive.
Because I said so...
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Mogrin
Caldari Spartan Fleet Systems
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Posted - 2007.06.19 19:39:00 -
[126]
If you played eve like an RPG and had a logistics ship repairing you then your blasterthron would be very valid tactic. Say like 4 blasterthrons, a blackbird, and a oneiros against 6 ravens. Something like that. _______________ Rokh vs. Hyperion |

clean cut
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Posted - 2007.06.19 19:40:00 -
[127]
i think the imbalance resides in nos since that is what is fueling most tanks nowadays. they should just remove nos but leave neuts in. then give a percent bonus to the current bonused nos ships where neuts dnt remove some of your cap aswell.
lol but even then without adding that capwarfare to the equation i have a hard time seeing the blasterthron killing any tier 3 bs before dying.
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murder one
Gallente Death of Virtue Vigilance Infinitas
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Posted - 2007.06.19 19:42:00 -
[128]
Originally by: Mogrin If you played eve like an RPG and had a logistics ship repairing you then your blasterthron would be very valid tactic. Say like 4 blasterthrons, a blackbird, and a oneiros against 6 ravens. Something like that.
While it looks good in theory, it doesn't work in practice.
Because I said so...
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Pesadel0
Ordem dos Templarios Te-Ka
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Posted - 2007.06.19 19:48:00 -
[129]
Want to be the elite off eve?
Try to fly minmatar.
I was sworn to absolute secrecy BY CCP. |

murder one
Gallente Death of Virtue Vigilance Infinitas
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Posted - 2007.06.19 20:12:00 -
[130]
Originally by: Pesadel0 Want to be the elite off eve?
Try to fly minmatar.
I do fly Minmatar. All Nos/Torp Typhoon with a huge armor tank works great. (175m3 drone bay WTF?!) Maelstrom w/ 4x Heavy Diminishing Nos and 4x 800 AC IIs works great. Rupture works great. Hurricane is AWESOME.
I fail to see your point. Because I said so...
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Santa Anna
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Posted - 2007.06.19 20:13:00 -
[131]
If you can't figure out how to fly a Megathron effectively then no changes CCP can make will help you 
This is like your 50th whine thread on the subject. As always, Megathron is a well above-average solo ship and the best small gang ship in the game. It will continue to be in the future. If you ignore a would-be victim's ship bonuses and fill it up with NOS then it may be able to avoid dying long enough for you to cap out. This is the current counter to your preferred tactic. Everyone else in the game manages to deal with counters to their prefered tactics without constant epic whine threads. A Nosdomi may not die before a gank mega caps out, but 2 gank megas will handle two nos domis no problem. (Damage scales much better than tank, especially active tank.) If you want to play solo then fly a nosdomi for the 3-4 weeks until the Revelations 2.1 or 2.2 patch nerfs nos, then go back to your Mega. If you want to solo in your Mega now, work a bit better on target selection like everybody else. Hell, just stay near jump/dock range in your gank attempts -- no nos ship save the Domi should be able to take down your hitpoint buffer before you have time to deagress and jump out/dock and you should be able to gank everyone else.
No ship or tactic should be without a counter, but that seems to be all you ask for in your Mega threads. I see plenty of Megas about in pvp, most flown by players with far less than 30M SP, so they can't be that bad. They aren't FOTM I-Win buttons, and they shouldn't be.
BTW, to the extent that the EANM nerf forces some people to switch to 2x active + DC tank from a 2x EANM2 + DC tank (I'm very skeptical), the big losers are Minmatar and the big winners are Gallente. The resistance hole will likely move from Exp to Therm on these ships, which is good for ships that can field a full flight of Ogre 2's (esp if bonused) and bad for ships whose T2 ammo is Kin+Exp.
If you just don't like that CCP seems to be patching the game away from solo instaganks, EVE may not be a game for you in the future. Regardless of the effectiveness of their various boosts/nerfs, they've pretty consistently intended to extend the duration of fights and encourage well-coordinated group tactics. The decreasing effectiveness of your gank mega relative to tankier setups in solo pvp is the intended effect of CCP's efforts and from every dev blog I've read is a trend that is likely to continue indefinitely. |

El Torrent
Gallente
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Posted - 2007.06.19 20:15:00 -
[132]
I 100% agree with your argumentation, Murder One. Only thing that still kind of works, is slaves, plates, and gank. And that is now, even more difficult on cpu, although still manageable.
Btw: may I steal your nice sig? -- Hello World. |

Lore Isander
Caldari Sybrite Inc.
|
Posted - 2007.06.19 20:16:00 -
[133]
Originally by: murder one Edited by: murder one on 19/06/2007 19:29:04 A halfway decent setup after Rev2:
Megathron-
Highs: 7x Ion2s w/ Void. (Haven't tried it with faction AM yet)
Mids: T2 mwd, fleeting web, faint 20km scram, T2 heavy injector w/ 800s.
Lows: Large Accom Rep, 1600 Tungsten plate, Internal Force Field Array DC, 2x T2 EANM w/ Comp skills @5, 2x Mag field stabs.
Drones: Berserker IIs (5) or Ogre IIs (5) depending on expected targets.
Rigs: 3x Trimark Armor Rigs.
Implants: (this setup **will not** work without these implants) High Grade Slave set (~1.4+ bil ISK), +5% all turret damage implant (~250m+ ISK), +5% Large Hybrid implant (~250m+ ISK).
And you would die to my fit any day: Linkage ---
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El Torrent
Gallente
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Posted - 2007.06.19 20:29:00 -
[134]
I use something very very similar to Lore Isander. One less MFS, one more EAN. More balanced, effective hp's versus damage. -- Hello World. |

murder one
Gallente Death of Virtue Vigilance Infinitas
|
Posted - 2007.06.19 20:37:00 -
[135]
Originally by: Lore Isander
Originally by: murder one Edited by: murder one on 19/06/2007 19:29:04 A halfway decent setup after Rev2:
Megathron-
Highs: 7x Ion2s w/ Void. (Haven't tried it with faction AM yet)
Mids: T2 mwd, fleeting web, faint 20km scram, T2 heavy injector w/ 800s.
Lows: Large Accom Rep, 1600 Tungsten plate, Internal Force Field Array DC, 2x T2 EANM w/ Comp skills @5, 2x Mag field stabs.
Drones: Berserker IIs (5) or Ogre IIs (5) depending on expected targets.
Rigs: 3x Trimark Armor Rigs.
Implants: (this setup **will not** work without these implants) High Grade Slave set (~1.4+ bil ISK), +5% all turret damage implant (~250m+ ISK), +5% Large Hybrid implant (~250m+ ISK).
And you would die to my fit any day: Linkage
I use a similar setup when I'm fighting in dock range. When I'm out and about, I require the use of a rep. Otherwise, one good fight and I'm toast on the second encounter. Because I said so...
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murder one
Gallente Death of Virtue Vigilance Infinitas
|
Posted - 2007.06.19 20:38:00 -
[136]
Originally by: El Torrent I 100% agree with your argumentation, Murder One. Only thing that still kind of works, is slaves, plates, and gank. And that is now, even more difficult on cpu, although still manageable.
Btw: may I steal your nice sig?
If you want to hang that piece of crap in all your posts, go right ahead lol!  Because I said so...
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Steyr Daghan
|
Posted - 2007.06.19 20:48:00 -
[137]
Edited by: Steyr Daghan on 19/06/2007 20:50:29
Originally by: Tonkin am i reading this right someone wants gallente boosted!!!
they have the best drones one of the best snipers, the domi with its ubber nos, best carrier, best mothership, 2 of the best hacs and the best crusier
so come again?
Well, what's strange or unusual about that? The forum is full of gallentes who either a) whine that they once couldn't kill something fast enough so now it must be nerfed or yelling that someone is a "carebear" because they suggest that they should not be forced to crosstrain in order to survive. Calling for their overpowered ships to be boosted is just the logical next step.
Your surprise surprises me. 
EDIT: grammar and for clairity
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The RepoMan
Caldari Red Horizon Inc Red Horizon
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Posted - 2007.06.19 21:10:00 -
[138]
did it ever occur to you that your perception that mass dps to win is a valid play tactic is in itself flawed, and that the months of "nerfs" that change this should probably tip you off that ccp thinks the same?
You claim balance on a 1v1 level but seem to want to win on a 1v1 level, I mean, seriously buddy get a clue. Blasterthrons, especially plated/passive ones are allready overpowered in most situations.
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d026
THE LEGION OF STEEL WARRIORS.... R0ADKILL
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Posted - 2007.06.19 21:19:00 -
[139]
Quote: Blasterthrons, especially plated/passive ones are allready overpowered in most situations.
And if you don't believe this we can try it on the test server any day:) But you just seem to lazy to dock after a encounter to repair your ship! And it seems that your mega performs so well, even tough u use rep and capinjectors, that you can take on multiple targets before you have to redock and load a full cargohold of 800's?
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murder one
Gallente Death of Virtue Vigilance Infinitas
|
Posted - 2007.06.19 21:35:00 -
[140]
Originally by: d026
Quote: Blasterthrons, especially plated/passive ones are allready overpowered in most situations.
And if you don't believe this we can try it on the test server any day:) But you just seem to lazy to dock after a encounter to repair your ship! And it seems that your mega performs so well, even tough u use rep and capinjectors, that you can take on multiple targets before you have to redock and load a full cargohold of 800's?
It's easier to stash GSCs full of 800s and ammo in remote territory when you're flying solo than it is to get repaired. Because I said so...
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Mogrin
Caldari Spartan Fleet Systems
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Posted - 2007.06.19 21:41:00 -
[141]
Originally by: murder one
Originally by: Mogrin If you played eve like an RPG and had a logistics ship repairing you then your blasterthron would be very valid tactic. Say like 4 blasterthrons, a blackbird, and a oneiros against 6 ravens. Something like that.
While it looks good in theory, it doesn't work in practice.
Sure it does, it just isn't practiced. Logistics boats can pump out some insane repair numbers like running 3 large t2 reps indefinitely. But nobody flies them, takes way too many skill points. CCP's bad. _______________ Rokh vs. Hyperion |

Silverized
0utbreak
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Posted - 2007.06.19 21:48:00 -
[142]
Edited by: Silverized on 19/06/2007 21:47:05 Fly the mega with neutblaster setup, its alot better then ions with tank. and you wont have the issue with being short on fittings. And tbfh you really dont need a full HG slave set to beat another t2 fitted BS.. some trimarks will do fine. ------------------------------
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JoCool
MASS
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Posted - 2007.06.19 21:56:00 -
[143]
Originally by: murder one I don't have my 'own race' in Eve. I fly Hurricanes, Drakes, Rokhs, Maelstroms, Typhoons. Whatever is effective. It just disgusts me when I have to abandon any ship that doesn't conform to the 4x Heavy Nos, 4x whatever else cookie cutter template in order to compete in PVP.
It's a **** poor indication of CCP's lack of competence with respect to game design and insight into combat mechanics within Eve itself. Nos fights and waiting for your target to run out of cap charges is **not fun**. Requiring two, if not three ships in a gang in order to ensure a decisive and quick kill against a single target is **not fun**.
CCP continues to water down combat in general, and solo combat specifically.
I have no 'own 'race' Jim. I fly a Drake, it was nerfed a little, but not enough to make any difference with how I use it or how effective it is. The EANM nerf doesn't touch any of my other ships: Typhoon, Dominix, Rokh, Myrm, Ishtar, Maelstrom, Brutix, Vexor, Rifter, Hurricane, Rupture, etc. etc.
I just can't stand flying some weak ass lamer Caldari nos boat, just like everyone else, when there really is no need to, if CCP will just stop nerfing the Blasterthron.
I concurr, Nosferatus might be over the top and need a hit with TomB's good old nerf bat. They are the bane of a living solo PVP.
However, on TQ I see Nosferatus much more rarely fitted than in the impression your text made.
If you engage Nos heavy enemies regularly on TQ you will need to counteract. At the moment you might not want to go solo. Get a friend with jammers or one with enough firepower so that you guys can overcome the target's tank, even if you have a 2on2 or 2on3 with hostile Nos ships you can succeed, some battleship pilots use 2 Heavy Cap Boosters.
However a Nos is still the killer numero uno to medium sized ships, as we might agree.
Trey Azagthoth > Youre my idol Jocool. I wanna be like Jocool jr. or Jocool the sequel! Oveur > ohnoes jocool |

Dr Ming
Mindworks
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Posted - 2007.06.19 23:05:00 -
[144]
- Gallente drone boats are not the same ships as gallente blaster boats.
- When you read corp chat and see some random scrub say "lolz gallente are teh overpowered to the max", their talking about SOME gallente boats (which have good synergy with NOS).
- The OP is pointing out that Dominix are a lot more effective than Megathrons with current game mechanics. Dominix are gallente boats. So claiming this is a 'gallente issue thread' is just pointing out that you couldn't even make it through the original post before you got confused.
------------------------------------------------
I've been trying some diffrent things to try and make the Gallente blaster boats feel less lackluster. It isn't solopwnmobile stuff, but it has at least been somewhat effective in some solo fights.
1) ECM drones instead of combat drones.
-ECM drones counter NOS. This shuts down absurd tanks, and protects your cap.
-Blasters do a lot of damage, so losing the drone damage isn't really a huge drop in DPS compared to the hit a heavy active tank takes when it loses the extra cap from a NOS.
-Blaster boats get into point blank range, so you can scoop-release your ECM drones non-stop until you get a jam cycle off.
-You have a chance to run away from a single target.
2) Drop a mid slot and find the grid for a second injector of some sort. Likley your web.
-Make sure you've got some way of doing some ammount of damage past 10km.
-Using webber drones can be somewhat effective. Not as effective as a webber, but more effective than nothing.
-You can fit 1-2 energy neuts. If their NOSing and your neuting, their going to cap out and then their tank will fail, and your reasonable blaster damage will chew them up.
-Sometimes your going to have to turn the MWD on and leave it on. But their going to have to turn their MWD on and leave it on to stay away from you. Since your dual injecting, their going to get tired first.
----------------------------
Blaster ships could really use some love though.
-They take a ton of SP to fly.
-they suffer in group fights since they have to MWD into point blank range for each target. Raven pilots whine about their damage while ignoring the range on their weapons. You don't appreciate what weapon range means in practice until you've flown a Gallente blaster ship.
-Megathrons are dodgeable. If you see one barreling down on you, just start moving. There is a good chance that the pilot will miss you, and will have to spend a lot of cap and time to get into optimal blaster range.
-Afterburners > Blaster ships. Turn on your afterburner which sips cap, and pull out of his optimal range. Watch him cap out when he uses his MWD to get back in range, or kill him once you get far enough away that your lower optimal DPS is higher than his non-optimal DPS.
Of course, everyone just goes to quickfit and makes some sort of hypothetical setup, looks at its maximum DPS and screams bloody murder because a blaster ship's theroy-peen is bigger than your ship's theroy-peen.
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murder one
Gallente Death of Virtue Vigilance Infinitas
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Posted - 2007.06.19 23:05:00 -
[145]
Originally by: Mogrin
Originally by: murder one
Originally by: Mogrin If you played eve like an RPG and had a logistics ship repairing you then your blasterthron would be very valid tactic. Say like 4 blasterthrons, a blackbird, and a oneiros against 6 ravens. Something like that.
While it looks good in theory, it doesn't work in practice.
Sure it does, it just isn't practiced. Logistics boats can pump out some insane repair numbers like running 3 large t2 reps indefinitely. But nobody flies them, takes way too many skill points. CCP's bad.
If I had a 6 man gang, I wouldn't be wasting an entire person on a Logistics ship. I'd have 5x Blasterthrons and 1x Rook. Because I said so...
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Constantinee
Caldari Omerta Syndicate Exuro Mortis
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Posted - 2007.06.20 00:04:00 -
[146]
tbh who ever decided to raise t2 eanm's should be slapped in the face with a metal tipped boot.
Now i have a feeling that there will be more navy megas and vindicators on the battlefield. Thankfully after i had gotten my vindi fully pimped i now no longer even fly a regular mega for solo hunting. however if i were to id be reduced to 6 guns. This is NOT what the mega was intended to do. i said this once before, this all could have ben avoided by just giving the damn explosive crystals to the amarr but ssp yet again decided to screw gallante ship flyers. thx ccp, like we dont suffer enough on cpu.
Omerta Syndicate |

Foulis
Minmatar Chosen Path FATAL Alliance
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Posted - 2007.06.20 00:07:00 -
[147]
Have you ever considered that if you are losing to pilots with a fraction of your SP that you might not be a very good pilot?
Maybe?
Blasterthron is one of the most skill intensive ships around, not SP, which doesn't matter after a certain point, but actual piloting talent.
----
Originally by: Nikolai Nuvolari NO WORDS IN THE ENGLISH LANGUAGE ARE SPELLED WITH THE NUMBER "8" IN THEM GODDAMNIT!
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Santa Anna
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Posted - 2007.06.20 08:50:00 -
[148]
While I'm not a big skill points uber alles guy like Murder One is, I think there may be a valid solution to his conflict with the current trend in EVE patches/changes...
Make the specialization skills more important. 2% damage per level is nice, but when you go from lvl 4 to lvl 5 in (Say) large blaster spec it's only a 1.85% improvement for a month of training.
How about expanding the benefits of specialization?
So for each level of (say) large blaster spec you get +2% dmg mod on t2 large blasters -2% grid on t2 large blasters -2% cpu on large blasters -2% penalty on t2 large blaster ammo
or something like that? That way people who really specialize towards a certain playstyle would reap a nontrivial reward for their investment. |

Horus Dark
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Posted - 2007.06.20 09:17:00 -
[149]
murder stop making 10 posts with whining about megas kk tnx
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Lore Isander
Caldari Sybrite Inc.
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Posted - 2007.06.20 09:23:00 -
[150]
Originally by: Silverized Edited by: Silverized on 19/06/2007 21:47:05 Fly the mega with neutblaster setup, its alot better then ions with tank. and you wont have the issue with being short on fittings. And tbfh you really dont need a full HG slave set to beat another t2 fitted BS.. some trimarks will do fine.
You wont kill another properly setup battleship with a Slaveless NeutronMega, I know this from experience.
I had 15k armor left after fighting full t2'd Megathron and Apoc. So I lost 30k armor in the fight, a Mega without slaves has like 25k? 30k? ---
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Gabriel Karade
Celtic Anarchy Anarchy Empire
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Posted - 2007.06.20 10:30:00 -
[151]
Perhaps once faction ammo becomes more available T1 fitted blasterthrons will become more competitive. As it stands the OP is correct, if you arenÆt spec'ed up to the wazoo you aren't competitive with anything else out there.
Cap is still a huge issue, I believe it's time the controlled bursts skill got some love - 7.5% per level, or even 10% per level (clearly extensive balance testing would be required), helping both Gallente Blaster boats and Amarr Laser boats.
----------
Video - 'War-Machine' |

Tom Gunn
Caldari North Eastern Swat Pandemic Legion
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Posted - 2007.06.20 10:51:00 -
[152]
rofl at the idea of a T2 Blaster fitted BS with T2 tank mods being 'entry level'
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Col FireBreath
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Posted - 2007.06.20 10:57:00 -
[153]
Edited by: Col FireBreath on 20/06/2007 11:02:41 Edited by: Col FireBreath on 20/06/2007 10:58:13 Buy a Vindicator.
or, pick you targets more carefully.
Its perfectly possible to pick off mission running Raven's in low-sec with a T1 blasterthron. Do some research on where the agents are and therefore where ships will be jumping through. Pick an area where the likely targets will be throwing EM or explosive damage and as a result your target's tank will be not be as resistant to your damage type (Kin/Therm).
Sit and wait. T2 Cloaking device and good cloaking skills can help a great deal.
If you get caught out and the target has a very good tank you can always turn away, cap inject and MWD out of scram range. Most mission runners don't have scram fitted anyway and very few will have a MWD (they don't work in deadspace) so you should have no trouble escaping if it all goes wrong.
There are two types of fit you can use for this, depending on how much you want to chance it with sentry guns pounding on you.
Pure Gank (mostly T1): 7x Mega Modal Neut Blasters w/Antimatter 1x Cloak?
1x Med Cap Injector 1x Quad LIF Booster MWD 1x Fleeting Web 1x Fleeting 20k Scram
2-3x 1600 mm RT plates 1-2x MFS II 2x EANM II 1x DCU II
2x Trimark Armour Pump I 1x Explosive Resist Rig
More tanked approach:
7x Mega Modal Ions w/Antimatter 1x Cloak? / NOS
1x Heavy Electro Cap Injector 1x Quad LIF MWD 1x Fleeting Web 1x Fleeting 20k Scram
2x LAR II 1x DCU II Either: 2x EANM II + 2x MFS II or less MFS and more hardeners
2x Rep Amount Rigs 1x Rep Time Rig
NOTE: This is a Rev I setup, haven't check to see if they fit in Rev II yet.
Naturally a 7x Ion II, 2x Core X-Type LAR, Shadow Serp MFS Vindicator will do the job better, but its expensive and sometimes mission runners do have friends to surprise you!
EDITs: Typos
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Entilzah Valen
0utbreak
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Posted - 2007.06.20 11:42:00 -
[154]

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Caffeine Junkie
Caldari Elite Storm Enterprises Storm Armada
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Posted - 2007.06.20 23:10:00 -
[155]
Originally by: Col FireBreath
Buy a Vindicator.
or, pick you targets more carefully.
Agreed ___________________
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50freefly
Caldari Purify United Freemen Alliance
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Posted - 2007.06.21 00:32:00 -
[156]
Ever try a platethron? Those work...
Originally by: Eight Ace For reasons that have been lost in the mists of time all caldari ships are designed by two people. One does the left hand side and the other does the right.
And they never meet.
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Tibrius Archer
Kurai-Komichi Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2007.06.21 01:01:00 -
[157]
Edited by: Tibrius Archer on 21/06/2007 01:02:39
To answer the orginal poster.
I agree. Infact half the people who have smacked you have smacked me when I complained once that the game favours a NOS over 90% of racial guns or launchers and the game mechanics completely pander to the no cap required NOS with drone damage combo.
Thing is; people who fly Caldari on the outside looking in see megathron videos like "wave of mutilation" and think "Gosh, the megathron kills all 1v1 its balanced if not overpowered...."
The point is every megathron pilot who does these things has pretty much MAXED Skills and you could do these things in a MAXED raven just that raven pilots tend always to fit crap criuse lauchers and T1 ammo.... nobody makes raven solo combat vids because raven combat is crap to watch.
I must admitt most of the outside looking in quick judgments are made by primarly caldari pilots (simply because there the most popular race). I read a hole thread the other day on some silly caldari pilots who got really annoyed with the fact that a mega and domi can fully tackle and still tank that they requested caldari only low slot modules...lol
They clearly had no understanding on low/med slot game mechanics and the FUNDAMENTAL differances between shield and armour tanking.... what was quite disturbing is the way they looked at there own strengths and called them weakness' not understanding Alpha or the tracking issues, trying to force the argument that its unfair a raven can't have a web and tank. (the reason for this is linked to guns)
It was really sad to see as these peoples views if listened too would ruin the game.
I think a lot of the NERF gunship views come from the gunship p o r n thats out there I have even contributed some here. When people see even the current "rubbish" geddon gank people in seconds they see it conclude that the scorpion and not even there more expensive raven can do that and cry nerf.
I will admitt prehaps if I did not play around with ships so much and I flew caldari I would feel a bit hard done by after watching something like "Wave of mutilation" and on the face of it the numbers support the obvious view too given that a Torp raven does MAX about 750dps and that even an electron mega can do over a 1000dps...
The one way in which the gallante ARE overpowered caldari pilots never mention because they never realise as they are blinded on the trivia ...
The real overboost to gallante is; All blasterships use accuracy falloff opposed to optimal. There gun classes from electron to neutron all operate in a tiny range band meaning there is no big loss to fitting electrons over neutron on a mega or any other gallante blaster. Also there is next to no need for any ammo but the most close range and damaging (this was turbo true before null in the T1 days) CCP have nerfed this a little by making VOID nerf the falloff range totally.
Think about it, would be sucide for various reasons to think about using anything other than Megapulse on a Amarr battleship... but Mega electrons would go down a treat on a Gallante BS.
Oh yeah, about the CPU on ENAM's yep, This means that you can't have all T2 lows anymore on megas even with the obligatory 5% gun CPU implant you need to even get into a mega.
*****************************************
"Get in my way and I will burn your fleet from stem to stern" |

Incantare
Caldari Darkness Inc.
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Posted - 2007.06.21 01:13:00 -
[158]
Originally by: Tibrius Archer
The point is every megathron pilot who does these things has pretty much MAXED Skills and you could do these things in a MAXED raven just that raven pilots tend always to fit crap criuse lauchers and T1 ammo.... nobody makes raven solo combat vids because raven combat is crap to watch.
Congratulations. You win the 'most ********' thing I've read all day award. Ever think it could be because of low dps, tank conflicting with tackle, high mass and low speed? But no, you don't see solo raven vids because the pilots would rather 'fit crap cruise launchers and t1 ammo'. 
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murder one
Gallente Death of Virtue Vigilance Infinitas
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Posted - 2007.06.21 01:15:00 -
[159]
Originally by: Foulis Have you ever considered that if you are losing to pilots with a fraction of your SP that you might not be a very good pilot?
Maybe?
Blasterthron is one of the most skill intensive ships around, not SP, which doesn't matter after a certain point, but actual piloting talent.
I didn't say I was losing to pilots with less SP. What I said was it takes far less SP to fly almost any other BS, when compared to the Blasterthron. You can field a competetive Domi or Typhoon or Rokh very easily with half the SP or LESS than what is required to fly a Blasterthron effectively.
I'm sure you're a no talent hack who gets killed daily, but no, I don't lose to low SP or low experience players. I don't lose very often to high SP players either.
In short: blow me.
BUYING ZAINOU 'DEADEYE' ZGL1000 IMPLANTS, PAYING WELL, CONVO/MAIL IN-GAME |

murder one
Gallente Death of Virtue Vigilance Infinitas
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Posted - 2007.06.21 01:24:00 -
[160]
Originally by: Col FireBreath Buy a Vindicator.
<insane crap fits>
LOL! Buy a what? Obviously by the fits that you're posting (t1 guns? are you joking?) you have no experience what so ever, so I'll explain something to you:
The Vindicator has the exact same damage output as the Megathron, with maxed skills. Same with the Navy Mega, although it is obvious that the Navy Mega can fit a much better tank than the standard Mega can, while still fitting 3x damage mods, so in a straight up 1v1 fight, a Navy Mega will last a little bit longer.
But here's the point: the Peak DPS for any of the three ships, at absolute maximum, IS EXACTLY THE SAME. What does this mean? It means that if you can tank a normal Mega, you sure as hell can tank a Navy Mega, or a Vindi, and once those two ultra expensive faction BS are out of cap, guess what? They're just as dead in the water as a regular Mega. Same goes for the Hype.
It's like you guys don't read the posts or something. Or maybe I'm just not explaining it in simple enough terms.
BUYING ZAINOU 'DEADEYE' ZGL1000 IMPLANTS, PAYING WELL, CONVO/MAIL IN-GAME |
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Tommy Vercetti
Queens of the Stone Age Anarchy Empire
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Posted - 2007.06.21 02:27:00 -
[161]
Originally by: Dr Ming Blaster ships could really use some love though.
-They take a ton of SP to fly.
-they suffer in group fights since they have to MWD into point blank range for each target. Raven pilots whine about their damage while ignoring the range on their weapons. You don't appreciate what weapon range means in practice until you've flown a Gallente blaster ship.
-Megathrons are dodgeable. If you see one barreling down on you, just start moving. There is a good chance that the pilot will miss you, and will have to spend a lot of cap and time to get into optimal blaster range.
-Afterburners > Blaster ships. Turn on your afterburner which sips cap, and pull out of his optimal range. Watch him cap out when he uses his MWD to get back in range, or kill him once you get far enough away that your lower optimal DPS is higher than his non-optimal DPS.
- As do most other battleships to get the best out of them. You want a spec phoon? T2 siege, T2 autocannons, T2 armor, T2 heavy drones and fittings skills to fit it all.
- Megathrons suffer in group fights? so your tackler isn't scramming and webbing them for you, leaving you to click mwd and approach? As for appreciation of weapon range try flying a ship with autocannons. You learn to realise your optimal range is really half your max dps and squashed between disruptor and web range.
- Dodgeable? Some nice web drones and good mwd soon fix that.
- Afterburners AB's give you what 200-300% boost on base speed? Which for most battleships is around 600m/s. AB's are useless outside of deadspace.
Originally by: "Janu Hull"
Nothing says gritty cynicism like a 1 ISK note wedged between a pair of silicone enhanced knockers.[/qu
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murder one
Gallente Death of Virtue Vigilance Infinitas
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Posted - 2007.06.21 05:26:00 -
[162]
Originally by: Tommy Vercetti
Originally by: Dr Ming Blaster ships could really use some love though.
-They take a ton of SP to fly.
-they suffer in group fights since they have to MWD into point blank range for each target. Raven pilots whine about their damage while ignoring the range on their weapons. You don't appreciate what weapon range means in practice until you've flown a Gallente blaster ship.
-Megathrons are dodgeable. If you see one barreling down on you, just start moving. There is a good chance that the pilot will miss you, and will have to spend a lot of cap and time to get into optimal blaster range.
-Afterburners > Blaster ships. Turn on your afterburner which sips cap, and pull out of his optimal range. Watch him cap out when he uses his MWD to get back in range, or kill him once you get far enough away that your lower optimal DPS is higher than his non-optimal DPS.
- As do most other battleships to get the best out of them. You want a spec phoon? T2 siege, T2 autocannons, T2 armor, T2 heavy drones and fittings skills to fit it all.
- Megathrons suffer in group fights? so your tackler isn't scramming and webbing them for you, leaving you to click mwd and approach? As for appreciation of weapon range try flying a ship with autocannons. You learn to realise your optimal range is really half your max dps and squashed between disruptor and web range.
- Dodgeable? Some nice web drones and good mwd soon fix that.
- Afterburners AB's give you what 200-300% boost on base speed? Which for most battleships is around 600m/s. AB's are useless outside of deadspace.
I can kill a max skilled T2 Blasterthron with a T2 tanked, T1 everything else Tyhoon any day of the week. Even T1 drones. Piece of cake. Heck, I did it on test with only Min BS2 and Torps1. It's that easy.
BUYING ZAINOU 'DEADEYE' ZGL1000 IMPLANTS, PAYING WELL, CONVO/MAIL IN-GAME |

Lusian
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Posted - 2007.06.21 06:09:00 -
[163]
I will have to agree and that pilots should pick targets more carefully.
Second i look at it this way. here in reality there are no nerf's that help the underdogs in war. Noone to say that bullets do les damage because of what ever reasons that it is unfair to the other side or apposeing force. we have to deal with it. Extreems in a game are different.
My point being that there are too many nerf's that make it rediculous and there for i sympathize with the original post. But..... Again iys just a game and the game is designed for pvp. There for not all things will be even. The newb or the complainer for nerf's will have to accept that not all things are equal.
The blasterthron will have to take its course and from the way i have been taken down by one i havent seen too much of a loss in its abilities from ships i have lost to them. Blasterthrons are good ships and terrible in distances so keep your distance :D
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Butter Dog
The Littlest Hobos Betrayal Under Mayhem
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Posted - 2007.06.21 07:13:00 -
[164]
Originally by: murder one Edited by: murder one on 19/06/2007 19:29:04 A halfway decent setup after Rev2:
Megathron-
Highs: 7x Ion2s w/ Void. (Haven't tried it with faction AM yet)
Mids: T2 mwd, fleeting web, faint 20km scram, T2 heavy injector w/ 800s.
Lows: Large Accom Rep, 1600 Tungsten plate, Internal Force Field Array DC, 2x T2 EANM w/ Comp skills @5, 2x Mag field stabs.
Drones: Berserker IIs (5) or Ogre IIs (5) depending on expected targets.
Rigs: 3x Trimark Armor Rigs.
Implants: (this setup **will not** work without these implants) High Grade Slave set (~1.4+ bil ISK), +5% all turret damage implant (~250m+ ISK), +5% Large Hybrid implant (~250m+ ISK).
That's a little over 2bil in implants. The ship absolutely will not work without them. You will cap out or run out of armor every time in a solo fight with almost any other BS with equal skills. I can't remember off hand how much CPU I had left over, but it was around 0.5 or 1 CPU left or something.
It ends up with average resists (explosive is around 54% or so, Kin/therm around 66%) and something like 31.6k armor. It's REALLY SLOW, due to the plate and 3x armor rigs. Around 125m/sec base speed, and around 960m/sec w/ T2 MWD topped out. (and it takes forever to get up to speed) I MWDed 30km, and still didn't hit max speed by the time I got to my target.
Anyway, the above setup works fairly well- that is, it's able to compete (barely) with other battleships that don't use implants themselves, and just stick with a basic T2 fit. As soon as you add faction mods or implants to other BS, you're going to lose.
This also is referring to a straight up 1v1 fight with no EW or other screwy stuff. And if you run into a really nasty nos boat, like a 4 nos Maelstrom or Abaddon or a generic nos Domi ([sarcasm]never seen one of those ever[/sarcasm]) then you still might die anyway, if the pilot knows what he's doing.
I built a Hype using the same basic design, only with a tracking comp in the 5th mid to fix the tracking, one less T2 EANM due to the lost low, and a T2 LAR because of the increased CPU and grid on the Hype. I ended up with 1 CPU free. It does quite well, but is a little more cap hungry than the Mega is, with it's 8th gun and T2 LAR and lower resistances requiring the use of the rep more.
If you don't have perfect skills to fly these setups, I wouldn't even bother. You need maxed Nav skills for every little bit of speed, maxed Mech skills for that last little bit of resistance (and for speed due to Armor rigs), maxed gunnery skills are a given, and you had better have maxed drone skills to squeeze every last DPS out of your drones (all spec skills at 5).
Don't forget maxed engineering skills for that last bit of cap and shield, as you'll need every bit of it while you MWD 30km to your target, all the while being hit by torps with your sig radius the size of a Titan.
I still stand by my original post. Blasterthrons are a ship for the most elite, most experienced and most skilled of the PVP community. No other ship requires as much time and ISK to be used effectively, or even made barely competitive.
This post is ridiculous. You're being a drama queen.
I'm a gallente specialist, the EANM nerf annoyed me, but to suggest you *NEED* HG slave implants and 5% damage implants or the ship wont work is absolutely ludicrous.
I don't have run with a slave set. I have my comp skills at IV. And yet, I still kill almost every other BS quite comfortably if I land close enough. Thats how it should be - close range do or die.
Your melodramatic posts are not exactly helping the Gallente cause here, you are making yourself look like an expectant fool who wants a 'solo pwn machine' to win in every possible scenario you may encounter.
The megathron isnt perfect, but to suggest you need HG slave and 5% damage implants, and ridiculous level V skills which convey a 1% increase in resistances, is frankly idiotic.
---------- signature removed - please do not discuss moderation in your signature graphic - Jacques([email protected])
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Lore Isander
Caldari Sybrite Inc.
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Posted - 2007.06.21 07:24:00 -
[165]
Originally by: 50freefly Ever try a platethron? Those work...
Like I said in the last page, it doesnt work against competant pilot without slaves  ---
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murder one
Gallente Death of Virtue Vigilance Infinitas
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Posted - 2007.06.21 07:39:00 -
[166]
Originally by: Butter Dog
This post is ridiculous. You're being a drama queen.
I'm a gallente specialist, the EANM nerf annoyed me, but to suggest you *NEED* HG slave implants and 5% damage implants or the ship wont work is absolutely ludicrous.
I don't have run with a slave set. I have my comp skills at IV. And yet, I still kill almost every other BS quite comfortably if I land close enough. Thats how it should be - close range do or die.
Your melodramatic posts are not exactly helping the Gallente cause here, you are making yourself look like an expectant fool who wants a 'solo pwn machine' to win in every possible scenario you may encounter.
The megathron isnt perfect, but to suggest you need HG slave and 5% damage implants, and ridiculous level V skills which convey a 1% increase in resistances, is frankly idiot
I can make a Typhoon, Dominix, Rokh, Abaddon, Maelstrom, Scorpion etc. etc. that will kill your Blasterthron 1v1 every time. I'll even let you start at 3km optimal. I know I can do it because I know I can tank 100% of your damage with those ships and simply wait for you to run out of cap and die.
I fly a Blasterthron at 10/10ths. I use every resource available to me to max out my DPS and try and get it to work, yet it still fails miserably when compared to other battleships with basic T2 fits and only L4 skills. Pretty weak.
And rest assured you'd lose horribly if you tried to 1v1 my Blasterthron with it's slaves with yours without.
BUYING ZAINOU 'DEADEYE' ZGL1000 IMPLANTS, PAYING WELL, CONVO/MAIL IN-GAME |

Gamesguy
Amarr E X O D U S Imperial Republic Of the North
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Posted - 2007.06.21 09:10:00 -
[167]
Originally by: murder one
Originally by: Butter Dog
This post is ridiculous. You're being a drama queen.
I'm a gallente specialist, the EANM nerf annoyed me, but to suggest you *NEED* HG slave implants and 5% damage implants or the ship wont work is absolutely ludicrous.
I don't have run with a slave set. I have my comp skills at IV. And yet, I still kill almost every other BS quite comfortably if I land close enough. Thats how it should be - close range do or die.
Your melodramatic posts are not exactly helping the Gallente cause here, you are making yourself look like an expectant fool who wants a 'solo pwn machine' to win in every possible scenario you may encounter.
The megathron isnt perfect, but to suggest you need HG slave and 5% damage implants, and ridiculous level V skills which convey a 1% increase in resistances, is frankly idiot
I can make a Typhoon, Dominix, Rokh, Abaddon, Maelstrom, Scorpion etc. etc. that will kill your Blasterthron 1v1 every time. I'll even let you start at 3km optimal. I know I can do it because I know I can tank 100% of your damage with those ships and simply wait for you to run out of cap and die.
I fly a Blasterthron at 10/10ths. I use every resource available to me to max out my DPS and try and get it to work, yet it still fails miserably when compared to other battleships with basic T2 fits and only L4 skills. Pretty weak.
And rest assured you'd lose horribly if you tried to 1v1 my Blasterthron with it's slaves with yours without.
Now you're being a ******. You're not even complaining about the EANM nerf anymore, but rather that tank+nos is overpowered.
What you think the pulse geddon, blaster rokh, etc have an easier time than the blaster mega? I bet I can build a nos/tank mega that will beat your nos/tank abaddon, scorp, etc senseless.
What does the EANM nerf have to do with nos+tank+drones being overpowered atm? 
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Vasiliyan
The Flying Swan
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Posted - 2007.06.21 09:24:00 -
[168]
Have you looked at the new, cheap, widely available faction EANMs? The gallente navy ones look like costing about 10-15m, with T2 stats and 30 cpu fitting.
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Spaced Skunk
D00M. Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2007.06.21 09:27:00 -
[169]
'Elite' 
Over the past year or so; Null, increased tracking bonus, damage controls changed (this change boosted Gallente so so much).
If any ship has got easier to fly, its the Megathron.
Still annoys me to this day on how overpowered imo Null is, being a Minmatar pilot and all. Your excellent range and dps on Null means I cannot use my Tempest's good range and extra bit of speed to effectiveness.
Quote: Blasterthrons need maxed out skills in order to get that last 10-15% DPS increase in order to compete with the tremendous tanking increases brought about by rigs and the Tier 3 battleships. It's quite easy to build a Rokh or Maelstrom or Dominx, or even a Typhoon with relatively little ISK and less than maximum skills that is competitive with other battleship setups in PVP. With the Blasterthron (and also the Blaster Hype), if you don't have every applicable skill to five, you're probably going to die in a 1v1 fight with another BS if it's properly fit for PVP.
Phoon isnt hard to fit, and is way more SP intensive than the Mega, Tempest needs level 5 battleship and t2 guns to start being a good battleship, anyone ever tried a Tempest at level 4 with t1 best named guns? Its bad damage. However I like hard mode, and I like Minmatar ships.
Point being, Megathron for the elite and nerfed to hell? 
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Butter Dog
The Littlest Hobos Betrayal Under Mayhem
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Posted - 2007.06.21 09:42:00 -
[170]
Originally by: murder one
Originally by: Butter Dog
This post is ridiculous. You're being a drama queen.
I'm a gallente specialist, the EANM nerf annoyed me, but to suggest you *NEED* HG slave implants and 5% damage implants or the ship wont work is absolutely ludicrous.
I don't have run with a slave set. I have my comp skills at IV. And yet, I still kill almost every other BS quite comfortably if I land close enough. Thats how it should be - close range do or die.
Your melodramatic posts are not exactly helping the Gallente cause here, you are making yourself look like an expectant fool who wants a 'solo pwn machine' to win in every possible scenario you may encounter.
The megathron isnt perfect, but to suggest you need HG slave and 5% damage implants, and ridiculous level V skills which convey a 1% increase in resistances, is frankly idiot
I can make a Typhoon, Dominix, Rokh, Abaddon, Maelstrom, Scorpion etc. etc. that will kill your Blasterthron 1v1 every time. I'll even let you start at 3km optimal. I know I can do it because I know I can tank 100% of your damage with those ships and simply wait for you to run out of cap and die.
I fly a Blasterthron at 10/10ths. I use every resource available to me to max out my DPS and try and get it to work, yet it still fails miserably when compared to other battleships with basic T2 fits and only L4 skills. Pretty weak.
And rest assured you'd lose horribly if you tried to 1v1 my Blasterthron with it's slaves with yours without.
Any fool can specifically fit against a blasterthron and win. Not difficult. That proves nothing. Technically a nub in a T1 pest with some tracking disruptors will win hands down, but we're entering the realms of stupidity.
And yes, with two identically fitted blasterthrons, one with slave implants the other without - you will win in a 1v1 with your slaves.
But get real here. How often is that going to happen? What you want is a ship which can win against everything, everytime, and anything less just isnt good enough.
The point remains - you DONT need expensive implants to make the ship work, in most cases. You mentioning 1v1's which are never likely to happen, or people specifically fitting against you - well, that just goes to show how weak your arguement has become.
Dont underestimate the power of luck in this game. There is no such thing as a 'sure' win in EVE, and there never will be. But you have a good enough chance to beat most battleships, in most normal fittings, if you catch them at close range in a well fitted blasterthron (without 1bn worth of implants).
---------- signature removed - please do not discuss moderation in your signature graphic - Jacques([email protected])
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Lore Isander
Caldari Sybrite Inc.
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Posted - 2007.06.21 09:46:00 -
[171]
Originally by: Spaced Skunk 'Elite' 
Over the past year or so; Null, increased tracking bonus, damage controls changed (this change boosted Gallente so so much).
If any ship has got easier to fly, its the Megathron.
Still annoys me to this day on how overpowered imo Null is, being a Minmatar pilot and all. Your excellent range and dps on Null means I cannot use my Tempest's good range and extra bit of speed to effectiveness.
Quote: Blasterthrons need maxed out skills in order to get that last 10-15% DPS increase in order to compete with the tremendous tanking increases brought about by rigs and the Tier 3 battleships. It's quite easy to build a Rokh or Maelstrom or Dominx, or even a Typhoon with relatively little ISK and less than maximum skills that is competitive with other battleship setups in PVP. With the Blasterthron (and also the Blaster Hype), if you don't have every applicable skill to five, you're probably going to die in a 1v1 fight with another BS if it's properly fit for PVP.
Phoon isnt hard to fit, and is way more SP intensive than the Mega, Tempest needs level 5 battleship and t2 guns to start being a good battleship, anyone ever tried a Tempest at level 4 with t1 best named guns? Its bad damage. However I like hard mode, and I like Minmatar ships.
Point being, Megathron for the elite and nerfed to hell? 
Null tracking bonus? WTF?!
There is nothing but tracking penalty on Null. ---
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Ione Hunt
0utbreak
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Posted - 2007.06.21 10:13:00 -
[172]
Originally by: Lore Isander
Originally by: 50freefly Ever try a platethron? Those work...
Like I said in the last page, it doesnt work against competant pilot without slaves 
Platathron works fine without slaves and mediocre skills (aka ~12-18mil sp), I know 'cause I don't use slaves...got a bad habit of clonejumping with implants.
If you want to fly a gankathron, yes, you'll need top skills to get that last few percentage of damage. _______________
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Lore Isander
Caldari Sybrite Inc.
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Posted - 2007.06.21 10:33:00 -
[173]
Originally by: Ione Hunt
Originally by: Lore Isander
Originally by: 50freefly Ever try a platethron? Those work...
Like I said in the last page, it doesnt work against competant pilot without slaves 
Platathron works fine without slaves and mediocre skills (aka ~12-18mil sp), I know 'cause I don't use slaves...got a bad habit of clonejumping with implants.
If you want to fly a gankathron, yes, you'll need top skills to get that last few percentage of damage.
It works, but like I'm saying for 3rd or 4th time, it doesnt work against a pilot who fits his ships properly and has similiar skills.
But with Slaves it works against those too (I know this from experience). ---
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Tibrius Archer
Kurai-Komichi Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2007.06.21 12:07:00 -
[174]
Originally by: The RepoMan did it ever occur to you that your perception that mass dps to win is a valid play tactic is in itself flawed, and that the months of "nerfs" that change this should probably tip you off that ccp thinks the same?
You claim balance on a 1v1 level but seem to want to win on a 1v1 level, I mean, seriously buddy get a clue. Blasterthrons, especially plated/passive ones are allready overpowered in most situations.
Mass DPS is a valid play tactic. CCP STILL think so, they just want it all to take longer so they can add more features in combat. Eve is not HOMEWORLD its it is a RPG and RPGs are tipically sill elf based affairs but eve is this to a point to. The Gallante are clearly the the "Warriors/Beserkers" the caldari are clearly the "ranged magicians" the Minmatar are clearly "night elves" with a blend of both combat and magic, very sleek and fast.
Removing the warrior i.e the gallante high DPS as a valid play tactic leaves what??? A lot of people jamming each other? Ships being undefeatable 1v1. Being undefeatable 1v1 is something the devs DID say they did not want to happen when they made the HP boost.
High damage still does work and should work. Should just take longer. Solo play has being killed by battles taking sumwhat longer meaning people always have time to rally friends. Plus if you a pirate you have to sit longer under the sentry guns.
I would like to point out another way the megas have been boosted in the patchs... Smaller cap charges where needed to scale tanking times, but when used to fuel a MWD you can fly relatvily futher than before... Meaning these days its worth a mega pilot chasing you down from obsene ranges and he will still be successful.
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"Get in my way and I will burn your fleet from stem to stern" |

n0thing
omen. D-L
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Posted - 2007.06.21 13:00:00 -
[175]
Originally by: Tom Gunn rofl at the idea of a T2 Blaster fitted BS with T2 tank mods being 'entry level'
By spectacular he meant not skill req`s, the idea was that even such T2 standart kit needs a ton of ISK to fit. While not having any fancy stuff like Tobias`s Disruptors or Chelm`s nosfs. ---
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Spaced Skunk
D00M. Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2007.06.21 17:04:00 -
[176]
Originally by: Lore Isander
Originally by: Spaced Skunk 'Elite' 
alallsa372374
Null tracking bonus? WTF?!
There is nothing but tracking penalty on Null.
It wasnt clear but I meant Megas tracking bonus was increased a while back from 5 to 7.5% per level. As did all the other ships (2.5 increase) that had a tracking bonus.
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KD.Fluffy
The Refugees
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Posted - 2007.06.21 20:51:00 -
[177]
Quote: Guess what? I fly a Drake too. Why? It's really friggin good! It was nerfed (slightly) with Rev2. Guess what? I'm not whining about it! Why? Because it's FAIR! The Drake is STILL REALLY GOOD! It can still do it's job. It still has a great passive tank. IMO the nerf wasn't enough. It can still passive tank exceptionally well, and my shields now idle at 74% instead of 85% when being fired on by sentries.
The nerf didn't change a dang thing for my ship.
Guess what... if you use all 7 of your lows lots and mid slots, and rig slots for an armor tank on your mega its going to tank like mad, even with the nerf. LOL the devs watn you to pick tank, or gank. Not both. These mega setups with 40k armor and omni resisted are over the top, end of story. If you want to tank fit some freakin ion blasters dude, I promise your damage will still be very reasonable. If you want to fly pure gank, fly with some ecm buddies. Also, stop crying about getting nerfed dude. It happens to everyone in eve.
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welsh wizard
0utbreak
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Posted - 2007.06.21 22:47:00 -
[178]
Edited by: welsh wizard on 21/06/2007 22:53:04 Besides the point, the blasterthron is still the most effective 1v1 battleship bar the Dominix & perhaps a Geddon in skilled hands.
Forget the numbers, just have a look at a few killboards instead. If you're so experienced then base your opinions on your experiences, not hypothetical situations and theoretical limits/constraints. If you're so certain of your argument go and solo in a Raven, Scorpion or even a Tempest, I guarentee you'll get flattened frequently.
It's arguably the most flexible battleship in the game given its ability in fleet, alone & in small gangs. I don't think there is another battleship that excels in all these areas apart from the Geddon, but thats open to debate.
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madaluap
Gallente Mercenary Forces Exquisite Malevolence
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Posted - 2007.06.21 23:04:00 -
[179]
lol wtf...
A neut plate thron will wtf own in tank and fire power. These things take ages to take down. Serieusly quit the ******* whining. I got up to 40k armor without slaves, when i jumped into the slaveset is was even better. And thats on a ship that deals 1000+ dps and is pretty much *immune* yes i said *immune* to nos.
Cause ya just need to fire zeh guns mkay. _________________________________________________ Breetime
A killmail!11!1 omgrawr: BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOYAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA |

Tommy Vercetti
Queens of the Stone Age Anarchy Empire
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Posted - 2007.06.21 23:05:00 -
[180]
Edited by: Tommy Vercetti on 21/06/2007 23:05:08
Originally by: murder one I can kill a max skilled T2 Blasterthron with a T2 tanked, T1 everything else Typhoon any day of the week. Even T1 drones. Piece of cake. Heck, I did it on test with only Min BS2 and Torps1. It's that easy.
I call BS. Unless your talking about a typhoon specifically fit for encountering solo megas. Any solo phoon will get owned by a blasterthron, even a phoon with the gank trimark fit. Mega only needs to take out the drones and 1/3 the dps is gone already.
The only breaker against a mega is nos (i.e a full rack of it), which also happens to be a breaker against most ships in the game anyway.
Originally by: "Janu Hull"
Nothing says gritty cynicism like a 1 ISK note wedged between a pair of silicone enhanced knockers.[/qu
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trouser boy
The Eve Pacification Syndicate
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Posted - 2007.06.21 23:07:00 -
[181]
Tbh the nos isn't a breaker if you pack adequate 800's. Almost all BS are long dead to a plated Thron before its even got half way through its boosters.
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murder one
Gallente Death of Virtue Vigilance Infinitas
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Posted - 2007.06.21 23:35:00 -
[182]
Originally by: Tommy Vercetti Edited by: Tommy Vercetti on 21/06/2007 23:05:08
Originally by: murder one I can kill a max skilled T2 Blasterthron with a T2 tanked, T1 everything else Typhoon any day of the week. Even T1 drones. Piece of cake. Heck, I did it on test with only Min BS2 and Torps1. It's that easy.
I call BS. Unless your talking about a typhoon specifically fit for encountering solo megas. Any solo phoon will get owned by a blasterthron, even a phoon with the gank trimark fit. Mega only needs to take out the drones and 1/3 the dps is gone already.
The only breaker against a mega is nos (i.e a full rack of it), which also happens to be a breaker against most ships in the game anyway.
4 torp 4 nos phoon with dual rep armor tank will kill any Blasterthron in the game 1v1. Simply because I can tank 100% of it's damage, while removing cap from the target, until he runs out of tank and cap.
BUYING ZAINOU 'DEADEYE' ZGL1000 IMPLANTS, PAYING WELL, CONVO/MAIL IN-GAME |

Murukan
Minmatar Chaos Reborn
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Posted - 2007.06.22 00:15:00 -
[183]
Originally by: murder one
Originally by: Tommy Vercetti Edited by: Tommy Vercetti on 21/06/2007 23:05:08
Originally by: murder one I can kill a max skilled T2 Blasterthron with a T2 tanked, T1 everything else Typhoon any day of the week. Even T1 drones. Piece of cake. Heck, I did it on test with only Min BS2 and Torps1. It's that easy.
I call BS. Unless your talking about a typhoon specifically fit for encountering solo megas. Any solo phoon will get owned by a blasterthron, even a phoon with the gank trimark fit. Mega only needs to take out the drones and 1/3 the dps is gone already.
The only breaker against a mega is nos (i.e a full rack of it), which also happens to be a breaker against most ships in the game anyway.
4 torp 4 nos phoon with dual rep armor tank will kill any Blasterthron in the game 1v1. Simply because I can tank 100% of it's damage, while removing cap from the target, until he runs out of tank and cap.
You mean like how a nos domi can do the same thing?   
Manlove by Zaphod Jones
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Benglada
Infinitus Odium
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Posted - 2007.06.22 02:04:00 -
[184]
Originally by: E Vile Edited by: E Vile on 19/06/2007 08:09:52 Sorry, but you are completely full of it.
All Tier 3 BS are far more expensive and AT LEAST just as skill intensive to fly correctly.
LOL they are the easiest to fit by far.
try fitting a mega. OOPS YOUR 100 CPU SHORT!
try fitting a hyperion HEY YOUV GOT OODLES OF CPU! ---------------------------
Originally by: Arkanor
0.0 is the Final Frontier. Bring money and friends.
Sig nerfz0r - maximum allowed siz0r is 24000 bytz0r. - Devil ([email protected]) Sig By Ortos |

KD.Fluffy
The Refugees
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Posted - 2007.06.22 02:10:00 -
[185]
Quote: 4 torp 4 nos phoon with dual rep armor tank will kill any Blasterthron in the game 1v1. Simply because I can tank 100% of it's damage, while removing cap from the target, until he runs out of tank and cap.
With this kidna of logic...... I can fit a scorpian with 4 nos and 2 torpedos and tank the mega all day..... while nossing him and kill him LMFAO
dude, im sorry ships can counter your setups, get the **** over it.
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murder one
Gallente Death of Virtue Vigilance Infinitas
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Posted - 2007.06.22 02:32:00 -
[186]
Originally by: Murukan
Originally by: murder one
Originally by: Tommy Vercetti Edited by: Tommy Vercetti on 21/06/2007 23:05:08
Originally by: murder one I can kill a max skilled T2 Blasterthron with a T2 tanked, T1 everything else Typhoon any day of the week. Even T1 drones. Piece of cake. Heck, I did it on test with only Min BS2 and Torps1. It's that easy.
I call BS. Unless your talking about a typhoon specifically fit for encountering solo megas. Any solo phoon will get owned by a blasterthron, even a phoon with the gank trimark fit. Mega only needs to take out the drones and 1/3 the dps is gone already.
The only breaker against a mega is nos (i.e a full rack of it), which also happens to be a breaker against most ships in the game anyway.
4 torp 4 nos phoon with dual rep armor tank will kill any Blasterthron in the game 1v1. Simply because I can tank 100% of it's damage, while removing cap from the target, until he runs out of tank and cap.
You mean like how a nos domi can do the same thing?   
Can't shoot hte torps off a Phoon. 
Neeeext..
BUYING ZAINOU 'DEADEYE' ZGL1000 IMPLANTS, PAYING WELL, CONVO/MAIL IN-GAME |

Vincent Almasy
Gallente The Underground
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Posted - 2007.06.22 05:17:00 -
[187]
Please post your set up so we can just see what's wrong with it, K?
If your blaster for max DPS is killin, look into your own tank maybe? Try using ECM drones? If you are worried about nod switch to a Hyperion for better tank and use t1 ammo and not t1, better range and tracking as well as have longer range ammo as people now have brains and try to dictate the range.
And for distance higher dps + nos for matar ships it i a tempest over the maelstrom as the tier three does half a turrent more after bonuses with 8 runs to the tempests's 6 and the temp has then blank slots to add in something there.
Is blasterthon was really so bad now it would be felt in all blaster ships just just the mega but down to the frigate level.
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KD.Fluffy
The Refugees
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Posted - 2007.06.22 05:31:00 -
[188]
no you can't shoot the phoons torps off. But you can easily jamm them off you... can't do that against a domi... NEXT rofl. Oh, good luck blowing up three flights of heavy drones......
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murder one
Gallente Death of Virtue Vigilance Infinitas
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Posted - 2007.06.22 05:33:00 -
[189]
Originally by: Vincent Almasy Please post your set up so we can just see what's wrong with it, K?
If your blaster for max DPS is killin, look into your own tank maybe? Try using ECM drones? If you are worried about nod switch to a Hyperion for better tank and use t1 ammo and not t1, better range and tracking as well as have longer range ammo as people now have brains and try to dictate the range.
And for distance higher dps + nos for matar ships it i a tempest over the maelstrom as the tier three does half a turrent more after bonuses with 8 runs to the tempests's 6 and the temp has then blank slots to add in something there.
Is blasterthon was really so bad now it would be felt in all blaster ships just just the mega but down to the frigate level.
Re-read the thread. I've posted quite a few very good setups.
BUYING ZAINOU 'DEADEYE' ZGL1000 IMPLANTS, PAYING WELL, CONVO/MAIL IN-GAME |

Vincent Almasy
Gallente The Underground
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Posted - 2007.06.22 05:36:00 -
[190]
Originally by: KD.Fluffy no you can't shoot the phoons torps off. But you can easily jamm them off you... can't do that against a domi... NEXT rofl. Oh, good luck blowing up three flights of heavy drones......
Don't forget some might be e-war heavies(not nerfed) to start it all off. Not long before, you are webbed, scrambled and nossed to hell and back and set to go back when you see them start to use their heavy drones to attack.
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Erotic Irony
0bsession
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Posted - 2007.06.22 05:50:00 -
[191]
Originally by: murder
LOL. I'm in 0.0 all the time. Putting bubbles up on gates and popping haulers from 180km away with my sniperthron is pretty boring.
Not according to your kb you're not. Your kb shows murder killing haulers in hi sec with a crane and other one gun haulers. Your pvp god alt, Bellum Eternus, has been doing nothing but lowsec in Decon for many days nonstop.
Originally by: murder The Hype is a garbage blaster ship when compared to the Megathron. The only advantage that the Hype has over the Mega is that it can actively tank 100% of a Mega's DPS and just wait for it to cap out and die.
Translation: Despite my obsession with DPS, my nuetron-void hyperion lost to Arnold's electron hyp, thus it is a bad ship. What happened there? ___ Junkie Beverage: i use your tears to cyno in my laughter
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Vincent Almasy
Gallente The Underground
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Posted - 2007.06.22 05:55:00 -
[192]
Originally by: murder one Edited by: murder one on 19/06/2007 19:29:04 A halfway decent setup after Rev2:
Megathron-
Highs: 7x Ion2s w/ Void. (Haven't tried it with faction AM yet)
Mids: T2 mwd, fleeting web, faint 20km scram, T2 heavy injector w/ 800s.
Lows: Large Accom Rep, 1600 Tungsten plate, Internal Force Field Array DC, 2x T2 EANM w/ Comp skills @5, 2x Mag field stabs.
Drones: Berserker IIs (5) or Ogre IIs (5) depending on expected targets.
Rigs: 3x Trimark Armor Rigs.
Implants: (this setup **will not** work without these implants) High Grade Slave set (~1.4+ bil ISK), +5% all turret damage implant (~250m+ ISK), +5% Large Hybrid implant (~250m+ ISK).
-Switch to ecm drones. That is step one. -Ditch t2 ammo for t1 or faction, the pen is too much. -Don't *need* the dmg imps, but they help. -Put a med neut in high. maybe a td in mid as you show it empty as ya not using so much cap ya need two injectors. -Keep more then one type of ammo on board. -If soon needed change ion or electron. -You are a slug with what ya got on, a 1600 and 3 armor rigs but your tactic. -Look into playing with other e-war and if you have so much get a hype and faction tank it so much it can tank a carrier's 10 fighters with a dual inject.
That what is what can already see from this point. If you want to to better look into resist then just mass HP. maybe a duel rep tank would work better for you with a hype is prefered from 37.5% rep bonus
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murder one
Gallente Death of Virtue Vigilance Infinitas
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Posted - 2007.06.22 06:44:00 -
[193]
Originally by: Erotic Irony
Originally by: murder
LOL. I'm in 0.0 all the time. Putting bubbles up on gates and popping haulers from 180km away with my sniperthron is pretty boring.
Not according to your kb you're not. Your kb shows murder killing haulers in hi sec with a crane and other one gun haulers. Your pvp god alt, Bellum Eternus, has been doing nothing but lowsec in Decon for many days nonstop.
Originally by: murder The Hype is a garbage blaster ship when compared to the Megathron. The only advantage that the Hype has over the Mega is that it can actively tank 100% of a Mega's DPS and just wait for it to cap out and die.
Translation: Despite my obsession with DPS, my nuetron-void hyperion lost to Arnold's electron hyp, thus it is a bad ship. What happened there?
Third char.. OHO...
BUYING ZAINOU 'DEADEYE' ZGL1000 IMPLANTS, PAYING WELL, CONVO/MAIL IN-GAME |

murder one
Gallente Death of Virtue Vigilance Infinitas
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Posted - 2007.06.22 07:01:00 -
[194]
Originally by: Vincent Almasy
Originally by: murder one Edited by: murder one on 19/06/2007 19:29:04 A halfway decent setup after Rev2:
Megathron-
Highs: 7x Ion2s w/ Void. (Haven't tried it with faction AM yet)
Mids: T2 mwd, fleeting web, faint 20km scram, T2 heavy injector w/ 800s.
Lows: Large Accom Rep, 1600 Tungsten plate, Internal Force Field Array DC, 2x T2 EANM w/ Comp skills @5, 2x Mag field stabs.
Drones: Berserker IIs (5) or Ogre IIs (5) depending on expected targets.
Rigs: 3x Trimark Armor Rigs.
Implants: (this setup **will not** work without these implants) High Grade Slave set (~1.4+ bil ISK), +5% all turret damage implant (~250m+ ISK), +5% Large Hybrid implant (~250m+ ISK).
-Switch to ecm drones. That is step one. -Ditch t2 ammo for t1 or faction, the pen is too much. -Don't *need* the dmg imps, but they help. -Put a med neut in high. maybe a td in mid as you show it empty as ya not using so much cap ya need two injectors. -Keep more then one type of ammo on board. -If soon needed change ion or electron. -You are a slug with what ya got on, a 1600 and 3 armor rigs but your tactic. -Look into playing with other e-war and if you have so much get a hype and faction tank it so much it can tank a carrier's 10 fighters with a dual inject.
That what is what can already see from this point. If you want to to better look into resist then just mass HP. maybe a duel rep tank would work better for you with a hype is prefered from 37.5% rep bonus
I built a dual heavy injector Ion Hype with dual large reps once. All tanking rigs. It was crazy. It could hold up to quite a bit of nos too, with two heavy injectors to feed the reps.
Anyway, big bucks, but it could tank. I attacked a Drake outside of a station in .4 with it. Pure comedy. Drake pilot was a low SP noob, but I didn't have the DPS with maxed skills and 8x T2 Ions with Void to break his tank.
I happily tanked the station guns and his missiles until I ran out of cap charges. I had my buddies ferry me MORE cap charges from the station. More than once. It was crazy.
I ran out of ammo for my guns (over 2k worth) without breaking his tank. So..., I had my buddies scramble him, I docked, hopped in a Neutron Hype with all damage mods, no tank, and undocked and killed him in about 8 vollies.
Does this prove that the Hype or Mega is accepably balanced and working fine? No. It proves that tank heavy setups don't work on a ship that uses cap for it's primary weapons. Especially when even with a full rack of medium sized T2 battleship guns using high damage ammo, you can't break a BC tank.
It doesn't matter how good of a tank you have with a blaster ship if you can't break the other guys tank. You will run out of cap, and you will die. Every time.
BUYING ZAINOU 'DEADEYE' ZGL1000 IMPLANTS, PAYING WELL, CONVO/MAIL IN-GAME |

Ione Hunt
0utbreak
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Posted - 2007.06.22 09:15:00 -
[195]
Originally by: murder one
Originally by: Tommy Vercetti Edited by: Tommy Vercetti on 21/06/2007 23:05:08
Originally by: murder one I can kill a max skilled T2 Blasterthron with a T2 tanked, T1 everything else Typhoon any day of the week. Even T1 drones. Piece of cake. Heck, I did it on test with only Min BS2 and Torps1. It's that easy.
I call BS. Unless your talking about a typhoon specifically fit for encountering solo megas. Any solo phoon will get owned by a blasterthron, even a phoon with the gank trimark fit. Mega only needs to take out the drones and 1/3 the dps is gone already.
The only breaker against a mega is nos (i.e a full rack of it), which also happens to be a breaker against most ships in the game anyway.
4 torp 4 nos phoon with dual rep armor tank will kill any Blasterthron in the game 1v1. Simply because I can tank 100% of it's damage, while removing cap from the target, until he runs out of tank and cap.
  Depends on the blasterthron setup and pilot...but unless you specifically tank for therm/kin, there is NO WAY you will tank my blasterthron. And even then you'll have a hard time...NOS doesn't really hurt my mega all that much tbh. _______________
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murder one
Gallente Death of Virtue Vigilance Infinitas
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Posted - 2007.06.22 10:29:00 -
[196]
Originally by: Ione Hunt
Originally by: murder one
Originally by: Tommy Vercetti Edited by: Tommy Vercetti on 21/06/2007 23:05:08
Originally by: murder one I can kill a max skilled T2 Blasterthron with a T2 tanked, T1 everything else Typhoon any day of the week. Even T1 drones. Piece of cake. Heck, I did it on test with only Min BS2 and Torps1. It's that easy.
I call BS. Unless your talking about a typhoon specifically fit for encountering solo megas. Any solo phoon will get owned by a blasterthron, even a phoon with the gank trimark fit. Mega only needs to take out the drones and 1/3 the dps is gone already.
The only breaker against a mega is nos (i.e a full rack of it), which also happens to be a breaker against most ships in the game anyway.
4 torp 4 nos phoon with dual rep armor tank will kill any Blasterthron in the game 1v1. Simply because I can tank 100% of it's damage, while removing cap from the target, until he runs out of tank and cap.
  Depends on the blasterthron setup and pilot...but unless you specifically tank for therm/kin, there is NO WAY you will tank my blasterthron. And even then you'll have a hard time...NOS doesn't really hurt my mega all that much tbh.
Sure there is. Quite easily in fact. And without double tanking for Kin/Therm.
BUYING ZAINOU 'DEADEYE' ZGL1000 IMPLANTS, PAYING WELL, CONVO/MAIL IN-GAME |

Ione Hunt
0utbreak
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Posted - 2007.06.22 12:22:00 -
[197]
Edited by: Ione Hunt on 22/06/2007 12:22:07
Originally by: murder one
Originally by: Ione Hunt
Originally by: murder one
Originally by: Tommy Vercetti Edited by: Tommy Vercetti on 21/06/2007 23:05:08
Originally by: murder one I can kill a max skilled T2 Blasterthron with a T2 tanked, T1 everything else Typhoon any day of the week. Even T1 drones. Piece of cake. Heck, I did it on test with only Min BS2 and Torps1. It's that easy.
I call BS. Unless your talking about a typhoon specifically fit for encountering solo megas. Any solo phoon will get owned by a blasterthron, even a phoon with the gank trimark fit. Mega only needs to take out the drones and 1/3 the dps is gone already.
The only breaker against a mega is nos (i.e a full rack of it), which also happens to be a breaker against most ships in the game anyway.
4 torp 4 nos phoon with dual rep armor tank will kill any Blasterthron in the game 1v1. Simply because I can tank 100% of it's damage, while removing cap from the target, until he runs out of tank and cap.
  Depends on the blasterthron setup and pilot...but unless you specifically tank for therm/kin, there is NO WAY you will tank my blasterthron. And even then you'll have a hard time...NOS doesn't really hurt my mega all that much tbh.
Sure there is. Quite easily in fact. And without double tanking for Kin/Therm.
\o/ Challenge! TQ or SISI (better SISI, my blasterthrons are kinda far south atm)? Ship scanner will ensure no double tanking kin/therm and we'll see who stands in the end 
I'm on all weekend as of 10pm tonight.
PS: EW does not count as tanking btw Or else you could say you can "tank" a Blasterthron in a Rifter with a tracking disruptor... _______________
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Lux Simian
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Posted - 2007.06.23 12:35:00 -
[198]
Originally by: Erichk Knaar I've killed a few, but I've also had my a$$ wtfhanded to me by them on more than one occasion. It's one of those setups that favors the brave/stupid. Seeing a blasterthron pilot kill 2-3 enemy before he goes down is a thing of beauty. Those that pull it off with regularity, are elite, so, I don't see the point of the post. Adapt...
Which is what the Blasterthon is all about, the Charge of the T2 Ion Brigade. A ship thats all about the glory of crashing through the enemy lines and killing as many as possible before succumbing to its wounds. If you reach the enemy, then they are truely f**ked.
Nothing in high sec compares to the sight of a Megathon with three flanking brutix charging towards you in a halo of angry T2 Drones. Its like death coming for you through the window with flashbangs....
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Vincent Almasy
Gallente The Underground
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Posted - 2007.06.23 16:03:00 -
[199]
Originally by: murder one
Originally by: Vincent Almasy
Originally by: murder one Edited by: murder one on 19/06/2007 19:29:04 A halfway decent setup after Rev2:
Megathron-
Highs: 7x Ion2s w/ Void. (Haven't tried it with faction AM yet)
Mids: T2 mwd, fleeting web, faint 20km scram, T2 heavy injector w/ 800s.
Lows: Large Accom Rep, 1600 Tungsten plate, Internal Force Field Array DC, 2x T2 EANM w/ Comp skills @5, 2x Mag field stabs.
Drones: Berserker IIs (5) or Ogre IIs (5) depending on expected targets.
Rigs: 3x Trimark Armor Rigs.
Implants: (this setup **will not** work without these implants) High Grade Slave set (~1.4+ bil ISK), +5% all turret damage implant (~250m+ ISK), +5% Large Hybrid implant (~250m+ ISK).
-Switch to ecm drones. That is step one. -Ditch t2 ammo for t1 or faction, the pen is too much. -Don't *need* the dmg imps, but they help. -Put a med neut in high. maybe a td in mid as you show it empty as ya not using so much cap ya need two injectors. -Keep more then one type of ammo on board. -If soon needed change ion or electron. -You are a slug with what ya got on, a 1600 and 3 armor rigs but your tactic. -Look into playing with other e-war and if you have so much get a hype and faction tank it so much it can tank a carrier's 10 fighters with a dual inject.
That what is what can already see from this point. If you want to to better look into resist then just mass HP. maybe a duel rep tank would work better for you with a hype is prefered from 37.5% rep bonus
I built a dual heavy injector Ion Hype with dual large reps once. All tanking rigs. It was crazy. It could hold up to quite a bit of nos too, with two heavy injectors to feed the reps.
Anyway, big bucks, but it could tank. I attacked a Drake outside of a station in .4 with it. Pure comedy. Drake pilot was a low SP noob, but I didn't have the DPS with maxed skills and 8x T2 Ions with Void to break his tank.
I happily tanked the station guns and his missiles until I ran out of cap charges. I had my buddies ferry me MORE cap charges from the station. More than once. It was crazy.
I ran out of ammo for my guns (over 2k worth) without breaking his tank. So..., I had my buddies scramble him, I docked, hopped in a Neutron Hype with all damage mods, no tank, and undocked and killed him in about 8 vollies.
Does this prove that the Hype or Mega is accepably balanced and working fine? No. It proves that tank heavy setups don't work on a ship that uses cap for it's primary weapons. Especially when even with a full rack of medium sized T2 battleship guns using high damage ammo, you can't break a BC tank.
It doesn't matter how good of a tank you have with a blaster ship if you can't break the other guys tank. You will run out of cap, and you will die. Every time.
.....a BS and a high sp pilot shouldn't break then noobs tank.. how much dps were you doing and how much was each volley doing to his shields?
Just so you know not all pilots omni, what system rats were you dealing with, he could of had high resists on th and kn for deal with rats but from you being in a gal ship you might of been only doing those two dmgs, lol.
How old was this 'noob' as most times people like that are alts of a older char so faster and more refined learning times and a good setup. also what range was it, point blank or did it manage to dictate it to about 7km+ stably as well as his avg speed while webbed?
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KD.Fluffy
The Refugees
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Posted - 2007.06.23 17:57:00 -
[200]
Quote: Does this prove that the Hype or Mega is accepably balanced and working fine? No. It proves that tank heavy setups don't work on a ship that uses cap for it's primary weapons. Especially when even with a full rack of medium sized T2 battleship guns using high damage ammo, you can't break a BC tank.
This just further reinforces the reason to fly in gangs. You can't expect to break many peoples tank using medium sized guns with no damage mods. Now if you had 3-4 super tanked hyperions like this, you could easily break anythings tank while anything attacking you will have a very tough time doing so. Talk to amarr, they have cap heavy tanks and weapons. Yet they can field arguably the strongest tanks in the game.
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el caido
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Posted - 2007.06.24 03:09:00 -
[201]
Lots of different directions in this thread ...
murder one, you're absolutely right, a blasterthron is an all-or-nothing ship. Your initial sentence perfectly summarizes this debate ... I just don't think you fully-comprehend its meaning.
As the community has responded, there are many ways to fit the beast, and many ways this can be countered in the current nos-happy PVP environment. There is no problem here. Effective Gallente blaster boats inflict a frightening amount of damage, but concordantly sacrifice much of their defences. Find a wingman, start fitting nos, discover railguns, or stop b*tching about blasterthrons. Quite frankly, they are fantastic ships.
And for the record, I fly a Navy Mega. |

Calarn
Infinitus Odium
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Posted - 2007.06.24 05:00:00 -
[202]
Originally by: madaluap lol wtf...
A neut plate thron will wtf own in tank and fire power. These things take ages to take down. Serieusly quit the ******* whining. I got up to 40k armor without slaves, when i jumped into the slaveset is was even better. And thats on a ship that deals 1000+ dps and is pretty much *immune* yes i said *immune* to nos.
Cause ya just need to fire zeh guns mkay.
Oh please ....
Immune to nos? you do realise HYBRIDS need cap to fire? 1 heavy injector will not keep neutrons going for an extended length of time when nos is thrown into the mix.
And without slaves, you can get around 27k MAX with 3 trimarks, 2 rolled tungstens and hull upgrades 5.
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Cat Casidy
Death of Virtue Vigilance Infinitas
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Posted - 2007.06.24 08:12:00 -
[203]
in regards to OP, and yes im in his corp, and no what im about to say doesnt affect me at all cuz i fly an astarte and it doesnt bug me, but he did mention the eanm nerf, increased cpu need, which ive heard ammar pilots i know just cursing about, and i realy dont see the point of ccp implementing it. It helps no one that i can see and severly weakens an already tight rope in terms of fitting for ammar armor tankers. But like i said i dont have a cpu problem so what do I know? can anyone elaborate on who wins with this?
*Almost certainly nominated for something somewhere* |

Djerin
Obsidian Exploration Services
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Posted - 2007.06.28 22:30:00 -
[204]
The reason for EANM nerf was to remove those omni tanks. It obviously worked. The OP seems to be pretty ****ed to not being able to fit an omni tank anymore.
I'm an piloting an Astarte too, but it's got T2 resistances. Of course it's not as difficult to fit an omni tank to ships like that.
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