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Does distance effect missile DPS?

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Complex Potential Soliders Of Eve The Makhai	Posted - 2007.09.12 16:32:00 - [1] Ok, I got a corp mate who is convinced that missile DPS decreases as you get further from the target. I always thought missiles did the same DPS up close as from range. Now I've tried to bend my mind to his way of thinking but I just cant get past the fact the the ROF is constant regardless of how far the missiles have to travel. BTW we're not including defender missiles in this. Have I had this upside down for the last year? CP
NoNah Unseen University	Posted - 2007.09.12 16:35:00 - [2] No, damage is constant, only factors are the opponents velocity and signature radius. There are rumours saying that if transversal velocity is 0(ie theyre heading straight towards you), missiles might do more. I won't judge that rumour - but the fact that distance affects it is not true. This is also what makes them so great. Postcount: 443808
Tovarishch Caldari Body Count Inc. Mercenary Coalition	Posted - 2007.09.12 16:39:00 - [3] Edited by: Tovarishch on 12/09/2007 16:46:15 Originally by: NoNah No, damage is constant, only factors are the opponents velocity and signature radius. There are rumours saying that if transversal velocity is 0(ie theyre heading straight towards you), missiles might do more. I won't judge that rumour - but the fact that distance affects it is not true. This is also what makes them so great. Wrong. Missile DPS most certainly decreases with distance... since DPS is a measure of 'damage over time'. The further that missiles have to travel for any given fight the longer the period where they are doing no damage... which in turn effects DPS. The fight's 'timer' starts at the beginning of the engagement... missile DPS begins when they impact the target. This applies to each new target during the engagement. Missile DPS is also effected by whether the last volley of missiles hit the target. Read the link below my sig for more info. Edit - example - If a particular missile ship will do 400 DPS, and the missiles will have to travel 10 seconds to hit the target, then in this scenario the ship will actually do 266.6 DPS over a 30 second engagement, 333.3 DPS over 60 seconds, and 366.6 over 120 seconds. It also makes missiles the only weapon system that has a very real chance of doing 0 DPS if the target warps off or is destroyed before the missiles impact. My crusade for faster missiles.
Complex Potential Soliders Of Eve The Makhai	Posted - 2007.09.12 16:40:00 - [4] Let's keep it simple. If you are standing still and your target is standing still will you do more damage up close than at range with missiles?
ArmyOfMe hirr Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2007.09.12 16:44:00 - [5] Originally by: Complex Potential Let's keep it simple. If you are standing still and your target is standing still will you do more damage up close than at range with missiles? no. as long as you count dps from the moment the first volly hits rather then the moment u fire your guns
Jennai The Silent Rage R0ADKILL	Posted - 2007.09.12 16:45:00 - [6] Originally by: Complex Potential Let's keep it simple. If you are standing still and your target is standing still will you do more damage up close than at range with missiles? no. the only difference would be how long you have to wait before your missile hits the enemy.
Complex Potential Soliders Of Eve The Makhai	Posted - 2007.09.12 16:45:00 - [7] Ok, this is the way I see it. All your missiles travel at the same speed. So the time between each missile landing on your target and the ROF must be the same regardless of how far apart you are. (once missiles start landing) Sure the distance between those missiles will vary with the missile velocity, but the TIME between them crossing a certain point must remain the same as the ROF. I do feel I am missing something, but I'm not sure.
Complex Potential Soliders Of Eve The Makhai	Posted - 2007.09.12 16:46:00 - [8] Originally by: ArmyOfMe Originally by: Complex Potential Let's keep it simple. If you are standing still and your target is standing still will you do more damage up close than at range with missiles? no. as long as you count dps from the moment the first volly hits rather then the moment u fire your guns So you agree with me? Ok, maybe I'm not going mad.
Sunabi Caldari Defiance Corp Brutally Clever Empire	Posted - 2007.09.12 16:46:00 - [9] It'll take longer for your missiles to reach their target, so over the course of the engagement you will do less damage over time. The damage of individual missiles doesn't change though.
Tonto Auri	Posted - 2007.09.12 16:47:00 - [10] No, missile damage (damage amount per single missile) does not affected by distance, but DPS (damage ratio over time) does. There's also missiles guide on site. Give it a try. -- Thanks CCP for cu<end of sig>
Complex Potential Soliders Of Eve The Makhai	Posted - 2007.09.12 16:47:00 - [11] Originally by: Sunabi It'll take longer for your missiles to reach their target, so over the course of the engagement you will do less damage over time. The damage of individual missiles doesn't change though. So you're saying the dps goes down with distance?? I just cant see why. Maybe I'm going mad.
Complex Potential Soliders Of Eve The Makhai	Posted - 2007.09.12 16:50:00 - [12] Originally by: Tonto Auri No, missile damage (damage amount per single missile) does not affected by distance, but DPS (damage ratio over time) does. There's also missiles guide on site. Give it a try. DPS of one launcher is found by taking the missile damage and dividing by the ROF right? How exactly does the distance travelled effect this? The actually TIME between missile hits will not change.
ArmyOfMe hirr Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2007.09.12 16:53:00 - [13] the reason some say the dps goes down is the simple reason that as soon as you fire guns they hit while the missiles have to wait for the first volly to hit. As soon as the first volly of missiles hit a target your dps is constant if the ships dont move.
Tovarishch Caldari Body Count Inc. Mercenary Coalition	Posted - 2007.09.12 16:53:00 - [14] Originally by: Complex Potential Originally by: Tonto Auri No, missile damage (damage amount per single missile) does not affected by distance, but DPS (damage ratio over time) does. There's also missiles guide on site. Give it a try. DPS of one launcher is found by taking the missile damage and dividing by the ROF right? How exactly does the distance travelled effect this? The actually TIME between missile hits will not change. Read my above post. Second reply in the thread. My crusade for faster missiles.
Complex Potential Soliders Of Eve The Makhai	Posted - 2007.09.12 16:54:00 - [15] Originally by: ArmyOfMe the reason some say the dps goes down is the simple reason that as soon as you fire guns they hit while the missiles have to wait for the first volly to hit. As soon as the first volly of missiles hit a target your dps is constant if the ships dont move. This is exactly my point. Once this missiles start to land, the DPS would be the same as if you were closer.
Sanzorz Amarr EVEfan.dk	Posted - 2007.09.12 16:55:00 - [16] I too find it a bit odd that the dps is decrease on range. Yes, it will take time before the missiles hit, but you don't do any damage from start on the target...so how can that count as dps? It starts when the first missile hits tbh :-P --- Member of the Danish Evefan.DK corp
MailFan Stormlord Battleforce Dark Matter Coalition	Posted - 2007.09.12 16:59:00 - [17] Originally by: Sanzorz I too find it a bit odd that the dps is decrease on range. Yes, it will take time before the missiles hit, but you don't do any damage from start on the target...so how can that count as dps? It starts when the first missile hits tbh :-P Tell that to the instant hitting (insert random Turret ship) pilot. To compare Damage Per Second correctly you will need to take into account the flightime of missiles. So when Turret pilot A presses fire he will do instant damage, while the Missile pilot will still have to wait for his missiles to hit. -- I'm in this mood because of scorn. I'm in a mood for total war Boost the Eagle
Complex Potential Soliders Of Eve The Makhai	Posted - 2007.09.12 16:59:00 - [18] Edited by: Complex Potential on 12/09/2007 17:10:21 Originally by: Tovarishch Originally by: Complex Potential Originally by: Tonto Auri No, missile damage (damage amount per single missile) does not affected by distance, but DPS (damage ratio over time) does. There's also missiles guide on site. Give it a try. DPS of one launcher is found by taking the missile damage and dividing by the ROF right? How exactly does the distance travelled effect this? The actually TIME between missile hits will not change. So you're taking into account the flight time of that initial missile with the dps calculation. Fair enough, but I get the feeling my friend thinks the dps would be lower even if you started working it out from the first missile hit.
Complex Potential Soliders Of Eve The Makhai	Posted - 2007.09.12 17:12:00 - [19] Originally by: Sanzorz I too find it a bit odd that the dps is decrease on range. Yes, it will take time before the missiles hit, but you don't do any damage from start on the target...so how can that count as dps? It starts when the first missile hits tbh :-P Agreed. If you start the dps calculation from the time the first missile hits the distance should not make a difference.
mama guru Gallente Corp 1 Allstars Insurgency	Posted - 2007.09.12 17:12:00 - [20] Originally by: Tovarishch Edited by: Tovarishch on 12/09/2007 16:59:31 Originally by: NoNah No, damage is constant, only factors are the opponents velocity and signature radius. There are rumours saying that if transversal velocity is 0(ie theyre heading straight towards you), missiles might do more. I won't judge that rumour - but the fact that distance affects it is not true. This is also what makes them so great. Wrong. Missile DPS most certainly decreases with distance... since DPS is a measure of damage over time. The further that missiles have to travel for any given fight the longer the period where they are doing no damage... which in turn effects DPS. The fight's 'timer' starts at the beginning of the engagement, but missile damage begins when they impact the target. This applies to each new target during the engagement. Missile DPS is also effected by whether the last volley of missiles hit the target. Read the link below my sig for more info. Edit - example - If a particular missile ship will do 400 DPS, and the missiles will have to travel 10 seconds to hit the target, then in this scenario the ship will actually do 266.6 DPS over a 30 second engagement, 333.3 DPS over 60 seconds, and 366.6 over 120 seconds. It also makes missiles the only weapon system that has a very real chance of doing 0 DPS if the target warps off or is destroyed before the missiles impact. True, but this only accounts for the first volley if your target cant warp out etc. the others will arrive in due time according to the Rate of fire. -YOU ARE NOW READING MY SIGNATURE- EVE is like the "Fisherman's Friend" of MMOs. If it's too hard, you are too weak.
NoNah Unseen University	Posted - 2007.09.12 17:31:00 - [21] Originally by: Tovarishch Wrong. Missile DPS most certainly decreases with distance... since DPS is a measure of damage over time. The further that missiles have to travel for any given fight the longer the period where they are doing no damage... which in turn effects DPS. The fight's 'timer' starts at the beginning of the engagement... missile DPS begins when they impact the target. This applies to each new target during the engagement. Missile DPS is also effected by whether the last volley of missiles hit the target. Read the link below my sig for more info. Edit - example - If a particular missile ship will do 400 DPS, and the missiles will have to travel 10 seconds to hit the target, then in this scenario the ship will actually do 266.6 DPS over a 30 second engagement, 333.3 DPS over 60 seconds, and 366.6 over 120 seconds. It also makes missiles the only weapon system that has a very real chance of doing 0 DPS if the target warps off or is destroyed before the missiles impact. The above is pretty much true for fleet engagements - not counting capitals and poses. To all other battles, there is a delay of up to 15 seconds(iirc, and only that much in long range battles, which leads back to fleet engagements). It's much like measuring datarates. If youre scouting for another peer to download from, they might have a latency of several seconds, but as long as the bandwidth is high, the initial delay doesnt really matter. Bad example perhaps,but it is an example. Postcount: 118542
000Hunter000 Gallente Magners Marauders	Posted - 2007.09.12 17:35:00 - [22] Originally by: Complex Potential Ok, I got a corp mate who is convinced that missile DPS decreases as you get further from the target. U mean does the missile damage degrade with distance right? like i'm at 10km and missile does 100 damage but when i am at 100km missile only does 90 damage. Well that is false, range has nothing to do with how much damage a single missile does, a missile does as much damage at 100km as it does at 10km. CCP, let us pay the online shop with Direct Debit!!! Magners is now recruiting, evemail me or Dagazbo ingame.
Partacz Amarr Imperial Academy	Posted - 2007.09.12 17:37:00 - [23] Originally by: Complex Potential DPS of one launcher is found by taking the missile damage and dividing by the ROF right? How exactly does the distance travelled effect this? The actually TIME between missile hits will not change. This is simple. Lets do a little bit of math. DPS is Damage per Second. When Secound means time. D = Damage T = Time Ft = Flight time (its the time missile takes to hit target) DPS = D : T + Ft where for turrent Ft is "0" becouse its insta damage. So u will get max dps with missiles when your missiles FT will be "0", you will only get it when you will be 0m from your target Ft = Distance / Velocity of the missile Cheers
NoNah Unseen University	Posted - 2007.09.12 17:40:00 - [24] Edited by: NoNah on 12/09/2007 17:43:17 Originally by: Partacz Edited by: Partacz on 12/09/2007 17:38:49 Originally by: Complex Potential DPS of one launcher is found by taking the missile damage and dividing by the ROF right? How exactly does the distance travelled effect this? The actually TIME between missile hits will not change. This is simple. Lets do a little bit of math. DPS is Damage per Second. When Secound means time. D = Damage T = Time Ft = Flight time (its the time missile takes to hit target) DPS = D : T + Ft (where for turrent Ft is "0" becouse its insta damage) So u will get max dps with missiles when your missiles FT will be "0", you will only get it when you will be 0m from your target Ft = Distance / Velocity of the missile Cheers Haha, good one. Made my day. =) That would mean... a standard torp Raven... 6 launchers, 4 BCU II's, max skills. Would do a hefty sum of: 964 * 6 / (7.35 + 45) = 110 dps =) Strange, I would've guessed its more like 964 * 6 / 7.35 = 786 dps, with an initial 45 second delay. All at max range of course. Postcount: 823204
iiOs Evil Things	Posted - 2007.09.12 17:41:00 - [25] im amazed how some fail to understand such a simple thing ---------------------------------------- ---------------------------------------- BB
Emperor D'Hoffryn No Quarter. Vae Victis.	Posted - 2007.09.12 17:41:00 - [26] most accurate way to say it is, as distance increases, the DELAY before damage starts to occur increases. If the ships are sitting still, once the first volley hits, your damage is your damage per missle divided by rof. If your target is flying all around fast enough, then missles have to chase them, which can increase flight time, but this can occur equally at any distance, and if they are already going fast enough for this to occur, the velocity damamge reduction is going to be your main worry anyway. Originally by: Snuggly It's just so great to have an actual reason to not die, incentive is fantastic!
Vandalias	Posted - 2007.09.12 17:43:00 - [27] If you start counting from the moment you fire, then yes. If you start counting from the moment the first missiles hit, then no.
Complex Potential Soliders Of Eve The Makhai	Posted - 2007.09.12 17:45:00 - [28] Originally by: Vandalias If you start counting from the moment you fire, then yes. If you start counting from the moment the first missiles hit, then no. Thank you. This is exactly what I thought in the first place.
Complex Potential Soliders Of Eve The Makhai	Posted - 2007.09.12 17:47:00 - [29] Originally by: Vandalias If you start counting from the moment you fire, then yes. If you start counting from the moment the first missiles hit, then no. Thank you. This is exactly what I thought in the first place.
Partacz Amarr Imperial Academy	Posted - 2007.09.12 17:48:00 - [30] Originally by: NoNah Haha, good one. Made my day. =) That would mean... a standard torp Raven... 6 launchers, 4 BCU II's, max skills. Would do a hefty sum of: 964 * 6 / (7.35 + 45) = 110 dps =) Strange, I would've guessed its more like 964 * 6 / 7.35 = 786 dps, with an initial 45 second delay. All at max range of course. Yea you will get 786 dps at 0 range m8 Thats why Insta dmg 4tw.

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