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Wideen
Resurrection
R i s e
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Posted - 2007.08.04 14:03:00 -
[31]
 Originally by: Kagura Nikon
So you can achieve at best 3 times mass. That would only make it tanke 3 times more to rech warp. Never prevent it.
I forsee very successful gatecamps, especially against stabbed-out targets (Haulers e.g.) who are just waiting to enter warp but which instead will be bumped and torn apart.
Go pirates - it's your birthday :P
Originally by: P'uck
I know somebody who heard somebody say that an Osprey defeated Chuck Norris. Twice. Need I say more?
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n0thing
omen.
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Posted - 2007.08.04 14:23:00 -
[32]
Originally by: slothe
Originally by: n0thing
Tbh, yeah, maybe its good idea, but what stops nano ship from fitting this and therefore boosting its defence?
nothing i guess, but then i suspect it makes nano ships more vulnerable esp if they passive tank and can now be hit by missiles and guns.
Ok, maybe I dont get how the mass/speed thing works, but if your MWD have x thrust, and your ship y mass. Then if y increases by 2, then x still the same and lowers your top speed because thrust need more mass to 'pull', but speed is not halfed? Decrease will be maybe from 4.5km/sec to maybe 3km/sec?
Comment not pointed at you directly, but since nano ships can also fit it and dont get hit that much, why others are whining about Minmatar nerf?
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IHurricane
Sniggerdly
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Posted - 2007.08.04 14:31:00 -
[33]
Not going to comment on the module. But please there is nothing wrong with skirmish warfare and EW, it is the two things that makes this game fun to play. As it enables you to kill a enemy that has more people then you. Think about how fun it would be if the gang that had most people where always the ones to win.
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There was never a genius, without a tincture of madness - Aristotle |
Naughty Boy
Chronics of ordinary hate
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Posted - 2007.08.04 14:42:00 -
[34]
Edited by: Naughty Boy on 04/08/2007 14:42:52
Originally by: IHurricane
[...] As it enables you to kill a enemy that has more people then you. Think about how fun it would be if the gang that had most people where always the ones to win.
This argument is older than any of us and yet didn't ever succeed in anything because... what happens if the team with superior numbers starts using this strategy as well?
If you have an issue with how you can stack numbers with little penalty (and as far as I'm concerned, I have such an issue) then it should be addressed at this level and not at any other (as far as your post is concerned, it is based on the dodgy assumption that all large gangs do not rely on speed and EW setups, which far from true).
NB.
In Rust We Trust |
Khanak Hryad
Amarr
The Firestorm Cartel
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Posted - 2007.08.04 14:44:00 -
[35]
Originally by: Jim McGregor
Originally by: Leandro Salazar
The problem with speed is kinda similar to the problem of EW. Excessive EW makes the target unable to do anything at all, and excessive speed kinda does the same in making anyone unable to affect the speeder. And of course the parties (ab)using that will throw 1000 temper tantrums against any proposal to nerf their I-win buttons.
What it comes down to is this: Speed/EW overkill battle: all the fun on one side and none on the other. Standard 'boring' pewpewtank: Fun on both sides. And I for one prefer the latter. Just like EW, speed should give you an advantage, but not make you invincible.
I think ccp are overdoing it. In the beginning of Eve, we were all very happy to get 5% speed boosts with the modules. Now things are out of control, with faction ships, faction implants, rigs etc.
Its not just speed, its tanking, dps, and basically everything. All these extra modules add far too large bonuses.
oh noes, bonuses everywhere....how bout you load up on them yourselves. Throughout this thread I've been seein a lot of "this ship gets too much" or "with <new module>, this ship will be invincible and that ship will be useless." ffs, quit whining about it and try obtaining said "invincible" ship.
"All these extra modules add far too large bonuses"
well then, what modules are you using that doesn't provide enough bonuses to counter the other ones? There's a balance here, and smart players can find it instead of whining about how their own WTFPWN method is getting nerfed.
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ElCoCo
KIA Corp
KIA Alliance
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Posted - 2007.08.04 14:51:00 -
[36]
Erm, you know it's going to be even easier than now to beat a megathron pilot in your tempest if you fit this module yourself?
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Naughty Boy
Chronics of ordinary hate
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Posted - 2007.08.04 15:05:00 -
[37]
Edited by: Naughty Boy on 04/08/2007 15:11:52
Originally by: Khanak Hryad
"All these extra modules add far too large bonuses"
well then, what modules are you using that doesn't provide enough bonuses to counter the other ones? There's a balance here
Erm, no, how significant and cumulative are the various bonuses from modules, implants and rigs tend to reward - or not - extreme setups. As it stand currently, you have very little interest in using "balanced" setups: extreme setups are rewarded way more in comparison (for instance, plated-gank short range battleships, nano-extended t2 ships etc). In turn, very effective extreme setups tend to stop some mechanisms working perfectly fine otherwise from working, ultimately affecting diversity more than if extreme setups where not rewarded so much in the first place.
If an example is needed, see the "first nano-era"...
NB.
In Rust We Trust |
Phelan Lore
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
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Posted - 2007.08.04 15:34:00 -
[38]
Edited by: Phelan Lore on 04/08/2007 15:34:39
Nanomach and snakes... 3bil isk
Gangmates with mass addition modules... 350m
Having them activate the mass addition modules on the mach while it is traveling 11km/s exactly 1 second before it rams a station hugging cap ship... Priceless 
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Lucus Ranger
Gallente
Infortunatus Eventus
Cruel Intentions
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Posted - 2007.08.04 15:49:00 -
[39]
Originally by: Phelan Lore
Edited by: Phelan Lore on 04/08/2007 15:34:39
Nanomach and snakes... 3bil isk
Gangmates with mass addition modules... 350m
Having them activate the mass addition modules on the mach while it is traveling 11km/s exactly 1 second before it rams a station hugging cap ship... Priceless
/Prince of Darkness at your service..
Disclaimer: None of my ideas or posting reflects my Alliance/Corp in any way |
Royaldo
Gallente
KVA Noble Inc.
Institute of Cooperative Education
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Posted - 2007.08.04 16:01:00 -
[40]
Originally by: Jim McGregor
Would be fun to activate 5 of them on a freighter. Wonder if it would move at all.
it adds mass right?
what modules are affected by mass? mwd and ab.
those modules use what slots? medium right..
how many slots on a freigther?
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bldyannoyed
Un4seen Development
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Posted - 2007.08.04 16:05:00 -
[41]
Wow.
Huggin plus 1 web plus 1 grav beam = target with no top speed, no cornering and no acceleration WHATSOEVER.
Long live Minnie recons.
Your signature exceeds the maximum allowed dimensions of 400x120 pixels and filesize of 24000 bytes -Sahwoolo Etoophie ([email protected]) |
oniplE
NED-Clan
R i s e
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Posted - 2007.08.04 16:09:00 -
[42]
Originally by: slothe
Originally by: oniplE
How will close range ships ever get in range with such a module in the game, needs a nerf :P
and you base your suggestion on what exactly?
Wasnt really a suggestion, more a question.
Lets say you're in a megathron and you get this thing pointed at you, the acceleration of the ship will be crap, and since the module has a 25km optimal range on it, you're pretty much stuck outside your range.
On the other hand, if you speed up your thron to 1000 m/s and then get your gangmates to "graviton beam" you, your ship should coast further when you turn the MWD off, it should also have the agility of a brick but ok.
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Testosterone Bomb
Red Ballz
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Posted - 2007.08.04 16:12:00 -
[43]
Edited by: Testosterone Bomb on 04/08/2007 16:12:49
The Module is similar to a Web and or also a counter to AB & MWD.
1. Reduce range to Web Range of similar rarity
2. Have the effectivness of the module be no more then 25% of the boost you can get from an AB or MWD since you can stack the module
also if you allow this then allow a pilot to fit and use more then 1 AB and or MWD at a time.
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Anubis Xian
Vertigo One
E.A.R.T.H. Federation
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Posted - 2007.08.04 16:18:00 -
[44]
The funny thing about this mass increasing module is that is what I proposed as a change to Webs.
Originally by: CCP Oveur
The client handles no logic, it is simply a dumb terminal.
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Jim McGregor
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Posted - 2007.08.04 16:22:00 -
[45]
Originally by: Royaldo
Originally by: Jim McGregor
Would be fun to activate 5 of them on a freighter. Wonder if it would move at all.
it adds mass right?
what modules are affected by mass? mwd and ab.
those modules use what slots? medium right..
how many slots on a freigther?
0
So why doesnt a freighter accelerate and turn as fast as a frigate without modules?
The ships themselfs are affected by their own mass.
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Originally by: CCP Wrangler
You're not supposed to feel like you're logging in to a happy, happy, fluffy, fluffy lala land filled with fun and adventures, thats what hello kitty online is for.
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Maya Rkell
Third Grade Ergonomics
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Posted - 2007.08.04 16:24:00 -
[46]
So basically it makes MWD's suicidal. The signature bloom of a MWD dosn't go away when you're hit with this, you just slow down. Suddenly, you're far easier to hit. It'd reverse and more the effect of the nos nerf for frigates, for starters.
//Maya |
welsh wizard
0utbreak
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Posted - 2007.08.04 16:40:00 -
[47]
I imagine it'll be a high slot module slothe but that still leaves the Tempest with the advantage over the Mega.
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Benn Helmsman
Caldari
Helmsman Engineering Company
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Posted - 2007.08.04 16:53:00 -
[48]
I like the module, ranged combat needs a serious buff in smaller encounters. It has way to many drawback for the small advantages which can be made useless very easy. It would give a reason to bring long range combat in your own gang.
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Wild Rho
Amarr
Endgame.
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Posted - 2007.08.04 16:56:00 -
[49]
I hope these mods having a stacking nerf or can you imagine the pain of giving an inty the mass of a small moon 
Personally though I kinda like the idea.
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Jim McGregor
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Posted - 2007.08.04 17:02:00 -
[50]
A combination of neutralizers and grav beams on drone ships would be scary.
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Originally by: CCP Wrangler
You're not supposed to feel like you're logging in to a happy, happy, fluffy, fluffy lala land filled with fun and adventures, thats what hello kitty online is for.
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Hannobaal
Gallente
Dragonfire Intergalactic Crusaders of Krom
Dark Matter Coalition
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Posted - 2007.08.04 17:08:00 -
[51]
Originally by: Leandro Salazar
The problem with speed is kinda similar to the problem of EW. Excessive EW makes the target unable to do anything at all, and excessive speed kinda does the same in making anyone unable to affect the speeder. And of course the parties (ab)using that will throw 1000 temper tantrums against any proposal to nerf their I-win buttons.
What it comes down to is this: Speed/EW overkill battle: all the fun on one side and none on the other. Standard 'boring' pewpewtank: Fun on both sides. And I for one prefer the latter. Just like EW, speed should give you an advantage, but not make you invincible.
Yeah, because obviously only one side of a battle are allowed to fit speed and Ewar modules...
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Hannobaal
Gallente
Dragonfire Intergalactic Crusaders of Krom
Dark Matter Coalition
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Posted - 2007.08.04 17:11:00 -
[52]
Originally by: oniplE
Lets say you're in a megathron and you get this thing pointed at you, the acceleration of the ship will be crap, and since the module has a 25km optimal range on it, you're pretty much stuck outside your range.
This is a stealth Caldari boost. 
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Kagura Nikon
Minmatar
Guardians of the Dawn
Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2007.08.04 17:36:00 -
[53]
Originally by: Jim McGregor
Edited by: Jim McGregor on 04/08/2007 17:05:40
I want this module. The more I think about it, the more I like it for the Tempest.
mass is already a stack nerfed attribute (if its nerfed on reduction modules its always neerfed on increasign modules too).
If brute force doesn't solve your problem... you are not using enough |
Jagerin
Gallente
AB INITO
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Posted - 2007.08.04 17:37:00 -
[54]
Yeah, this will kill fast ships. The remains of solo-capable ships.
So lets make BIG gangs & blobs & have fun with huge lags
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Daelin Blackleaf
No Joy Corp
Pride - Honor - Duty
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Posted - 2007.08.04 18:13:00 -
[55]
A second thread... while the first one is still on the front page.
Ok, I'll repeat.
Less range, hi-slot fitting, and yes please.
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Rafein
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Posted - 2007.08.04 18:40:00 -
[56]
few things.
1. It's in test, no guanentee it will ever be released. Plenty of modules are in test, and have been for ages, that have never been released to Tranq.
2. Even if it is released, it increases a ships mass by a % of it's current mass. so a Nano ship will feel the effect less than a tank ship.
3. oh yeah, you can use it too. Actually, it would be nice to see it replace Target painter's are the Minnie Ewar.
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Hannobaal
Gallente
Dragonfire Intergalactic Crusaders of Krom
Dark Matter Coalition
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Posted - 2007.08.04 18:43:00 -
[57]
Sounds like a good module the way it is to me, and it will increase tactical dangers, opportunities and options.
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Wayward Hooligan
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
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Posted - 2007.08.04 18:59:00 -
[58]
This Graviton Beam thing just look ********. There is no need for it. We already have a module for this. It's called a web.
Nano ships are no longer a problem.
Cruisers and frigs can go fast and BS can't. I really hope this stupid idea never sees the light of day.
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Camilo Cienfuegos
EP0CH
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Posted - 2007.08.04 19:13:00 -
[59]
Quote:
This Graviton Beam... There is no need for it. We already have a module for this. It's called a web.
Not quite true, as the effect of a web would be more severe than this module. In it's current incarnation though, I'd tend to agree it's of little use. Imagine it as a highslot mod with fitting requirements and limitations the same as those for nosferatu and neutralizers (so assuming tech one small is 5km, medium 10km large 20km with powergrid and cpu requirements that would make you cringe) and you have a powerful weapon indeed that could have many useful applications.
It's a pirates dream: lock, scram, graviton, web and kill. I love it!
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Don't take the carebears out of empire - take the empire out of carebears! |
Dangerously Cheesey
Anqara Expeditions
The OSS
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Posted - 2007.08.04 19:21:00 -
[60]
This mod needs to be 1. A mid slot item and 2. Have steep fitting requirements. If its a high slot item, with the nos nerf, lots of ships that had one random NOS in their highs to round out a setup will just stick one of these beams in there now.
Im gonna have to stay on the "Is this really needed/a good idea?" boat for now. People pay a lot of isk to become speed invincible (its not cheap making your sabre go 11km/s). Maybe there is something needed to balance ships like that but good luck to the people who fly their nano ships without snakes.
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